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(Metro)   Listen up you basement dwellers, the future of video gaming is in jeopardy   (metro.co.uk) divider line 92
    More: Interesting, Rovio, The Old Republic  
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5739 clicks; posted to Geek » on 10 Mar 2013 at 9:50 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-10 06:32:48 AM  
So much yammer.
 
2013-03-10 06:41:44 AM  
graphics8.nytimes.com
 
2013-03-10 06:49:49 AM  

Sgygus: So much yammer.


Done in one.
 
2013-03-10 08:05:09 AM  
Quantum computing is around the corner.

Prepare for the next revolution.

It is very possible that we will finally have the power to have something like real VR (not that Nintendo crap)
 
2013-03-10 08:11:21 AM  

cman: Quantum computing is around the corner.

Prepare for the next revolution.

It is very possible that we will finally have the power to have something like real VR (not that Nintendo crap)


www.doolwind.com
 
2013-03-10 08:12:25 AM  
Fark social games!  God, how I hate them.  Video games are for when I am feeling decidedly anti-social.
 
2013-03-10 08:15:28 AM  

Jon iz teh kewl: cman: Quantum computing is around the corner.

Prepare for the next revolution.

It is very possible that we will finally have the power to have something like real VR (not that Nintendo crap)

[www.doolwind.com image 468x335]


Can it suck my dick?

Then no, real VR aint here
 
2013-03-10 08:16:52 AM  
F*ck quantum computers, I want actual live genetically modified barrel-throwing gorillas and real enheightening mushrooms et al...
 
2013-03-10 08:31:23 AM  

EvilEgg: Fark social games!  God, how I hate them.  Video games are for when I am feeling decidedly anti-social.


you know they make MULTI PLAYER GAMES??
 
2013-03-10 10:02:08 AM  

Sgygus: So much yammer.


There was a lot of words.  None of them looked very interesting, so I didn't read them.
 
2013-03-10 10:02:35 AM  
Is this like when the RIAA was trying to prove Piracy was killing music because sales were down 9% but they had 23% less artists than the year before?
 
2013-03-10 10:07:42 AM  

Jon iz teh kewl: EvilEgg: Fark social games!  God, how I hate them.  Video games are for when I am feeling decidedly anti-social.

you know they make MULTI PLAYER GAMES??


Yes, and by and large they are populated with total assholes.
 
2013-03-10 10:13:53 AM  
OK, let's have our own discussion then.  Video gaming will never die as long as someone can cobble together "Pong" from one of countless development technologies available today.  What's happening is saturation and decline of existing and outdated business models.  Back in the day, the market favored one console dominating.  Then the market expanded to the point that it could support multiple competing consoles.  Now the market is trending toward massive fragmentation, which means gamers will no longer see AAA budgets spent on their niches.  Actually that's been the case for a while now.  It does mean the big money will be spent on schlock, same as the music, TV and movie industries. . . life goes on.

HST's Dead Carcass: Is this like when the RIAA was trying to prove Piracy was killing music because sales were down 9% but they had 23% less artists than the year before?


23% of nothing is nothing.
 
2013-03-10 10:16:19 AM  
tl;dr version

Video games are expensive to make.  Video game execs are trying to find more lame ways to milk more money from you to recoup costs and make a profit.
 
2013-03-10 10:19:06 AM  

Jon iz teh kewl: EvilEgg: Fark social games!  God, how I hate them.  Video games are for when I am feeling decidedly anti-social.

you know they make MULTI PLAYER GAMES??


Yes, but "social games" are not multiplayer: it's the same single-player experience, only with opposition which usually scores lower on the Turing Test. There is no substitute for being there.

But whatever. The real threat to gaming is not online, but HD, which ratchets up the cost of development so much that quality gaming becomes unprofitable.
 
2013-03-10 10:22:17 AM  
from a non-gamer perspective it seems like there are enough games already on the market to keep most people busy for years to come.
 
