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(Opposing Views)   Little League needs money, holds raffle for assault rifle very similar to weapon that killed 20 kids in Sandy Hook Elementary, sees no problem   (opposingviews.com) divider line 184
    More: Ironic, raffle, assault weapons, assault rifles, Little League  
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3384 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Mar 2013 at 9:22 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-12 11:00:50 PM

Ontos: I think it's trying to communicate.... What should we do?


My suggestion? Support him.
 
2013-03-12 11:01:34 PM

GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?


I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?
 
2013-03-12 11:03:00 PM

willfullyobscure: What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?


I know that it has more faces than the one you present.
 
2013-03-12 11:03:00 PM

Amos Quito: Benjamin Orr: Amos Quito: Benjamin Orr: I don't want to get into the circle jerk of which weapon is best for home defense... But can we please stop this bullshiat about how the sound of a pump action makes criminals shiat their pants and run away?


Hey, I'm no ITG.

In the (highly unlikely) event that I should be prowling through the darkened corridors of some stranger's house, the sound of a pump shotgun action would get both my feet AND my bowels moving - and fast.


/Short range, shotguns are wicked MF's
// 00
/// 000

I am going to assume you are not the typical robbet with a history of making bad choices. Will some run away? Probably. Acting like the sound is some magical charm that scares everybody away is just stupid though.

All you have to do is watch the news or read fark to see examples of criminals doing things that sane people would never even consider.


Heh!

You're right. I guess I'm just not cut out for a career of thuggery.

The curse of foresight, I suppose.

But if the sound of the action of a pump shotgun won't make them shiat their pants, the consequences of discharge will make shiat ooze through their abdominal walls.

So at least there's that.


I am not going to deny what a 12 gauge with buckshot will do to a human body at close range. If I needed to try and put down an intruder quickly it would be high on my list.

I just would not try and scare him off by sound.
 
2013-03-12 11:03:30 PM

Yogimus: Ontos: I think it's trying to communicate.... What should we do?

My suggestion? Support him.


The Zumbo-Fudd guy?  Ehh... Not a chance.
 
2013-03-12 11:05:42 PM

willfullyobscure: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?

I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?


Are you somewhere where you can check your blood pressure?
 
2013-03-12 11:05:46 PM

Ontos: Yogimus: Ontos: I think it's trying to communicate.... What should we do?

My suggestion? Support him.

The Zumbo-Fudd guy?  Ehh... Not a chance.


Why? I support him wholeheartedly in the enjoyment of his hobbies, and I wish him no ill.
 
2013-03-12 11:06:05 PM

willfullyobscure: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?

I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?


I am.

Did you know they sell super-duper-scarey M1 Carbines?

They also qualify as "assault rifles".

Hell, In New York State, the M1 Garand does, too.
 
2013-03-12 11:07:34 PM
I do think it is really cute that the Fudds and other luddites think that bans would stop with semi auto rifles with removable magazines.
 
2013-03-12 11:11:10 PM

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: 'm pr


Also, the single longest consistently used military firearm.


A frank lie, or you're stupid, pick one. (here's a hint, genius, there are muskets that were used longer than the AR platform)

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: n. They are antithetical to common sense, actual knowledge about firearms and the great firearm traditions of this country,

The fark?



They are shiatty guns that are overpriced. I can outshoot any stock AR variant out of the box with a Marlin 60. That is not hyperbole. They are shiatty , over priced guns sold to idiots who don't understand them.

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: This isn't a legal decision, its a cultural one.And you should not be the arbiter of my culture. It is OK if you wish to opt out, I would think no less of you. I merely request the same level of respect.


fark you; you're carrying a deadly weapon you have no understanding of, or appreciation for its history , or its design purpose, and you want me to accept into my hunting camps and my ranges, which are populated by sane, grown, adults that understand why and what we shoot at, so no. fark you and get the fark away from me with those stupid, ugly, inaccurate fashion accessories you call rifles. You are ignorant and stupid and you are instrumenatl in getting our guns taken away.

