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(The Sun)   R.I.P. and sleep tight Lance Corporal James Ashworth, for you are now in the canyon of heroes   (thesun.co.uk) divider line 70
    More: Hero, Lance Corporal James Ashworth, Victoria Cross, Battalion Grenadier Guards, R.I.P., Kettering, Northants, Grenadier Guards, Brit Awards  
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13173 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Mar 2013 at 12:23 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-16 06:51:38 AM
People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.
 
2013-03-16 09:17:21 AM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


What?  No distinctive Cockney accent?
/paging Michael Caine

/ happy 80th dude
 
2013-03-16 11:17:20 AM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


It doesn't matter if you're right or not, a number of people are going to flame you to hell for that.  We are not allowed to consider military members to be anything but heroes.
 
2013-03-16 12:00:51 PM
I thought the Canyon of Heroes was the term used when people are given parades up Broadway from the Battery.
 
2013-03-16 12:06:49 PM
What's an Ashworth?


/waits
 
2013-03-16 12:26:19 PM
Unfortunately they misspelled "valor" on the medal, and will have to re-forge it.

img.thesun.co.uk
 
2013-03-16 12:26:33 PM
A brave man in a bullshiat war. Fighting for the TAPI pipeline, oh wait I mean freedom and democracy.

 That guy was 11 when the current Afghan war started.
 
2013-03-16 12:27:27 PM

PC LOAD LETTER: I thought the Canyon of Heroes was the term used when people are given parades up Broadway from the Battery.


Is... is that a euphemism?
 
2013-03-16 12:30:49 PM
Salute and Farewell
 
2013-03-16 12:33:11 PM
FTA
"We are devastated by the loss of our son, brother, uncle and boyfriend."

I knew the inbreeding was bad over there, but damn.

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


8/10
Points deducted for being in so quick with it.
 
2013-03-16 12:34:51 PM

Suede head: PC LOAD LETTER: I thought the Canyon of Heroes was the term used when people are given parades up Broadway from the Battery.

Is... is that a euphemism?


Only if your name is Christy Canyon.
 
2013-03-16 12:35:47 PM
He was quite a handsome young man, wasn't he?
 
2013-03-16 12:36:00 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


Recent Pic of DrPainMD:

www.gamefront.com
 
2013-03-16 12:36:27 PM
Had he and I but met
By some old ancient inn,
We should have set us down to wet
Right many a nipperkin!

But ranged as infantry,
And staring face to face,
I shot at him as he at me,
And killed him in his place.

I shot him dead because--
Because he was my foe,
Just so: my foe of course he was;
That's clear enough; although

He thought he'd 'list, perhaps,
Off-hand like--just as I--
Was out of work--had sold his traps--
No other reason why.

Yes; quaint and curious war is!
You shoot a fellow down
You'd treat, if met where any bar is,
Or help to half a crown.
 
2013-03-16 12:36:30 PM
When you're lying half-dead on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
and go to your God like a soldier
soldier of the Queen
 
2013-03-16 12:37:46 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


Hey look, a troll in the Boobies.  How quaint.
 
2013-03-16 12:39:07 PM
TFA doesn't actually say what he did...
 
2013-03-16 12:39:29 PM
Looks like the ugly truth has everyone trying to find a clever ad-hom.
 
2013-03-16 12:41:48 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


I won't flame you, but I disagree with you. The taliban aided and hid those most responsible for 9/11, and deserved retaliation.
As to this soldier, he died trying to protect his fellow soldiers, and I respect his sacrifice.
 
2013-03-16 12:42:41 PM

gameshowhost: What's an Ashworth?



Roughly an increase of 0.0001 cents per share in (pick an oil company)'s bottom line.
 
2013-03-16 12:48:19 PM
Why didn't the new pope stop this tragedy. This is a sign that baby Jesus is unhappy with the meddling of men in the affairs of popiness.
 
2013-03-16 12:49:24 PM
Holy crap, what an attractive man. Too bad he is no more. RIP, handsome and foreign soldier guy.
 
2013-03-16 12:51:48 PM

cantsleep: DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.

I won't flame you, but I disagree with you. The taliban aided and hid those most responsible for 9/11, and deserved retaliation.
As to this soldier, he died trying to protect his fellow soldiers, and I respect his sacrifice.


They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.
 
2013-03-16 12:52:41 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


War of aggression?

Nice try.  Afghanistan was always a defensive war, retalliation for the attack on the United States on 9/11/01.  UK involvement is pursuant to the invocation of the North Atlantic Treaty (i.e. the Taliban regime governing Afghanistan sanctioned an attack on the US, was therefore legally an attack on every NATO power, including the UK).