2013-03-10 10:25:05 AM  

dragonchild: OK, let's have our own discussion then.  Video gaming will never die as long as someone can cobble together "Pong" from one of countless development technologies available today.  What's happening is saturation and decline of existing and outdated business models.  Back in the day, the market favored one console dominating.  Then the market expanded to the point that it could support multiple competing consoles.  Now the market is trending toward massive fragmentation, which means gamers will no longer see AAA budgets spent on their niches.  Actually that's been the case for a while now.  It does mean the big money will be spent on schlock, same as the music, TV and movie industries. . . life goes on.

HST's Dead Carcass: Is this like when the RIAA was trying to prove Piracy was killing music because sales were down 9% but they had 23% less artists than the year before?

23% of nothing is nothing.


This.  A lot of programming talent is wasted on Angry Bird's and shovelware games because its cheap and every teenager w/ a celltablet will buy it on a whim.  AAA titles have already shrunk to the handful of core titles with few companies willing to risk a new game. So if you don't like Madden or CoD games then you'll be left wanting.  At least in the AAA arena.

I think there is a healthy renaissance in the indy game market though.  This is where we're going to see innovation if you're not too scared off by the relative low-end graphics.  Event then, I think if an indy game becomes popular enough.  Its 1st edition can be a proof of concept and provide exposure for a crowd funded indy AAA sequel.
 
2013-03-10 10:31:59 AM  

cman: Quantum computing is around the corner.

Prepare for the next revolution.

It is very possible that we will finally have the power to have something like real VR (not that Nintendo crap)


Let me guess, you also think 3d printing is a "revolution".
 
2013-03-10 10:33:44 AM  

Neondistraction: Jon iz teh kewl: EvilEgg: Fark social games!  God, how I hate them.  Video games are for when I am feeling decidedly anti-social.

you know they make MULTI PLAYER GAMES??

Yes, and by and large they are populated with total assholes.


THIS so damn much!
 
2013-03-10 10:34:27 AM  
AAA game makers are feeling threatened, nothing more.  The industry would be better off without EA and Activision, they were useful in the past when they were just one of the developers but as publishers with MBAs running the show they are literally shiatting where they eat.

/worst launch since the challenger
 
2013-03-10 10:36:37 AM  

KrispyKritter: from a non-gamer perspective it seems like there are enough games already on the market to keep most people busy for years to come.


But that's like saying there's already enough board games on the market for people to keep playing Chutes and Ladders for years.  Or there's enough restaurants in a town to keep people fed.  Etc...

Gamers usually stick to a genre or a small set of genre's.  You complete a game, you move on to the next one in that genre, and depending on its replay value you may never play the first game again.  Moral of the story, new fresh games are in demand and the publishers are there to meet that demand with a supply.
 
2013-03-10 10:37:33 AM  
I really don't care for online, multiplayer gaming. After a typical day I want less human interaction, not more.
 
2013-03-10 10:37:40 AM  

duckpoopy: cman: Quantum computing is around the corner.

Prepare for the next revolution.

It is very possible that we will finally have the power to have something like real VR (not that Nintendo crap)

Let me guess, you also think 3d printing is a "revolution".


Plastic fabrication? Hell no
 
2013-03-10 10:38:01 AM  

BumpInTheNight: AAA game makers are feeling threatened, nothing more.  The industry would be better off without EA and Activision, they were useful in the past when they were just one of the developers but as publishers with MBAs running the show they are literally shiatting where they eat.

/worst launch since the challenger


/bans you from the forum
 
2013-03-10 10:40:28 AM  

BumpInTheNight: AAA game makers are feeling threatened, nothing more.  The industry would be better off without EA and Activision, they were useful in the past when they were just one of the developers but as publishers with MBAs running the show they are literally shiatting where they eat.

