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(Chmura Economics & Analytics)   Switching to Daylight Saving Time costs the American economy $434 million due to lost sleep, according to the rocket surgeons at the Institute For Pulling Statistics Out Of Our Asses   (sleepbetter.org ) divider line
    More: Unlikely  
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2301 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Mar 2013 at 10:15 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-11 10:55:00 AM  

jfivealive: I usually spend about 5 minutes a day picking my nose, so I had to give that up yesterday in order to change the clocks that didn't adjust automatically.  It was tough, but it did lead to extra good pickins today.


Fifty bucks more says he eats it...Man that kid'll eat anything.
 
2013-03-11 10:55:53 AM  

Gifted Many Few: debug: Your stove and microwave update automatically?

No, I covered that in my other post. There is no need to have clocks in every appliance. Every house should have three. One when waking up, one in living room and one in the car. Keep a cell phone handy watch on your wrist if you need to know the time on a whim.


FTFY.
 
2013-03-11 10:57:43 AM  
Can't we just cut to the chase and blame Obama for this mess?
 
2013-03-11 10:58:22 AM  
All the clocks I care about update automatically, except for 1.  I had to press 1 button twice and twist a knob to set my car clock.  Otherwise my computer, phone, alarm, computers all automatic.
 
2013-03-11 10:59:45 AM  
I was playing xbox when the "time changed." The system clock automatically updated and really messed with my head because I thought I dozed off for an hour mid game.
 
2013-03-11 11:00:10 AM  

3rdtimearound: Can't we just cut to the chase and blame

Obama Hitler for this mess?

FTFY!
 
2013-03-11 11:02:12 AM  
I had to change my stove and microwave, that took
 
2013-03-11 11:03:23 AM  

dittybopper: I do have analog wall clocks. Know why? Because they always work, don't depend on infrastructure beyond a single AA battery, and an analog clock face is a much better intuitive visual representation of time than a digital display


At least you will know the exact time the government came to take your guns.
 
2013-03-11 11:05:00 AM  
How many car accidents from trying to set the clock while eating and texting?
 
2013-03-11 11:05:58 AM  
All i know is the sun is up when I leave the office, and I like that.
 
2013-03-11 11:06:07 AM  

rumpelstiltskin: Pocket Ninja:
And before you start poo-pooing the idea, I know what the major critique is. Yes, when all is said and done, we'd be a day or two, maybe 3 or 4, behind ourselves. That's fine..."days" are just a human concept, anyway. And once the economy was fixed and there was no more need to fall back for money, we could start springing forward again, a little at a time, until we were back to "normal." It's similar to time travel, really.

You've brought up a good point: moving back and forth by hours isn't really any less arbitrary than moving back and forth by days. Days are just bigger than hours. But our deficit is big, so we've got to think big to solve it. Every second Saturday until football season starts, we should move the calendar back one day for "Daylight Savings Date". This will give us one extra productive day per week, which I estimate should be worth about $50 billion dollars. We can give the day back on Sunday morning, when we return to "Standard Date". This won't cost us anything, because no one does anything on Sunday anyway.


I like to go fishing on Sundays, you farking heathen!
 
2013-03-11 11:07:16 AM  

jfivealive: dittybopper: I do have analog wall clocks. Know why? Because they always work, don't depend on infrastructure beyond a single AA battery, and an analog clock face is a much better intuitive visual representation of time than a digital display

At least you will know the exact time the government came to take your guns.


They're confiscating flintlocks now?  Wow, it really *IS* worse than I thought.
 
2013-03-11 11:11:19 AM  
Yeah, this time change happens in the middle of the night during the weekend. If you can't adjust for an hour by the beginning of the day on Monday, getting rid of DST is the LEAST of your worries.

Really, this is nothing more than a  crutch for lazy people.
 
2013-03-11 11:12:12 AM  

choo: 3rdtimearound: Can't we just cut to the chase and blame Obama Hitler for this mess?

FTFY!


Sorry - but what did you change to my post?
 
2013-03-11 11:12:32 AM  
Unrelated:
I just got a new digital cable box because the old one died.
It doesn't have a clock and it's driving me crazy.
 
