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(Phoenix New Times)   Arizona wants to go full "Where birth certifcit whe" on anyone who uses a public restroom   (blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com) divider line 160
    More: Amusing, restrooms, Representative John Kavanagh, United States House Committee on Appropriations, bathrooms  
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14521 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Mar 2013 at 5:36 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-19 04:45:16 PM
Kavanagh's strike-everything amendment to Senate Bill 1432, which proposes the following:

B. A PERSON COMMITS DISORDERLY CONDUCT IF THE PERSON INTENTIONALLY ENTERS A PUBLIC RESTROOM, BATHROOM, SHOWER, BATH, DRESSING ROOM OR LOCKER ROOM AND A SIGN INDICATES THAT THE ROOM IS FOR THE EXCLUSIVE USE OF PERSONS OF ONE SEX AND THE PERSON IS NOT LEGALLY CLASSIFIED ON THE PERSON'S BIRTH CERTIFICATE AS A MEMBER OF THAT SEX.

C. SUBSECTION B OF THIS SECTION DOES NOT APPLY TO A PERSON WHO ENTERS A PUBLIC RESTROOM, BATHROOM, SHOWER, BATH, DRESSING ROOM OR LOCKER ROOM AND WHO IS OF A DIFFERENT SEX THAN THAT INDICATED ON THE SIGN IF THE PERSON IS ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:

1. ENTERING AS PART OF THE PERSON'S JOB RESPONSIBILITIES.
2. ENTERING TO GIVE AID OR ASSISTANCE TO ANOTHER PERSON.
3. A CHILD WHO NEEDS ASSISTANCE.
4. PHYSICALLY DISABLED.


So ... was he caught with a tranny recently?
 
2013-03-19 04:51:19 PM
remind me not to go potty in AZ. I'm lucky i have my driver's license on me. I'm not about to carry my birth certificate
 
2013-03-19 04:53:40 PM
Woo hoo, Arizona.  Making transsexualism a crime.  Way to go.
 
2013-03-19 04:58:57 PM

GAT_00: Woo hoo, Arizona.  Making transsexualism a crime.  Way to go.

 
2013-03-19 05:02:02 PM
It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?

/I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.
 
2013-03-19 05:10:59 PM

nekom: It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?


Doesn't bother me.  Then again, I don't live in Arizona where everyone seems to be afraid of their own shadow.
 
2013-03-19 05:12:13 PM
Give me your tired, your poor, your transgendered masses yearning to take a pee...
 
2013-03-19 05:22:10 PM
i3.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-03-19 05:25:02 PM
I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"
 
2013-03-19 05:25:55 PM
So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?
 
2013-03-19 05:27:12 PM

cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"


FYI: Fark is twice as hard when one is high from marijuana.

Lets try that again with a proper URL, shall we?
 
2013-03-19 05:28:39 PM
To bad we can get a national id. Good for citizen checks, voting and welfare programs.
 
2013-03-19 05:29:06 PM

cman: FYI: Fark is twice as hard when one is high from marijuana.


I hear that stuff can make you post the same tfd thread twice.
 
2013-03-19 05:30:36 PM

nekom: It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?

/I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.


Not in the slightest. I never really understood the whole men's and women's rooms, anyway.  If someone is a deviant predator waiting to abduct me or do something horrible in the bathroom, that "women's" sign isn't going to deter him, or make him say "oh wait, I can't be in here. Better go somewhere else."  I really don't care who is in the bathroom with me, so long as they aren't in the same stall as i am using - and I'd have a problem if a woman did that, as well.
 *shrug*

I really don't pay enough attention to people minding their own business and not bothering anyone to have the slightest care or concern to this end.
 
2013-03-19 05:34:23 PM

cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"


Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."
 
2013-03-19 05:34:34 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


A very naughty girl at the least
 
2013-03-19 05:35:00 PM
It sounds like its aimed at transgendered people.

/and drag queens who do bumps of cocaine in the ladies room.
 
2013-03-19 05:35:05 PM

cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.


But its sole purpose is to target those folk.
 
2013-03-19 05:36:23 PM

serpent_sky: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."


Thats not it.

Sometimes men could be waiting for a victim and get caught before they can do anything. We could not charge him on anything. Although he had yet to commit the crime of sexual assault, it could have still been his intention.

Thats just my opinion.
 
2013-03-19 05:37:46 PM

Slaxl: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

But its sole purpose is to target those folk.


Right now

But there is a chance to change that

Tack on an amendment with the language. If he votes against it he will be labeled an enabler of sexual assault.
 
2013-03-19 05:38:59 PM
The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly
 
2013-03-19 05:39:38 PM

cman: Slaxl: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

But its sole purpose is to target those folk.

Right now

But there is a chance to change that

Tack on an amendment with the language. If he votes against it he will be labeled an enabler of sexual assault.


I see, use his own bill against him... an interesting plan, but no one will go for it, because they don't want to be labelled an enabler of rights for all humans and a tolerant person. That'll cost you elections.
 
2013-03-19 05:42:54 PM

grinding_journalist: The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly


I'd vote for a ban on high capacity memes
 
2013-03-19 05:43:56 PM
Don't you see what they're trying to do???

1. Require birth certificate in order to use bathroom
2. Invite Obama down to "public" event
3. Serve him lots of beer...

It's brilliant, really...
 
2013-03-19 05:43:59 PM

grinding_journalist: The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly


i.imgur.com
 
2013-03-19 05:44:10 PM

cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"


Dude, it is specifically FOR transgendered folk. As in "If you're TG get the fark out of AZ... or at least don't even THINK about taking your perverted little self out in public."
 
2013-03-19 05:44:41 PM

grinding_journalist: The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly


No, subby is fine.  I don't have the picture that goes with it, though.
 
2013-03-19 05:44:47 PM
I vaguely remember going to a nightclub with a unisex bathroom. A very crowded unisex bathroom. I was so blitzed outta my mind that there was probably more going on in there than the rest of the club. Oh god, I was being hit on by a gay guy, wasn't I. I guess this is true....

sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2013-03-19 05:44:55 PM

unlikely: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Dude, it is specifically FOR transgendered folk. As in "If you're TG get the fark out of AZ... or at least don't even THINK about taking your perverted little self out in public."


cman: FYI: Fark is twice as hard when one is high from marijuana.

