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(Yahoo)   Man's reaction to being arrested inside his own building for "loitering" by the NYPD sums up why keeping your civil rights is so hard: "I don't want to be stopped," he said. "But I also don't {it} to happen to my family"   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 40
    More: Sad, New York Police Department, civil rights, New York Civil Liberties Union, Michael Bloomberg, State of the City  
•       •       •

21282 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Mar 2013 at 3:50 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-11 03:22:30 PM  
13 votes:
But I also don't {it} to happen to my family

So... you changed the quote from "But I also don't want something bad to happen to my family " to one that makes no sense? Good work, subtard.
2013-03-11 03:53:30 PM  
7 votes:
"We don't feel safe, but it's because of the police,"

This is becoming the norm.
2013-03-11 03:55:52 PM  
6 votes:
Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy standing around not doing anything otherwise illegal"?
2013-03-11 03:55:35 PM  
6 votes:

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: "We don't feel safe, but it's because of the police,"

This is becoming the norm.


I'm pretty sure that for people of a darker hue, it's always been the norm.
2013-03-11 04:24:16 PM  
5 votes:
Due to poor life decisions (either made by myself or my parents, depending on my age) - I've always lived in crappy parts of town.  Some places worse than others; none so bad as the 'inner-city'...but I can say with 100% confidence, the worst part of being poor is.....dealing with trashy poor people.

I live in a ~450 sq. ft. apartment in a crappy part of town.  I don't mind the size, and I don't mind that the dryer doesn't work and I have to hang my clothes to dry, or that I don't have a thermostat, or that my shower doesn't work or that water leaks onto the patio from above.

No, the only problem I have with being poor is dealing with trashy poor people.  Neighbors who use the outside of my wall as a basketball court, neighbors who play music until 2am because, apparently, they don't work.  I can't leave my bicycle (I don't own a car, so my bicycle is pretty important to my livelihood) outside because the trashy people that I live near will steal it.  I have to pre-plan deliveries and take personal time off work because if I don't, it will be stolen from my doorstep before I get home.

I'm willing to accept there are economic factors that make the accumulation of wealth unfair towards those who don't already have some....but the things that *really* SUCK about being poor are almost completely self-inflicted.

And this guy is dealing with it.  It sucks that police see him standing outside a building and harass him.  But, the community is better-off for it.  Poor people standing around doing nothing are just waiting to be poor people doing something wrong.  It's why I can't leave anything of value outside and why anything that doesn't move has been 'tagged' with spray paint.

Basically your choice is between being harassed by the police or being harassed by the poor guys standing around with nothing to do (the ones committing the crimes that make this guy conflicted over being stopped by the police.
2013-03-11 04:29:10 PM  
4 votes:
A private owner has every right to allow the police to enter the common areas of their property,  There doesn't need to be any special program in place.

Why would a property owner do this?

1)  It keeps trouble out of the hallways.
2)  If the police do need to enter the building, they use a key instead of a foot.
3)  It costs the building owner $1  (to make a copy of the hallway key)

 It isn't a civil rights violation in they are INVITED by the property owner.
2013-03-11 03:55:55 PM  
4 votes:

Al_Ed: Maybe the terrorists *have* won.


They did and they are currently in control of congress.
2013-03-11 04:12:02 PM  
3 votes:

YixilTesiphon: Stephen_Falken: [i131.photobucket.com image 200x309]

Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.

/fuX0r the police

Yeah....New York City isn't exactly run by the Republican Party, but know your enemy, etc...


You're right. In this case, it's not Republicanism that's the problem...it's pure authoritarianism.
2013-03-11 04:00:02 PM  
3 votes:

Spade: Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy standing around not doing anything otherwise illegal"?


If by NYPD you mean all police forces and by black guy you mean anybody who isn't "normal"... Then yes.
2013-03-11 03:50:45 PM  
3 votes:

Magorn: timujin: But I also don't {it} to happen to my family

So... you changed the quote from "But I also don't want something bad to happen to my family " to one that makes no sense? Good work, subtard.

250 char limit, same basic idea.  in context, he makes it clear he  wants the patrols because they make his building safe, but he also doesn't want his family hasseled by the same cops (the "something bad to happens" he means).   a Variant of NIMBY thinking


The actual quote would have made it 234 characters.

Man's reaction to being arrested inside his own building for "loitering" by the NYPD sums up why keeping your civil rights is so hard: "I don't want to be stopped," he said. "But I also don't want something bad to happen to my family"
2013-03-11 03:29:35 PM  
3 votes:

Magorn: timujin: But I also don't {it} to happen to my family

So... you changed the quote from "But I also don't want something bad to happen to my family " to one that makes no sense? Good work, subtard.