/worst launch since the challenger


The funny thing is that this isn't the worst game launch I've ever been involved in. Early MMO's used to routinely be difficult upon launch. The launch of AO was the stuff of legends. But I have to say Sim City is the worst launch to a single player game I've ever experienced.

/At least they're giving us a free game out of it.
//Too bad it's an EA free game.
 
2013-03-10 10:45:43 AM  
Bring back oddworld.
That is all.
 
2013-03-10 10:47:12 AM  

Neondistraction: Jon iz teh kewl: EvilEgg: Fark social games!  God, how I hate them.  Video games are for when I am feeling decidedly anti-social.

you know they make MULTI PLAYER GAMES??

Yes, and by and large they are populated with total assholes.


I felt that way for years, but playing Mass Effect 3 Multiplayer has changed my opinion completely. It's only co-op, so no annoying DM-type games, and the vast majority of the time, everyone really goes out of their way to pull their weight. You've got the odd freeloader, but very few of them.

It's really fun, and made me reassess my opinion of multiplayer games.

/PC gamer, thankyouverymuch
 
2013-03-10 10:55:25 AM  
Video games are ending! The sky is falling! This mole on my arm is probably cancer!

Video games aren't going anywhere. The way we play them and the people that make them are going to change. Maybe not for the best.
 
2013-03-10 10:56:51 AM  

js34603: Video games are ending! The sky is falling! This mole on my arm is probably cancer!

Video games aren't going anywhere. The way we play them and the people that make them are going to change. Maybe not for the best.


Its a game of Civ.  This particular golden age has ended.  We'll just have to wait til the next one.
 
2013-03-10 10:58:53 AM  

Kimpak: js34603: Video games are ending! The sky is falling! This mole on my arm is probably cancer!

Video games aren't going anywhere. The way we play them and the people that make them are going to change. Maybe not for the best.

Its a game of Civ.  This particular golden age has ended.  We'll just have to wait til the next one.


Can we sacrifice the Bieber "great artist" to trigger the next one?  I think that's a good plan.
 
2013-03-10 11:00:53 AM  
The markets change. Businesses will adapt or they will fail, and then someone else will take up the challenge. Oh noes. So long as someone sniffs money out there to be had, folks will rise up to take a poke at getting some of it.
 
2013-03-10 11:04:40 AM  

"I think there is a healthy renaissance in the indy game market though.  This is where we're going to see innovation if you're not too scared off by the relative low-end graphics.  Event then, I think if an indy game becomes popular enough.  Its 1st edition can be a proof of concept and provide exposure for a crowd funded indy AAA sequel. "



I always chuckle a little bit when I hear gamers/system marketers reciting things like number-of-polygons that a new system can push, or how the new bump map shaders graphics can make the characters in the next game more lifelike, and so on....and then I keep coming back to the fact that Minecraft has probably the highest ROI of any videogame in history.

(and strangely enough, you can probably make a case that in some circumstances, the social aspects of setting up a server and playing with your friends is a big part of that success now...I know 3 parents who have had to set up a server for their kids and their friends)
 
2013-03-10 11:08:01 AM  

Kimpak: dragonchild: OK, let's have our own discussion then.  Video gaming will never die as long as someone can cobble together "Pong" from one of countless development technologies available today.  ...I think there is a healthy renaissance in the indy game market though.  This is where we're going to see innovation if you're not too scared off by the relative low-end graphics.  Event then, I think if an indy game becomes popular enough.  Its 1st edition can be a proof of concept and provide exposure for a crowd funded indy AAA sequel.


Ayup. The videogame market is not dead, it's just undergoing a change much like the music industry, and some of the current business models just aren't going to work. But you know what? There are other workable models out there.
Consider the last four game I bought with actual cash

FTL. Indie game, $5 sale on Steam. A graphical joke, but certainly worth $5 for entertainment
Reichenbach Falls. A true indie game by a 1-man shop (Everett Kaiser Games) that specializes in logic puzzles. He's been around for a decade and seems to be doing just fine with graphics that wouldn't look out of place on a C64
Guild Wars 2. The only AAA title, but one with no subscription and DLC done correctly.
Don't Starve: Indie, $11 sale on Steam. Graphics fit the game but certainly aren't high end- I think the development team is 10 people tops judging from the forums. Constant, rapid development in the beta phase right now.
So we have a bunch of high end duds out there like Aliens: CM and SimCity? The Xbox and PS4 may not make money? Who cares? I've got plenty to play.
 
