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(Mother Nature Network)   You know the hipsters have officially taken over the neighborhood when the first organic dry cleaner opens up on your block   (mnn.com) divider line 57
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2550 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Mar 2013 at 8:05 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-06 08:07:47 AM
I live in Bucktown/Wicker Park, Chicago. Ground zero for the hipster population.

/We have an organic dry cleaner.
 
2013-03-06 08:07:52 AM
Organic dry cleaning?

I thought that was called being a bachelor, you know hanging it outside the window for a few hours
 
2013-03-06 08:11:36 AM
I've gone off the grid with my clothes cleaning. I take then down to the river and beat them on a rock.
 
2013-03-06 08:15:11 AM
This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.
 
2013-03-06 08:16:34 AM
I have one near me...it's right next to the wind-powered organic market.

/but college park, MD isn't very hipster-y imo
 
2013-03-06 08:18:57 AM
We just bought a a house in South Philly because it's up the street from a silkscreen place and a vegan cafe which means that it's not gentrified enough for two coffee houses and for a million chain stores making artisanal whatever, but is in the germinal stage. Plus there's a million and one cheap Asian and Mexican places to eat so this place is total college kid/young urban professional bait.

So let's get this gentrification started!
 
2013-03-06 08:20:27 AM
I was thinking about hipsters the other day as I tried to shop at Whole Foods. I felt kinda bereft and lonely.

I wasn't there because I give a crap about free trade chocolate and helping the downtrodden souls of Ghana to take care of themselves.  I wasn't there because they save trees and recycle everything.

I just want food without free glutamic acids. And let me tell you, that's tough to find even at Whole Foods  :/
 
2013-03-06 08:22:52 AM
i too think about hipsters quite a bit while hanging out at city-based suburban mom experiences. Thinking about hipsters right now. Got a rage boner just thinking about them hipsters hipstering around. Ugh. I have to spit.
 
2013-03-06 08:24:55 AM
I live in a communal house where no one pays rent or bills.  Food is freely provided and you even get to pick your roommate if you've been here long enough.  Today, while you work, I'm going to play Monopoly and watch television in between buffet style meals.  And, of course, have all the sex I want.  But you just go right ahead and go on living in your prison of modern day convenience.  If you knew how awesome this life could be, you'd kill to get here.
 
2013-03-06 08:27:03 AM
reminds me of a 1950's Popular Science article with b&w drawing of fully clothed business people walking into and out of a pool which left their garments sparkling clean.
 
Skr
2013-03-06 08:29:40 AM
Hmm, I had thought they were going to be using rice to dry moistened clothes or something of that nature.

/Rice saves your wet cell phones.
 
2013-03-06 08:31:37 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


I have said this for years. And I get the same reaction.
 
2013-03-06 08:32:07 AM
I used to wash my clothing with gasoline, but then I switched to ethanol because it's more eco-friendly.
 
2013-03-06 08:32:43 AM

brandnewchair: I live in Bucktown/Wicker Park, Chicago. Ground zero for the hipster population.

/We have an organic dry cleaner.


I'm familiar with that dry cleaner (the one under the L stop, right?), but I've never used it.
 
2013-03-06 08:33:58 AM

spentmiles: I live in a communal house where no one pays rent or bills.  Food is freely provided and you even get to pick your roommate if you've been here long enough.  Today, while you work, I'm going to play Monopoly and watch television in between buffet style meals.  And, of course, have all the sex I want.  But you just go right ahead and go on living in your prison of modern day convenience.  If you knew how awesome this life could be, you'd kill to get here.


So you have a food, shelter, and utility fairy that pays for everything?  Must be nice.
 
2013-03-06 08:35:46 AM
All of my organs are dry-clean only.
 
2013-03-06 08:38:33 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


I look funny at anyone who starts explaining something to me that I didn't ask them to explain.
 
2013-03-06 08:40:56 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


I was eating Roentgenium before it was renamed.
 
2013-03-06 08:41:10 AM
We must ridicule and scoff at those who want sustainable, eco-friendly things.

WE MUST NOT LET THEM SUCCEED
 
2013-03-06 08:42:14 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


that's because you're an arrogant jackass who fails to realize that in this sense the term "organic" refers to a process as defined by the USDA certified organic standards.
 
2013-03-06 08:42:28 AM

Erebus1954: I've gone off the grid with my clothes cleaning. I take then down to the river and beat them on a rock.


When my girlfriend whines about doing laundry, I remind her that tossing clothing into a machine, waiting an hour, then tossing it into another machine to dry them really isn't all that bad....considering one of the few pictures around of my grandmother is her on the side of a river with a tub, scrub board and some rocks washing the farking clothes.

/mom says the clothes came out cleaner back then
//used hot coals in her iron as well
///I would never mess with grandma
 
2013-03-06 08:46:18 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.