They started this one, so it isn't a war of aggression.
 
2013-03-16 12:54:33 PM
A shame a Brit as good looking as that had to get killed by a brown person.
 
2013-03-16 01:00:27 PM
The Japanese Buddhists, whom considered themselves pacifists, believed that Samurai, when they died, they simply were reborn as Samurai.

The Vikings thought that warriors ended either with Odin, or Freya.
 
2013-03-16 01:00:53 PM

Silverstaff: defensive war, retalliation for


Yup, the best defense is a good retaliation. I guess the bombing of Saudi Arabia wasn't shown on TV here for some reason.
 
2013-03-16 01:01:11 PM

Silverstaff: They started this one, so it isn't a war of aggression.


Down with Ulfric, the killer of kings, on the day of your death we will drink and we'll sing.
 
2013-03-16 01:03:36 PM

Fubini: TFA doesn't actually say what he did...


I read the whole thing trying to figure out if there were more details, but my best guess is he acted as a Human Shield.
 
2013-03-16 01:05:29 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


ignore (troll) click!
there's ways to express yourself that don't make individuals place you one the ignore list.
In your next registration you might like to try learning them.
Adios till then.
 
2013-03-16 01:09:03 PM

gameshowhost: What's an Ashworth?

/waits



A dead soldier!
WAKA-WAKA!
 
2013-03-16 01:15:39 PM

Suede head: When you're lying half-dead on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
and go to your God like a soldier
soldier of the Queen


That's beastly.
 
2013-03-16 01:16:17 PM
Here ya go  DrPainMd. maybe someone will jump on it for ya..

4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-03-16 01:20:52 PM
Much respect.

Rest in peace, Lance Corporal Ashworth.
 
2013-03-16 01:23:38 PM
25.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-03-16 01:25:06 PM

Suede head: When you're lying half-dead on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
and go to your God like a soldier
soldier of the Queen


Ahh, Kipling. Feels like coming home.
 
2013-03-16 01:28:57 PM

ghare: Suede head: When you're lying half-dead on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
and go to your God like a soldier
soldier of the Queen

Ahh, Kipling. Feels like coming home.


You like Kipling?
 
2013-03-16 01:29:19 PM

Silverstaff: DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.

War of aggression?

Nice try.  Afghanistan was always a defensive war, retalliation for the attack on the United States on 9/11/01.  UK involvement is pursuant to the invocation of the North Atlantic Treaty (i.e. the Taliban regime governing Afghanistan sanctioned an attack on the US, was therefore legally an attack on every NATO power, including the UK).

They started this one, so it isn't a war of aggression.


That's just the causus belli we used to justify the invasion. The Taliban were just one political party in the region, the vast majority of Afghanistan was and is nominally ungoverned except by local law and custom, so how do we invade an entire country, displace millions, kill thousands of civilians? We do it because Rumsfield, Bush and Chaney want to clear the decks of any future threat, get a nice war going to boost the party status, and use 9/11 cynically as a pretext to invade not just Afghanistan, who really had nothing to do with 9/11, but Iraq, who were avowed enemies of Al-Queda. That's just historical fact now, with documentary evidence to support it, thanks to FOA findings by American journalists and wikileaks media blasts. It's not even technically a war, since we declared them all terrorists and not legitimate soldiers, sidestepping all sorts of treaties and internal checks on war-operations. Convenient, that.

It's all absurd, but I don't think it has any bearing on whether an individual soldier should receive a medal of valor, since that's just predicated on individual acts of bravery, not foreign policy considerations. Still, I wish first-responders, doctors and educators got equally grand medals for achievement and bravery, the hawkish bent of half the U.S. (And I assume the UK has it's own variant)  is tiresome to put up with.
 
2013-03-16 01:58:07 PM

deadsanta: It's all absurd, but I don't think it has any bearing on whether an individual soldier should receive a medal of valor, since that's just predicated on individual acts of bravery, not foreign policy considerations.


That's a great way to put it.  Individual valor is just that, a judgement of the individuals actions in that situation.

Modern politics that caused the situation to occur are irrelevant mostly.  Sure, if you fought for the south and the right to keep slaves, there's an argument to be made there, but the modern soldier is pretty much kept out of the loop, so to speak.  They sign up to serve and protect, and leave the thinking and decision making up to others.

Maybe that makes them brainless jarheads, a tool in both senses of the word, but without soldiers backing government the world would be a very different and tyranical place where the strong are all powerful.