 
2013-03-19 05:45:05 PM

unlikely: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Dude, it is specifically FOR transgendered folk. As in "If you're TG get the fark out of AZ... or at least don't even THINK about taking your perverted little self out in public."


Annnnnnd I see this ground has already been covered. I'm going back to youtube videos of baby pangolins.
 
2013-03-19 05:45:06 PM
 
2013-03-19 05:45:52 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


Yes, if your bc says you're a woman.  Get in the kitchen where you belong!

/disorderly conduct's a misdemeanor
 
2013-03-19 05:46:43 PM
Representative Kavanagh,

No transsexual is interested in your dick and this isn't going to make them any more interested.
 
2013-03-19 05:47:49 PM
img810.imageshack.us

Would like a word.
 
2013-03-19 05:48:28 PM
Forget the transgenders, what if the men's room is out of order?  I mean, I follow the proper procedure and all- if it's a multi-person bathroom I call into the bathroom to make sure no women are there, leave a friend at the door to let people know I'm there... what about a one person bathroom?  I know lots of small shops that have two one person bathrooms.  You really want to make it a crime to use the wrong one?  (Why shops with just two bathrooms don't make two unisex bathrooms I don't know.)

And what about unisex bathrooms?  Is that ONLY for transgendered now?

I understand there is some fear that guys going in the women's bathrooms may be rapists.  Is a public nuisance law actually going to stop a rapist from going into a women's bathroom though?  So now that you have your only legitimate reason thrown out, why bully the people with gender identity issues?  (Of course, that's obviously the point, but let's call it out for the bigotry that it is.)
 
2013-03-19 05:49:28 PM

Tiiba: img810.imageshack.us

Would like a word.


That's the wizard from that monthly stick figure webcomic.
Is that still running? I used to like that one!
 
2013-03-19 05:50:46 PM
He seems like the type to refer to a transsexual as "it".
 
2013-03-19 05:50:57 PM

cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"


Also missing is a provision for out-of-order restrooms.  I suppose that could be taken care of by temporarily covering the gender sign on the working one.

But if he really wants to protect delicate sensibilities, he should ban unisex restrooms.  It makes me  sick to see bloody tampons in the toilet, and cooties are highly contagious!
 
2013-03-19 05:51:34 PM
votesmart.org

"Sometimes, not being a cop just isn't good enough to tap my foot. What if you used to be a woman?"
 
2013-03-19 05:52:22 PM

unlikely: Tiiba: img810.imageshack.us

Would like a word.

That's the wizard from that monthly stick figure webcomic.
Is that still running? I used to like that one!


It's weekly now.
 
2013-03-19 05:52:52 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


You would be robbing me of the petty satisfaction I get walking past an endless line of women waiting with their legs crossed as I breeze in and out of the men's room, so yes.
 
2013-03-19 05:54:20 PM

Relatively Obscure: grinding_journalist: The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly

No, subby is fine.  I don't have the picture that goes with it, though.


I see. I've been using "whar xxxx whar" for years and have seen it on many other forums; this is the first I'm seeing that picture or the quote/meme/reference in this context.
 
2013-03-19 05:55:53 PM

grinding_journalist: Relatively Obscure: grinding_journalist: The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly

No, subby is fine.  I don't have the picture that goes with it, though.

I see. I've been using "whar xxxx whar" for years and have seen it on many other forums; this is the first I'm seeing that picture or the quote/meme/reference in this context.


It's because it references the birth certificate. It's referencing that specific picture I posted.
 
2013-03-19 05:57:28 PM

gilgigamesh: what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?

You would be robbing me of the petty satisfaction I get walking past an endless line of women waiting with their legs crossed as I breeze in and out of the men's room, so yes.


You've never been to an opera, have you. The lines at the Gents are even longer than those at the Ladies. Elderly prostates can be a bugger.
 
2013-03-19 05:58:20 PM
pedophile republican poisons bill that would of allowed him to gain access into ladies room, but he didn't have any crippled people to assist, so he poisoned the bill.

/That seems to be the jizz of it.
//If he is not a pedobear, then he must be able to prove it with some type of government document.

Sarcasm? and what the fark is wrong with people who preach morals but stomp on puppies that pissed in his cornflakes.
 
2013-03-19 06:05:35 PM
The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.
 
2013-03-19 06:06:14 PM

Tillmaster: Elderly prostates can be a bugger.


Much to my chagrin--THIS.
 
2013-03-19 06:07:31 PM

HoratioGates: Forget the transgenders, what if the men's room is out of order?


I'm

out of order?  I'm out of order?  You're out of order!  This whole courtroom is out of order!  Attica!  Attica!  Attica!

/obscure?
 
2013-03-19 06:09:47 PM

pisceandreamer: Then again, I don't live in Arizona where everyone seems to be afraid of their own shadow.


Be fair.  It would be better to phrase this as "Then again, I don't live in Arizona, where most of the country sends its old racist grandfathers and uncles during cold weather, which is coincidentally also when everyone votes."
 
2013-03-19 06:10:27 PM

rickythepenguin: I'm out of order? I'm out of order? You're out of order! This whole courtroom is out of order! Attica! Attica! Attica!

/obscure?


encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com

RIP Serpico Brigante
 
CTRL + Q to Enable/Disable GoPhoto.itCTRL + Q to Enable/Disable GoPhoto.it
 
2013-03-19 06:10:40 PM
nekom: It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?


Nope, gone to gay bars where (duh) 90% of the people in the women's lavatory were men.  They were super nice and wanted to make sure I was comfortable or I wanted them to clear out.  As long as stalls have doors I don't care.
 
2013-03-19 06:11:12 PM
WTF with that thing?
 
2013-03-19 06:11:18 PM
Wait, so Arizonans will have to prove that they were born in America before they can use a public restroom? What about foreigners and illegal immigrants, will they have to piss in the bushes?
 
2013-03-19 06:12:53 PM
It's just a trick to get Obama's birth certificate next time he needs to take a presidential shiat at a Target in Glendale.
 
2013-03-19 06:13:36 PM
Arizona must be a really really boring place.

