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(Yahoo)   Justice delivered: two members of the high school football team that is the pride of Steubenville were found guilty of raping a drunken 16-year-old girl   (news.yahoo.com ) divider line
    More: News, Ohio, found guilty, football team  
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12557 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Mar 2013 at 11:24 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-17 01:37:29 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: Yes.

Your point?


Just checking.
 
2013-03-17 01:38:02 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: Theaetetus:

Doesn't help, for an obvious reason: the vast majority of men are not rapists. The ones who are are sociopaths like InitialCommentGuy, and telling them not to rape will not be successful, by definition. All we can do is publicly identify them and warn people so that they don't have an opportunity to rape, and simultaneously let them know that we're watching them and they won't find any sympathy or escape from prosecution with their "but she was drunk" or "but she was wearing a short skirt" or "but she's had sex before so she's a slut".

Yes, again.  Anyone who says something you disagree with must be a rapist.


I didn't call you a rapist. I called you a sociopath. I have no specific knowledge of whether you have or have not raped anyone, regardless of how likely I think it is.
 
2013-03-17 01:38:17 PM  

Jim_Tressel's_O-Face: InitialCommentGuy: I was a teenager.  I also didn't accept a drink I didn't personally mix/pour myself or give out a drink that wasn't witnessed being mixed by the person I made it for.

Yes, yes, we know, your wisdom and maturity came with you straight from the womb. You have been immaculate since, never having slipped up or made a mistake. We can take your word for it, since you're being so judgemental on the internet.


Or, again, you could realize that not all people were teenage idiots.  Indeed I find that teenage idiocy continues through adulthood, as demonstrated in your strangely savant-level of riding my dick.
 
2013-03-17 01:40:07 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Bontesla: Rape is NEVER partially the victim's fault.

Every time I read something like this, I wonder why its author is being so helpful to rapists.  Women who think they can do whatever they want guilt-free are easy pickings.


Why do you think blaming rape victims is helpful to women or rape victims?

The only risk factor for being raped is being in the presence of a rapist. Most of the time - the victim isn't aware they're in the presence of a rapist until after the rape.

Wearing frumpy clothes doesn't prevent rape. Traveling in groups doesn't prevent rape. Drinking doesn't prevent rape.

Suggesting that if only this girl remained sober, she wouldn't have been raped is absurd and speculative.

Teaching people that you can avoid rape if you follow these things is incredibly cruel to the victims that have followed all of the rules and still ended up being raped.
 
2013-03-17 01:40:17 PM  

Trixie212: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Tak the Hideous New Girl: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: She got finger banged. What that poor girl in India went through on that bus was brutal.

Cuz if one thing is bad other things can't be bad, too

I didn't say that. In fact, the other part of my post said that she didn't deserve for them to touch her. I still don't believe it qualified as being "brutal".

I imagine it was quite brutal to her. Good god, it is probably the worst thing that will happen to her and will stay with her for life. Just because worse things happen doesn't mean she should have a stiff upper lip and move on.

I have sons and I gave daughters and I've tried to imagine how I would feel if it was any of my kids who were involved in this. My opinion is not going to be popular but I really don't care. Had that been my daughter, I would have held her just as responsible for what happened to her as I would have the guys. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have understood her being hurt and upset and I know she would have had to deal with the consequences for a long time.

But at the end of the day, the consequences began with the choices she made. If this girls' former friends are to be believed, she was a bit of a train wreck. Ideally, she could be a train wreck and affect no one other than herself but we all know that's not the way society works.

The boys will pay the consequences for this all the rest of their days. Rightly so? Maybe. I just think she shares in the responsibility of what happened to her.

I feel so sorry for your daughter. I can see her ending up like this poor girl. Link

I don't even know who did the bolded bit but Holy fark. Really?

It's depressing enough to see all the men jumping to defend their rape fantasies, but when a MOTHER is saying the girl is to blame, and that what happened to her wasn't "brutal" and dismissing it as just "getting finger banged," it's even more sickening.

One more time, moron. I sa ...


So you're saying that rape is ok if the woman is drunk, not ok if she's sober?  Because that's what it sounds like by saying that she "doesn't share responsibility" for being raped if she's sober.
 
2013-03-17 01:40:58 PM  
Ah Fark Rape threads. Once again proving that sociopathy isn't a rare quality around these parts.
 
2013-03-17 01:41:21 PM  

Bender The Offender: Popcorn Johnny: Musikslayer: Popcorn Johnny:  drunken, consensual

Oxymoron, dumbass.

Drunk people never have consensual sex? I guess I'm guilty of raping my girlfriend about 237 times.

If by "girlfriend" you mean your "right hand"


Now, be fair.  He could be lefthanded.
 
