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(Network World)   White House replies to petition: "It's time to legalize cell phone unlocking"   (networkworld.com) divider line 120
    More: Cool, White House, SIM lock, Librarian of Congress, DMCA  
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14259 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Mar 2013 at 4:19 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-04 02:49:34 PM  
Outrage in 5... 4... 3...
 
2013-03-04 02:56:04 PM  
I believe the phrase you're looking for is "re-legalize"
 
2013-03-04 03:02:02 PM  
Wow, now let's hope that this has some teeth and doesn't take 2 more years to implement.
 
2013-03-04 03:05:44 PM  

show me: Wow, now let's hope that this has some teeth and doesn't take 2 more years to implement.


Well, it's the President supporting deregulation, so it has an approximately zero percent chance of getting through the House.
 
2013-03-04 03:05:45 PM  
i1135.photobucket.com
 
2013-03-04 03:10:56 PM  

GAT_00: show me: Wow, now let's hope that this has some teeth and doesn't take 2 more years to implement.

Well, it's the President supporting deregulation, so it has an approximately zero percent chance of getting through the House.


I don't think it's so much deregulation as that it'll be a very narrow DMCA exemption for device unlocking.

Personally, I think the Copyright Office was doing some goofy gas when it issued its revised DMCA exemptions. What is the logic for making rooting and jailbreaking a phone perfectly legal for phones (i.e. exempt from DMCA), but illegal for tablets (i.e. not exempt from the DMCA) while simultaneously making it illegal to unlock your phone for different carriers?

It's this bizarre hodgepodge of exemptions that simply makes no sense whatsoever.
 
2013-03-04 04:08:16 PM  
Will Obama spend political capital on such an issue? I am wondering if this is only a glorified press release.
 
2013-03-04 04:22:20 PM  

Rincewind53: I believe the phrase you're looking for is "re-legalize"


De-criminalize.
 
2013-03-04 04:23:00 PM  
FTA: The issue came to a head recently when the Library of Congress allowed to expire an exception to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) that until then protected those who would unlock their cell phones and those carriers who would court their business.

The Library of Congress? I didn't realize they had legislative or regulatory authority.
 
2013-03-04 04:23:26 PM  
I'd view this one as an easy win for Obama.  The law pisses of a bunch of people and only benefits a few big corporations.
 
2013-03-04 04:23:38 PM  

GAT_00: Well, it's the President supporting deregulation, so it has an approximately zero percent chance of getting through the House.


And he's probably only supporting it on Obamaphones!!
 
2013-03-04 04:23:47 PM  

Mr Guy: Rincewind53: I believe the phrase you're looking for is "re-legalize"

De-criminalize.


Whatever.
1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-03-04 04:25:35 PM  

MBooda: De-criminalize.

Whatever.


Perspective matters.  If you emphasize the legalizing part, you emphasize the government giving back, as if they are being generous and offering something new.  De-criminalize points out that it's only illegal because of contractual profitability butthurtz.
 
2013-03-04 04:25:45 PM  
OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?
 
2013-03-04 04:26:29 PM  
Can we please lock stolen cellphones?   Other countries do this, which means other countries don't have a market for stolen cellphones.   We have the technology, and the ability--it's built into the systems.    However, our wireless providers would rather sign a new subscriber than shut down a stolen phone, and that is ridiculous.
 
2013-03-04 04:27:00 PM  

kpaxoid: OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?


Cablevision is suing Viacom in court over that right now. Stay tuned.
 
2013-03-04 04:27:35 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: I'd view this one as an easy win for Obama.  The law pisses of a bunch of people and only benefits a few big corporations.


I agree, as long as he does what the corporations say, they'll make sure he wins.
 
2013-03-04 04:30:31 PM  

kpaxoid: OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?