You know what we call someone that hunts with a semi-automatic? Someone that likes to miss.
 
2013-03-12 11:16:41 PM

Ontos: willfullyobscure: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?

I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?

I am.

Did you know they sell super-duper-scarey M1 Carbines?

They also qualify as "assault rifles".

Hell, In New York State, the M1 Garand does, too.


Post the results of your last Garand match competition. or STFU and vanish.
 
2013-03-12 11:16:53 PM

willfullyobscure: Yogimus: willfullyobscure: 'm pr


Also, the single longest consistently used military firearm.

A frank lie, or you're stupid, pick one. (here's a hint, genius, there are muskets that were used longer than the AR platform)

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: n. They are antithetical to common sense, actual knowledge about firearms and the great firearm traditions of this country,

The fark?


They are shiatty guns that are overpriced. I can outshoot any stock AR variant out of the box with a Marlin 60. That is not hyperbole. They are shiatty , over priced guns sold to idiots who don't understand them.

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: This isn't a legal decision, its a cultural one.And you should not be the arbiter of my culture. It is OK if you wish to opt out, I would think no less of you. I merely request the same level of respect.

fark you; you're carrying a deadly weapon you have no understanding of, or appreciation for its history , or its design purpose, and you want me to accept into my hunting camps and my ranges, which are populated by sane, grown, adults that understand why and what we shoot at, so no. fark you and get the fark away from me with those stupid, ugly, inaccurate fashion accessories you call rifles. You are ignorant and stupid and you are instrumenatl in getting our guns taken away.

You know what we call someone that hunts with a semi-automatic? Someone that likes to miss.


You might find this to be quite the conundrum, but I own an 1896, a 1938 karl gustav mauser, a remington 512, as well as more modern firearms.  Don't worry, they won't take your guns away.  (my tacticool milspec zombiehunter XTREME HD won't let them) I understand you are scared, and I respect your fears. I really do. Hopefully you will understand that appeasement won't keep you safe.
 
2013-03-12 11:19:35 PM

willfullyobscure: Yogimus: willfullyobscure: 'm pr


Also, the single longest consistently used military firearm.

A frank lie, or you're stupid, pick one. (here's a hint, genius, there are muskets that were used longer than the AR platform)

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: n. They are antithetical to common sense, actual knowledge about firearms and the great firearm traditions of this country,

The fark?


They are shiatty guns that are overpriced. I can outshoot any stock AR variant out of the box with a Marlin 60. That is not hyperbole. They are shiatty , over priced guns sold to idiots who don't understand them.

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: This isn't a legal decision, its a cultural one.And you should not be the arbiter of my culture. It is OK if you wish to opt out, I would think no less of you. I merely request the same level of respect.

fark you; you're carrying a deadly weapon you have no understanding of, or appreciation for its history , or its design purpose, and you want me to accept into my hunting camps and my ranges, which are populated by sane, grown, adults that understand why and what we shoot at, so no. fark you and get the fark away from me with those stupid, ugly, inaccurate fashion accessories you call rifles. You are ignorant and stupid and you are instrumenatl in getting our guns taken away.

You know what we call someone that hunts with a semi-automatic? Someone that likes to miss.


No.  No you can't.

Besides... Why are you using a semi-auto rifle (Marlin 60) as an example in a comment directed towards how awful semi-auto rifles are?

Is the Marlin OK because it uses a fixed magazine?

Is your semi-auto hate directed towards detachable box magazine rifles?

What about a Browning BAR?

I'm honestly a little curious about which rifles get your seal of approval and at which point it crosses over into complete spittle flinging hatred.
 
2013-03-12 11:20:06 PM

Yogimus: You might find this to be quite the conundrum, but I own an 1896, a 1938 karl gustav mauser, a remington 512, as well as more modern firearms.  Don't worry, they won't take your guns away.  (my tacticool milspec zombiehunter XTREME HD won't let them) I understand you are scared, and I respect your fears. I really do. Hopefully you will understand that appeasement won't keep you safe.