2013-03-17 01:41:25 PM  

Tak the Hideous New Girl: captainmaxthedestroyer:

/i would never walk naked in a bad neighborhood but I really should be able to do so safely, because a naked woman does not force a man into violent copulation. That's the most retarded argument men ever tried to put over on women.

You are clearly farked in the head.  And clearly, you do not understand how the world and more specifically, males function.

Please do tell us how men function, because you seem to be saying that he mere sight of a naked women sends men into an uncontrollable frenzy of lust and rapine. If that's the case the average life drawing/painting class should be banned forthwith! Art museums should have armed guards in every room!

Seriously are you saying that given the opportunity, the average dude would rape a vulnerable woman because he just can't help it? You certainly seem to have a low opinion of men's capacity for rationality.


I wish I could say that this sort of viewpoint is rare, but it isn't.  My wife and I taught self-defense on a college campus.  It was a co-ed class, because it was for credit.  Overall, it was a very successful class that actually allowed both men and women to protect themselves in real life situations.  One semester (out of four) we had a psychology master's student come and ask us if we could hold a workshop for the men in the class.  One thing it told me was that my ability to pick out douchebags is spot on.  Some of the beliefs and things that came out of these young mens' mouths was truly disturbing.

Luckily, people like the chucklehead you are sparring with are not the majority, but they are definitely out there in significant numbers and have built a self-verification system that allows them to believe all sorts of farked-up stuff.
 
2013-03-17 01:41:42 PM  

adamgreeney: It's depressing enough to see all the men jumping to defend their rape fantasies, but when a MOTHER is saying the girl is to blame, and that what happened to her wasn't "brutal" and dismissing it as just "getting finger banged," it's even more sickening.


Given the percentage of men being wrongly accused of rape (Yes maybe a rape did occur but the wrong person is accused) I treat all rape allegations with a high degree of of skepticism.

"Every year since 1989, in about 25 percent of the sexual assault cases referred to the FBI where results could be obtained, the primary suspect has been excluded by forensic DNA testing. Specifically, FBI officials report that out of roughly 10,000 sexual assault cases since 1989, about 2,000 tests have been inconclusive, about 2,000 tests have excluded the primary suspect, and about 6,000 have "matched" or included the primary suspect."

The authors continued, "these percentages have remained constant for 7 years, and the National Institute of Justice's informal survey of private laboratories reveals a strikingly similar 26 percent exclusion rate"

Link

And then there is this:

Former California Football Standout, Cleared of Rape, Kidnapping Conviction


"Banks, who is 26 today, was just 17 when his classmate, Wanetta Gibson - who he'd known since middle school - told authorities he sexually assaulted her."

"After being charged with rape and kidnapping in 2002, Banks took a plea deal on the advice of his lawyer to avoid spending the rest of his life behind bars despite knowing he was innocent. His accuser, Wanetta Gibson, collected $1.5 million after suing the school over lack of safety on campus"

anks was sentenced to six years, ruining his football career and was forced to wear an ankle bracelet after being released on parole in 2008.

While the Bank's future seemed bleak - another potential star athlete ruining their life with one bad decision - the unbelievable happened February 28, 2011, when Gibson requested his friendship on Facebook.

"Why would you friend request me?" Banks asked Gibson over Facebook. "The reply was, 'I figured you and I could let bygones be bygones. I was immature then, but I'm much more mature now.'"

CBS reports Gibson then met with Banks in person and pledged to help him clear his name, but she was reluctant to reiterate her story to prosecutors because she didn't want to give back the $1.5 million civil judgment awarded to her.


Despite Gibson's hesitance, Banks was able to secretly record her admitting his innocence, which was enough for a Los Angeles County Superior Court judge to reverse the conviction."
 
2013-03-17 01:41:45 PM  

Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: Yep. Shame on me. I raised my sons to treat women with respect and I raised my daughters to understand that all boys aren't raised the way their brothers were. I raised all of my kids to understand that if they CHOSE to engage in dangerous behavior, consequences would ensue. Should I have raised them to expect cotton candy and roses from everybody they came in contact with?

It's great that your boys can walk the Earth with confidence because Mom will look on with admiration and approval when they date rape some slut to teach her a lesson.

Because that totally agrees with what I said.


What you SAID is that once a girl become intoxicated, she is just as responsible for being raped as the person who rapes her.

You say your children understand this as well. Your sons believe now that they are 100% responsible for raping a sober girl, but only 50% responsible if she had something to drink.

You are telling them that their own responsibility for rape can be mitigated by the victim's decision to drink.
 
2013-03-17 01:42:41 PM  
Lock these bastards up and throw away the ley.
 
2013-03-17 01:43:07 PM  

Tak the Hideous New Girl: captainmaxthedestroyer:

/i would never walk naked in a bad neighborhood but I really should be able to do so safely, because a naked woman does not force a man into violent copulation. That's the most retarded argument men ever tried to put over on women.

