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(Fox News)   House Republicans, eager to prove that they're serious about passing a budget, include as the core component of their new proposal the repeal of Obamacare   (foxnews.com) divider line 278
    More: Fail, obamacare, Republican, repeal, balanced budgets, House Budget Committee, heart  
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2989 clicks; posted to Politics » on 10 Mar 2013 at 3:08 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-10 02:12:30 PM
Again? Hasn't the House already repealed it like 5 times? Let it go man, it's gone.
 
2013-03-10 02:15:21 PM
Yeah yeah, we know, Republicans.
 
2013-03-10 02:17:03 PM
The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that the re-elected the guy who signed it.
 
2013-03-10 02:19:38 PM
They do this every time Obama seizes our guns.
 
2013-03-10 02:41:10 PM

nmrsnr: Again? Hasn't the House already repealed it like 5 times? Let it go man, it's gone.


They tried 33 times or something like that last session.  And the first bill of this Congress was to repeal Obamacare.
 
2013-03-10 02:43:15 PM
i49.tinypic.com
 
2013-03-10 02:44:42 PM
Hey, if first you don't succeed, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try again.
 
2013-03-10 02:57:26 PM
Republican politicians, screwing up America since 1994.
 
2013-03-10 03:12:31 PM
....Like a broken record Like a broken record Like a broken record...

/repeat ad nauseum
 
2013-03-10 03:13:46 PM
"Our budget does promote repealing ObamaCare," said Ryan, who was not clear whether his 2014 budget is based on a full repeal...... "I've very confident this is the way to go,"

"Here's my plan.  We want to repeal Obamacare.  I know we tried like 35 times when we had more Republicans in the HoR, and more Republicans in the Senate, and it failed every time.  This time will be different and is in no way just a waste of time in which I'm trying to distract you from the fact that I got nuthin'.  I'm not sure if this thing I'm proposing gets rid of all of it, but I know it's the right thing to do, even though I'm not sure exactly what it does."

47% of you voted for this dumbshiat to be the VPOTUS.
 
2013-03-10 03:14:32 PM
What a shock, the Republicans pass another poison pill piece of legislation that they know will never get passed just so they can say that they're doing something and the Senate needs to get of their asses. I'm surprised it doesn't defund Planned Parenthood, NPR, and PBS.
 
2013-03-10 03:16:34 PM
You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.
 
2013-03-10 03:18:12 PM
It really pisses them off that Obama will be forever known as the president who brought the US universal healthcare, doesn't it?
 
2013-03-10 03:18:42 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Your name is accurate.
 
2013-03-10 03:20:01 PM
Remember folks, $600 billion per year to enable us to blow up sand into more sand and does nothing back home except give us wounded vets to take care of(which the GOP doesn't seem to care about either) and line the pockets of defense contractors is a good use of tax dollars, but $100 billion per year to take care of Americans is the worst socialism to ever socialize.
 
2013-03-10 03:20:07 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Your name is accurate.


Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.
 
2013-03-10 03:20:07 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


You are full of sh*t. Histrionics without facts, and Obamacare hasn't even started yet! Just right wing nit wit noise, go eff yourself with a rusty pistol.
 
2013-03-10 03:21:21 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


It was much better before Obamacare. You know, the time where in my personal experience, my premiums went up 200% in 3 years. Good times.

/Anecdote fight
 
2013-03-10 03:21:52 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?
 
2013-03-10 03:22:00 PM

Generation_D: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

You are full of sh*t. Histrionics without facts, and Obamacare hasn't even started yet! Just right wing nit wit noise, go eff yourself with a rusty pistol.


You don't know what the fark you're talking about.  It's been implemented in stages.  The exchanges go into place in '14.  I know exactly what I'm talking about.
 
2013-03-10 03:23:23 PM
WALLACE: Are you saying that as part of your budget you would repeal - you assume the repeal of Obamacare?

RYAN: Yes.

WALLACE:  Well that's not going to happen.


When even Fox News doesn't swallow your load, you have a losing hand.
 
2013-03-10 03:23:23 PM

themindiswatching: It really pisses them off that Obama will be forever known as the president who brought the US universal healthcare, doesn't it?


They've got one more year to try and get rid of it.  2014 is when most of the big stuff swings into action.

Premiums went up slightly, but it was the smallest increase I've seen in years percentage wise (only 1%), plus my benefits expanded to cover vaccinations and improved what they cover for preventative care.
 
2013-03-10 03:23:23 PM

Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Your name is accurate.

Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.


For one, it's not 2014 yet...
 
2013-03-10 03:23:54 PM

Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

You are full of sh*t. Histrionics without facts, and Obamacare hasn't even started yet! Just right wing nit wit noise, go eff yourself with a rusty pistol.

You don't know what the fark you're talking about.  It's been implemented in stages.  The exchanges go into place in '14.  I know exactly what I'm talking about.


Right wing troll tards spent a year screwing up health care reform, now the same crowd wants to repeal the few improvements we did get.
 
2013-03-10 03:23:54 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Ah. Wheras I got money back from the insurance company, saw my rates go down, and no longer had to worry about how in gods name I'd ever get health insurance for my fiance, since she had a stroke (due to a generic of Yaz, which she was taking for medical reasons) about 3 years ago at the age of 23.

Let's play the andecdote game!
 
2013-03-10 03:23:58 PM

Generation_D: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

You are full of sh*t. Histrionics without facts, and Obamacare hasn't even started yet! Just right wing nit wit noise, go eff yourself with a rusty pistol.


This.
 
2013-03-10 03:24:01 PM

LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?


My premiums didn't go up every year, it was closer to every other.  They have since doubled, and I'm a single man in good health.  As for the rest, go fark yourself with a rusty fork.  I said the status quo was bad.
 
2013-03-10 03:25:55 PM

Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Your name is accurate.

Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.


Those are all trends that have been going on for at least 30 years.
 
2013-03-10 03:26:18 PM

meat0918: Premiums went up slightly, but it was the smallest increase I've seen in years percentage wise (only 1%), plus my benefits expanded to cover vaccinations and improved what they cover for preventative care.


Indeed. Mine actually didn't go up at all for 2013.
 
2013-03-10 03:26:44 PM
Yes, spend the thread discussing how awful Obamacare is with an obvious idiot rather than look at the steaming pile of shiat Ryan is again trying to warm up and serve to seniors.

Bueno.
 
2013-03-10 03:26:53 PM
Yeah the other day I wanted to ask for a raise at work, so I started by asking the boss if I could fark him in the ass.  Just to show I was serious.
 
2013-03-10 03:26:57 PM
Silly people.  You're supposed to pass the bill and sign it into law before reading it.

/jeesh
 
2013-03-10 03:26:57 PM

Fail in Human Form: My premiums didn't go up every year, it was closer to every other.  They have since doubled, and I'm a single man in good health.  As for the rest, go fark yourself with a rusty fork.  I said the status quo was bad


Maybe you should look into the exchanges next year.
 
2013-03-10 03:27:23 PM
And still waiting on t hose JOBS we were promised by the GOP back in 2010
 
2013-03-10 03:27:34 PM
Ever wonder why a budget doesn't get passed? Here's a prime example.
 
2013-03-10 03:28:03 PM

fuhfuhfuh: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

It was much better before Obamacare. You know, the time where in my personal experience, my premiums went up 200% in 3 years. Good times.

/Anecdote fight


My premiums went up 500% because of Obamacare and my employer fired me because Obama taxed the rich.  Also, my Papa Johns pizza is way too expensive and I can no longer afford to eat.  Luckily, I don't have to worry about any of this because a death panel has already sentenced me to execution.
 
2013-03-10 03:28:21 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?
 
2013-03-10 03:28:26 PM

Soup4Bonnie: Yes, spend the thread discussing how awful Obamacare is with an obvious idiot rather than look at the steaming pile of shiat Ryan is again trying to warm up and serve to seniors.

Bueno.


I'm not a conservative, I said I supported Obama Care (go ahead and search the site).  What you're telling me is to ignore what I'm seeing with my own eyes.
 
2013-03-10 03:29:31 PM

Fail in Human Form: Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.


My rates stayed the same this year because Obamacare capped the amount of profit that my insurance company was allowed to take from my premium.
The rebate from last year was applied to my account this year.

First time my rates haven't increased in decades.
 
2013-03-10 03:29:47 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?


The exchanges are only one factor in the law, so please stop sounding like an idiot, there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.  Will that be better or worse than it is now?
 
2013-03-10 03:30:06 PM

meat0918: Remember folks, $600 billion per year to enable us to blow up sand into more sand and does nothing back home except give us wounded vets to take care of(which the GOP doesn't seem to care about either) and line the pockets of defense contractors is a good use of tax dollars, but $100 billion per year to take care of Americans is the worst socialism to ever socialize.


If history is any guide, it works like this:
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"I sacrificed for this country, send more guys to finish what I couldn't, ooo-rah, Merica!", then the GOP loves him.
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"So, uh, losing my legs here wasn't part of the deal...I got medical insurance for this shiat, right?  And college assistance so I can learn a desk job?", then the GOP could give a fark less.
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"Okay, that sucked and there's no good reason to send more American boys into that suck.  I am now against war, in fact I'm turning Democrat.", then not only does the GOP not care, they'll go out of their way to trivialize it and make up outright slander about it.
 
2013-03-10 03:30:23 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.
 
2013-03-10 03:30:25 PM
I love the right wing dipsh*t brigade who had it their way for 20 years on health care, and health care costs have only gone up since the 1990s. Meanwhile insurance company profits are through the roof.

So finally enough said enough and we get a smidgen of reform. No single payer option, no canadian-style.. but at least we got something.

Now you effing asswits who screamed against doing any reform, despite things having sucked for 20 years, are back in force saying zomg o noes everything is going to hell and its all OBAMA's FAULT.

Its like the war debt. None of it mattered to the blithering right wing idiot class until 1-20-2009. Then suddenly zomg debt debt debt libs libs libs.

Like your causing the Iraq war had nothing to do with it, like the Bush Tax Cuts had nothing to do with it.

Seriously, right wingers, you're the reason America's broke and you're the reason health care reform was barely implemented after a year of screaming by your side. Nobody wants your side in power, yet you keep screaming. The few of you thats left.
 
2013-03-10 03:31:53 PM

amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.


Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.
 
2013-03-10 03:32:25 PM

Soup4Bonnie: Yes, spend the thread discussing how awful Obamacare is with an obvious idiot rather than look at the steaming pile of shiat Ryan is again trying to warm up and serve to seniors.

Bueno.


Odds are this was the actual goal of the post.
 
2013-03-10 03:33:14 PM

Fail in Human Form: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?

My premiums didn't go up every year, it was closer to every other.  They have since doubled, and I'm a single man in good health.  As for the rest, go fark yourself with a rusty fork.  I said the status quo was bad.


Biatching about the failure of Obamacare when it's still in early implementation is like going to a birthday dinner and insisting that you want cake while everyone else is working on their salad.
 
2013-03-10 03:34:06 PM
I assure you that i am not a conservative, but i will henceforth proceed to spew every conservative talking point as if my brain was hard wired to fox and friends.  You must believe that i am in no way a conservative though, my word is my bond.
 
2013-03-10 03:34:10 PM

Fail in Human Form: Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.


So, again, wait until the exchanges go in.

Also, Ohio must suck. I pay $44 a month for myself.
 
2013-03-10 03:34:36 PM

NeverDrunk23: Soup4Bonnie: Yes, spend the thread discussing how awful Obamacare is with an obvious idiot rather than look at the steaming pile of shiat Ryan is again trying to warm up and serve to seniors.

Bueno.

Odds are this was the actual goal of the post.


Well this thread does prove one thing: The Republicans are not changing their tactics.
 
2013-03-10 03:37:25 PM

ilambiquated: NeverDrunk23: Soup4Bonnie: Yes, spend the thread discussing how awful Obamacare is with an obvious idiot rather than look at the steaming pile of shiat Ryan is again trying to warm up and serve to seniors.

Bueno.

Odds are this was the actual goal of the post.

Well this thread does prove one thing: The Republicans are not changing their tactics.


They have "governed" in 2013 as if it was 2010. And it'll lose them 2014-2022 at least.
 
2013-03-10 03:37:54 PM

nmrsnr: Again? Hasn't the House already repealed it like 5 times? Let it go man, it's gone.


I think the difference this time is the Obamacare-Benghazi Connection which all the all of the GOP politicians' constituents are asking them about whenever they go and whenever they see one but cannot name for a never ending string of reasons.

Or something like that.

One thing is for certain, the Republiturds are very concerned.

i.imgur.com
 
2013-03-10 03:38:02 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

So, again, wait until the exchanges go in.

Also, Ohio must suck. I pay $44 a month for myself.


Honestly, I don't see it improving much with the exchanges but I hope I'm proved wrong.  I understand it has helped some people but here's my question.  When you look at it from my perspective (and those I know personally), and very tight budget, how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit?  I don't say that as an evil "screw'em all" conservative.  I'm honestly asking.
 
2013-03-10 03:38:37 PM
Fail in Human Form:
there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.

And why is this, again?
 
2013-03-10 03:38:41 PM

Soup4Bonnie: WALLACE: Are you saying that as part of your budget you would repeal - you assume the repeal of Obamacare?

RYAN: Yes.

