Now That's What I Call a Taco!: Yes, that's a threat with a lot of anger towards the victim, but it doesn't blame her for getting raped.
jso2897: If you're sober enough to get a hardon
precious_crotchflake: Actually, GAT_00 really DID argue that it's worse for men. Quoted verbatim.
GAT_00: As bad as it still is for women who are victims of rape, it is actually worse if a man gets raped by a woman. The almost universal reaction is of disbelief.
stonicus: But rape is about power, not sex. So even if you cut their junk off, they still gonna rape you with a cucumber, ya know, for the powerz
ADHD Librarian: Your 'facts' are manifestly untrue. The conviction rate where the victim is male is higher than when the victim is female.
CeroX: ADHD Librarian: What is the exact opposite of this? If a sober woman forces herself on a drunk man the law says that is ok?I'm not saying this is true for all areas... but as stated above: By definition, sexual attacks on males are excluded from the rapeThat's the law for some areas, not my opinion... if it's forced or coerced it's rape... Not exactly being overly emotional here, so i don't understand the sudden hate... I agree with you, so if i worded something badly feel free to correct it...
ADHD Librarian: Perhaps in some (even many?) jurisdictions a rape must include penetration, but that doesn't mean that a sexual assault without penetration results in a nice police officer saying "you are in the clear, go back home, nothing to see here."
the ha ha guy: ADHD Librarian: Your 'facts' are manifestly untrue. The conviction rate where the victim is male is higher than when the victim is female.The conviction rate only measures those who make it into court. But when the police make threats against the victim for daring to go against the status quo, the case never makes into court in the first place.
nickerj1: Can anyone clarify what exactly happened during "the act"? All the news reports I've read throw the word "rape" around like candy at a parade, and then don't actually talk about what legally constituted the rape. The NYT summary indicates one of the boys played with her titties and stuck his finger in her hooha. Did one of them actually use their penis and penetrate her butthole or hooha?And I'm going to pose a question, or discussion instigation, which will completely piss off a bunch of people and probably have me labeled a rape apologist or some other BS. But here's the moral conundrum I'm posing, based on what I know about the actual act, and some assumptions to make it more arguable:Apparently the girl was completely unconscious and unaware of what was going on and she didn't have any recollection of the act.Assume the guy(s) penetrated her with his dong in her butthole/hooha, but not excessively or forcibly, perhaps gently, in such a way that resulted in no physical damage to the girl.This results in a situation where, after the act, the girl is completely emotionally/mentally and physically unaffected and unharmed by the act. If you didn't tell her it happened, she'd have no clue it ever happened. Her future life would be unaffected by the act. We're talking just the act here and the effect of the act, not the effect of the social media blowup and trial, etc.In such a situation (given the above assumptions) is the act morally wrong? Has the girl been wronged? Should the guy(s) be penalized? How significantly?Is the above situation any morally different than: drawing a penis on your passed out friend's forehead? shaving your friend's head hair off while they're passed out drunk? clipping your friend's toenails while they're passed out drunk?If you ignore moral preconceptions, is it any different than the above scenarios?
ExperianScaresCthulhu: /but i forogt: women are eternally blameless the unconscious cannot give consent, or put another way
Deucednuisance: cardex: not defending the guysYes, you are.It's pretty hard to "consent" or "say no" or do much of anything blameworthy when you're farking unconscious.So, have you heard that one of these fine student-athletes offered three dollars to any of his teammates who would piss on the girl while she was vomiting in the street? And that more than a few got their three dollars?Not that you would "defend" such people, heaven forbid.
ADHD Librarian: Is she not entitled to her day in court until you feel that enough men have had their say?
