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(Reuters)   Yahoo employees complain to CEO that they still have 800 vacancies because she is a snob who only wants CS degrees and only from certain schools. Her response? "Why can't we just be better at hiring"? And that's why she makes the big bucks   (reuters.com) divider line 257
    More: Asinine, Yahoo, CEO, computing, Yahoo employees, mobile computing, Evercore Partners, personal project, Ed Boyden  
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7585 clicks; posted to Geek » on 12 Mar 2013 at 11:16 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-12 02:29:43 PM
As a college graduate, I'd never run a company that hired only college graduates. There's a lot of dumbasses out there that received degrees, and there's a lot of really smart people that never did.
 
2013-03-12 02:30:47 PM

FormlessOne: Huh. She cuts employee benefits, kills their telecommuting policy, and is surprised that she can't get talent?

In other news, tech companies with half a clue are still hiring, still offering lovely benefits, and are still offering telecommuting. If you're going to go work at Yahoo, it's because you got turned down at Microsoft, Oracle, Google, and any number of vertical tech companies with far better benefits.

Good luck with that. Your clueless CEO is going to run you into the ground, Yahoo. Buckle up.


A possibility is that she recognises Yahoo's days as a true innovator are over and it is in the mature stage of its life. They don't want crazy free thinkers, they only want steady mid range people who are good enough to do the job they are given but not good enough to get better jobs elsewhere and won't make waves by constantly suggesting better ways to do things.
If she has decided and accepted that Yahoo will never be able to truly rival Google but has decided to merely follow them in certain areas then by cutting costs that could result in a profitable business.
Many a business has enjoyed huge success in doing a fairly boring job but just doing it efficiently while others have desperately tried to find the latest huge killer business and failed.
 
2013-03-12 02:34:47 PM

CPennypacker: Shrugging Atlas: If Mayer wasn't a good looking woman, would Yahoo! be getting any attention at all regardless of all these stupid policies?  Honest to god, every time it comes up the only thing I can think of is, "Why the fark is Yahoo still around?"

No seriously, why is yahoo still around?


Fantasy sports?
 
2013-03-12 02:34:59 PM
I've never met a single person who works at Yahoo because they love Yahoo so much. They just happened to find a job there.

If your company is crap, you will never attract the "top tier" people no matter how much you pay.
 
2013-03-12 02:35:18 PM

Katie Couric's Crotch: She's the CEO of Yahoo. What are you doing with your life asshole?


Not running a once respected company into the ground?

/He's chancellor of Germany. What are you doing with your life asshole?
 
2013-03-12 02:37:03 PM

WhippingBoy: Katie Couric's Crotch: She's the CEO of Yahoo. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Not running a once respected company into the ground?

/He's chancellor of Germany. What are you doing with your life asshole?


Let's be fair, here; Yahoo was into the death spiral well before Ms. Mayer arrived.
 
2013-03-12 02:39:34 PM
But she's cute
 
2013-03-12 02:40:03 PM
So she wants people educated beyond their intelligence?  Brilliant move there toots.
 
2013-03-12 02:42:26 PM

GameSprocket: soakitincider: this lady is a terrible CEO.

Yeah, the stock is only up about 40% since she took over. Terrible.


What was it that she did to cause the increase?
 
2013-03-12 02:43:44 PM

wee: dittybopper: Interesting thing about institutes of higher education: They often value the sheepskin itself more than the knowledge it supposedly represents.

"Since I spent the time, money and frustration getting a degree, you should too."

I got an offer I couldn't refuse 2 months before I was going to graduate. Therefore, no degree. Not sure what a B.S. in Geosciences would do for me anyway.  Been working in IT without pause since 1995, though. So I suppose it's a moot point by now.  Most places trade experience for college.

I've found places that would turn me down because I have no degree aren't places I'd want want to work at anyway.  There was a Fortune 100 company I worked for that would send me an email every 6 months asking if I'd made "any updates to my educational status". I always responded in a "What did you learn over the summer, kids?" sort of way and they finally stopped annoying me.


