If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(CBS Atlanta)   Worst...healer...ever infects 16 with HIV   (atlanta.cbslocal.com) divider line 77
    More: Dumbass, HIV, Prevention in Atlanta, United Press International, CBS Atlanta  
•       •       •

9252 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Mar 2013 at 4:16 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



77 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2013-03-19 12:23:32 AM
Is the scary tag hiding under that table, sobbing quietly, subby?


The only way I can imagine this is that the "unlicensed acupuncturist who's also a music teacher" re-used needles from patient to patient or something.

*shudder*
 
2013-03-19 12:36:05 AM

johnnieconnie: Is the scary tag hiding under that table, sobbing quietly, subby?


The only way I can imagine this is that the "unlicensed acupuncturist who's also a music teacher" re-used needles from patient to patient or something.

*shudder*


I imagine that's how it happened, yes.  Which is why you really should avoid all kinds of hippy-dippy, scientifically unproven, woo-woo bullshiat when it comes to medical treatment.  That also counts acupuncture, chiropractors, homeopathy, faith healers, and Marvin Gaye.
 
2013-03-19 12:53:28 AM
Good grief, are acupuncture needles that expensive?  Even if they are, a jug of rubbing alcohol to soak them in between patients isn't.  This seems almost too shortsighted and dumb to have been a purely accidental.
 
2013-03-19 12:59:52 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Good grief, are acupuncture needles that expensive?  Even if they are, a jug of rubbing alcohol to soak them in between patients isn't.  This seems almost too shortsighted and dumb to have been a purely accidental.


Seriously?  The guy is an amateur acupuncturist.  It surprises you that he may not have proper training, or may not believe in things like germ theory or sanitation?  Or care about regulations?
 
2013-03-19 01:03:41 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: TuteTibiImperes: Good grief, are acupuncture needles that expensive?  Even if they are, a jug of rubbing alcohol to soak them in between patients isn't.  This seems almost too shortsighted and dumb to have been a purely accidental.

Seriously?  The guy is an amateur acupuncturist.  It surprises you that he may not have proper training, or may not believe in things like germ theory or sanitation?  Or care about regulations?


I have no medical training and even I know that putting needles into one person then into another person without sterilizing them first is just a recipe for bad news.  You'd think that this guy would have at least read a book about acupuncture first to know where to even stick the needles, and it might have mentioned sanitation/sterilization at some point.
 
2013-03-19 01:09:06 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Benevolent Misanthrope: TuteTibiImperes: Good grief, are acupuncture needles that expensive?  Even if they are, a jug of rubbing alcohol to soak them in between patients isn't.  This seems almost too shortsighted and dumb to have been a purely accidental.

Seriously?  The guy is an amateur acupuncturist.  It surprises you that he may not have proper training, or may not believe in things like germ theory or sanitation?  Or care about regulations?

I have no medical training and even I know that putting needles into one person then into another person without sterilizing them first is just a recipe for bad news.  You'd think that this guy would have at least read a book about acupuncture first to know where to even stick the needles, and it might have mentioned sanitation/sterilization at some point.


I'm inclined to believe you also know better than to stick needles into people based on a book you read.  Or start performing minor surgery because of a library book you checked out once.

Not that it was impossible for him to know, but it doesn't surprise me that he might not think it necessary, or perhaps didn't believe in "the establishment" germ theory.
 
2013-03-19 01:15:36 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: TuteTibiImperes: Benevolent Misanthrope: TuteTibiImperes: Good grief, are acupuncture needles that expensive?  Even if they are, a jug of rubbing alcohol to soak them in between patients isn't.  This seems almost too shortsighted and dumb to have been a purely accidental.

Seriously?  The guy is an amateur acupuncturist.  It surprises you that he may not have proper training, or may not believe in things like germ theory or sanitation?  Or care about regulations?

I have no medical training and even I know that putting needles into one person then into another person without sterilizing them first is just a recipe for bad news.  You'd think that this guy would have at least read a book about acupuncture first to know where to even stick the needles, and it might have mentioned sanitation/sterilization at some point.

I'm inclined to believe you also know better than to stick needles into people based on a book you read.  Or start performing minor surgery because of a library book you checked out once.

