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(The Business Journals)   Kaiser Permanente gets highest customer satisfaction in California, coming in just ahead of Kaiser Soze and Kaiser Wilhelm   (bizjournals.com) divider line 41
    More: Spiffy, Kaiser Permanente, California, customer satisfaction, HealthNet, J.D., Cigna, Aetna, UnitedHealthcare  
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1664 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Mar 2013 at 9:51 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-13 08:58:21 AM  
Sounds like Kaiser is on a roll.
 
2013-03-13 09:52:36 AM  
True, but that's strictly based on Verbal testimony.
 
2013-03-13 09:54:50 AM  
Good headline.
 
2013-03-13 09:55:11 AM  
You know who else was a 20th century German leader?  That's right!   Gerhard Schroeder!
 
2013-03-13 09:56:21 AM  
The fact that there were no drugs in that company helped matters significantly.

/there was no. farking. coke.
 
2013-03-13 09:56:39 AM  
Keaton used to say: "I don't believe in socialized medicine, but I'm scared of it." Well, I do believe in socialized medicine, and the only thing that scares me is Medicare.
 
2013-03-13 09:57:15 AM  
But he took our word for "twenty"!
 
2013-03-13 09:57:36 AM  
assets.bizjournals.com

Not sure if want
 
2013-03-13 09:59:57 AM  

Arkanaut: But he took our word for "twenty"!


I see my thunder has already been stolen...
 
2013-03-13 10:03:36 AM  
That cant be. That just freakin' cant be.


My hatred of Kaiser reaches biblical proportions every time I had to call them. They suck. They are awful. You are on hold for freakin' ever.


Their call centers are like bad unions... "oh, you want do do x, well, we only do y here, let me transfer you." Then you get transferred, and you have to give all your personal data again, only to be told that once again you were not in the right place, but let me transfer you, is there anything else I can help you with", then you go to another dept, complete the transaction, but need to go back to the first one to get a confirmation of the transaction you just did since the dept. you did the transaction cant actually take a payment over the phone... oh look theyre closed for the day..


HULK SMASH.
 
2013-03-13 10:22:27 AM  
Only if you are not sick.
 
2013-03-13 10:27:19 AM  
because they are non-profit

//CEO made $5 million last year
 
2013-03-13 10:36:41 AM  

Father_Jack: That cant be. That just freakin' cant be.


My hatred of Kaiser reaches biblical proportions every time I had to call them. They suck. They are awful. You are on hold for freakin' ever.


Their call centers are like bad unions... "oh, you want do do x, well, we only do y here, let me transfer you." Then you get transferred, and you have to give all your personal data again, only to be told that once again you were not in the right place, but let me transfer you, is there anything else I can help you with", then you go to another dept, complete the transaction, but need to go back to the first one to get a confirmation of the transaction you just did since the dept. you did the transaction cant actually take a payment over the phone... oh look theyre closed for the day..


HULK SMASH.


Um, I do everything online

//so easy and efficient
 
2013-03-13 11:01:52 AM  
JD Powers and Associates? LMAO. I'm sure Kaiser paid good money for the result.
 
2013-03-13 11:19:02 AM  
donkeybakery.com

RIP Kaiser Bun
 
2013-03-13 11:23:09 AM  
Kaiser did a hell of a lot more for me than Blue Cross did, and my GP is smokin' hot.
 
2013-03-13 11:28:08 AM  
I don't get the hate for Kaiser. I've never had a health care experience that was more efficient than visiting a Kaiser center. Went in for shoulder pain, and within 10 minutes of seeing the doc I was headed downstairs to radiology to have x-rays. Fifteen minutes after that I was headed to another office to have a tetanus booster and flu shot. All done in under 2 hours, and for a very reasonable co-pay. If they were available through my current company I would definitely choose them.

Cuthbert Allgood: Um, I do everything online


This, too.

My current doc, it's back to this: get a referral, schedule an appointment, take ANOTHER day off from work, go here, go there, hand carry records back to the primary care office, and so on. It's sad and confusing.
 
2013-03-13 11:34:11 AM  

SurfaceTension: I don't get the hate for Kaiser. I've never had a health care experience that was more efficient than visiting a Kaiser center. Went in for shoulder pain, and within 10 minutes of seeing the doc I was headed downstairs to radiology to have x-rays. Fifteen minutes after that I was headed to another office to have a tetanus booster and flu shot. All done in under 2 hours, and for a very reasonable co-pay. If they were available through my current company I would definitely choose them.