250 char limit, same basic idea.  in context, he makes it clear he  wants the patrols because they make his building safe, but he also doesn't want his family hasseled by the same cops (the "something bad to happens" he means).   a Variant of NIMBY thinking


No, in context the "something bad" is his family being a victim of crime, if you read the paragraph right before that one
2013-03-11 04:38:22 PM  
2 votes:
But others say they can't go home without being menaced. In August 2011, Ligon sent her teenage son to the corner store get ketchup for the fries she was making for dinner. He didn't return.

Eventually, a police officer rang her doorbell and told her over the intercom to come down and identify her boy.



Wow, AP. I wonder what race her "boy" is.

Seriously, never have seen anything other than "son" used in this context. Maybe if he were 5 years old, but they're referring to a teenager. Reminds me of the captions from Katrina where black people "loot" and white people "find"
2013-03-11 04:32:31 PM  
2 votes:

KWillets: "if she hadn't come downstairs to identify him he would've been arrested on a trespassing charge."

So:

not arrested
not loitering

Anything else you'd care to share with us, subby?


According to the SCOTUS, the moment you are detained by police, and no longer able to freely leave on your own volition, an "arrest" has been made, no matter how  briefly,  this is why even "Terry Stops" aka "brief investigative detentions" require some objective reason and suspicion that you are engaged in wrongdoing.  Under Bloomberg, the NYPD has even abandonded this unbelievably basic level of probable cause and just begun blanket "stop and frisks" of random people in high crime neighborhoods.  The fact that this has only caused outrage from the ACLU and other "usual susoects" rather than mass protests and riots, or even the same level of press criticism that has attended his "soda ban" is a sad example fo how far this country, and NYC in particular, has fallen since 9/11
2013-03-11 04:23:53 PM  
2 votes:
"Kelly has called the practice a lifesaving tool that deters criminals from taking illegal weapons in public"

Damn, even the proponents of the policy can't explain why they support it without explaining it in terms of "it's a false excuse to stop and search people that we otherwise have no probable cause to stop and search because they aren't doing anything suspicious"

The logic of the "loitering" arrests being that now police can claim (lie) that ANYONE seen in or around the building is by default "loitering" and therefore is not just available to be asked questions per "Terry-stop" limits, but actually subject to ARREST, which then allows the cop to do a full body search and detain or jail the individual - all for the purpose of finding something else that they can be prosecuted for (drugs, guns, etc.)
2013-03-11 04:18:24 PM  
2 votes:
img833.imageshack.us
2013-03-11 04:13:34 PM  
2 votes:
Somebody/Anybody - read this:

Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.

Don't finish the degree, you won't need it. Dishwashers can work with undergraduate work. Cheney? Really?
2013-03-11 04:12:23 PM  
2 votes:

Stephen_Falken: [i131.photobucket.com image 200x309]

Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.

/fuX0r the police


sounds like we won't lose much.
2013-03-11 04:04:32 PM  
2 votes:
Spade: Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy standing around not doing anything otherwise illegal"?

s/black guy/anyone we don't like the look of/

For example
A white guy wearing a trench coat on a bright sunny day.
Asian guys changing their windshield wipers in a pep boys parking lot
Hispanic guys in a low rider (even if the low rider happens to be moving at the time)
A white guy sitting in an unmarked van, down by the river

etc
2013-03-11 04:03:11 PM  
2 votes:
Subtard doesnt understand his own submission.
2013-03-11 04:02:27 PM  
2 votes:

Magorn: timujin: But I also don't {it} to happen to my family

So... you changed the quote from "But I also don't want something bad to happen to my family " to one that makes no sense? Good work, subtard.

250 char limit, same basic idea.  in context, he makes it clear he  wants the patrols because they make his building safe, but he also doesn't want his family hasseled by the same cops (the "something bad to happens" he means).   a Variant of NIMBY thinking


But you also the verb.
2013-03-11 04:00:05 PM  
2 votes:
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Seriously, what happens when the criminals figure out 'huh- the cops don't patrol in the buildings at night.'?
2013-03-11 03:59:35 PM  
2 votes:
That's the bloomberg way, damn it! Shut up & take what's good for you.

NYC - suck city. Nuke it.
2013-03-11 03:55:29 PM  
2 votes:
Papers please
2013-03-11 03:52:32 PM  
2 votes:
Maybe the terrorists *have* won.
2013-03-11 06:09:02 PM  
1 votes:

Spade: Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy standing around not doing anything otherwise illegal"?


He probably had a 32 oz. soda dipped in trans fat.
2013-03-11 04:52:43 PM  
1 votes:
ftfa: Jay Victorino was standing outside his mother's apartment when he was grabbed by police, and he says if she hadn't come downstairs to identify him he would've been arrested on a trespassing charge.


It wasn't his building, it was the building where his mother had an apt.
And is it normal for grown-up men to hang around in the downstairs areas of apt buildings?
2013-03-11 04:52:26 PM  
1 votes:

LordJiro: You're right. In this case, it's not Republicanism that's the problem...it's pure authoritarianism.