Not that it was impossible for him to know, but it doesn't surprise me that he might not think it necessary, or perhaps didn't believe in "the establishment" germ theory.


You probably have a point.  I forgot about all of the people who believe in chemtrails, water fluoridation conspiracies, or that vaccinations cause autism.  I'm just not good at thinking from the POV of a nut.
 
2013-03-19 01:18:50 AM
If these idiots realized acupuncture was bullshiat and that the placebo effect is extremely powerful, they wouldn't have had this problem.
 
2013-03-19 01:22:27 AM
Probably just a rogue pretending to be a healer to scam young adventurers.  I seen it before in my line of work.
 
2013-03-19 03:54:15 AM
Might I suggest popping a vicodin and downing a double of bourbon? Much safer.
 
2013-03-19 04:18:07 AM
i173.photobucket.com
 
2013-03-19 04:19:29 AM
Am I the only one who expected this to be sex-related somehow?
 
2013-03-19 04:23:03 AM
Are they positive?
 
2013-03-19 04:26:06 AM
Acupuncture may only be a step or two above homeopathy in terms of actually working but you would think that even the lowest grade moron would do better than this...

On the upside it will ultimately turn in to a bogus story about how acupuncture spreads HIV and people will quit paying these quacks for fake treatments. Try to find the silver lining... Nah, it's still horrible, that didn't help.
 
2013-03-19 04:40:11 AM
Another round of acupuncture and they'll be fine.
 
2013-03-19 04:41:04 AM
Religious dogma once again f*cks the poor. Who knew?
 
2013-03-19 04:42:03 AM

randomjsa: Acupuncture may only be a step or two above homeopathy in terms of actually working but you would think that even the lowest grade moron would do better than this...

On the upside it will ultimately turn in to a bogus story about how acupuncture spreads HIV and people will quit paying these quacks for fake treatments. Try to find the silver lining... Nah, it's still horrible, that didn't help.


 the Iceman from The Alps had tattoos over acupuncture points.  Unless he didn't.  But anyway, some say he did.  I also read that acupuncture and chiropractic, along  with garlic and vinegar can cure almost  anything,  and will also  stop you from getting things.  And at least Homopaths talk to you to find out whats wrong, instead of just doing tests.
 
2013-03-19 04:43:19 AM
How's that psuedoscience taste now, biatches?
 
2013-03-19 04:44:19 AM
BUT he was also a music teacher
 
2013-03-19 04:45:29 AM
What a prick.
 
2013-03-19 04:48:32 AM

puffy999: Am I the only one who expected this to be sex-related somehow?


No, you are not. And this thread thus disappoints me, because I expected some doc with AIDS drilling his patients.

:(

Not some retard shaman with dirty needles infecting suckers. This is too sad to post a picture of a retarded pug.
 
2013-03-19 04:52:16 AM
Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.
 
2013-03-19 04:59:11 AM

AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.


And then go back for 400 more treatments. Find a physical therapist you idiot.
 
2013-03-19 05:01:12 AM
TuteTibiImperes: You probably have a point.  I forgot about all of the people who believe in chemtrails, water fluoridation conspiracies, or that vaccinations cause autism.  I'm just not good at thinking from the POV of a nut.

That's essentially the exact same demographic that believe in acupuncture and chiropractic nonsense, so... yeah, I'm not terribly surprised that they'd go one past being ignorant of science and medicine and cross over into actively denying basic known facts of biology in ways that end up being dangerous.

//Well, believing in the medicinal value of acupuncture and chiropracty, rather, I'm pretty sure they both exist, unfortunately I've seen it.
 
2013-03-19 05:02:50 AM
4.bp.blogspot.com

Worst... Meme... Ever...
 
2013-03-19 05:22:26 AM
Yeah, music teachers are always who I go to for healing.  Hard to feel sorry for people this stupid.
 
2013-03-19 05:26:40 AM
I would hope these charges are all for murder. Is there something in place for long time range murder? There's sure to be a precedent, with some skanky person who knows they have aids or hiv farking people.

If only there was worse than the death penalty.
 
2013-03-19 05:30:16 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: johnnieconnie: Is the scary tag hiding under that table, sobbing quietly, subby?


