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(Opposing Views)   Father takes pic of 11-year-old son with gun, social services shows up at his door demanding entry into his home and access to guns or else they will "take his kids"   (opposingviews.com) divider line 756
    More: Stupid, Shawn Moore, social services, door demanding, The Blaze, guns  
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15883 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Mar 2013 at 8:09 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



756 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-03-19 09:19:24 PM  

Frank N Stein: In other gun related news, DiFi's assault weapon ban finally died. No scary black gun ban, no mag ban, and no registration. And of course, DiFi cried like a little biatch about it.

It's a good day.


She probably crushed some pearls clutching them so much.
 
2013-03-19 09:19:30 PM  

sbking: I am not antigun and i believe in the 2nd amendment BUT COME ON...

If those parents let that kid, who is not even a teenager, hold that gun then they have no business being parents.  Foster homes are bad but they would be not cause as much damage to the kid as that home and they would probably save another mass shooting down the road.

I know, i know: guns don't kill people: bla, bla, bla.  How would you feel if he was holding a bottle of bourbon (legal)???


Oh, you're good.
 
2013-03-19 09:21:34 PM  

StatelyGreekAutomaton: sbking: I am not antigun and i believe in the 2nd amendment BUT COME ON...

If those parents let that kid, who is not even a teenager, hold that gun then they have no business being parents.  Foster homes are bad but they would be not cause as much damage to the kid as that home and they would probably save another mass shooting down the road.

I know, i know: guns don't kill people: bla, bla, bla.  How would you feel if he was holding a bottle of bourbon (legal)???

Oh, you're good.


Perhaps a bit too good - i was trying to make a point but blurred the lines a bit much.

Then got tangled up with a old college buddy (now i don't think it was actually him).
 
2013-03-19 09:22:02 PM  

geekbikerskum: The kid in the pic at least has proper trigger discipline which is more than I can say of many adults I see handling guns in photos.


You mean like this one....

gerarddirect.com
 
2013-03-19 09:22:48 PM  

feckingmorons: sbking: "we" "we" "we"  you remind me of that guy

What about the guy who likes to say I, me, my a lot?


Oh.  I thought you were talking about these guys: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIL75TnWtnw
 
2013-03-19 09:24:15 PM  

jigger: jso2897: 5. father hits the internet with "THEY CUMIN FER OUR GUUUUNS!!!"

Are you saying they weren't coming for his guns?


They're coming fer our sons....
 
2013-03-19 09:24:45 PM  

willfullyobscure: military-style weapon


But they're not military style weapons any more than Chicago Deep Dish Style is pizza (it is a casserole). Military weapons are selctive fire, they can and do fire fully automatic. The kid has a .22 caliber target rifle (it appears to me to be a S&W M&P 15-22) it is not automatic, it fires a rimfire cartridge, it costs about $500. The only similarity to a military rifle is cosmetic.

You just think they look scary and you want all the scary things to go away.
 
2013-03-19 09:24:48 PM  
So now, it's reached the point where, if I don't take this stupid debate "seriously" enough, the butthurt are going to take other people's words and gin up a fake quote to make it look like I said it? Are you f**king people twelve? Is that the only way you can convince yourselves you have "won" an argument?
 
2013-03-19 09:27:10 PM  

feckingmorons: willfullyobscure: military-style weapon

But they're not military style weapons any more than Chicago Deep Dish Style is pizza (it is a casserole). Military weapons are selctive fire, they can and do fire fully automatic. The kid has a .22 caliber target rifle (it appears to me to be a S&W M&P 15-22) it is not automatic, it fires a rimfire cartridge, it costs about $500. The only similarity to a military rifle is cosmetic.

You just think they look scary and you want all the scary things to go away.


I think he, and others, want you to go away...

/i really hope this is J.G.
 
2013-03-19 09:27:15 PM  

skozlaw: OgreMagi: I'll keep that in mind for future discussions.

No, you won't. You'll just want a fight based on nothing, same as here. A fight based on a story in a blog about some forum posts from a guy who appears to be given multiple recitations of a single event based on who he's talking to because gernz are involved.

