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(Fox News)   White House announces that it is lowering expectations for Barack Obama's Israel trip, presumably from "establishing the groundwork for a lasting Middle East peace" to "not handing over Israel to the Friends of Hamas"   (foxnews.com) divider line 109
    More: Obvious, obama, White House, Hamas, Middle East, Middle East peace, deputy press secretary, Republican President George W. Bush, Technological escalation  
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2120 clicks; posted to Politics » on 18 Mar 2013 at 10:42 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-03-18 09:09:14 AM  
7 votes:
Cry moar, Israeli lobby. Obama's the best president since Eisenhauer for protecting American interests, not just bowing to Israeli ones.
2013-03-18 11:35:17 AM  
6 votes:

Generation_D: Alphakronik: Wake me when we stop giving Isreal $40,000,000,000 a year in aid.


They don't need it.

Biggest welfare state in America.


It's pretty obvious that the two of you are lost in WILLFUL IGNORANCE.

For those who prefer to get their opinions from facts, instead of feeling the need to repeat an idiotic remark any time Israel is mentioned; please note the following:


1) Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and Egypt all receive either more or close to what Israel gets in US aid.
2) Unlike Pakistan that was hiding OSB, Israel provides positive intelligence information to the US, in addition to an exchange of military technology, some of which is:


    ADM-141 TALD (Improved Tactical Air Launched Decoy)- device used to protect U.S. warplanes from enemy fire.
    AGM-142 Have Nap "The Popeye" - a precise bomb which hits specific coordinates
    Python missile - A major air to air missile.
    M120 mortar - A 120 mm Mortar developed by Soltam Systems.
    SMAW - An Anti-tank guided missile developed by Israel Military Industries, based on the Israeli B-300.
    Cardom - A 120mm Recoil mortar system using modern electronic navigation, self-positioning, and target acquisition.
    Gabriel missile - A sea skimming Anti-ship missile.
    SIMON breach grenade - A rifle grenade designed to breach through doors. A variant is currently in service with the United States army.
    LITENING targeting pod - A precision targeting pod designed to increase combat effectiveness of aircraft.
    International MaxxPro - An MRAP armored fighting vehicle.
    Samson Remote Controlled Weapon Station - A Remote weapon system.

3) Finally, the money that is sent in 'aid' to Israel is used to purchase US weapons, exclusively.  Therefore, the US 'aid' to Israel amounts to a US military jobs program, since the money is used to purchase US made goods.

_____

I know it's fun to hate Jews and keep screaming "why do we help them!", but don't pretend this is done on a moralistic high-ground.  The US gets plenty for it's money to Israel.  I'd argue we get a MUCH better return on investment than the money we spent in Iraq, Afghanistan, or Pakistan (over a trillion dollars on our two wars... keep it in perspective haters).
2013-03-18 10:51:17 AM  
6 votes:
Israel is quickly becoming an apartheid state, where Israelis will be the minority ruling over a majority of Arabs who have little or no rights. Its morally reprehensible, especially given the history of the Jewish religion and the Jewish people.
2013-03-18 11:15:42 AM  
5 votes:
Wake me when we stop giving Isreal $40,000,000,000 a year in aid.


They don't need it.
2013-03-18 11:16:11 AM  
4 votes:
Frankly, I'm not really sure why we are basically slaves to Israel anyway.

Oh please, may we have another proxy war that's basically protecting only their interests, and ruining ours.

No thanks. Let them actually deal with the consequences of their behavior.
2013-03-18 09:38:51 AM  
4 votes:
I lol'd at the headline, subs. Well done.

I think Obama's doing a great job of not sucking Israel's dick, and I hope he keeps up the good work.
2013-03-18 02:59:24 PM  
3 votes:

NostroZ: cameroncrazy1984: NostroZ: That's what's anti-Semitic.  A double standard towards Israel / Jews that no other Middle-Eastern or even Western countries fully abide by.

When the Israel lobby stops in Congress then we'll stop criticizing it.

That's funny... do you also criticize Saudi Arabia that has a lobby?
Or the German lobby?
Or the Egyptian lobby?

Do you know how Congress works?  Everyone and anyone with influence has a lobby...
Yet, the JEWISH LOBBY gets special attention for you.

I wonder why... Ya Jew Hating Hyporcrite


Come back to me when you have something substantive to say, and when presidential candidates are giving speeches to the German lobby, or the Egyptian lobby, or the Saudi Arabia lobby. When was the last time a presidential candidate did that? Yet every year each party pays fealty to AIPAC.

You don't have to hate Jews to dislike what Israel does. Get down off your cross already.
2013-03-18 02:46:48 PM  
3 votes:

NostroZ: My REAL argument is that Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for criticism that other countries are exempt from.


Whoa, that's funny, because my REAL argument is Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for special treatment and praise that other countries are exempt from.
2013-03-18 11:28:17 AM  
3 votes:

NostroZ: Yes, not all Arabs are citizens, but there ARE Arab citizens with EQUAL rights.


Not in the West Bank.
2013-03-18 11:14:18 AM  
3 votes:
The stupid thing is, if Israel could just come to terms with the Palestinians, the combination of Israeli money and brains, and a Palestinian workforce, they could together be the next China in terms of economy.
2013-03-18 11:01:41 AM  
3 votes:

Via Infinito: I lol'd at the headline, subs. Well done.

I think Obama's doing a great job of not sucking Israel's dick, and I hope he keeps up the good work.


Because, he's too busy sucking Muslim Brotherhood dick.
2013-03-18 10:39:45 PM  
2 votes:

Tatterdemalian: Generation_D: What is the issue is Israel's government. It is wrong. And it is dependent on the USA for funding.

So stop funding it already.

/except you won't
//because every single sentence you posted is a lie
///and even if you don't know it, Obama does, and he'll drone strike your revolutionary anarcho-terrorist ass back into line if he has to


"Hurpa derpa doo he killed one traitor on the battlefield that means the next target will be the elementary school in Richmond Virginia because I think he's evil"
2013-03-18 05:26:19 PM  
2 votes:

Amos Quito: NostroZ: So, you're argument is that AMERICA treats Israel favorably... which no duh, anyone can see.
My argument is that, except for America, the world has a huge bias against Israel.


Have you ever bothered to wonder why?

I'm pretty sure you have me on IGNORE, but just in case you don't...


Because everywhere else in the world except for America is chock-full of Jew-hating Nazis, duh.
2013-03-18 05:20:19 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: So, you're argument is that AMERICA treats Israel favorably... which no duh, anyone can see.
My argument is that, except for America, the world has a huge bias against Israel.



Have you ever bothered to wonder why?

I'm pretty sure you have me on IGNORE, but just in case you don't...
2013-03-18 05:08:32 PM  
2 votes:

Vectron: [upload.wikimedia.org image 200x200]

I kid you not.



Great link. Thanks.

Yeah, there is certainly a well organized and determined effort to push pro-Zionist propaganda - and to viciously attack / smear anyone who even HINTS at opposing their agenda.

Read more at:

The Israel Project's Secret Hasbara Handbook Exposed

These guys actually have "training camps" and such.

See also Birthright Israel - they give free trips to the Zionist State to (Jewish) kids -  the idea being to reenforce ethnocentric cohesion, and to instill a sense of loyalty TO the Jewish State - regardless of where the kid is from.

But there's nothing "racist" or "bigoted" about Zionism, you know.
2013-03-18 04:38:53 PM  
2 votes:
2013-03-18 04:27:50 PM  
2 votes:
2013-03-18 03:59:11 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: Kittypie070: Dear NostroZ or NoDoz or NozStrawz or whatever you are:

I have one very humble piece of advice for you.

If you want people to listen to and take seriously the world-shattering wisdom you feel you absolutely must impart to us lowdown booger-picking yokels, try drinking a nice relaxing cup of chamomile tea first.

Speaking at 480 decibels tends to put the audience off just a slight bit.

Fark off!
I'm not here to impart some world-shattering wisdom... I'm here to tell the haters that they are haters and provide anyone in between with FACTS of what's ACTUALLY going on vs. the Anti-Semite propaganda you call opinion... I'm not here to impress you or care if you WANT to listen to me... Block me for all I care.