You are clearly farked in the head.  And clearly, you do not understand how the world and more specifically, males function.

Please do tell us how men function, because you seem to be saying that he mere sight of a naked women sends men into an uncontrollable frenzy of lust and rapine. If that's the case the average life drawing/painting class should be banned forthwith! Art museums should have armed guards in every room!

Seriously are you saying that given the opportunity, the average dude would rape a vulnerable woman because he just can't help it? You certainly seem to have a low opinion of men's capacity for rationality.


Ok.

Let's assume that I'm in my apartment and a hot naked woman walks down my street and into my view.  My first thought would be, "WTF" and then in almost a split instant I would have between one and ten thousand images of lust pass before my vision and one of those would likely ignite a surge in my nether region.  And then, because I'm a better man than I am male, I would let that thought slip away and I would return to drinking my coffee wondering why that stupid white girl was walking naked down my street.

But not all males are good men.  That's the issue here.
 
2013-03-17 01:44:16 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: Or, again, you could realize that not all people were teenage idiots.  Indeed I find that teenage idiocy continues through adulthood, as demonstrated in your strangely savant-level of riding my dick.


Yes, because teengers who get in over their heads should obviously be judged like adults.

And its not my fault you're swinging it around to show off just how morally superior you are to all of us plebes.
 
2013-03-17 01:44:42 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Big Ramifications: Could you have chosen a more pissweak light-on-facts news story if you tried? The comments section alludes to so much more. Very frustrating.

Came to say pretty much this.  The NYT has a nice reprise of the trial.


legend, thx
 
2013-03-17 01:44:54 PM  

captainmaxthedestroyer: elysive: /i would never walk naked in a bad neighborhood but I really should be able to do so safely, because a naked woman does not force a man into violent copulation. That's the most retarded argument men ever tried to put over on women.

You are clearly farked in the head.  And clearly, you do not understand how the world and more specifically, males function.



Oh, so you want to warn women about how males function. You know, I'm quite familiar with how guys like you think. It was no small factor in learning self defense. I'm not one of those looney, drunk in public, risk taking females...but I defend those people's safety. It annoys me when people go out of their way blame them for crimes enacted by real predators.

Our society is structured such that men use all sorts of lame excuses for sex crime when in places like France, nudity is commonplace. Get over yourself and stop trying to justify your male fantasies. A penis does not make a person special. Men can control their urges just as well as women. When they dont, it's a product of culture, not biology..and I stick by my original statement that society should allow me to dress or undress however I want without fear of violence. We dont live in the Middle East.
 
2013-03-17 01:44:58 PM  
I have sons and I gave daughters and I've tried to imagine how I would feel if it was any of my kids who were involved in this. My opinion is not going to be popular but I really don't care. Had that been my daughter, I would have held her just as responsible for what happened to her as I would have the guys. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have understood her being hurt and upset and I know she would have had to deal with the consequences for a long time.

See Trixie, this is why people think you are a horrible person (for the record I think you are a horrible person too).

You have a crying, traumatized girl (your daughter!) who's worried that she got a disease or is pregnant, is terrified that there pictures of her shame are all over Twitter or Facebook (something I did not have to worry about back in the dinosaur age, thank goodness), and your reaction is to tell your daughter, "Too bad, so sad, you should have made better choices."
 
2013-03-17 01:45:06 PM  
I heard about this when the victim went against a court order and posted the names of the 'juvenile offenders' to everyone who would listen. It was when she faced jail time for speaking out as a victim. that others got involved. A year? Pffffttttt. However, these boys names are shot. No hiding from the Internet.
 
2013-03-17 01:45:10 PM  

captainmaxthedestroyer: Let's assume that I'm in my apartment and a hot naked woman walks down my street and into my view.  My first thought would be, "WTF" and then in almost a split instant I would have between one and ten thousand images of lust pass before my vision and one of those would likely ignite a surge in my nether region.  And then, because I'm a better man than I am male, I would let that thought slip away and I would return to drinking my coffee wondering why that stupid white girl was walking naked down my street.

But not all males are good men.  That's the issue here.


But. But. But the social contract!
 
2013-03-17 01:45:17 PM  

casey17: Trixie212: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Tak the Hideous New Girl: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: She got finger banged. What that poor girl in India went through on that bus was brutal.

Cuz if one thing is bad other things can't be bad, too

I didn't say that. In fact, the other part of my post said that she didn't deserve for them to touch her. I still don't believe it qualified as being "brutal".

I imagine it was quite brutal to her. Good god, it is probably the worst thing that will happen to her and will stay with her for life. Just because worse things happen doesn't mean she should have a stiff upper lip and move on.

I have sons and I gave daughters and I've tried to imagine how I would feel if it was any of my kids who were involved in this. My opinion is not going to be popular but I really don't care. Had that been my daughter, I would have held her just as responsible for what happened to her as I would have the guys. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have understood her being hurt and upset and I know she would have had to deal with the consequences for a long time.