Exactly what do you think I'm afraid of? Articulate it in your own words. Bear in mind I've been shooting since I was 8 and I'm a gun owner.
 
2013-03-12 11:22:28 PM

willfullyobscure: I'm pretty consistent about wanting to ban AR-style guns. they are out loud crappy tech,  fashion statement toy guns, with no real value, and only designed to give the user a tactical hard on. They are antithetical to common sense, actual knowledge about firearms and the great firearm traditions of this country, and their users are almost certain to be ignant morons. They should be banned simply because we don't need a CIVILIAN paramilitary gun culture. This isn't a legal decision, its a cultural one. We don't want sex and vilence on TV, we don't want to walk around Topeka looking like its farking Somalia.


So you are saying that your opposition to legal civilian ownership of AR-pattern rifles is based entirely upon your demonstrably false generalization of individuals who own them, and not because such prohibition will in any way enhance public safety. Thank you for admitting that you are an authoritarian fascist.
 
2013-03-12 11:23:42 PM

willfullyobscure: Yogimus: You might find this to be quite the conundrum, but I own an 1896, a 1938 karl gustav mauser, a remington 512, as well as more modern firearms.  Don't worry, they won't take your guns away.  (my tacticool milspec zombiehunter XTREME HD won't let them) I understand you are scared, and I respect your fears. I really do. Hopefully you will understand that appeasement won't keep you safe.

Exactly what do you think I'm afraid of? Articulate it in your own words. Bear in mind I've been shooting since I was 8 and I'm a gun owner.


You're afraid of everything.  Therein lies the problem.
 
2013-03-12 11:24:46 PM

violentsalvation: You pants-shiatting anti-gun tards have built a hell of a soapbox on those 26 graves.



27. Killer's mom was a victim too. (just not at the same location)
 
2013-03-12 11:25:51 PM

willfullyobscure: Ontos: willfullyobscure: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?

I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?

I am.

Did you know they sell super-duper-scarey M1 Carbines?

They also qualify as "assault rifles".

Hell, In New York State, the M1 Garand does, too.

Post the results of your last Garand match competition. or STFU and vanish.


Well... We're getting a little closer.  Garands (an assault rifle under the NYS "SAFE Act") is good to go.

How about a BM-59?

upload.wikimedia.org

It's just a modified M1 Garand, after all.

BTW... I haven't shot a High Power match with my Garand in for months.  Do I have to have shot a match within the past 90 days to stay?
 
2013-03-12 11:25:57 PM

willfullyobscure: Yogimus: You might find this to be quite the conundrum, but I own an 1896, a 1938 karl gustav mauser, a remington 512, as well as more modern firearms.  Don't worry, they won't take your guns away.  (my tacticool milspec zombiehunter XTREME HD won't let them) I understand you are scared, and I respect your fears. I really do. Hopefully you will understand that appeasement won't keep you safe.

Exactly what do you think I'm afraid of? Articulate it in your own words. Bear in mind I've been shooting since I was 8 and I'm a gun owner.


I would prefer you tell me in your own words. I am interpreting your hostility to be based out of a fear, and I am projecting my own values if I try to determine its root.

I grew up in a country where military marched down the street not to celebrate, but to keep people in line. The first gun I ever held was put into my hands by uncle sam, so I guess you beat me in the age department... but I think you lack the perspective.
 
2013-03-12 11:30:23 PM

willfullyobscure: Yogimus: You might find this to be quite the conundrum, but I own an 1896, a 1938 karl gustav mauser, a remington 512, as well as more modern firearms.  Don't worry, they won't take your guns away.  (my tacticool milspec zombiehunter XTREME HD won't let them) I understand you are scared, and I respect your fears. I really do. Hopefully you will understand that appeasement won't keep you safe.

Exactly what do you think I'm afraid of? Articulate it in your own words. Bear in mind I've been shooting since I was 8 and I'm a gun owner.