The only way I can imagine this is that the "unlicensed acupuncturist who's also a music teacher" re-used needles from patient to patient or something.

*shudder*

I imagine that's how it happened, yes.  Which is why you really should avoid all kinds of hippy-dippy, scientifically unproven, woo-woo bullshiat when it comes to medical treatment.  That also counts acupuncture, chiropractors, homeopathy, faith healers, and Marvin Gaye.


'Son, this is the last forty-five you're ever going to listen to.'

/elderly joke
//bad taste
///hint of slashy
 
2013-03-19 05:34:35 AM

farkingismybusiness: What a prick.


Elderly physician is about to administer an injection to a sweet young thing.

'Now you're just going to feel a little prick.'

The patient bats his eyelashes.

'Why doctor, we've hardly even met.'

/ Brought to you by Cali gay humor
// You're welcome
 
2013-03-19 05:40:11 AM

AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.


Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

And thus spreading infection merrily among the innocent supplicants.
 
2013-03-19 05:56:56 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Benevolent Misanthrope: TuteTibiImperes: Benevolent Misanthrope: TuteTibiImperes: Good grief, are acupuncture needles that expensive?  Even if they are, a jug of rubbing alcohol to soak them in between patients isn't.  This seems almost too shortsighted and dumb to have been a purely accidental.

Seriously?  The guy is an amateur acupuncturist.  It surprises you that he may not have proper training, or may not believe in things like germ theory or sanitation?  Or care about regulations?

I have no medical training and even I know that putting needles into one person then into another person without sterilizing them first is just a recipe for bad news.  You'd think that this guy would have at least read a book about acupuncture first to know where to even stick the needles, and it might have mentioned sanitation/sterilization at some point.

I'm inclined to believe you also know better than to stick needles into people based on a book you read.  Or start performing minor surgery because of a library book you checked out once.

Not that it was impossible for him to know, but it doesn't surprise me that he might not think it necessary, or perhaps didn't believe in "the establishment" germ theory.

You probably have a point.  I forgot about all of the people who believe in chemtrails, water fluoridation conspiracies, or that vaccinations cause autism.  I'm just not good at thinking from the POV of a nut.


So why are you hanging out with the rest of us here?
 
2013-03-19 06:00:57 AM

SpeedyBB: AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.

Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

And thus spreading infection merrily among the innocent supplicants.


Hook, line, and sinker.
 
2013-03-19 06:02:34 AM

SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).


I'll keep that in mind the next time they send the US a shipment of contaminated drywall or dog food and toys contaminated with toxic materials.
 
2013-03-19 06:20:44 AM

SpeedyBB: AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.

Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

And thus spreading infection merrily among the innocent supplicants.


Just because something has been done/believed for a long time does not mean it actually works. Otherwise we should immediately add prayer and faith healing to the list of medically approved therapies.
And the Chinese not being superstitious... er no. My Chinese inlaws believe in a whole host of weird whacky superstitious crap.
 
2013-03-19 06:21:35 AM
Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

I understand it just fine thank you. I am a PT, and if you don't want to follow sound advise, by all means keep paying your chiropractor all of your money. OR... Go see a licensed Physical Therapist and get to the root of your problem/pain. Its up to you. I'm going to bed now. All free medical advice ends here.
 
2013-03-19 06:22:18 AM
This is so farked up.
 
2013-03-19 06:22:26 AM
acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.
 
2013-03-19 06:28:25 AM

SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition


hehehehe, errrrrr..... ummmm...

Im in Beijing right now and they ARE given to superstition. More so than any other race or group I have met. Particularly when it comes to medicine. There are no controls over medicine for the most part. There is a lot of good medicine but it is naive to make the claim that they are not given to superstition.
 
2013-03-19 06:29:42 AM

willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo
 
2013-03-19 06:30:21 AM

SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition,


And that's how I know this post is a troll. Marriages spike on "auspicious" days with good astrological numbers, millions are paid for ground-up rhino horns to improve virility because horns look kinda like a boner, and every other business run by Chinese seems to have 8 somewhere in the name just because it shares a pronunciation with wealth or luck or whatever it was. The Chinese are probably the single most visibly superstitious group I know of. And that's despite the fact that I know Pakistanis whose parents still worry about djinn.
 