But at the end of the day, the consequences began with the choices she made. If this girls' former friends are to be believed, she was a bit of a train wreck. Ideally, she could be a train wreck and affect no one other than herself but we all know that's not the way society works.

The boys will pay the consequences for this all the rest of their days. Rightly so? Maybe. I just think she shares in the responsibility of what happened to her.

I feel so sorry for your daughter. I can see her ending up like this poor girl. Link

I don't even know who did the bolded bit but Holy fark. Really?

It's depressing enough to see all the men jumping to defend their rape fantasies, but when a MOTHER is saying the girl is to blame, and that what happened to her wasn't "brutal" and dismissing it as just "getting finger banged," it's even more sickening.

One more time, moron. I sa ...

So you're saying that rape is ok if the woman is drunk, not ok if she's sober?  Because that's what it sounds like by saying that she "doesn't share responsibility" for being raped if she's sober.


I think in this case, nothing would have happened to her had she remained sober. I don't think that excuses what they did to her. Still, I really believe her night would have gone in an entirely different direction had she passed on the booze. At this point, I'm just worn out with trying to help anyone understand what I'm saying. At no time have I said the boys should get a pass.
 
2013-03-17 01:45:58 PM  
www.movie-poster-artwork-finder.com

You know...maybe it's just wishful thinking, but there's a part of me that wishes that a small team of "justice-bringers" would start keeping a list of people that got slaps on the wrist for things that completely destroyed another person's life, and then hunted them to extinction.

Or if they didn't kill them, then at least inflicted the same pain, humiliation, and shame on their victims...publicly.  Like sending around pics on the interwebs of these guys passed out drunk with brooms shoved up their poop-chutes so everyone can laugh at them, and call them broom-buddies.  You know...justice that inflicts the feelings of victimhood upon them that they so gleefully handed out to another.

Yeah...wishful thinking...I know.
 
2013-03-17 01:46:40 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: I was a teenager.  I also didn't accept a drink I didn't personally mix/pour myself or give out a drink that wasn't witnessed being mixed by the person I made it for.


Okay that's a pretty good one.  I Lol'd.
 
2013-03-17 01:46:44 PM  

hasty ambush: Given the percentage of men being wrongly accused of rape (Yes maybe a rape did occur but the wrong person is accused) I treat all rape allegations with a high degree of of skepticism.


You found a 25% failure rate and some ancedotes to back up your misogyny. Congratulations.
 
2013-03-17 01:46:56 PM  

elysive: Oh, so you want to warn women about how males function. You know, I'm quite familiar with how guys like you think. It was no small factor in learning self defense. I'm not one of those looney, drunk in public, risk taking females...but I defend those people's safety. It annoys me when people go out of their way blame them for crimes enacted by real predators.


Words on websites don't defend against rape.  Slacktivist.
 
2013-03-17 01:47:15 PM  

captainmaxthedestroyer: yelmrog: captainmaxthedestroyer: Perhaps the underage retarded girl who got black-out drunk in an unsafe environment learned her lesson as well?

Probably not.

She was totally asking for it, right?

Not saying that.  And I'm not saying that rape isn't wrong or even that it wasn't rape in this case.  It appears it was.

I'm saying that if you get shiat-faced and pass out face down, ass up, there's a solid chance that something bad is going to happen to you.

If you get shiat-faced and get behind the wheel, there's a solid chance that something bad is going to happen to you.

If you get shiat-faced at a bar and start talking shiat to somebody, there is a solid chance that something bad is going to happen to you.


clothdiapermalaysia.com
 
2013-03-17 01:47:22 PM  

DrewCurtisJr: casey17: Why is it we have to tell girls/women not to drink, not to "dress provocatively" etc., but guys aren't told NOT TO RAPE? It should be a given, but apparently it's not.

Not this again.

Say no to drugs. If stopping people from committing crimes were as simple as telling people not to do it we wouldn't have any crime.


First off, doing drugs isn't the same as rape. But yes, I know what you're saying......I just don't understand *why* all these men/boys think it's perfectly all right to help themselves to another persons' body. WHY aren't their parents teaching them it's WRONG? WHERE are they getting the idea that it's acceptable behavior?
 
2013-03-17 01:47:27 PM  

Polyhazard: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: Yep. Shame on me. I raised my sons to treat women with respect and I raised my daughters to understand that all boys aren't raised the way their brothers were. I raised all of my kids to understand that if they CHOSE to engage in dangerous behavior, consequences would ensue. Should I have raised them to expect cotton candy and roses from everybody they came in contact with?

It's great that your boys can walk the Earth with confidence because Mom will look on with admiration and approval when they date rape some slut to teach her a lesson.

Because that totally agrees with what I said.