 

rebelyell2006: Wait, so Arizonans will have to prove that they were born in America before they can use a public restroom? What about foreigners and illegal immigrants, will they have to piss in the bushes?


Yes and then they will be sex offenders.
 
2013-03-19 06:13:59 PM

cman: serpent_sky: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."

Thats not it.

Sometimes men could be waiting for a victim and get caught before they can do anything. We could not charge him on anything. Although he had yet to commit the crime of sexual assault, it could have still been his intention.

Thats just my opinion.


I've used the ladies room when some guy is taking forever and the ladies room door is slightly ajar so obviously no one is in there and DAMMIT I JUST GOTTA PEE.  I really don't think that should be a crime.
 
xcv
2013-03-19 06:15:01 PM
Criminalizing the mentally ill, that always works out well.
 
2013-03-19 06:15:41 PM
I can't remember the last time I saw a public ladies room without stall doors. Why is this a thing? Who cares if the lady in the next stall has a peener in her undies. It's not like I have to look at it.
 
2013-03-19 06:16:21 PM
And how does this apply when there's a Unisex wheelchair restroom ADA sign on the door??

/just wonderin
 
2013-03-19 06:21:11 PM
"Where birth certifcit whe"

I have to say, this is kind of unfair on the birth certifict guy. If you look at the picture, he clearly isn't done writing. What did he intend that last word to be? Hard to say - most likely "where", but there are of course other possibilities, like "wheat", "whelp" and "Whedon"
 
2013-03-19 06:24:17 PM

Biological Ali: "Where birth certifcit whe"

I have to say, this is kind of unfair on the birth certifict guy. If you look at the picture, he clearly isn't done writing. What did he intend that last word to be? Hard to say - most likely "where", but there are of course other possibilities, like "wheat", "whelp" and "Whedon"


and "CERTiFcIT"?
 
2013-03-19 06:24:37 PM
I'm not transgendered, but every news report I read about Arizona makes me glad I have no reason to go there, ever.
 
2013-03-19 06:31:52 PM

Tiiba: It's weekly now.


Interesting... the first one dated 2013 is "#865" and "#880" is the most recent, though we're only 13 weeks into the year. More than weekly, apparently?

Barricaded Gunman: I'm not transgendered, but every news report I read about Arizona makes me glad I have no reason to go there, ever.


A whole bunch of my family moved there. If they want to see me they get to go to Colorado. I'm not going there, ever.
 
2013-03-19 06:33:47 PM
So basically, the GOP wants to ensure that they are only cruising for *genuine* men and boys in the restroom. We wouldn't want to be caught crusing with a post-op F to M, right?
 
2013-03-19 06:35:22 PM

Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.


That sort of logical thinking won't be tolerated in the aspie hugbox that is fark nowadays
 
2013-03-19 06:37:33 PM
If I go in a public restroom and someone asks me "paper, please", it better be because their stall is out of toilet paper.
 
2013-03-19 06:38:18 PM

unlikely: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Dude, it is specifically FOR transgendered folk. As in "If you're TG get the fark out of AZ... or at least don't even THINK about taking your perverted little self out in public."


I don't know, it's Arizona... they might be coming at it from a whole different angle. "Your hair seems a little too long 'Miguel', lets see that birth certificate."
 
2013-03-19 06:38:28 PM

raygundan: pisceandreamer: Then again, I don't live in Arizona where everyone seems to be afraid of their own shadow.

Be fair.  It would be better to phrase this as "Then again, I don't live in Arizona, where most of the country sends its old racist grandfathers and uncles during cold weather, which is coincidentally also when everyone votes."


Hey, my grandma moved out there voluntarily.
 
2013-03-19 06:40:13 PM
Yeah...  AZ is starting to scare me.  First SB 1070 and now this shiat,    I mean, isn't this supposed to be America?  Since when are WE the folks shouting "Zieten, bitte!"
 
2013-03-19 06:44:40 PM
The Tea Party stranglehold on the Legislature was hit during the November elections. Unfortunately, we've still got dicks like this in office. The GOP no longer has a super majority in both houses. This is good. Jan Brewer has bouts of sanity. This is good news. They are all still primarily GOP controlled. This is not.

But I'm starting to think they pissed off hispanics a bit too much, here. Watch for the tide to begin to shift in the coming elections.
 
2013-03-19 06:47:49 PM
I don't understand this. If you stand up to pee, you go to the bathroom with urinals. If you need a tampon, you go to the bathroom with the tampon machine. It's not a complicated thing. Besides, I know plenty of women who just bust into the men's bathroom with no farks given because the line is shorter.
 
2013-03-19 06:50:47 PM
I take it this guy wants to keep all the trannys for himself?

nekom: /I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.


This, and good luck trying to stop me from peeing in the men's room at a packed concert. Those women's room lines are rediculous!
 
2013-03-19 06:52:00 PM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: To bad we can get a national id. Good for citizen checks, voting and welfare programs.


And an absolute prerequisite for any gun purchase - amirite?
 
2013-03-19 06:53:10 PM
Meanwhile, in Europe....
 
2013-03-19 06:54:28 PM

duffblue: Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.

That sort of logical thinking won't be tolerated in the aspie hugbox that is fark nowadays


You call that logical? So we're supposed to put penis inspectors at the entrance now? What if someone is a hermaphrodite?

The suggestion isn't actually very different from the ridiculous amendment, and thus not worthy of anything but spite.

Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.


0/10 troll points.

At first I thought of awarding you points for pure shock value, but the more I considered it, the more I felt that your effort was clumsy and far too blatant.
 
2013-03-19 06:57:07 PM

nekom: It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?

/I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.


This is only because the men were patiently waiting for the women to say, 'ok who wants a blow job', and didnt want to jinx it.
 
2013-03-19 06:57:49 PM

Agent Smiths Laugh: duffblue: Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.

That sort of logical thinking won't be tolerated in the aspie hugbox that is fark nowadays

You call that logical? So we're supposed to put penis inspectors at the entrance now?.


Might as well just use the TSA; they're already trained in this field.
 
2013-03-19 06:58:29 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


I'm sure the local sheriff will just chose not to enforce that particular law in that case.
 
2013-03-19 06:58:54 PM

cman: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

FYI: Fark is twice as hard when one is high from marijuana.