No

Please no

If the government gets involved in regulation of cable networks in a complex fashion we will see FCC obscenity rules apply to these stations. Now, I dont know about you, but I really appreciate the beauty of a woman's breasts. That kind of shiat goes bye-bye
 
2013-03-04 04:31:09 PM  
How about game consoles? PS3s are going to start hitting the pawn shops for a lot cheaper with the release of the PS4. I'd like to set up some linux on a dozen or two running together.
 
2013-03-04 04:31:52 PM  
If I buy a computer or gadget or tool from you, You no longer get to tell me what to do with it. 
It is mine.
Unless I mod it to kill, you STFU and take my money.
Once.
That is it.
It's a machine.
I bought it.
Kiss it goodbye.
You want to make money selling widgets?
Sell more widgets.
If I figure out how to hack a satellite and get free calls for life, fark you.
How the fark do you think the farking internet was invented?
 
2013-03-04 04:33:51 PM  
This is somewhat bad news for my buddy. He makes a small wad of cash by unlocking cellphones for people. From what I've seen on Craigslist, there are quite a few people who make their meager ends meet this way.
 
2013-03-04 04:34:46 PM  

Rhypskallion: Can we please lock stolen cellphones?   Other countries do this, which means other countries don't have a market for stolen cellphones.   We have the technology, and the ability--it's built into the systems.    However, our wireless providers would rather sign a new subscriber than shut down a stolen phone, and that is ridiculous.


This.

I'd like to see three things:
1. Phones which are not locked to a particular network.
2. Phones without network-specific crap. (That is, I want "stock" firmware from the phone manufacturer rather than from the network.)
3. Coordination with international authorities to block phones that have been stolen.
 
2013-03-04 04:34:47 PM  
And if you have paid for your mobile device, and aren't bound by a service agreement or other obligation, you should be able to use it on another network.

Gee, I wonder what the response from cell-phone and tablet makers will be.
 
2013-03-04 04:35:32 PM  
Even if we make it legal to unlock phones, it's not like the phone companies are going to make it easy for you.
 
2013-03-04 04:35:43 PM  
I thought I heard the sound of lobbyist briefcases clicking, the shuffle of feet, and doors slamming...

Good to know that was actually real.
 
2013-03-04 04:38:05 PM  

vudukungfu: If I buy a computer or gadget or tool from you, You no longer get to tell me what to do with it.


If you buy a phone outright, it's not going to be locked. If you take out a loan with your cell phone company like most people, they're going to lock the phone to make sure you keep paying.

Car loans often work the same way if you have poor credit. The bank can flip a switch if you miss to many lease payments and "your" car won't start anymore.
 
2013-03-04 04:40:24 PM  

DicksWii: How about game consoles? PS3s are going to start hitting the pawn shops for a lot cheaper with the release of the PS4. I'd like to set up some linux on a dozen or two running together.


Download the v3.15 or earlier firmware and you're good to go. You won't be able to connect to the PSN, but heck, you're building a linux cluster so why would you?
 
2013-03-04 04:40:33 PM  

heypete: I'd like to see three things:
1. Phones which are not locked to a particular network.
2. Phones without network-specific crap. (That is, I want "stock" firmware from the phone manufacturer rather than from the network.)
3. Coordination with international authorities to block phones that have been stolen.


Good news - your first two requests are already available.
 
2013-03-04 04:40:52 PM  

cman: kpaxoid: OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?

No

Please no

If the government gets involved in regulation of cable networks in a complex fashion we will see FCC obscenity rules apply to these stations. Now, I dont know about you, but I really appreciate the beauty of a woman's breasts. That kind of shiat goes bye-bye


Who watches women's breasts on TV these days?
 
2013-03-04 04:41:36 PM  

MrEricSir: If you take out a loan with your cell phone company like most people, they're going to lock the phone to make sure you keep paying


Why would you do that?

never mind, I do tech support for consumers who farked up.
People aren't too bright.