ExperianScaresCthulhu: Peekachicka: I really "adore" how many people say things like "don't drink stoopid" or "why did her parents let her go out" when horrible situations like this come up. As if they never snuck out of their bedroom window, lied that they were going to a movie with a friend only to meet someone else, or had their first experience with (insert type of alcohol that they're never touching again here). When someone else is in a terrible situation all of a sudden they become saints.Except that just like not everyone started having sex at the age of 12, not everyone became a blackout drunk by 14. Like in that recent story of the kids who died in the car crash, who were accused of stealing the car they drowned in (except for the kid who was pinned under it in the pond after the car hit the barrier) -- not everyone experiments with grand theft by the age of 15.For her, if she doesn't want this to happen again, the advice is indeed: DONT DRINK. She needs to deal with her alcoholism, and whatever is driving her to engage in enough well known sexual escapades to be considered one of the school's doorknobs.
the ha ha guy: ADHD Librarian: Perhaps in some (even many?) jurisdictions a rape must include penetration, but that doesn't mean that a sexual assault without penetration results in a nice police officer saying "you are in the clear, go back home, nothing to see here."Really? Tell that to the three officers who literally laughed in my face when I tried to press charges.
ADHD Librarian: So, if the 'voiceless men of the world' are your concern, express your concern by shouting down any people, any laws and any Farkers who are apologists for rapist. When a woman has her day in court don't moan that a man didn't but say loudly "good, I'm glad that rapist got his comeuppance" and see if you can help create a society where no one would stand around and watch something like this happen. It shouldn't take too much work, because most people seem to be able to hold a party and have a drink without raping anyone and it can't be much of a stretch to go from not raping anyone to being willing to stop any rapes you see.
Peekachicka: Just because people put themselves in certain situations doesnt mean they should be taken advantage of. No one should be shot just because they wear the color blue, no one should be kidnapped because they were walking home from school alone, and no one should be raped just because they had too much to drink.
ADHD Librarian: But as so many people have pointed out, plenty of women are ignored (given the gender ratio of victims, probably more women are ignored than men) doesn't make it right but isn't the take home message 'listen when someone says they were raped' rather than making it somehow about gender?
stonicus: How soon before lying to a girl invalidates her giving of consent and turns the act into rape
quickdraw: LovingTeacher: I just listened to a call in news show (on NPR of all places) where a man called in and said he "hoped he wouldn't have done something like that if the opportnity presented itself when he was younger but, well, boys will be boys". I'm sorry but from 18-22 I lived in a crazy party house where someone was as wasted as that girl at least once or twice a week and nothing like that ever happened nor would it have been allowed to happen. Too many people are excusing the behavior and blaming the victim. I just don't see how you can be so lacking in empathy that you not only let something like this happen but make the victim the butt of jokes. I know it is not something new and has happened probably for as long as humans have gathered in tribes but I just don't get it.I like you. Welcome to TF.
OgreMagi: The appropriate punishment for that inbred, dickweed town would be for the other high schools in their league to refuse to play any sports against them. Sure, the Stuebenville school would win by default, but it would be an empty, meaningless win. It would deny them their only reason for existence.
quickdraw: [sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net image 610x610]
Popular Opinion: raised on mtv, simpsons and family guy.giggityrole models? bill clinton, kobe bryant....
stonicus: ADHD Librarian: So, if the 'voiceless men of the world' are your concern, express your concern by shouting down any people, any laws and any Farkers who are apologists for rapist. When a woman has her day in court don't moan that a man didn't but say loudly "good, I'm glad that rapist got his comeuppance" and see if you can help create a society where no one would stand around and watch something like this happen. It shouldn't take too much work, because most people seem to be able to hold a party and have a drink without raping anyone and it can't be much of a stretch to go from not raping anyone to being willing to stop any rapes you see.Much easier said than done...On a different note... It's just anecdotal, but I've yet to meet a woman in my life who says she hasn't been a victim of sexual assault at some point in her life. Not one.
GregoryD: You want to blame something? How about now every kid at the age of 10 sees every kind of rape, murder, suicide, dead body, beheading, sexual act on the internet? By 12 they've seen every kind of depravity known to man and suddenly you are surprised that they are desensitized to fingerbanging a drunk girl?
stoli n coke: FunkOut: puffy999: Athletics trumps all when it comes to young society.The ability to understand advanced mathematics or chemistry is nothing compared to running, jumping, catching,rolling over, and fetching.You might want to understand a little more biology, there, Professor. Athletic ability is an indicator of strengh, which is attractive in the hunter/gatherer sense. Just like the root of attraction to large breasts and nice hips is indicative of a woman who can have and take care of children more easily.It's been part of our DNA since the caveman days. Back then, the guys who whined about not getting chicks because they understood advanced math usually froze to death.