Lets try that again with a proper URL, shall we?


Neither one of those stories had anything to do with adult males entering girls' restrooms.
 
2013-03-19 06:59:37 PM
I (female) once worked a concession stand at a major football stadium being used by the Promise Keepers - a male-only evangelical movement.  There were maybe 40,000 men there and 100 or so women.  During the rest breaks, men were just freely using the women's restrooms - and I couldn't have cared less.  If everyone's using a stall with a latchable door, as women's restrooms are generally set up, it genuinely doesn't matter much.

It is dumb as hell for legislation like this to declare every single one of those men guilty of a misdemeanor.  (They are still guilty of supporting Promise Keepers, but that's an entirely different problem.)
 
2013-03-19 07:06:30 PM
www.nmedia.net

Who needs birth certificates when there are plenty of highly trained specialists ready and willing to guard our lavatories?


/Just a grab 'll do ya
 
2013-03-19 07:07:19 PM
Unless there are other sections to this bill that were not posted in the article, it is pretty much unenforcible for the vast majority of restrooms.  I have seen the entrances to a few thousand public restrooms in the decades that I have been alive.  I have only seen a handful that meet the criteria that was laid out in the bill language.

AND A SIGN INDICATES THAT THE ROOM IS FOR THE EXCLUSIVE USE OF PERSONS OF ONE SEX

Most have a sign that just indicates sex such as "MEN" or "WOMEN" or the little stick figure guys.  They say nothing about "exclusivity" and can be viewed as suggestions.  Unless the bill specifically defines what it takes to meet the definition of "indicating exclusivity" then there's a problem.
 
2013-03-19 07:07:20 PM

cman: serpent_sky: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."

Thats not it.

Sometimes men could be waiting for a victim and get caught before they can do anything. We could not charge him on anything. Although he had yet to commit the crime of sexual assault, it could have still been his intention.

Thats just my opinion.


GOD you are an ass! Why not make it illegal to carry bibles, since they are so often used to roll up a doobie? Sometimes they haven't ripped the paper out but this would take care of that.

you ass.
 
2013-03-19 07:10:07 PM

kevinatilusa: If I go in a public restroom and someone asks me "paper, please", it better be because their stall is out of toilet paper.


Or if they left their pipe at home!
 
2013-03-19 07:14:02 PM
azmarijuana.com

Are you a whizzer?
 
2013-03-19 07:15:28 PM
Proposing to use the law in order to express/enforce a widely accepted social norm?

Insanity!
 
2013-03-19 07:16:36 PM
Business as usual for the party of small government... Unless it has something to do with with sex/gender choices of complete strangers. Do not license your weapons, that would do no one any good. DO license your artificial vagina though, because who knows how much damage that could cause.
 
2013-03-19 07:19:15 PM
www.efficientdrinker.com

PAPERS, CITIZEN!
 
2013-03-19 07:19:33 PM
Your tax's dollars at work.

Remind me again which is the party of "small government"?
 
2013-03-19 07:19:37 PM

angrymacface: grinding_journalist: The meme is "whar xxxxx whar" not "where xxx whe".

/if you use memes, use them responsibly

[i.imgur.com image 477x417]


well, subby spelled "CERTiFicT" wrong and put it in the wrong spot.
 
2013-03-19 07:20:23 PM
I should add that it is just a coincidence that this bathroom attendant is of the
African-American persuasion.I was looking for an old white guy.
 
2013-03-19 07:20:51 PM
So does this mean gay and lesbian sex in the bathrooms is ok but straight sex isn't? Gotcha.
 
2013-03-19 07:26:58 PM

Tiiba: [img810.imageshack.us image 327x322]

Would like a word.


I believe in that world there are "Elves' rooms" for just that purpose.
 
2013-03-19 07:27:26 PM
I'd support it if they tacked on a section banning theme restaurants from using gimmicky names for the genders.  ok, this room is for "stagehands" and that room is for "russlers", but which one of those am I?
 
2013-03-19 07:27:33 PM
Having separate 'men' and 'women' restrooms should be illegal and unethical as having 'white' and 'colored' restrooms.

There should be one main room with the sinks, hand dryers, baby changing table, etc. and modesty stalls for everyone who doesn't want to be seen. If you don't want to see, just don't look.

"Separate but Equal" does not work.
 
2013-03-19 07:28:20 PM

grinding_journalist: I see. I've been using "whar xxxx whar" for years and have seen it on many other forums; this is the first I'm seeing that picture or the quote/meme/reference in this context.


You're referring to the accompanying Rush Limbaugh meme where he's captioned saying "Whar Pudding Whar?!"

That one came after the first one and was an adaptation.

I'm sure someone will do me the favour of posting it as I'm hard at work at my .gov job.
 
2013-03-19 07:28:46 PM
The only time Arizona is in the news is when one of their legislators comes up with something so inane they are in the news all over the world.  Something in the water there or they are just born like that.   They need some fresh immigrant blood and good migrant genes.  How about some good Mexican smarts.
 
2013-03-19 07:29:31 PM

a61sun: And how does this apply when there's a Unisex wheelchair restroom ADA sign on the door??

/just wonderin


Your mistake is assuming that they actually gave this idea more than five minutes of thought.
 
2013-03-19 07:30:48 PM
Take it from a guy who has two birth certificates, cause you never know when you'll want to impress someone you meet in a pubic toilet that you're younger than you seem.

votesmart.org
 
2013-03-19 07:33:23 PM

serpent_sky: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."


Protip: when they play the "for the children" card, no matter what they are trying to restrict and which side of the aisle they're on, what a politician is really saying is "this will restrict <some group> which I dislike because they disagree with me/are icky/are brown."
 
2013-03-19 07:33:39 PM

Bumblefark: Proposing to use the law in order to express/enforce a widely accepted social norm?

Insanity!


Anything, extended to a sufficiently absurd length, is insane. Insanity is mainly a matter of degree.
 
2013-03-19 07:43:08 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-03-19 07:44:42 PM
WHAR 'ARIZONA' TAG?  WHAR?

/seriously, they're giving FL a run for their money in the 'derp' department.  political derp vs. 'here, hold my beer' derp; which is worse?
 