Tell me I'm not as good as Tatsuma... I don't care... You're nuanced hatred is still that!  It's hatred and I will not look the other way.

I'm not about to sit idly by while this Jew Hating orgy goes wild, sowing falsehoods like "we don't get anything from Israel for our money" or like Mr.lennavan post who's word for word argument is "Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for special treatment and praise that other countries are exempt from."

So Fark Off for trying to tell me I'm not responding how you would like to hatred that has led to genocide in the past!



In any thread containing criticism of Zionism or the Zionist State, Farkers like NostroZ will crawl out of the cracks and crevices - first to whine, then to cry, and then it's

J'accuse!

J'accuse!


J'accuse!

They're hoping to shut folks up by accusing them of anti-Semitism.

This little game used to work like a charm - but this charm has lost its luster.

Problem is, it's the only charm they have, so they're kind of screwed.
2013-03-18 03:43:32 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: IrateShadow: NostroZ: Go ahead, prove to me that you're not a Jew Hating Hypocrite.

I can provide baseless inflammatory accusations, too.  Prove to me you aren't a baby-raping serial murderer.

I would love to... but I'm not the one posting on a baby-rapping serial murderer thread defending the rapist.



But you are defending Israel, despite the fact that they have shot children outside of their own homes solely because the Israeli government secretly extended the restricted area. So what does that make you?
2013-03-18 03:38:47 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: Yet, 99 times out of 100 they also hate Jews... the 1 out of a 100 is usually a person who cares about ALL world injustices, like Sudan, which has no Jews, but has terrible things going on there.



You know this for a fact? Or are you stereotyping based on "every injustice you don't post about is an injustice you wholeheartedly support"?
2013-03-18 03:35:00 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: cameroncrazy1984: You don't have to hate Jews to dislike what Israel does. Get down off your cross already.

You're right, you don't... but much like all KKK members hate African Americans, but not everyone who hates blacks is KKK, the same goes for the "I hate Israel crowd".

Yet, 99 times out of 100 they also hate Jews... the 1 out of a 100 is usually a person who cares about ALL world injustices, like Sudan, which has no Jews, but has terrible things going on there.

But, more often than not, when someone talks about Israel, they are talking about Jews... don't play stupid, you know this.


"I dislike what Israel does" "I hate Israel"

And yet you accuse other people of playing stupid.
2013-03-18 03:16:25 PM  
2 votes:

sillydragon: So is this the new and less troll-fu possessing version of everyone's favorite Israeli?


Yeah, Tats did it first and did it better.

BTW, am I an anti-semite if I think the Israeli government is a huge pile of douchebags, but it isn't because they're jewish?

From what I can discern, if you don't make a point of specifically mentioning in every post that surrounding governments/organizations are at least as douchebaggy, if not moreso, then you are indeed an anti-Semite.  Sorry about that.
2013-03-18 03:03:23 PM  
2 votes:

lennavan: The United States is not located in the Middle East. Why the fark is it our responsibility to establish the groundwork for lasting peace. If they don't want peace, who are we to force it on them?


The Allies won WWII, because between the two of them, the UK and the US controlled 75% of the world's mineral resources. Germany lost because it couldn't fight its way to oil or uranium.

The Middle East, currently having mineral wealth and having always been a crossroads of the world, has always been worth keeping an eye on, and always will be, even if only because the Suez runs through Egypt.
2013-03-18 02:31:30 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: Uh huh... yet for some reason those articles do NOT get green lit, only one's about Israel... funny thing about Israel is that everyone is interested in nitpicking it.



Egypt shoots those who actually cross the fence. Those who are killed make a deliberate effort to pass into an area they know to be off-limits.

Israel, on the other hand, announced that the no-go zone was 300m from the fence, but they secretly extended the zone to 1km and shot people who were legally on their own farm well outside of the official restricted area.

I'm not defending Egypt's actions here, nobody deserves the death penalty for merely jumping a fence, but I think being shot after having your home secretly declared a restricted area is slightly more fark-worthy than being shot for deliberately entering a clearly identified restricted area.
2013-03-18 02:26:58 PM  
2 votes:
Isn't "Lowering Expectations" the theme of Obama's presidency?

Haven't read any posts in the thread yet, but I bet it is full of Jewish hating leftists mimicking rhetoric from Nazi Germany.
2013-03-18 02:26:18 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: cameroncrazy1984: NostroZ: That's what's anti-Semitic.  A double standard towards Israel / Jews that no other Middle-Eastern or even Western countries fully abide by.

When the Israel lobby stops in Congress then we'll stop criticizing it.

That's funny... do you also criticize Saudi Arabia that has a lobby?
Or the German lobby?
Or the Egyptian lobby?

Do you know how Congress works?  Everyone and anyone with influence has a lobby...
Yet, the JEWISH LOBBY gets special attention for you.

I wonder why... Ya Jew Hating Hyporcrite


"The ONLY reason you say ANYTHING bad is because you're ANTI-SEMITE!!"

Sure it is, you silly child you.
2013-03-18 01:55:50 PM  
2 votes:
You know that tired old "with great power comes great responsibility" that got repeated ad nauseam in Spiderman?  It works both ways:  with zero power comes zero responsibility.

If the middle east won't take our suggestions or implement our plans for peace, then we have fark-all responsibility when they start killing each other.  Y'all want nothing more than to murder each other, meh, have at it.  I'm tired of wasting time and effort and lives trying to make you act like goddamn adults.


ringersol: Who in their right mind has expectations of the peace process that *can* be lowered?


I knew I had you favorited for a reason.
2013-03-18 01:29:50 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: Excuse me? You sound like one hell of an educated anti-Semite.

Please explain to me how in your world view, having a PRO-Israel opinion means that one is a paid for propagandist?
Seriously... explain to me how you do NOT HATE Jews, yet believe that ANYONE who supports Israel is automatically a paid for shill???

/ It's amazing to me that you do not see your own seething hatred of Israel.
// To have such intellectual dishonesty as to believe that the only people who disagree with you are paid for.
/// If anyone thinks there is "no anti-antisemitism", just look at the above logic: Either you agree Israel is evil or you're paid for.


Well, yesterday I was accused of being a pro-Israel shill, and today I'm accused of being an antisemite, so that's fun.

I'm calling you a paid Israeli shill because you're acting like a JIDF, you came in at the same time as other people ranting at the same time, and you have the same thoughtless, push-button, multiple-punctuated screed that Israel pays for, complete with ignorant racism while preemptively calling anyone who dares to disagree with you an antisemite.
2013-03-18 01:01:57 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: But please, stop talking about Israel as though no real people live there or as though they have not been fighting to KEEP their land since 1947.



i.imgur.com
Clearly Israel isn't invading Palestine, they are merely driving out the Palestinian invaders who have been occupying Israeli land for the last few thousand years.

Would you be happy with a similar plan to give back America to the descendants of the Inuit, Inca, Maya, and Native Americans, while all others are rounded up and forced into highly concentrated cities and shot on sight when they try to leave? Or do ancient land claims only count when it's someone else's land being taken?
2013-03-18 12:58:41 PM  
2 votes:

Teufelaffe: cameroncrazy1984: The hell is an Eternal Jew?

I think that's the name of the new fragrance from Jon Stewart.


Now that's funny right there. 

NostroZ: There was no unique 'Palestinian identity' until one was invented to fight against the Jews... the people that lived in the region ascribed themselves to the countries that are present


No, they lived in the British protectorate of Palestine.

Jesus, do you even know your own history?
2013-03-18 12:51:13 PM  
2 votes:

CheatCommando: Spare Me: Because, he's too busy sucking Muslim Brotherhood dick.

Man, it took a while for the Israel, Israel Uber Alles crowd to show up.


And Man, if that doesn't just torque off the Palestine Uber Alles crowd, always being beaten by the Eternal Jew.
2013-03-18 12:46:09 PM  
2 votes:
Never forget the genocide unless it happens to other people:

www.historyplace.com
2013-03-18 12:01:27 PM  
2 votes:

NostroZ: vernonFL: InstaZen25: Except Arabs are citizens there and they have Arab members of their Knesset. Also, Arabs are not the majority there. So many things wrong here

Arabs living in the West Bank are not citizens of any country.