Yeah, that's generally been my experience:  I've got the work experience, I interview reasonably well, and I'm *JUST* eccentric enough that people think I'm some kind of genius without being so off the deep end that they think I'm insane.  That's actually a plus in this field, btw.  It may not be for others.
 
2013-03-12 02:44:20 PM

dittybopper: I'm *JUST* eccentric enough that people think I'm some kind of genius


Just to be clear:  I'm not actually a genius.
 
2013-03-12 02:46:23 PM

dittybopper: dittybopper: I'm *JUST* eccentric enough that people think I'm some kind of genius

Just to be clear:  I'm not actually a genius.


Where have you been? We're all geniuses here.... just one big group of untapped knowledge.
 
2013-03-12 02:52:51 PM

Magorn: My father never got a degree, or any post-high school education beyond Radar Repairman's school in the 1950's.  However B-52 Bombers, NASA's early programs in the 60's at Wallops Island, the Mark 48 torpedo, The Navy's entire fleet of Nuclear missile subs, the Tomahawk cruise missile, and finally the Small Explorer program at NASA in the 90's ad early 2000's were all the stunning successes they were  thanks, in a large part to the reliability engineering he did on all those projects.    At the end of his career he was often invited to lecture to PHD students at the local university's Reliability Engineering program, and everytime the secretary or AA arranging the visit would simply refuse to believe him when they asked for his ...


Tell him some anonymous guy on an insignificant message board said thanks.
 
2013-03-12 02:53:03 PM

InfrasonicTom: GameSprocket: soakitincider: this lady is a terrible CEO.

Yeah, the stock is only up about 40% since she took over. Terrible.

What was it that she did to cause the increase?


I have no idea and it doesn't really matter. She has only been in place for 9 months. Stock price is really the only way anyone outside of Yahoo can evaluate her. By that standard, she is not a terrible CEO.
 
2013-03-12 02:53:33 PM

Magorn: in the late 90's even HAVING a degree was a serious red flag for many tech start-ups.


And where are those start-ups now?

How are they doing against that search engine start-up that was founded at Stanford University by a couple of CS grad students?
 
2013-03-12 03:01:21 PM

GameSprocket: She has been CEO for 9 months. Even if she had an idea for a big technology launch when she was hired, it wouldn't be ready yet.


If she's truly capable of turning the company around, then I'd expect her to have brought at least a dozen small ideas for improvement to the table, most of which should have been accomplishable by this point.

It's an "agile" industry now, and corporations that measure their "pivot time" in years won't stay around for too long.
 
2013-03-12 03:03:44 PM

qorkfiend: WhippingBoy: Katie Couric's Crotch: She's the CEO of Yahoo. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Not running a once respected company into the ground?

/He's chancellor of Germany. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Let's be fair, here; Yahoo was into the death spiral well before Ms. Mayer arrived.


True, but at least the passengers were comfortable and the descent was slow. Now, the new pilot's told everyone that she wants trays up and belts buckled, because instead of that lazy spiral, she's going to augur that farker right into the friggin' ground. Oh, and she's going to eject before impact, floating serenely under her golden parachute, while everyone else enjoys a screaming, flaming demise.

She's the new class of "fark you, got mine" CEO - she's going to claim short-term reduction in operating costs, get a nice fat bonus, and then eject before the long-term results of her short-sightedness impacts her personal bottom line.
 
2013-03-12 03:05:33 PM

poot_rootbeer: GameSprocket: She has been CEO for 9 months. Even if she had an idea for a big technology launch when she was hired, it wouldn't be ready yet.

If she's truly capable of turning the company around, then I'd expect her to have brought at least a dozen small ideas for improvement to the table, most of which should have been accomplishable by this point.

It's an "agile" industry now, and corporations that measure their "pivot time" in years won't stay around for too long.


As has been drilled into us for the last half-decade, "three months is the new year." I'm working for a company right now that hasn't planned beyond CY 2013, because much of our future rides on the next 9 months (and three waves of releases.) Sounds like Yahoo better sack up.
 
