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(New York Daily News)   Woman who pushed her husband out of a 17th floor window blames break-away glass   (nydailynews.com) divider line 37
    More: Unlikely, Tulsa, floor windows, Tulsa World, glass  
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7583 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Mar 2013 at 9:53 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-03-20 11:06:38 AM  
3 votes:
There is a lot of White Knighting in this thread. Look guys, she isn't going to give you sexy time just because you side with her.

She may not be guilty of murder, but sure as hell was responsible for his death. Thin glass or not, you cannot expect a pane of glass to support the weight of a human being.
2013-03-20 10:00:39 AM  
3 votes:
Wait, on what possibly grounds do they have for asking the repairman if he feared the lady he was working for, the one time he had contact with her?  How on earth is that relevant information?

What did the line of questioning go like:

Attorney:  So that biatch, kinda crazy eyes right?
Rosala:  biatches be crazy.
2013-03-20 11:32:55 AM  
2 votes:
How long was this submission in the queue?  She's already been sentenced.  Second-degree murder, 25 years.  She will have to serve at least 21 years and 3 months, which will (by that time) represent about half her life.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2295788/Amber-Hilberling-tri al -Mother-guilty-murder-pushing-Air-Force-husband-25th-floor-window.html

Additional information from other articles (not just the Daily Fail):
-> Amber was allegedly abusing her husband, not the other way around.  She hit him with a lamp about a month before his death, requiring stitches.  He applied for, but never completed, an emergency protective order against her.
-> Joshua's family said he'd packed up his belongings and was leaving Amber at the time of his death.
-> The prosecutors offered a 5-year plea deal but were turned down.
2013-03-20 11:09:24 AM  
2 votes:

Gunther: Wow, any reason they were so hard on her?


Because they thought the story was bullsh*t, which means she killed her husband intentionally?

Just a guess.
2013-03-20 10:58:14 AM  
2 votes:

Egoy3k: If she had a reasonable expectation that the glass would not break then she's safe


No, it'd still be manslaughter.

It's like if you punched someone and they fell, hit their head and died from the injury: even though you didn't intend it, you're still legally responsible.
2013-03-20 10:45:56 AM  
2 votes:
Rookie mistake on the husband's part - you never try to argue with a pregnant woman in person. Just agree with everything they say, leave at the first opportunity and call when you're a good hour's drive away and you can say what you really think in safety.
2013-03-20 10:39:16 AM  
2 votes:

Master Sphincter: There is no way I would vote "guilty" as a juror.

The building should have installed the proper glass. Go after them.

/would hit it


Not guilty of what?

She committed manslaughter 100%.  You dont get to shove somebody at glass and just assume they wont get injured.
2013-03-20 10:26:33 AM  
2 votes:
/would still hit it
//in a one story building
2013-03-20 08:41:35 AM  
2 votes:
If the sexes were reversed, there wouldn't be much sympathy. "Your honor, sure, I pushed my wife through the window, but it was too thin! I thought it would bounce her back like a trampoline."

So in the interests of equality and public order, put her away.
2013-03-20 08:15:27 AM  
2 votes:
There needs to be a hot/defenestration scale.
2013-03-20 02:32:43 PM  
1 votes:
I'd hit it.

But then again, I live in a basement apartment.

(No, not my parents basement.)
2013-03-20 01:17:02 PM  
1 votes:
Whatever her intentions or culpability, she's not very smart.  Bail was revoked because she didn't follow simple rules.

Glassco revoked Hilberling's bond in December and ordered her jailed after he was informed that she had violated her curfew and failed to keep her Global Positioning System monitor charged on multiple occasions.
Glassco subsequently allowed Hilberling's bond to be reinstated, and she was again released from jail with requirements that included urinalyses. The judge revoked the $250,000 bond again on Jan. 6 and ordered her held without bail after he received a report that she provided urine samples that tested positive for THC, which is indicative of marijuana use.
2013-03-20 12:19:11 PM  
1 votes:
Sounds like my kind of woman. Granted I'm not so much bigger than her that I'm afraid to hit her back.