Why aren't they citizens of Jordan!?

[data.un.org image 300x300]

Look at the map!
Why is it ISRAEL that needs to fix the problems of the population to the south (Gaza) population to the east (west bank) and population to the north (Hezbollah)???

There is Egypt for Gaza, who have refused to allow Palestinians to cross their border to get supplies (killing them on sight).
There is Jordan that has refused to take ANY Palestinian in as citizen... Jordan took a large chunk of the land given in the original Balfour declaration (twice the size of Israel), and pushed all the 'non citizen Arabs you described' as close to Israel as they can and then got the UN to get a PERMANENT and SPECIAL status to be placed on those 'refugees'.
Finally, there is Lebanon, where there is plenty of Palestinians who are not considered citizens... and will not be admitted to the government.

_____

Please join in threads about Egypt, Jordan, and Lebanon's humanitarian treatment of the Palestinians.  How they are kept in refugee camps and are not citizens for generations, at the hands of their own brethren!

Yet, I'm sure you don't care about those countries and how they treat Palestinians for some reason... Ya, Jew hating hypocrite.


Because they aren't Jordanian?  Because they are Palestinian?

Oh right, "there are no Palestinian, only Arabs, that way we aren't the anti-semitic ones."

Help me out here, are you repeating this old, debunked lies for the first time because you're ignorant or just bringing the circle back around because you ran out of arguments?
2013-03-18 11:49:35 AM  
2 votes:

vernonFL: InstaZen25: Except Arabs are citizens there and they have Arab members of their Knesset. Also, Arabs are not the majority there. So many things wrong here

Arabs living in the West Bank are not citizens of any country.


Why aren't they citizens of Jordan!?

data.un.org

Look at the map!
Why is it ISRAEL that needs to fix the problems of the population to the south (Gaza) population to the east (west bank) and population to the north (Hezbollah)???

There is Egypt for Gaza, who have refused to allow Palestinians to cross their border to get supplies (killing them on sight).
There is Jordan that has refused to take ANY Palestinian in as citizen... Jordan took a large chunk of the land given in the original Balfour declaration (twice the size of Israel), and pushed all the 'non citizen Arabs you described' as close to Israel as they can and then got the UN to get a PERMANENT and SPECIAL status to be placed on those 'refugees'.
Finally, there is Lebanon, where there is plenty of Palestinians who are not considered citizens... and will not be admitted to the government.

_____

Please join in threads about Egypt, Jordan, and Lebanon's humanitarian treatment of the Palestinians.  How they are kept in refugee camps and are not citizens for generations, at the hands of their own brethren!

Yet, I'm sure you don't care about those countries and how they treat Palestinians for some reason... Ya, Jew hating hypocrite.
2013-03-18 11:23:52 AM  
2 votes:
I sat let Iran have the bomb. A little Mutually Assured Destruction in that region might actually keep israeli from walking all over everyone.
2013-03-18 11:19:35 AM  
2 votes:

Alphakronik: Wake me when we stop giving Isreal $40,000,000,000 a year in aid.


They don't need it.


Biggest welfare state in America.
2013-03-18 11:12:26 AM  
2 votes:

Spare Me: Via Infinito: I lol'd at the headline, subs. Well done.

I think Obama's doing a great job of not sucking Israel's dick, and I hope he keeps up the good work.

Because, he's too busy sucking Muslim Brotherhood dick.


You know very well that it hasn't gone beyond heavy petting.

Or is that droning?
A US President never has to apologize for putting US interests ahead of other countries', and that includes Israel. Obama is somehow expected to blast Iran back to the pre-nuclear age at a moment's notice, but not even give a frank assessment to Netanyahu. That's just silly.
2013-03-18 10:25:26 AM  
2 votes:
Lasing ME peace simply isn't possible with the current Israeli government.  They're interested only in expansion.
2013-03-18 09:53:54 AM  
2 votes:
The line between "Good troll" and "crazy right winger" is a fine one.
2013-03-20 11:08:22 AM  
1 votes:
i1121.photobucket.com

You don't have to be ON "Ignore" to be ignored, Liar76.
2013-03-19 02:18:07 PM  
1 votes:

This text is now purple: lennavan: This text is now purple: We tried that policy between 1919 and 1939. It didn't work well in a world with steam ships and airplanes.

I don't recall the United States being attacked or invaded between 1919 and 1939.  Apparently you think it was?

When did I say that?

The US reverted to isolationism in 1919, and the world went to shiat in the next 20 years. It wasn't until 1942 that we were even in a position to say anything about it again.

Given the world situation in 1946, we couldn't afford another 20 years of hiding and three years of ramping back up. In a mid-60s world, we wouldn't be able to afford those three years -- the world had gotten too small.

Someone had to be the world police. The options were the UK, the US, and the USSR. The UK couldn't do it and absolutely no one wanted the USSR to do it -- that left the US. It wasn't perfect, but it was better than the alternatives.

\There was a reason that in WWII, everyone preferred to surrender to the Americans, or failing that, the British.



The world is not the US's responsibility.  I don't know why you think it is.  What do you mean we "couldn't afford" another 20 years of hiding.  Again, we were not attacked or under the threat of attack.  We weren't about to be invaded.  We absolutely could have afforded another 20 years of hiding.

Why does someone have to be the world police?  And who the fark are we to police the rest of the world anyway?  We're going to tell the rest of the world how to run themselves, how to govern themselves?  Have you paid any attention to our own political system at all and all of the corruption and influence of money on the process?

By the way, if you actually subscribe to the US being the world police, then I imagine you're amazingly upset at the US for its inaction in a whole slew of places.  You're telling me how it was imperative the US intervene in WWII, have you paid any attention to what is currently happening in various African countries?
2013-03-19 02:12:48 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: lennavan: NostroZ: Please support your argument that Israel / Jews get a preferential treatment... otherwise you sound like a bigot who says "Jews conspire to get a better deal"

Tragedy.  I had a nice long post written out with citations but then I had to work for a bit and apparently I closed that window.  Anyway, here's the brief synopsis:

Assume the situation in the Sudan is equivalent to Israel, even though we all know the situation in the Sudan is way worse.

Israel gets 7x the aid.
Obama is actually visiting Israel.
Obama talks about Israel in his speeches all the time.
Israel was a major issue during the last presidential election.  Hell, Romney actually traveled to Israel to give a speech.
At various times the US has promised troops and severe intervention/military responses should a country do anything with respect to Israel.
People get their jobs filibustered in Congress over Israel, not the Sudan.

If you want citations, you'll have to www.google.com it yourself.

So, you're argument is that AMERICA treats Israel favorably... which no duh, anyone can see.
My argument is that, except for America, the world has a huge bias against Israel.

Please step outside your bubble of the world = America


Fair enough.  I'd rather not step outside my "bubble."  The US has a big problem of sticking its nose where it doesn't belong.  We've got plenty of our own problems to deal with before we start worrying about other countries.  I get a say, via voting, how my own country deals with Israel.  I don't really get a say, nor do I want a say, in how other countries deal with Israel.
2013-03-19 01:20:16 PM  
1 votes:

verdigris1: Generation_D: Cry moar, Israeli lobby. Obama's the best president since Eisenhauer for protecting American interests, not just bowing to Israeli ones.


Wow, how ignorant.

 Eisenhower was as much a pacifist malcontent as that socialist whack-job obama hussein...
AND, said whack-job, will go down in history as one of America's greatest mistakes.

What has he done for you lately?
he hates America and always will.

'shoulda stayed in Indonesia.....


If you use "pacifist" as an insult, you probably need to increase your meds.
2013-03-19 01:18:58 PM  
1 votes:

Tatterdemalian: Amos Quito: I, for one, find it interesting that certain folks who would happily disembowel me on THIS topic are often in complete (if unacknowledged) agreement with me on other topics.

And vice versa.

Strange universe.

Don't you think?