2013-03-11 11:17:02 AM  

Burr: SuperChuck: You don't think there are any kids out waiting for the bus before 7:15am?

"Small" kids, no. Older kids, yeah.

When I was in Middle School/HS (so, starting around 6th grade, which would have made me around 11-12) I was the first one on the bus.  Our school day started at 7:20 I believe, and I had an hour long bus ride, so that means that I was on the bust by at least 6:15....

/of course, I was a farm kid, so I was used to early mornings


When I was a wee lad, the elementary kids got picked up first. 6:30 every morning at that stop. But finally we get to that last year. After this, we are in middle school. Bus doesn't come till 7:15! Hallelujah!

But you know what the farkin schoolboard did that year? The decided the littlest brats should her the later bus. So me and my class got the 6:30 crap all the way through!!
 
2013-03-11 11:20:43 AM  
I like to switch some clocks and leave the others, so that I can pretend I'm a time traveler on trips between different rooms.
 
2013-03-11 11:22:38 AM  
If you can't adjust, absorb a 1hr change in your routine without it adversly affecting your life in such a way that you are dangerous(safety wise) and less of a productive employee. Then you have a few other issues that you should be working on instead of spending time biatching about it.
 
2013-03-11 11:24:57 AM  

doglover: FALSE


I've spent the last 8 years without DST. You are disingenuous and dead wrong besides.


Disingenuous?  What's disingenuous about outlining what the days would look like at the solstices?

Jesus.  Take a deep breath, buddy, OK?

DownDaRiver: If you can't adjust, absorb a 1hr change in your routine without it adversly affecting your life in such a way that you are dangerous(safety wise) and less of a productive employee. Then you have a few other issues that you should be working on instead of spending time biatching about it.


So much this.
 
2013-03-11 11:25:30 AM  

Babwa Wawa: - If we shift forward all year long (DST all the time), daylight hours will be 8:15a-5:30p in much of the country. Small children waiting for the bus in the dark isn't tenable.


What backwards part of the US do you live in? Most bus routes start at 5:30 or 6. even if "daylight" starts at 7:15, you still have a buncha kids "sitting" in the dark. Unless you have those hippie 9-3 schools.
 
2013-03-11 11:27:18 AM  

SuperChuck: You don't think there are any kids out waiting for the bus before 7:15am?


Sure.  I've got two of them.  They're 8 and 10 years old, and I'm fine with them waiting for the bus in the dark.

When they were four, I would have had a problem with them standing by a busy road in the pitch dark.
 
2013-03-11 11:28:29 AM  

priapic_abandon: Three cars in the driveway, all have a different system for changing the time:

My wife's Yaris you hold the clock button down until the minutes start blinking, wait ten seconds then the hour starts blinking, push the button immediately to change the hour, wait ten more secs for the hour to stop blinking. My Accord has dedicated hour and minutes buttons, no problem there. My daughter's Civic only has a clock in the aftermarket stereo, I think you recite a spell in Olde Elvish and it might change the time, or not.


I never change the time on the clock in my car. It is permanently set to EST. Ditto on the wall clocks that I have to get a step-stool out to reach. Screw all that. I know what time it is.

Those of us who live close to the western edge of a time zone particularly hate DST. I'm only about 50 miles from the western edge of the eastern zone and right now, the sun doesn't rise until after 8am. Around the summer solstice, there will still be light in the sky at 10pm. How's that for screwing up your circadian rhythms?
 
2013-03-11 11:29:21 AM  

Pocket Ninja: What I've just realized upon reading this is that, if "springing forward" costs the economy half a billion dollars, then the opposite must be true when we "fall back" (which makes sense because instead of losing an hour, we're gaining one). So, let's do this: we'll mandate that, for the next year or so, we'll "fall back" one more hour until the budget deficit is fixed. No need to get unreasonable about it...we can do one a week, for an economic gain of about $2 billion per month. $24 billion in a year, not too shabby. Yes, this will cause some havoc with people's schedules, but as Mr. Obama is so fond of saying, we've all got to sacrifice. We could even switch it up a bit and make the fallback 2 hours at a time, which would double our savings. We could be in a surplus situation in a couple of years.