What you SAID is that once a girl become intoxicated, she is just as responsible for being raped as the person who rapes her.

You say your children understand this as well. Your sons believe now that they are 100% responsible for raping a sober girl, but only 50% responsible if she had something to drink.

You are telling them that their own responsibility for rape can be mitigated by the victim's decision to drink.


Spent a lot of time twisting that, didn't you?
 
2013-03-17 01:47:56 PM  

SubBass49: [www.movie-poster-artwork-finder.com image 487x700]

You know...maybe it's just wishful thinking, but there's a part of me that wishes that a small team of "justice-bringers" would start keeping a list of people that got slaps on the wrist for things that completely destroyed another person's life, and then hunted them to extinction.

Or if they didn't kill them, then at least inflicted the same pain, humiliation, and shame on their victims...publicly.  Like sending around pics on the interwebs of these guys passed out drunk with brooms shoved up their poop-chutes so everyone can laugh at them, and call them broom-buddies.  You know...justice that inflicts the feelings of victimhood upon them that they so gleefully handed out to another.

Yeah...wishful thinking...I know.


Wishful thinking including rape and murder. Excellent.
 
2013-03-17 01:48:30 PM  
One year in juvenile detention? That's it?

Our country is farked up.
 
2013-03-17 01:49:08 PM  

natmar_76: Our country is farked up.


You should read the thread.
 
2013-03-17 01:49:23 PM  

Popular Opinion: sobe: Whole Wheat: Never in my most drunken days of high school or college would I have imagined this to be alright. Maybe the parents of S-ville should focus less on sports and more on morality.

I'm sure they consider themselves an upright Christian god-fearing community.

nobody who truly fears god would do such a thing.


Well, that's true as far as it goes. All you have to do is create a god who is OK with whatever it is you want to do -- or modify your god's will if you change your mind -- and off you go. (And really, that's the whole point of creating a god, isn't it? To relieve yourself of the responsibility of having to honestly think about things?)

God-fearing, Christian slaveholders went to church, convinced that god had sent them the blacks to serve them.
 
2013-03-17 01:49:50 PM  

aedude01: ha-ha-guy: Lady Indica: They could have been charged with kidnapping (they moved the victim), criminal conspiracy, etc.

You can't convict on charges the prosecutors didn't file...

If the prosecutor didn't file these charges, in theory couldn't he file them now?  It wouldn't be double jeopardy since kidnapping is a completely different crime.


Yup, in theory. But it won't happen. You might see a criminal conspiracy case (based on the name 'rape crew' and the attempted intimidation and cover up that followed), but I doubt it. Any additional justice will probably come in the form of civil judgments against those involved. I wonder how much of it will be covered by various home owner insurance policies.

You can see in this very thread, despite the abundance of evidence in this case to rape, how many rape apologists there are. How many who say the victim is somehow responsible. Those are the type of people too stupid to get out of jury duty adjudicating these cases.
 
2013-03-17 01:50:15 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: SubBass49: [www.movie-poster-artwork-finder.com image 487x700]

You know...maybe it's just wishful thinking, but there's a part of me that wishes that a small team of "justice-bringers" would start keeping a list of people that got slaps on the wrist for things that completely destroyed another person's life, and then hunted them to extinction.

Or if they didn't kill them, then at least inflicted the same pain, humiliation, and shame on their victims...publicly.  Like sending around pics on the interwebs of these guys passed out drunk with brooms shoved up their poop-chutes so everyone can laugh at them, and call them broom-buddies.  You know...justice that inflicts the feelings of victimhood upon them that they so gleefully handed out to another.

Yeah...wishful thinking...I know.

Wishful thinking including rape and murder. Excellent.


Only to be "gifted" to those that have done the same, and not been properly punished.  But yeah...
 
2013-03-17 01:50:35 PM  

Trixie212: Polyhazard: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: Yep. Shame on me. I raised my sons to treat women with respect and I raised my daughters to understand that all boys aren't raised the way their brothers were. I raised all of my kids to understand that if they CHOSE to engage in dangerous behavior, consequences would ensue. Should I have raised them to expect cotton candy and roses from everybody they came in contact with?

It's great that your boys can walk the Earth with confidence because Mom will look on with admiration and approval when they date rape some slut to teach her a lesson.

Because that totally agrees with what I said.

What you SAID is that once a girl become intoxicated, she is just as responsible for being raped as the person who rapes her.

You say your children understand this as well. Your sons believe now that they are 100% responsible for raping a sober girl, but only 50% responsible if she had something to drink.

You are telling them that their own responsibility for rape can be mitigated by the victim's decision to drink.

Spent a lot of time twisting that, didn't you?


Do you believe that blame is shared equally by the rapist and a drunken victim or not?
 
2013-03-17 01:50:39 PM  

Trixie212: casey17: Trixie212: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Tak the Hideous New Girl: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: She got finger banged. What that poor girl in India went through on that bus was brutal.

