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(NewsMax)   Conservative thinks that Howard Dean wants a running mate who can't legally be vice president until May 2005   (newsmax.com ) divider line
    More: Dumbass  
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14754 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Dec 2003 at 3:36 AM (12 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2003-12-19 11:05:51 AM  
[image from nationalreview.com too old to be available]
 
2003-12-19 11:06:00 AM  
TheConvincingSavant:

Of course things are going to look more and more difficult for him. The heat gets turned up as he gets more popular, it's to be expected and isn't worrying me in the least.

As to the Gore issue, yeah, there are still a lot of pissed off people. What happened in Florida was disgusting and went against what democracy stands for. People aren't likely to give it up any less than certain Republicans will ever give up Clinton's penis.
 
2003-12-19 11:06:59 AM  
BurnTime:

Starbucks? Uh, no. I'm a computer engineer making upwards of $90k a year. Nice try, though.
 
2003-12-19 11:07:21 AM  
/neo-fascist imperialistic chauvanist pig. :-P

Chauvanists are my favorite pigs, right after pot-bellied.

Pork...the other white meat.
 
2003-12-19 11:09:48 AM  
However, I do not want my tax dollars wasted on preserving someone's right to do things they are doing anyway.

Uh...care to point out those programs?
 
2003-12-19 11:10:25 AM  
2003-12-19 11:04:37 AM MyrnaMinkoff wrote:

Better sell all those Prince albums!!

Don't lie, you know you've got purple vinyl out the wazoo.

ROFLMAO - Thanks for the smiles - witty comment.
 
2003-12-19 11:12:01 AM  
It seems to me the best choices for Dean would be either Clark, Edwards, or Graham. Graham is hella popular in Florida and once again, the asshats from the Sunshine State are going to decide the whole banana. Kind of scary, actually.
 
2003-12-19 11:14:35 AM  
CatholicSamurai
zappaisfrank:
Yeah, man, I guess Ronald Reagan signing Gay-Rights legislature when he was President of the U.S. and Governor of California just made him dance down the yellow brick road with Falwell and Robertson.
______________________

Yea, we're talking about the same guy who thought AIDS was God's punishment to gay people! Sure, they can have rights (anything to get a few extra votes) but if they get a disease from buttfarking each other, then that's God's will! As someone who lived during his administration, I saw his alliances with the religious right plain as day..they were on the news all the time!
_____________
A hint of advice: Zappa's only achievement in existance was making tripping music and naming his kids really stupid names. Get a new hero.
__________
You know what, I don't need a fakring dinkwad you telling me who I should have for a hero. If you knew the first thing about Frank Zappa, you would know that he was not a drug user, nor did he make music for people to do drugs by. FZ was a very intellegent man. If you ever bothered to read anything that he had to say, be it in interviews, or in "The Real Frank Zappa Book" you would know that he had a very firm grip on reality, and could see things that blockheaded blinder wearing Republicans refused to see! His was a unique and educated viewpoint, unlike those who think Bill O'Reily and Rush Limbaugh are conveyers of fact.
I beleive there are a number of Farkers who will support me on this as well, and even if not, I don't care.
So keep your advice to yourself, thank you very little.
 
2003-12-19 11:16:23 AM  
2003-12-19 11:06:00 AM OsirisOTheDead

As to the Gore issue, yeah, there are still a lot of pissed off people.


Ah, you write this now, but a few moments ago you said my statement was silly. You can't have it both ways.

There's no telling what the left will come up with when Dean is severely trounced in 2004.
 
2003-12-19 11:16:46 AM  
zappaisfrank:

Hey, man, you don't have to defend your boyfriend to me. To each his own. But, I must tell you, the Reagans miniseries on Showtime was fiction. He didn't say that AIDS was punishment from God and he didn't tell the CIA to create crack to destroy the black males in the inner cities.
 
2003-12-19 11:18:07 AM  
2003-12-19 11:14:35 AM zappaisfrank wrote:
"Yea, we're talking about the same guy ((REAGAN)) who thought AIDS was God's punishment to gay people."

Find that somewhere outside a made for tv movie screenplay before you use it as fact. sheesh

btw, I like Zappa and the Mothers - I don't like political rhetoric and false information.
 