I'm sick of this crap. As a gun owner, I don't need some slack-jawed idiot with a Glenn Beck fixation speaking on my behalf about he told dem der larmern to get off his perpity. I don't need slack-jawed folks like you running about trying to make arguments out of half-assed forum posts from some guy you don't know about an event that had no particular outcome.

I'm sick of being represented by morons on the national stage. I'd like to keep hold of my firearms. That's not going to happen if the people who speak on my behalf are morons like this guy and people like you who just arbitrarily run alongside of them for exactly no reason.


Out of curiosity, why the wild accusations?  Here is a guy who reported his story on Delaware Open Carry.  Then a writer for The Blaze contacts him to get more info.  The Blaze talks to the guy's lawyer but the police and family services both refuse to answer any questions.

You pull "slack-jawed idiot with a Glenn Beck fixation" totally out of your ass.  Then, your ass still being full, you start with some bizarre accent and actually have a problem with him refusing a warrantless search of his "perpity".  But I guess since you claim to have found this guy posting multiple versions of his story (love to see the citations for these, btw) you feel justified as making shiat up.
 
2013-03-19 09:27:25 PM  

AdolfOliverPanties: I'm thinking bullshiat:


He ended his post by saying, "People it can happen that fast. Most people wouldn't have stood up to them like I did."

links to the inquisitor and blaze.


Not sure if its bullshiat or not but this is the same sentence I have a problem with, fark him and his inflated ego.
 
2013-03-19 09:28:21 PM  
Well this has petered out. Lets post gun pictures. I own a Thompson 1928a1 fully automatic machine gun.

www.nam.ac.uk
 
2013-03-19 09:28:32 PM  

jso2897: jigger: jso2897: 5. father hits the internet with "THEY CUMIN FER OUR GUUUUNS!!!"

Are you saying they weren't coming for his guns?

I did not say that. Willfullyobscure said that, and I have no idea why you are quoting me as saying it. It's trivial, but that's really not very honest of you.


Woops. I guess I didn't pick up on the italics like I should have. O well.
 
2013-03-19 09:28:59 PM  
Doesn't Senator Feinstein also have a CCR?
Looks like she needs some refresher training in handling procedures IMHO.

gerarddirect.com
 
2013-03-19 09:29:23 PM  

feckingmorons: The kid has a .22 caliber target rifle (it appears to me to be a S&W M&P 15-22) it is not automatic, it fires a rimfire cartridge, it costs about $500. The only similarity to a military rifle is cosmetic.


Yeah but like, perception is reality, so like, a scary looking .22 is more dangerous than a .22 with a traditional stock. Maaaan.
 
2013-03-19 09:29:24 PM  

willfullyobscure: military-style clothing


I bet you he had a military style breakfast too!

You seem fixated. Do you hate the military?
 
2013-03-19 09:30:23 PM  

Allen262: geekbikerskum: The kid in the pic at least has proper trigger discipline which is more than I can say of many adults I see handling guns in photos.

You mean like this one....

[gerarddirect.com image 450x366]


That's the same finger she put in bullet holes, you insensitive monster.
 
2013-03-19 09:31:23 PM  
Too bad this criminal still has guns. He shouldn't have broke the law.
 
2013-03-19 09:31:26 PM  

jigger: jso2897: jigger: jso2897: 5. father hits the internet with "THEY CUMIN FER OUR GUUUUNS!!!"

Are you saying they weren't coming for his guns?

I did not say that. Willfullyobscure said that, and I have no idea why you are quoting me as saying it. It's trivial, but that's really not very honest of you.

Woops. I guess I didn't pick up on the italics like I should have. O well.


"Oh well?"
That's a deep subject.
 
2013-03-19 09:31:30 PM  

willfullyobscure: What about that picture says "sporting shooter" to you, pal?


The .22 caliber rifle.

/Whoops, dropped a paragraph last post.
 
2013-03-19 09:31:44 PM  
Well when I was 10, I shot using a .22 for BSA.  We got a badge.  Had it been nowadays Im sure it would have been on Facebook.  Since there was no pic in the article, I can't tell what DFS was biatching about.
 
2013-03-19 09:32:05 PM  

Brick-House: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 640x682]


those guys in the background---you are a moron.
 