We're all trying to figure that out.  Apparently it lays somewhere between "M1 Garand" and "AR-15".

If you answer some more questions, it would help a bunch.

How do you feel about FAL's?  The originals had wood furniture, if that helps.
 
2013-03-12 11:33:46 PM

Benjamin Orr: willfullyobscure: man, get these things out of public view and quick or get your guns taken away, you fools. Anal gaping in the Town Day parade isn't appropriate and no ether are military style fashion guns in civilian hands. cut the shiat or get your guns taken away you assholes.

How about no... Does no work for you?


I'm with you man; they're our asses and we can do whatever we want with them!
 
2013-03-12 11:33:57 PM

Ontos: willfullyobscure: Ontos: willfullyobscure: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?

I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?

I am.

Did you know they sell super-duper-scarey M1 Carbines?

They also qualify as "assault rifles".

Hell, In New York State, the M1 Garand does, too.

Post the results of your last Garand match competition. or STFU and vanish.

Well... We're getting a little closer.  Garands (an assault rifle under the NYS "SAFE Act") is good to go.

How about a BM-59?



It's just a modified M1 Garand, after all.

BTW... I haven't shot a High Power match with my Garand in for months.  Do I have to have shot a match within the past 90 days to stay?


Good thing the M1 isn't considered "military style" though... Since they were never used by the military or anything....

Pretty sure he is just trolling again.
 
2013-03-12 11:35:29 PM

ProfessorOhki: Benjamin Orr: willfullyobscure: man, get these things out of public view and quick or get your guns taken away, you fools. Anal gaping in the Town Day parade isn't appropriate and no ether are military style fashion guns in civilian hands. cut the shiat or get your guns taken away you assholes.

How about no... Does no work for you?

I'm with you man; they're our asses and we can do whatever we want with them!


Damn right! Keep politicians out of my asshole!
 
2013-03-12 11:36:44 PM
Can we just start calling them AR-15 Patrol Rifles? That's what they're called when the good guys in blue carry them to protect me in the suburbs!
 
2013-03-12 11:38:59 PM

DarkSoulNoHope: arentol: There is basically no better choice for home defense than an AR-15.

I disagree, one of two weapons are better for home defense in a pinch and don't need 5.56 mm rifle ammunition. One is a pistol, easy to hold, lightweight, easy to store in a secure box in your bedroom, plus the pistol is easier to handle in tight spaces when you have to search your own house and it's easier to clear corners with a pistol than a long rifle like the AR-15. The other is a pump action shotgun, not for the weapon's ability to suppress and/or kill the target, but the psychological effect it puts on a person who just broke into your home hearing the weapon being cocked, they'll run out the front door in a hurry and you won't have to waste ammunition.  The AR-15 is too long to be an effective weapon in close quarters unless you live in a mansion!


Tell that to the guys That spent literally 10 years kicking doors with ar-15 type weapons in Iraq. On a side note any defense expert that says the sound of a weapon racking will scare a badguy out of your house has obviously never met a criminal that has been shot. I mean just a month or two ago a guy got blasted when he broke through a sliding glass door to get into a home. He could see the home owner, he could see her shotgun, but apparently he didn't think she would shoot.
 
2013-03-12 11:41:42 PM

willfullyobscure: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: Benjamin Orr: GUTSU: willfullyobscure: . Anal gaping


OH I GET IT! You're a Fudd! Very cute, shouldn't you have mentioned that all people need are revolvers and muskets?

I'm a member of the CMP. Are you? Didn't think so, moron, that takes time and effort instead of buying a fashion package. What else do you not know about firearm culture, tacti-tard?


Ooooh cmp talk to me once you've shot a uspsa match. That takes real skill.
 
2013-03-12 11:45:17 PM

youmightberight: Ooooh cmp talk to me once you've shot a uspsa match. That takes real skill.