Not really. A lie is most convincingly hidden between two truths, and you've certainly spent enough time perfecting your recipe for slipping poisonous antisemitism into FARK threads to be an expert at it, probably even better than Himmler himself.



If anyone is creating "anti-Semites" on Fark (or elsewhere), it is the clowns like you (and NostroZ, etc) who immediately attack anyone critical of your agenda by labeling them a "Nazi", and then browbeating them until they actually do acquire a distaste for their tormentors.

You guys are creating "enemies" out of whole cloth. Churning them out by the dozen.

Do you really not see this, or are you doing it intentionally?

Tatterdemalian: /at least on FARK
//in the real world, you're still the same basement-dwelling neo-nazi you've always been



Oooh. Look. You called me a "neo-nazi".

Well, that was both productive AND original, wasn't it?
2013-03-19 12:18:19 AM  
1 votes:
NostroZ: Well, yesterday I was accused of being a pro-Israel shill, and today I'm accused of being an antisemite, so that's fun.

captainktainer:

I'm calling you a paid Israeli shill because you're acting like a JIDF, you came in at the same time as other people ranting at the same time, and you have the same thoughtless, push-button, multiple-punctuated screed that Israel pays for, complete with ignorant racism while preemptively calling anyone who dares to disagree with you an antisemite.


NostroZ has done this before in other Fark threads.  He's either deranged or being paid to spread lies.
2013-03-18 11:04:06 PM  
1 votes:

TheBigJerk: Help me out here, are you repeating this old, debunked lies for the first time because you're ignorant or just bringing the circle back around because you ran out of arguments?



No, I'm sorry to say that NostroZ isn't ignorant, at least not in the innocent sense of merely not knowing any better.  He's posted misinformation in several Fark threads about Israel before, and gotten extremely belligerent when confronted by actual facts.  He appears to be full of hatred and rage against, well, somebody.  I'm not entirely sure who it is he hates and whether he should be classified as an antisemite or not, but he's furiously derptastic when it comes to Israel and only gets moreso when confronted.
2013-03-18 08:42:11 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: lennavan: NostroZ: My REAL argument is that Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for criticism that other countries are exempt from.

Whoa, that's funny, because my REAL argument is Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for special treatment and praise that other countries are exempt from.

I'm glad someone has the balls to speak their mind, instead of dancing around their bias.

Here is some literature showing Antisemitism in America... these are peer reviewed sources to support my argument.
http://www.pbs.org/jewishamericans/jewish_life/anti-semitism.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_antisemitism
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2011/10/06/antisemitic-incidents-inc re ase-in-america-for-the-first-time-since-2004/

Please support your argument that Israel / Jews get a preferential treatment... otherwise you sound like a bigot who says "Jews conspire to get a better deal"


The burden of proof is not on those that question the American/Israeli alliance. It is on those that support it to continue justifying it.

We see a bunch of negatives that come from it.

Instead of addressing those, you immediately jump in with the anti-semite accusations.

Lets just be clear here. Israel's religion is not the issue, and neither is Israel's 5000 year old culture.

What is the issue is Israel's government. It is wrong. And it is dependent on the USA for funding.

I'm sick of it. My country, the USA, needs its money at home. Not propping up a military dictatorship that only exists because of a stupid mistake 80 years ago by a british foreign secretary.

I don't owe this government sh*t. In fact, it has helped to ruin my country's reputation around the world and continues to do so to this day.

Tired of it.
2013-03-18 06:04:15 PM  
1 votes:

Harbinger of the Doomed Rat: Remember, if you think what happened to Rachel Corrie was horrifying and unacceptable, you're an anti-Semite.


I'm an anti-Semite for thinking it was disgraceful that someone could fail to realize how little damage they'd do to a bulldozer?
2013-03-18 06:02:18 PM  
1 votes:

lennavan: This text is now purple: We tried that policy between 1919 and 1939. It didn't work well in a world with steam ships and airplanes.

I don't recall the United States being attacked or invaded between 1919 and 1939.  Apparently you think it was?


When did I say that?

The US reverted to isolationism in 1919, and the world went to shiat in the next 20 years. It wasn't until 1942 that we were even in a position to say anything about it again.

Given the world situation in 1946, we couldn't afford another 20 years of hiding and three years of ramping back up. In a mid-60s world, we wouldn't be able to afford those three years -- the world had gotten too small.

Someone had to be the world police. The options were the UK, the US, and the USSR. The UK couldn't do it and absolutely no one wanted the USSR to do it -- that left the US. It wasn't perfect, but it was better than the alternatives.

\There was a reason that in WWII, everyone preferred to surrender to the Americans, or failing that, the British.
2013-03-18 05:42:31 PM  
1 votes:
Remember, if you think what happened to Rachel Corrie was horrifying and unacceptable, you're an anti-Semite.
2013-03-18 05:34:17 PM  
1 votes:
To clarify, NostroZ is an idiot and a liar. Any civilized person can, should and typically does take issue with the barbaric actions taken by the Israeli government against civilian refugees under their authority. Religion never even comes into it. Anyone claiming that 99% of the people who feel this way are just bigots is a troll or a malicious lunatic or both.
2013-03-18 05:31:47 PM  
1 votes:

Amos Quito: NostroZ: So, you're argument is that AMERICA treats Israel favorably... which no duh, anyone can see.
My argument is that, except for America, the world has a huge bias against Israel.


Have you ever bothered to wonder why?


Something something "orgy of Jew hate"?

Just a guess.  Do I win anything?
2013-03-18 05:11:28 PM  
1 votes:

InstaZen25: mayIFark: Is  NostroZ and InstaZen25 same alt?

Either way both going into my ignore list.

So sorry for offending your delicate sensibilities by (gasp!) Not completely poo-pooing on Israel. I shall try to do better next time.


Most of us aren't "constantly poo-pooing in Israel", either. But according to the two of you, any slightly negative thought or word, or any criticism of their actions and policies and constant crying to America to fix their problems, equals Jew-hating monster seeking the complete annihilation of the grand race chosen by God. And you consistently fail to understand (or choose to disregard) that your behavior is not helping your argument or your side.
2013-03-18 04:59:30 PM  
1 votes:

This text is now purple: We tried that policy between 1919 and 1939. It didn't work well in a world with steam ships and airplanes.


I don't recall the United States being attacked or invaded between 1919 and 1939.  Apparently you think it was?
2013-03-18 04:05:56 PM  
1 votes:

This text is now purple: lennavan: The United States is not located in the Middle East. Why the fark is it our responsibility to establish the groundwork for lasting peace. If they don't want peace, who are we to force it on them?

The Allies won WWII, because between the two of them, the UK and the US controlled 75% of the world's mineral resources. Germany lost because it couldn't fight its way to oil or uranium.

The Middle East, currently having mineral wealth and having always been a crossroads of the world, has always been worth keeping an eye on, and always will be, even if only because the Suez runs through Egypt.



While I don't share your view of WWII history at all, I get what you're trying to say and I think your reasoning is spot on for why the US does it.  I just don't find that reason compelling enough to engage in multiple wars and getting in the middle of a religious conflict between other countries.  We shouldn't be the world police.
2013-03-18 04:01:58 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Harbinger of the Doomed Rat: NostroZ: cameroncrazy1984: You don't have to hate Jews to dislike what Israel does. Get down off your cross already.

And yet you accuse other people of playing stupid.

For someone to care about a country so far away, that has so little to do with their well being makes me think they have an axe to grind.  Simple as that.  If you dislike what America does, if you dislike what Saudi Arabia does, if you dislike what Mexico does, if you dislike etc. etc. etc. along with your dislike of Israel, fine.
...............


That's where you are wrong yet again. It's my hard earned tax dollar that goes there. Its is the reason I get groped at the airport. It's the reason 6K+ Americans are dead. The list goes on and on.
2013-03-18 04:01:52 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: But one thing that I cannot stand is when all these alleged humanitarians talk about Israel/Palestine as though there is not a genocide going on in Darfur... as though the only problem they know or care about is one concerning the Jews.