WALLACE:  Well that's not going to happen.


When even Fox News doesn't swallow your load, you have a losing hand.


Step 4: magic happens.
 
2013-03-10 03:38:49 PM
The GOP continues to prove that they don't really care about the budget, and Obama continues to treat them as if they do.
 
2013-03-10 03:38:52 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: And still waiting on t hose JOBS we were promised by the GOP back in 2010


We did get hosed by the GOP back in 2010. Where have you been?
 
2013-03-10 03:39:54 PM

Ishidan: Fail in Human Form:
there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.

And why is this, again?


The Republicans.  I'm not arguing who farked up the bill, I'm looking at the bill AS IT IS, from my perspective.
 
2013-03-10 03:40:06 PM

Fail in Human Form: how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit?


Answer: "Look to the Bible".
 
2013-03-10 03:40:19 PM
Once again, I find it absolutely hilarious that Paul Ryan is considered to be a Republican policy wonk, an intellectual heavy lifter.
 
2013-03-10 03:40:44 PM
Anyway, let's talk about how Fartfartacare, while nowhere near what is needed and must inevitably happen (single-payer or socialized healthcare), is incontrovertibly an improvement - terrible anecdotes aside - over the status quo ante and the brainchild of the Heritage Foundation and the Republicans. If they had half a farking brain between them they'd be taking credit for it. God knows their single-digit IQ voting base will just shift gears to supporting it like they always do. Instead, they do this, to which I can only say, "Please proceed, Congressman."
 
2013-03-10 03:41:54 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?


Numbers are hard.
 
2013-03-10 03:43:09 PM

LouDobbsAwaaaay: The GOP continues to prove that they don't really care about the budget, and Obama continues to treat them as if they do.


4 more years...of budget by 'continuing resolution'
 
2013-03-10 03:43:12 PM
If the American people wanted Obamacare repealed, Paul Ryan would be vice president right now, instead of drafting pointless legislation.
 
2013-03-10 03:43:47 PM
But is Ryan serious about these ideas, or are they gimmicks? Liberals tend to view Medicaid block grants as a fig leaf for the gutting of the Medicaid program. And as Ryan has proposed them, they're right -- He would grow the block grants so slowly that they would amount to an $800 billion cut in the Medicaid program over 10 years, over and above a repeal of the Medicaid expansion in the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.
 
2013-03-10 03:44:40 PM
amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.


Evidently you are doing something horribly wrong. Might I suggest reexamining your current options and making some changes to your Health Insurance. Obamacare seems to be working out pretty well for most people effected by it. You seem to be on the far end of that bell curve and so are going to have to devote some time to changing that. Try going over your Health Insurance payments line by line, you may be paying for things you don't really need. Also shop around for other Health Insurance providers in your area, you might find a better deal.
 
2013-03-10 03:45:15 PM

Fail in Human Form: Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?

The exchanges are only one factor in the law, so please stop sounding like an idiot, there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.  Will that be better or worse than it is now?


So what part of the currently enacted law has caused your rates to increase? Go ahead, I'll wait.
 
2013-03-10 03:46:20 PM

Fail in Human Form: Ishidan: Fail in Human Form:
there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.

And why is this, again?

The Republicans.  I'm not arguing who farked up the bill, I'm looking at the bill AS IT IS, from my perspective.


Then you should be a) supporting further changes to the health care system, and b) organizing your workplace and working with your friends to organize theirs. Drastic cuts in hours and benefits is and has been the norm for years and is neither caused by nor particularly exacerbated, writ large, by the ACA. The only way to fight back against that, realistically, is to fight yourself instead of asking Washington to do it for you; even if single-payer healthcare were passed, you don't think there would be more of this same crap from some other direction that the capitalists blamed on SOCIALISM!!!!! and laughed while they pocketed the difference? Because that's what's happening now..
 
2013-03-10 03:46:21 PM

Brass_Robo: amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

Evidently you are doing something horribly wrong. Might I suggest reexamining your current options and making some changes to your Health Insurance. Obamacare seems to be working out pretty well for most people effected by it. You seem to be on the far end of that bell curve and so are going to have to devote some time to changing that. Try going over your Health Insurance payments line by line, you may be paying for things you don't really need. Also shop around for other Health Insurance providers in your area, you might find a better deal.


I'm with a local HMO.  My other option is BC/BS (given who has deals with the local hospitals) with far less coverage and only marginally better prices.
 
2013-03-10 03:47:00 PM

Evil High Priest: Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?

Numbers are hard.


Oooo you mean you have numbers and proof? I'll wait for you to provide it. But just like the other guy I can bet my house on the fact that you won't.
 
2013-03-10 03:47:07 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?

The exchanges are only one factor in the law, so please stop sounding like an idiot, there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.  Will that be better or worse than it is now?

So what part of the currently enacted law has caused your rates to increase? Go ahead, I'll wait.


Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.
 
2013-03-10 03:49:23 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Premiums and co-pays are higher, and people working part-time don't have health insurance; and the Obamacare exchanges haven't been implemented yet.
So worst case for Obamacare is that everything is going along the exact same trend it was before, no?
 
2013-03-10 03:49:30 PM

Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.


Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?
 
2013-03-10 03:49:32 PM
Why Republicans follow Satan and not Jesus:

Matthew 25:34-36

Then the king will say to those at his right hand, "Come, you that are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; for I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, I was naked and you gave me clothing, I was sick and you took care of me, I was in prison and you visited me."
 
2013-03-10 03:49:39 PM
LibertyHiller:
Biatching about the failure of Obamacare when it's still in early implementation is like going to a birthday dinner and insisting that you want cake while everyone else is working on their salad.

At this point, more like seeing the baker come in the door with the cake and trying to punch him in the face for daring to bake a chocolate cake when everybody knows you prefer coconut.  Then when he reminds you that you're not the birthday boy and so don't get to to decide the cake flavor, you kick him in the crotch and demand a strawberry cake.  The baker successfully gets the cake to the table, which you then attempt to flip while screaming that you have the freedom of speech to demand vanilla cake, goddamnit!  Look, what can't you understand about the fact that last year's pineapple upsidedown cake was perfectly fine and there's no reason to change it?  The people want dobash, you tyrant!  THE CAKE IS A LIE!
 
2013-03-10 03:49:41 PM
That poor chicken.
cdn.shopify.com
 
2013-03-10 03:49:57 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: Ishidan: Fail in Human Form:
there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.

And why is this, again?

The Republicans.  I'm not arguing who farked up the bill, I'm looking at the bill AS IT IS, from my perspective.

Then you should be a) supporting further changes to the health care system, and b) organizing your workplace and working with your friends to organize theirs. Drastic cuts in hours and benefits is and has been the norm for years and is neither caused by nor particularly exacerbated, writ large, by the ACA. The only way to fight back against that, realistically, is to fight yourself instead of asking Washington to do it for you; even if single-payer healthcare were passed, you don't think there would be more of this same crap from some other direction that the capitalists blamed on SOCIALISM!!!!! and laughed while they pocketed the difference? Because that's what's happening now..


a) I do
b) We get told what are options are (mention the U word and you're out the door)
c) I consider myself liberal but not "progressive" as the current D's policy is called.  Myself?  I'm a man without a part and I say a pox on both their houses.  I don't like having to picking which sets of my rights I want to support based on two parties beholden to the banks.
 
2013-03-10 03:50:49 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?


I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.
 
2013-03-10 03:51:50 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.


So, really what you're saying is that the insurance company lies to you by saying that Obamacare forced them to raise their rates and you believe them for no apparent reason
 
2013-03-10 03:52:36 PM

GAT_00: nmrsnr: Again? Hasn't the House already repealed it like 5 times? Let it go man, it's gone.

They tried 33 times or something like that last session.  And the first bill of this Congress was to repeal Obamacare.


The GOP is coming close to Jodi Arias. Stab. Stab. Stab. Stab. Stab. Stab. etc.
 
2013-03-10 03:52:43 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.

So, really what you're saying is that the insurance company lies to you by saying that Obamacare forced them to raise their rates and you believe them for no apparent reason


I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?
 
2013-03-10 03:53:12 PM

Fail in Human Form: Brass_Robo: amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

Evidently you are doing something horribly wrong. Might I suggest reexamining your current options and making some changes to your Health Insurance. Obamacare seems to be working out pretty well for most people effected by it. You seem to be on the far end of that bell curve and so are going to have to devote some time to changing that. Try going over your Health Insurance payments line by line, you may be paying for things you don't really need. Also shop around for other Health Insurance providers in your area, you might find a better deal.

I'm with a local HMO.  My other option is BC/BS (given who has deals with the local hospitals) with far less coverage and only marginally better prices.


I have a question:  Why are you convinced that Obamacare is why your rates have increased?  Did you get a letter from your insurance provider saying, "We're raising your rates because OBAMACARE!!!", or are you just making assumptions based on the idea that the increases happened after portions of the ACA were implemented, therefore any increase is a direct result of those portions of the ACA?
 
2013-03-10 03:53:54 PM

Fail in Human Form: I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?


A letter lying to you is not "data," it's lying.
 
2013-03-10 03:54:25 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.


You do know that they can, and will, lie to you, right?
 
2013-03-10 03:54:46 PM

Fail in Human Form: How do you base yours?


I develop mine from the personal experiences of random strangers on the internet without question.
 
2013-03-10 03:55:35 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?

A letter lying to you is not "data," it's lying.


Well I have to go by what I have.  As for the reduction of hours of part time employees I mentioned in my Boobies.  That was stated by our company.  They cut their hours to avoid giving them benefits.
 
2013-03-10 03:56:09 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?

A letter lying to you is not "data," it's lying.

Well I have to go by what I have.  As for the reduction of hours of part time employees I mentioned in my Boobies.  That was stated by our company.  They cut their hours to avoid giving them benefits.


And it's Obamacare's fault that you work for a sh*tty company?
 
2013-03-10 03:56:39 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.   Not a detailed list of why.


So, if they didn't tell you why they changed your rates, why did you assume it was due to the partial implementation of Obamacare?  I mean, you do understand that cause and effect are a wee bit more complex than Aristotle suggested?
 
2013-03-10 03:56:54 PM

Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: Ishidan: Fail in Human Form:
there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.

And why is this, again?

The Republicans.  I'm not arguing who farked up the bill, I'm looking at the bill AS IT IS, from my perspective.

Then you should be a) supporting further changes to the health care system, and b) organizing your workplace and working with your friends to organize theirs. Drastic cuts in hours and benefits is and has been the norm for years and is neither caused by nor particularly exacerbated, writ large, by the ACA. The only way to fight back against that, realistically, is to fight yourself instead of asking Washington to do it for you; even if single-payer healthcare were passed, you don't think there would be more of this same crap from some other direction that the capitalists blamed on SOCIALISM!!!!! and laughed while they pocketed the difference? Because that's what's happening now..

a) I do
b) We get told what are options are (mention the U word and you're out the door)
c) I consider myself liberal but not "progressive" as the current D's policy is called.  Myself?  I'm a man without a part and I say a pox on both their houses.  I don't like having to picking which sets of my rights I want to support based on two parties beholden to the banks.


Talk to your co-workers outside of work about organization. You do realize that it is illegal for employers to fire people or threaten their jobs for trying to organize, right? If that is really a thing and not just a scary story the company has convinced you to tell each other you have a strong basis for an unfair labor practices suit.

As for me, I am an anarchist and I don't support either - or any - political party, but I can objectively look at policies to determine better/worse based on facts and data instead of campfire stories or scaremongering from people who have a financial interest in keeping me scared. If you dislike both parties, then that's all the more reason to organize and get some actual self-determination.
 
2013-03-10 03:57:03 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.

So, really what you're saying is that the insurance company lies to you by saying that Obamacare forced them to raise their rates and you believe them for no apparent reason

I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?


It really sounds like you've got the shiattiest HMO ever. Or you fail at reading comprehension.
Perhaps you could scan and post the letter in this thread?
You know, the one in which they explain they raised your rates because of Obamacare.
 
2013-03-10 03:57:55 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?

A letter lying to you is not "data," it's lying.

Well I have to go by what I have.  As for the reduction of hours of part time employees I mentioned in my Boobies.  That was stated by our company.  They cut their hours to avoid giving them benefits.


Which again, is the exact same thing companies have been doing to part-time workers for decades.
 
2013-03-10 03:58:27 PM
Fail in HumanForm Honestly, I don't see it improving much with the exchanges but I hope I'm proved wrong. I understand it has helped some people but here's my question. When you look at it from my perspective (and those I know personally), and very tight budget, how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit? I don't say that as an evil "screw'em all" conservative. I'm honestly asking.

You do understand, don't you, that the Reagan Signed EMTAL of `86 (emergency room must treat regardless of ability to pay) has been adding ~$1000, for a family of 4, through increased private insurance premiums (somebody had to eat the cost of the most poorly implemented `socialized' medicine program EVER - really screwed with availability of treatment options for even the paying customer - close down the ER's!).

Single payer is the only way I see to actually start to decrease (not just decrease increases), over the long term, of the enormous long term debt that is medicare. AFCA is near-beer and still doesn't require the restructuring of Medicare part D (unfunded mandate that is estimated to, over 75 yr., add more to debt (17 trillion) than is currently owed to the unfunded portion of SS (14 trillion). Drug companies will have to wait for some more forceful President to bring them into a generic universe.