Wow - fourth post, huh?  I came here to say "in before that dork who's going to tell us that drycleaning fluid is organic because it contains carbon."
 
2013-03-06 08:52:40 AM
While there are indeed health/environmental concerns that come along with some of these, their reputations are not nearly as dubious as perc, a substance that's classified by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency as a likely human carcinogen.

Uh... heavy petrochemical hydrocarbon mixtures, one of the suggested alternatives, goes well beyond being a "likely" human carcinogen, they're typically straight-up cancer in a gas can where prolonged exposure is concerned.

And CO2-cleaning, one of the other suggested alternatives, is absurdly energy-intensive.  As for the last, while silicone isn't itself a hazard, the chemicals used to convert silica to silicone are the kinds of shiat you get dipped in when applying to become a batman villain.

Basically, all these "green alternatives" are as bad or worse for the environment, humans, or both than good old Prechloroethylene, similar to how "organic farming" takes on the order of five to ten times the crop-land of real farming and is thus massively worse for the environment than using modern technology like a non-retarded human.

Additionally, the primary issue with dry cleaning isn't solvents, those can be (and routinely are) handled and disposed safely easily enough, it's the overall energy consumption of the processes.  The solution to the environmental issues associated with dry cleaning is  don't use dry cleaning.  Wear clothing of durable, modern fabric (even polyester blend counts) that can be washed in a standard efficiency washer, which has the additional advantage of lasting longer to begin with and thus saving on new clothing manufacturing cost.  Use anti-static balls instead of dryer sheets, use a high-efficiency washer and detergent instead of an old-school one, etc.

I know the old slogan of "Reduce, Re-use, Recycle" is corny, but it's pretty much the optimum solution to problems like this and  the order of the words is not an accident.  Reducing actual consumption is by far the superior solution in basically all cases, and re-use is superior to recycling if it's even remotely feasible.  Even captain goddamned Planet got that much right.

//The pop-"science" "organic" movement largely earned the number of sarcasm quotes it has the hard and thorough way, by being almost universally working directly counter to its stated goals at all times.  By using organic products, you are always, always raping a significantly larger portion of the environment and Earth's natural resources in exchange for a non-superior or outright inferior product.  Good job, numbnuts.
 
2013-03-06 08:54:41 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


Most people understand that the word 'organic' has more than one meaning, depending on context.
 
2013-03-06 08:56:11 AM

spentmiles: I live in a communal house where no one pays rent or bills.  Food is freely provided and you even get to pick your roommate if you've been here long enough.  Today, while you work, I'm going to play Monopoly and watch television in between buffet style meals.  And, of course, have all the sex I want.  But you just go right ahead and go on living in your prison of modern day convenience.  If you knew how awesome this life could be, you'd kill to get here.


So you're a college student.
 
2013-03-06 09:01:47 AM
Silly Subby, Hipsters don't dry-clean anything.  They're busy washing their clothes using laundry detergent that they made themselves, from hand-grated Ivory soap, borax and sodium carbonate.  Then they air-dry on an clothes line made from organic hemp.
 
2013-03-06 09:02:18 AM
Damn those eco hipsters. Damn them!
 
2013-03-06 09:03:55 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


came to say this.
 
2013-03-06 09:05:39 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


Actually...

While that statement is true of trichloroethylene, the molecule in question is tetrachloroethylene (or perchloroethylene, the per- meaning "as much chloro as possible).  Each carbon is double-bonded to each other, and the other two bonds are occupied by chlorine.  Since there are no C-H bonds, it's technically not an organic compound.

/I'm usually on board with hippie-mockery, but I'm too much of a pedantic chemist to let this go.
 
2013-03-06 09:07:17 AM

TheGreatGazoo: spentmiles: I live in a communal house where no one pays rent or bills.  Food is freely provided and you even get to pick your roommate if you've been here long enough.  Today, while you work, I'm going to play Monopoly and watch television in between buffet style meals.  And, of course, have all the sex I want.  But you just go right ahead and go on living in your prison of modern day convenience.  If you knew how awesome this life could be, you'd kill to get here.

So you have a food, shelter, and utility fairy that pays for everything?  Must be nice.


The majority of housing co-ops typically find it more efficient to let the more... useless residents just keep on rolling with their minimal contribution while a smaller core group of the actual competent members manages the chore/member labor schedules, negotiates utility and corporate property rental contracts, and so on.