2013-03-19 07:45:12 PM

Amos Quito: [www.nmedia.net image 400x276]

Who needs birth certificates when there are plenty of highly trained specialists ready and willing to guard our lavatories?


/Just a grab 'll do ya


shinybadge.com

ok sir or ma'am i jes needs ta see yer state-issued ID and then i needs to checks insid'ja asshole...
 
2013-03-19 07:47:26 PM
as in "whe"t stone?

or dhry stone
???
 
2013-03-19 07:47:29 PM

Benjimin_Dover: Unless there are other sections to this bill that were not posted in the article, it is pretty much unenforcible for the vast majority of restrooms.  I have seen the entrances to a few thousand public restrooms in the decades that I have been alive.  I have only seen a handful that meet the criteria that was laid out in the bill language.

AND A SIGN INDICATES THAT THE ROOM IS FOR THE EXCLUSIVE USE OF PERSONS OF ONE SEX

Most have a sign that just indicates sex such as "MEN" or "WOMEN" or the little stick figure guys.  They say nothing about "exclusivity" and can be viewed as suggestions.  Unless the bill specifically defines what it takes to meet the definition of "indicating exclusivity" then there's a problem.


Interesting idea. And you're probably right.
 
2013-03-19 07:50:28 PM
i29.photobucket.com

What about a restroom for dolphins...?
 
2013-03-19 07:54:46 PM

serpent_sky: nekom: It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?

/I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.

Not in the slightest. I never really understood the whole men's and women's rooms, anyway.  If someone is a deviant predator waiting to abduct me or do something horrible in the bathroom, that "women's" sign isn't going to deter him, or make him say "oh wait, I can't be in here. Better go somewhere else."  I really don't care who is in the bathroom with me, so long as they aren't in the same stall as i am using - and I'd have a problem if a woman did that, as well.
 *shrug*

I really don't pay enough attention to people minding their own business and not bothering anyone to have the slightest care or concern to this end.



I have a female friend who used a men's bathroom once in an emergency.  She reported afterwards that it was horrible for her knowing that that the person in the next stall was a man.  Granted, she's a bit neurotic (though not homophobic or transphobic), but apparently women really not wanting men in the ladies' room is a real thing.

On the other hand, being bisexual, I can tell you one of the advantages of dating someone of the opposite sex is that when you excuse yourself and go to the bathroom, there's no chance of your date following you in.  I wouldn't mind unisex bathrooms in general, but on a date, I would love there to be some sort of protocol that prevented your date from using the same bathroom as you.
 
2013-03-19 07:55:29 PM
The best politician is one that just blocks all new laws from being passed.
Very rare.
 
2013-03-19 07:56:25 PM
TFA:  Republican Representative...

NO shiat...A REPUBLICAN??1?
 
2013-03-19 07:58:22 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


Nah. Just show me your tits, and I promise I won't tell on you.
 
2013-03-19 07:59:54 PM
Stopped reading at "Arizona"

www.ushmm.org
 
2013-03-19 08:03:44 PM

serpent_sky: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."



It's quite the well-known canard in the transgender community that transphobes THINK transwomen are "really" just perverted, deviant men who want to go into women's restrooms for voyeuristic thrills.

It's ridiculous, of course.  If there was really some big danger of people going into bathrooms in order to get their jollies spying on others, then you'd be a lot more worried about gay men and lesbians.  And no, I'm not denying that there -are- people who want to spy on women using the bathroom.  I know that there are whole websites devoted to that kind of thing.  I'm just saying that the perverts aren't the ones contemplating sexual reassignment surgery.  You don't cut your penis off because you think it's going to help you get laid.

Also, no, I'm not saying that it's necessarily perverted or wrong to get a sexual thrill from watching someone use the toilet.  But if that's what floats your boat, talk your girlfriend into letting you watch or something.
 
2013-03-19 08:14:44 PM
I think this should pass and that cross dressers, pre-op trannies, transgendered folk with "male" on their BC, and anyone else you can scrounge up that freaks out straight males should descend upon Arizona like a plague of locusts. And drink a lot of water.
 
2013-03-19 08:17:26 PM

Tiiba: [img810.imageshack.us image 327x322]

Would like a word.


"Yeah, Frost, but the one that you had was a male!"
images2.wikia.nocookie.net
"It don't matter when it's Arcturian, baby!"
 
2013-03-19 08:18:10 PM

jso2897: Bumblefark: Proposing to use the law in order to express/enforce a widely accepted social norm?

Insanity!

Anything, extended to a sufficiently absurd length, is insane. Insanity is mainly a matter of degree.


Yeah, and I fail to find what is so "extreme" in this measure. If anything, it simply makes an explicit violation of something that has historically been regulated through "disorderly conduct" statutes, etc.

That's a good thing, however you feel about segregated bathrooms. If you support them, it gives you a clear basis for a complaint over a violation. If you oppose them, it give a clear target for a legislative or legal challenge.
 
2013-03-19 08:20:59 PM
Arizona's derp level is now so far off the scale is can no longer be measured.
 
2013-03-19 08:21:21 PM
i470.photobucket.com
Dads still need to be able to take their sons and daughters into the bathroom.
Moms still need to be able to take their daughters and sons into the bathroom.

Sometimes the only bathroom with a diaper changing station is in the bathroom labeled for women.
Dads can't change diapers there?
Baby boys can't get changed in the bathroom labeled for women?

Some lawmakers need to stop being obsessed with what everyone is doing with their genitals.
 
2013-03-19 08:22:10 PM

Biological Ali: "Where birth certifcit whe"

I have to say, this is kind of unfair on the birth certifict guy. If you look at the picture, he clearly isn't done writing. What did he intend that last word to be? Hard to say - most likely "where", but there are of course other possibilities, like "wheat", "whelp" and "Whedon"


Yeah.  It's a little-known fact, but he's actually a HUGE Firefly fan.

/They took the birth certificate from me :(
 
2013-03-19 08:23:08 PM

ciberido: but apparently women really not wanting men in the ladies' room is a real thing


Not wanting a black in the ladies' room was a real thing too. Doesn't mean it's something we should tolerate.