 Authoritarianism knows no political boundaries.  Both sides will use it to further their own goals, and this petty bickering between the parties actually helps them by taking the focus away from what they are doing.
2013-03-11 04:51:57 PM  
1 votes:

Stephen_Falken: [i131.photobucket.com image 200x309]

Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.

/fuX0r the police


I can't tell you about all of Europe - but I can say I spent the first 26 years of my life in the US and then moved to Ireland.  There are very few meaningful differences, despite everyone (on both sides) wanting to pretend otherwise.

European governments will trample over your rights just as fast as the US government.  In some cases, even faster.

The biggest difference that impacts my day-to-day life is the amount of tax I pay.  My experience with the police/local governments are pretty much identical.
2013-03-11 04:41:28 PM  
1 votes:

Christian Bale: But others say they can't go home without being menaced. In August 2011, Ligon sent her teenage son to the corner store get ketchup for the fries she was making for dinner. He didn't return.

Eventually, a police officer rang her doorbell and told her over the intercom to come down and identify her boy.


Wow, AP. I wonder what race her "boy" is.

Seriously, never have seen anything other than "son" used in this context. Maybe if he were 5 years old, but they're referring to a teenager. Reminds me of the captions from Katrina where black people "loot" and white people "find"


perhaps that was the language the police used?
2013-03-11 04:37:21 PM  
1 votes:

Krieghund: timujin: The actual quote would have made it 234 characters.

But this isn't twitter, where every submission gets seen as long as it is under the character limit. I think Fark mods are more likely to green succinct headlines. And not to care about things like grammar, spelling, or logic.


Yes, because cutting out the two words that would make the headline make sense was the big difference between getting a green or not.

I'm not sure why you or Magorn are trying to defend the headline, it was a dumb decision by subby and I was just stating so.  I only pointed out that it was under the 250 character limit because Magorn brought it up.  Hell, I'm not sure why my OC got a response in the first place.
2013-03-11 04:34:50 PM  
1 votes:

wgb423: A private owner has every right to allow the police to enter the common areas of their property,  There doesn't need to be any special program in place.

Why would a property owner do this?

1)  It keeps trouble out of the hallways.
2)  If the police do need to enter the building, they use a key instead of a foot.
3)  It costs the building owner $1  (to make a copy of the hallway key)

 It isn't a civil rights violation in they are INVITED by the property owner.


Property owners aren;t the only ones with civil rights, particularly 4th Amendment ones, nor can the cops, absent the owner's specific participation in every case, on their own dtermine who is a tresspasser and who is an invitee
2013-03-11 04:30:46 PM  
1 votes:
When I see how the police are able to act in a nation such as ours, it makes me realize the terror of living somewhere where there are no checks and balances to their behavior.
2013-03-11 04:30:01 PM  
1 votes:

Spade: Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy standing around not doing anything otherwise illegal"?


It's anybody Bloomberg doesn't like.  The mans is the text book definition of nanny-state
2013-03-11 04:29:19 PM  
1 votes:
"I don't want to be stopped," he said. "But I also don't want something bad to happen to my family. It's not easy to say what the right answer is. ... It's not a perfect world."
Wisdom beyond his years right there.
2013-03-11 04:28:27 PM  
1 votes:

KarmicDisaster: It's a metaphor! They speak in metaphors!


They must be like the girl who was hurt in the darkness and ate what was given to her.
2013-03-11 04:24:36 PM  
1 votes:

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: "We don't feel safe, but it's because of the police,"

This is becoming the norm.


A couple of weeks ago, my car broke down, and I had to sit on the side of Rt 1, in PA, for 45 minutes waiting for the tow truck.  For anyone that's ever been down that road, you'd know how scary that is.  Traffic whizzes by at like 80mph!

The one thing that amazed me was that for all that time, I didn't see one cop.  Not one.  I would really have liked to have a cop there with lights to draw attenton to my car.

When I mentioned this to the driver, he shrugged and said, "That's the way it is with the cops.  They are like Nanny McFee.  When you need them they aren't around.  And when you don't want them, there they are."

Nice analogy...
2013-03-11 04:09:07 PM  
1 votes:

Stephen_Falken: [i131.photobucket.com image 200x309]

Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.

/fuX0r the police


Yeah....New York City isn't exactly run by the Republican Party, but know your enemy, etc...
2013-03-11 04:08:50 PM  
1 votes:
And then they wonder why people live in the suburbs.  I can have more than 10 cars parked for free around my house and an officer on patrol might drive past every few months.  The main noisy person nearby just moved away so the loudest things that I hear in the morning are some woodpeckers.
2013-03-11 04:07:27 PM  
1 votes:
i131.photobucket.com

Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.

/fuX0r the police
2013-03-11 03:53:23 PM  
1 votes:
SWB?

/standing while black
 
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