And before you start poo-pooing the idea, I know what the major critique is. Yes, when all is said and done, we'd be a day or two, maybe 3 or 4, behind ourselves. That's fine..."days" are just a human concept, anyway. And once the economy was fixed and there was no more need to fall back for money, we could start springing forward again, a little at a time, until we were back to "normal." It's similar to time travel, really.

Hey, that's an idea...what if we could fall back enough to change past events? Like, maybe stop the recession before it happened? We could make a ton of money for the economy AND prevent economic collapse, so we'd be ahead on two fronts. I'm excited about this.


I think I love you.
 
2013-03-11 11:29:39 AM  

AppleOptionEsc: What backwards part of the US do you live in? Most bus routes start at 5:30 or 6. even if "daylight" starts at 7:15, you still have a buncha kids "sitting" in the dark. Unless you have those hippie 9-3 schools.


As I stated just after your post, plenty of kids stand around for the bus before dawn in the winter around here.  But not the really small kids.

An 8 year old kid or 17 year old "kid" standing in the dark for the bus is one thing.  A four or five year old kid is another entirely.
 
2013-03-11 11:33:21 AM  

dittybopper: Consider this.

THere are about 115 million households in the US.  If it takes each household on average 5 minutes to change all of their clocks, that's 575 million minutes.  Divide that by 60, that's about 9.6 million hours.

The average yearly wage in the US is about $43,000.  If you figure a 40 hour work week, that's an average hourly wage of $20.67.

That means it costs the US about $396,923,077 in lost time just to change the clocks every year.


BAN the POOPIN'!
 
2013-03-11 11:34:54 AM  

DownDaRiver: If you can't adjust, absorb a 1hr change in your routine without it adversly affecting your life in such a way that you are dangerous(safety wise) and less of a productive employee. Then you have a few other issues that you should be working on instead of spending time biatching about it.


Have a baby, that changes right fast
 
2013-03-11 11:36:50 AM  

tricycleracer: Pocket Ninja: "days" are just a human concept, anyway.

[www.timecube.com image 528x359]


See, now I regret choosing "Cube Divinity" as my Fark handle. Thanks a lot.
 
2013-03-11 11:37:06 AM  

JackieRabbit: Those of us who live close to the western edge of a time zone particularly hate DST. I'm only about 50 miles from the western edge of the eastern zone and right now, the sun doesn't rise until after 8am. Around the summer solstice, there will still be light in the sky at 10pm. How's that for screwing up your circadian rhythms?


Where I'm at now, I'd <i>love</i> to go to DST all year. On the winter solstice the sunset officially occurs slightly before 4:30pm and, according to the US Naval Observatory's definition, civil twilight ends at 4:58pm. Watching the sun set from my office has always been depressing; kicking the hour forward a bit would be really nice. Sure, the sunrise would be around 8:30am then, but it's a lot nicer to leave for work when it's dark than it is to leave for dinner or home when it's dark.
 
2013-03-11 11:39:13 AM  

Babwa Wawa: AppleOptionEsc: What backwards part of the US do you live in? Most bus routes start at 5:30 or 6. even if "daylight" starts at 7:15, you still have a buncha kids "sitting" in the dark. Unless you have those hippie 9-3 schools.

As I stated just after your post, plenty of kids stand around for the bus before dawn in the winter around here.  But not the really small kids.

An 8 year old kid or 17 year old "kid" standing in the dark for the bus is one thing.  A four or five year old kid is another entirely.


Why?
 
2013-03-11 11:39:24 AM  

Pocket Ninja: What I've just realized upon reading this is that, if "springing forward" costs the economy half a billion dollars, then the opposite must be true when we "fall back" (which makes sense because instead of losing an hour, we're gaining one). So, let's do this: we'll mandate that, for the next year or so, we'll "fall back" one more hour until the budget deficit is fixed. No need to get unreasonable about it...we can do one a week, for an economic gain of about $2 billion per month. $24 billion in a year, not too shabby. Yes, this will cause some havoc with people's schedules, but as Mr. Obama is so fond of saying, we've all got to sacrifice. We could even switch it up a bit and make the fallback 2 hours at a time, which would double our savings. We could be in a surplus situation in a couple of years.