2013-03-19 06:33:55 AM
A good chiropractor will work you into a routine where you need treatment less and less, because you suffer from less pain. The best ones also study other treatment methods as well.

The best combo I have ever had for working with my spinal injury was a combo of the chiro, accupuncture, deep tissue massage and treatments on my lower back with a tens unit, turned up pretty high to compensate for the nerve damage.

Physical therapy works good for the recovery stage of things, the other stuff I've gotten treated with works great for the upkeep afterward when it's done by someone that is practical and not all hippy dippy about it. The excersices from my physical therapy only get me so far before I wind up doing something stupid and need an adjustment. As I've seen it, it's the only thing that keeps me on this side of losing the use of my legs. It's not fun when that happens. Don't wanna wind up there again.
 
2013-03-19 06:40:52 AM

SpeedyBB: Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.


Define "medical history".  The only medical history I'm aware of is when chiropractic has been clinically tested against the claims that it makes, and has been found wanting.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition...

You've got to be kidding.

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

You're right, you should fully understand anything that you talk about, before you talk about it.  Fortunately, I understand chiropractic just fine, and so I'm able to talk about what unmitigated bullshiat it all is.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

Ah, that tired old trope, the Galileo Gambit.  Unfortunately for you, using this gambit successfully requires not only that you are scorned by the establishment, but that you are also correct.
 
2013-03-19 06:46:23 AM

willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.


The reason for this is well known and understood.  Most telling is that it doesn't matter if the patient is receiving "proper" acupuncture or not - people who receive either "real" or "sham" acupuncture report positive results.
 
2013-03-19 07:08:31 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: I imagine that's how it happened, yes. Which is why you really should avoid all kinds of hippy-dippy, scientifically unproven, woo-woo bullshiat when it comes to medical treatment. That also counts acupuncture, chiropractors, homeopathy, faith healers, and Marvin Gaye.


Whether or not you believe in the efficacy of acupuncture, I think the moral of the story is to avoid unlicensed doctors. I mean, heart surgery has a pretty proven track record, but you wouldn't let your soccer coach perform a bypass because he read a book and looked at some websites. The acupuncture clinics I've been to were just as clean as any hospital with doctors who had received multiple years of training at universities.
 
2013-03-19 07:24:01 AM
This guy's the worst healer ever?

Not according to every pug i've participated in.

/right before I /ragequit during the tank's pull
 
2013-03-19 07:24:16 AM

Thats_right_ALL_the_tea: SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition,

And that's how I know this post is a troll. Marriages spike on "auspicious" days with good astrological numbers, millions are paid for ground-up rhino horns to improve virility because horns look kinda like a boner, and every other business run by Chinese seems to have 8 somewhere in the name just because it shares a pronunciation with wealth or luck or whatever it was. The Chinese are probably the single most visibly superstitious group I know of. And that's despite the fact that I know Pakistanis whose parents still worry about djinn.


Of course they are, haven't you seen those movies?
 
2013-03-19 07:24:52 AM
his gear was ungemmed and unenchanted, and worst of all, his spec was dps
 
2013-03-19 07:33:16 AM

Dinobot: his gear was ungemmed and unenchanted, and worst of all, his spec was dps


Even DPS-spec I can heal better than 90% of ...

you know what, just nevermind
 
2013-03-19 07:33:18 AM

Deacon Blue: Homopaths


NTTAWWT
 
2013-03-19 07:40:19 AM

RobSeace: Deacon Blue: Homopaths

NTTAWWT


Nobody's complimented  me on my troll yet.  I thought it was pretty good
 
2013-03-19 07:43:54 AM

SpeedyBB: AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.

Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

And thus spreading infection merrily among the innocent supplicants.

farm9.staticflickr.com

 
2013-03-19 07:51:58 AM

Benevolent Misanthrope: That also counts acupuncture, chiropractors, homeopathy, faith healers, and Marvin Gaye.


Heh.
 
2013-03-19 08:29:20 AM

Deacon Blue: RobSeace: Deacon Blue: Homopaths

NTTAWWT

Nobody's complimented  me on my troll yet.  I thought it was pretty good


2/10.  Not enough bites before you revealed it as a troll.
 