2003-12-19 11:18:24 AM  
TheConvincingSavant:

I'm not trying to have it both ways. You asked me if I'd let Dean drop if he lost next year. I said I would. That has nothing to do with the Gore issue. What's your point? Do you even have a point?
 
2003-12-19 11:21:48 AM  
2003-12-19 11:00:07 AM ESH

Not to argue, but Greg Palast offers some very interesting information about the 2000 election. There may be an overview on his website, but there is always his book, The Best Democracy Money Can Buy. As he tells it, there were some very suspicious goings-on in Florida and other places.
It's a good read, if you're interested.


Ol' Greg Palast. I'm always suspicious of someone who is praised by socialists.

Heads Up
 
2003-12-19 11:22:57 AM  
TheConvincingSavant:

You mean... you can't... .trust... socialists...?!?!?

I think I have to go to work now and try to recover from that harsh statement!!!
 
2003-12-19 11:24:05 AM  
OsirisOTheDead:

After reading your bio, Dean is the perfect candidate for you (I wish he'd take a stand on decrimilization of weed) although I am not sure if he will appeal to enough voters. His stance on gun control is very against his party's platform while his stand on gay rights is even a little too far to the left for some Democrats.

Too bad we can't have a candidate who really goes to bat for what he believes in instead of going to bat for what the party chairperson tells him to believe in.

//Still looking for representative government.
 
2003-12-19 11:24:57 AM  
My source for the gay comment on Reagan was The Discovery Times Channel TV specials "The Reagan Years". So, if they mislead me with false information, then I retract the statement.

As far as "defending my boyfriend" goes...I'm a married hetero male with a daughter. I don't have boyfriends. I just can recognize when someone has their eyes open to all sides of issues and can recognize when something is a buncha shiat. FZ had this ability and he wasn't afraid to say what was on his mind. He did not follow any political party affiliations (unlike you) he did his own research into issues and made up his own mind, something that he encouraged others to do as well.

Regarding your "boyfriend" comment (which seems to indicate you are questioning my sexual preference) usually those who call people gay have issues with their own sexuality. Perhaps this a problem of yours....
 
2003-12-19 11:26:33 AM  
AFVet:

He's willing to re-think his position on marijuana (at least the medicinal side of marijuana). His stance on some issues I don't agree with (e.g., death penalty, Israel should be able to assassinate suspected terrorists, etc) but I think he's generally a good guy who is very passionate about this country. That said, I'd support any of the Dems except Lieberman, Sharpton or Kucinich.
 
2003-12-19 11:27:12 AM  
2003-12-19 11:18:24 AM OsirisOTheDead
TheConvincingSavant:
I'm not trying to have it both ways. You asked me if I'd let Dean drop if he lost next year. I said I would. That has nothing to do with the Gore issue. What's your point? Do you even have a point?


My point is you seem to get worked up very easily, as your comments have illustrated. If you get worked up over so little, what will you do when your best hope has been defeated? After watching you take pot shots at me and others, it is a safe assumption that you have difficulty letting things die.
 
2003-12-19 11:28:15 AM  
2003-12-19 11:24:57 AM zappaisfrank wrote:

"My source for the gay comment on Reagan was The Discovery Times Channel TV specials "The Reagan Years". So, if they mislead me with false information, then I retract the statement. .........I just can recognize when someone has their eyes open to all sides of issues and can recognize when something is a buncha shiat."

Just like the Showtime Movie..... probably not a good idea to post your source for the Aids - God's Punishment apology with the above statement.

/still like the Mothers of Invention........
 
2003-12-19 11:29:32 AM  
CatholicSamurai:
I say prove it because if this really went on, we would still hear about it non-stop to this day. Libertarians would be screaming about it on talk radio, since it is a violation of American's rights.

The only people I hear bringing it up are liberals. Liberals who hate George W. Bush.

Hell, I live where they had a voting scandal. Here in St. Louis, we kept the polls open in the city far past the time when they were supposed to close. Most of the people who live in the city are black. Were they being disinfranchised? Nope. Were they voting illegaly? Yep.