And before you start poo-pooing the idea, I know what the major critique is. Yes, when all is said and done, we'd be a day or two, maybe 3 or 4, behind ourselves. That's fine..."days" are just a human concept, anyway. And once the economy was fixed and there was no more need to fall back for money, we could start springing forward again, a little at a time, until we were back to "normal." It's similar to time travel, really.

Hey, that's an idea...what if we could fall back enough to change past events? Like, maybe stop the recession before it happened? We could make a ton of money for the economy AND prevent economic collapse, so we'd be ahead on two fronts. I'm excited about this.



Sorry, but the whole reason for the Bush recession was time travelers.
 
2013-03-11 11:40:22 AM  

Babwa Wawa: AppleOptionEsc: What backwards part of the US do you live in? Most bus routes start at 5:30 or 6. even if "daylight" starts at 7:15, you still have a buncha kids "sitting" in the dark. Unless you have those hippie 9-3 schools.

As I stated just after your post, plenty of kids stand around for the bus before dawn in the winter around here.  But not the really small kids.

An 8 year old kid or 17 year old "kid" standing in the dark for the bus is one thing.  A four or five year old kid is another entirely.


Yeah, our K-5 get picked up starting around 7:30 I think.  Grades 6 and over are earlier.

Our bus stop was at the end of our driveway though (maybe 100 ft from the house), so our mom would shove us out in the cold and watch us from the window when we were smaller.

A drivers license is a god send when you live in the country.  A 15 min drive to school vs an hour ride (plus making money driving people around since you were the first one in your grade to get your license was pretty sweet).
 
2013-03-11 11:43:02 AM  
Daylight Savings Time was fine when it was understood that we lived in a society that operated primarily from sun up to sun down.  However, we are currently operating in a 24 hour society.  I see this as no different than a person who sets his clock ahead 5 minutes so he won't be late- we're basically fooling ourselves by calling hours by different names.  You do not gain an hour of daylight- it's already there, as any third shifter can attest to.

The only reason I can see that Indiana went to Daylight Savings Time was because "everyone was doing it".  But, in my opinion, this is just an example of everyone doing something stupid and outdated because it makes them feel comfortable.
 
2013-03-11 11:44:19 AM  
this is most likely impossible and possibly stupid...but let's split the difference in the fall at 30 minutes and never f*cking do this sh*t again.
 
2013-03-11 11:47:20 AM  

Babwa Wawa: AppleOptionEsc: What backwards part of the US do you live in? Most bus routes start at 5:30 or 6. even if "daylight" starts at 7:15, you still have a buncha kids "sitting" in the dark. Unless you have those hippie 9-3 schools.

As I stated just after your post, plenty of kids stand around for the bus before dawn in the winter around here.  But not the really small kids.

An 8 year old kid or 17 year old "kid" standing in the dark for the bus is one thing.  A four or five year old kid is another entirely.


So, waiting for the bus in the dark:
Kindergarten: Bad
3rd Grade: OK

I think what you meant to say in your Boobies is "If we shift forward all year long (DST all the time) it would be farking ratarded and would just be the same as being in the GMT+4 time zone."
 
2013-03-11 11:50:01 AM  
If the switch to DST costs $, then logic dictates that "fall back" does the opposite.

If it wasn't for DST, the sunrise in my area would be as early as 5:19.  A time when most folks are sleeping.  IMHO, the purpose of DST is most people will have more daylight when they're actually awake.
 
2013-03-11 11:50:23 AM  
Curse you filter!  I guess this is my punishment for arguing about DST...
 
2013-03-11 11:50:43 AM  
What's time to a Pig?
 
2013-03-11 11:51:33 AM  
Has anyone mentioned that Fark.com goes a long way in contributing to the non-productive factor?
 
2013-03-11 11:55:03 AM  
I change the clocks on friday so by monday I'm all caught up.
 
2013-03-11 11:57:13 AM  

busy chillin': this is most likely impossible and possibly stupid...but let's split the difference in the fall at 30 minutes and never f*cking do this sh*t again.


Venezuela is on GMT-4½ time.
 