2013-03-19 09:32:12 PM  
Odd.
"Exactly the same" with a different magazine capacity.
I imagine the scope would allow greater accuracy from a greater distance.
The stand would allow a steadier shot, from a fixed position.
The flash suppressor would suppress flashes.
The magazine would allow for a higher capacity.

Other than that, they're exactly the same.
 
2013-03-19 09:32:30 PM  
I honestly didn't even see the kid in the photo the first dozen or so times I looked.  Then I realized he was wearing camo and was just barely able to discern his location in the photo.
 
2013-03-19 09:32:41 PM  
I'll be a gambler, baby
Lay down the bet
We get together, mama
You'll sweat
 
2013-03-19 09:32:43 PM  
Hey, this is a great story! There's enough stupidity to go around for everybody!

But seriously. What type of gun are we talking? hunting? gang-banger? mass murderer? Was the gun loaded? Was it cocked? Was the kid pointing it at somebody? Was the father responsibly teaching gun safety and practicing it? Was the kid too dumb to live?

I'm a liberal and in favour of reasonable restrictions on the manufacture, sales, purchase, ownership and use of guns. But I like a bit of venison or moose, partrige, duck or goose. I don't object to salmon or trout or even coarse fishing of some species.

This is not an automatic decision. If a guy wants to take a picture of a kid with a gun, it makes a difference to me whether he is holding it to the head of a battered black man or white woman. It makes a difference whether the gun is legal, the purpose of the gun is legitimate, and the use of the gun rational and responsible.

I fired a gun once. It was my grandfather's XIXth century heirloom, as heavy as a dog and with a kick like a mule. Enough gun training for me. It taught me that you should stick heirlooms in museums or display cases with locks because sticking them into the hands of an untrained child is not a great idea, even with instructions.

On the other hand, some kids like to hunt, just as some men don't. Even some women like to hunt.

My Father has that gun now and he obeys the laws regarding safety and security. The gun is locked up, so is the ammo, and I expect the firing pins are removed if that is what the law says. Even guns that aren't designed specifically to hurt or kill people do so when abused.

Did the gun get abused? Was the kid abused? Or is it abusive to threaten the kid simply because of a photo.

There are a number of photos my family members took that could get you arrested and treated like a permanent threat to society--for example bathtub photos of little kids. Parents think this goo is cute and nostalgic. Predators seem to like it too. But one is not ipso facto a sexual predator and monster for taking such a photograph or having one in a drawer some where. One reason we have juries and judges is so that occasionally common sense will prevail over the forces of authority and law. It doesn't always work, sadly.
 
2013-03-19 09:32:46 PM  
I was 10.

i.imgur.com

Looking back at this image it strikes me as funny that my dad very carefully taught me to release the mag and clear the weapon before handling it further but didn't say anything about keeping my finger off the goddamn trigger while he was taking pictures. I'm going to give him some grief about that, I think.
 
2013-03-19 09:33:06 PM  

feckingmorons: willfullyobscure: military-style clothing

I bet you he had a military style breakfast too!

You seem fixated. Do you hate the military?


Your dinner might have come out of military-style devices. Food canning for invented for the Napoleonic Army, which makes any canned food evil and requires them to be outlawed?
 
2013-03-19 09:33:11 PM  

Igor Jakovsky: Well when I was 10, I shot using a .22 for BSA.  We got a badge.  Had it been nowadays Im sure it would have been on Facebook.  Since there was no pic in the article, I can't tell what DFS was biatching about.


Why do you hate gay people you BSA joiner?
 
2013-03-19 09:34:29 PM  
I actually, and unfortunately, know someone who works for DYFS. They really are like this. They really do think nothing of taking a kid from his home, without a court order and without exigent circumstances. And the cops are basically required to go along with them, even if what they're doing is totally illegal. I would not be shocked if every word of this story were true, including the bit where she refused to give her name. Hell, I wouldn't be shocked to find out that I knew the idiot.

/fascists
 
2013-03-19 09:34:32 PM  

clowncar on fire: brandent: sbking: I am not antigun and i believe in the 2nd amendment BUT COME ON...

If those parents let that kid, who is not even a teenager, hold that gun then they have no business being parents.  Foster homes are bad but they would be not cause as much damage to the kid as that home and they would probably save another mass shooting down the road.