Thankfully we are social creatures for the most part and do sense a need to more or less get along, and to stop confrontation when possible, or when needed to defend ourselves and weaker members of our species from aggressors.

Now, that returns us to the people we've elected making decisions on behalf of us all, and all the dirty and shady reasons that go with that.  The soldier is not to blame, the leader is.

If people were more active in a political nature, some of that dirtiness would go away.  The reason those shady people manage to gain power is because the people let them.  In a sense, griping about a soldier in a war a person doesn't agree with, is projecting his own personal fault.

That is the root of the problem.  Sure, the leaders are to blame, but what allowed them to become leaders?  We did.  The theory behind our western society is that our leaders are supposed to represent the populace, AND to be regulated by the populace.

The populace has lost sight of much of that.  We're too busy with Fark, WoW, Angry birds to do anything about it.  sure, we may make an angry comment in the two minutes of the day that we use to think about such things, but other than that, we really don't care.

When democracy(as such, the term is used loosely) fails, it is only the fault of the people.  Sure, the political leader may be a bad guy, but we expressly allow it when we ignore what he does.

When people project that fault such as the troll(poe's law of course) is doing in this thread, they do so on the wrong party(twice removed even) and only worsen the situation.  It's akin to spreading misinformation, intent or no, that's the result.

It's the result of religious like thinking.  Faith that our leadership is omniscient, so they stay out of it.  These trolls/zealots take that to an extreme.  Misplaced faith in a patron like system that does not exist.  Our government does not exist to protect us, it exists to serve us.  if we are not vocal in our needs and desires, the system fails. We, as a populace, are to blame.
 
2013-03-16 01:58:53 PM

tonguedepressor: ghare: Suede head: When you're lying half-dead on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
and go to your God like a soldier
soldier of the Queen

Ahh, Kipling. Feels like coming home.

You like Kipling?


How can you not?
 
2013-03-16 02:09:15 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.



jlee5879.files.wordpress.com


/ IHBT
 
2013-03-16 02:12:24 PM

ghare: tonguedepressor: ghare: Suede head: When you're lying half-dead on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
and go to your God like a soldier
soldier of the Queen

Ahh, Kipling. Feels like coming home.

You like Kipling?

How can you not?


www.donaldmcgill.info
 
2013-03-16 02:18:32 PM

DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.


Your shoulders and back would probably hurt a lot less if you pulled your head out of your arse.

deadsanta: They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.


The same goes for you. Your attempt to follow up and sound intellectual in another post is noted and by the way all those lovely websites that told you what you wanted to hear might just have had an agenda behind it so the idea that you're holding them up as some unassailable fortress of unbiased truth is really quite amusing. I'm guessing that all the contradictory information out there that flies in the fact of some the things you believe must all be wrong or some kind of grand conspiracy.

The primary base of operate for Al Queda was Afghanistan. Irregardless of where the funding and support came from that is where the leadership and main infrastructure of the organization was. The idea that we might have been able to negotiate something with the Taliban is utterly laughable. This was a government of brutal subjugation who allowed Al Queda to exist within their country and nobody in their right mind questions whether the Taliban actively supported/worked with Al Queda. There's a reason they became almost indistinguishable from one another once the fighting began.

The are the worst kind of ignorant fool. The type so filled with sanctimony and self righteous indignation that you've actually gone out of your way to make yourself more ignorant. You are literally making a concerted effort to be stupid for your own sake.
 
2013-03-16 02:23:26 PM

deadsanta: cantsleep: DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.

I won't flame you, but I disagree with you. The taliban aided and hid those most responsible for 9/11, and deserved retaliation.
As to this soldier, he died trying to protect his fellow soldiers, and I respect his sacrifice.

They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.


That's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it pays off for you...
 
2013-03-16 02:30:45 PM

randomjsa: DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.

Your shoulders and back would probably hurt a lot less if you pulled your head out of your arse.

deadsanta: They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.

The same goes for you. Your attempt to follow up and sound intellectual in another post is noted and by the way all those lovely websites that told you what you wanted to hear might just have had an agenda behind it so the idea that you're holding them up as some unassailable fortress of unbiased truth is really quite amusing. I'm guessing that all the contradictory information out there that flies in the fact of some the things you believe must all be wrong or some kind of grand conspiracy.

The primary base of operate for Al Queda was Afghanistan. Irregardless of where the funding and support came from that is where the leadership and main infrastructure of the organization was. The idea that we might have been able to negotiate something with the Taliban is utterly laughable. This was a government of brutal subjugation who allowed Al Queda to exist within their country and nobody in their right mind questions whether the Taliban actively supported/worked with Al Queda. There's a reason they became almost indistinguishable from one another once the fighting began.