2013-03-12 03:06:34 PM

ongbok: Yahoo's problem is that they need to innovate their services and offer new innovative products. Yahoo's personal seems to have stagnated creatively, so it does seem necessary for her to shake things up. However this new hiring process isn't the right way to go if you are looking to inject new innovative blood into your process. By only accepting CS degrees and CS degrees form certain schools you are turning your back on a huge pool of diverse thinkers and narrowing your talent pool to a smaller range of thinkers.

To innovate you truly need a whole range of people. What she is doing is only looking for people who have are approved way of thinking. This will kill the creative process and this attempt to innovate will fail.


Heh - at my company we are routinely encouraged to 'think outside the box' , etc - and come up with new areas in which to expand our business.  So, being an idiot I sat down and thought of just such a plan.

Scheduled a meeting with my VP (the one continuously telling us how much he values creativity, new ideas, etc, which should have been an obvious red flag, but as I mentioned - idiot.) and pitched my plan.

Paraphrasing slightly, his response was that the first thing he always did when evaluating a new potential opportunity is to determine whether it meets three key criteria (size, approachability, something else).  I confess that I tuned out as I quickly realized is that his first approach to any 'out of the box' idea was to see whether it would immediately meet the conditions of our existing business model (which is, in fact, the 'box') , and eliminating even the possibility of innovation by declaring that new ideas are clearly bad because we have not already had them.
 
2013-03-12 03:09:11 PM
Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.
 
2013-03-12 03:12:07 PM

FormlessOne: qorkfiend: WhippingBoy: Katie Couric's Crotch: She's the CEO of Yahoo. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Not running a once respected company into the ground?

/He's chancellor of Germany. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Let's be fair, here; Yahoo was into the death spiral well before Ms. Mayer arrived.

True, but at least the passengers were comfortable and the descent was slow. Now, the new pilot's told everyone that she wants trays up and belts buckled, because instead of that lazy spiral, she's going to augur that farker right into the friggin' ground. Oh, and she's going to eject before impact, floating serenely under her golden parachute, while everyone else enjoys a screaming, flaming demise.

She's the new class of "fark you, got mine" CEO - she's going to claim short-term reduction in operating costs, get a nice fat bonus, and then eject before the long-term results of her short-sightedness impacts her personal bottom line.



She already got a $1.1m bonus.

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/yahoos-marissa-mayer-gets-1-1m-bonus -a fter-5-months-1C8775298
 
wee [TotalFark]
2013-03-12 03:24:46 PM

dittybopper: Just to be clear: I'm not actually a genius.


I've found that affability, a sense of humor, not taking youerself too seriously, and being able to write reasonably well have all been a plus.  I guess I'm a bit eccentric as well.
 
2013-03-12 03:26:40 PM

poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.


What, her face?
 
2013-03-12 03:34:47 PM

Jster422: ongbok: Yahoo's problem is that they need to innovate their services and offer new innovative products. Yahoo's personal seems to have stagnated creatively, so it does seem necessary for her to shake things up. However this new hiring process isn't the right way to go if you are looking to inject new innovative blood into your process. By only accepting CS degrees and CS degrees form certain schools you are turning your back on a huge pool of diverse thinkers and narrowing your talent pool to a smaller range of thinkers.

To innovate you truly need a whole range of people. What she is doing is only looking for people who have are approved way of thinking. This will kill the creative process and this attempt to innovate will fail.

Heh - at my company we are routinely encouraged to 'think outside the box' , etc - and come up with new areas in which to expand our business.  So, being an idiot I sat down and thought of just such a plan.

Scheduled a meeting with my VP (the one continuously telling us how much he values creativity, new ideas, etc, which should have been an obvious red flag, but as I mentioned - idiot.) and pitched my plan.

Paraphrasing slightly, his response was that the first thing he always did when evaluating a new potential opportunity is to determine whether it meets three key criteria (size, approachability, something else).  I confess that I tuned out as I quickly realized is that his first approach to any 'out of the box' idea was to see whether it would immediately meet the conditions of our existing business model (which is, in fact, the 'box') , and eliminating even the possibility of innovation by declaring that new ideas are clearly bad because we have not already had them.