I know, i know: guns don't kill people: bla, bla, bla.  How would you feel if he was holding a bottle of bourbon (legal)???

The article is complete b.s. but you should at least be aware that this is perfectly normal behavior in a vast portion of the US (by normal I mean within accepted norms).  Remington makes a pink "youth" 20 gauge shotgun.  There are all manner of pink guns for little girls.  My son who is 10 is very upset with me because all his friends have guns already and get to go hunting (check the laws, many states don't even have legal minimum ages).  I told him he must wait until he is 12.  Just this weekend I was in Cabelas and we decided to just go see what a .22 would cost.  The counter clerk tried to sell my 10 year old a .22 handgun that was small enough to fit in your front pants pocket.

I was a little taken aback by their sales effort on my kid.

So yes I have a couple guns but am not a gun nut.  I just wanted to see what was out there and it turns out there are entire lines of gun products for 10 year olds.  Who knew?

Those cheerfully colored guns are not designed to appeal to children- they are made as collectables as they have the dual purpose of both protection as well as being a trendy accessory.  I saw a number of these in a gun shop one day and I was a little taken aback by the cute trendy appearance of some of the weaponry.   I was told by a dealer, they have become popular amongst the single female 20-25 age group.  occasionally, they are purchased as gifts for collectors, spouses, or family members just getting out on their own.  Very few adults have actually asked about them as an en ...


I didn't say he was allowed to handle one.  Your statements about the "20 something" are either just plain due to inexperience on your part or you are a gun nut trying to lie.  They are specifically called "youth model" and "jr" and targeted to teenagers.  They are NOT collectibles.  In the case of the Remington 870 youth model it is actually a very practical and useful gun for a teenager to learn on.  But let's not kid ourselves here.  They are made for, branded, and marketed for youth under the age of 18.

http://www.gandermountain.com/modperl/product/details.cgi?i=GM413065 &a ID=510D2
referred to as "jr" at Gander Mountain.

http://www.cabelas.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=705625
Note the "youth 870 express" in the table

And here note an entire inventory of "youth" shotguns.

http://www.hyattgunstore.com/youth-shotguns/

You are living on another planet if you do not believe 10 year olds shoot weapons by the hundreds of thousands in this country.
 
2013-03-19 09:34:38 PM  

feckingmorons: Well this has petered out. Lets post gun pictures. I own a Thompson 1928a1 fully automatic machine gun.

[www.nam.ac.uk image 480x361]


The Republicans should push for legislation to rollback the regulations on those.
 
2013-03-19 09:35:23 PM  
I don't care about this guy having guns - they decrease his chances of survival, and Darwin likes that. But should we really be encouraging fat, soft, ugly, inferior, inbred sub-European stock like this to reproduce?
We have enough ugly people. If we take his kids now, and let them be raised by circus people, they might end up in a cage, biting the heads off chickens - where they belong.
The small hands and pervasive cabbage odor are a small price to pay.
 
2013-03-19 09:36:24 PM  

sbking: How would you feel if he was holding a bottle of bourbon (legal)???


60% of the trouble we have with alcohol and youth in this country is because we don't have kids drink.  It's a hell of a lot easier to control eleven-year-olds than nineteen-year-olds.
 
2013-03-19 09:36:28 PM  

feckingmorons: willfullyobscure: military-style weapon

But they're not military style weapons any more than Chicago Deep Dish Style is pizza (it is a casserole). Military weapons are selctive fire, they can and do fire fully automatic. The kid has a .22 caliber target rifle (it appears to me to be a S&W M&P 15-22) it is not automatic, it fires a rimfire cartridge, it costs about $500. The only similarity to a military rifle is cosmetic.

You just think they look scary and you want all the scary things to go away.


Correct. My argument is about style. A Model 70 can pierce an armored car. A Tikka T3 is a better sniper platform than anything the military uses. A Marlin 60 holds fifteen rounds and can be reloaded in 3 seconds(with a tube). None of these guns look like an AR-15 because they are purpose built- they are not fashion accessories. Guns should not be fashion accessories. We give up nothing by losing these tactifool firearms except the gun nut fantasy world of FEMA camps and Rambo wannabes.