Cuz if one thing is bad other things can't be bad, too

I didn't say that. In fact, the other part of my post said that she didn't deserve for them to touch her. I still don't believe it qualified as being "brutal".

I imagine it was quite brutal to her. Good god, it is probably the worst thing that will happen to her and will stay with her for life. Just because worse things happen doesn't mean she should have a stiff upper lip and move on.

I have sons and I gave daughters and I've tried to imagine how I would feel if it was any of my kids who were involved in this. My opinion is not going to be popular but I really don't care. Had that been my daughter, I would have held her just as responsible for what happened to her as I would have the guys. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have understood her being hurt and upset and I know she would have had to deal with the consequences for a long time.

But at the end of the day, the consequences began with the choices she made. If this girls' former friends are to be believed, she was a bit of a train wreck. Ideally, she could be a train wreck and affect no one other than herself but we all know that's not the way society works.

The boys will pay the consequences for this all the rest of their days. Rightly so? Maybe. I just think she shares in the responsibility of what happened to her.

I feel so sorry for your daughter. I can see her ending up like this poor girl. Link

I don't even know who did the bolded bit but Holy fark. Really?

It's depressing enough to see all the men jumping to defend their rape fantasies, but when a MOTHER is saying the girl is to blame, and that what happened to her wasn't "brutal" and dismissing it as just "getting finger banged," it's even more sickening.

One mo ...


I've got your back.

...only with your permission though.  And if you're not drinking.
 
2013-03-17 01:51:15 PM  

Trixie212: casey17: Trixie212: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Tak the Hideous New Girl: casey17: Trixie212: adamgreeney: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: She got finger banged. What that poor girl in India went through on that bus was brutal.

Cuz if one thing is bad other things can't be bad, too

I didn't say that. In fact, the other part of my post said that she didn't deserve for them to touch her. I still don't believe it qualified as being "brutal".

I imagine it was quite brutal to her. Good god, it is probably the worst thing that will happen to her and will stay with her for life. Just because worse things happen doesn't mean she should have a stiff upper lip and move on.

I have sons and I gave daughters and I've tried to imagine how I would feel if it was any of my kids who were involved in this. My opinion is not going to be popular but I really don't care. Had that been my daughter, I would have held her just as responsible for what happened to her as I would have the guys. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have understood her being hurt and upset and I know she would have had to deal with the consequences for a long time.

But at the end of the day, the consequences began with the choices she made. If this girls' former friends are to be believed, she was a bit of a train wreck. Ideally, she could be a train wreck and affect no one other than herself but we all know that's not the way society works.

The boys will pay the consequences for this all the rest of their days. Rightly so? Maybe. I just think she shares in the responsibility of what happened to her.

I feel so sorry for your daughter. I can see her ending up like this poor girl. Link

I don't even know who did the bolded bit but Holy fark. Really?

It's depressing enough to see all the men jumping to defend their rape fantasies, but when a MOTHER is saying the girl is to blame, and that what happened to her wasn't "brutal" and dismissing it as just "getting finger banged," it's even more sickening.

One mo ...


So the Rape Squad only rapes unconscious women? Got any citation for that?
 
2013-03-17 01:51:26 PM  

SubBass49: Only to be "gifted" to those that have done the same, and not been properly punished.  But yeah...


Yep.  Eye for an eye justice is a great idea.  I'm guessing you lack depth perception.
 
2013-03-17 01:51:43 PM  

knobmaker: Bender The Offender: Popcorn Johnny: Musikslayer: Popcorn Johnny:  drunken, consensual

Oxymoron, dumbass.

Drunk people never have consensual sex? I guess I'm guilty of raping my girlfriend about 237 times.

If by "girlfriend" you mean your "right hand"

Now, be fair.  He could be lefthanded.


Or he could have no hands and uses his feet instead.
 
2013-03-17 01:51:50 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: Jim_Tressel's_O-Face: InitialCommentGuy: I am sorry that I assume a basic wisdom so simple it can be imparted to a five year old to have been included in a teenager's repertoire of 'how not to fark up my life'.

So you never were a teenager, you were formed onto this sinful Earth fully-formed with all-seeing wisdom and judgement over others. How nice.

I was a teenager.  I also didn't accept a drink I didn't personally mix/pour myself or give out a drink that wasn't witnessed being mixed by the person I made it for.

You do realize teenager doesn't equal moron to everyone right champ?


Unless you are intently staring at your drink for the duration of your evening, there is a chance someone can slip something into it after you mix/pour it yourself. Turn your head to talk to a friend and somebody can slip something into it. I had a chance to review some security footage at a bar I used to bartend at after a customer thought she got a mickey. Sure enough she turned her head for about 20 seconds, even had her hand still around the glass and some guy sidled up next to her and his hand went over her glass. Thank God nothing worse actually happened to her that night.
 