2013-03-10 11:10:05 AM  

snowshovel: I always chuckle a little bit when I hear gamers/system marketers reciting things like number-of-polygons that a new system can push, or how the new bump map shaders graphics can make the characters in the next game more lifelike, and so on....and then I keep coming back to the fact that Minecraft has probably the highest ROI of any videogame in history.

(and strangely enough, you can probably make a case that in some circumstances, the social aspects of setting up a server and playing with your friends is a big part of that success now...I know 3 parents who have had to set up a server for their kids and their friends)


Completely agree.  I've been in on Minecraft since Alpha.   Great graphics do not a good game make.  However, to the masses it seems like that's all that matters.  Now if someone can actually combine the two.  Great graphics AND great gameplay, then we have gold.  I might argue that Skyrim has accomplished this, for me at least.  And to a certain degree Assassin's creed 2.
 
2013-03-10 11:12:55 AM  

Glockenspiel Hero: FTL. Indie game, $5 sale on Steam. A graphical joke, but certainly worth $5 for entertainment


Slightly off topic, but holy carp.  FTL has consumed many hours of my life.  Its a harsh mistress though.  Even the best ships can get unlucky and destroyed in the first couple of sectors.  Buy this game!
 
2013-03-10 11:28:59 AM  
...and absolutely no mention of the sort of independent gaming coming out of Humble Bundle and Steam.

To me, that stuff is like punk rock compared to the excesses of prog rock. People on small budgets with lots of imagination making fun games, rather than huge budgets going into updates of existing games.
 
2013-03-10 11:38:30 AM  

farkeruk: ...and absolutely no mention of the sort of independent gaming coming out of Humble Bundle and Steam.

To me, that stuff is like punk rock compared to the excesses of prog rock. People on small budgets with lots of imagination making fun games, rather than huge budgets going into updates of existing games.


I wonder what the game would look like if one of the better indy teams was suddenly given a AAA game budget.  If I had Bruce Wayne money I'd try this social experiment   Would the sudden big budget make the game suck, or is it indeed the team that can take the budget and make a better game.
 
2013-03-10 11:40:42 AM  
I would like a 2 to 5 person Skyrim.  Not MMO  just multiplayer.
 
2013-03-10 11:42:28 AM  
Kentucky Route Zero begs to differ.

/awesome game
 
2013-03-10 11:47:40 AM  
Good.

Games have reached a point where they are good. Really good. And almost anything is possible. Games can be played practically forever, explored, enjoyed, re-played. And yet there are just so damned many of them coming out every month. It's getting stupid, and needs to slow down, stop even.
 
2013-03-10 11:48:26 AM  

Kimpak: I wonder what the game would look like if one of the better indy teams was suddenly given a AAA game budget. If I had Bruce Wayne money I'd try this social experiment Would the sudden big budget make the game suck, or is it indeed the team that can take the budget and make a better game.


It would suck.  Managing a team is a completely different skillset.  Have you seen "indie game the movie"?  Those kinds of games are one or two brilliant artists working for years on one specific thing.  The business side they fail hard at.
 
2013-03-10 11:56:46 AM  
The economics is the root of the problem.

Big budgets demand big sales, which means a title has to be homogenized to appeal to a broad audience. The indie titles are fun but can't be guaranteed to sell in any number, meaning (for a publisher) they aren't worth the cost of selling.
This is why all the consoles and PC are trying to do more downloaded content, so they can get some space between themselves and the publishers that are killing the business.