My argument is that people who buy firearms in order to pretend they are bad ass Navy Ranger specops BUDS paratroopeals are fools, and we should not suffer fools gladly, because we do not want to live in a society where the civilian apes military dress, military manners, and so on.

You know who else encouraged the same kind of thing, even recruiting civilian corps of boys to engage in military style exercises and learn to fire military small arms? Who encouraged the fetishization of military culture and military garb? Do you?
 
2013-03-19 09:36:35 PM  

jaytkay: none of it is corroborated. The only source is his crappy blog.


feckingmorons: And his lawyer, and the pictures of the police, and many other sites who have spoken to the lawyer and corresponded with the man.


Cuz if you tell a bullshiat story and "many other sites" correspond with you it has to true.

That's some excellent detective work there, Lou.

And the guy just happened to be on speaker phone with his self-described gun law "expert" lawyer when he arrived home that day.

How conveeeenient!!
 
2013-03-19 09:37:25 PM  

badhatharry: feckingmorons: Well this has petered out. Lets post gun pictures. I own a Thompson 1928a1 fully automatic machine gun.

[www.nam.ac.uk image 480x361]

The Republicans should push for legislation to rollback the regulations on those.


I like it just the way it is. I don't want the value of my gun to drop. Too bad for the suckers that didn't get them in 86.
 
2013-03-19 09:37:27 PM  
4.bp.blogspot.com

Choirboys with machine guns.
The Pedophile Priest's worst nightmare.
Nobody would be molested if everybody
was required to carry bigger guns than the Clergy.

I love it when people post great pictures to threads.
And I love the smell of gunpowder tea in the morning.
 
2013-03-19 09:38:36 PM  

A Shambling Mound: I was 10.

[i.imgur.com image 528x424]

Looking back at this image it strikes me as funny that my dad very carefully taught me to release the mag and clear the weapon before handling it further but didn't say anything about keeping my finger off the goddamn trigger while he was taking pictures. I'm going to give him some grief about that, I think.


20 years later

ospois.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-03-19 09:39:23 PM  
NRA life memberships are $700 off during a promotion.

Three hundred bucks for a life membership in the NRA is sweet.
 
2013-03-19 09:39:33 PM  

willfullyobscure: Dressing your child up like a soldier, complete with deadly weapon, is a sign of mental illness or that you expect him to do or die.


It couldn't possibly be that the parent is trying to encourage his son to embrace the traditional virtues associated with being a soldier... after all, everyone of willfullyobscure's acquaintance knows that all soldiers are Nazis. And since every weapon by definition is "deadly", really any parent who allows their son or daughter to learn to shoot a gun is automatically an accomplice to murder, right? 

Either way, I'd say a little chat with a sane adult is in order.


You seem to be cool with having the State kidnap children merely because their parents, who have committed no crime, are instilling in them the same values that made their country great... you are not "sane" at all: you are a dangerous left- wing lunatic.
 
2013-03-19 09:40:11 PM  

brandent: http://www.hyattgunstore.com/youth-shotguns/You are living on another planet if you do not believe 10 year olds shoot weapons by the hundreds of thousands in this country.


I thought i was gay for a while because I loved my aunt's .410 so much when I was 11. Damn that was a great shooter. But my asshole cousins kept calling it "the ladies' shotgun, nyeeahhh"

Little did they know I beat off in their closet to their copies of Cosmo and Seventeen, those coonty biatches.
 
2013-03-19 09:40:58 PM  

jaytkay: And the guy just happened to be on speaker phone with his self-described gun law "expert" lawyer when he arrived home that day.


If you read the article he called his lawyer when his wife said the child protective service and cops where there, and he went immediately home.

I guess you didn't read the article.
 
2013-03-19 09:41:26 PM  

willfullyobscure: Dressing your child up like a soldier, complete with deadly weapon, is a sign of mental illness or that you expect him to do or die. Either way, I'd say a little chat with a sane adult is in order.


Funny thing.  I grew up in a military household.  My dad wasn't "dad", he was "sir".  I spend a lot of weekends at the range on base.  In the end, I joined the military and "do or die" became much more than a motto.  Are you suggesting this was wrong as well?  If so, things get really squirrelly.
 