2013-03-19 08:30:18 AM

SpeedyBB: AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.

Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

And thus spreading infection merrily among the innocent supplicants.


THIS ONE, however, I have to rate as at least a 7/10.
 
2013-03-19 08:48:13 AM
I would hunt him down and kill him with a baseball bat and a blow torch.
 
2013-03-19 08:51:55 AM

robohobo: I would hope these charges are all for murder. Is there something in place for long time range murder? There's sure to be a precedent, with some skanky person who knows they have aids or hiv farking people.

If only there was worse than the death penalty.


Yes, there is attempted murder charges for spreading HIV intentionally, this  being negligence though, I am curious if it'll be "Attempted negligent manslaughter"

What worries me is who did the prick stick, that started giving everyone HIV.
 
2013-03-19 08:59:25 AM
And to think, this could have been all avoided by putting little condoms on the needles.

SeraphicSorcerer: robohobo: I would hope these charges are all for murder. Is there something in place for long time range murder? There's sure to be a precedent, with some skanky person who knows they have aids or hiv farking people.

If only there was worse than the death penalty.

Yes, there is attempted murder charges for spreading HIV intentionally, this  being negligence though, I am curious if it'll be "Attempted negligent manslaughter"

What worries me is who did the prick stick, that started giving everyone HIV.


It may be possible that the first individual didn't know they were infected and could be counted in the 16.
 
2013-03-19 09:04:50 AM

lack of warmth: And to think, this could have been all avoided by putting little condoms on the needles.

SeraphicSorcerer: robohobo: I would hope these charges are all for murder. Is there something in place for long time range murder? There's sure to be a precedent, with some skanky person who knows they have aids or hiv farking people.

If only there was worse than the death penalty.

Yes, there is attempted murder charges for spreading HIV intentionally, this  being negligence though, I am curious if it'll be "Attempted negligent manslaughter"

What worries me is who did the prick stick, that started giving everyone HIV.

It may be possible that the first individual didn't know they were infected and could be counted in the 16.


That's what I was thinking, and I think any blood related activity, (especially new places) need to be told you have HIV, that being said, he should still be sterilizing before doing the sticking. What worries me more is, are there even more out there that now don't even know they have it.
 
2013-03-19 09:11:58 AM
This place says you definitely need to tell your primary care, and it's a part of your medical record once your HIV status is known.

That being said unsure where beyond that goes. But out of safety, large gashes, or anyplace where blood could be a worry for contamination, It's your obligation I believe.

Like I said, if this was sex related, there would be 16 counts of Attempted murder, and possible premeditation or aggravating circumstances may be applied to the charges depending on the district

IANAL however, but I do know that law.
 
2013-03-19 09:23:53 AM
SeraphicSorcerer:
It may be possible that the first individual didn't know they were infected and could be counted in the 16.

That's what I was thinking, and I think any blood related activity, (especially new places) need to be told you have HIV, that being said, he should still be sterilizing before doing the sticking. What worries me more is, are there even more out there that now don't even know they have it.


This.

Always sterilize instruments, and if there is any moment of doubt get yourself tested.  Porn stars complain about having to use condoms, but every time one of them come up HIV-pos they all have to be tested before they can continue filming, well the pros.  Testing and sterilizing standards are the only reason why we don't have the crazy problems of Aids seen in some African countries.  The threat is going to always be there.
 
2013-03-19 09:57:23 AM
SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstition,

lolwut? Chinese medicine still today, as in right now, are still using tiger penis, elephant skins, and tusks, leopard skins, parts of north american bear, rhino horn, endangered turtles, etc, as medicine. It is a multi-billion dollar black market in China. They are easily the single MOST superstitious people in the world today today, if not in all of history. Or maybe they take second after India. They have a large market for "dragon bones" fer chissakes.
 
2013-03-19 10:01:08 AM

karmachameleon: willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.

The reason for this is well known and understood.  Most telling is that it doesn't matter if the patient is receiving "proper" acupuncture or not - people who receive either "real" or "sham" acupuncture report positive results.


It's funny that you don't understand that even the "sham" acupuncture techniques are actually considered to be alternative methods of stimulating the points, and this is was documented more than 2000 years ago.