Potatoes on toothpicks.. 100 meters. Iron sights.  (.22lr)
 
2013-03-12 11:45:50 PM
I own a rock river. I haven't killed anyone with it but it is a balls accurate flawless rifle. I must buy for all of us racist conservatives.

/elite a4
 
2013-03-12 11:49:04 PM

OMG! We're All Gonna Die!: I own a rock river. I haven't killed anyone with it but it is a balls accurate flawless rifle. I must buy for all of us racist conservatives.

/elite a4


I just heard a Marlin 60 can shoot rings around it...

/I know, I know... I made that same face when I heard it.
 
2013-03-12 11:49:55 PM

willfullyobscure: Yogimus: willfullyobscure: 'm pr


Also, the single longest consistently used military firearm.

A frank lie, or you're stupid, pick one. (here's a hint, genius, there are muskets that were used longer than the AR platform)

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: n. They are antithetical to common sense, actual knowledge about firearms and the great firearm traditions of this country,

The fark?


They are shiatty guns that are overpriced. I can outshoot any stock AR variant out of the box with a Marlin 60. That is not hyperbole. They are shiatty , over priced guns sold to idiots who don't understand them.

Yogimus: willfullyobscure: This isn't a legal decision, its a cultural one.And you should not be the arbiter of my culture. It is OK if you wish to opt out, I would think no less of you. I merely request the same level of respect.

fark you; you're carrying a deadly weapon you have no understanding of, or appreciation for its history , or its design purpose, and you want me to accept into my hunting camps and my ranges, which are populated by sane, grown, adults that understand why and what we shoot at, so no. fark you and get the fark away from me with those stupid, ugly, inaccurate fashion accessories you call rifles. You are ignorant and stupid and you are instrumenatl in getting our guns taken away.

You know what we call someone that hunts with a semi-automatic? Someone that likes to miss.


Yeah you've super zumbo'd.

Here is a hint I shoot coyotes at 400yds with my junk fashion accessory. I hunt hogs with 300blk in the same gun. You know what a person with a scoped bolt action is? A beltway "sniper" in hiding. (this is not my personal opinion but a direct quote from a progressive "friend")

If you're too dumb to see they want every bangstick off the streets and in the caring hands of our gov. then I'm not sure there is hope for you..
 
2013-03-12 11:55:42 PM

syrynxx: Assault rifles are fully-automatic weapons, you retard.  This is not an assault rifle.


look again, they have taken to tacking "style" in there somewhere. military "style" weapon, etc.
 
2013-03-13 12:01:00 AM
I don't see a problem either. The farking gun didn't kill anyone. The asshole behind the trigger did. Or should we just keep vomiting blame on the weapon instead of the person who committed the crime?
We all try to find blame for that shooting. I choose to blame the shooter, instead of the weapon he used. If a drunk driver driving a 2013 caddy slammed into the side of a school bus and killed all the kids, would you call for banning all caddy's? No. Or a train? No. You don't blame the tool, you blame the person who uses it in a bad way. But i guess it's easier to rail at an inanimate object now that the damage has been done. And yes, they have every right to see wtf they want. This is still America, kind of.
 
2013-03-13 12:01:23 AM

TomD9938: So long as they dont let some FPS gamer nerd get his hands on it.


Yeah, make sure it gets into the hands of a nice drunkard or an uptight office worker.

/gamers are just so unstable
 
2013-03-13 12:08:09 AM

SanjiSasuke: TomD9938: So long as they dont let some FPS gamer nerd get his hands on it.

Yeah, make sure it gets into the hands of a nice drunkard or an uptight office worker.

/gamers are just so unstable


I heard literacy leads to violence. Look how many of the school shooters took English classes.
 
2013-03-13 12:10:49 AM

Yogimus: SanjiSasuke: TomD9938: So long as they dont let some FPS gamer nerd get his hands on it.

Yeah, make sure it gets into the hands of a nice drunkard or an uptight office worker.

/gamers are just so unstable

I heard literacy leads to violence. Look how many of the school shooters took English classes.