23FPB23: In the high school hallsIn the shopping mallsConform or be cast outSubdivisions --In the basement barsIn the backs of carsBe cool or be cast out
stonicus: ADHD Librarian: So, if the 'voiceless men of the world' are your concern, express your concern by shouting down any people, any laws and any Farkers who are apologists for rapist. When a woman has her day in court don't moan that a man didn't but say loudly "good, I'm glad that rapist got his comeuppance" and see if you can help create a society where no one would stand around and watch something like this happen. It shouldn't take too much work, because most people seem to be able to hold a party and have a drink without raping anyone and it can't be much of a stretch to go from not raping anyone to being willing to stop any rapes you see.Much easier said than done...
ExperianScaresCthulhu: Mock26: robohobo: By all accounts from kids i her school, this girl was a train depot at parties.So what? If she is conscious and says "Yes" to the entire basketball team then that is her decision. If she is passed out and does not give consent then it is no longer her decision. At that point it is rape.That first part isn't true. All she has to do is claim that she felt forced or afraid and that's why she said yes and spread her legs and suddenly the whole basketball team is marked as rapists.The dudes were big dummies because you're supposed to record sexual acts to prove that someone was willing, if they try to accuse you after the fact: The Tupac rule. And then i remember some of these kids weren't even conceived when Tupac was murdered. But you record sexual acts to cover your ass. If you can't cover your ass, don't do it.As for the school doorknob, well, hopefully this is a wakeup call for her. What's the betting odds on whether she continues to engage in risky sexual behavior versus cleans her act up?
OgreMagi: cardex: Benevolent Misanthrope:When a woman is raped, she is generally the one on trial, and has to prove she didn't ask for it. Which pisses me off on alot of levels, because - even if she did consent, this implies that a woman doesn't have the right to say, "Stop."Sick, but that's the way it is. It's the prevailing tactic for rape defense, and was absolutely openly used in this case.She has every right to say no up to the point it's over, not 2 weeks later then decide it was rape not defending the guys but in this place they are only 33% to blame the girl is 17% and her parents are 50% for not teaching her not to get shiat face drunk and farking every guy in townOh, look. Another moron defending the rapists. No, she is 0% responsible for getting rape. When you pass out drunk with supposed friends, you get sharpie moustache picture posted on facebook that you laugh about the next day. You don't get dragged unconscious from party to party, half naked, and sexually abused.The blame is on the rapists, their parents for not teaching them right from wrong, and the community for creating and encouraging this kind of behavior.
superdude72: WTF is up with kids posting this shiat from their Twitter accounts. Is it *that hard* to use email? Or for something that truly needs to remain private, a note tied to a brick and thrown through a window?
ADHD Librarian: Oh, wait, you did you giant steaming moran. But, in fact some shenanigans involving the drunken are in fact illegal and at this point in time drawing Harry Potter glasses and a lightning bolt scar on someone is in the 'legal' column while 'sexual assault' is not.
quickdraw: A rape is not a sexual encounter. If you understand it as just another form of physical assault then it's pretty straightforward. The perpetrator is solely at fault and cannot be a victim.
deanis: Mock26: robohobo: By all accounts from kids i her school, this girl was a train depot at parties.So what? If she is conscious and says "Yes" to the entire basketball team then that is her decision. If she is passed out and does not give consent then it is no longer her decision. At that point it is rape.This guy is way too interested in the underage rape victim. He is now labeled pedo guy
James F. Campbell: Generation_D: Sh*theel local politics and good-ol-boy bullcrap in a famously football-centric town were winning out until international lights were shone, which is where Anonymous came in.That's a bit surprising to me, given how much Anonymous favors rape.
deanis: ExperianScaresCthulhu: deanis: SundaesChild: GregoryD: I played high school football. I never raped anyone.In fact, I gained no additional respect/favors/dates from anyone playing football even though I was one of the best players on the team. I started every varsity game for three years and I was the team captain my senior year. I didn't even go to my proms.Just because this town has some farked up problems, don't somehow bunch every school/town/football program together. That is just stupid........I just don't agree with where you're going with it. Again, they farked up.Is there any actual proof there was anything in her system beyond enough alcohol to make a Russian pass out? Or is that just on the same level as 'possibly penetrating her anally'?/To Young Men: Young Women are not your equals, so don't treat them the same way you'd treat other young menThis explains a lot.