Cuthbert Allgood: Um, I do everything online

This, too.

My current doc, it's back to this: get a referral, schedule an appointment, take ANOTHER day off from work, go here, go there, hand carry records back to the primary care office, and so on. It's sad and confusing.


I love my Kaiser.  Very efficient, very thorough, sticks with the problem until it is solved.  Plus, i can email my doc anytime, and she answers right away :)  Been my experience that hating Kaiser is some "anti-socialist" thing.  Parroting the lines fed to them.  UNTIL they actually EXPERIENCE Kaiser, then they always changed their tune. Their phone service takes some understanding, I will agree. Know WHO to call, and when.  Consult your directory if confused.
 
2013-03-13 11:40:54 AM  
all-cars-viewer.com
 
2013-03-13 11:53:09 AM  
Best dentist I've ever had... Staff is freaking awesome too. Had a broken molar extracted last year (crack, snap) Currently just covered under their dental plan, but I had a torn meniscus repaired about 10 years ago by Kaiser and it went perfectly. I don't get the outrage because I've never experienced poor service @ Kaiser.
 
2013-03-13 12:15:09 PM  

Cuthbert Allgood: Father_Jack: That cant be. That just freakin' cant be.


My hatred of Kaiser reaches biblical proportions every time I had to call them. They suck. They are awful. You are on hold for freakin' ever.


Their call centers are like bad unions... "oh, you want do do x, well, we only do y here, let me transfer you." Then you get transferred, and you have to give all your personal data again, only to be told that once again you were not in the right place, but let me transfer you, is there anything else I can help you with", then you go to another dept, complete the transaction, but need to go back to the first one to get a confirmation of the transaction you just did since the dept. you did the transaction cant actually take a payment over the phone... oh look theyre closed for the day..


HULK SMASH.

Um, I do everything online

//so easy and efficient


Not always possible.

I spent a year fighting KP after they refused to pay for a prosthetic leg.  Eventually, the state Dept. of Managed Care made them issue me a new policy with the proper coverage. CA law requires insurers to explicitly offer prosthetic coverage.

How will this help someone who is already insured who becomes an amputee? It won't.

/prosthetic parity FTW
//write your congresscritter
 
2013-03-13 12:28:45 PM  
... says Kaiser sponsored PR Blitz
 
2013-03-13 12:34:17 PM  
We have Kaiser, have a kid with a weird genetic issue, as we were figuring it out our gp met with us with a textbook in hand. Instead of blowing me off, actually took the time to realize that there really was a problem, set up testing and follow up at Children's Hospital and checks in on a regular basis.

Mental health services though, not so much.
 
2013-03-13 01:15:50 PM  
I had Kaiser for around 7 years in San Francisco, and I loved it.  Wish I still had Kaiser.  There was a medical center about 8 blocks from my flat, and I could walk in anytime, the waits were never very long.  So convenient.  Just for basic health care though, I never had any complex medical issues.
 
2013-03-13 01:43:48 PM  
I call shenanigans, just simply based on how many people I've known who have/had Kaiser or whose family member had Kaiser and who've had horrific experiences with them... Malpractice, negligence, surgical/Rx screw-ups, unnecessary suffering and deaths, etc.  Of course not everyone has had bad experiences with them, many people are perfectly satisfied, but it seems like it's a game of chance as to whether you will get a good vs. a bad physician, or have a medical issue that they are good at solving vs. one that they're completely inept and/or inneffectual at addressing. I suppose that, in general, Kaiser is better than nothing.
 
2013-03-13 02:07:24 PM  
Kaiser Permanente, the 7-11 of health care.

/good luck seeing a real doctor instead of an intern from another country.
 
2013-03-13 02:26:48 PM  
KP provider here calling shenanigans on the haters. people either hate because they never had kaiser or like to blame a whole organization for their one bad experience which can happen anywhere. for everyone complaining I have come across even more patients who openly express how happy they are with kaiser and their doctor. there are some not used to not having concierge style of private practice. the fact still remains and is proven in numbers that kaiser leads California and even the nation in preventative care and health care outcomes. And yes most of our patients do see a doctor and most of my colleagues are from well respected medical schools and residency programs.
 
2013-03-13 02:38:43 PM  
What about the Kaiser Chiefs?
 
2013-03-13 03:55:42 PM  
I had Kaiser for over 30 years when living in CA. I never had any trouble getting in to see anyone, and I had no problems with emergency room visits, either. Their co-pays are reasonable and I never worried about getting a bill 6 weeks later for shiat they didn't cover. I always had 2 or 3 locations within easy distance of my work and home. I cannot say enough good things about KP.