So we're all in here saying stuff l like "Yeah, fark Israel...they're the only bad people on Earth!"?

What's the acceptable protocol here? What's the minimum number of other world problems we have to mention before speaking about Israel doesn't make us jew-hating Nazi hitlers that want nothing but the extermination of all jews everywhar!1!? Do we have to mention different ones each time? Can one of us just start a thread about Israel with "Hey guys, have you heard about that shiat in Somalia?"
2013-03-18 04:00:45 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: For someone to care about a country so far away, that has so little to do with their well being makes me think they have an axe to grind.


That ranks as one of the top 10 dumbest things ever said on Fark.

Person 1: "Did you hear?  The Greek government is taking a portion of everyone's savings accounts without their permission."
Person 2: "Wow, that's messed up."
You: "OMG, WHY DO YOU HATE THE GREEKS!?!?"

You know what they call people who don't have feelings or opinions about other people that have little to do with their own well being?  Sociopaths.
2013-03-18 04:00:35 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: I'm not about to sit idly by while this Jew Hating orgy goes wild, ... like Mr.lennavan post who's word for word argument is "Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for special treatment and praise that other countries are exempt from."


I don't hate Israel.  I'm just against giving Israel special treatment.  There's a huge difference there and you seem to be purposely conflating the two.
2013-03-18 03:58:21 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Please support your argument that Israel / Jews get a preferential treatment... otherwise you sound like a bigot who says "Jews conspire to get a better deal"


Tragedy.  I had a nice long post written out with citations but then I had to work for a bit and apparently I closed that window.  Anyway, here's the brief synopsis:

Assume the situation in the Sudan is equivalent to Israel, even though we all know the situation in the Sudan is way worse.

Israel gets 7x the aid.
Obama is actually visiting Israel.
Obama talks about Israel in his speeches all the time.
Israel was a major issue during the last presidential election.  Hell, Romney actually traveled to Israel to give a speech.
At various times the US has promised troops and severe intervention/military responses should a country do anything with respect to Israel.
People get their jobs filibustered in Congress over Israel, not the Sudan.

If you want citations, you'll have to www.google.com it yourself.
2013-03-18 03:57:19 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: the ha ha guy: NostroZ: IrateShadow: NostroZ: Go ahead, prove to me that you're not a Jew Hating Hypocrite.

I can provide baseless inflammatory accusations, too.  Prove to me you aren't a baby-raping serial murderer.

I would love to... but I'm not the one posting on a baby-rapping serial murderer thread defending the rapist.


But you are defending Israel, despite the fact that they have shot children outside of their own homes solely because the Israeli government secretly extended the restricted area. So what does that make you?

It makes me an American-Jew who has lived in Israel when he was young and understands what it's like to live less than a mile from someone who wishes death upon you, your family, and anyone else you have a connection with.

What do the actions of the American government in Abu Grahib, Guantanamo bay, Iraq, etc. make you?


So it's okay for the Jews to secretly extend a forbidden zone so they can murder young children?
2013-03-18 03:37:19 PM  
1 votes:

IrateShadow: NostroZ: Go ahead, prove to me that you're not a Jew Hating Hypocrite.

I can provide baseless inflammatory accusations, too.  Prove to me you aren't a baby-raping serial murderer.


I would love to... but I'm not the one posting on a baby-rapping serial murderer thread defending the rapist.
2013-03-18 03:36:23 PM  
1 votes:
In this thread:  A guy who believes that the ONLY possible explanation for disagreement with US policy re Israel is hatred of Jews.
2013-03-18 03:33:34 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Go ahead, prove to me that you're not a Jew Hating Hypocrite.


I can provide baseless inflammatory accusations, too.  Prove to me you aren't a baby-raping serial murderer.
2013-03-18 03:23:26 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: So Fark Off


Are you the guy I asked to ratchet things down a bit last week?

This is Fark, not the UN. People here are douchebags (well, the UN too, sometimes). You're not here to convince people, you're here because your job is boring (or because Starbuck's has free weefees). You should be here to discuss, not make everything about you. You may feel persecuted, but this is not a place to come to feel solidarity with Israel.

This is a place where we happily burn your idols to the ground in front of your weeping children.

// I actually come here to find the holes in my arguments
2013-03-18 03:23:09 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Kittypie070: Dear NostroZ or NoDoz or NozStrawz or whatever you are:

I have one very humble piece of advice for you.

If you want people to listen to and take seriously the world-shattering wisdom you feel you absolutely must impart to us lowdown booger-picking yokels, try drinking a nice relaxing cup of chamomile tea first.

Speaking at 480 decibels tends to put the audience off just a slight bit.

Fark off!
I'm not here to impart some world-shattering wisdom... I'm here to tell the haters that they are haters and provide anyone in between with FACTS of what's ACTUALLY going on vs. the Anti-Semite propaganda you call opinion... I'm not here to impress you or care if you WANT to listen to me... Block me for all I care.

Tell me I'm not as good as Tatsuma... I don't care... You're nuanced hatred is still that!  It's hatred and I will not look the other way.

I'm not about to sit idly by while this Jew Hating orgy goes wild, sowing falsehoods like "we don't get anything from Israel for our money" or like Mr.lennavan post who's word for word argument is "Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for special treatment and praise that other countries are exempt from."

So Fark Off for trying to tell me I'm not responding how you would like to hatred that has led to genocide in the past!


If you're trolling, I applaud you. If you're serious, I pity you.
2013-03-18 03:21:48 PM  
1 votes:

sillydragon: So is this the new and less troll-fu possessing version of everyone's favorite Israeli?

BTW, am I an anti-semite if I think the Israeli government is a huge pile of douchebags, but it isn't because they're jewish?


Of course.  You see, what a person does and what their race is are inseparably linked.  So, if a black person cuts you off in traffic you and you object, you hate black people.  If an Asian stabs you in the face with an icepick and that pisses you off, you're totally racist against Asians.  If a Hispanic guy farks your dog and wipes his dick on the curtains, you'd better not say anything, or that will totally mean you're a racist scumbag.
2013-03-18 03:14:12 PM  
1 votes:

sillydragon: So is this the new and less troll-fu possessing version of everyone's favorite Israeli?

BTW, am I an anti-semite if I think the Israeli government is a huge pile of douchebags, but it isn't because they're jewish?


Yes. Being against Israel for any reason makes you a filthy Jew-hating Nazi who only wants to see their destruction. Just ask NostroZ.
2013-03-18 03:06:31 PM  
1 votes:
So is this the new and less troll-fu possessing version of everyone's favorite Israeli?

BTW, am I an anti-semite if I think the Israeli government is a huge pile of douchebags, but it isn't because they're jewish?
2013-03-18 03:00:25 PM  
1 votes:

lennavan: NostroZ: My REAL argument is that Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for criticism that other countries are exempt from.

Whoa, that's funny, because my REAL argument is Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for special treatment and praise that other countries are exempt from.


I'm glad someone has the balls to speak their mind, instead of dancing around their bias.

Here is some literature showing Antisemitism in America... these are peer reviewed sources to support my argument.
http://www.pbs.org/jewishamericans/jewish_life/anti-semitism.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_antisemitism
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2011/10/06/antisemitic-incidents-inc re ase-in-america-for-the-first-time-since-2004/

Please support your argument that Israel / Jews get a preferential treatment... otherwise you sound like a bigot who says "Jews conspire to get a better deal"
2013-03-18 02:57:38 PM  
1 votes:
Dear NostroZ or NoDoz or NozStrawz or whatever you are:

I have one very humble piece of advice for you.

If you want people to listen to and take seriously the world-shattering wisdom you feel you absolutely must impart to us lowdown booger-picking yokels, try drinking a nice relaxing cup of chamomile tea first.

Speaking at 480 decibels tends to put the audience off just a slight bit.
2013-03-18 02:56:30 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: I'm glad your willfully ignorant to everyone... Be it Jewish ... genocide.


Er, you think there is currently a Jewish genocide?  Nice dude, nice.
2013-03-18 02:55:30 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Keizer_Ghidorah: Don't fight a straw-man like a coward.
My REAL argument is that Israel, and Jews by extension, are singled out for criticism that other countries are exempt from.