Western medicine is so out of it's depth on this that it can't even come up with adequate testing protocols, and yet you put blind faith into a system that actively discouraged basic sanitation and fed children heroin on purpose less than 100 years ago.

What's more you seem to be completely unaware that modern, scientific research is being carried out at a breakneck pace in China on traditional medicine and there's any number of excellent adjunct treatements and therapies in use over there because of that. They even do invasive surgery with nothing but acunpuncture and NSAIDs.
 
2013-03-19 10:06:40 AM

LiberalConservative: willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo


I think you ought to get some placards made up, with bloody needles on them or something,  and you can stand outside your local acupuncture clinic. When patients go in and out, you can scream at them: "YOU DIDN'T REALLY FEEL ANYTHING. YOU'RE NOT FEELING ANYTHING! YOU CAN'T FEEEEEEL IT!!1!1"
 
2013-03-19 10:31:40 AM

willfullyobscure: LiberalConservative: willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo

I think you ought to get some placards made up, with bloody needles on them or something,  and you can stand outside your local acupuncture clinic. When patients go in and out, you can scream at them: "YOU DIDN'T REALLY FEEL ANYTHING. YOU'RE NOT FEELING ANYTHING! YOU CAN'T FEEEEEEL IT!!1!1"


Interesting idea. Though i expect they do feel something as needles are stuck into them. Probably better to hand out flyers explaining the placebo effect. Or perhaps just business cards with an appropriate URL. Pity it won't make much difference; always another innocent ready to be scammed (by someone who unfortunately is probably also deluded into thinking their service is medically valid).
 
2013-03-19 10:44:06 AM
The obvious question that needs to be answered is why a CBS affiliate in Atlanta is reporting on a crime in Switzerland.
 
2013-03-19 10:56:15 AM

LiberalConservative: willfullyobscure: LiberalConservative: willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo

I think you ought to get some placards made up, with bloody needles on them or something,  and you can stand outside your local acupuncture clinic. When patients go in and out, you can scream at them: "YOU DIDN'T REALLY FEEL ANYTHING. YOU'RE NOT FEELING ANYTHING! YOU CAN'T FEEEEEEL IT!!1!1"

Interesting idea. Though i expect they do feel something as needles are stuck into them. Probably better to hand out flyers explaining the placebo effect. Or perhaps just business cards with an appropriate URL. Pity it won't make much difference; always another innocent ready to be scammed (by someone who unfortunately is probably also deluded into thinking their service is medically valid).


You do not feel the needles when inserted; or if you do, the practitioner has made a mistake. What you do feel is (usually) an immediate sense of drowsiness and well-being followed by a variety of stimulating effects as the acupuncturist manipulates the needles. The effects can be varied quite a bit, from sweating to hot flashes to feelings of sleepiness, alertness, calm or agitation depending on what's desired. Acupuncture is often used to relieve constipation or congestion and the effects are proximate, to say the least.

But you go right ahead and tell the patients it's all in their heads. Whatever lets you sleep at night, hon.
 
2013-03-19 11:19:35 AM
We must immediately ban Atlanta, Switzerland and music.

For the children
 
2013-03-19 12:13:55 PM

SpeedyBB: AverageAmericanGuy: Say what you want, chiropractors are awesome.

You go once a week, get a great massage, have all your stiff joints cracked, and feel like a million bucks. It's pretty great.

Not to mention that it's a practice with six thousand years of medical history behind it.

The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition, were practicing acupuncture, moxybustion and herbal medicine when you white folks' ancestors were living in peat bogs and painting themselves blue. And they're still doing it (in addition to appropriating western medical discoveries).

Just because you can't understand it, don't ridicule it.

Remember when your own medical men were laughing derisively when Pasteur suggested they wash their hands after treating a patient with an infectious condition.

And thus spreading infection merrily among the innocent supplicants.


Lol. Yes, the Chinese aren't known for their superstitions at all. Not their huge array of things that constitute good luck, nor the large amount of hells they have, nor all the woo that is passed on, including the notion that ground up rare animal parts are aphrodisiacs.
 