That IS how it works: if the man is much bigger she'll claim self-defense because he attacked her even if she's the one with the chain saw. Unless it happens in public with hundreds of witnesses taping it. It's very rare that a jury will believe that a little woman beat up a football player.

Only if the guy is a tiny wimp or a paraplegic will a jury believe he killed her in self-defense; if you're closely matched in size and she's drunk, on meth and crazy to begin with then a guy has a 50/50 chance of acquital.

What happened here is very rare: this much-bigger veteran was nice enough to not simply deck her and he had the balls to call the cops on her a few times. He obviously explained it by saying "If I defended myself as hard as she attacked me she'd be hospitalized, and besides I was taught that you don't hit women."  And I bet most people that heard that still thought "Yeah, right. I'll bet you sit down to pee."

Fortunately for me when I was 20 and got into physical fights with my crazy girlfriend she had the obvious size advantage: she outweighed me by 40 pounds (I weighed only 120# then), she was stocky rather than fat, and we were about the same height. When she came charging at me I had to defend myself or she'd do some damage, and nobody who knew us thought otherwise. The tactic in those cases is to keep her from hurting you without hurting her too much, and if she pulls a knife you've got to run if you can. (Which is not to say the fact that we came to blows was her fault: in those days I was not very easy to put up with.)

But this guy? He was too damn nice. And look what it got him. When you're a 6'5" 220-pound former football player the only sensible way to defend yourself against a violent woman is to stay away from them completely. If you've got to stick your dick in crazy you're safer turning gay.

Let this be a lesson to you mankiller-wannabes: never ever say anything like "I'm afraid one of these days I'll wind up killing him." No no no. What you say if you plan to kill your husband is "But I really do love him. he just has PTSD and he doesn't really mean to hurt me when he blows up like that, and anyway I'm carrying his baby. Boo hoo hoo." Never forget to put him in the wrong by playing the beaten-wifey victim card, no matter what the actual facts are: what you want the jury to think is that you were abused until you finally snapped, that the only think you did wrong is not leave that horrible evil man before he made you shoot him in the back 20 times while he was passed out from the roofies you put in his Yoo-Hoo.
2013-03-20 11:57:56 AM  
1 votes:

limeyfellow: Generation_D: So why have "breakaway glass" on a 17th floor?

To deal with storm damage and allow for fire fighting mostly. It not very good when you can't get through the window to safe the people from burning to death.


For about a million bucks you can get a ladder truck with a 100 foot ladder. Unless the firefighters are going to be repelling down the side of the building, they ain't breaking the glass from the outside on the 17th floor.

/No, I'm not a firefighter and I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night so I could be very wrong.
2013-03-20 11:49:53 AM  
1 votes:

Generation_D: So why have "breakaway glass" on a 17th floor?


To deal with storm damage and allow for fire fighting mostly. It not very good when you can't get through the window to safe the people from burning to death.
2013-03-20 11:46:12 AM  
1 votes:
Quantum Apostrophe


Random Anonymous Blackmail: you cannot expect a pane of glass to support the weight of a human being.

I am talking about a wall, not a floor which was obviously designed to be such.
2013-03-20 11:39:45 AM  
1 votes:
TeDDD:

Additional information from other articles (not just the Daily Fail):
-> Amber was allegedly abusing her husband, not the other way around.  She hit him with a lamp about a month before his death, requiring stitches.  He applied for, but never completed, an emergency protective order against her.
-> Joshua's family said he'd packed up his belongings and was leaving Amber at the time of his death.
-> The prosecutors offered a 5-year plea deal but were turned down.


He did have an emergency protective order for a couple weeks, but he didn't follow up to have a permanent one ordered.
Other information:
->She's applied to be executor of her husband's estate in probate.
->She is suing the apartments for the glass being too thin.
Both of these cases were ordered to stay pending the outcome of the murder trial. I don't think now she'll get very far with either.
2013-03-20 11:25:13 AM  
1 votes:

The Muthaship: Menqet: If you want to witness the train-wreck first hand, check out the Amber Hilberling is Innocent facebook page: Praying, praying, praying, then OMG! The judge had it out for her the whole time! The truth will come out! Blah, blah, blah...