"taking out a load with a cell phone company. . . . "
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahha*gasp*ahhahahahahahaha h ahahahahahahahahaha

/Doesn't own one.
/Not even a itterbug.
//If I can't see what is in it and know there is no tracing device, I'm not carrying it.

GPS + Drones = Not good.
 
2013-03-04 04:41:56 PM  

kpaxoid: OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?


I'm really not a fan of a la carte programming.  Every proposal I've seen seems guaranteed to raise prices, to offset the losses of dropping package models, and to kill any hope of niche programming.
 
2013-03-04 04:42:19 PM  

heypete: 2. Phones without network-specific crap. (That is, I want "stock" firmware from the phone manufacturer rather than from the network.)


Verizon used to be the absolute world's worst about that garbage. They disabled a number of a phone's OEM built-in functions and required a fee to 'activate' them, or forced people to purchase apps to do something that the phone is designed to do natively. Not that many years ago, they even charged people a fee to enable bluetooth on some of their bluetooth models and locked early GPS chips to be accessible only by purchased-from-Verizon software.
 
2013-03-04 04:43:26 PM  
Did he ever finish solving the BCS playoff thingy, cuz that was really important?
 
2013-03-04 04:43:38 PM  

Mr Guy: MBooda: De-criminalize.

Whatever.

Perspective matters.  If you emphasize the legalizing part, you emphasize the government giving back, as if they are being generous and offering something new.  De-criminalize points out that it's only illegal because of contractual profitability butthurtz.


"De-criminalize" is often used to refer to a middle ground between something being legal and something being illegal, often in regards to drug law enforcement. I don't think that is where anyone wants to go with  phone-unlocking.
 
2013-03-04 04:44:36 PM  

Some 'Splainin' To Do: kpaxoid: OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?

I'm really not a fan of a la carte programming.  Every proposal I've seen seems guaranteed to raise prices, to offset the losses of dropping package models, and to kill any hope of niche programming.


So the only alternative is bend over, grab your ankles, grit your teeth and think about How I Met Your Mother reruns.
 
2013-03-04 04:45:01 PM  
What people aren't understanding here is that to utilize 4G some phones have to be designed specifically for certain frequencies. Unlocking it may do you no good anyway
 
2013-03-04 04:45:50 PM  

cman: kpaxoid: OK.

Can we add to that making it illegal to be forced to buy 300 cable channels when you watch only 2?

No

Please no

If the government gets involved in regulation of cable networks in a complex fashion we will see FCC obscenity rules apply to these stations. Now, I dont know about you, but I really appreciate the beauty of a woman's breasts. That kind of shiat goes bye-bye


The even bigger issue would be that the prices would likely go up for the same packages that most people have now, and channel diversity would suffer.  The big draw channels subsidize the lesser viewed ones at the moment, and if people have the option to opt-out, a lot of the niche channels could go away.

Plus, the really popular channels would end up being a lot more expensive anyway.  If they did go ala carte it wouldn't be a '$5 per month per channel' type of model.  ESPN, TNT, USA, etc would likely draw larger prices making any actual savings pretty minimal.
 
2013-03-04 04:45:58 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: The law pisses of a bunch of people and only benefits a few big corporations.


Which is exactly why the Republicans will filibuster this until the end of time.

/Good on Obama for choosing the right answer, though.
//No snark intended.
 
2013-03-04 04:46:12 PM  

vudukungfu: MrEricSir: If you take out a loan with your cell phone company like most people, they're going to lock the phone to make sure you keep paying

Why would you do that?

never mind, I do tech support for consumers who farked up.
People aren't too bright.

"taking out a load with a cell phone company. . . . "
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahha*gasp*ahhahahahahahaha h ahahahahahahahahaha

/Doesn't own one.
/Not even a itterbug.
//If I can't see what is in it and know there is no tracing device, I'm not carrying it.

GPS + Drones = Not good.


What the fark is wrong with you?
 