AFCA is better than nothing and possibly a first step in getting the farking health care spending in line with our major, industrialized, trading partners (where we really take the hit).
 
2013-03-10 03:59:22 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Paid shill's gonna shill.
 
2013-03-10 04:00:13 PM

Via Infinito: Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.

So, really what you're saying is that the insurance company lies to you by saying that Obamacare forced them to raise their rates and you believe them for no apparent reason

I'm basing my opinion on the data provided to me.  How do you base yours?

It really sounds like you've got the shiattiest HMO ever. Or you fail at reading comprehension.
Perhaps you could scan and post the letter in this thread?
You know, the one in which they explain they raised your rates because of Obamacare.


I no longer have the letter and they didn't call it "Obamacare" they called it the Affordable Care Act.
 
2013-03-10 04:00:29 PM
Ryan said his budget, like his plan last year, would propose giving new Medicare beneficiaries, now younger than age 55, the option of purchasing private insurance with a government subsidy instead of the traditional Medicare plan.

Vouchers. Again.
 
2013-03-10 04:00:52 PM
Seriously?  They really are committed to abandoning all pretense of progress, aren't they.
 
2013-03-10 04:02:02 PM
Well Obamacare has worked great for me. I'm on the pre-existing condition plan. My premiums went up (from 0 to $296 a month) but overall my medical costs are down because, you know, I actually have insurance now.

I actually was diagnosed when I was on my school's insurance plan. I paid $200 a month at that time (2008-10) and it only covered $1000 worth of prescription costs for the year. (My prescription at the time cost $1500 a month) The plan I'm on now covers all prescription costs above the deductible with just a $30 copay.
It's funny how superior Obamacare is to private insurance.
 
2013-03-10 04:02:45 PM

Soup4Bonnie: Ryan said his budget, like his plan last year, would propose giving new Medicare beneficiaries, now younger than age 55, the option of purchasing private insurance with a government subsidy instead of the traditional Medicare plan.

Vouchers. Again.


More vouchers and another attempt at repealing PPACA.
Maybe we'll get lucky and the republicans will hold their breath long enough that their voters start to turn blue.
 
2013-03-10 04:03:32 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.

You do know that they can, and will, lie to you, right?


Sounds like the good news is they'll be sending him a check for all that money they overcharged him.

Thanks, 2bama.
 
2013-03-10 04:04:28 PM
Sorry, ACA.

/acronymanical
 
2013-03-10 04:04:42 PM

JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.


Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.
 
2013-03-10 04:06:47 PM

Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.


Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.
 
2013-03-10 04:07:27 PM
Crazy Lee:
You do understand, don't you, that the Reagan Signed EMTAL of `86 (emergency room must treat regardless of ability to pay) has been adding ~$1000, for a family of 4, through increased private insurance premiums (somebody had to eat the cost of the most poorly implemented `socialized' medicine program EVER -

Oh oh, you must have missed the recent comedy wherein a prominent Republican outright said things along the lines of,  "We don't have a setting across this country where if you don't have insurance, we just say to you, 'Tough luck, you're going to die when you have your heart attack,"  No, you go to the hospital, you get treated, you get care, and it's paid for, either by charity, the government or by the hospital."

Thus meaning that the poor can either be charity cases, have their tabs picked up by the government (but ONLY for emergency rescue, no mention of preventative care or care for injuries that are crippling but not immediately life-threatening, so it's not socialism then, you see), or make private companies eat the cost whether they want to or not.

Which one?  Uh...Mitt Romney.  http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/10/11/1143096/-Romney-reiterates-c l aim-that-ER-is-health-care
 
2013-03-10 04:08:31 PM
The GoP sure is LASER FOCUSED on Job.
 
2013-03-10 04:08:47 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: So what part of the currently enacted law has caused your rates to increase? Go ahead, I'll wait.


Not taking Fail's side of the argument.  But I'd what to go with

"What was enabled by exempting Insurance companies from anti-trust restrictions?. Alex"


/always one of the stupider concessions made during the 'sausage making' process
 
2013-03-10 04:09:34 PM

Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.

Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.


You're not expressing your concerns. You're towing your insurance company's line.
 
2013-03-10 04:10:06 PM
KFTC.
 
2013-03-10 04:11:20 PM
Fail in Human Form:
I no longer have the letter and they didn't call it "Obamacare" they called it the Affordable Care Act.

Of  course they did.  The Affordable Care Act is its official name.  "Obamacare" is what Republicans call it so they can oppose it with a straight face.  Remember, if there's one thing that politicians are good at, it's naming their bills something that sounds good on the surface.
 
2013-03-10 04:14:20 PM

LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?



You are wrong..again.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/02/12/1186608/-Virginia-cuts-part -t ime-state-workers-hours-in-response-to-Obamacare
 
2013-03-10 04:14:53 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.

Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.

You're not expressing your concerns. You're towing your insurance company's line.


My concern is that me and the people I know, who are hardly wealthy, are taking a hit.  Is the HMO full of shiat?  Absolutely could be, but it is what it is and I'm going by the information provided.
 
2013-03-10 04:16:53 PM

Ishidan: Fail in Human Form:
I no longer have the letter and they didn't call it "Obamacare" they called it the Affordable Care Act.

Of  course they did.  The Affordable Care Act is its official name.  "Obamacare" is what Republicans call it so they can oppose it with a straight face.  Remember, if there's one thing that politicians are good at, it's naming their bills something that sounds good on the surface.


And in ten years when everyone sees that it's an improvement they'll attempt to go back to calling it the Affordable Care Act.  Because otherwise they'd be pushing for a voucher system to replace Johnsoncare and privatization of Roosevelt Security.
 
2013-03-10 04:18:56 PM

Fail in Human Form: I no longer have the letter


Right. Could that be because the letter never actually existed and you're a remorseless AW?
 
2013-03-10 04:20:05 PM

Fail in Human Form: I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.


You also have a letter from a Nigerian prince in your e-mail.  He doesn't detail a list of why he's going to give you eleventy billion dollars.
 
2013-03-10 04:20:47 PM

Via Infinito: Fail in Human Form: I no longer have the letter

Right. Could that be because the letter never actually existed and you're a remorseless AW?


Do you save every scrap of mail you get?  Ah forget it, believe whatever you want.
 
2013-03-10 04:21:13 PM

Generation_D: Republican politicians, screwing up America since 1994 1972.


FTFY
 
2013-03-10 04:21:24 PM

LessO2: Fail in Human Form: I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.

You also have a letter from a Nigerian prince in your e-mail.  He doesn't detail a list of why he's going to give you eleventy billion dollars.


The Nigerian isn't someone I have a business relationship with.
 
2013-03-10 04:21:44 PM

Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.

Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.


It's possible you're every bit as stupid as you appear to be, but I prefer to believe that someone's paying you.  Welcome to my ignore list.
 
2013-03-10 04:22:34 PM

Nemo's Brother: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?


You are wrong..again.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/02/12/1186608/-Virginia-cuts-part -t ime-state-workers-hours-in-response-to-Obamacare


A republican governor cuts part-time state employees hours and blames it on Obamacare.  Have you considered the possibilities that he either didn't have to do that and just wanted something to bash Barack with, or that he's just trying to privatize some of their functions?

Much like Fail's insurance company, saying Obamacare made you do something don't necessarily make it so.
 
2013-03-10 04:23:45 PM
I like Paul Ryan. He is the real deal GOP. God bless the second amendment. Paul Ryan is interested in health care. I have seen internet pictures of Mr. Ryan lifting weights. Mr. Ryan smiles.

I have seen internet pictures of Mr. Ryan being sodomized. Mr. Ryan smiles a lot.

Apparently, Republican men smile when they receive anal sex. God bless.
 
2013-03-10 04:24:04 PM

JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.

Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.

It's possible you're every bit as stupid as you appear to be, but I prefer to believe that someone's paying you.  Welcome to my ignore list.


Is there someplace I can apply for this "shill" job I keep hearing about?  I could use the extra money.
 
2013-03-10 04:24:15 PM

Fail in Human Form: The Nigerian isn't someone I have a business relationship with.


And there is nothing preventing you from terminating your business relationship.
 
2013-03-10 04:25:33 PM

LessO2: Fail in Human Form: The Nigerian isn't someone I have a business relationship with.

And there is nothing preventing you from terminating your business relationship.


Not having insurance and/or having to pay a fine?
 
2013-03-10 04:28:11 PM

Fail in Human Form: LessO2: Fail in Human Form: The Nigerian isn't someone I have a business relationship with.

And there is nothing preventing you from terminating your business relationship.

Not having insurance and/or having to pay a fine?


You only have one option for insurance? That's terrible. Perhaps you should look into the exchanges.
 
2013-03-10 04:29:02 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Yeah it was soo much better when people with pre-existing illness couldn't buy insurance at any price.

You friends who work part-time will now qualify for Medicaid unless their State's Governor is one of the few jack-holes who prefer to side with the Tea-Party than the American public (also assuming they are not very wealthy part-timers).

The best part about "Obama Care" is that is it moving us closer to single payer.  Lots of hurdles to overcome, but it's a start.
 
2013-03-10 04:29:09 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: LessO2: Fail in Human Form: The Nigerian isn't someone I have a business relationship with.

And there is nothing preventing you from terminating your business relationship.

Not having insurance and/or having to pay a fine?

You only have one option for insurance? That's terrible. Perhaps you should look into the exchanges.


Two if I go through the company, as I explained earlier.  Not sure what's going to happen with the exchanges.
 
2013-03-10 04:29:36 PM
Obamacare made me fart in the elevator. Damn you Obama!!!!!
 
2013-03-10 04:31:26 PM

Fail in Human Form: amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.


He's got more state participation (Medicaid) than you do.
 
2013-03-10 04:32:34 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.  The HMO doesn't send me a letter explaining every detail of their business amazingly.

Well then how do you know they increased their rates because of the new law?

I got a letter saying so and a letter explaining the percent paid on premiums requirement.  Not a detailed list of why.


You're serious? Really? You got a letter explaining why your premiums went up from the HMO, and you believed them?

OK then.

Here's one plausible explanation. The accountants with your HMO did some calculations based on the profit limit in the affordable health care act, played with some costs, and then figured out the maximum you could be charged.

They then charge it.

Of course, rather than writing into their letter that they're all greedy SOBs, they'll just write and say - because ObummerCare.

Depending on where you live in Ohio, that will certainly deflect the blame and rile up the base for those pesky midterm elections.

And if you look at it from their slanted point of view, yes the affordable health care act caused your premiums to be raised. They saw a way to make more money in a constrained market (it's them or BC/BS), stay within the guidelines, and blame it on someone else.

Perfect.

/ I didn't laugh, honest I didn't
// You'll just have to believe me
 
2013-03-10 04:34:49 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Boo hoo.  If you have to pay more in premiums or co-pays so that two other Americans can have health insurance and not die of disease because they can't pay, I'm okay with that.  If a little discomfort for you saves someone else's life, I'm okay with that. You were not the target population for Obamacare.  It's not just about you.  Biatching about what you have to give up so that others can have something they need is Republicanism 101.

The horrors of the healthcare system prior to Obamacare were very, very real, even if they didn't effect you.  Having your insurance cancel you when you get sick.  Not being able to even get insurance because you had asthma as a child (pre-existing).  Services being denied and people literally left to die.   You may have had it great with your health insurance before Obamacare, but other people are dead because of it.  Again, it's not just about you.

My premiums didn't go up.  Doesn't sound like anyone else's did here either.
 
2013-03-10 04:36:30 PM

Nemo's Brother: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?


You are wrong..again.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/02/12/1186608/-Virginia-cuts-part -t ime-state-workers-hours-in-response-to-Obamacare


No way that Governor Bob Mcdonnell, the chairman of the Republican Governors Association, could be using this as a political stunt, right?

Jesus you are thick.
 
2013-03-10 04:36:40 PM
Paul Ryan, Chairman of the House Budget Committee attempts repealing Obamacare again?

37th time the charm or something?

They know it's a non starter so why start with it?

Oh right, so nothing can start or get done and they can try to blame it all on the blah guy.

Obamacare isn't perfect but it's a foot in the door towards proper universal healthcare where a lot of the profit motive is taken out of the picture.

And argue cat sez...

i1.kym-cdn.com

/obligz,, hot, all that.
 
2013-03-10 04:37:02 PM
Can you imagine if Paul Ryan WERE Vice President?

We dodged a bullet there...
 
2013-03-10 04:37:46 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.

Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.

You're not expressing your concerns. You're towing your insurance company's line.

My concern is that me and the people I know, who are hardly wealthy, are taking a hit.  Is the HMO full of shiat?  Absolutely could be, but it is what it is and I'm going by the information provided.


You need different sources of information then, it appears that you are just repeating what someone who watches fox news tells you.
 
2013-03-10 04:38:44 PM

Fail in Human Form: Not having insurance and/or having to pay a fine?


Last I checked, there's more than your insurance company.

Yay free market, huh?
 
2013-03-10 04:39:11 PM
Obviously, healthcare reform (AKA Obamacare) isn't going anywhere soon.  But by calling for the repeal of Obamacare, the Republicans can then claim that allowing it to continue is their "compromise".
 
2013-03-10 04:39:59 PM

Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.