2013-03-19 12:16:11 PM

ThrobblefootSpectre: SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstition,

lolwut? Chinese medicine still today, as in right now, are still using tiger penis, elephant skins, and tusks, leopard skins, parts of north american bear, rhino horn, endangered turtles, etc, as medicine. It is a multi-billion dollar black market in China. They are easily the single MOST superstitious people in the world today today, if not in all of history. Or maybe they take second after India. They have a large market for "dragon bones" fer chissakes.


Looking at the rest of the thread, all I can say is "forget it ThrobblefootSpectre, it's Trollytown."
 
2013-03-19 12:55:06 PM
I smell a rat.  My infection control experience is about 10 years out of date but the last I knew, there wasn't a measurable risk of HIV infection from solid needles.  Back in my hospital days, if you got stuck with a hollow needle you'd be tested and given anti-retrovirals.  If you got cut or jabbed by something that was only blood-smeared (scalpel blade, suture needle, etc.) you wouldn't be treated for possible HIV exposure because it'd never been shown to pass by that route.  Even with a hollow needle, the chance of transmission from a known HIV positive patient was something like 0.1%.  On the other hand, the Hepatitis transmission risk was something like 40% no matter what you got stuck with.

tl;dr
I call bullshiat.
 
2013-03-19 07:58:14 PM
That would be the day I quit WoW. Or at least went DPS.
 
2013-03-19 09:12:15 PM

Alex Broughton Butt Chugger: Thats_right_ALL_the_tea: SpeedyBB: The Chinese, not particularly known to be a people given to voodoo or superstitition,

And that's how I know this post is a troll. Marriages spike on "auspicious" days with good astrological numbers, millions are paid for ground-up rhino horns to improve virility because horns look kinda like a boner, and every other business run by Chinese seems to have 8 somewhere in the name just because it shares a pronunciation with wealth or luck or whatever it was. The Chinese are probably the single most visibly superstitious group I know of. And that's despite the fact that I know Pakistanis whose parents still worry about djinn.

Of course they are, haven't you seen those movies?


MEA CULPA:
I should have known better than to write that. Yes they are prone to odd beliefs, like all other races. What I should have said is that ample evidence exists for the validity of eastern medicine, and while the process is subtler and gentler than the sledge-hammer of antibiotics, surgery or physical therapy, it can have the effect of encouraging the body to rebalance and heal itself. I speak from personal experience, and I wish I didn't have to travel two hours to North Jakarta and wait two hours more in line for the acupuncturist. These days most folks either carry their own needles with them or buy a fresh pack for each treatment. Between hep and HIV the word has spread.

The limitations of western medicine (and thought) are well-known enough that an open and inquisitive mind will consider alternatives, even if they do not conform to the holy standard of the western scientific method. How much about the workings of the human body is still unknown? How often have the poo-bahs of science and medicine changed their tune for us in the past fifty years?

It was amusing to note that when the CIA found out the KGB was devoting serious time, money and attention to paranormal phenomena (particularly those having to do with practical skills like psychokinesis) they very grudgingly delved a bit into it themselves. But with fingers crossed. The Soviets had no prejudice about such matters: whatever might work, they gave it a shot. Not that much came out of it but the point is that they were not self-limiting the way farkers apparently are.

Wash your hands after treating that diphtheria patient, gentlemen. Even if you don't believe in the wee beasties.
 
2013-03-19 09:15:03 PM

Farce-Side: Deacon Blue: RobSeace: Deacon Blue: Homopaths

NTTAWWT

Nobody's complimented  me on my troll yet.  I thought it was pretty good

2/10.  Not enough bites before you revealed it as a troll.


That's like Roy D. Mercer talking about 'africadesiacs'.
 
2013-03-20 03:43:52 AM

willfullyobscure: LiberalConservative: willfullyobscure: LiberalConservative: willfullyobscure: acupuncture remains popular because when people have it done, they feel and see undeniable results. Otherwise they wouldn't go back, QED. Suck on it, haters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo

I think you ought to get some placards made up, with bloody needles on them or something,  and you can stand outside your local acupuncture clinic. When patients go in and out, you can scream at them: "YOU DIDN'T REALLY FEEL ANYTHING. YOU'RE NOT FEELING ANYTHING! YOU CAN'T FEEEEEEL IT!!1!1"

Interesting idea. Though i expect they do feel something as needles are stuck into them. Probably better to hand out flyers explaining the placebo effect. Or perhaps just business cards with an appropriate URL. Pity it won't make much difference; always another innocent ready to be scammed (by someone who unfortunately is probably also deluded into thinking their service is medically valid).