Yea, no shiat sherlock. I mean if it was a good idea, someone would have already thought of it!

duh
 
2013-03-12 03:38:12 PM

InfrasonicTom: FormlessOne: qorkfiend: WhippingBoy: Katie Couric's Crotch: She's the CEO of Yahoo. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Not running a once respected company into the ground?

/He's chancellor of Germany. What are you doing with your life asshole?

Let's be fair, here; Yahoo was into the death spiral well before Ms. Mayer arrived.

True, but at least the passengers were comfortable and the descent was slow. Now, the new pilot's told everyone that she wants trays up and belts buckled, because instead of that lazy spiral, she's going to augur that farker right into the friggin' ground. Oh, and she's going to eject before impact, floating serenely under her golden parachute, while everyone else enjoys a screaming, flaming demise.

She's the new class of "fark you, got mine" CEO - she's going to claim short-term reduction in operating costs, get a nice fat bonus, and then eject before the long-term results of her short-sightedness impacts her personal bottom line.


She already got a $1.1m bonus.

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/yahoos-marissa-mayer-gets-1-1m-bonus -a fter-5-months-1C8775298


Oddly enough, she may get more bonuses. That short-term reduction in operating costs, I'm certain, is probably tied to a KPI in her performance assessment. Plus, of course, it's also keeping her golden parachute at an appropriate size. It's going to be fun watching this mess.
 
2013-03-12 03:41:06 PM

Magorn: Mayer's insistence on her hires not only having the "right" degree (CS as opposed to say EE)


Yahoo is a software company.  EEs are notoriously bad at programming.  Makes sense to me.

Yahoo doesn't make any hardware, anyway.  Why would an EE want to work there?
 
2013-03-12 03:43:29 PM

poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.


Yeah, give the slut a break.
 
2013-03-12 03:43:56 PM

space1999: Magorn: Mayer's insistence on her hires not only having the "right" degree (CS as opposed to say EE)

Yahoo is a software company.  EEs are notoriously bad at programming.  Makes sense to me.

Yahoo doesn't make any hardware, anyway.  Why would an EE want to work there?


There are plenty of hardware-related jobs at a software company. Most have to do with custom in-house server designs the likes of which Facebook and Google do. I'm not sure that Yahoo does such a thing but it has benefits vs off-the-shelf stuff from Dell.
 
2013-03-12 03:45:41 PM

poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.


THANK YOU
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-03-12 03:57:42 PM
I'm an old-school system administrator.  That means I learned it the hard way long before there was much in the way of degrees for that type of job.  There really isn't a "system admin" degree, the closest you can get is information technology, which has serious definiciencies.  I'm very good at my job.  I have worked for Google and currently work for a major technology company.  I would have stayed at Google, but that was back when that biatch was in charge of hiring so I was unable to switch from contract to permanent since I did not meet her requirements, never mind that I did the job for an entire year and got rave reviews from my manager.

I get pinged by a yahoo recruiter every few months.  They seem to be a bit slow because I have repeatedly told them "not a farking chance in hell".  Maybe I should change that to, "tell that Mayer biatch to go to blow me and I'll consider it".
 
2013-03-12 03:58:18 PM
...and only hire locally. Walking distance preferred.
 
2013-03-12 04:00:07 PM

show me: poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.

Yeah, give the slut a break.


Biatches hate being called sluts.
 
2013-03-12 04:02:49 PM

poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.


I actually note a hint of sexism in all the well publicized attacks on her.  Not that they aren't valid critisims, but the fact that they are well publicized is the sexist part.  That is, lots of tech companies have morons for CEOs, but we keep hearing about her because she's a she.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-03-12 04:11:09 PM
Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

"Hormone-addled lactating moron" just doesn't have the brevity we love on Fark.
 