1. All I've seen are premiums go up,


You're sure you no longer have a copy of that letter from your HMO? You might want to ask them to
email you a pdf copy so you can check the date and info provided.

http://www.healthcare.gov/law/features/costs/rate-review/index.html
Rate ReviewThe Affordable Care Act creates a Rate Review program in your state to help protect individuals and small businesses from unreasonable health insurance rate increases. Starting on September 1, 2011, health insurers must justify any rate increase of 10% or more before the increase takes effect.

Your insurance company can't raise rates by 10% or more without first explaining its reasons to your state or federal Rate Review program. All explanations will be posted on HealthCare.gov and your Rate Review program will give you a chance to comment on them.

2.  my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care,

www.healthcare.gov/news/brochures/info-for-small-businesses.pdf

page 12:
You may be eligible for tax credits to help you pay for your employees' insurance.
The credits are as large as 35% today and rise to 50% in 2014.
You might qualify if you:
1) have low-wage workers,
2) pay at least 50% of the premium cost, and
3) have up to 25 full-time equivalent employees.
You can get more information on this at the IRS website: www.irs.gov/sbhtc.
(Beginning in 2014, you will need to buy your company's coverage through the
Affordable Insurance Exchange in your State to get the tax credit.)

see also http://www.dol.gov/ebsa/newsroom/tr12-01.html

Forcing employees to a part time schedule may not work out if the employer loses productive
work from that employee, but still ends up averaging over 30 hours per week for 3-6 months
of reporting.  Or has them in part time service consistently for more that 750 hours (9 months).

3.  the co-pay on everything double

See the answer on point 1 - they can't change rates more than 10% without documented justification.

, and impending fines.

 What fines are you referring to?

Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.

OK.
 
2013-03-10 04:43:26 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Wait, so your company decided to cut hours in order to save money and that's Obamacare's fault?  What are you, 5?  "If you hadn't put the cookie jar where I could reach it, I wouldn't have snuck some cookies before dinner.  It's YOUR fault I ate those cookies!"
 
2013-03-10 04:43:54 PM

Nemo's Brother: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?


You are wrong..again.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/02/12/1186608/-Virginia-cuts-part -t ime-state-workers-hours-in-response-to-Obamacare


What was wrong?  He said "few" substantiated cases, not "none".  Besides, in Virginia, full-time is considered 32 or more hours, so a cut to 29 hours is at most a 2-hour per week cut. Not really the "severe reduction" to which he was responding.
 
2013-03-10 04:45:22 PM

Seequinn: Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.

1. All I've seen are premiums go up,

You're sure you no longer have a copy of that letter from your HMO? You might want to ask them to
email you a pdf copy so you can check the date and info provided.

http://www.healthcare.gov/law/features/costs/rate-review/index.html
Rate ReviewThe Affordable Care Act creates a Rate Review program in your state to help protect individuals and small businesses from unreasonable health insurance rate increases. Starting on September 1, 2011, health insurers must justify any rate increase of 10% or more before the increase takes effect.

Your insurance company can't raise rates by 10% or more without first explaining its reasons to your state or federal Rate Review program. All explanations will be posted on HealthCare.gov and your Rate Review program will give you a chance to comment on them.

2.  my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care,

www.healthcare.gov/news/brochures/info-for-small-businesses.pdf

page 12:
You may be eligible for tax credits to help you pay for your employees' insurance.
The credits are as large as 35% today and rise to 50% in 2014.
You might qualify if you:
1) have low-wage workers,
2) pay at least 50% of the premium cost, and
3) have up to 25 full-time equivalent employees.
You can get more information on this at the IRS website: www.irs.gov/sbhtc.
(Beginning in 2014, you will need to buy your company's coverage through the
Affordable Insurance Exchange in your State to get the tax credit.)

see also http://www.dol.gov/ebsa/newsroom/tr12-01.html

Forcing employees to a part time schedule may not work out if the employer loses productive
work from that employee, but still ends up averaging over 30 hours per week for 3-6 months
of reporting.  Or has them in part time service consistently for more that 750 hours ...


As I understand the part time thing you can either do the measurement monthly or annually.  We cut the part timers down to 25 hours/week.
The fines are the ones imposed for not having insurance which I believe goes into effect in '14
Heading off to check that website you listed now.
 
2013-03-10 04:50:45 PM
Oh so they're trying to do something that would be of great benefit to the country. That's good to know.
 
2013-03-10 04:53:30 PM
A "House Republican" is like the "house wine" - sure, it's wine, but it's cheap, easily had, and leaves a bad aftertaste.
 
2013-03-10 04:54:43 PM
According to that website here was the reason for the increase (although it says some people only got about an 11% increase based off of yadda yadda)

Type of Cost:Per Member Increase
Per Month IncreasePortion of Increase
Medical Services* - Cost of providing healthcare
services to policyholders$30.9688.03%
Administrative Expenses - Marketing, claims
processing, and other costs to the
company$3.509.95%Underwriting Gain/Loss - Amount the company keeps
after paying claims and administrative expenses$0.712.02%
 
2013-03-10 04:54:43 PM

Soup4Bonnie: spend the thread discussing how awful Obamacare is with an obvious idiot rather than look at the steaming pile of shiat Ryan is again trying to warm up and serve to seniors.


Since they've already tried like 50 brazillion times to repeal it and lost seats in the ensuing election, I don't see why looking at Ryan's poop would be more illuminating that sharing stories about how our actual situations have gotten better. Mine has as well.
 
2013-03-10 04:55:17 PM

randomjsa: Oh so they're trying to do something that would be of great benefit to the country. That's good to know.


Yup, just like Sisyphus was doing work of great benefit.
 
2013-03-10 04:55:36 PM

cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that the re-elected the guy who signed it.


that's basically what Chris Wallace said to Ryan. I haven't seen Wallace stop a guest so often to dispute them in some time.* Wallace was all over Ryan about the medicare vouchers. politely but firmly.

*not that i watch a lot of fox news sunday.
 
2013-03-10 04:56:37 PM

Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Your name is accurate.

Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.


Yeah none of those things have happened to you or anyone you know. You are a lying sack of shiat, begone from this place and bother decent folks no more.
 
2013-03-10 04:57:29 PM

Fail in Human Form: According to that website here was the reason for the increase (although it says some people only got about an 11% increase based off of yadda yadda)

Type of Cost:Per Member Increase
Per Month IncreasePortion of Increase
Medical Services* - Cost of providing healthcare
services to policyholders$30.9688.03%
Administrative Expenses - Marketing, claims
processing, and other costs to the
company$3.509.95%Underwriting Gain/Loss - Amount the company keeps
after paying claims and administrative expenses$0.712.02%



OK, now here's the real test.  Read through that a few times and tell us what's missing.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Answer: It's any mention whatsoever of the ACA.
 
2013-03-10 04:58:28 PM

gaspode: Fail in Human Form: A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Your name is accurate.

Everything I just said is from first hand experience.  Please tell me where I'm wrong.

Yeah none of those things have happened to you or anyone you know. You are a lying sack of shiat, begone from this place and bother decent folks no more.


I don't know, in reading his posts I don't think he is a liar, it sounds like someone he listens to is a derper and he isn't educated enough to know why that person is wrong/lying.
 
2013-03-10 05:03:48 PM

cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that the re-elected the guy who signed it.


Instead of the guy who first implemented it at the state level.
 
2013-03-10 05:04:29 PM

jst3p: No way that Governor Bob Mcdonnell, the chairman of the Republican Governors Association, could be using this as a political stunt, right?


Certainly not the governor who declared Confederate History month! No, surely he wouldn't do anything like that.

/God I cannot wait for him to be out of office.
//I just hope we don't elect Cucinelli in his place....
 
2013-03-10 05:04:54 PM
Intentionally including things they know will tank their bill... how Republican of them.
 
2013-03-10 05:06:01 PM
Fail in Human Form:

.... blah blah blah .....

shill. ignored. (fail in 'bot form, amirite?)
 
2013-03-10 05:09:36 PM

cameroncrazy1984: I pay $44 a month for myself.


must be nice. i have medicare and pay 2+ times that. and no part D. on the upside my 2011 week in the hospital was billed at over $10,000, medicare paid roughly half and my 20% of that was $1000. overall i'm happy. no private insurance i've ever had was any better.
 
2013-03-10 05:10:18 PM

LordOfThePings: cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that the re-elected the guy who signed it.

Instead of the guy who first implemented it at the state level and then spent most of his campaign saying he'd repeal Obamacare as his first act in office.


FTFY

If one of the folks running for HOA president was the first in the neighborhood to get an in-ground pool, but says the first thing they'll do when elected is ban the installation or use of in-ground pools, you don't vote for them if you want to keep your pool.
 
2013-03-10 05:12:23 PM

theorellior: Once again, I find it absolutely hilarious that Paul Ryan is considered to be a Republican policy wonk, an intellectual heavy lifter.


shows how shallow the bench is doesn't it?
 
2013-03-10 05:13:38 PM

randomjsa: Oh so they're trying to do something that would be of great benefit to the country. That's good to know.


How so? You can't explain that.
 
2013-03-10 05:16:29 PM
i28.photobucket.com
 
2013-03-10 05:18:15 PM

Fail in Human Form: Brass_Robo: amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

Evidently you are doing something horribly wrong. Might I suggest reexamining your current options and making some changes to your Health Insurance. Obamacare seems to be working out pretty well for most people effected by it. You seem to be on the far end of that bell curve and so are going to have to devote some time to changing that. Try going over your Health Insurance payments line by line, you may be paying for things you don't really need. Also shop around for other Health Insurance providers in your area, you might find a better deal.

I'm with a local HMO.  My other option is BC/BS (given who has deals with the local hospitals) with far less coverage and only marginally better prices.


It's almost like you want the consumer to dictate to the supplier the price they will pay. Are you some sort of commie?
 
2013-03-10 05:18:27 PM
Premiums were going up before Obama was ever elected. So now people are blaming a rise even before the program is implemented in 2014? Obama truly is a Time Lord.
 
2013-03-10 05:26:39 PM
Do we have the ability to recall some of the members of this Congress?
 
2013-03-10 05:28:40 PM

Somacandra: Since they've already tried like 50 brazillion times to repeal it and lost seats in the ensuing election, I don't see why looking at Ryan's poop would be more illuminating that sharing stories about how our actual situations have gotten better. Mine has as well.


Haha. Fair enough. They are trying a new shade of polish on the turd this go-round, however. Now that Obama has at least a portion of the taxes on the wealthy that he wanted, Ryan can claim to balance the budget in ten years.

"So how can Ryan balance the budget in 10 years without adding major new spending cuts to his budget? Simple. All he needs to do is take advantage of the Congressional Budget Office's new and much-rosier deficit projections and, ironically, the fiscal cliff deal's tax increases."
 
2013-03-10 05:30:22 PM

JohnnyC: Intentionally including things they know will tank their bill... how Republican of them.


Remember the time they had to scramble to vote "no" on their budget proposal because the Democrats voted "present" and the GoP didn't actually want it to pass?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/15/house-democrats-republicans -b udget_n_849715.html
 
2013-03-10 05:31:22 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Those are the death throes of the old way. Obamacare fully ramps up next year. You're talking about a massive change to the healthcare infrastructure. Give it a minute to start firing on all cylinders.
 
2013-03-10 05:32:18 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.



Really?  My premiums have gone down, copays have gone down, coverage has improved, and I've even gotten a rebate the last two years.  My anecdote is better than your anecdote.
 
2013-03-10 05:34:32 PM

Fail in Human Form: According to that website here was the reason for the increase (although it says some people only got about an 11% increase based off of yadda yadda)

Type of Cost:Per Member Increase
Per Month IncreasePortion of Increase
Medical Services* - Cost of providing healthcare
services to policyholders$30.9688.03%
Administrative Expenses - Marketing, claims
processing, and other costs to the
company$3.509.95%Underwriting Gain/Loss - Amount the company keeps
after paying claims and administrative expenses$0.712.02%



You're insurance company is raising premiums because their advertisement costs have gone up.
If they're having trouble marketing not being dead then Obamacare may not be their biggest problem.
 
2013-03-10 05:37:32 PM

Fail in Human Form: Do you save every scrap of mail you get? Ah forget it, believe whatever you want.


from my insurance company, hell yeah. especially if it is spelling out future costs and benefits.
 
2013-03-10 05:40:43 PM

Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Fail in Human Form: Not a clue.


Feel free to repeat this to yourself a few hundred more times in case it hasn't sunk in, this should be your personal mantra.
 
2013-03-10 05:55:03 PM

Fail in Human Form: Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?

The exchanges are only one factor in the law, so please stop sounding like an idiot, there is no "public option" so the exchanges are going to be private companies.  Will that be better or worse than it is now?


As a healthy single male, his rates probably did go up, people. Probably as much as he says. Don't know about the hours for his friends, but i haven't heard of any cases myself.
 
2013-03-10 05:55:45 PM

Fail in Human Form: Is there someplace I can apply for this "shill" job I keep hearing about? I could use the extra money.


With the amount of time you've invested in this thread, if you're not getting paid for it that may be even sadder than if you are.
 
2013-03-10 05:56:37 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

So, again, wait until the exchanges go in.

Also, Ohio must suck. I pay $44 a month for myself.

