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(Huffington Post)   Census shows that places that should never have been populated eventually realized it   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 117
    More: Obvious, population ageing, new immigrants, Rick Snyder, Population Reference Bureau, Fort Benning, subprime mortgage crisis, meat packing plant, U.S. counties  
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17162 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Mar 2013 at 3:27 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-14 07:40:30 PM

ladyfortuna: I suspect that if certain climate change predictions come true, much of the private resident population of those western states is going to flee for states that have more water, food, etc. - leaving lots of even cheaper land behind.


Thing is that our precipitations and snowpack levels have not been significantly lower.   For the most part, it has been pretty average.  The water usage on the other hand.....
 
2013-03-14 08:29:47 PM
I'm kind of surprised, I figured the rise of the internet and prevalence of easy shipping options would inject new money into areas that could never reach world markets before.
 
2013-03-14 09:23:37 PM

vpb: PC LOAD LETTER: Detroit's population decline has to do with lead and steel, and I don't mean in the factories.

You mean the auto industry that we exported to Japan?


That's some first class stupid right there. Oh. I see your from Florida. Carry on!
 
2013-03-14 10:44:00 PM

EngineerAU: tricycleracer: I got shouted out of a bar by a drunk New Orleanian woman for suggesting that just maybe people should live below sea level next to a giant river and a huge lake.

If you go to a bar to criticize the life choices of drunk strangers, you're going to have a bad time.


Depends on your size.
 
2013-03-14 10:48:51 PM

Rapmaster2000: HeadLever: dv-ous: It amazes me that so many people are so much more attached to their geographic place than they are to the lifestyle they wanted, the plans they had, their dreams, culture, and the families that abandoned them to live in more civilized parts.

Some of us raised in the rural areas have a huge connection to the geographical area and the land that we grew up on.  Many of us spend our time and effort looking for a job and scraping by so that we can continue to live in these places.

Not everything in life is about status and money when you get to see this out your backdoor regularly.

[mw2.google.com image 500x335]

Some of us raised in the rural areas couldn't wait to get the fark out.

[www.wargearstudio.com image 700x525]
This is how most people see rural Indiana.  At 85 mph on the way to somewhere else.


Bizzarely, I recongnized that is Indiana before I scrolled to the bottom...
 
2013-03-14 10:53:01 PM
As someone born in rural bumblefark, I'm very happy to live near civilization now. Sure it sucks that starter homes are going for $600,000, but I'll take that any day over some strip mall shiat hole where fine dining means getting dressed up to go to Applebee's.

If I want to see nature, I'll fly there, snap some photos, and GTFO.
 
2013-03-14 11:12:39 PM

stiletto_the_wise: If I want to see nature, I'll fly there, snap some photos, and GTFO.


Good for you. That attitude helps to keep the characteristics of the land just the way I like it.
 
2013-03-15 01:06:38 AM

Hacker_X: xanadian: In the last year, Maine joined West Virginia as the only two entire states where deaths exceed births

WOO!!  YEAH, MAINE!!!! WE'RE #...2!  WE'RE #2!

I drove through WV last week. A large part of that state looks like a wasteland right now. Dead, brown, unpopulated. And lots of the areas that are populated look like they are falling apart. That includes the capital.


Born and raised.  I love it here, and I didn't appreciate it until I moved around a lot to different states/cities.  It's a beautiful state, though my area (outside of Pittsburgh) isn't as pretty as the rest of the state.  As opposed to the rest of the country where sure there's a Walgreens and McDonalds on every block but everything looks the same and has no sense of "home." People can be backwards at times but at least they don't look at you like you're a crazy person just because you try to exchange pleasantries.
 
2013-03-15 01:10:17 AM
dv-ous:  families that abandoned them to live in more civilized parts.

Civilized parts? Yeah I can't imagine why some of us wouldn't want to join in on that
 
2013-03-15 01:30:07 AM

Alonjar: I'm kind of surprised, I figured the rise of the internet and prevalence of easy shipping options would inject new money into areas that could never reach world markets before.


Rural broadband in the US is fiendishly expensive and buggy when it isn't entirely nonexistent. Wild Blue's satellite internet service has come a long way over the years, but none of us would mistake it for DSL or cable. Sadly, even though there's plenty of cell data coverage in most rural areas (at least the ones within sniffing distance of an Interstate), the usage fees are astronomical since AT&T and Verizon don't want people switching from DSL+LTE to LTE.
 
2013-03-15 01:55:19 AM

piglet: Not amusing: The U.S. and world economies founded on the concept that there must be continual and unlimited growth despite finite land and resources. Greed really does put the blinders on people.


True, but not the way most people interpret that. Modern finance requires ever-expanding economic growth, which can happen a number of ways, including but by no means limited to...

1. Population growth (labor supply increases, resulting in more work that can be performed).
2. Increased resources (new supplies of affordable raw materials are found, which are converted into marginally useful goods).
3. Gains in efficiency and productivity (we learn to do more with less).

The Industrial Revolution was pretty much "all of the above" - population growth skyrocketed due to improvements in medicine and sanitation. At the same time, improvements in science and technology (along with a bit of the ol' ultraviolence in Africa) led to more resources being discovered and ultimately consumed. On top of that, gains in productivity made it possible for people to spend less time on the farm or traveling by foot and more time in cities building lots of stuff.

