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(The New York Times)   Colorado legalizes civil unions for same-sex couples. State ski industry expecting downturn due to rain of fire and brimstone (link fixed)   (nytimes.com) divider line 47
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2281 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Mar 2013 at 5:24 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-13 04:50:18 PM
7 votes:
Oh, and of course, this is a "civil union" bill that grants "gay couples rights similar to marriage," and those have been repeatedly held to be clear violations of the 14th amendment in the federal courts, so congratulations on legalizing gay marriage, in another year or so!
2013-03-13 06:13:16 PM
5 votes:

ck1938: Dear Homosexuals,

Despite the conclusions my choice to ski in Utah rather than Colorado from now on may lead you to I can assure you it is not true.  I am not trying to avoid you.  Rather I choose to avoid the legions of unemployed and giggling stoners who make up an increasingly large percentage of the population of Colorado.  Enjoy your stay in the Miles High state.

Sincerely,

John F.


And nothing of value was lost.  Have fun in Utah!
2013-03-13 04:26:23 PM
5 votes:
Civil unions? Really

You guys are farking sick.

Two homosexuals should not have the option for civil union.

Instead it should be marriage
2013-03-13 05:36:21 PM
4 votes:
4.bp.blogspot.com

Separate but equal!
2013-03-13 06:46:03 PM
3 votes:

NkThrasher: Mrtraveler01: Ah yes, the city of self-reliant conservatives who rely on the government (ie: Military) to power it's economy.

You can't argue with irony like that.

Just remember, citizen, if you want a street lamp lit in your area of Colorado Springs, you can volunteer to pay for it.  The city sure cant.

/Seriously
//http://www.springsgov.com/news.aspx?newsid=295


I like how the headline has multiple meanings:

Over 30 percent of City's streetlights to go dark to help keep City in black.

"It's just like what many of us are doing at home.When our take-home paychecks are reduced we look for ways to cut expenses.We have more than 24,000 streetlights within the City limits and the energy cost alone to keep all those lights on is about $3.2 million each year.By shutting off between 8,000 and 10,000 of the most inefficient lights we expect to save taxpayers slightly over $1.2 million each year.In these lean times we are all cutting back where we can," explained Dave Krauth, City Traffic Engineer.

This is why I don't take those "treat the government budget like a household budget" tards seriously.

This would be the same as saying "I'm not going to put new batteries in the smoke detector because I can save money by not buying batteries".

There's a cost to not doing something.
2013-03-13 06:24:55 PM
3 votes:

iheartscotch: You can accomplish most of the same stuff by giving the other person power of attorney.

I guess I don't know why anyone, now-a-days, wouldn't have a living will. But, sometimes wills mean squat in court.

Custody issues are difficult for everyone.

I agree that changes are needed; but, you might have to wait till all of the boomers are gone before it happens.


As someone who gets powers of attorney frequently, I can tell you that no, they don't grant all of the same powers, rights, or privileges of marriage.
Want a simple example? Hospital visitation. There's no contract, power of attorney, or other document you and I could sign that could force a non-party hospital to let me into your ER room.
How about another? Military cemetery burial rights for spouses. If I was a veteran, there would be no contract you and I could sign that would force the government to bury you with me.
Third? Spousal immunity against being forced to testify. Again, no private contract would grant that constitutional right.
2013-03-13 05:46:02 PM
3 votes:

iheartscotch: Theaetetus: Oh, and of course, this is a "civil union" bill that grants "gay couples rights similar to marriage," and those have been repeatedly held to be clear violations of the 14th amendment in the federal courts, so congratulations on legalizing gay marriage, in another year or so!

Hey now! Baby steps. Life isn't about the destination; it's about the journey.

/ I've always thought that it was screwy that LGTwhatevers didn't just have the ceremony in a friendly church and thumb their noses at the anti-people.


Because it's not about the ceremony, it's about the over a thousand legal rights and privileges that come with the civil institution of marriage. Ceremonies? Shiat, those are always up to the church, which is why divorced people can get wed by protestants and thumb their noses at the Catholics. Weddings have nothing to do with legal rights, though.
2013-03-13 07:27:45 PM
2 votes:

milsorgen: After the glitz and glamour of a thousand courthouse weddings and the temporary boost it will provide to economies expect the moral decay to make itself more and more apparent as economic activity (a domain of the industrious and morally righteous) declines as more and more Christians head for greener pastures. Combine this the epidemic of hard drug abuse in the state (marihauna is a scheduled I drug mind you) and we have a new Welfare Capitol in the works.