Besides that, her real complaint sounds like "I didn't feel like the stall provided enough privacy" not "someone with a penis was within 6' of me while I peed". That's a bathroom design issue, not a gender issue.
 
xcv
2013-03-19 08:23:23 PM

PC LOAD LETTER: I think this should pass and that cross dressers, pre-op trannies, transgendered folk with "male" on their BC, and anyone else you can scrounge up that freaks out straight males should descend upon Arizona like a plague of locusts. And drink a lot of water.



Like abortion, government and men should have no decision in this. Leave it to the agency of individual women if they wish to tolerate adult bio-males in their restroom or instead ask them to wait outside.
 
2013-03-19 08:24:10 PM
Sounds like a disabled creeper free-for-all.
 
2013-03-19 08:25:45 PM

grimlock1972: Arizona's derp level is now so far off the scale is can no longer be measured.



"ciberido, do we have derpsign?"
www.duneinfo.com
"grimlock1972, we have derpsign the likes of which even God has never seen. "
 
2013-03-19 08:27:43 PM
Make no mistake, this is what Arizona is aiming for:

whereintheworldispatty.com
 
2013-03-19 08:28:39 PM

nekom: It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?

/I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.


Hey, let's ask for volunteers to express a very personal, yet easily ridiculed position! The world is not made up entirely of Farkettes. Their opinions do not represent the real world.

That said, the legislator is a farking creep. There is a VERY clear commit point when it comes to transgender and it's not on the birth certificate.
 
2013-03-19 08:29:06 PM

Gleeman: Meanwhile, in Europe....


Yeah...
farm1.staticflickr.com

/think there's some weird version for females too
 
2013-03-19 08:32:15 PM

penthesilea: Baby boys can't get changed in the bathroom labeled for women?


Exceptions are spelled out pretty clearly. TFA's not that long.

Some lawmakers need to stop being obsessed with what everyone is doing with their genitals.

No argument here. This is a stupid law. But it's best to understand it before criticizing it because of something it doesn't do.
 
2013-03-19 08:32:58 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


Don't pull that shiat in Stubenville!
 
2013-03-19 08:34:53 PM

Sgt.Zim: serpent_sky: cman: I would see nothing wrong with this if there was language added to protect transgendered folk.

You gotta admit, there is a litlebit of logic concerning "grown men go into girls bathroom for children"

Because there are no laws on the book that protect children from adult predators now?
Because that sign on the door, or that "disorderly conduct" charge is really going to make a predator say "never mind..." and go home and have a cup of tea and do the crossword instead?

It's blatantly obvious this is just a little "f-you" to transsexual and transgender people and when they realized just how blatant it was, they padded it out with some "protecting the little girls" bullshiat.  Because by this logic, who is protecting the girls from female predators? Or the boys from male predators? Maybe they need children only bathrooms because of this epidemic of child molesters in the bathrooms in AZ!  Or, you know, they just want to make like a little more difficult for, while further marginalizing, trans people and it has nothing at all to do with "the children."

Protip: when they play the "for the children" card, no matter what they are trying to restrict and which side of the aisle they're on, what a politician is really saying is "this will restrict <some group> which I dislike because they disagree with me/are icky/are brown."


This is why I should be in charge, running a mostly-benevolent mostly-dictatorship.

Then my law would be, "If you're proposing a 'for the children' statute, you need a 85% majority vote to pass."  If it's a genuinely good law, then it will have no trouble passing.  If it's a GOPishly disguised bigotry move, then go fark yourselves.
 
2013-03-19 08:41:10 PM

vernonFL: It sounds like its aimed at transgendered people.

/and drag queens who do bumps of cocaine in the ladies room.


No, I'd say it's aimed EXCLUSIVELY at transgendered men who use the ladies room. I can't imagine for one second they even thought about transgender women using the men's room (because men know those don't exist). But it's also aimed at perverts who are dressed as women for the sole purpose of diddling little children in the ladies room, who presumably are only transgendered men, because we all know they're perverts anyway.

Which raises an interesting question. Given that little children often need Mommy's help in the potty, and the law allows children to be in the "other gender" bathroom by its language (C(1)), at what age can "children" no longer be in the wrong-gender bathroom without running afoul of this law? Any age below 18? When it starts getting creepy to have a teenage boy in the girl's room? What's the cutoff age?
 
2013-03-19 08:42:53 PM

ciberido: grimlock1972: Arizona's derp level is now so far off the scale is can no longer be measured.


"ciberido, do we have derpsign?"
[www.duneinfo.com image 850x360]
"grimlock1972, we have derpsign the likes of which even God has never seen. "


Mohadib!
 
2013-03-19 08:49:48 PM
Well, guess I am not going down to visit my Mom in Tucson anytime soon. I don't have a copy of my birth certificate, and would have to wait months to get one from Germany. By that point, I would probably urinated on myself, so I think I will just avoid the issue totally.
 
2013-03-19 09:01:43 PM
cman:

Thats not it.

Sometimes men could be waiting for a victim and get caught before they can do anything. We could not charge him on anything. Although he had yet to commit the crime of sexual assault, it could have still been his intention.

Thats just my opinion.


Already  got laws for Public nuisances, threatening behavior, and good old fashioned trespassing.

If that ain't enough there's bigger problems.
 
2013-03-19 09:20:59 PM

what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?


Yes, if a man in the reverse situation would be a felon. It's only fair.
 
2013-03-19 09:26:18 PM

duffblue: Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.

That sort of logical thinking won't be tolerated in the aspie hugbox that is fark nowadays


Insult everyone else here about their lack of logic, yet fail to show you have used any at all.

Under this proposed law and the logical 'penis' rule, which bathroom would a post op female to male transgender individual be able to legally use?
 
2013-03-19 09:31:14 PM

DustBunny: grinding_journalist: I see. I've been using "whar xxxx whar" for years and have seen it on many other forums; this is the first I'm seeing that picture or the quote/meme/reference in this context.

You're referring to the accompanying Rush Limbaugh meme where he's captioned saying "Whar Pudding Whar?!"

That one came after the first one and was an adaptation.