2013-03-12 04:11:51 PM

Magorn: dittybopper: fortheloveofgod: Endive Wombat: I then get a call from some Sr. HR person who is quite pissy with me on the phone and tells me that the deal is off.  She goes on to say that they ONLY hire folks with college degrees, and relevant work experience, and work successes fall 2nd to the degree requirement.  She told me "They pride themselves in having a staff that is 100% college educated."

Meh.  My employer requires a 4-year degree minimum to work here.  If you know that going in, don't apply.  They're not hurting for people either - currently have about ~260,000 employees globally.  If I don't meet the requirements for a job posting, I don't waste everyone's time by applying, just because I think their policies suck.

Why?

I don't have a degree.  In the past 20+ years I've been in IT, I've been hired for at least 3 positions that required a 4 year degree, and I've turned down at least two job offers that also required a BS degree simply because they were shiat jobs that didn't pay squat.

/You want a programmer comfortable with Unix, Windows, and Mac OS's, able to code in several different languages (including COBOL), with a 4 year degree and some work experience, and you want to pay them $10 an hour in 2000?   Good luck with that!

My father never got a degree, or any post-high school education beyond Radar Repairman's school in the 1950's.  However B-52 Bombers, NASA's early programs in the 60's at Wallops Island, the Mark 48 torpedo, The Navy's entire fleet of Nuclear missile subs, the Tomahawk cruise missile, and finally the Small Explorer program at NASA in the 90's ad early 2000's were all the stunning successes they were  thanks, in a large part to the reliability engineering he did on all those projects.    At the end of his career he was often invited to lecture to PHD students at the local university's Reliability Engineering program, and everytime the secretary or AA arranging the visit would simply refuse to believe him when they asked for his ...


This is just a theory of mine:


Degrees are for people who are not intelligent enough or adaptable enough to learn and succeed on their own, which happens to be the plurality of humanity. I would say that for people of average iq - 90-120, a degree - or some sort of specialization is necessary to succeed in life. You can be a very good doctor, lawyer, scientist or anything else with a 110-120 IQ, but you will likely be unskilled at just about anything else you try to learn outside your speciality.


The the truly capable - a small minority, like your father- are able to do pretty much anything they put their mind to. This applies to IQs above 120 or 130 - and the higher the IQ, the more detrimental structured learning and/or specialization becomes. The higher the IQ, the sharper the ability to see patterns - and the ability to see patterns ties in with the ability to see how different fields interrelate.
 
2013-03-12 04:13:24 PM
This woman apparently went to the Carly Fiorina school of management.
 
2013-03-12 04:13:59 PM
Yahoo employees complain to CEO that they still have 800 vacancies because she is a snob who only wants CS degrees and only from certain schools.

She's just parroting Page and Brin.  She could add some other Google rules:
* PhD's preferred
* no MBAs
* 3.5+ GPA or we don't even read your resume
* need some low-leve help?  Outsource it.
 
2013-03-12 04:16:45 PM

Lando Lincoln: As a college graduate, I'd never run a company that hired only college graduates. There's a lot of dumbasses out there that received degrees, and there's a lot of really smart people that never did.


That a person attained a degree tells me that they had the stick-to-it-ness required to get a degree.  I suppose what field and what college the degree was from may add a tiny bit more to the story, but still doesn't by itself mean the person will shine in any particular job.

I didn't finish a degree and, except for about one semester of full-time school, I haven't been unemployed since high school (28 years).  I also dropped out of began my extended sabbatical from college with $0 debt, since I'd been working full time to play for tuition most of while in school.  The classes at college that were most valuable (i.e. that I couldn't or wouldn't have taught myself) were Calculus, Chemistry and a materials science course.

I learned assembly language and a hella lot about computers by picking up a microprocessor's technical databook.  I learned C from a white book with a big blue C on the cover.  These days it may be about an even split between books and the web.  Most things I've learned just because I was interested in the topic or it was the right tool for attacking the topic I was interested in.  Interest and engagement... that may be the thing that's more important for success on the job and less than obvious from the degree someone possesses.  A person doesn't have to give a single rats ass about any topic in their curriculum to get a degree (though I'm sure it helps).  All you have to do is stick to it and make the necessary grades.  When I see an applicant with a degree, I mostly shrug.  When I see actual work or personal projects, especially self-started, self-directed projects, listed in a resume' then I start getting really interested in an applicant.  When they talk to me knowledgeably and passionately about the job's area of expertise, I'm all thumbs up.  When they also talk to me knowledgeably and passionately about *other* areas of interest and expertise, that's when I pee my pants and insist they be hired.
 