It was a bench trial?  Her lawyer should be disbarred.



No. Jury trial, but her family is blaming the judge for her murder conviction. Like I said, her family is very delusional.
2013-03-20 11:22:28 AM  
1 votes:

Menqet: If you want to witness the train-wreck first hand, check out the Amber Hilberling is Innocent facebook page: Praying, praying, praying, then OMG! The judge had it out for her the whole time! The truth will come out! Blah, blah, blah...


It was a bench trial?  Her lawyer should be disbarred.
2013-03-20 11:19:43 AM  
1 votes:
According to another article, she was abusive to him, told his parents that if they stayed together she'd probably end up killing him and the fight happened after she found out he packed his bags and was leaving her.

Doesn't sound like self defense to me.
2013-03-20 11:18:25 AM  
1 votes:

Menqet: Tulsan here. She was convicted of 2nd degree murder this week. The jury recommended that she serve the maximum time allowed under that conviction - 25 years (for a clean record, which she has). During the deliberations, they asked if the judge could modify that sentence. I think they wanted her to serve more time. She was offered a plea deal last week of 5 years but didn't take it. Her whole family is very religious, and they were holding prayer vigils leading up to the deliberations.


So either their god doesn't listen to prayers, or he wants her to do hard time.
2013-03-20 11:14:05 AM  
1 votes:

Biological Ali: Gunther: Egoy3k: If she had a reasonable expectation that the glass would not break then she's safe

No, it'd still be manslaughter.

It's like if you punched someone and they fell, hit their head and died from the injury: even though you didn't intend it, you're still legally responsible.

A push in and of itself doesn't really strike me as being on the same level as a punch, in terms of the degree to which it can reasonably be expected to cause injury.


Shoving someone against a window hard enough to send them through even thin glass requires a pretty serious push. It seems like it'd be on the same level of injury as a punch

The Muthaship: Because they thought the story was bullsh*t, which means she killed her husband intentionally?


Yeah, but what led them to think that?
2013-03-20 11:13:15 AM  
1 votes:

Mr Guy: markfara: She didn't think it through. If she'd said she "felt threatened" by her husband, she'd be home free.

That's her EXACT defense.  She was pregnant and hormonal, and he threatened her.  She responded with what she believed would be a safe space clearing shove, and had no way of knowing that incorrectly installed glass would give way.


There is no evidence in that article that points to the glass being installed incorrectly.  All that was said is that the glass is thinner than what is installed now.  Have codes been updated since then due to more information on what types of glass to use in high-rise building?  Was the building built before all this information was available and the codes were updated? Etc., etc.  Just because the glass is thinner does not mean it was installed wrong.   However, if that particular piece of glass was replaced after the building codes were updated then there just might be some bite to the notion that the glass was installed incorrectly but so far, ftfa, there is nothing that points in that direction.

Either way it goes for this lady the one thing to remember is that glass breaks.  All the time. Glass is not some magical life-saving, rubberized, bounce-back-when-pushed-into type of device, it's their to let light in, and to allow viewing.  And what causes one piece of glass to break may notnecessarilycause a different piece of glass to break,  Just keep in mind that it will break.

/was a glazier for 13 years
2013-03-20 11:13:00 AM  
1 votes:

Biological Ali: Gunther: Egoy3k: If she had a reasonable expectation that the glass would not break then she's safe

No, it'd still be manslaughter.

It's like if you punched someone and they fell, hit their head and died from the injury: even though you didn't intend it, you're still legally responsible.

A push in and of itself doesn't really strike me as being on the same level as a punch, in terms of the degree to which it can reasonably be expected to cause injury.


What I was thinking was, on her part, a determined two-to-three step accelerating forward momentum shove towards the window (he'd have his back to her, probably)..  That'd do it.....
2013-03-20 11:12:41 AM  
1 votes:

Gunther: Menqet: Tulsan here. She was convicted of 2nd degree murder this week. The jury recommended that she serve the maximum time allowed under that conviction - 25 years

Wow, any reason they were so hard on her?