/what we have now is like Motown or Disney choosing the content to be sure that only "the best" gets through.
/If you wanted to find new and innovative music, starting in the front of a music store was a waste of time.
/what everyone with a console is looking for is the iTunes like model of distribution for the entire game industry.
 
2013-03-10 11:57:39 AM  
All this has happened before.

upload.wikimedia.org

Video games will cease to exist for two years, and the cycle will begin anew.
 
2013-03-10 12:00:26 PM  

Kimpak: I wonder what the game would look like if one of the better indy teams was suddenly given a AAA game budget.  If I had Bruce Wayne money I'd try this social experiment   Would the sudden big budget make the game suck, or is it indeed the team that can take the budget and make a better game.


To be honest, I feel that Valve do AAA games well and are prepared to take some risks. I'm not wholly into indy games. I just generally find them more imaginative.
 
2013-03-10 12:07:45 PM  

HST's Dead Carcass: Is this like when the RIAA was trying to prove Piracy was killing music because sales were down 9% but they had 23% less artists than the year before?


The key word there being THEY.  THEY can keep biatching, I'll keep buying music from Bandcamp and Indie labels that I never would have heard without the intertubes.
 
2013-03-10 12:12:56 PM  
Yeah, let me know when we're all supposed to suddenly stop playing video games to make this stupid headline truthful.
 
2013-03-10 12:20:12 PM  

Dragonflew: Yeah, let me know when we're all supposed to suddenly stop playing video games to make this stupid headline truthful.


I don't think the issue is with people not playing video games. We're just not as willing to pay as much as we used to.

With Steam Sales and GOG and the Humble Bundle, why would I fork over $60 for one game when I can spend that much on more games than I'll ever have time to play. Which is pretty much where I am right now. I could stop spending money on games and have more than enough to last me a long, long time.
 
2013-03-10 12:20:16 PM  

KrispyKritter: from a non-gamer perspective it seems like there are enough games already on the market to keep most people busy for years to come.


This is absolutely true.
The number of titles announced or presumed to be in development that I'm interested in keeps on growing:

Europa Universalis IV
Cyberpunk2077
The Witcher III
Fallout 4 (the pace of leaks on this one suggests to me an unveil by end of year)
Watch Dogs

And I haven't even finished Far Cry 3 and Tomb Raider yet.

With a 50-60 hour job and a whole other stack of "objectives" to get done this year, I have no idea how I'll find time for most of those (and especially FO4 and EU4 which could easily be 200+ hour games).

mrlewish: I would like a 2 to 5 person Skyrim.  Not MMO  just multiplayer.


No, please god no.

And Skyrim seems to have sold just fine despite being a single-player RPG. Perhaps the lesson the publishers should be taking away is that it's not multiplayer that sells, it's good games.

/and yes, yes, Skyrim isn't as good as Morrowind or even FO3.
 
2013-03-10 12:21:01 PM  

PanicMan: Kimpak: I wonder what the game would look like if one of the better indy teams was suddenly given a AAA game budget. If I had Bruce Wayne money I'd try this social experiment Would the sudden big budget make the game suck, or is it indeed the team that can take the budget and make a better game.

It would suck.  Managing a team is a completely different skillset.  Have you seen "indie game the movie"?  Those kinds of games are one or two brilliant artists working for years on one specific thing.  The business side they fail hard at.


I don't think this really gets to the heart of the issue. Many of the problems prevalent in AAA titles are due to management forcing bad game mechanics or pushing release dates on the developers to make more money. While I'm sure there's something to be said for having too many cooks in the kitchen, I would trust the people actually making the game with the money rather than the people in charge of the money.
 
2013-03-10 12:21:04 PM  

PhiloeBedoe: F*ck quantum computers, I want actual live genetically modified barrel-throwing gorillas and real enheightening mushrooms et al...


Funny you should mention mushrooms, because I just might have a plan...
 
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