I heard that exposure to dihydrogen monoxide cause violent tendencies.
 
2013-03-13 12:12:07 AM
I have hair growing out of my head which is similar to the hair of the Sandy Hook killer. What should I do?
 
2013-03-13 12:18:26 AM

Ontos: OMG! We're All Gonna Die!: I own a rock river. I haven't killed anyone with it but it is a balls accurate flawless rifle. I must buy for all of us racist conservatives.

/elite a4

I just heard a Marlin 60 can shoot rings around it...

/I know, I know... I made that same face when I heard it.


Thats why Rock River has a contract with some LEO/Feds for Marlin 60's obviously.
 
2013-03-13 12:19:54 AM

Benjamin Orr: violentsalvation: You pants-shiatting anti-gun tards have built a hell of a soapbox on those 26 graves.

20 graves. Nobody seems to give a fark about the adults.


say what, obama gave them medals. the man can't close gitmo which pisses me off but this, this is farking nuts. there is no excuse for this blatant pandering. shame on him.

Obama posthumously awarded the 2012 Presidential Citizens Medal to the six educators who died during the school shooting that also claimed the lives of 20 children.
 
2013-03-13 12:20:48 AM

treesloth: I have hair growing out of my head which is similar to the hair of the Sandy Hook killer. What should I do?


Don't panic yet.  Do you also have 2 implements at the ends of your arms with 4 digits and an additional opposable digit on each implement? Cause then it might be time to worry.
 
2013-03-13 12:20:54 AM

Giltric: Ontos: OMG! We're All Gonna Die!: I own a rock river. I haven't killed anyone with it but it is a balls accurate flawless rifle. I must buy for all of us racist conservatives.

/elite a4

I just heard a Marlin 60 can shoot rings around it...

/I know, I know... I made that same face when I heard it.

Thats why Rock River has a contract with some LEO/Feds for Marlin 60's obviously.


Obviously, only professionals should be trusted with a weapon as deadly accurate as the Marlin 60.
 
2013-03-13 12:26:42 AM

Ontos: Giltric: Ontos: OMG! We're All Gonna Die!: I own a rock river. I haven't killed anyone with it but it is a balls accurate flawless rifle. I must buy for all of us racist conservatives.

/elite a4

I just heard a Marlin 60 can shoot rings around it...

/I know, I know... I made that same face when I heard it.

Thats why Rock River has a contract with some LEO/Feds for Marlin 60's obviously.

Obviously, only professionals should be trusted with a weapon as deadly accurate as the Marlin 60.


Plus it is high capacity with a high rate of fire. In fact it will shoot as fast any other assault rifle available.
 
2013-03-13 12:28:19 AM

Benjamin Orr: Ontos: Giltric: Ontos: OMG! We're All Gonna Die!: I own a rock river. I haven't killed anyone with it but it is a balls accurate flawless rifle. I must buy for all of us racist conservatives.

/elite a4

I just heard a Marlin 60 can shoot rings around it...

/I know, I know... I made that same face when I heard it.

Thats why Rock River has a contract with some LEO/Feds for Marlin 60's obviously.

Obviously, only professionals should be trusted with a weapon as deadly accurate as the Marlin 60.

Plus it is high capacity with a high rate of fire. In fact it will shoot as fast any other assault rifle available.


I just pee'd in my pants a little... Just from reading that.

Thanks a lot, guy.
 
2013-03-13 12:28:21 AM
Next year, a W88 two stage thermonuclear warhead! Only to be used for home defense, and subjugation of small island countries not friends of the good old US of A! The guys are the gun club will swoon over this baby!

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-03-13 12:30:45 AM

youmightberight: Tell that to the guys That spent literally 10 years kicking doors with ar-15 type weapons in Iraq


The guys in Iraq are kicking in doors with offense in mind.  If you're in your home, any reputable home-defense class will teach you to barricade and defend. That completely changes the game insofar as what may be more beneficial to you.