I'd have expected 5-10 years for manslaughter.



She was out on probation but was remanded back to jail for failing a drug test. I'm sure her conflicting statements about what happened really had a lot to do with it, too. During the initial interviews after the incident, she admitted to pushing him as a joke while he was messing with the TV. Then, during the trial, her defense was that it was self defense, and he grabbed her shoulders. She claims she feared for her life and pushed him back to defend herself and her baby. Her family is extremely wealthy and very delusional.
2013-03-20 10:59:34 AM  
1 votes:

markfara: She didn't think it through. If she'd said she "felt threatened" by her husband, she'd be home free.


That's her EXACT defense.  She was pregnant and hormonal, and he threatened her.  She responded with what she believed would be a safe space clearing shove, and had no way of knowing that incorrectly installed glass would give way.
2013-03-20 10:50:57 AM  
1 votes:
She didn't think it through. If she'd said she "felt threatened" by her husband, she'd be home free.
2013-03-20 10:49:25 AM  
1 votes:
If only there was a glazing submittal on record at the architect's office with detailed information about the glass that was installed.
2013-03-20 10:45:34 AM  
1 votes:
There are very specific building codes pertaining to the glass used in highrise buildings for this very reason but a building not being built to code does not mean that you can kill people with impunity. What this is going to come down to is if she expected the glass to break or not. If she had a reasonable expectation that the glass would not break then she's safe, if not then not. She's going to have to take the stand a convince the jury. Good news for her shes a woman and she isn't ugly. She'll probably walk.
2013-03-20 10:30:48 AM  
1 votes:
This sounds like the same thing as a break away football jersey.

"He could fall all the way... and does!"
2013-03-20 10:26:54 AM  
1 votes:
Armando Rosales, a glass repairman, went to the apartment after hearing the glass shatter. He corroborated Amber Hilberling's claim to the court that the large pane was in fact thinner than what is typically used in highrise windows.

A truly fortunate coincidence to find a glass repairman happening by on that fateful day
2013-03-20 10:23:25 AM  
1 votes:
It's my experience that any girl named Amber is someone that is batshiat crazy to begin with.
2013-03-20 10:20:28 AM  
1 votes:

abhorrent1: But Rosales also told the jury that he feared that Amber Hilberling might push him through the broken window after he entered.
Seems odd. Why would he think that? Did he assume she was going on a "Push people out the window" spree?


Well, to be fair... if I heard my neighbors glass shatter, I walked over there to see whats up, and some woman screams at me that she just murdered somebody by pushing them out the window..... I might just not feel too safe walking near the edge in her presence.

You know, since she just murdered somebody by pushing them through the window.
2013-03-20 10:12:54 AM  
1 votes:

Mr Guy: abhorrent1: But Rosales also told the jury that he feared that Amber Hilberling might push him through the broken window after he entered.
Seems odd. Why would he think that? Did he assume she was going on a "Push people out the window" spree?

"Oh my god!  I pushed my husband out the window!  Quit fix it because the RUSH!  OH MY GOD THE RUSH!  FIX THAT WINDOW YOU GLORIOUS FALLING BASTARD."

He only wrote it down, because it seemed like it was going to come up later.


Like a lion she stalked her prey, waiting for him to drop his guard ever so slightly. As Rosala examined the broken shares of glass that littered the now destroyed living, he felt her warm breath on the back of his neck.

"Sure would be tragic if you fell out of the window similar to my husband"
2013-03-20 10:05:21 AM  
1 votes:
i18.photobucket.com

So - d'ya feel better now, little girl?
2013-03-20 10:02:44 AM  
1 votes:

abhorrent1: But Rosales also told the jury that he feared that Amber Hilberling might push him through the broken window after he entered.
Seems odd. Why would he think that? Did he assume she was going on a "Push people out the window" spree?


He probably has experience with pregnant ladies.
2013-03-20 10:01:38 AM  
1 votes:
But Rosales also told the jury that he feared that Amber Hilberling might push him through the broken window after he entered.
Seems odd. Why would he think that? Did he assume she was going on a "Push people out the window" spree?
 
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