Go ahead and prove me wrong by showing your identical concern for world issues that are not Jewish... please tell me about Sudan and what's been going on there for the past 15 years and your real knowledge/concern about those people. Go ahead, prove to me that you're not a Jew Hating Hypocrite.
___
That's easy. I don't give a shiat about anyone and anything over there. They've been slaughtering each other over retarded shiat for 2,000 years, and they're never going to stop. Far as I'm concerned we should stop giving ANY of them money and aid, pull our people out, and leave them to their own devices. Maybe they'll finally develop intelligence and stop their baby feud, or they'll completely destroy each other and no more fighting. Either way, the world wins.

Also, it might come as a total and utter shock to you, but people can dislike Israel and what they're doing for reasons that have nothing to do with "Hurpa durpa doooooooo I only hate da Joooooooooo".
___
Excellent.  I'm glad your willfully ignorant to everyone... Be it Jewish or Sudanese genocide.
It's usually polite to keep your mouth shut when you do not know about things Mr.Keizer.


I know all about over there, and that's WHY I don't care. How can you help people who refuse to stop slaughtering each other over retarded shiat? They're not going to stop because the almighty America comes down and rebukes them. They're going to fight and kill and die until one side or the other or both are destroyed. I say let them, since we're not going to stop it, unless we invade the area and force them to stop, which will just turn their rage towards us.
2013-03-18 02:55:21 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Generation_D: Alphakronik: Wake me when we stop giving Isreal $40,000,000,000 a year in aid.


They don't need it.

Biggest welfare state in America.

It's pretty obvious that the two of you are lost in WILLFUL IGNORANCE.

For those who prefer to get their opinions from facts, instead of feeling the need to repeat an idiotic remark any time Israel is mentioned; please note the following:

1) Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and Egypt all receive either more or close to what Israel gets in US aid.
2) Unlike Pakistan that was hiding OSB, Israel provides positive intelligence information to the US, in addition to an exchange of military technology, some of which is:


    ADM-141 TALD (Improved Tactical Air Launched Decoy)- device used to protect U.S. warplanes from enemy fire.
    AGM-142 Have Nap "The Popeye" - a precise bomb which hits specific coordinates
    Python missile - A major air to air missile.
    M120 mortar - A 120 mm Mortar developed by Soltam Systems.
    SMAW - An Anti-tank guided missile developed by Israel Military Industries, based on the Israeli B-300.
    Cardom - A 120mm Recoil mortar system using modern electronic navigation, self-positioning, and target acquisition.
    Gabriel missile - A sea skimming Anti-ship missile.
    SIMON breach grenade - A rifle grenade designed to breach through doors. A variant is currently in service with the United States army.
    LITENING targeting pod - A precision targeting pod designed to increase combat effectiveness of aircraft.
    International MaxxPro - An MRAP armored fighting vehicle.
    Samson Remote Controlled Weapon Station - A Remote weapon system.

3) Finally, the money that is sent in 'aid' to Israel is used to purchase US weapons, exclusively.  Therefore, the US 'aid' to Israel amounts to a US military jobs program, since the money is used to purchase US made goods.

_____

I know it's fun to hate Jews and keep screaming "why do we help them!", but don't pretend this is done on a moralistic high-g ...


Can they support themselves? Yes.

Is the intelligence being directly sold? No.

They don't need the farking AID money supposed to be for FOOD FOR DEVELOPING COUNTRIES, numbnuts. We can pay for the Eyewitness hotline, I'm all for that, but how about not paying for it with SNAP funds?
2013-03-18 02:33:15 PM  
1 votes:
pbs.twimg.com

If the History Channel is to be believed, Obama is Satan. I laughed when I saw this.
2013-03-18 02:25:46 PM  
1 votes:

Generation_D: Cry moar, Israeli lobby. Obama's the best president since Eisenhauer for protecting American interests, not just bowing to Israeli ones.


Let's see...he allowed Cuba to go Communist.  His planning of the Bay of Pigs invasion was absolutely first rate, that's for sure.  Then of course there was his policy of sending "advisers" to Vietnam.  His lack of support for the Hungarian Uprising in 1956.  Yep, stellar.

At least his golf game never suffered...sort of like Obama's.
2013-03-18 02:18:48 PM  
1 votes:

cameroncrazy1984: NostroZ: That's what's anti-Semitic.  A double standard towards Israel / Jews that no other Middle-Eastern or even Western countries fully abide by.

When the Israel lobby stops in Congress then we'll stop criticizing it.


That's funny... do you also criticize Saudi Arabia that has a lobby?
Or the German lobby?
Or the Egyptian lobby?

Do you know how Congress works?  Everyone and anyone with influence has a lobby...
Yet, the JEWISH LOBBY gets special attention for you.

I wonder why... Ya Jew Hating Hyporcrite
2013-03-18 02:13:27 PM  
1 votes:
Obama: Is there any way we can convince you to stop stealing land?

Israeli Leader (whatshisfaceowitz): The guys in the stupid hats say no.

Obama: Okay then.
2013-03-18 02:08:05 PM  
1 votes:

the ha ha guy: NostroZ: But please, stop talking about Israel as though no real people live there or as though they have not been fighting to KEEP their land since 1947.


[i.imgur.com image 806x639]
Clearly Israel isn't invading Palestine, they are merely driving out the Palestinian invaders who have been occupying Israeli land for the last few thousand years.


Care to explain why "Palestenian land" includes a lake?

Can you explain the methodology of the map?  ie why the empty areas are called "arab"?


the ha ha guy: Would you be happy with a similar plan to give back America to the descendants of the Inuit, Inca, Maya, and Native Americans, while all others are rounded up and forced into highly concentrated cities and shot on sight when they try to leave? Or do ancient land claims only count when it's someone else's land being taken



If the descendants of those people bought land in the US, the federal govt was no onger around, and they voted to start their own country, I would be fine with it.
2013-03-18 02:05:31 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: That's what's anti-Semitic.  A double standard towards Israel / Jews that no other Middle-Eastern or even Western countries fully abide by.


When the Israel lobby stops in Congress then we'll stop criticizing it.
2013-03-18 01:59:44 PM  
1 votes:
We get it guy, you will support anything Israel does, and support no limit to the amount of wasted money, lives and credibility are sunk into it.

Personally, since you repeat it often about "bbbbut you give money to Pakistan!!": fark Pakistan. As far as I'm concerned, pakistan can eat its own gun, and get its money from somewhere else. See how well they can live with a billion screaming hindu fanatics pouring across their border raping everything. Be interesting.

As can Isreal. Iraq, Afghanistan, and the entire region. Israel created it's current bed, they can lie in it without our tax dollars buying them a farking blanket.
2013-03-18 01:54:28 PM  
1 votes:

Crazy Lee: Throughout the Roosevelt and Truman administrations, the Departments of War and State, recognizing the possibility of a Soviet-Arab connection and the potential Arab restriction on Oil supplies to the United States, advised against U.S. intervention on behalf of the Jews.

http://www.trumanlibrary.org/whistlestop/study_collections/israel/la rg e/index.php

Let me guess:  SOS, tweak annual AID package, sell some more `Defensive' hardware, express solidarity while encouraging tolerance and smile for the cameras.

/remember, if U.S. had any cojones we'd have gone through withdrawal from ME oil jag, decades ago.  Then the tables would be turned to some degree - we'd have more leverage (if we actually gave a shiat at that late date).
//pretty much just subsidizing the `suppression of conflict $$$', at this point, and Obama is a puppet dancing at the ends of the strings of a farked history
///anyone making `bomb Iran' book, yet??  Really thought we'd have completely decamped from the ME by 1980, had/have the science/tech to have done so - Energy Policy guided by the Invisible Hand of `capitalism'???  Say hi to the future/present, Uncle Sam...


Hard to add more emphasis than yours on the ME oil.

We have more energy within our, the US, borders than any other area on earth, but we won't tap it.

Why? For the same reason we usually only get Florida oranges in the NW, it cost more to ship it, which adds to the cost, which allows the price to be even higher.