Nowadays, option 1 really isn't on the table anymore - the global population is starting to flatten out now that birth rates in poorer countries is starting to flatten out due to a combination of there being fewer poorer areas, increased distribution of contraceptives, and AIDS (more of that ol' ultraviolence in Africa). Mexican birth rates, for example, aren't going to be high enough to paper over below-replacement birth rates in the US and Canada for too much longer. Option 2, meanwhile, is also disappearing - the last time a large area of the world with easily accessible natural resources opened up was when the Cold War ended and western companies could use modern technology in former communist countries (there's a reason gas was <$1/gallon during the '90s). At this point, the only places left are either near-impossible to reach due to physical constraints (the Arctic, deep ocean, Africa), political constraints (much of the North American wilderness, almost all of Europe, Africa), or require staggering inputs of resources and energy in order to exploit effectively (tar sands, fracking, Africa).

That leaves option 3. We grow by doing more with less.

The good news is option 3 is pretty realistic, if a little slow. Modern cars, for example, are more powerful,  more fuel efficient, and infinitely more reliable than anything sold in the '70s. Computers... well, we all know how computing is going. Even manufacturing has progressed substantially - the reason manufacturing is returning to America is because it's cheaper to build robots in North Carolina and ship the resulting product to its chief market in the next state over than it is to build certain products in China, ship them across the Pacific, transport them over the several and myriad mountain ranges between San Francisco and eastern United States, and then finally get them where they need to be in the US. In short, continual technological improvement will lead to improved standards of living, which will be interpreted as "growth".

Having said that, in order to achieve continual technological improvement, we have to be able to accumulate sufficient capital to build improved productive capacity and the improved productive capacity has to achieve a reasonable rate of return against the capital that was expended. Unfortunately, instead of investing in capital creation, our finance industry has instead decided they can enjoy greater rates of return (in the short term) by exchanging pieces of paper with one another and convincing everyone else to do the same. The sad part is they're absolutely right... in the short term.

/At least our financial instruments are more efficient.
//They're destroying more with less!
 
2013-03-15 03:01:32 AM

HeadLever: ladyfortuna: I suspect that if certain climate change predictions come true, much of the private resident population of those western states is going to flee for states that have more water, food, etc. - leaving lots of even cheaper land behind.

Thing is that our precipitations and snowpack levels have not been significantly lower.   For the most part, it has been pretty average.  The water usage on the other hand.....


Usage, sure, but the predictions forecast in the next ~20 years or so that midwest/west states are going to have a lot less water to draw from overall. Again, obviously this is all speculation, but last year's winter was CRAZY weird for western NY, and I hope never to see the like again. The bugs were terrible all summer and the trees got all farked up because they were confused by the high temperatures.
 
2013-03-15 07:48:26 AM

vpb: PC LOAD LETTER: Detroit's population decline has to do with lead and steel, and I don't mean in the factories.

You mean the auto industry that we exported to Japan?


Toyota builds its cars in the US. GM is mostly in Mexico. So what are you talking about?
 
2013-03-15 08:37:08 AM

IAMTHEINTARWEBS: vpb: PC LOAD LETTER: Detroit's population decline has to do with lead and steel, and I don't mean in the factories.

You mean the auto industry that we exported to Japan?

Toyota builds its cars in the US. GM is mostly in Mexico. So what are you talking about?


So does Honda, VW, BMW and Mecedes
 
2013-03-15 10:54:56 AM

ladyfortuna: Usage, sure, but the predictions forecast in the next ~20 years or so that midwest/west states are going to have a lot less water to draw from overall. Again, obviously this is all speculation,


Exactly, they have been saying that for 15 years now and it still has not come true here.  Here is a good representation of the streamflows for a good bellweather river here in Idaho.  As bad years go, the late 80 and mid 30s were the worst, while the early 60s and 2000s were good decades.  In any case, there is no downward trend in this streamflow measurement.  Will it happen?  very possible.  However, so far their predictions are not coming to true.

As a note, the Columbia River basin has had enough water running through its hydro plants that they have had to shut down the wind farms because there was too much power on the grid.
 
2013-03-15 10:55:50 AM

d23: mcreadyblue: Eventually, low housing prices might draw people back if telecommuting ever becomes mainstream.

As the new idiot CEO of Yahoo is blamed, telecommuting is only for the important people.

For everyone else in the 99.8% it's corporate feudalism.  Wait for the company dorms and the company stores... they're right around the bend again.


As a software dev working three simultaneous remote development contracts, it's nice to discover that I am now "an important people".

I'll say that it is nice that I can enjoy a commute of 20 feet from my bed to my desk (I do make detours to the bathroom and kitchen though so it's more like 100 feet or so once all is said and done).  It's not so nice that I work from 7:30AM to around 6:30PM most days.  However, today is Friday and my typical Friday habit is to step away from the desk around 4PM and head downstairs and pour myself a Buffalo Trace neat and then head back to the desk to tie up the week's effort with a little bit of leisure.
 
2013-03-15 05:03:50 PM

Crewmannumber6: IAMTHEINTARWEBS: vpb: PC LOAD LETTER: Detroit's population decline has to do with lead and steel, and I don't mean in the factories.

You mean the auto industry that we exported to Japan?

Toyota builds its cars in the US. GM is mostly in Mexico. So what are you talking about?

So does Honda, VW, BMW and Mecedes


I just bought an American-made car--a nearly-100%-domestic-parts Camry.

The factories may have moved away from Detroit, but we still build a ton of automobiles.
 
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