I hope that at least part of what you say comes true--if the Christian organizations based in Colorado Springs were to abandon the state, that would be a tremendous boon.  As it is, they are a burden on the area's tax structure--their employees tend towards large families, overloading the schools and the limited water supplies, yet the organizations themselves pay no taxes.
2013-03-13 07:13:15 PM
2 votes:

EngineerAU: gingerjet: Marriage isn't a religious institution.

Yes it is. You can argue that it isn't exclusive a religious institution or that it historically arose for non-religious purposes but is absolutely positively is a religious institution in addition to being a legal one. To claim otherwise is to wander into the world of flat earthers and believers in the reptile people.



Can you get married without going to the courthouse and getting a license?  NO.
Can you get married by Sheriff Andy and never have religion involved at all?  YES.
Can you get married in a church belonging to any of five dozen religions OTHER than Christianity (which seems to be the only one against gay marriage), including being married by Elvis, aliens, or a minister who got ordained over the internet in between kitten-killing episodes?  YES.

Marriage in the United States is not a religious instituion.  It is not the private reserve of Christians, and they do not get to define it.
2013-03-13 06:45:00 PM
2 votes:
Oh, and they are leaning (meaning He is leaning, my folks vote in blocks) to legalizing the gay marriage.  It is quite an amazing thing to grow up with someone that treated his troops better than his children and watch him slowly melt.  Not "melt" in a bad way.  I guess, open his eyes would be a better choice of words.

To see a man that has had so many views ingrained in himself through bigoted family and military career crumble.  Send the flames but it really does bring a tear to my eye to hear my father shoot down some of our Born Again family members as he tells them that he is finally seeing what he fought all those years for.

/Cheers Dad.  I love you.
2013-03-13 06:42:14 PM
2 votes:

Mrtraveler01: Ah yes, the city of self-reliant conservatives who rely on the government (ie: Military) to power it's economy.

You can't argue with irony like that.


Just remember, citizen, if you want a street lamp lit in your area of Colorado Springs, you can volunteer to pay for it.  The city sure cant.

/Seriously
//http://www.springsgov.com/news.aspx?newsid=295
2013-03-13 06:27:18 PM
2 votes:

NkThrasher: FatalDischarge: milsorgen: After the glitz and glamour of a thousand courthouse weddings and the temporary boost it will provide to economies expect the moral decay to make itself more and more apparent as economic activity (a domain of the industrious and morally righteous) declines as more and more Christians head for greener pastures. Combine this the epidemic of hard drug abuse in the state (marihauna is a scheduled I drug mind you) and we have a new Welfare Capitol in the works.

So your'e saying christians will leave the state? Good deal.

Colorado Springs would become a ghost town.


Ah yes, the city of self-reliant conservatives who rely on the government (ie: Military) to power it's economy.

You can't argue with irony like that.
2013-03-13 06:19:28 PM
2 votes:

ck1938: Dear Homosexuals,

Despite the conclusions my choice to ski in Utah rather than Colorado from now on may lead you to I can assure you it is not true.  I am not trying to avoid you.  Rather I choose to avoid the legions of unemployed and giggling stoners who make up an increasingly large percentage of the population of Colorado hang out with Mormons because I'm boring and cool people find me insufferable.  Enjoy your stay in the Miles High state.

Sincerely,

John F.


FTFY
2013-03-13 05:34:20 PM
2 votes:
Are civil unions allowed only for same sex couples? And are the benefits/responsibilities the same as 'traditional' marriage? If both are 'yes', I could easily see civil unions becoming a popular alternative for those who don't need or want the intermingled state and religious institution but do want a legal association with their partner, regardless of gender.
2013-03-13 05:27:57 PM
2 votes:
Ah, so this is why Colorado Springs is issuing forth copious amounts of derp lately.

//Well more than usual
2013-03-13 05:25:01 PM
2 votes:
...and possibly men. Hallelujah!
2013-03-13 04:48:26 PM
2 votes:
Congrats, Colorado, and what a great way to celebrate the new Pope!
2013-03-13 04:05:40 PM
2 votes:

Nadie_AZ: Non paywall link, please?


Here

Bad form subby! Bad form!
2013-03-13 03:53:41 PM
2 votes:
Non paywall link, please?
2013-03-14 01:15:42 AM
1 votes:

cptjeff: Nuclear Pancake: DIAF Subby!

/WTF Mods? A Paywall?