If we pumped our own energy, Wall Street would have to change 40 years of speculation theory, and that would cost them money.

Plus, we won't be able to jack up the price every time a Sultanate sneezes.

And Taxes, don't forget, that in Seattle, $1.65 of the price of every gallon of regular is taxes.
2013-03-18 01:30:08 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Look, I have family members with Palestinian, Lebanese, Jordanian and Syrian citizenship.


Hang on, I thought nobody identified as Palestinian?
2013-03-18 01:29:08 PM  
1 votes:
It's hard to set expectations any lower when talking about President Obama...
2013-03-18 01:20:32 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Please keep your self-centered bigoted worldview to yourself... lest you prove yourself a total dunce.


I love this response.  I don't think we need Israel, so I'm self-centered and bigoted.

That's the height of ignorance.

1/10 for intelligence.
2013-03-18 01:08:36 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: mayIFark: When all else fails, play the anti-Semite card!

No one is playing a card game you dolt.

If you do not think Israel gets singled out because it is THE ONLY JEWISH state in the world, then your self imposed delusions are beyond me to explain.


I really want to know what you're smoking, because that has got to be some seriously strong shiat.
2013-03-18 01:00:20 PM  
1 votes:

RoboZombie: Also, Israel has been getting this kind of money from us for iver 30 years, so yeah, NOT like Pakistan et al.


Lol.  So let me get this straight....
30 years Israel is a close ally and provides an exchange of military technology = Evil
10+ years of hiding Osama Bin Laden, taking money while providing refuge for the enemy = Good

You have a perverse logic there... but then again, when someone hates Jews, their logic is often twisted.
2013-03-18 12:59:11 PM  
1 votes:

vernonFL: Israel is quickly becoming an apartheid state, where Israelis will be the minority ruling over a majority of Arabs who have little or no rights. Its morally reprehensible, especially given the history of the Jewish religion and the Jewish people.


The abused often become abusers themselves. It's just odd to see it acted out at the nation level.
2013-03-18 12:57:54 PM  
1 votes:
They really should have accepted that two-state deal in 1947.
2013-03-18 12:45:18 PM  
1 votes:

Flissss: Before the US was forced to be friendly with the Israeli state and magnified when Israel blackmailed the u.s. with the threat of worldwide nuclear war in 1973, we had virtually no enemies in the M.E.


You, uh...

You don't remember the Cold War, do you?

The reason the US allied with Israel is either because Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, and others were allying with the Soviets (I believe Syria in particular ordered military hardware from the USSR) or to prevent them from becoming so allied (depending on the nation - also, many of these states had different names/borders than now). The US "forced" itself to be friends with Israel because they wanted a Cold War ally in the MidEast.
2013-03-18 12:43:51 PM  
1 votes:

mayIFark: No, winning a war does not give anymore right to any land. Why the heck we went after Saddam after he occupied Kuwait?


And if we wanted part of Iraq, we can take it.  Just because the US chose not to do so does not mean the victor gets to dictate terms.  The purpose of the Iraq war was to liberate Kuwait, not expand into Iraq.
2013-03-18 12:38:08 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Generation_D: Alphakronik: Wake me when we stop giving Isreal $40,000,000,000 a year in aid.


They don't need it.

Biggest welfare state in America.

It's pretty obvious that the two of you are lost in WILLFUL IGNORANCE.

For those who prefer to get their opinions from facts, instead of feeling the need to repeat an idiotic remark any time Israel is mentioned; please note the following:

1) Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and Egypt all receive either more or close to what Israel gets in US aid.
2) Unlike Pakistan that was hiding OSB, Israel provides positive intelligence information to the US, in addition to an exchange of military technology, some of which is:


    ADM-141 TALD (Improved Tactical Air Launched Decoy)- device used to protect U.S. warplanes from enemy fire.
    AGM-142 Have Nap "The Popeye" - a precise bomb which hits specific coordinates
    Python missile - A major air to air missile.
    M120 mortar - A 120 mm Mortar developed by Soltam Systems.
    SMAW - An Anti-tank guided missile developed by Israel Military Industries, based on the Israeli B-300.
    Cardom - A 120mm Recoil mortar system using modern electronic navigation, self-positioning, and target acquisition.
    Gabriel missile - A sea skimming Anti-ship missile.
    SIMON breach grenade - A rifle grenade designed to breach through doors. A variant is currently in service with the United States army.
    LITENING targeting pod - A precision targeting pod designed to increase combat effectiveness of aircraft.
    International MaxxPro - An MRAP armored fighting vehicle.
    Samson Remote Controlled Weapon Station - A Remote weapon system.

3) Finally, the money that is sent in 'aid' to Israel is used to purchase US weapons, exclusively.  Therefore, the US 'aid' to Israel amounts to a US military jobs program, since the money is used to purchase US made goods.

_____

I know it's fun to hate Jews and keep screaming "why do we help them!", but don't pretend this is done on a moralistic high-ground.  The US gets plenty for it's money to Israel.  I'd argue we get a MUCH better return on investment than the money we spent in Iraq, Afghanistan, or Pakistan (over a trillion dollars on our two wars... keep it in perspective haters).


The money we send to Iraq, Egypt, Pakistan, and Afghanistan are all the result of American support for Israel. Before the US was forced to be friendly with the Israeli state and magnified when Israel blackmailed the u.s. with the threat of worldwide nuclear war in 1973, we had virtually no enemies in the M.E.

After that we started paying everyone off to play nice with Israel. This led to things like 9/11 and iraq etc. The fact is that the toxic relationship with the U.S. has cost us several trillion dollars and tens of thousands of American lives. I don't hate Israel, I want then off our Teets.
2013-03-18 12:35:45 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: TheBigJerk: Because they aren't Jordanian? Because they are Palestinian?

Oh right, "there are no Palestinian, only Arabs, that way we aren't the anti-semitic ones."

Help me out here, are you repeating this old, debunked lies for the first time because you're ignorant or just bringing the circle back around because you ran out of arguments?


///When Mexico comes in and claims most of the South-Western USA (as is historically theirs), then we'll have a real discussion... until then, you have no horse in the race...only an excuse to voice your hate of Jews.

When all else fails, play the anti-Semite card!

Up until this, no one even mentioned "Jews". We were talking about Israel. Using the suffering of ancestors to gain unfair political advantage, that is just insane.
2013-03-18 12:32:14 PM  
1 votes:

Spare Me: Because, he's too busy sucking Muslim Brotherhood dick.


Man, it took a while for the Israel, Israel Uber Alles crowd to show up.
2013-03-18 12:31:59 PM  
1 votes:

The Irresponsible Captain: One of the crazy reasons that the U.S. spends so much time on Israel:

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 460x276]


Awww Jack Chick!  Always with the mot juste!:

A Message From Jack Chick


Dear Ones in Christ,

When I saw the news of those freakish tornadoes hitting in February that caused such havoc, the first thing that crossed my mind was, "What on earth are we doing to Israel?" God made it clear we are not going against Jerusalem, God's holy city, or tamper with His holy land. But our American leaders are, and I dread to think of the consequences as the "roadmap for peace" is negotiated. Is there anyone advising the president that giving God's land to the Muslims is a no-no? The media have successfully changed the thinking of the people into believing Israel is the villain. It's the Muslims who are screaming for blood. All Israel is trying to do is stay alive!

Watch the storms increase every time we double-cross little Israel. I believe we are just getting a taste of what is coming. What should we do as believers? "Pray for the peace of Jerusalem" (Ps. 122:6). God said, "I will bless them that bless [Israel], and curse him that curseth [Israel]" (Gen 12:3). Any nation messing with Jerusalem will pay a terrible price. (See Zech. 12:1-3.) In the not-too-distant future, Russia and the Muslim nations will move against her, and they will be destroyed. (See Ezek 38-39.) When we see these things coming upon us, the Lord tells us to "look up" (Luke 21:28) and preach the gospel (Matt. 24:14). We won't be able to pass tracts in heaven. By then it will all be over.

May God bless and protect you.