Honestly, I don't see it improving much with the exchanges but I hope I'm proved wrong.  I understand it has helped some people but here's my question.  When you look at it from my perspective (and those I know personally), and very tight budget, how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit?  I don't say that as an evil "screw'em all" conservative.  I'm honestly asking.


Well, why don't you sit down and figure out what you were paying before every time you had to go to the ER to cover the people who were kicked off any insurance ever because of pre-existing conditions? And then compare it to the projected future rates and your rates now?

Odds are great you aren't, in the long run, sacrificing a damn thing. In fact, you're probably making out like a bandit.

/This is why the 'I can't do the right thing because MONEY!!!111!' argument is usually so stupid. Doing the right thing usually saves you a fark-ton in the long run, so all you've done is make yourself sound like an utter tool.
 
2013-03-10 05:59:36 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: And still waiting on t hose JOBS we were promised by the GOP back in 2010


What? This is a jobs bill. Because tax cuts. Also job creators.
 
2013-03-10 06:03:08 PM
Our insurance is still crap because my husband's employer is a government contractor and was granted a waiver. I don't know how long the waiver can be renewed and find conflicting information about it. My last kid needs to hurry up and get out of diapers so I can start working; with any luck my insurance won't suck as much.
 
2013-03-10 06:09:27 PM

amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Wow, that is definitely better than the 2k or whatever a month some Farkers were lamenting a couple years back. But for reference in the socialist texasshole of Canada, Alberta the basic coverage is zero $. Awhile back it used to be 44$ for a family a month for basic health coverage which for some reason doesn't include dental, drugs or eyewear. That comes from supplemental insurance that came out to 90$ total this year.
/2$ deductible for prescriptions
//had to get several month's worth of Fragmin, 1400$ a month... still 2$
///no one wanted to answer the question "What would happen if I had no drug plan and couldn't afford the drug?"
 
2013-03-10 06:11:12 PM

jst3p: JohnnyC: Intentionally including things they know will tank their bill... how Republican of them.

Remember the time they had to scramble to vote "no" on their budget proposal because the Democrats voted "present" and the GoP didn't actually want it to pass?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/15/house-democrats-republicans -b udget_n_849715.html


Yep, I sure do. Republicans don't govern honestly or with good intention and have no intention of doing so. It's all dog and pony show for those asshats.
 
2013-03-10 06:12:42 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


All your friends work at Papa Johns?
 
2013-03-10 06:18:39 PM

nmemkha: All your friends work at Papa Johns?


also why blame a law for the actions of people trying their hardest to be lousy employers?
 
2013-03-10 06:23:20 PM
Unpopular law remains unpopular.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-healthcare-gua r antee.aspx">http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-he althcare-guar antee.aspx
 
2013-03-10 06:27:03 PM

WhyteRaven74: nmemkha: All your friends work at Papa Johns?

also why blame a law for the actions of people trying their hardest to be lousy employers?


because teleprompter
 
2013-03-10 06:30:51 PM

LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?


It's all your fault you got raped!  Maybe if your skirts weren't so damned tight this would have never happened.

Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.  The older ones will facing retirement will either retire a bit earllier than planned or find a smaller clinic where they can avoid the heavier patient load.  Government regulation is requiring the use of systems like EPIC to maintain patient records in order to receive compensation for their services- the hospitals get to pick up the tab on this one or they won't be compensated for the additional madated patient load.
Good times ahead.
 
2013-03-10 06:39:07 PM

Zeb Hesselgresser: Unpopular law remains unpopular.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-healthcare-gua r antee.aspx">http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-he althcare-guar antee.aspx


Gallup couldn't get the presidential election right.
 
2013-03-10 06:44:20 PM

themindiswatching: meat0918: Premiums went up slightly, but it was the smallest increase I've seen in years percentage wise (only 1%), plus my benefits expanded to cover vaccinations and improved what they cover for preventative care.

Indeed. Mine actually didn't go up at all for 2013.


Mine went up ~$70 a pay period but if I let them do a fairly invasive physical, get a rebate of $20 and the knowlege that they can cut me off the insurance tit the day it looks like I might actually need my insurance for other than my annual strep throat/allergy induced eye infection. Turning 50 this year- can't wait for the scoping (I have to cover at least $100 of that) just to find out I may have polyps in my colon.  Hint: we all have polyps.  Colon cancer comes from polyps but not all polyps become cancerous.  For a couple extra hundred, I get to have them removed- just to be sure.  All that for the magic rebate of $20 a pay period.

Thanks Obama
 
2013-03-10 06:48:31 PM

clowncar on fire: and the knowlege that they can cut me off the insurance tit the day it looks like I might actually need my insurance for other than my annual strep throat/allergy induced eye infection


Nothing new about that. Insurance companies have been dicking people over that way since insurance existed.

My step Dad had been paying into his insurance for 30 years. He gets cancer and they dropped him immediately. Treatment ate up almost all of his retirement money. Had nothing to do with Obama.
 
2013-03-10 06:52:00 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


It's weird, I was against it but as an employer my costs have gone down and Ive hired two additional staff members in the past year.

Boggling
 
2013-03-10 06:52:45 PM
If the Senate and the President don't like the House budget, they should offer their own for us to take a look at.

While they're at it, all of them should probably take a remedial civics class.

Let me some it up for you:
The Senate ok's the budget.
The House ok's the money.
The President agrees to all of it.

/we invented video games to keep you off our lawns, so there!
 
2013-03-10 06:53:24 PM

Princess Ryans Knickers: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

2014

That's when Obamacare goes in.  Want to fail again?


Implemented in steps since 2012.  Goes full out by 2014.  Not working in the healthcare profession you probably wouldn't even notice the changes that are taking place within healthcare facilities.  Staffing, documentation, monitoring/informationmanagement systems, tying patient ratings (the hospital expirience) to medicare compensation, etc.All these changes are a result of the expected increased patient load and for now the management of information required.  Some over due, some absolutely the product of some idiot who has been away from the field a little too long to be offering any ideas of value.
 
2013-03-10 06:59:41 PM

Reverend Monkeypants: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

It's weird, I was against it but as an employer my costs have gone down and Ive hired two additional staff members in the past year.

Boggling


'Boggling" mean "i'm a lying troll"?
 
2013-03-10 07:00:47 PM

clowncar on fire: Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.


This is a good point.  Can't blame Obamacare because the private insurance companies don't want to pay doctors.  And this has been in effect since before Obama came to office.  Case in point: my mother's cardiologist.  He left the practice he was in, and moved to somewhere that will pay better.  He left Fairfield County, CT (a.k.a. one of the richest counties in the US, and very high cost of living) because of their lacking payouts.  Granted his story has some Rich People's Problems seasoning, but it illustrates a trend with private insurances.  They dictate what they pay doctors, not the other way around.  If the doctor's office bills the insurance for $150, the insurance pays $45, take it or leave it.  Just because the hospital puts in for a $1,000 Tylenol pill, doesn't mean the hospital sees anywhere near that.
 
2013-03-10 07:01:52 PM

Zeb Hesselgresser: Unpopular law remains unpopular.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-healthcare-gua r antee.aspx">http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-he althcare-guar antee.aspx


Funny, I see questions about quality and cost of care, a question about the government's responsibility for health coverage, but nothing in there about this "unpopular law" you're referring to.
 
2013-03-10 07:05:23 PM

Zeb Hesselgresser: Unpopular law remains unpopular.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-healthcare-gua r antee.aspx">http://www.gallup.com/poll/158966/majority-against-gov-he althcare-guar antee.aspx


Inaccurate pollsters remain inaccurate:

How can you give any credibility to the guys who told you this?

conservativebyte.com
 
2013-03-10 07:06:33 PM

Richard Saunders: Silly people.  You're supposed to pass the bill and sign it into law before reading it.

/jeesh


Silly sycophant.  You're supposed to make arguments based on statements taken out of context to people who don't know or don't care what the original context was in the first place.

/jeesh
 
2013-03-10 07:08:22 PM

clowncar on fire: Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.


Citation needed.  Note that a link to some opinion piece by a non-medical professional about how they heard that 78 bajillion percent of the doctors in the universe hate Obamacare and are retiring because it's going to force them to be imprisoned in their clinics and treat 500 patients an hour for no pay doesn't count as a citation.
 
2013-03-10 07:14:15 PM

cchris_39: Reverend Monkeypants: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

It's weird, I was against it but as an employer my costs have gone down and Ive hired two additional staff members in the past year.

Boggling

'Boggling" mean "i'm a lying troll"?


No, just observation.  I only have 3 people other than myself on payroll and do lots of subcontracting.  I'm just... confused by some people's stories because I haven't been having that experience.  Your experience is not really what's happening around here musch at all, if at all.  The on;y businesses going down over here are ones run by idiots... like the guy who tried to open the 6th coffee house in town and glean "volunteers" to work for the business.  Farking hippy fail.
 
2013-03-10 07:15:48 PM
Reverend Monkeypants: ... around here musch at all, if at all.  The on;y businesses going down over here are ones run by idiots...
Farking typing fail as well...
 
2013-03-10 07:17:04 PM

Duck_of_Doom: clowncar on fire: Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.

This is a good point.  Can't blame Obamacare because the private insurance companies don't want to pay doctors.  And this has been in effect since before Obama came to office.  Case in point: my mother's cardiologist.  He left the practice he was in, and moved to somewhere that will pay better.  He left Fairfield County, CT (a.k.a. one of the richest counties in the US, and very high cost of living) because of their lacking payouts.  Granted his story has some Rich People's Problems seasoning, but it illustrates a trend with private insurances.  They dictate what they pay doctors, not the other way around.  If the doctor's office bills the insurance for $150, the insurance pays $45, take it or leave it.  Just because the hospital puts in for a $1,000 Tylenol pill, doesn't mean the hospital sees anywhere near that.


The problem is government insurance will pay a lower flat rate than private insurance and then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.  Should a patient complain about the care they received, good luck getting partial payment.

The expensive Tylenol is urban legend- by requesting an itemized bill (most hospitals sell "packages" which are made up of several items expected to be used for a procedure and are sold at flat rate), you can contest individual items you did not use and have them removed from the bill.
 
2013-03-10 07:17:52 PM

clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.


What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.
 
2013-03-10 07:18:46 PM

Virtual Pariah: Do we have the ability to recall some of the members of this Congress?


Yes every two years you get a chance
 
2013-03-10 07:21:27 PM

Reverend Monkeypants: cchris_39: Reverend Monkeypants: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

It's weird, I was against it but as an employer my costs have gone down and Ive hired two additional staff members in the past year.

Boggling

'Boggling" mean "i'm a lying troll"?

No, just observation.  I only have 3 people other than myself on payroll and do lots of subcontracting.  I'm just... confused by some people's stories because I haven't been having that experience.  Your experience is not really what's happening around here musch at all, if at all.  The on;y businesses going down over here are ones run by idiots... like the guy who tried to open the 6th coffee house in town and glean "volunteers" to work for the business.  Farking hippy fail.


Like everything the government does- results will vary to from user to user.  Someone else getting different results from the same expirience does not mean they are lying, it means they were effected differently.
 
2013-03-10 07:21:56 PM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


How is this the fault of the ACA when it hasn't kicked in yet?
 
2013-03-10 07:24:09 PM

cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.


Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.
 
2013-03-10 07:27:47 PM

clowncar on fire: cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.

Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.


Maybe those hospitals could be better, if that's the case.
 
2013-03-10 07:28:16 PM

Ishidan: meat0918: Remember folks, $600 billion per year to enable us to blow up sand into more sand and does nothing back home except give us wounded vets to take care of(which the GOP doesn't seem to care about either) and line the pockets of defense contractors is a good use of tax dollars, but $100 billion per year to take care of Americans is the worst socialism to ever socialize.

If history is any guide, it works like this:
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"I sacrificed for this country, send more guys to finish what I couldn't, ooo-rah, Merica!", then the GOP loves him.
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"So, uh, losing my legs here wasn't part of the deal...I got medical insurance for this shiat, right?  And college assistance so I can learn a desk job?", then the GOP could give a fark less.
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"Okay, that sucked and there's no good reason to send more American boys into that suck.  I am now against war, in fact I'm turning Democrat.", then not only does the GOP not care, they'll go out of their way to trivialize it and make up outright slander about it.


And in the end, the wounded vet votes Republican anyway and tells everyone that Democrats hate America.
 
2013-03-10 07:29:04 PM

balloot: fuhfuhfuh: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

It was much better before Obamacare. You know, the time where in my personal experience, my premiums went up 200% in 3 years. Good times.

/Anecdote fight

My premiums went up 500% because of Obamacare and my employer fired me because Obama taxed the rich.  Also, my Papa Johns pizza is way too expensive and I can no longer afford to eat.  Luckily, I don't have to worry about any of this because a death panel has already sentenced me to execution.


Welcome to Canada! (I know that global warming has removed most of our winters, but the toque is one of our national symbols. You'll only be required to wear it if you're cast as an extra in a Molson beer commercial.)

/Scheduled to die May 17, 2044 of a massive heart attack, +/- 17 days, with a 6% chance of being shot by an angry husband.
//Is also scheduled to pay 93.72% of my income in income taxes, 6.31% in sales taxes, 11.98% in gasoline taxes, and 1.25% in property taxes after our Conservative government cuts our tax rates to a balmy 113.17%! PARTY TIME!
 