I'm sure someone will do me the favour of posting it as I'm hard at work at my .gov job.


i830.photobucket.com
 
2013-03-19 09:33:50 PM
(damn, clicked too soon to add CSB)

My brother, while at a mall in Dallas, had to pee like a racehorse and found a woman blocking the men's room door (two stalls, three urinals). "My friend is in there and she had to go bad" said the door guard. "So do I" said my brother, who pushed his way past the woman, and used the urinal before he wet his pants. The woman in the stall began to scream, mall cops entered and found the woman still in the stall and my brother using the urinal. Both women continued yelling, the real cops were called and both the women were cited for disorderly conduct. Nothing happened to my brother.

Me? I've been in the men's room twice when women entered to use a stall, citing their "emergency need". Didn't bother me. We all gotta pee.
 
2013-03-19 09:58:21 PM
WAY TO GO ARIZONA!!!!  Anything to check for illegals, and get them the hell out of this country!!
 
2013-03-19 10:00:29 PM
God dammit, lemme RTFA first.

God DAMN.

I'll be back.
 
2013-03-19 10:06:27 PM

Fury Pilot: duffblue: Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.

That sort of logical thinking won't be tolerated in the aspie hugbox that is fark nowadays

Insult everyone else here about their lack of logic, yet fail to show you have used any at all.

Under this proposed law and the logical 'penis' rule, which bathroom would a post op female to male transgender individual be able to legally use?


Well, by including the word "legally", your question sort of confuses the norm (i.e., the "penis" rule) with the proposed law (i.e., the birth certificate designation). You seem to assume this creates an ethical paradox.

Except, it doesn't. AZ (like most every state, nowadays, as far as I'm aware) will reissue your birth certificate to reflect a change of sex.
 
2013-03-19 10:07:03 PM
More: Amusing, restrooms, Representative John Kavanagh, United States House Committee on Appropriations, bathrooms

More? There can never be enough United States House Committee on Appropriations threads!
 
2013-03-19 10:19:50 PM
Holy shiatweasels.

A) glad to live in California, land of the fruits n nuts

B) had a really interesting digestive malady for some months [fixed right up with a simple calcium citrate+vitamin D supplement]
that made me extremely aware of where EVERY goddamned publicly available bathroom was in my usual haunts, only once
did I need to sneak into the guy's restroom cuz my guts abruptly decided to yank the f*ck outta the loud handle AND THIS ASSHOLE WOULDA PINNED A FELONY ON ME!!??

C) frak Arizona right in the ear
 
2013-03-19 10:44:32 PM

Nadie_AZ: Kavanagh's strike-everything amendment to Senate Bill 1432, which proposes the following:

2. ENTERING TO GIVE AID OR ASSISTANCE TO ANOTHER PERSON.


Easy solution.  Just say you entered to check if anyone needed assistance.  Duh.
 
2013-03-19 11:25:49 PM
If you don't have your birth certifcit on you, just take a dump in the street.  Arizona can use the upgrade.
 
2013-03-19 11:49:58 PM

Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.


Well, if it's that important to everyone, okay. I don't have one, so I'll use the ladies' room. I have a full beard and a bass voice, but I'm sure everyone will be totally comfortable with my presence there.
 
2013-03-19 11:50:07 PM

Tillmaster: gilgigamesh: what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?

You would be robbing me of the petty satisfaction I get walking past an endless line of women waiting with their legs crossed as I breeze in and out of the men's room, so yes.

You've never been to an opera, have you. The lines at the Gents are even longer than those at the Ladies. Elderly prostates can be a bugger.


I was in a beach bar's men's room when a bikini babe rushed, peeled down her bottoms, and squatted without even closing the stall's door.  Talk about Miss Demeanor!
 
2013-03-19 11:52:02 PM
If you had gone to the underware party at the downtown Congress hotel in Tucson, Arizona last year, you would have seen all of the twenty eight sexes there.
 
2013-03-19 11:57:08 PM

Draq: I don't understand this. If you stand up to pee, you go to the bathroom with urinals. If you need a tampon, you go to the bathroom with the tampon machine. It's not a complicated thing. Besides, I know plenty of women who just bust into the men's bathroom with no farks given because the line is shorter.


Once again. If you see someone with a full beard and a deep voice going into a ladies' room, is that going to be more or less comfortable than seeing that same person in a men's room? It's both more and less complicated than you seem to "think". It's more complicated because someone who looks like one gender but has the pee parts of a different gender could actually make people much more uncomfortable by going into the bathroom that matches the parts nobody will see rather than the one that matches the parts everyone will see. It's less complicated in that if you simply mind your own business and stop paying so much attention to other people in public bathrooms, there really wouldn't be a problem for anyone.
 
2013-03-19 11:59:33 PM

Bumblefark: Fury Pilot: duffblue: Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.

That sort of logical thinking won't be tolerated in the aspie hugbox that is fark nowadays

Insult everyone else here about their lack of logic, yet fail to show you have used any at all.

Under this proposed law and the logical 'penis' rule, which bathroom would a post op female to male transgender individual be able to legally use?

Well, by including the word "legally", your question sort of confuses the norm (i.e., the "penis" rule) with the proposed law (i.e., the birth certificate designation). You seem to assume this creates an ethical paradox.

Except, it doesn't. AZ (like most every state, nowadays, as far as I'm aware) will reissue your birth certificate to reflect a change of sex.


This thread is about a proposed law about access to bathrooms based on gender on birth certificate, so it is perfectly reasonable to hold the 'penis' rule up to scrutiny under the proposed law.

DuffBlue's attempted insult implies support for the rule, the rule is logically inconsistent with the topic at hand, so calling his attempt to insult others on the basis of logical superiority is reasonable.

Also, your dismissal of the contradiction is based on a false premise:

Even two minutes on wikipedia found me this:
Almost all U.S. states permit the name and sex to be changed on a birth certificate, either through amending the existing birth certificate or by issuing a new one. Only Idaho, Ohio, Tennessee, and Texas refuse to change the sex, though Texas will do so if a court order is presented. The legislatures and courts of many states, however, including Missouri, have not addressed this issue. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_aspects_of_transsexualism_in_the_ Un ited_States

So there are at least 4 US states and any number of foreign countries that would not provide birth certificate changes.
 
xcv
2013-03-20 12:05:47 AM

grimnir: Draq: I don't understand this. If you stand up to pee, you go to the bathroom with urinals. If you need a tampon, you go to the bathroom with the tampon machine. It's not a complicated thing. Besides, I know plenty of women who just bust into the men's bathroom with no farks given because the line is shorter.