2013-03-12 04:18:06 PM

Omnivorous: Yahoo employees complain to CEO that they still have 800 vacancies because she is a snob who only wants CS degrees and only from certain schools.

She's just parroting Page and Brin.  She could add some other Google rules:
* PhD's preferred
* no MBAs
* 3.5+ GPA or we don't even read your resume
* need some low-leve help?  Outsource it.


The thing is, Yahoo ain't Google.  Google can get away with such high demands because it's farking Google.  Yahoo isn't able to be as picky.
 
2013-03-12 04:19:10 PM

GAT_00: Her gender is irrelevant in that, except that her actions are somewhat more shocking when she personally knows better, or would if she had any empathy.


Her gender is absolutely relevant because if a man tried this crap he'd be toast.
 
2013-03-12 04:29:28 PM

space1999: Yahoo is a software company.  EEs are notoriously bad at programming.  Makes sense to me.


So are CS graduates - great for theory, not very great at actual implementation. "Why can't programmers... program?" and all.

Geotpf: That is, lots of tech companies have morons for CEOs, but we keep hearing about her because she's a she.


That's not sexism on the part of the people critiquing her. The criticism is coming up because it's listed in the news feed. Now if you want to claim that it's in the news feed because she is a woman and that itself is sexist, sure, I agree. She deserves no special attention, and she is only as "well regarded" (by the groups that do) because she is a woman. Plenty of men and cats and vegetables make lousy CEOs too, don't get me wrong - she just has absolutely no properties that would make her a reasonable candidate to even try out. I have never seen a single technical or detailed account of her accomplishments in her 13 years at Google. Just a lot of credit-taking for what engineers likely did and the usual power-trippy "change the color!" type psycho stuff.

cybrwzrd: You can be a very good doctor, lawyer, scientist or anything else with a 110-120 IQ, but you will likely be unskilled at just about anything else you try to learn outside your speciality.


Anyone who has ever had to assist these people with something technical or mechanical can attest to this. You can find someone who can replace your organs for you but won't be able to tell you how many cylinders their vehicle has - which is something that the "truly capable" (as you say) would just pick up from the background noise. Computer usage is another great way of demonstrating adaptability. You can take someone completely proficient in their area of expertise, who knows how to use a computer, but then change one detail about how the computer works and they are lost. Same with their vehicle or any other thing (even something as simple as a debit terminal). They lack the higher intelligence to adapt on the fly, to guess or estimate or investigate. They freeze.

The same applies to CEO/business person/investor. It takes only a very small (as you say, 10%) advantage over an otherwise normal IQ for someone to be highly successful in whatever field they specialize in - but the other stuff? Forget it.

Don't get me wrong, I want a doctor who went to school. A lawyer probably, too - those seem like good things. Software development is so young, ambiguous and so rapidly changing, that a degree really doesn't say a whole lot. Now she's claiming that only a few esteemed institutions are worthwhile. I really can't speak to that - but I am the only person without a degree out of all the people I have worked with, and very, very few of them exhibit much in the way of useful skills. It's mostly just mediocre developers writing mediocre throw-away code everywhere you look. I wouldn't dismiss someone for having a degree, but I also don't consider it a guarantee that they know anything. Because of this, the only real way to decide is to have an interview, solve some problems together and so on.

Her elitism towards graduates is just another sign that she doesn't know what she is doing. She's drawing arbitrary lines in the sand to make it seem like she has a game plan. The reality is that the engineers at Yahoo are either going to make something or not and her overall influence on the company will come down to, "Were people able to make great things despite her bullshiat or was it severe enough that it ruined everything?"
 