I see you have completely missed my point. My point was that there is actually evidence that such wrongdoings (or just massive fark-ups, if you are being charitable) occurred. Did you even look at the article I linked? I thought they made a pretty compelling case.

And it is not the case that "if this really went on, we would still hear about it non-stop to this day." There are plenty of injustices that happen every single day that people don't get up in arms about because they either don't care, or they don't *know.* This story about the disenfranchisement of so many voters has been woefully ignored by the major media in this country. If someone does mention it, it is doubted, as in your case.

And please don't confuse the issue by implying that all voting scandals are cases of illegal voting. That may not have been your intention, but that is how it seemed to me. If it was not, I apologize.

Please read the article, and tell me what you think. If you think they don't make a compelling case, then we can agree to disagree. Until such time, I still think you are unjustified in thinking that it is not the case that bad stuff happened. Why do I think so? Because your only evidence is that a bunch of people couldn't "prove" it to you on the spot. There is better evidence out there. Here is the google search I did:
black voters disenfranchised 2000 florida election

Oh, and in the first 20 hits, I didn't see anything from BET. In fact, I saw quite credible sources, like the Guardian and CNN.
 
2003-12-19 11:31:10 AM  
A "bad" article on Newsmax has a lot more truth to it than any "good" piece of dirt some liberal thinks he has on Ann Coulter.
 
2003-12-19 11:31:12 AM  
ozoneman,
Actually, the 2000 election was the first one in recent memory where the taller candidate (Gore) lost. Throughout the 20th century, the taller guy's always been elected president.
Yeah, I'm a nerd.
 
2003-12-19 11:31:31 AM  
TheConvincingSavant:

*rolls eyes*

If Dean loses next year, I'll be working on whichever candidate comes out of the woodwork that I believe will be good for this country in 2008 (be it Democrat or Republican. I was really pulling for McCain for the last election because Gore sucks). I have been following and supporting Dean since August of last year. The Flordia deal is eternal and we need constant reminders to make sure nothing like that happens again. If someone wins in a fair mannor, I may not like who got elected but there's no point in pissing and moaning about it.
 
2003-12-19 11:31:59 AM  
2003-12-19 11:26:33 AM OsirisOTheDead wrote:

AFVet:

He's willing to re-think his position on marijuana (at least the medicinal side of marijuana). His stance on some issues I don't agree with (e.g., death penalty, Israel should be able to assassinate suspected terrorists, etc) but I think he's generally a good guy who is very passionate about this country. That said, I'd support any of the Dems except Lieberman, Sharpton or Kucinich."

Interesting that you eliminated Lieberman as a possibility. What is it about him that you won't support? Out of all the Democratic candidates he is the most appealing to me. Just as long as Mr. Theresa Heinz doesn't get the nomination, I can deal.
 
2003-12-19 11:34:07 AM  
A "bad" article on Newsmax has a lot more truth to it than any "good" piece of dirt some liberal thinks he has on Ann Coulter.

What the hell?
 
2003-12-19 11:35:44 AM  
Geez...have to get some marshmellows with all the flames around here.

1) Bush won Florida and the election. Get over it. There was no vast conspiracy. Old jews and blacks were not specifically targeted for "disenfranchisment". It never happened. Gore lost...repeatedly. I'm glad the courts finally stepped in to put the thing to bed.

2) The Bush bashing is just a little revenge for all the Clinton bashing. Suck it up. If the GOP can't take what they dish out, too farking bad ya whiners.

3) Dean is NOT the Democratic nominee yet. The primaries haven't happened yet. It pisses me off that two craptastic states like Iowa and N.H. get to decide who gets elected before I even get a chance to vote. We need a national primary system.

4) Bush is not part of some evil organization bent on world domination. Get over yourselves...please. I didn't vote for him for Governor. I didn't vote for him for President and I won't next time either. This does not mean he is in league with Satan. I just don't care for his policies.

5) Dean IS electable. 'Nuff said.

6) If the Democrats would have gotten off their asses and worked toward getting rid of the Electoral College when the iron was hot, we would not be facing yet another razor thin election. Pussies...

7) I am a Libertarian Party member and have voted strait ticket in every election since 1988. In 2004, however, I will be voting Democrat because it is quite clear that Republicans hate public school teachers (if you live in Texas, you know exactly what I am talking about).