2013-03-10 07:29:09 PM

themindiswatching: It really pisses them off that Obama will be forever known as the president who brought the US universal healthcare, doesn't it?


Based on everything else the GOP has done, the fact that they want to repeal it so badly is a sure sign that it's good for our country.
 
2013-03-10 07:32:12 PM

trotsky: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

How is this the fault of the ACA when it hasn't kicked in yet?


Because there ain't no gratification unless it is instant gratification.
 
2013-03-10 07:35:28 PM

cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.

Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.

Maybe those hospitals could be better, if that's the case.


Some people forget that the efforts the staff made in repairing their body and instead focus on that damned iv pump that alarmed everytime they lowered the bed their bed on the their iv line during their stay at the Medical Motel.  Most forget they were not in a fancy hotel (dispite the best possible environment we provide them) and actually biatch about the service (food, television, interruptions by medical staff, being moved floor to floor between radiology, emergency room, ccu, etc).  We are not a hotel but that does not matter when the ratings come in.
 
2013-03-10 07:36:40 PM

sdd2000: Virtual Pariah: Do we have the ability to recall some of the members of this Congress?

Yes every two years you get a chance


lolgerrymandering.jpg
 
2013-03-10 07:42:50 PM

cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.

Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.

Maybe those hospitals could be better, if that's the case.


Indeed.  People will complain if the floor in their room has blood on it, the sheets smell musty, or the room is dirty.  They won't usually complain about the care unless the care is lacking.

There is also the subset of humans that will complain about anything, because they want comps/bill nullification, or they are miserable SOBs.  This is unfortunate, but not exclusive to medical care.
 
2013-03-10 07:45:18 PM
clowncar on fire:

The expensive Tylenol is urban legend- by requesting an itemized bill (most hospitals sell "packages" which are made up of several items expected to be used for a procedure and are sold at flat rate), you can contest individual items you did not use and have them removed from the bill.

So they automaticlaly bill for things they didn't use and cancel them by item IF they are contested in the correct way with the right paperwork by someone who understands the arcana of the system enough to both know the billing has to be checked by item and knows enough to identify what is a fake billed item that should be cancelled?

So outright fraudulent billing then? nice. If you or I did that we would go to farking jail.
 
2013-03-10 07:52:35 PM

cchris_39: Reverend Monkeypants: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

It's weird, I was against it but as an employer my costs have gone down and Ive hired two additional staff members in the past year.

Boggling

'Boggling" mean "i'm a lying troll"?


Apparently it means that you are a shill and won't accept any data that doesn't correspond to your narrow world view.
 
2013-03-10 07:56:00 PM

cchris_39: If the Senate and the President don't like the House budget, they should offer their own for us to take a look at.

While they're at it, all of them should probably take a remedial civics class.

Let me some it up for you:
The Senate ok's the budget.
The House ok's the money.
The President agrees to all of it.

/we invented video games to keep you off our lawns, so there!


Didn't the Senate do just that, last July?
 
2013-03-10 07:58:26 PM

Duck_of_Doom: Just because the hospital puts in for a $1,000 Tylenol pill, doesn't mean the hospital sees anywhere near that.


Nor should they.  I'm waiting for someone to bring up the hospital chargemaster scam.  While we are hating on insurance companies, the "non-profit" hospitals are price-gouging sick people.

My post-op overnight stay in the hospital was billed at $17,000.00.
The insurance "discount" was ($15,000.00) leaving a $2000.00 bill.
With a 90/10 split insurance paid 1800.00 and I paid $200.00.

My insurance, BC/BS, is the largest insurer in my area.  No hospital could stay in business if they were truly writing off 88% of their costs.  The only thing that makes sense is that the $17000.00 price tag is completely made up.   I'm guessing that the real cost of my 1 night stay was closer to the $2000.00.

Any poor slob trying to pay out of his HSA would have to pony-up the exorbitant $17000.00 charge.
 
2013-03-10 07:58:39 PM
Both 'sides' do this type of shiat.  It's what politicians do.  They don't care about you.
 
2013-03-10 08:01:25 PM

DeathByGeekSquad: Both 'sides' do this type of shiat.  It's what politicians do.  They don't care about you.


No they don't. Democrats absolutely have not passed the repeal of a Republican-enacted law 37 times with no hope of getting it through the Senate.
 
2013-03-10 08:07:34 PM
LeoffDaGrate:
And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.

Companies have done this for decades.  Why hire a 2 full-timers when you can get 3 part-timers cheaper and avoid paying benefits.  More flexibility in arranging schedules, another person to cover if someone is sick or goes on vacation, etc.  The only negative is they might not find good people who will put up with that, and what workers are willing to put up with has been getting worse and worse since the late 70's.  It's almost like organizations that were designed to protect workers has lost power in that time.
 
2013-03-10 08:10:12 PM

cameroncrazy1984: DeathByGeekSquad: Both 'sides' do this type of shiat.  It's what politicians do.  They don't care about you.

No they don't. Democrats absolutely have not passed the repeal of a Republican-enacted law 37 times with no hope of getting it through the Senate.


Can't they enact a rule that states the following: If you attempt to create a law with the same goal (wording need not be the same) as a previously failed attempt, and it fails 6 times per session, it cannot be attempted again for 365 calendar days.

This would cover Obamacare, gun control, abortion, tax increases, everything.  It would benefit both parties, and create beautiful amounts of gridlock.  Nothing would get done, but congresscritters may surprise us and be judicious in their pet projects.
 
2013-03-10 08:11:09 PM
269 comments, down to 114, with just one shill taken care of.

I wonder how low I can get the post count to go?

/misses the days of worthwhile arguments on Fark.
// :(
 
2013-03-10 08:13:51 PM

Fail in Human Form: amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.


I'm in Ohio, too. My insurance didn't increase for the first time in decades.  My benefits didn't decrease, either.

My personal experience indicates that you're wrong or lying.
 
2013-03-10 08:20:16 PM

Testiclaw: 269 comments, down to 114, with just one shill taken care of.

I wonder how low I can get the post count to go?

/misses the days of worthwhile arguments on Fark.
// :(


Just by ignoring the one idiot that decided that he was going to take a dump on this thread I got it down to 128 myself...and Fark LOVES the shills, that's where they get their page views...
 
2013-03-10 08:22:26 PM

clowncar on fire: Duck_of_Doom: clowncar on fire: Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.

This is a good point.  Can't blame Obamacare because the private insurance companies don't want to pay doctors.  And this has been in effect since before Obama came to office.  Case in point: my mother's cardiologist.  He left the practice he was in, and moved to somewhere that will pay better.  He left Fairfield County, CT (a.k.a. one of the richest counties in the US, and very high cost of living) because of their lacking payouts.  Granted his story has some Rich People's Problems seasoning, but it illustrates a trend with private insurances.  They dictate what they pay doctors, not the other way around.  If the doctor's office bills the insurance for $150, the insurance pays $45, take it or leave it.  Just because the hospital puts in for a $1,000 Tylenol pill, doesn't mean the hospital sees anywhere near that.

The problem is government insurance will pay a lower flat rate than private insurance and then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.  Should a patient complain about the care they received, good luck getting partial payment.

The expensive Tylenol is urban legend- by requesting an itemized bill (most hospitals sell "packages" which are made up of several items expected to be used for a procedure and are sold at flat rate), you can contest individual items you did not use and have them removed from the bill.




Urban legend? MD Cancer Center in Houston billed Sean Recchi of Lancaster, Ohio $1.50 for "1 ACETAMINOPHE TABS 325 MG" or in layman's terms, $1.50 for a single Tylenol. You can buy them off Amazon for $.08 a pill and that's without a hospital's purchasing power.

That is only one way hospitals overcharge their patients. How about $18 for a single Accu-Chek strip, that you can buy from Amazon for $.53 a strip? Or $3 for a "MARKER SKIN REG TIP RULER", or what you would call a "Sharpie". Yes, a patient was charged for an office supply.

Where did I read about these? Time Magazine: Why medical bills are killing us
 
2013-03-10 08:22:42 PM

Graffito: Duck_of_Doom: Just because the hospital puts in for a $1,000 Tylenol pill, doesn't mean the hospital sees anywhere near that.

Nor should they.  I'm waiting for someone to bring up the hospital chargemaster scam.  While we are hating on insurance companies, the "non-profit" hospitals are price-gouging sick people.

My post-op overnight stay in the hospital was billed at $17,000.00.
The insurance "discount" was ($15,000.00) leaving a $2000.00 bill.
With a 90/10 split insurance paid 1800.00 and I paid $200.00.

My insurance, BC/BS, is the largest insurer in my area.  No hospital could stay in business if they were truly writing off 88% of their costs.  The only thing that makes sense is that the $17000.00 price tag is completely made up.   I'm guessing that the real cost of my 1 night stay was closer to the $2000.00.

Any poor slob trying to pay out of his HSA would have to pony-up the exorbitant $17000.00 charge.


No, you would pay the negotiated rate of $2000.

HSAs usually have a large deductible.  Around here (SW Ohio) $3000 deductibles tend to be fairly common.  In that case, you'd be responsible for the $2000 allowable, and still have $1000 remaining on your deductible for the year.

Also, regarding non-profit hospitals: the fact that they are non-profit does not mean they are benevolent angels.  Many of them are making lots of money, tax free.  If you'd like to peek at your local non-profit hospital's dirty laundry, look at their Form 990.  Here's a free site; the most recent available forms are from 2011:

http://foundationcenter.org/findfunders/990finder/

Take a look at Part VII - Compensation of Officers, Directors,Trustees, Key Employees, Highest Compensated Employees, and Independent Contractors

Part VIII is a breakdown of revenue.

Part IX lists expenses

Part X is the balance sheet.
 
2013-03-10 08:22:46 PM

clowncar on fire: Duck_of_Doom: clowncar on fire: Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.

This is a good point.  Can't blame Obamacare because the private insurance companies don't want to pay doctors.  And this has been in effect since before Obama came to office.  Case in point: my mother's cardiologist.  He left the practice he was in, and moved to somewhere that will pay better.  He left Fairfield County, CT (a.k.a. one of the richest counties in the US, and very high cost of living) because of their lacking payouts.  Granted his story has some Rich People's Problems seasoning, but it illustrates a trend with private insurances.  They dictate what they pay doctors, not the other way around.  If the doctor's office bills the insurance for $150, the insurance pays $45, take it or leave it.  Just because the hospital puts in for a $1,000 Tylenol pill, doesn't mean the hospital sees anywhere near that.

The problem is government insurance will pay a lower flat rate than private insurance and then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.  Should a patient complain about the care they received, good luck getting partial payment.

The expensive Tylenol is urban legend- by requesting an itemized bill (most hospitals sell "packages" which are made up of several items expected to be used for a procedure and are sold at flat rate), you can contest individual items you did not use and have them removed from the bill.


The expensive Tylenol is not an urban legend.  Time Magazine a few weeks back had a very comprehensive article about the problems associated with healthcare billing in this country.  The central problem is that every hospital maintains a pricing structure called the chargemaster which details the prices for every single good or service offered by the hospital.  The problem is that the chargemaster bears little resemblence to reality and doesn't have a connection to the actual costs paid by the hospital for the services.  As a result, you end up with a $3.00 Tylenol when you can get a bottle of 100 for that price.  The chargemaster also tends to result in double or triple billing since you can be charged for the room costs of an operating room along with a tool kit used in the operation and a particular tool in that tool kit when everything should be included in the room costs.

Medicare solves this problem by setting fixed prices for procedures and goods (with the exception of durable medical equipment which still results in crazy overbilling) which actually correspond to the hospital costs plus a certain percentage profit, but private insurance and as a result consumers get screwed.  You get your EOB saying that your insurance saved you 30% but that's based off of an inflated price to begin with.  And if you have no insurance, you get a bill for thousands of dollars in medical-ease.  Yes, it's true that hospitals will negotiate, but how would someone know that and how would they even know where to begin if they can't decipher the coded entries on the itemized receipt.

The simplest solution would be to do away with the chargemaster concept and standardize hospital billing procedures using Medicare as a model.  If hospitals were required to abide by fair billing procedures then the whole system would work more effectively.  You'd have closer connection to your actual cost of care, fewer chargeoffs and bankruptcies from inability to pay, and improved cost containment.
 
2013-03-10 08:26:30 PM

Parthenogenetic: No, you would pay the negotiated rate of $2000.


I don't think so.  Why would the hospital give the BC/BS rate to someone with an HSA?  Where does the $17000.00 charge come from in the first place?
 
2013-03-10 08:42:13 PM
Obamacare ruined my life. I still work three same number of hours and my insurance went up 1% last year! My little sister in collage gets to be on my mom's insurance too, which is pretty terrible.

Oh, and my preventative care is covered by my premium now too!
 
2013-03-10 08:45:24 PM
I love this, these guys don't even really represent the people.  Everyone remember http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/gop-memo-gerrymandering-ho u se-majority.php

that little bit of news?   These guys are a bunch of sore ass cheating scum bags.   I'm hoping that justice gets done and these fellows fall out of power asap.
 
2013-03-10 08:46:25 PM

dustman81: Urban legend? MD Cancer Center in Houston billed Sean Recchi of Lancaster, Ohio $1.50 for "1 ACETAMINOPHE TABS 325 MG" or in layman's terms, $1.50 for a single Tylenol. You can buy them off Amazon for $.08 a pill and that's without a hospital's purchasing power.