You get 15 free articles a month, and there are easy ways around it. Learn to deal.


Subby here, sorry about the paywall mess, all I can say is that it was free and clear when I submitted the headline.  Hell, I'm over my 15 free articles a month and it still let me view the whole thing without any prompts or tricks earlier this afternoon.
/Should have linked to the Guardian article
//Currently dying in a fire
///Damn, that was good chili
2013-03-13 08:29:23 PM
1 votes:

cman: Civil unions? Really

You guys are farking sick.

Two homosexuals should not have the option for civil union.

Instead it should be marriage


Colorado has a state constitutional ban on marriage... is a relic of when the state was conservative instead of whogivesafark. We're working on it.
2013-03-13 08:09:25 PM
1 votes:
Meanwhile, in Colorado Springs...

i28.photobucket.com


Shame it's not called "marriage" just yet, but as someone who used to live there and remembers a nasty and mean-spirited bill called "Amendment 2", this is a big step forward. Suck it, James Dobson!  ;)
2013-03-13 07:58:26 PM
1 votes:

Mike Chewbacca: Killer Cars: Karac: pciszek: Karac: Can you get married in a church belonging to any of five dozen religions OTHER than Christianity (which seems to be the only one against gay marriage)

Islam, Orthodox Judaism, and Mormonism are pretty dead set against gay marriage, to name three.


Mormon's count as fundamentalist Christians.  And how many Muslim or Jewish political groups or politicians have you seen come out against gay marraige?  How many times have you heard "This is a Jewish nation, and Jehovah clearly said no to homosexuality"?  How many places has Sharia actually been installed as law?  They many not want to perform the ceromonies they they don't seem to give a shiat if anyone else does.

If a gay person can get hung in some Middle Eastern countries simply for their orientation....I think we can extrapolate their positions, even if publicly undefined currently, on gay marriage.

I didn't realize Middle Easterners got to vote in America.


I didn't realize civil rights for American citizens was contigent upon the laws of countries a third of the way around the world.
Well, except for Vatican City.
2013-03-13 07:57:26 PM
1 votes:

Karac: And how many Muslim or Jewish political groups or politicians have you seen come out against gay marraige?


I think the governments of Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Iraq count as "Muslim political groups" and they have come out against gay people even existing, let alone getting married.
2013-03-13 07:49:25 PM
1 votes:

EngineerAU: gingerjet: Marriage isn't a religious institution.

Yes it is. You can argue that it isn't exclusive a religious institution or that it historically arose for non-religious purposes but is absolutely positively is a religious institution in addition to being a legal one. To claim otherwise is to wander into the world of flat earthers and believers in the reptile people.


So you're saying the reptile people don't exist?
2013-03-13 07:45:23 PM
1 votes:

Karac: pciszek: Karac: Can you get married in a church belonging to any of five dozen religions OTHER than Christianity (which seems to be the only one against gay marriage)

Islam, Orthodox Judaism, and Mormonism are pretty dead set against gay marriage, to name three.


Mormon's count as fundamentalist Christians.  And how many Muslim or Jewish political groups or politicians have you seen come out against gay marraige?  How many times have you heard "This is a Jewish nation, and Jehovah clearly said no to homosexuality"?  How many places has Sharia actually been installed as law?  They many not want to perform the ceromonies they they don't seem to give a shiat if anyone else does.


If a gay person can get hung in some Middle Eastern countries simply for their orientation....I think we can extrapolate their positions, even if publicly undefined currently, on gay marriage.
2013-03-13 07:38:49 PM
1 votes:

pciszek: Karac: Can you get married in a church belonging to any of five dozen religions OTHER than Christianity (which seems to be the only one against gay marriage)

Islam, Orthodox Judaism, and Mormonism are pretty dead set against gay marriage, to name three.



Mormon's count as fundamentalist Christians.  And how many Muslim or Jewish political groups or politicians have you seen come out against gay marraige?  How many times have you heard "This is a Jewish nation, and Jehovah clearly said no to homosexuality"?  How many places has Sharia actually been installed as law?  They many not want to perform the ceromonies they they don't seem to give a shiat if anyone else does.
2013-03-13 07:32:29 PM
1 votes:

Karac: Can you get married in a church belonging to any of five dozen religions OTHER than Christianity (which seems to be the only one against gay marriage)


Islam, Orthodox Judaism, and Mormonism are pretty dead set against gay marriage, to name three.
2013-03-13 07:14:59 PM
1 votes:

Mike Chewbacca: Civil unions? Really? 2002 called and they want their Separate But Equal back.