2013-03-12 04:30:22 PM

cybrwzrd: This is just a theory of mine:


Degrees are for people who are not intelligent enough or adaptable enough to learn and succeed on their own, which happens to be the plurality of humanity. I would say that for people of average iq - 90-120, a degree - or some sort of specialization is necessary to succeed in life. You can be a very good doctor, lawyer, scientist or anything else with a 110-120 IQ, but you will likely be unskilled at just about anything else you try to learn outside your speciality.


The the truly capable - a small minority, like your father- are able to do pretty much anything they put their mind to. This applies to IQs above 120 or 130 - and the higher the IQ, the more detrimental structured learning and/or specialization becomes. The higher the IQ, the sharper the ability to see patterns - and the ability to see patterns ties in with the ability to see how different fields interrelate.


Why would you suggest "average" is -10 to +20 around the standardized average? C'mon, you could at least use one standard deviation and say 85 to 115.
 
2013-03-12 04:33:43 PM
I hear she narrowed her search to The Big Ten. Yo !!!

// Dice man voice.
 
2013-03-12 04:36:25 PM

poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.


It's a big, scary, unfair world out there. You'd better get used to it.
 
2013-03-12 04:36:50 PM

RatOmeter: I learned C from a white book with a big blue C on the cover.


So did I, and the damn thing taught me to use global variables for everything. Unlearning that was a painful process.

Degrees are dandy for indicating a basic level of instruction. If you are familiar with the school's program, you can be pretty confident in what you will get. There are some things that only experience can teach, however. Pretty much any new grad will be bad at estimating the time required to complete a task. Usually, they forget to include following up to find the actual requirements and time for testing. They also tend to over-engineer the solution so it becomes twice as large as required and takes up three times the development and test time.

There are exceptions, of course, but developers need to learn to be lazy in the right ways.
 
2013-03-12 04:39:16 PM

ProfessorOhki: Why would you suggest "average" is -10 to +20 around the standardized average? C'mon, you could at least use one standard deviation and say 85 to 115.


Because we're talking about the subset of the population that is able, with education, to obtain employment performing some kind of skilled or semi-skilled task. At the lower end people would shift towards unskilled labor and thus you don't have an even distribution.
 
2013-03-12 04:43:24 PM

ProfessorOhki: Why would you suggest "average" is -10 to +20 around the standardized average? C'mon, you could at least use one standard deviation and say 85 to 115.


Because an 85 is a pretty damn low IQ and likely unable to learn what is necessary to earn a degree. That and I am pulling the numbers out of my arse.

If you want to nitpick, fine make it 85-115, but the theory still stands.
 
2013-03-12 04:46:52 PM

poot_rootbeer: Guys, can you maybe find a way to critique Mayer's job performance without calling her a "twat" or a "coont"?

Come on.


We call men we don't like "dicks" and no one complains. Is that misandry?
 
2013-03-12 04:49:58 PM
I hated college.. the learning pace was way too slow and I have a low tolerance for repetitive nonsense.

The only courses I liked were 2 Comp-Sci courses where the professors gave preemtive final exams about 3 weeks into the course to see what kind of apptitude people had.  I passed both exams and was told I got an A in the course and attendance was not necessary for the rest of the semester unless I wanted to help the other students.

Give me a text book, I will read it and digest it in about a week and pass any test on its contents.

Why do we have to learn at the pace of the slowest learner in the class?... its PAINFUL.
 
2013-03-12 04:50:11 PM

RatOmeter: That a person attained a degree tells me that they had the stick-to-it-ness required to get a degree.


I agree and totally disagree with you.  Based off whatever field that person is going into, yeah...sure.  You do not need to have a degree to do a lot of the jobs that exist here in the US.  Does a degree help (the actual education you got) sure...can you self study or learn on the job?  Yup.

My personal take on the matter is that the overwhelming amount of business that require one to have a degree are actually diminishing its value.  It may as well be just another 4 years tacked onto ones education here in the US.  You do not graduate at 12th grade, it is now 16th grade...
 
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