That is all...
 
2003-12-19 11:36:29 AM  
For all of those not yet swayed by either side. What does Howard Dean stand for?

Beliefs
 
2003-12-19 11:36:38 AM  
AFVet:

I don't think he's electable, but that's not really answering your question. He has some strange ideas about morality (drug use is immoral?!) and I believe he's too theocratic to run such a diverse nation.

His voting record is pretty impressive (he stands for most of what I do) but I honestly don't like the guy.
 
2003-12-19 11:37:22 AM  
2003-12-19 09:47:31 AM Bauer
if he really wanted to 'seal' the black vote...he would choose sharpton.

I couldn't let that one pass without comment. Obviously, you don't know many black people. If you ever get a chance to have a conversation with a real live black person, give it a shot. You might be surprised to find out that Al's not exactly appealing or electable in black people's eyes. Or you could just project what you believe without any input. Your choice.
 
2003-12-19 11:39:08 AM  
2003-12-19 11:35:44 AM aesc wrote:
".....) I am a Libertarian Party member and have voted strait ticket in every election since 1988. In 2004, however, I will be voting Democrat because it is quite clear that Republicans hate public school teachers (if you live in Texas, you know exactly what I am talking about).

That is all..."

Full agreement on 1 through 5, not sure about 6 but what's with 7? Can you clarify why you believe the Republicans hate public school teachers?
 
2003-12-19 11:40:21 AM  
Conservatives THINK?
 
2003-12-19 11:41:26 AM  
aesc said: 4) Bush is not part of some evil organization bent on world domination.

Have you read the PNAC statements regarding that very subject, in which, most of the Administration (including Jeb Bush) is a signatory to?
 
2003-12-19 11:42:32 AM  
Oh and for the record, I know that Jeb is not "officially" part of the Administration and that he is Gov. of Flordia.

coincidence?
 
2003-12-19 11:42:50 AM  
OsirisOTheDead

Yeah Lieberman stands far to the right on some moral issues. I agree with you there but I also admire that he doesn't tap dance around the party line - he is either on it or off it - like McCain. That's why Lieberman appeals to me. I also am a HUGE fan of McCain and hope to see his name on a presidential ballot within my lifetime.
 
2003-12-19 11:44:06 AM  
AFVet:

Yup. If it's McCain vs. Hillary in 2008, I'll be all over McCain's campaign.
 
UES
2003-12-19 11:46:42 AM  
It's amazing to me how many Conservative Republican posters are geniuses at determining a year before the election if Dean can win or not, yet voted to nominate Bob Dole in 1996 (Great choice!) and worship the electoral genius of a guy who had a 17 point lead in August 2000 who then lost the popular vote.

If I thought the Republicans were nominating someone completely unelectable I would be laughing and keeping quiet, not working myself into a rage. If Dean is completely unelectable, what do you care if he's a Socialist tree-hugging hippie? He's not, but even if he was, why do you care? Are you so mentally unstable that you actually worry that someone you are ABSOLUTELY 100% CONVINCED can't win....will somehow win? How?

Jimmy Carter wanted to run against Ronald Reagan, because Reagan was too conservative and dopey- he was unelectable. He was worried about a more mainstream Republican like Ford or Dole.

I think that Bush wants to run against a no-talent assclown like Gephardt or Lieberman. They are predictable and weak.

Dean is fearless and inventive...my kind of scum.
 
2003-12-19 11:50:45 AM  
Well, I'll give my list for potential running mates for Dean (at least the ones I'd like to see...) in no particular order:

Wesley Clark (Former general and commander of U.N. forces in Kosovo)

Max Cleland (Former senator from Georgia, a Vietnam vet who lost both legs and an arm in combat)

John McCain (Senator who sponsored and supports fair campaign finance law)

Clark and Cleland both would provide strong foreign policy and military support to the Dean campaign which, truth be told, sorely needs it. Cleland's voting record better meshes with Dean's policies than Clark's and I have some concerns that Clark has too many skeletons in his closet that would come out during the election.

McCain's campaign finance position would work well with Dean's grassroots campaign and his current status as a Republican would help to get crossover votes.
 