/it's called MARRIAGE equality, biatches!


Colorado's got a big Libertarian contingent. I think that it's a guarantee that a lot of the people who wanted this also believe that the government shouldn't be in the marriage business at all, so they aren't trying to be inconsistent. They've just bought into an obsolete idea.

But you are entirely correct, and this is why civil unions always were one of those bad ideas that sound good at first. In practice, we'll never get the government out of certifying marriages, therefore any Civil Union option becomes a de facto second class marriage. And, of course, this plays hash for getting your "union" recognized in other states or by the Federal Government.

If I'm married, I'm married and my marriage... whether or not I could have had it performed in your state... is still legal. But if I have a "civil union" and I move to some other state, I've got bupkis.

On the plus side, though, bear in mind that this was the state that passed the infamous Amendment 2, which enshrined the ability to discriminate against gays in the state's constitution. To go from that to the point where they realize that they have to give gays  some way to officially sanction their unions represents a huge (albeit insufficient) amount of progress. Let's consider this a partial victory.
2013-03-13 07:00:11 PM
1 votes:

EngineerAU: Yes it is. You can argue that it isn't exclusive a religious institution or that it historically arose for non-religious purposes but is absolutely positively is a religious institution in addition to being a legal one. To claim otherwise is to wander into the world of flat earthers and believers in the reptile people.


Marriage as it is discussed in terms of laws is not a religious institution, it's a legal status granting two consenting adult citizens special rights and privileges in regards to each other.  This unfortunately frequently requires that the two consenting adult citizens be mismatched in recognized legal gender.

Marriage as it is discussed in terms of simply the word is as you described.  But when in the context of a discussion of law it is not a religious institution.
2013-03-13 06:56:04 PM
1 votes:
No, it's not enough. Separate is NOT equal.

But for a state that has a constitutional ban on the use of the word "marriage"...it's a step forward and one more on a list of states for SCOTUS to have to look at in two weeks. (IANAL, but the s-b-e states might have a greater impact than those who have full equality?)

If only MN could move more quickly, I'd love so see us on that map as well.
2013-03-13 06:55:45 PM
1 votes:

NkThrasher: Colorado Springs would become a ghost town.


Then maybe the Air Force could go back to being a division of the military instead of an outpost of the fundie wacko church.
2013-03-13 06:39:55 PM
1 votes:

FARK rebel soldier: [thesword.com image 480x640]
WHATEVER HAPPENED TO JUST farkING A DUDE?!


Whatever happened to taking your flogging like a man?  Farking pussy with his leather breast plate.

Regarding the news...yes it isn't full on legalization of gay marriage but we got weed too so it is like, "Two steps forward, and one more forward".  We are getting there folks.  Can't help that we have all of the Evangelicals in Co Springs.  I'm just happy that my folks (Former Battalion Commander now working for MDA and his/my lovely Army House Mom) voted to legalize ze weed.

It was very cute when my mom called me after voting, all hush-hush, and told me that the two of them voted to legalize ze herb.  Of course I was sworn to secrecy.  The internet is secret, right?  They aren't lib by any stretch of the term.  At least, they don't realize they are.  Slowly my plans are coming to fruition!

/my headline was better a few days ago
//yes I'm bitter
///yes I take my flogging like a man
//safe word?
/slashies
2013-03-13 06:25:45 PM
1 votes:
You get married at city hall.

You celebrate at a church.
2013-03-13 06:25:04 PM
1 votes:

FatalDischarge: milsorgen: After the glitz and glamour of a thousand courthouse weddings and the temporary boost it will provide to economies expect the moral decay to make itself more and more apparent as economic activity (a domain of the industrious and morally righteous) declines as more and more Christians head for greener pastures. Combine this the epidemic of hard drug abuse in the state (marihauna is a scheduled I drug mind you) and we have a new Welfare Capitol in the works.

So your'e saying christians will leave the state? Good deal.


Colorado Springs would become a ghost town.
2013-03-13 06:24:12 PM
1 votes:

milsorgen: After the glitz and glamour of a thousand courthouse weddings and the temporary boost it will provide to economies expect the moral decay to make itself more and more apparent as economic activity (a domain of the industrious and morally righteous) declines as more and more Christians head for greener pastures. Combine this the epidemic of hard drug abuse in the state (marihauna is a scheduled I drug mind you) and we have a new Welfare Capitol in the works.