Your brother in Christ,

Jack T. Chick, President
Chick Publications, Inc.
2013-03-18 12:28:50 PM  
1 votes:

TheBigJerk: Because they aren't Jordanian? Because they are Palestinian?

Oh right, "there are no Palestinian, only Arabs, that way we aren't the anti-semitic ones."

Help me out here, are you repeating this old, debunked lies for the first time because you're ignorant or just bringing the circle back around because you ran out of arguments?


Re-posting a quote from BravadoGT:
"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a
Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle
against the state of Israel for our Arab unity.
In reality
today there is no difference between Jordanians,
Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and
tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of
a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand
that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian
people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state
with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa.
While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa,
Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we
reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even
a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."
(PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, in a 1977
interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw.)

/This is a VERY real struggle for survival for a people that have been through more genocide than you can imagine...  The 'Palestinian identity' did not begin UNTIL AFTER the loss of the 1967 war... it's a political strategy... one born after KILLING ALL THE JEWS did not work, multiple times!
//I doubt you have the time to research or care about the countless wars that were brought upon Israel in less than 30 years following its creation...  But please, stop talking about Israel as though no real people live there or as though they have not been fighting to KEEP their land since 1947.
///When Mexico comes in and claims most of the South-Western USA (as is historically theirs), then we'll have a real discussion... until then, you have no horse in the race... only an excuse to voice your hate of Jews.
2013-03-18 12:28:15 PM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: it's like calling in mommy/daddy when the siblings had a fight... it's better to resolve it yourself, because whatever punishment mommy/daddy imposes does not solve the underlying problem, it only heightens the issue by using the foreign authority figure for leverage.

/Truly believe the problem would get resolved if everyone would let them figure it out for themselves without a stage to play victim to in the world theater.


Well, at least the problem is resolved - sure everyone (still) hates each other, but there are no bombs. You are correct that outside forces trying to solve regional conflicts often end up creating new ones (like ALL the post-WWI border-drawing that England/France did in the ME), but it's pretty clear that these two sides are either OK with the status quo or unwilling to do anything to change it.

Your slashy is a bit too pie-in-the-sky. They are governments - by definition, what they do is "in the world theater"/"on the world stage", and while both sides have a victim's mentality, both are more than willing to subject their people to sectarian violence (or the aftereffects of it) to further political goals. The problem is that no one wants to sort through the bullshiat - the lines are predrawn, and everything that happens gets filtered through that lens first.
2013-03-18 12:14:28 PM  
1 votes:

Nutsac_Jim: mayIFark: We heard that one was well before as well. Got something new? They must be slacking at the Israeli ministry of propaganda.

"I've heard that one before" is not an effective logical argument.


So you thought your so called argument had logic? Good for you. Make sure to add the coin to your unicorn beforehand.

No, winning a war does not give anymore right to any land. Why the heck we went after Saddam after he occupied Kuwait? Or, by your logic, if Iran wins a war against Israel and grabs it, you will be fine with that? Whether they can or not is not the question, the question is will you be saying, they won the war, this land belongs to them?
2013-03-18 12:02:30 PM  
1 votes:

mayIFark: We heard that one was well before as well. Got something new? They must be slacking at the Israeli ministry of propaganda.


"I've heard that one before" is not an effective logical argument.
2013-03-18 11:58:52 AM  
1 votes:

NostroZ: Generation_D: Alphakronik: Wake me when we stop giving Isreal $40,000,000,000 a year in aid.


They don't need it.

Biggest welfare state in America.

It's pretty obvious that the two of you are lost in WILLFUL IGNORANCE.

For those who prefer to get their opinions from facts, instead of feeling the need to repeat an idiotic remark any time Israel is mentioned; please note the following:

1) Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and Egypt all receive either more or close to what Israel gets in US aid.
2) Unlike Pakistan that was hiding OSB, Israel provides positive intelligence information to the US, in addition to an exchange of military technology, some of which is:


    ADM-141 TALD (Improved Tactical Air Launched Decoy)- device used to protect U.S. warplanes from enemy fire.
    AGM-142 Have Nap "The Popeye" - a precise bomb which hits specific coordinates
    Python missile - A major air to air missile.
    M120 mortar - A 120 mm Mortar developed by Soltam Systems.
    SMAW - An Anti-tank guided missile developed by Israel Military Industries, based on the Israeli B-300.
    Cardom - A 120mm Recoil mortar system using modern electronic navigation, self-positioning, and target acquisition.
    Gabriel missile - A sea skimming Anti-ship missile.
    SIMON breach grenade - A rifle grenade designed to breach through doors. A variant is currently in service with the United States army.
    LITENING targeting pod - A precision targeting pod designed to increase combat effectiveness of aircraft.
    International MaxxPro - An MRAP armored fighting vehicle.
    Samson Remote Controlled Weapon Station - A Remote weapon system.

3) Finally, the money that is sent in 'aid' to Israel is used to purchase US weapons, exclusively.  Therefore, the US 'aid' to Israel amounts to a US military jobs program, since the money is used to purchase US made goods.

_____

I know it's fun to hate Jews and keep screaming "why do we help them!", but don't pretend this is done on a moralistic high-g ...


"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a
Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle
against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality
today there is no difference between Jordanians,
Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and
tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of
a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand
that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian
people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state
with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa.
While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa,
Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we
reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even
a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."
(PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, in a 1977
interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw.)
2013-03-18 11:49:51 AM  
1 votes:
What about the stuff Israel steals from the US in order to sell to China?
What say you, JDIF members?
2013-03-18 11:45:36 AM  
1 votes:

vernonFL: InstaZen25: Except Arabs are citizens there and they have Arab members of their Knesset. Also, Arabs are not the majority there. So many things wrong here

Arabs living in the West Bank are not citizens of any country.



That can be taken up with Jordan, Europe, et. al. Ignoring the tyranny in the rest of the middle east to focus solely on Israel's relationship with the West Bank and Gaza is way to narrow a view.
2013-03-18 11:45:25 AM  
1 votes:

St_Francis_P: Freudian slip. Your subconscious wanted to say that Obama is the communist fascist socialist Kenyan usurper anti-Christ anti-Semite empty suit threat to America that everyone says.


I disagree.  Obama usually has very nice suits and they are tailored, so he fills them out well.
2013-03-18 11:25:43 AM  
1 votes:

vernonFL: Israel is quickly becoming an apartheid state, where Israelis will be the minority ruling over a majority of Arabs who have little or no rights. Its morally reprehensible, especially given the history of the Jewish religion and the Jewish people.


???

Except Arabs are citizens there and they have Arab members of their Knesset. Also, Arabs are not the majority there. So many things wrong here.
2013-03-18 11:23:14 AM  
1 votes:

vernonFL: Israel is quickly becoming an apartheid state, where Israelis will be the minority ruling over a majority of Arabs who have little or no rights. Its morally reprehensible, especially given the history of the Jewish religion and the Jewish people.


Apartheid state is a fancy sounding word for someone trying to pigeon hole Jews as people who are 'special in their history of religion and as the Jewish people'.

Every country is FOR it's people... Yes, not all Arabs are citizens, but there ARE Arab citizens with EQUAL rights.  No different than blacks, or Latinos here in America who have EQUAL rights, but are discriminated against, as is the human nature.

If you're here to argue that JEWS are SPECIAL and ANY imperfection from them as a WHOLE PEOPLE means that they are evil. Then we have our first official anti-Semite in this thread.
2013-03-18 10:47:28 AM  
1 votes:
There's a difference between supporting an ally meet objectives for it's people and enabling an ally to run ramshod over it's neighbors and think itself above consequence.
2013-03-18 10:45:47 AM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: Lasing ME peace simply isn't possible with the current Israeli government.  They're interested only in expansion.


I don't know...

/Lasers might be just what we need
2013-03-18 09:44:09 AM  
1 votes:

Peter von Nostrand: I'm deeply concerned

This sounds very concerning

If you're not concerned, you're not paying attention


My concern is subterranean. It extends to the center of the Earth.
2013-03-18 09:18:42 AM  
1 votes:
I'm deeply concerned

This sounds very concerning

If you're not concerned, you're not paying attention
 
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