Essentially they tend to deal with the free rider problem by shrugging and ignoring it so long as the freeloaders in question don't actively get in the way of the revenue-generation activities.  Which, in the case of rent-free cooperatives with internet access, usually consist of property management and short-term rentals in a hostel format.  Given that the initial property investment at the point of incorporation is usually fairly substantial and the locations concentrated in cheap, low-demand areas (and affordable housing qualifying for 501.c.3 exemption) utilities can actually be pretty minimal with rural resource generation (cows, pigs, gardens, etc) and solar power (on average more feasible for co-ops since they tend to be located in places like Arizona).  The balance is pretty easily made up from non-member rental income or, in a pinch, long-term investments.

Albeit, all this is pretty contingent on a fairly dedicated core group of people willing to put a decent amount of time into making it work, and the freeloaders not getting in the way.  But it's more common than you'd think, honestly.

//That said, the guy you're responding to is clearly either terminally stupid or actively trolling.  I'm just pointing out that his troll is actually based in something that's demonstrably possible.
 
2013-03-06 09:10:19 AM

Jim_Callahan: That said, the guy you're responding to is clearly either terminally stupid or actively trolling. I'm just pointing out that his troll is actually based in something that's demonstrably possible.


Could be wrong, but I think he was hinting that he's institutionalized.
 
2013-03-06 09:13:44 AM
thumbnails.visually.netdna-cdn.com
 
2013-03-06 09:14:05 AM

doublesecretprobation: Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.

that's because you're an arrogant jackass who fails to realize that in this sense the term "organic" refers to a process as defined by the USDA certified organic standards.


Silly me - I never realised.
 
2013-03-06 09:18:27 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


I thought tri-chlor was either banned or effectively displaced from the dry cleaning business a decade ago?  I have an old bottle of it I break out for cleaning any kind of greasy or sticky glue residue that gets on anything in the house.  It used to be commonly used as a flux solvent after soldering.  Pretty sure it's considered carcinogenic and will rape your children in California.  I think what I used to use was called Chloro Clean and was marketed by GC Electronics in the 90s.  Glass bottle with green label.   Really good stuff.  All the echo friendly replacements didn't even come close (except the alcohol based flux removers did work reasonably well for just that particular application).  Prolly should have worn gloves when working with it back then...
 
2013-03-06 09:21:42 AM
Bondith:

Actually...

While that statement is true of trichloroethylene, the molecule in question is tetrachloroethylene (or perchloroethylene, the per- meaning "as much chloro as possible).  Each carbon is double-bonded to each other, and the other two bonds are occupied by chlorine.  Since there are no C-H bonds, it's technically not an organic compound.

/I'm usually on board with hippie-mockery, but I'm too much of a pedantic chemist to let this go.


According to Wikipedia:

    "There is no "official" definition of an organic compound. Some textbooks define an organic compound as one containing one or more C-H bonds; others include C-C bonds in the definition. Others state that if a molecule contains carbon―it is organic."

Perhaps we should just stick to the USDA definition and keep doublesecretprobation happy.
 
2013-03-06 09:22:44 AM

Bondith: While that statement is true of trichloroethylene, the molecule in question is tetrachloroethylene (or perchloroethylene, the per- meaning "as much chloro as possible).  Each carbon is double-bonded to each other, and the other two bonds are occupied by chlorine.  Since there are no C-H bonds, it's technically not an organic compound.


Actually, typically perchloroethylene would generally be considered an organic compound, the C-H bond thing is an arbitrary rule made up by a textbook more or less at random to explain why pure-carbon substances like graphite and metal alloys like steel aren't called "organic"... but that's not really the definition.

Full disclosure, there's not really a universal definition.  The distinction originates in pre-chemistry, with late-phase alchemists making the transition to full-on science carrying some of their old baggage about vital forces and so on.  While everyone pretty much agrees that carbon is involved, surface and materials chemists tend to discard the disqualification of graphite and diamond and refer to those as organic materials, and bench chemists tend to either ignore the question entirely (probably the wiser choice there) or back-end something about substituted bonds or reactivity leading to chirality (kind of a practical distinction) and call it a day.

The problem with the C-H distinction is that it claims that halons and a lot of multiple alcohols are "inorganic", which is kinda silly since a lot of those are pretty integral to organic chemistry and synthesis.

//This is apparently the the weird academic posts thread for today.
 
2013-03-06 09:24:45 AM
Poor Brooklyn. Poor, poor Brooklyn.

/Do hipsters urinate on the sidewalks too?
 
2013-03-06 09:27:08 AM

Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.


Preach on my organic chemistry brother.

/loved organic chemistry
 
2013-03-06 09:29:25 AM
well, the chemicals in dry cleaning are akin to urine. modern dry cleaning is based off the same chemicals from antiquity (back in those days, laundry services and tanning was always in the worst part of town because it smelled) and they used human urine.  so, enjoy your organic urine.
 
2013-03-06 09:30:59 AM

Big_Fat_Liar: I thought tri-chlor was either banned or effectively displaced from the dry cleaning business a decade ago?