So your'e saying christians will leave the state? Good deal.
2013-03-13 06:08:56 PM
1 votes:
Dear Homosexuals,

Despite the conclusions my choice to ski in Utah rather than Colorado from now on may lead you to I can assure you it is not true.  I am not trying to avoid you.  Rather I choose to avoid the legions of unemployed and giggling stoners who make up an increasingly large percentage of the population of Colorado.  Enjoy your stay in the Miles High state.

Sincerely,

John F.
2013-03-13 06:03:45 PM
1 votes:
Colorado's starting to sound pretty good. Pot, plus gay folks can throw a party.
2013-03-13 06:00:37 PM
1 votes:

milsorgen: After the glitz and glamour of a thousand courthouse weddings and the temporary boost it will provide to economies expect the moral decay to make itself more and more apparent as economic activity (a domain of the industrious and morally righteous) declines as more and more Christians head for greener pastures. Combine this the epidemic of hard drug abuse in the state (marihauna is a scheduled I drug mind you) and we have a new Welfare Capitol in the works.



www.charlesmarshall.net
2013-03-13 05:53:07 PM
1 votes:

iheartscotch: KiTTeNs_on_AciD: iheartscotch: Theaetetus: Oh, and of course, this is a "civil union" bill that grants "gay couples rights similar to marriage," and those have been repeatedly held to be clear violations of the 14th amendment in the federal courts, so congratulations on legalizing gay marriage, in another year or so!

Hey now! Baby steps. Life isn't about the destination; it's about the journey.

/ I've always thought that it was screwy that LGTwhatevers didn't just have the ceremony in a friendly church and thumb their noses at the anti-people.

Some people view baby steps and half-measures as insufficient when it comes to civil rights.  I am one of those people.  This is just some 'separate-but-equal bullshiat for the sake of religious fundie's delicate sensibilities.

I agree, seperate but equal is screwy.

And anyone who reads the passage in the bible that concerns homosexuality knows that it wasn't really about them being gay; it was more about them wanting to rape some dudes.

So, the message really is; rape is bad.

/ still don't know why they don't just get married and worry about the legality later


Your confusing the wedding with the rights that are granted to spouses.  Having a ceremony doesn't solve any inheritance issues, or immigration issues, or custody issues, tax filing issues, or any of the other issues that legally married straight couples don't have.  I know a few gay couples here in Colorado who did get married, ceremony and all....  but their marriage is not recognized by the state.  Hence why we are worried about the legality NOW.
2013-03-13 05:46:31 PM
1 votes:
It's made all the more wonderful by the simple fact that Colorado is home to nutty religious groups like Focus on the Family.
2013-03-13 05:44:35 PM
1 votes:

Theaetetus: Congrats, Colorado, and what a great way to celebrate the new Pope!


between this headline and the other with the cardinals hiring a new manager it has been a great day on fark.
2013-03-13 05:42:40 PM
1 votes:

iheartscotch: Theaetetus: Oh, and of course, this is a "civil union" bill that grants "gay couples rights similar to marriage," and those have been repeatedly held to be clear violations of the 14th amendment in the federal courts, so congratulations on legalizing gay marriage, in another year or so!

Hey now! Baby steps. Life isn't about the destination; it's about the journey.

/ I've always thought that it was screwy that LGTwhatevers didn't just have the ceremony in a friendly church and thumb their noses at the anti-people.


Some people view baby steps and half-measures as insufficient when it comes to civil rights.  I am one of those people.  This is just some 'separate-but-equal bullshiat for the sake of religious fundie's delicate sensibilities.
2013-03-13 05:35:50 PM
1 votes:

EngineerAU: Are civil unions allowed only for same sex couples? And are the benefits/responsibilities the same as 'traditional' marriage? If both are 'yes', I could easily see civil unions becoming a popular alternative for those who don't need or want the intermingled state and religious institution but do want a legal association with their partner, regardless of gender.


I can't speak for Colorado, but in California civil unions (domestic partnerships, I believe) are restricted to same-sex couples.
2013-03-13 05:32:10 PM
1 votes:
fark the NYT.

Go ahead, Colorado!
2013-03-13 05:31:12 PM
1 votes:
Civil unions? Really? 2002 called and they want their Separate But Equal back.

/it's called MARRIAGE equality, biatches!
2013-03-13 05:31:03 PM
1 votes:
  If God was going to smite Colorado for the gay he would have done it long ago for allowing telemark skiers...

/I keed...I keed
 
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