2013-03-04 04:46:14 PM  
Why don't we do something really noteworthy and nuke CDMA

/or whatever, so we end up with A STANDARD
//ONE.
///standard. one.
 
2013-03-04 04:46:39 PM  

Target Builder: "De-criminalize" is often used to refer to a middle ground between something being legal and something being illegal, often in regards to drug law enforcement. I don't think that is where anyone wants to go with phone-unlocking.


In this context, it's the exact same thing.  They added a criminal penalty to something that absolutely shouldn't have one.
 
2013-03-04 04:47:24 PM  

dv-ous: The Library of Congress? I didn't realize they had legislative or regulatory authority.


Lots of regulatory authority here in the US Copyright Office, located within, and under the budget of the Library of Congress.  (Been here 22 years.)  Lots of statues specifically empower the Register of Copyright or the Librarian of Congress to implement their regulation.
 
2013-03-04 04:47:52 PM  
Once we criminalized the phone unlocking, only criminals had unlocked phones.
 
2013-03-04 04:48:27 PM  

vudukungfu: MrEricSir: If you take out a loan with your cell phone company like most people, they're going to lock the phone to make sure you keep paying

Why would you do that?

never mind, I do tech support for consumers who farked up.
People aren't too bright.

"taking out a load with a cell phone company. . . . "
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahha*gasp*ahhahahahahahaha h ahahahahahahahahaha

/Doesn't own one.
/Not even a itterbug.
//If I can't see what is in it and know there is no tracing device, I'm not carrying it.

GPS + Drones = Not good.


Speaking of not being too bright, if you don't understand why loans exist or why people take them out, I have some bad news for you.
 
2013-03-04 04:48:55 PM  

Mattyb710: vudukungfu: MrEricSir: If you take out a loan with your cell phone company like most people, they're going to lock the phone to make sure you keep paying

Why would you do that?

never mind, I do tech support for consumers who farked up.
People aren't too bright.

"taking out a load with a cell phone company. . . . "
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahha*gasp*ahhahahahahahaha h ahahahahahahahahaha

/Doesn't own one.
/Not even a itterbug.
//If I can't see what is in it and know there is no tracing device, I'm not carrying it.

GPS + Drones = Not good.

What the fark is wrong with you?


He's stupid.
 
2013-03-04 04:54:55 PM  

RexTalionis: Cablevision is suing Viacom in court over that right now. Stay tuned.


And these guys support that suit very strongly.

http://www.americancable.org/

I'll be at their "Summit" next week, I imagine there will be a lot of talk about it.  I can chime in about that if there's ever a relevant thread, later.
 
2013-03-04 04:56:29 PM  
There's a hole in there response big enough to drive a truck through. They will only support unlocking /if/ your phone is paid for and off contract. For most people that means your two year old phone that has seen better days and that you don't want to use anymore. The majority of people with a smartphone are going to gain nothing from this at all.

Unless you pay cash for the full price of your phone up front (typically $5-$600 for a smart phone) you won't gain from this at all. Even if you do, nothing says that the carrier can't play games by claiming your phone is unsupported or some other such thing. This is nothing more than political hot air, move along, move along.
 
2013-03-04 04:58:36 PM  

MrEricSir: if you don't understand why loans exist or why people take them out


Hey, I'll borrow money from a bank.
they are FDIC insured.
Fly by night telecom?
No way
 
2013-03-04 04:58:40 PM  

cman: Will Obama spend political capital on such an issue? I am wondering if this is only a glorified press release.


I knew it wouldn't take long for the "Obama is saying something I agree with? I AM OUTRAGED AT HIM!!" posts.
 
2013-03-04 04:58:44 PM  

Rincewind53: I believe the phrase you're looking for is "re-legalize"

I'll believe it when I see it.

FTFY. Anybody believe the telcos will let this through? Not a chance. The lobbyists will be wining and dining like crazy tonight. Probably free hookers and blow for all, too. Whatever limits consumer freedom and choice.
 
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