2003-12-19 11:55:25 AM  
2003-12-19 11:44:06 AM OsirisOTheDead wrote"AFVet:

Yup. If it's McCain vs. Hillary in 2008, I'll be all over McCain's campaign."

Hillary Clinton is a horrible Senator. As a freshman, she should be out in her districts seeing what she can do for the people of New York State instead of flying around the world on our dime. She promised to bring companies to the upstate region if elected and has not done a thing.

I pray Dean is successful in getting rid of the "Clinton Legacy (Hillary)" and getting a new national party chairperson so we don't have to hear anymore of her rhetoric. She may believe she is for the people, but the people in NY know better. I am sure she'll do a thing or two in '05 but I hope by then it will be too late to get her re-elected.

//wishes she'd find a good man and settle down.
 
2003-12-19 11:57:06 AM  
AFVet


2003-12-19 11:24:57 AM zappaisfrank wrote:

"My source for the gay comment on Reagan was The Discovery Times Channel TV specials "The Reagan Years". So, if they mislead me with false information, then I retract the statement. .........I just can recognize when someone has their eyes open to all sides of issues and can recognize when something is a buncha shiat."

Just like the Showtime Movie..... probably not a good idea to post your source for the Aids - God's Punishment apology with the above statement.

_____________________

Perhaps not...I guess I thought an outlet like The Discovery Times channel would be a reliable source for information, since there doesn't seem to be any strong political alliances there. That's not the only place I have heard that comment, either...there were newspaper stories about when it was happening in the 80's. I remember reading them! (and they weren't op ed pieces, either!)
 
2003-12-19 12:07:47 PM  
2003-12-19 11:57:06 AM zappaisfrank wrote:

"...there were newspaper stories about when it was happening in the 80's. I remember reading them! (and they weren't op ed pieces, either!)"

An article was written by a leftist columnist for the Village Voice in the mid eighties and was picked up by a few papers but was also overwhelmingly disproven at that time. I'll try and find the writer's name/article but don't think it'll be on the net.

Village Voice newspaper was very anti-Reagan and would sling mud at him on a regular basis while he was in office. No legitimate newsource has ever reported that Reagan thought aids was God's Revenge against gay people.

Question the source, very few aren't biased.
 
2003-12-19 12:08:51 PM  
Ford is a little young--if he gets elected VP, and Dean is shot, we'd have a ~35 year old president. He's 33 now.

However, he does come across remarkably well in interviews; it's been very striking to me the two times I've seen him, and he seems to have more on the ball (and less bluster) than almost any other nationally recognized politician I've seen in the last few years. The people calling the very apt compliment "well spoken" a "racist gem" are knee-jerk jackasses, and ignorant at that.
 
ESH
2003-12-19 12:10:04 PM  
TheConvincingSavant
Ol' Greg Palast. I'm always suspicious of someone who is praised by socialists.

I'm always suspicious of someone who is suspicious of someone praised by socialists.
 
2003-12-19 12:10:10 PM  
The Dems could nominate Eisenhower and the Repubs would label him a "socialist", which is kind of amusing in a 50's kitschy kinda way, but after a while you just end up getting vaguely depressed over how many redneck nutcases are out there.
 
2003-12-19 12:15:48 PM  
I love good fiction, and hdhale delivers...

"Conservatives think that Bush is doing a great job.

As do about 60% percent of the American people. Does this mean that 60% of Americans are Conservatives?"

You are quoting polls written by the conservative-owned press. In the only poll that counts, Bush got less than half of the popular vote. And that was before he revealed what a world-class doofus he is.

__________________________

"Conservatives think that starting a war based on lies and then making profit on it is morally sound.

As opposed to Democrats, who started Vietnam based on lies."

And this is your justification for Iraq?? Great argument. Also, for the record, it was President Eisenhower (republican) who signed the treaty that committed us to Viet Nam. Both sides supported the escalation.
___________________________

"Conservatives think that revealing the name of an American spy is good politics.

No Conservative ever said that. Indeed the person who revealed the name may have been Liberal. Truth is we don't know."

Bush admitted that the leak came from his office. How many liberals do you think are on his staff?!
____________________________

"Conservatives think that spending record amount of tax dollars while giving tax breaks to the rich is good economics.