2013-03-19 09:41:29 PM  

jigger: jso2897: jigger: jso2897: 5. father hits the internet with "THEY CUMIN FER OUR GUUUUNS!!!"

Are you saying they weren't coming for his guns?

I did not say that. Willfullyobscure said that, and I have no idea why you are quoting me as saying it. It's trivial, but that's really not very honest of you.

Woops. I guess I didn't pick up on the italics like I should have. O well.


Actually, I said that. According to the lawyer's statement, it was the child services agent demanding to see everything. The police were simply responding to the initial call, and there was no mention of them making any demands, ever.  The social services lady was the one making demands, and got pissed about having her "authority" bucked, and she made a bunch of shiatty threats (that never happened.)  She should be investigated and reprimanded at the very least. She is the villain in the story. But the father is acting like the orders were coming directly from law enforcement. Was he wronged? Yes. By law enforcement? No. But the gun nuts are going to lay all the blame on the police/fartbama.

I don't think people should be able to give tips anonymously.
 
2013-03-19 09:42:08 PM  

fnordfocus: EvilEgg: The article says the police were there, but I find it less than credible that the government official did not tell the cops her name.

I assume the police knew who she was, but that none of them would tell the parents.

In California, it's common for Officers to cover their badge numbers and name tapes with black tape.  I'm not surprised that civilians are getting in on the same anonymity action.


The legislature should slap them down *HARD*.  Say 6 months in jail for anybody in law enforcement that conceals their identity when it's supposed to be visible.

OgreMagi: So you aren't bothered that they showed up at all? There was no crime. There was no indication of abuse. IT was a picture of a kid holding a rifle. Why should that cause government scrutiny? There are far too many stories of CPS (Child Protective Service) grabbing kids for no reason and it taking years for the parents to regain custody. That nothing happened this time is a farking miracle.


Exactly.  Showing up, especially in force, is totally unjustified.

brandent: The article is complete b.s. but you should at least be aware that this is perfectly normal behavior in a vast portion of the US (by normal I mean within accepted norms). Remington makes a pink "youth" 20 gauge shotgun. There are all manner of pink guns for little girls. My son who is 10 is very upset with me because all his friends have guns already and get to go hunting (check the laws, many states don't even have legal minimum ages). I told him he must wait until he is 12. Just this weekend I was in Cabelas and we decided to just go see what a .22 would cost. The counter clerk tried to sell my 10 year old a .22 handgun that was small enough to fit in your front pants pocket.


Yeah, that's utterly out of line.  I'd tell management.

I have no problem with properly trained kids having firearms.  I have a big problem with trying to bypass the parents who know the kid.
 
2013-03-19 09:42:17 PM  
It's hard to tell the French choirboys from the Palestinian terrorists when they wear both wear berets and carry machine guns. Stop giving terrorist machine gun squads berets! Stop giving French choir boys machine guns to play with!

And have you ever noticed that the only way to tell Israel soldiers from Palestianian boys is their choice of weapon, namely machine guns versus rocks? (Rocks is the wrong choice, apparently, to bring to a machine-gun fight.)

Can't tell the players without a programme. Get your pograms here! Oops. Get your programmes, here!
 
2013-03-19 09:42:37 PM  

willfullyobscure: brandent: http://www.hyattgunstore.com/youth-shotguns/You are living on another planet if you do not believe 10 year olds shoot weapons by the hundreds of thousands in this country.

I thought i was gay for a while because I loved my aunt's .410 so much when I was 11. Damn that was a great shooter. But my asshole cousins kept calling it "the ladies' shotgun, nyeeahhh"

Little did they know I beat off in their closet to their copies of Cosmo and Seventeen, those coonty biatches.


The posting rules state that Fark is not anyone's personal erotica site. Perhaps you should read them, and wash your hands.
 
2013-03-19 09:44:58 PM  

jigger: 20 years later

[creepyfatguntoyguitarguy.jpeg]


Nice.
 
2013-03-19 09:47:14 PM  
Any post starting with the word "so" probably isn't worth response.

"So you think..."
"So it doesn't..."
"So they shouldn't have to..."

and etc. An experienced observation from a guy that's been discussing things with people on the Internet since the Usenet days. Do with it what you will.
 
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