That is only one way hospitals overcharge their patients. How about $18 for a single Accu-Chek strip, that you can buy from Amazon for $.53 a strip? Or $3 for a "MARKER SKIN REG TIP RULER", or what you would call a "Sharpie". Yes, a patient was charged for an office supply.

Where did I read about these? Time Magazine: Why medical bills are killing us


I don't need Time to tell me this is true. My own ER bill included $9 for 600mg of ibuprofen, which I could buy at Target for about 12 cents.
 
2013-03-10 08:51:57 PM

Graffito: Parthenogenetic: No, you would pay the negotiated rate of $2000.

I don't think so.  Why would the hospital give the BC/BS rate to someone with an HSA?  Where does the $17000.00 charge come from in the first place?


You cannot create or contribute to an HSA without it being linked to a high-deductible health plan.  It is possible to have an HSA and not have health insurance, if you previously had an HDHPwith an HSA and then subsequently lost the health plan, but retained the accumulated savings in the HSA.

If that is the situation you were describing, yes you are indeed screwed.  However, most people with an HSA will also have the health insurance policy that is a prerequisite for its creation, and therefore are charged the rates that were negotiated between the provider and your insurer.
 
2013-03-10 08:53:24 PM

clowncar on fire: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?

It's all your fault you got raped!  Maybe if your skirts weren't so damned tight this would have never happened.

Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.  The older ones will facing retirement will either retire a bit earllier than planned or find a smaller clinic where they can avoid the heavier patient load.  Government regulation is requiring the use of systems like EPIC to maintain patient records in order to receive compensation for their services- the hospitals get to pick up the tab on this one or they won't be compensated for the additional madated patient load.
Good times ahead.


Yea most businesses close up shop when they are given 15-20% more customers.
Of course hospitals and doctors can refuse all insurance if they don't want to deal with the mandates.  My guess is that many hospitals in poor communities will spring up as their customers will now have insurance.
 
2013-03-10 08:56:55 PM

dustman81: Urban legend? MD Cancer Center in Houston billed Sean Recchi of Lancaster, Ohio $1.50 for "1 ACETAMINOPHE TABS 325 MG" or in layman's terms, $1.50 for a single Tylenol. You can buy them off Amazon for $.08 a pill and that's without a hospital's purchasing power.

That is only one way hospitals overcharge their patients. How about $18 for a single Accu-Chek strip, that you can buy from Amazon for $.53 a strip? Or $3 for a "MARKER SKIN REG TIP RULER", or what you would call a "Sharpie". Yes, a patient was charged for an office supply.

Where did I read about these? Time Magazine: Why medical bills are killing us


I really liked the one they mentioned on Law and Order when the lead cop had cancer.  She's looking through her bill, sees a $10 charge for 'MRS', can't figure out what it is.  So she's goes looking through a novel length book of hospital acronyms and finds that it stands for 'mucus retainment system'.  Or in layman's terms, a box of kleenex.

Most legends have at least a grain of truth.
 
2013-03-10 09:00:51 PM

clowncar on fire: cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.

Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.


So you're saying that government funding SHOULDN'T be tied to satisfactory service?
You also believe that tying school funding to student progress ratings is foolish, correct?
 
2013-03-10 09:07:38 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Your name is accurate.


I love when they do that.

/likely troll is likely
 
2013-03-10 09:14:08 PM

Job Creator: clowncar on fire: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?

It's all your fault you got raped!  Maybe if your skirts weren't so damned tight this would have never happened.

Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.  The older ones will facing retirement will either retire a bit earllier than planned or find a smaller clinic where they can avoid the heavier patient load.  Government regulation is requiring the use of systems like EPIC to maintain patient records in order to receive compensation for their services- the hospitals get to pick up the tab on this one or they won't be compensated for the additional madated patient load.
Good times ahead.

Yea most businesses close up shop when they are given 15-20% more customers.
Of course hospitals and doctors can refuse all insurance if they don't want to deal with the mandates.  My guess is that many hospitals in poor communities will spring up as their customers will now have insurance.


The patients in that extra 15-20% may not improve the bottom line, if they have insurance that pays lower than the average of your practice's current payor mix.  Even if the reimbursement covers the cost of taking care of the new patients (it may not, for Medicaid), you may be diluting your practice with patients who have low-paying insurance, who crowd out patients with higher-paying commercial insurance, sort of like those stories of small businesses who take a hit because of a massive surge of Groupon customers.

I know, I know... I'll just pre-emptively comment, "Anyone who's stupid enough to see a doctor who cares about money deserves the shiatty treatment they get from that greedy SOB.  I long for the day when those bloodsuckers are either Go Galt, are forced to work for scale, or are replaced by the finest doctors in the world imported from Cuba, who will be grateful to take their jobs for one tenth the pay."
 
2013-03-10 09:15:09 PM

LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?


Actually, I can attest to it. The part time thing is completely accurate. My employer put in a requirement that all non-management employees are prohibited from earning more than 27.95 hours to keep healthcare costs down. Any employee who does go over risks being terminated as well as the manager who did it.

http://www.kitchencollection.com/   my employer

http://www.nacco.com/   owning company of my employer


It is EXACTLY because of the healthcare bill. I do qualify for Medicaid vouchers on January 1st, so it's not unfair to me. The law is a good one, and I approve of the first step towards a comprehensive reform, but the actions are being felt (I was allowed up to 32 before the ACA became law). I blame corporate bootlickers.
 
2013-03-10 09:19:52 PM

Parthenogenetic: Job Creator: clowncar on fire: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?

It's all your fault you got raped!  Maybe if your skirts weren't so damned tight this would have never happened.

Nothing he has said hasn't happened although some of it has nothing to do with Obamacare.  Let me add: Some docs are getting out of general care due to the increase in work load/ decrease in compensation for those new patients they have to take on.  The older ones will facing retirement will either retire a bit earllier than planned or find a smaller clinic where they can avoid the heavier patient load.  Government regulation is requiring the use of systems like EPIC to maintain patient records in order to receive compensation for their services- the hospitals get to pick up the tab on this one or they won't be compensated for the additional madated patient load.
Good times ahead.

Yea most businesses close up shop when they are given 15-20% more customers.
Of course hospitals and doctors can refuse all insurance if they don't want to deal with the mandates.  My guess is that many hospitals in poor communities will spring up as their customers will now have insurance.

The patients in that extra 15-20% may not improve the bottom line, if they have ...


So health providers will have to innovate to make that new subset profitable.  Like we're always told capitalism works.  Urgent care clinics, nurse practitioners, and doctor's assistants can all do 98% of the routine work that doctors now do, at a fraction of the cost and at 99.9% of the quality.  Of course the AMA wants the status quo of a limited number of providers at high rates, but that shouldn't matter when considering the health care of the country.
 
2013-03-10 09:22:33 PM

GoodyearPimp: Fail in Human Form: how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit?

Answer: "Look to the Bible".


Hahha, pimp slapped by GoodyearPimp
 
2013-03-10 09:24:21 PM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: LeoffDaGrate: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Why do I have the feeling that 90$ of everything you just said is a lie?

Yes, your premiums may have gone up, but... they go up every year, right?  Did they, like, triple or something overnight?

And as for your "friends..." highly doubtful.  Lots of talk about companies doing the reduced hours to avoid paying Health Care, but... very, very few substantiated cases.  Maybe your friends just suck at their jobs?

Actually, I can attest to it. The part time thing is completely accurate. My employer put in a requirement that all non-management employees are prohibited from earning more than 27.95 hours to keep healthcare costs down. Any employee who does go over risks being terminated as well as the manager who did it.

http://www.kitchencollection.com/   my employer

http://www.nacco.com/   owning company of my employer


It is EXACTLY because of the healthcare bill. I do qualify for Medicaid vouchers on January 1st, so it's not unfair to me. The law is a good one, and I approve of the first step towards a comprehensive reform, but the actions are being felt (I was allowed up to 32 before the ACA became law). I blame corporate bootlickers.


I'm sure those edicts will do wonders for employee morale and in turn, customer service.  I'll be boycotting Kitchen Collection preemptively.  No offense, you seem like a decent person.

/because all of these greedy employers have been giving employees more hours than they need out of the goodness of their hearts until now
//thanks a lot O'Bareefer Fartbama!
 
2013-03-10 09:29:42 PM
Job Creator:
I'm sure those edicts will do wonders for employee morale and in turn, customer service.  I'll be boycotting Kitchen Collection preemptively.  No offense, you seem like a decent person.

/because all of these greedy employers have been giving employees more hours than they need out of the goodness of their hearts until now
//thanks a lot O'Bareefer Fartbama!


Boycott NACCO. The company does a lot of consumer manufacturing, and their biggest customer shall be referred to as "RetailFranchiseBasedOutofBentonvilleArkansas" to keep things hush-hush. I don't think it's my level of corporate that's the problem, it's the ever present downward pressure from higher up.

And thank you.
 
2013-03-10 09:33:13 PM

cameroncrazy1984: DeathByGeekSquad: Both 'sides' do this type of shiat.  It's what politicians do.  They don't care about you.

No they don't. Democrats absolutely have not passed the repeal of a Republican-enacted law 37 times with no hope of getting it through the Senate.


I was focusing on the whole 'sliding unrelated matters into the discussion to cause roadblocks'.

This can come about as slipping random shiat into time-sensitive proposals so when 'the other side' opposes that specific element, they can point their fingers and say that their holding up the time-sensitive proposal.  This has happened with aid packages after disasters, and with things like getting body armor for the troops.
 
2013-03-10 09:48:53 PM
Diglett Dig, Diglett Dig, Trio Trio Trio.
 
2013-03-10 09:53:47 PM
Shorter Paul Ryan: "Guys, I'm still here! Remember me?"
 
2013-03-10 09:55:04 PM

Fail in Human Form: Everything I just said is from first hand experience. Please tell me where I'm wrong.


Post hoc ergo propter hoc.
 
2013-03-10 10:26:54 PM
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results
 
2013-03-10 10:49:53 PM

dennysgod: Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results


Actually the coach used to call that practice.
 
2013-03-10 10:54:02 PM

jst3p: dennysgod: Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results

Actually the coach used to call that practice.


Protip:  Coach was insane.  Unless different results were forthcoming.  That's the trick.
 
2013-03-10 10:54:40 PM

Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

So, again, wait until the exchanges go in.

Also, Ohio must suck. I pay $44 a month for myself.

Honestly, I don't see it improving much with the exchanges but I hope I'm proved wrong.  I understand it has helped some people but here's my question.  When you look at it from my perspective (and those I know personally), and very tight budget, how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit?  I don't say that as an evil "screw'em all" conservative.  I'm honestly asking.


You understand that how insurance always works? If it's government mandated or not.

Funny how you use "Obamacare" which most anti-Obama right wingers use.
 
2013-03-10 11:00:48 PM
global.fncstatic.com

Cue Infinite Face-Punching Machine.
 
2013-03-10 11:03:52 PM

Soup4Bonnie: WALLACE: Are you saying that as part of your budget you would repeal - you assume the repeal of Obamacare?

RYAN: Yes.

WALLACE:  Well that's not going to happen.


When even Fox News doesn't swallow your load, you have a losing hand.


Oh, boy.  Someone is going to read Wallace the riot act.  He's not supposed to think for himself like that!
 
2013-03-10 11:05:01 PM

Corvus: Fail in Human Form: cameroncrazy1984: Fail in Human Form: Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.

So, again, wait until the exchanges go in.

Also, Ohio must suck. I pay $44 a month for myself.

Honestly, I don't see it improving much with the exchanges but I hope I'm proved wrong.  I understand it has helped some people but here's my question.  When you look at it from my perspective (and those I know personally), and very tight budget, how much more should I be willing give up for another's benefit?  I don't say that as an evil "screw'em all" conservative.  I'm honestly asking.

You understand that how insurance always works? If it's government mandated or not.

Funny how you use "Obamacare" which most anti-Obama right wingers use.


It's just what I hear most people call it.  On a side note, I'm starting to remember why I read this site less frequently.  It's supposed to be a discussion forum.  There was maybe a handful of people posting an actual discussion, thanks for the tip about their marketing costs, the rest of this thread was just idiots trying to be funny or insults.
 
2013-03-10 11:09:23 PM
preview.turbosquid.com
 
2013-03-10 11:19:33 PM
So much for that "both sides are the same" bullshiat.  Again.
 
2013-03-10 11:33:42 PM
Looks like republicans are trying to redefine insanity

From "Doing the same thing and expecting different results" to "Just be a member of the GOP"
 
2013-03-10 11:59:56 PM

Job Creator: clowncar on fire: cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.

Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.

So you're saying that government funding SHOULDN'T be tied to satisfactory service?
You also believe that tying school funding to student progress ratings is foolish, correct?


Hospitals provide the service of making people better- and are not intended to be a vacation resort. The question should be: did the hospital achieve this objective, did they fix what was broken?  You ask anyone stuck on their back for a week being directed to keep the TV turned down so as to not bother the other patients, requesting that they don't smoke, get up and wander around, put up with staff poking and prodding for fluids and vitals several times a day but not having a private nurse at your beck and call every time ennui sets in, or any other hospital unpleasantry to write a review, you don't expect to get high marks.