2013-03-17 01:52:17 PM  

SubBass49: [www.movie-poster-artwork-finder.com image 487x700]

You know...maybe it's just wishful thinking, but there's a part of me that wishes that a small team of "justice-bringers" would start keeping a list of people that got slaps on the wrist for things that completely destroyed another person's life, and then hunted them to extinction.

Or if they didn't kill them, then at least inflicted the same pain, humiliation, and shame on their victims...publicly.  Like sending around pics on the interwebs of these guys passed out drunk with brooms shoved up their poop-chutes so everyone can laugh at them, and call them broom-buddies.  You know...justice that inflicts the feelings of victimhood upon them that they so gleefully handed out to another.

Yeah...wishful thinking...I know.


we had one, but we messed up and offed the wrong guy
www.catman.ca
 
2013-03-17 01:52:23 PM  

Jim_Tressel's_O-Face: natmar_76: Our country is farked up.

You should read the thread.


This.
 
2013-03-17 01:52:29 PM  

Tak the Hideous New Girl: I have sons and I gave daughters and I've tried to imagine how I would feel if it was any of my kids who were involved in this. My opinion is not going to be popular but I really don't care. Had that been my daughter, I would have held her just as responsible for what happened to her as I would have the guys. I'm not saying that I wouldn't have understood her being hurt and upset and I know she would have had to deal with the consequences for a long time.

See Trixie, this is why people think you are a horrible person (for the record I think you are a horrible person too).

You have a crying, traumatized girl (your daughter!) who's worried that she got a disease or is pregnant, is terrified that there pictures of her shame are all over Twitter or Facebook (something I did not have to worry about back in the dinosaur age, thank goodness), and your reaction is to tell your daughter, "Too bad, so sad, you should have made better choices."


I already understood what people thought. You're entitled to feel the way you do. I've been on Fark for a number of years and have taken exception to a lot of things people have said but I've never told anyone they were a horrible person.
 
2013-03-17 01:53:04 PM  

casey17: DrewCurtisJr: casey17: Why is it we have to tell girls/women not to drink, not to "dress provocatively" etc., but guys aren't told NOT TO RAPE? It should be a given, but apparently it's not.

Not this again.

Say no to drugs. If stopping people from committing crimes were as simple as telling people not to do it we wouldn't have any crime.

First off, doing drugs isn't the same as rape. But yes, I know what you're saying......I just don't understand *why* all these men/boys think it's perfectly all right to help themselves to another persons' body. WHY aren't their parents teaching them it's WRONG? WHERE are they getting the idea that it's acceptable behavior?


I think this question brings up a whole lot of issues that we as a society just don't want to deal with. Issues of women as commodities/decorations/fark holes as opposed to people (examples of which you can see on Fark about a thousand times a day) and male privilege. These are things that make the average person (not just men) run away screaming.
 
2013-03-17 01:53:17 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: Jim_Tressel's_O-Face: InitialCommentGuy: Truly we should accept any and all drinks from anyone who gives them to us.

I mean, strangers don't exist where there's booze right?

If only all sixteen year olds were as wise and above it all as you.

These days children are taught from an early age of stranger danger.  Don't eat, drink, etc. anything given to you by a stranger.  Apparently they just mystically lose this understanding at 14-18.  I'm sorry, but taking drinks in that atmosphere is a huge no-no per everything we teach, but apparently it is alright to forget basic lessons as long as booze are involved?


the problem isn't what we teach, its how we teach it.  I was raised in a very authoritarian home, in which the rules of life were dictated and expected to be followed on blind faith alone.  rather than appealing to reason as the method for teaching morality, my parents followed a set of rigid memes which have been passed on from generation to generation.  Many of these ideas are intrinsically good - based on a sense of empathy for others, but the problem is they are not taught at all, but enforced as canonical law.  This is almost the polar opposite of the curiosity, enjoyment of experiment, and general yearning to understand the world around us that has elevated humanity to incredible heights given the limitations and challenges we face from nature.  So the authoritative system we use to enforce morals which in principle are good, represses the curious nature that is embedded in our genes.  And surprise, surprise, you end up with the rebellious teenage years where the stirring of hormones opens up the need for experiment that has been bottled up for years.
 
2013-03-17 01:54:07 PM  

MagSeven: Unless you are intently staring at your drink for the duration of your evening, there is a chance someone can slip something into it after you mix/pour it yourself. Turn your head to talk to a friend and somebody can slip something into it. I had a chance to review some security footage at a bar I used to bartend at after a customer thought she got a mickey. Sure enough she turned her head for about 20 seconds, even had her hand still around the glass and some guy sidled up next to her and his hand went over her glass. Thank God nothing worse actually happened to her that night.


