fsbilly: So, the police detain him for loitering at building he doesn't live in. They question him and contact his mom who verifies that he has a legitimate reason to be there and they release him.Hate to say it, but it sounds like the program worked exactly as it's supposed to. Don't like it? Buy yourself a house where you can do as you please./And have some brioche while you're at it.
dready zim: lordargent: Spade: Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy standing around not doing anything otherwise illegal"?s/black guy/anyone we don't like the look of/For exampleA white guy wearing a trench coat on a bright sunny day.Asian guys changing their windshield wipers in a pep boys parking lotHispanic guys in a low rider (even if the low rider happens to be moving at the time)A white guy sitting in an unmarked van, down by the riveretcPlease use the quote system ;) I read that as `Spade: Is "loitering" NYPD code for "black guy `
Stephen_Falken: It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections
Stephen_Falken: Well now. It's about time the rest of you slackers got a taste of the police state that California has already become. Welcome to your future, you earned it by allowing that piece of sh*t Cheney to steal the elections and shove America so far right that it may never recover its balance. Screw you guys, I'm going to Europe once I finish my degree.
durbnpoisn: A couple of weeks ago, my car broke down, and I had to sit on the side of Rt 1, in PA, for 45 minutes waiting for the tow truck. For anyone that's ever been down that road, you'd know how scary that is. Traffic whizzes by at like 80mph!
Burr: Authoritarianism knows no political boundaries.
Magorn: wgb423: A private owner has every right to allow the police to enter the common areas of their property, There doesn't need to be any special program in place.Why would a property owner do this?1) It keeps trouble out of the hallways.2) If the police do need to enter the building, they use a key instead of a foot.3) It costs the building owner $1 (to make a copy of the hallway key) It isn't a civil rights violation in they are INVITED by the property owner.Property owners aren;t the only ones with civil rights, particularly 4th Amendment ones, nor can the cops, absent the owner's specific participation in every case, on their own dtermine who is a tresspasser and who is an invitee
LemSkroob: If the tenants don't like it, they can go and purchase their own property somewhere else.
Mikey1969: fsbilly: So, the police detain him for loitering at building he doesn't live in. They question him and contact his mom who verifies that he has a legitimate reason to be there and they release him.Hate to say it, but it sounds like the program worked exactly as it's supposed to. Don't like it? Buy yourself a house where you can do as you please./And have some brioche while you're at it.So explain the teenager sent to get some ketchup. If all he's doing is going from Point A to Point B and back, there is no reason to detain or even question, now is there?
durbnpoisn: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: "We don't feel safe, but it's because of the police,"This is becoming the norm.A couple of weeks ago, my car broke down, and I had to sit on the side of Rt 1, in PA, for 45 minutes waiting for the tow truck. For anyone that's ever been down that road, you'd know how scary that is. Traffic whizzes by at like 80mph!The one thing that amazed me was that for all that time, I didn't see one cop. Not one. I would really have liked to have a cop there with lights to draw attenton to my car.When I mentioned this to the driver, he shrugged and said, "That's the way it is with the cops. They are like Nanny McFee. When you need them they aren't around. And when you don't want them, there they are."Nice analogy...
Glancing Blow: I'm an internet lawyer: Excluding cooperatives and condominiums, the building owner owns the hallways, hence they are the private property of the owner. The rights you have on a public street are different than on private property.
Fark_Guy_Rob: Due to poor life decisions (either made by myself or my parents, depending on my age) - I've always lived in crappy parts of town. Some places worse than others; none so bad as the 'inner-city'...but I can say with 100% confidence, the worst part of being poor is.....dealing with trashy poor people.I live in a ~450 sq. ft. apartment in a crappy part of town. I don't mind the size, and I don't mind that the dryer doesn't work and I have to hang my clothes to dry, or that I don't have a thermostat, or that my shower doesn't work or that water leaks onto the patio from above.No, the only problem I have with being poor is dealing with trashy poor people. Neighbors who use the outside of my wall as a basketball court, neighbors who play music until 2am because, apparently, they don't work. I can't leave my bicycle (I don't own a car, so my bicycle is pretty important to my livelihood) outside because the trashy people that I live near will steal it. I have to pre-plan deliveries and take personal time off work because if I don't, it will be stolen from my doorstep before I get home.I'm willing to accept there are economic factors that make the accumulation of wealth unfair towards those who don't already have some....but the things that *really* SUCK about being poor are almost completely self-inflicted.And this guy is dealing with it. It sucks that police see him standing outside a building and harass him. But, the community is better-off for it. Poor people standing around doing nothing are just waiting to be poor people doing something wrong. It's why I can't leave anything of value outside and why anything that doesn't move has been 'tagged' with spray paint.Basically your choice is between being harassed by the police or being harassed by the poor guys standing around with nothing to do (the ones committing the crimes that make this guy conflicted over being stopped by the police.
Magorn: KWillets: "if she hadn't come downstairs to identify him he would've been arrested on a trespassing charge."So:not arrestednot loiteringAnything else you'd care to share with us, subby?According to the SCOTUS, the moment you are detained by police, and no longer able to freely leave on your own volition, an "arrest" has been made, no matter how briefly, this is why even "Terry Stops" aka "brief investigative detentions" require some objective reason and suspicion that you are engaged in wrongdoing. Under Bloomberg, the NYPD has even abandonded this unbelievably basic level of probable cause and just begun blanket "stop and frisks" of random people in high crime neighborhoods. The fact that this has only caused outrage from the ACLU and other "usual susoects" rather than mass protests and riots, or even the same level of press criticism that has attended his "soda ban" is a sad example fo how far this country, and NYC in particular, has fallen since 9/11
StoPPeRmobile: The cop smelled pot and saw the suspect throw something away when approached.
StaleCoffee: draypresct: StaleCoffee: Yeah, what a surprise, police states are more effective at stopping crime reporting.You left a word off there.No, police states really are more effective at stopping crime. Some people are willing to give up personal rights for that. Some people don't realize what they're doing, and some people don't care.It's not surprising that constantly patrolling and arresting anyone on the streets after 9 PM means there are no criminals on the streets after 9 PM.
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