TFA is talking about PERchloroethylene, i.e. Cl4C2 as opposed to trichlor, i.e. Cl3C2H.

I know it's kind of a dumb shorthand to use per instead of, say, tet-chloroethylene, but in our defense when we came up with this shiat it never really occurred to anyone that people that didn't automatically know that a fully functionalized ethylene molecule would have four Cl ligands would ever be using the IUPAC names for things in the first place.

It makes the structure obvious to scientists, but like a lot of things it doesn't translate immediately to layman's terms.  Also probably not clear to a layman why perchloro is going to be less active/chemically dangerous than trichlor, so... take our word for it, I guess?

//Or look up the MSDSes, I guess.
 
2013-03-06 09:36:11 AM
farm3.static.flickr.com

Have they re-discovered this guy yet?
 
2013-03-06 09:37:31 AM

Jim_Callahan: //This is apparently the the weird academic posts thread for today.


you can have your sciency academics, i'll stick to the classical academics

/ and now, I leave you with the croaking of frogs:  βρεχεχεχέξ χοάξ χοάξ
 
2013-03-06 09:38:13 AM

Sonneillon: "There is no "official" definition of an organic compound. Some textbooks define an organic compound as one containing one or more C-H bonds; others include C-C bonds in the definition. Others state that if a molecule contains carbon―it is organic."


Jim_Callahan: Actually, typically perchloroethylene would generally be considered an organic compound, the C-H bond thing is an arbitrary rule made up by a textbook more or less at random to explain why pure-carbon substances like graphite and metal alloys like steel aren't called "organic"... but that's not really the definition.


Huh...I'll be over here in the corner not talking.

/gotta be at the lab in 26 minutes
 
2013-03-06 09:40:14 AM
The important thing is the legal definition not the scientific definition. That and just how do you get organic urine and do you really want to wear it?
 
2013-03-06 09:44:02 AM

Bondith: Huh...I'll be over here in the corner not talking.

/gotta be at the lab in 26 minutes


Sorry, wasn't meaning to pile on to you there, that's just one of the classes I've taught, so I have a little spiel to explain to the undergrads why they don't get the standard "what is the definition of [subject of class]?" freebie on their first midterm.
 
2013-03-06 09:47:56 AM
I'm not a hippydippier BUT I would love one an organic dry cleaner near me. Do you know the toxic shiat they use to clean your close? Then you put them on and wear them next to your skin.......
 
2013-03-06 09:59:51 AM

Jim_Callahan: Bondith: Huh...I'll be over here in the corner not talking.

/gotta be at the lab in 26 minutes

Sorry, wasn't meaning to pile on to you there, that's just one of the classes I've taught, so I have a little spiel to explain to the undergrads why they don't get the standard "what is the definition of [subject of class]?" freebie on their first midterm.


My background is in nanoparticles and organometallic (where the definition is a metal-carbon bond), so I've come to disregard organic as "the stuff done by the people I make fun of".  I've also taught my class that carbon tetrachloride is an inorganic carbon-containing compound.  I probably shouldn't do that this summer, or at least bring up the uncertain definition.

/they're all ESL, so they won't get my jokes
 
2013-03-06 10:20:07 AM
I worry about my dry cleaners.  It's bad enough that I get light headed when I go to pick things up. Those poor saps that are in there eight hours a day must be practically brain dead.

That said, I live about 10 blocks from a superfund site so I'm pretty much pooched as it is.
 
2013-03-06 10:47:13 AM

Ikam: brandnewchair: I live in Bucktown/Wicker Park, Chicago. Ground zero for the hipster population.

/We have an organic dry cleaner.

I'm familiar with that dry cleaner (the one under the L stop, right?), but I've never used it.


There is one where I live next to the Costco on Clybourne. Highly recommend it.
 
2013-03-06 10:54:15 AM

Bondith: Sonneillon: This is what the silly tag was invented for, trichloroethlene is organic - it contains carbon. It's much the same as eating non-organic food is practically impossible.

/Most people look at me funny when I explain this to them.

Actually...

While that statement is true of trichloroethylene, the molecule in question is tetrachloroethylene (or perchloroethylene, the per- meaning "as much chloro as possible).  Each carbon is double-bonded to each other, and the other two bonds are occupied by chlorine.  Since there are no C-H bonds, it's technically not an organic compound.

/I'm usually on board with hippie-mockery, but I'm too much of a pedantic chemist to let this go.


"In summary, most carbon-containing compounds are organic, and almost all organic compounds contain at least a C-H bond or a C-C bond. Not all organic compounds necessarily contain C-H bonds (e.g.,)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organic_compound

BOOM Chakalaka!!!! Take *that* for pedantic.

/not a chemist, a computer scientist
//but to be fair I did take Organic Chemistry for fun.
 
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