CeroX: quickdraw: ADHD Librarian:/As an interesting aside though (and I asked this question myself during a recent training session on counselling teenagers on matters of sexuality, but no one could (or would?) answer it clearly. Too many lawyers in the room for anyone to offer a free opinion).In a situation where someone is impaired by alcohol (yay, teenage party), they are unable to (by law in most jurisdictions) consent to a sexual encounter. If both participants are impaired, how does a legal system decide which one is the rapist? Or, could it be (like with teenage self portraits) that one person can be both the victim AND the perpetrator of the crime?A rape is not a sexual encounter. If you understand it as just another form of physical assault then it's pretty straightforward. The perpetrator is solely at fault and cannot be a victim.accept according to the LAW, minors are incapable of giving consent... so that person's point, is that LEGALLY speaking, 2 people who are 14 who have sex, are, by LAW incapable of consensual sex, therefore, WHO is the rapist by LEGAL definition?This isn't your opinion, OR the opinion of the general populace... we ALL know that if someone forces or coerces themselves on a person who didn't consent to sex that it's rape... but there are soft issues, such as 2 people who the law says are incapable of making a consensual sexual decisions... so who's "at fault"? The law simply turns a blind eye to those situations or it criminalizes the males because males are defaulted as the aggressor where women are concerned...So put aside YOUR opinion and look at the law as it is writtenSeriously, i hope you are never on jury, you can't seem to look at the law objectively, and certainly incapable of looking at rape objectively, and more than willing to sling mud at those of us who look at rape from a legal standpoint and therefore look at the cases objectively... Just come out and admit that you are incapable of having a rational objective c ...
ExperianScaresCthulhu: Anonymous goes around 'raping' people by displaying their private information,
precious_crotchflake: thisone: Dafatone: GAT_00: Add this to the fact that some women have been shown to simply cry rape if they regretted a decision to sleep with someone because it would ruin a relationship, or simply cry it for attention, and there are still severe problems all around.Someday we'll have a thread on this subject where "cry rape" doesn't get brought up.Someday.I'm female, I have a friend who has been raped. My ex was accused of rape by a woman who, as we found out, had a history of "crying rape" or sexual assault whenever she was fired from a job.farked up, entitled people do exist and instead of just getting thrown out of court she should have been thrown in jail. I've no doubt she's just gone on to do it again.My ex just wanted the whole thing over with, he was so broken from having to go through it.Oh well then, your cool-story-sis vignette here proves every strawman argument about crying rape that there ever was, eh?
lacydog: http://publicshaming.tumblr.com/This has to be the saddest tumblr I have ever found. Humanity blows.
TopoGigo: It happens. Nobody knows how often it happens, but it definitely happens. While the words "cry rape" are pretty insensitive, the fact remains that it is hard to prove that any particular woman was "date raped". (God, how I hate that term.)So, WTF can we do about it? We can't assume that any accuser is automatically telling the truth. We can't assume that any accuser is automatically lying. We can't assume that any accuser is automatically exaggerating. We can't read their f*cking minds. Polygraphs are inadmissible in court, for what I can only assume are good reasons. The only thing I know to do is to tell girls to fight. At least if there are physical injuries, there is evidence. Punch, claw, scratch, kick, bite. And accept that you might get your face irreparably smashed in, or your life abruptly ended. WTF, that doesn't work, either.
Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.
When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.
Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.
You need to create an account to submit links or post comments.
Click here to submit a link.
Also on Fark
Submit a Link »
Copyright © 1999 - 2017 Fark, Inc | Last updated: Aug 22 2017 14:55:31
Runtime: 0.743 sec (743 ms)