I understand that this is part of a drive to get hospitals to improve the over all hospital expirience.  The problem is, the government pays a very low flat rate- which the hospital is under obligation to accept-- and then proceeds to chip away at it by asking miserable people how that hospital expirience was.  That is wrong.  You rate hospitals based on the performance of a task such as properly removing a kidney stone or ablating a uterus, not how that after dinner mousse was.
 
2013-03-11 12:00:34 AM

Ishidan: meat0918: Remember folks, $600 billion per year to enable us to blow up sand into more sand and does nothing back home except give us wounded vets to take care of(which the GOP doesn't seem to care about either) and line the pockets of defense contractors is a good use of tax dollars, but $100 billion per year to take care of Americans is the worst socialism to ever socialize.

If history is any guide, it works like this:
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"I sacrificed for this country, send more guys to finish what I couldn't, ooo-rah, Merica!", then the GOP loves him.
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"So, uh, losing my legs here wasn't part of the deal...I got medical insurance for this shiat, right?  And college assistance so I can learn a desk job?", then the GOP could give a fark less.
Wounded vet comes back and says,
"Okay, that sucked and there's no good reason to send more American boys into that suck.  I am now against war, in fact I'm turning Democrat.", then not only does the GOP not care, they'll go out of their way to trivialize it and make up outright slander about it.


Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die
 
2013-03-11 12:03:38 AM
Get bent, Ryan. You lost.
 
2013-03-11 12:09:16 AM

clowncar on fire: Job Creator: clowncar on fire: cameroncrazy1984: clowncar on fire: then make healthcare facilities jump through hoops to receive payment.

What? By all accounts Medicare is easier to deal with than private insurance.

Not to the medical facilities.  They are tying it to patient satisfaction ratings.  And, as everyone knows, patients are the happiest people in the world and are always happy to say nothing but good about their hospital stay.

So you're saying that government funding SHOULDN'T be tied to satisfactory service?
You also believe that tying school funding to student progress ratings is foolish, correct?

Hospitals provide the service of making people better- and are not intended to be a vacation resort. The question should be: did the hospital achieve this objective, did they fix what was broken?  You ask anyone stuck on their back for a week being directed to keep the TV turned down so as to not bother the other patients, requesting that they don't smoke, get up and wander around, put up with staff poking and prodding for fluids and vitals several times a day but not having a private nurse at your beck and call every time ennui sets in, or any other hospital unpleasantry to write a review, you don't expect to get high marks.

I understand that this is part of a drive to get hospitals to improve the over all hospital expirience.  The problem is, the government pays a very low flat rate- which the hospital is under obligation to accept-- and then proceeds to chip away at it by asking miserable people how that hospital expirience was.  That is wrong.  You rate hospitals based on the performance of a task such as properly removing a kidney stone or ablating a uterus, not how that after dinner mousse was.


Regarding schools:  Their job is to teach kids.  My rating of whether those teachers made great baby-sitters would not be as important as say, Johnny graduated with the ability to read and comprehend what he read- which would be the measure of whether the school had completed its task.  If a kid comes out biatching about how much school sucks (cause they'll do that the same way a patient will if he didn't like the menu or the physical therapist who made him do just one more leg lift) do we defund the school?  Not the school's place to make every kid happy, but it is their place to ensure they learn.
 
2013-03-11 12:14:07 AM

AliceBToklasLives: [preview.turbosquid.com image 600x600]


You make a convincing argument for gun ownership if not sole for the purpose of self defense.  Nice going.
 
2013-03-11 12:21:30 AM

cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that stupid, they re-elected the guy who signed it.

  Had Al Franken's fraudulent election not happened, we might not be on the precipice of disaster.  ObamaCare is going to fark things up really nicely.  Your argument is invalid since this has all been documented.
 
2013-03-11 12:25:15 AM

armoredbulldozer: cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that stupid, they re-elected the guy who signed it.  Had Al Franken's fraudulent election not happened, we might not be on the precipice of disaster.  ObamaCare is going to fark things up really nicely.  Your argument is invalid since this has all been documented.


You are not Mike_LowELL. Stop being Mike_LowELL.
 
2013-03-11 12:32:36 AM

jst3p: sdd2000: Virtual Pariah: Do we have the ability to recall some of the members of this Congress?

Yes every two years you get a chance

lolgerrymandering.jpg


nutsandolts.com
 
2013-03-11 12:55:57 AM

armoredbulldozer: cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that stupid, they re-elected the guy who signed it.  Had Al Franken's fraudulent election not happened, we might not be on the precipice of disaster.  ObamaCare is going to fark things up really nicely.  Your argument is invalid since this has all been documented.


And when your Doom Paul fantasies fail to come to pass, well, you'll just find some other cause to troll/hate on.

And we'll keep truckin' on, movin' this country forward, feasting on your delicious tears of impotent rage.

Please, proceed.
 
2013-03-11 01:00:50 AM

And to the chuckleheads in Congress who still think Obamacare is a thing?

2.bp.blogspot.com
"Please, proceed."
 
2013-03-11 01:05:48 AM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: Actually, I can attest to it. The part time thing is completely accurate. My employer put in a requirement that all non-management employees are prohibited from earning more than 27.95 hours to keep healthcare costs down. Any employee who does go over risks being terminated as well as the manager who did it.

http://www.kitchencollection.com/   my employer

http://www.nacco.com/   owning company of my employer


It is EXACTLY because of the healthcare bill. I do qualify for Medicaid vouchers on January 1st, so it's not unfair to me. The law is a good one, and I approve of the first step towards a comprehensive reform, but the actions are being felt (I was allowed up to 32 before the ACA became law). I blame corporate bootlickers.


Well, I heard a rumor around these parts that a certain truck stop company decided to implement a similar plan, only to have its CEO come flying back down from the corner office of his shiny new professional football toy to put a halt to that. Which is even more funny when you consider this certain CEO happens to come from a rock-rib Republican family. Sometimes customer service trumps party politics.
 
2013-03-11 01:30:24 AM

Stile4aly: The simplest solution would be to do away with the chargemaster concept and standardize hospital billing procedures using Medicare as a model. If hospitals were required to abide by fair billing procedures then the whole system would work more effectively. You'd have closer connection to your actual cost of care, fewer chargeoffs and bankruptcies from inability to pay, and improved cost containment.


That would make too much sense. We can't do that because socialism.
 
2013-03-11 01:43:16 AM

Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.


Paid shills be posting.
 
2013-03-11 02:12:03 AM

clowncar on fire: AliceBToklasLives: [preview.turbosquid.com image 600x600]

You make a convincing argument for gun ownership if not sole for the purpose of self defense.  Nice going.


Heh, oddly enough I can easily picture the likes of you running around like a freshly cleaved chicken wielding guns in both hands, shooting wildly at nothing at all. So I guess you do have sort of a point.
 
2013-03-11 02:27:41 AM

clowncar on fire: Hospitals provide the service of making people better- and are not intended to be a vacation resort. The question should be: did the hospital achieve this objective, did they fix what was broken?  You ask anyone stuck on their back for a week being directed to keep the TV turned down so as to not bother the other patients, requesting that they don't smoke, get up and wander around, put up with staff poking and prodding for fluids and vitals several times a day but not having a private nurse at your beck and call every time ennui sets in, or any other hospital unpleasantry to write a review, you don't expect to get high marks.

I understand that this is part of a drive to get hospitals to improve the over all hospital expirience.  The problem is, the government pays a very low flat rate- which the hospital is under obligation to accept-- and then proceeds to chip away at it by asking miserable people how that hospital expirience was.  That is wrong.  You rate hospitals based on the performance of a task such as properly removing a kidney stone or ablating a uterus, not how that after dinner mousse was.


Ever stop to think that perhaps the healthcare industry isn't a good fit for you? You sound incredibly bitter.
 
2013-03-11 02:45:22 AM
Same old song and dance. also that chicken is gonna file for a restraining order soon.
 
2013-03-11 05:35:19 AM

Raharu: The GoP sure is LASER FOCUSED on Job.


If you mean making every non-billionaire suffer like Job, I agree.
 
2013-03-11 07:17:20 AM
What a productive use of their time... Just look at all those jobs being created by the "job creatin'" GOP.
 
2013-03-11 07:45:47 AM
Obamacare is going to be VERY BAD for this country. Most Farktards don't realize it, because they have never read it. They just drink the kool aid the liberal news media feeds them.
 
2013-03-11 07:52:01 AM

Fail in Human Form: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: Generation_D: JesusJuice: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

Paid shill's gonna shill.

Pretty much this. Or the worlds most incompetent employee when it comes to his own health care, who knows or cares.

Vague reasoning, no examples, just "it sucks now and this is why" without any citation.

Goin on my ignore, have a nice life troll.

Right, everyone who expresses their own concerns is a troll or a shill.  You won't see this but I'm glad you put me on ignore asshole.

It's possible you're every bit as stupid as you appear to be, but I prefer to believe that someone's paying you.  Welcome to my ignore list.

Is there someplace I can apply for this "shill" job I keep hearing about?  I could use the extra money.


Hello Matthew Stafford. Ignored list.
 
2013-03-11 08:18:58 AM

Fail in Human Form: amyldoanitrite: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

I don't know what state you live in, but here in CA, once our state starts its insurance exchange, my family of 4 can get coverage for $124/month at my current income level. This will also be the first time my wife will have had insurance in more than 10 years do to a pre-existing condition.

So yeah, Obamacare is pretty f'ing great from my POV. Would I prefer true single payer? You bet. But this is certainly an improvement.

Ohio and I pay more than that for just myself.


Here in NC I pay over $500 monthly for my wife and myself.

/state health insurance
//they don't have competitive bidding for the contract
///just give it to BCBS
////hey why are our premiums so high?
 
2013-03-11 08:36:13 AM

Pick: Obamacare is going to be VERY BAD for this country. Most Farktards don't realize it, because they have never read it. They just drink the kool aid the liberal news media feeds them.


Needs more "SOSHULIZM!!" and a crying eagle GIF.
 
2013-03-11 08:49:45 AM
The Democrats need to pass an unrealistic non-passable balanced budget also that is "balanced" through only tax increases on the wealthy and token measures that undo Ronalod Reagan's legacy like defunding the Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport; or better yet renaming it the Barack Hussein Obama Washington Nationalized Healthcare Airport.
 
2013-03-11 09:17:44 AM

Generation_D: Fail in Human Form: You know what, I bought into the promise of "Obama Care".  I was wrong.  All I've seen are premiums go up, my friends who work part time get their hours severely reduced so the companies don't have to offer them care, the co-pay on everything double, and impending fines.  The status quo before wasn't sustainable... but this farking sucks.

You are full of sh*t. Histrionics without facts, and Obamacare hasn't even started yet! Just right wing nit wit noise, go eff yourself with a rusty pistol.


I heard that O.C. Doesn't even start until '14. Thanks Obama!
 
2013-03-11 09:28:16 AM

heavymetal: The Democrats need to pass an unrealistic non-passable balanced budget also that is "balanced" through only tax increases on the wealthy and token measures that undo Ronalod Reagan's legacy like defunding the Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport; or better yet renaming it the Barack Hussein Obama Washington Nationalized Healthcare Airport.


This is exactly what Obama doesn't do, and it's a big part of the reason the Republican's tactics are effective as they are.
 
2013-03-11 09:44:03 AM

heavymetal: The Democrats need to pass an unrealistic non-passable balanced budget also that is "balanced" through only tax increases on the wealthy and token measures that undo Ronalod Reagan's legacy like defunding the Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport; or better yet renaming it the Barack Hussein Obama Washington Nationalized Healthcare Airport.


Yes, because the best response to people being irresponsible and stupid is to be irresponsible and stupid right back.  What's your next advice, cops should get blitzed before they pull people over for a DUI?  "Dude, you were *hic* like, totally weaving an' shiat.  It was f*cking *hic* aweshome!  Give ush a high five, f*cker!"
 
2013-03-11 10:13:04 AM

Jim_Tressel's_O-Face: And to the chuckleheads in Congress who still think Obamacare is a thing?

"Please, proceed."


Problem is, they have actual work to do.
 
2013-03-11 10:58:07 AM

Harbinger of the Doomed Rat: heavymetal: The Democrats need to pass an unrealistic non-passable balanced budget also that is "balanced" through only tax increases on the wealthy and token measures that undo Ronalod Reagan's legacy like defunding the Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport; or better yet renaming it the Barack Hussein Obama Washington Nationalized Healthcare Airport.

Yes, because the best response to people being irresponsible and stupid is to be irresponsible and stupid right back.  What's your next advice, cops should get blitzed before they pull people over for a DUI?  "Dude, you were *hic* like, totally weaving an' shiat.  It was f*cking *hic* aweshome!  Give ush a high five, f*cker!"


I totally agree.
s3.amazonaws.com
 
2013-03-11 11:10:20 AM

cameroncrazy1984: The American public is so hungry to repeal Obamacare that the re-elected the guy who signed it.


Sure Obama wion with a landslide, and they made seats in the senate, however,since the Democrats didn't get enough votes to defeat Republican gerrymandering of districts to win the congress back, the GOP have a clear mandate from the people that the health care reform is hated and must be dismantled.
 
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