I've had UHC, Regence, and Blue Cross, and they all suck compared to KP. I get bills 2 months later from my doctors because they wouldn't cover the entire cost. I had a $250 emergency room copay last year after a car accident (not my fault) that they didn't even invoice me for until 8 months later. And when I had UHC, they literally paid for none of my claims. I moved from Seattle back to San Diego in 1999, and I ended up having to go to urgent care for a very bad case of bronchitis (my lung capacity was 105cc's), and they denied my claim stating I should have gone to my primary care physician who was in Seattle.

I have never gotten the run around from KP. I would go back to them in a heartbeat, but they don't operate in my area.

/haha, operate!
 
2013-03-13 04:21:56 PM  
That's because Kaiser Permanente has a long history and is expected to remain stable for the foreseeable future.
 
2013-03-13 05:11:42 PM  
Got hooked up with Kaiser off my wife's plan when I got out of the Navy about 10 years ago. I was diagnosed as a type 2 diabetic while in the Navy, and since getting out, their ongoing care is spectacular. My primary care doctor is a doctor of internal medicine, I can email her anytime, I can walk in for my lab tests, pull up the results online (normally within a day), schedule annual appointments with ophthalmologist, track diet with my nutritionist and update any medications immediately with the pharmacy: they're all in the same building and share the same medical record. The one time I had to go to the emergency room, they had my full records and the emergency room physician was able to consult with my doctor immediately.

My current employer offers a more expensive "premium" coverage (with no co-pay) that I turned down.

I love Kaiser
 
2013-03-13 06:39:52 PM  

Dead for Tax Reasons: [all-cars-viewer.com image 808x352]


The company that made that car and the health care provider are actually the same, more or less (IE, they both were part of Kaiser Steel, once upon a time).
 
2013-03-13 07:15:48 PM  

Geotpf: Dead for Tax Reasons: [all-cars-viewer.com image 808x352]

The company that made that car and the health care provider are actually the same, more or less (IE, they both were part of Kaiser Steel, once upon a time).


..which was a part of Kaiser Shipyard. Kaiser Permanente was started at the shipyards as an employee incentive during world war 2.
 
2013-03-13 10:09:43 PM  
I can't even express my overwhelming dislike for Kaiser of California. The list would be TL and you'd be all like, DNR. The only reason I keep them is that the alternative insurance offered by my employer is literally more than 400% the cost of Kaiser.

The sadness I see is that California is the "good" Kaiser, apparently, and all the rest suck worse.

/ok... just one... spinal damage caused by their intern during the placement of a spinal block before surgery... they deny it's even possible it could have happened, here's a pile of drugs and you should just stretch a bit, that'll fix it. I switched doctors and was told by the new one that old wives' tales told by some Armenian ladies she knows somehow caused it, and now that I knew the cause, it would magically disappear.  5 years of daily pain, anniversary tomorrow.
 
2013-03-13 11:28:50 PM  
fc00.deviantart.net
Would quite like to subscribe to your newsletter after personally wiping out a small army. :D

/AM very pleased someone did put in a reference to the above's namesake
 
2013-03-14 12:34:16 AM  
I belong to Kaiser and agree they are damned efficient.  Their problem is with the base of medical knowledge and quality of doctors in my area.  Their MDs are way behind the curve in many areas:  thyroid disease, nutrition, and female hormone regulation, to name just three.  I always have to go in with a pile of studies after I've thought about my problem and found evidence for my POV to argue with my PCP when she misdiagnoses a symptom, or worse, treats the symptom *as* the problem.  I've gotten to the point where I'd rather pay out of pocket to get to the bottom of my medical problems with doctors who (a) have a better understanding of the root causes of disease (b) keep up with research (c) give weight to my ideas that I can support with research and (d) like curing problems rather than just managing symptoms.

One example:  My knees, never great, began to really ache.  The PCP referred me to the PT, who gave me a bunch of exercises that didn't help.  On my own, I found in the medical literature and old folk medicine sources that a lack of some nutrients that the body uses to make cartilage, could cause my symptoms.  I started making bone broth, rich in gelatin, which contains those nutrients, and within 2 weeks, my knees stopped aching, my hair got stronger and more lustrous (according to my barber) and my nails got stronger.    Why the hell didn't my MD and PT know this stuff?  I could go on and on with examples like this and worse.