Once again. If you see someone with a full beard and a deep voice going into a ladies' room, is that going to be more or less comfortable than seeing that same person in a men's room? It's both more and less complicated than you seem to "think". It's more complicated because someone who looks like one gender but has the pee parts of a different gender could actually make people much more uncomfortable by going into the bathroom that matches the parts nobody will see rather than the one that matches the parts everyone will see. It's less complicated in that if you simply mind your own business and stop paying so much attention to other people in public bathrooms, there really wouldn't be a problem for anyone.



Bathrooms? Transspecies otherkin should be allowed to pee and shiat outside in public as long as they bring a pooper-scooper.
 
2013-03-20 12:17:38 AM

wambu: what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?

Yes, if a man in the reverse situation would be a felon. It's only fair.


I tend to agree with you.  There is a tendency in the USA to see men as sexual predators but give women a free pass.
 
2013-03-20 12:56:35 AM

Fury Pilot: Bumblefark: Fury Pilot: duffblue: Thisbymaster:

This thread is about a proposed law about access to bathrooms based on gender on birth certificate, so it is perfectly reasonable to hold the 'penis' rule up to scrutiny under the proposed law.


Sorry, I don't see it. The argument was that the "penis rule" is absurd because it produces an absurd legal result under the proposed law. Except, the penis rule doesn't say anything about one's legal sex, and the proposed law says nothing about penises. If you want to appeal to context, that's fine, but context is always going to be a matter of interpretation as to what is and isn't "reasonable"...

DuffBlue's attempted insult implies support for the rule, the rule is logically inconsistent with the topic at hand, so calling his attempt to insult others on the basis of logical superiority is reasonable.

Yeah...I really don't care about the pissing match element, here...

Also, your dismissal of the contradiction is based on a false premise:

Even two minutes on wikipedia found me this:
Almost all U.S. states permit the name and sex to be changed on a birth certificate, either through amending the existing birth certificate or by issuing a new one. Only Idaho, Ohio, Tennessee, and Texas refuse to change the sex, though Texas will do so if a court order is presented. The legislatures and courts of many states, however, including Missouri, have not addressed this issue.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_aspects_of_transsexualism_in_the_ Un ited_States

So there are at least 4 US states and any number of foreign countries that would not provide birth certificate changes.


"Most every" doesn't mean, "all." It means, "nearly all" -- which means, "some aren't." I didn't bother listing off the exceptions, but I certainly acknowledged them. If I acknowledged them, that probably means they weren't too critical to the point I was making...

The point was that there really isn't much of a contradiction when you take into account the fact that AZ allows re-issues of birth certifications. The argument pretty clearly implied that the dilemma for the post-op person is that their present physical form by necessity doesn't match their birth certificate. In AZ that's just not the case.

I suppose we can now more narrowly fret about the post-op Idahoan passing through AZ and in need of a bathroom...but, I doubt I'm going to be too sympathetic to the conclusion that, because the proposed law is substantially unfair to those people, it follows that the AZ law must be absurd one.

Seems to me, the problem is with the Idaho (etc.) laws. As a practical matter, local laws can really only address their own circumstances.
 
2013-03-20 01:59:36 AM
1. This is a proposed law, not an actual one.  Our avoidance of Arizona can maintain its current level for now.
2. It's a misdemeanor, not a felony.
3. This guy is still an ass.

/transgender
 
2013-03-20 02:46:30 AM
Arizona kind of reminds me of a small country in Europe:

static.twoday.net
 
2013-03-20 04:05:18 AM

serpent_sky: nekom: It's only March, but so far this may well be the dumbest idea I've heard all year. It has been pointed out that transsexuals (post or pre-op) are FAR better off going to the ladies room. But let's ask the Farkettes: Does that bother ANY of you at all? Honestly?

/I've seen women in the mens room at concerts, no one cared.

Not in the slightest. I never really understood the whole men's and women's rooms, anyway.  If someone is a deviant predator waiting to abduct me or do something horrible in the bathroom, that "women's" sign isn't going to deter him, or make him say "oh wait, I can't be in here. Better go somewhere else."  I really don't care who is in the bathroom with me, so long as they aren't in the same stall as i am using - and I'd have a problem if a woman did that, as well.
 *shrug*

I really don't pay enough attention to people minding their own business and not bothering anyone to have the slightest care or concern to this end.


I once went camping with a good friend from high school who I'd known was gay for years. Because we stayed up late around the camp fire having some drinks and just hanging out later than anyone else, he came into the female rest room with us (my other female friend who also knew him) when it was toof-brushing time. It was actually kind of fun just continuing to hang out while finishing getting ready for bed.

I don't necessarily want to share a rest room with most random men, but some are ok. It comes down to attitude.
 
2013-03-20 09:23:24 AM

penthesilea: [i470.photobucket.com image 500x500]
Dads still need to be able to take their sons and daughters into the bathroom.
Moms still need to be able to take their daughters and sons into the bathroom.

Sometimes the only bathroom with a diaper changing station is in the bathroom labeled for women.
Dads can't change diapers there?
Baby boys can't get changed in the bathroom labeled for women?

Some lawmakers need to stop being obsessed with what everyone is doing with their genitals.


I hadn't even thought of that, I just assumed this was a bill directly aimed at the transgendered, and maybe it is but this is an important aspect as well. When my daughter was younger, I took her into the mens room to change her. No one cared.
 
2013-03-20 09:48:38 AM
This looks like a good place for this.

fark you assholes with your cute and confusing bathroom door signs.
 
2013-03-20 10:38:17 AM
Oh, and I feel safer.
 
2013-03-20 02:47:20 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: what_now: So, if I use the men's room because its empty and there' are four chicks waiting in line for the ladies, I'm a felon?

A very naughty girl at the least


A Miss Demeanor.
 
2013-03-20 05:38:45 PM

Thisbymaster: The is simple if you have penis you use the men's room, regardless of your clothing or mental illness.


I was going to give you a 0/10 for the mental illness reference, but it made me chuckle. So I bumped your score up to 1/10.
 
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