Of course! All of those nights of roofie-riddled slumber caused when I didn't do proper attending to my drinks!  I should have thought about it!

Good of you to make up a nice lie there though.
 
2013-03-17 01:54:09 PM  

InitialCommentGuy: SubBass49: Only to be "gifted" to those that have done the same, and not been properly punished.  But yeah...

Yep.  Eye for an eye justice is a great idea.  I'm guessing you lack depth perception.


Eye-for-an-eye justice which would be completely unnecessary if the RAPIST SCUM got a sentence that was commensurate with the horrific crimes they committed.

If the justice system works, there is no need for my wish to come true.  This is a case that proves that it doesn't work.
 
2013-03-17 01:55:46 PM  

Trixie212: Polyhazard: Trixie212: jaytkay: Trixie212: Yep. Shame on me. I raised my sons to treat women with respect and I raised my daughters to understand that all boys aren't raised the way their brothers were. I raised all of my kids to understand that if they CHOSE to engage in dangerous behavior, consequences would ensue. Should I have raised them to expect cotton candy and roses from everybody they came in contact with?

It's great that your boys can walk the Earth with confidence because Mom will look on with admiration and approval when they date rape some slut to teach her a lesson.

Because that totally agrees with what I said.

What you SAID is that once a girl become intoxicated, she is just as responsible for being raped as the person who rapes her.

You say your children understand this as well. Your sons believe now that they are 100% responsible for raping a sober girl, but only 50% responsible if she had something to drink.

You are telling them that their own responsibility for rape can be mitigated by the victim's decision to drink.

Spent a lot of time twisting that, didn't you?


What part did Polyhazard twist? That falls in line with everything you've posted. You even said that if the girl had been sober she wouldn't have "shared responsibility" in what happened to her.
 
2013-03-17 01:55:58 PM  

Theaetetus: BarkingUnicorn: Bontesla: Rape is NEVER partially the victim's fault.

Every time I read something like this, I wonder why its author is being so helpful to rapists.  Women who think they can do whatever they want guilt-free are easy pickings.

Other way around, actually. Telling women that they're partially responsible if they're drinking, wearing short skirts, in the wrong part of town, out at the wrong time of night, etc. is really telling rapists that these are the conditions for targets for whom we will not prosecute. That's what helps rapists.


It's kind of both.

Boys should be bludgeoned with the "it's never rape" dogma, and girls should be bludgeoned with the "don't be a moran" dogma.
 
2013-03-17 01:56:43 PM  

SubBass49: InitialCommentGuy: SubBass49: Only to be "gifted" to those that have done the same, and not been properly punished.  But yeah...

Yep.  Eye for an eye justice is a great idea.  I'm guessing you lack depth perception.

Eye-for-an-eye justice which would be completely unnecessary if the RAPIST SCUM got a sentence that was commensurate with the horrific crimes they committed.

If the justice system works, there is no need for my wish to come true.  This is a case that proves that it doesn't work.


It works just as intended in this case.  I apologize that you think that they should serve life sentences or be raped for their crimes.

I also laugh at the people in the thread who believe these guys are facing shower rape due to their crimes.  Football players in juvie are going to be nigh untouchable, but that need for vengeance beyond thought seems popular in your type.
 
2013-03-17 01:56:48 PM  

Lady Indica: aedude01: ha-ha-guy: Lady Indica: They could have been charged with kidnapping (they moved the victim), criminal conspiracy, etc.

You can't convict on charges the prosecutors didn't file...

If the prosecutor didn't file these charges, in theory couldn't he file them now?  It wouldn't be double jeopardy since kidnapping is a completely different crime.

Yup, in theory. But it won't happen. You might see a criminal conspiracy case (based on the name 'rape crew' and the attempted intimidation and cover up that followed), but I doubt it. Any additional justice will probably come in the form of civil judgments against those involved. I wonder how much of it will be covered by various home owner insurance policies.

You can see in this very thread, despite the abundance of evidence in this case to rape, how many rape apologists there are. How many who say the victim is somehow responsible. Those are the type of people too stupid to get out of jury duty adjudicating these cases.


You're the only person I've got favorited. You're a generally awesome person, so I feel the need to step up here.

When someone gets behind the wheel of a car with alcohol in their system, and then gets involved in a traffic accident, no matter who was actually at fault, the drunk driver is recorded as being at fault. These are matters of life and death, and the person who chose to drink and do something dangerous is always at fault.

The guys who raped this girl are assholes, and I'd send them to the Wall, but I don't get how people can say that the girl is absolved of all responsibility, when the precedence is the drunk person is always responsible for what happens to themselves and others.
 
2013-03-17 01:57:10 PM  

casey17: WHY aren't their parents teaching them it's WRONG? WHERE are they getting the idea that it's acceptable behavior?


Again it's not that simple. Some people know something is wrong, but they do it anyway.
 
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