And if you look at the professional bios of these doc.s, they're more concerned with their work-life balance than producing great results for their patients.
 
2013-03-14 01:21:53 AM  
acohn:   I've gotten to the point where I'd rather pay out of pocket to get to the bottom of my medical problems with doctors who (a) have a better understanding of the root causes of disease (b) keep up with research (c) give weight to my ideas that I can support with research and (d) like curing problems rather than just managing symptoms.

On the one hand, it's good to know it's not just me. On the other, I wish they wouldn't suck so much.
 
2013-03-14 04:08:38 AM  

acohn: I've gotten to the point where I'd rather pay out of pocket to get to the bottom of my medical problems with doctors who (a) have a better understanding of the root causes of disease (b) keep up with research (c) give weight to my ideas that I can support with research and (d) like curing problems rather than just managing symptoms.

One example: My knees, never great, began to really ache. The PCP referred me to the PT, who gave me a bunch of exercises that didn't help. On my own, I found in the medical literature and old folk medicine sources that a lack of some nutrients that the body uses to make cartilage, could cause my symptoms. I started making bone broth, rich in gelatin, which contains those nutrients, and within 2 weeks, my knees stopped aching, my hair got stronger and more lustrous (according to my barber) and my nails got stronger. Why the hell didn't my MD and PT know this stuff? I could go on and on with examples like this and worse.


Family Practice doctors just can't keep on top of all that stuff, because they  have a churn through a high volume of patients every day for either basic exams, piddly stuff, or to set referrals to specialists.  As for the PT, they just get an order to "Eval and Treat for knee pain", so they're going to do basic stuff for knee pain unless they have a specific instructions to watch for something more, or there is something apparent on sight. (Technically, a PT wouldn't even be allowed to actually make a diagnosis; that's the purview of MDs)  If the pain continued for a long time, they might look into other ideas, but only if you're seeing the same PT multiple times, and they're up to date on the research. An orthopedist might have been more likely to suggest a nutritive solution, but since that is falling into the area of homeopathy, you might have had to see a homeopathic specialist to get that sort of suggestion.

   Basically, there's a huge amount of medical knowledge and research out there, way more than any single provider can possibly keep up with, so unless it comes out in a commonly read newsletter or journal for their specialty, they or a supervisor were directly involved in the research, or their organization pushes the info out to all of their providers, chances are they haven't heard of it, and they've got 150+ other patients they're also taking care of so they don't have a lot of time to dedicate to your particular case.  The cases that get extra personal focus would tend to be those that are more unusual, more life threatening or in some way outside the norm.
 
2013-03-14 09:39:32 AM  

Rising_Zan_Samurai_Gunman: acohn: I've gotten to the point where I'd rather pay out of pocket to get to the bottom of my medical problems with doctors who (a) have a better understanding of the root causes of disease (b) keep up with research (c) give weight to my ideas that I can support with research and (d) like curing problems rather than just managing symptoms.

One example: My knees, never great, began to really ache. The PCP referred me to the PT, who gave me a bunch of exercises that didn't help. On my own, I found in the medical literature and old folk medicine sources that a lack of some nutrients that the body uses to make cartilage, could cause my symptoms. I started making bone broth, rich in gelatin, which contains those nutrients, and within 2 weeks, my knees stopped aching, my hair got stronger and more lustrous (according to my barber) and my nails got stronger. Why the hell didn't my MD and PT know this stuff? I could go on and on with examples like this and worse.

Family Practice doctors just can't keep on top of all that stuff, because they  have a churn through a high volume of patients every day for either basic exams, piddly stuff, or to set referrals to specialists.  As for the PT, they just get an order to "Eval and Treat for knee pain", so they're going to do basic stuff for knee pain unless they have a specific instructions to watch for something more, or there is something apparent on sight. (Technically, a PT wouldn't even be allowed to actually make a diagnosis; that's the purview of MDs)  If the pain continued for a long time, they might look into other ideas, but only if you're seeing the same PT multiple times, and they're up to date on the research. An orthopedist might have been more likely to suggest a nutritive solution, but since that is falling into the area of homeopathy, you might have had to see a homeopathic specialist to get that sort of suggestion.

   Basically, there's a huge amount of medical knowledge and research out there, way more than any ...


So, you're saying the system is set up to fail patients.  Thanks for that.
 
2013-03-14 09:51:55 AM  

Rising_Zan_Samurai_Gunman: acohn: I've gotten to the point where I'd rather pay out of pocket to get to the bottom of my medical problems with doctors who (a) have a better understanding of the root causes of disease (b) keep up with research (c) give weight to my ideas that I can support with research and (d) like curing problems rather than just managing symptoms.