A husband, wife and child in a split floor plan house could effectively barricade themselves down a hallway with a saiga-12 and repel just about anything that dared to come near.  Of course, every home defense situation is different based on your home, your ability and what you are looking to protect.  I'm not going to tell anyone what they "need" and if someone wants to nerd it up with their AR, and turn it into a range queen, that is their business.
 
2013-03-13 12:34:23 AM

Yogimus: The impact area at room distances is the caliber of your shotgun.


i have a 18 1/2 barrel and while is been some time since i shot it IIRC with 00 buck it opened up more than that.
 
2013-03-13 12:35:10 AM
An assault rifle didn't kill those kids.  Some nutcase wielding a gun killed those children.  An inanimate object does not kill.

This gun paranoia is becoming quite annoying.
 
2013-03-13 12:37:46 AM
Am I the only one who feels caught in the middle between crazy jackasses? A certain vocal part of the gun rights set would have me believe it's perfectly reasonable for people to walk around with high-power, high capacity rifles anywhere and everywhere, and that even questioning the idea is tantamount to being a communist. Meanwhile the anti-gun people would have me believe that if I so much as play a video game like Grand Theft Auto I have effectively engaged in genocide against all the babies of the world. I may be naive, but there's probably a middle ground where the people who aren't great big coonts live.
 
2013-03-13 12:45:29 AM

lolpix: Am I the only one who feels caught in the middle between crazy jackasses? A certain vocal part of the gun rights set would have me believe it's perfectly reasonable for people to walk around with high-power, high capacity rifles anywhere and everywhere, and that even questioning the idea is tantamount to being a communist. Meanwhile the anti-gun people would have me believe that if I so much as play a video game like Grand Theft Auto I have effectively engaged in genocide against all the babies of the world. I may be naive, but there's probably a middle ground where the people who aren't great big coonts live.


That is probably where 90% of gun owners stay.

Curious: Yogimus: The impact area at room distances is the caliber of your shotgun.

i have a 18 1/2 barrel and while is been some time since i shot it IIRC with 00 buck it opened up more than that.


Depends on whether you use wadding or a shot cup design.  An average room is what... 10 yards or so?  The cup stays with the shot for about 3 yards or so.  I get about 6 inches of spread at that distance. (same size barrel, cylinder choke)
 
2013-03-13 12:46:00 AM

part of the problem: President Merkin Muffley: arentol: There is basically no better choice for home defense than an AR-15.

lol

Of course there are better choices, depending on the home in question and other factors. But it's no one's business if you want to own one to defend your home or just because you like the way the light bounces off the muzzle at dawn.

(I live in a subdivision so I wouldn't dream of needing one to "defend the home" but down on the farm they are an ideal tool.)


http://how-i-did-it.org/drywall/results.html

As you can see, if you use high velocity 40grain .223 for home defense you essentially can not penetrate 3 sheets of drywall unless you shoot repeatedly through the same hole. Meanwhile, almost any of the commonly recommended handgun rounds easily penetrate 3 sheets of drywall. Combine this with all the other benefits of an AR-15 and it (as well as some other .223 rifles) are pretty clearly a top choice for home defense, well above any handgun or shotguns (shotguns have similar one-hit stop capabilities, and similar penetration characteristics, but they kick way more and carry less rounds).
 
2013-03-13 12:49:32 AM

lolpix: Am I the only one who feels caught in the middle between crazy jackasses? A certain vocal part of the gun rights set would have me believe it's perfectly reasonable for people to walk around with high-power, high capacity rifles anywhere and everywhere, and that even questioning the idea is tantamount to being a communist. Meanwhile the anti-gun people would have me believe that if I so much as play a video game like Grand Theft Auto I have effectively engaged in genocide against all the babies of the world. I may be naive, but there's probably a middle ground where the people who aren't great big coonts live.


I know that feel. Unfortunately, political pragmatism seems to be a dying ideology in this country.
 
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