You do not feel the needles when inserted; or if you do, the practitioner has made a mistake. What you do feel is (usually) an immediate sense of drowsiness and well-being followed by a variety of stimulating

are placebo effects as the acupuncturist manipulates the needles. The effects can be varied (because they are placebo effects) quite a bit, from sweating to hot flashes to feelings of sleepiness, alertness, calm or agitation (wait a second - you said they didn't feel anything!?!?!) depending on what's desired an individual's experienced placebo effect. Acupuncture is often used to relieve attempt treatment of constipation or congestion and the effects are none or on occasion proximate (due to placebo effect), to say the least.

But you go right ahead and tell the patients it's all in their heads. Whatever lets you sleep at night, hon.


FTFY. But you are right on this last point - educating people to help reduce their likelihood of being scammed certainly does help me sleep at night.
Not much point responding either - I'm pretty sure you fall into that deluded category.
 
2013-03-20 10:55:26 AM

LiberalConservative: (due to placebo effect), to say the least.But you go right ahead and tell the patients it's all in their heads. Whatever lets you sleep at night, hon.FTFY. But you are right on this last point - educating people to help reduce their likelihood of being scammed certainly does help me sleep at night.Not much point responding either - I'm pretty sure you fall into that deluded category.


Here you go, friendo: a meta study rounding up most of the legitimate research into acupuncture:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18711761

Its quite real- there's more than thirty years of controlled studies on the mechanism. Nobody fully understands it, in biological terms, but it is unmistakably present.

So perhaps its time you stop taking what you know on blind faith and do a little research? I know its easier to simply make up your mind about what is and isn't real based on your own feelings and wishes for it to be true, but the real world doesn't work that way.
 
2013-03-20 10:56:19 PM

willfullyobscure: LiberalConservative: (due to placebo effect), to say the least.But you go right ahead and tell the patients it's all in their heads. Whatever lets you sleep at night, hon.FTFY. But you are right on this last point - educating people to help reduce their likelihood of being scammed certainly does help me sleep at night.Not much point responding either - I'm pretty sure you fall into that deluded category.

Here you go, friendo: a meta study rounding up most of the legitimate research into acupuncture:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18711761


Fail. The article only summarises theories oh how AA may/might/perhaps work. And it does this by only referencing favourable articles to its own conclusion. The article does not even address the initial question of whether AA is a valid medically proven treatment. A search of the article for "placebo" returns... oh my golly gosh... ZERO occurances. From these points its blindingly obvious this article is NOT a "meta study rounding up most of the legitimate research into acupuncture".

Its quite real- there's more than thirty years of controlled studies on the mechanism.

Fail. That any topic/phenomena has been studied for thirty years is not proof it is real/exists.

Nobody fully understands it, in biological terms, but it is unmistakably present.

Fail. The placebo effect is very well understood, demonstrated, and proven. And provides the best explanation for effects that are "unmistakenly present" but that "nobody understands".

So perhaps its time you stop taking what you know on blind faith and do a little research? I know its easier to simply make up your mind about what is and isn't real based on your own feelings and wishes for it to be true, but the real world doesn't work that way.

From your points above it is pretty clear that this last piece of text applies to yourself.
I've got more important things to do than reply to the deluded. By all means continue accepting any studies that support your beliefs/desires while ignoring an overwhelming majority of studies to the contrary. I'll just have to hope the sharing of your beliefs cause minimal harm to others that are ignorant of objective and quantitative enquiry.
 
2013-03-21 11:27:54 AM

LiberalConservative: From these points its blindingly obvious this article is NOT a "meta study rounding up most of the legitimate research into acupuncture".


I like how you explained yourself out of bothering to read any of the reams of research this study references. You did the internet equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and going lalalalala.

I only linked this study because it was the easiest roundup- it was far from the first public research on Google.

It works on rabbits and horses, dude. placebo that fact away.

None so blind as those that will not see --Gandalf
 
Displayed 77 of 77 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report