One example: My knees, never great, began to really ache. The PCP referred me to the PT, who gave me a bunch of exercises that didn't help. On my own, I found in the medical literature and old folk medicine sources that a lack of some nutrients that the body uses to make cartilage, could cause my symptoms. I started making bone broth, rich in gelatin, which contains those nutrients, and within 2 weeks, my knees stopped aching, my hair got stronger and more lustrous (according to my barber) and my nails got stronger. Why the hell didn't my MD and PT know this stuff? I could go on and on with examples like this and worse.

Family Practice doctors just can't keep on top of all that stuff, because they  have a churn through a high volume of patients every day for either basic exams, piddly stuff, or to set referrals to specialists.  As for the PT, they just get an order to "Eval and Treat for knee pain", so they're going to do basic stuff for knee pain unless they have a specific instructions to watch for something more, or there is something apparent on sight. (Technically, a PT wouldn't even be allowed to actually make a diagnosis; that's the purview of MDs)  If the pain continued for a long time, they might look into other ideas, but only if you're seeing the same PT multiple times, and they're up to date on the research. An orthopedist might have been more likely to suggest a nutritive solution, but since that is falling into the area of homeopathy, you might have had to see a homeopathic specialist to get that sort of suggestion.

   Basically, there's a huge amount of medical knowledge and research out there, way more than any single provider can possibly keep up with, so unless it comes out in a commonly read newsletter or journal for their specialty, they or a supervisor were directly involved in the research, or their organization pushes the info out to all of their providers, chances are they haven't heard of it, and they've got 150+ other patients they're also taking care of so they don't have a lot of time to dedicate to your particular case.  The cases that get extra personal focus would tend to be those that are more unusual, more life threatening or in some way outside the norm.


150? Depending on the area it is up to at least 1,000 per provider (I'm not FP).

To the other poster I'm glad that you are feeling better but your complaint isn't something that's unique to Kaiser. Likely most non KP docs wouldn't be aware of all of that. Also there's always new "research" coming out and most of it isn't Earth shattering and practice changing. Remember that in a single day there's a chunk of patients that come because of some article they read on the internet. I will admit that sometimes Kaiser may seem to be slow at new things but it's for a reason; such as most people not needing MRIs for back pain or even X-ray.
 
2013-03-15 01:54:06 PM  
An orthopedist might have been more likely to suggest a nutritive solution, but since that is falling into the area of homeopathy, you might have had to see a homeopathic specialist to get that sort of suggestion.

...your complaint isn't something that's unique to Kaiser. Likely most non KP docs wouldn't be aware of all of that. Also there's always new "research" coming out and most of it isn't Earth shattering and practice changing.


Since when is knowing how what you eat affects you in the domain of homeopathy? All you need to know is how the body builds cartilage (Physiology 102) what foods contains the building blocks of cartilage (Dr. Google), and be able to think about connecting the two.

Another example of blindered thinking: My cholesterol goes above 200, so my doctor wants to give me a statin, ignoring these facts: (a) that there is *zero* evidence that statins help anyone until they've received a diagnosis of frank cardiovascular disease, and (b) there are a dozen studies showing that statins cause Alzheimer's-like symptoms, cause muscle aches and muscle-wasting (b) that WHO data collected in the past 10 years shows that all-cause mortality for adults is lowest when cholesterol is around 220 (I showed her the graph somebody made of this) (c) every one of the major studies asserting a causal relationship between cholesterol and heart disease have fatal methodological flaws (d) Research in the past six years indicate that LDL particle count (LDL-P) is a far better predictor of CVD than cholesterol. Her response: The Kaiser standard of care is to recommend statins in my situation. WTF?! She's a doctor, not a robot! She's supposed to support evidence-based medicine, not diagnostic dogma!

The problems with mainstream doctors are (a) their training relies on obsolete notions, never supported by evidence, or obsolete evidence (b) they're trained to treat and manage disease symptoms (usu. with drugs) without ever addressing root causes. Example: My last job gave me severe lateral epicondylitis (tennis elbow). I could barely pick up and grip things after two months. My request to my doctor: a letter saying that my work caused my condition and that I had to stop doing the damaging work. The doctor's solution: Give me an NSAID for the and come back in a month.

I wish this lunacy was limited to this doctor, but she's the third Kaiser GP I've had.
 
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