2013-03-11 11:58:46 AM  

www.hometheaterhifi.com

 
2013-03-11 12:01:14 PM  

Pocket Ninja: I'm excited about this.


We could just skip a full day and save 365 times as much - that would put a dent in the deficit. Calendar makers and the lot would get to produce more in a given year helping the economy and their bottom line.  Everybody else would see all their business expenses drop by one day's worth of overhead for the year. That will free up a tremendous amount of capital for business reinvestment and expansion, add jobs, stimulate the economy, and directly generate increased taxation revenue. Once we realize that revenues have gone up, we can cut taxes because, after all, "it's the people's money," and that will FURTHER stimulate the economy. This is pure win-win-win.

Some would say we could never get that day back but someday, when times are good, we'll just add a day back into the calendar. In the meantime we'll just call it the Federal Day Deficit. Federal Day Deficits won't matter because we'll know we'll get it back later thanks to the improved economy which makes this small change a no brainer.
 
2013-03-11 12:01:56 PM  

Babwa Wawa: I get really tired of people who think that DST is somehow the most pressing problem facing this country.

Here's why we will never get rid of DST shifts:

-  If we shift forward all year long (DST all the time), daylight hours will be 8:15a-5:30p in much of the country.  Small children waiting for the bus in the dark isn't tenable.

-  If we get rid of DST entirely, then you'll have daylight hours of 3:45a-7:30p in much of the country in the middle of the summer.  I'm hard pressed to figure out how 4:45a-8:30p is worse than that.


We had DST when I was a child and when my sons were young and we all went to school on dark winter mornings. Making people change their sleep/waking patterns twice a year is is harder than learning to live with an hour of darkness for a few months. Little children aren't stupid or so delicate that they can't survive a dark morning.
 
2013-03-11 12:04:43 PM  

DiabloCanyonOne: busy chillin': this is most likely impossible and possibly stupid...but let's split the difference in the fall at 30 minutes and never f*cking do this sh*t again.

Venezuela is on GMT-4½ time.


India is that way as well...

And Nepal is like UTC +8.25
 
2013-03-11 12:06:40 PM  

GalFriday: Has Indiana weighed in yet?
We only started observing daylight savings time a few years ago.  It has really messed things up here.  I mean the whole concept of DST is like cutting a foot off of a blanket at the bottom and sewing it to the top top make it longer.
I liked it better when we were on the same time all year and had daylight much later.


The parts of Indiana on Central time have been observing DST since practically forever, putting us on the same time as the rest of the state for six months. Now, the rest of you have to join with our pain. I consider that a good compromise.

I'm sure I had a point when I started this post, but I'm sleepy.
 
2013-03-11 12:07:50 PM  
 
2013-03-11 12:09:24 PM  

Mija: Little children aren't stupid or so delicate that they can't survive a dark morning.


But they are likely to be eaten by a grue. Especially if they are adventurous.
 
2013-03-11 12:15:39 PM  

GalFriday: Has Indiana weighed in yet?
We only started observing daylight savings time a few years ago.  It has really messed things up here.  I mean the whole concept of DST is like cutting a foot off of a blanket at the bottom and sewing it to the top top make it longer.
I liked it better when we were on the same time all year and had daylight much later.


Good grief, if a time change messes up the farking state, I can't imagine what something that really matters does to your people.
 
2013-03-11 12:16:41 PM  
I be hatin on the DST

Stupid Washington Biureaucrats
 
2013-03-11 12:18:35 PM  

SuperChuck: Babwa Wawa: I get really tired of people who think that DST is somehow the most pressing problem facing this country.

Here's why we will never get rid of DST shifts:

-  If we shift forward all year long (DST all the time), daylight hours will be 8:15a-5:30p in much of the country.  Small children waiting for the bus in the dark isn't tenable.

-  If we get rid of DST entirely, then you'll have daylight hours of 3:45a-7:30p in much of the country in the middle of the summer.  I'm hard pressed to figure out how 4:45a-8:30p is worse than that.

You don't think there are any kids out waiting for the bus before 7:15am?


Hell, my 5 year old is late for kindergarten at 7:20 AM
 
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