The are the worst kind of ignorant fool. The type so filled with sanctimony and self righteous indignation that you've actually gone out of your way to make yourself more ignorant. You are ...


Salute, I have not favorited someone and voted smart in a very long time
 
2013-03-16 02:36:51 PM

deadsanta: They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.


Nice try.

We requested Bin Laden be extradited years before 9/11, twice, in 1998 and in 2000, for his role in other attacks like the bombing of the USS Cole and a series of bombings of US embassies in Africa.

The Taliban regime in Afghanistan made it crystal clear they would refuse to extradite Osama Bin Laden to the US for his jihad, saying he had done nothing wrong as his attacks had not harmed Muslims.  Since he was not killing Muslims, the Taliban didn't see anything he did as wrong, and they told us that.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2000-08-20/news/0008200272_1_saud i- born-militant-osama-bin-laden-new-sanctions

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/217947.stm

9/11 was the first major attack he launched after the Taliban regime made it clear they would never hand him over to the US, and that they saw nothing wrong with his jihad.  So, it's not like we had any real expectation that another extradition request would help.

In this case we had thousands dead, a crater where much of lower Manhattan was, and a major portion of the Pentagon in rubble.  This wasn't a bomb hitting a warship at sea, it wasn't a car bomb targeting an embassy overseas, we ignored that. . .this was 4 hijackings, intending to destroy 4 major buildings, resulting in thousands of fatalities on US soil and major damage to New York City and Washington DC. . .by an organization being actively supported and sheltered by a soveriegn government that had openly stated it saw no problem with that campaign of warfare

That is casus belli by any stretch of the imagination.
 
2013-03-16 02:45:04 PM

deadsanta: cantsleep: DrPainMD: People who participate in wars of aggression are not heroes. If you travel half-way around the world to fight people who are standing in their own front yards trying to defend their homes and their families, you're just a Nazi in a different uniform. Rot in hell, Ashworth.

I won't flame you, but I disagree with you. The taliban aided and hid those most responsible for 9/11, and deserved retaliation.
As to this soldier, he died trying to protect his fellow soldiers, and I respect his sacrifice.

They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.


No, we based our reply on the aeons old tradition of "kill ours and we'll kill yours, asshole."
 
2013-03-16 04:01:26 PM
As an Englishman I'd like to say just one (long-winded) thing, if I may?

Thanks for killing all those women & children bro and making my life, & the life of my fellow countrymen, far less safe & free than it was during the IRA bombing campaigns of the 80's & 90's (that I grew up with).

/War? What is it good for?
 
2013-03-16 04:02:15 PM
No heroes in this goat screw. If these guys want to live in the 15th century let them.
 
2013-03-16 04:04:58 PM

Silverstaff: deadsanta: They aided and hid those people based on thousand years-old traditions of guest-rights and hospitality, which if we'd taken half a minute to understand, we could have circumvented through diplomacy, bribery and our own outreach. But we didn't, we just told the innkeeper he and his family were evil and we'd be killing them all now.

Nice try.

We requested Bin Laden be extradited years before 9/11, twice, in 1998 and in 2000, for his role in other attacks like the bombing of the USS Cole and a series of bombings of US embassies in Africa.

The Taliban regime in Afghanistan made it crystal clear they would refuse to extradite Osama Bin Laden to the US for his jihad, saying he had done nothing wrong as his attacks had not harmed Muslims.  Since he was not killing Muslims, the Taliban didn't see anything he did as wrong, and they told us that.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2000-08-20/news/0008200272_1_saud i- born-militant-osama-bin-laden-new-sanctions

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/217947.stm

9/11 was the first major attack he launched after the Taliban regime made it clear they would never hand him over to the US, and that they saw nothing wrong with his jihad.  So, it's not like we had any real expectation that another extradition request would help.

In this case we had thousands dead, a crater where much of lower Manhattan was, and a major portion of the Pentagon in rubble.  This wasn't a bomb hitting a warship at sea, it wasn't a car bomb targeting an embassy overseas, we ignored that. . .this was 4 hijackings, intending to destroy 4 major buildings, resulting in thousands of fatalities on US soil and major damage to New York City and Washington DC. . .by an organization being actively supported and sheltered by a soveriegn government that had openly stated it saw no problem with that campaign of warfare

That is casus belli by any stretch of the imagination.


Of course Bin Laden was found hiding with our old friends the Pakis
 
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