The tax cuts were designed to stimulate the economy, something that has been tried before by both Democrat and Republican administrations with success. With the economy stimulated, people spend more and revenues increase, thus much of the spending increases are covered. Aside from that, there is a *war* on. Naturally the government is going to spend more than it otherwise should. That said, I personally find it asinine that we are creating new entitlement programs (i.e. prescription drug benefit for senior citizens) and spending billions that should be going elsewhere."

Even republican economists have stated that Trickle-Down economics only works in the short run. Also, larger wars have been fought with less resulting deficit. At least we agree on your last statement.
_____________________________

"Conservatives think that there is nothing wrong with having an Attorney General whose been found guitly of violating the laws he's supposed to enforce (as long as it's a Republican).

Excuse me, but I don't recall John Ascroft being found personally guilty of anything, any more than Janet Reno who ran a similar ship was personally found guilty of anything."

Allow me to pull your head out of the sand. Just yesterday Asscroft was fined $37,000 for election code violations. The same laws he is paid to enforce. You did not know this because the conservative-owned press does not cover stories like that. Only "liberal" places like Fark. Even if you had known you would not have cared because Asscroft is a republican. Had Janet Reno done that you would be screaming for her resignation and spending tax dollars on an investigation.
______________________________

"Conservatives think that Enron executives are perfectly qualified to be put in charge of America's energy policy.

Amazing...care to quote your source for this information?"

Jeez, read the papers once in a while. Bush name Enron officials to his energy advisory panel and then tried to keep their names secret as "executive privilage". Several groups sued and the case is currently before the Supreme Court.
_______________________________

"Conservatives think that spending 45 million tax dollars to investigate a Democratic President's sex life is good. But no crime done by a Republican President, no matter how many people die, is worth investigating.

... As for the current President, if you care to bring formal charges against him, feel free. As he has done nothing illegal, try not to get your feelings hurt when you get laughed out of courtroom in America."

Techinically you may be right. Lying to America to justify a war may not be illegal. But it sure as hell should be.

________________________________

Also, the original poster left off a couple things.

"Conservatives think that having a vice president own 433,000 shares of stock in a company (quoting a congressional report) that has a lucrative no-bid contract is not a conflict of interest.

Conservatives think that Tommy Chong should be jailed at taxpayer expense while Ken Lay should walk free.
 
2003-12-19 12:32:46 PM  
Why Republicans hate teachers and public schools...

1) They are the biggest proponents of standardized testing under the guise of "accountability". So rather than actually teaching kids, they have turned schools into test factories where kids can fill out a bubble sheet, but don't actually know anything.

2) The Republican controled state house refused to adopt new social studies textbooks even though the ones in use were well over 10 years old. Nothing like history books that mention President Bush (the first one) and the war in Iraq (Gulf War I) but not Clinton, the Internet, or the final collapse of the Soviet Union. They only gave in when the textbook companies threaten to sue after spending millions of dollars developing new books and materials and then were told, "nevermind".

3) Republican state congress cutting our sick days from five a year to three and cutting our insurance allowance from $500 a year to nothing.

4) Republicans are the biggest cheerleaders for vouchers. Of course, it makes perfect sense to take money from cash strapped public schools with recognized cirriculum and standards and give it to the local private school ran from the basement of the church where no standards of any type exsist. That makes perfect sense! And lest not forget those wonderful Charter Schools (with a 90% failure rate).

I could go on and on, but there isn't much point. The worst one of the bunch is Rep. Ken Grussendorf (R-Arlington). This jackass proposed more anti-school legislation than I even thought possible last session. Every teacher I know has made it a personal crusade to get this farker voted out of office as soon as possible.
 
2003-12-19 12:40:18 PM  
Methinks I'll be voting for Dean, too bad I live in Texas though.
 
2003-12-19 12:53:18 PM  
AESC

The textbook situation is unbelievable. I'm glad the text book companies got it changed.

As far as sick days and insurance coverage, this is happening all over the private sector and has been for years. It was just a matter of time before it hit employees of the government (as it should).

I support vouchers and school privitization. I went to parochial school and compared to my life-long friends who went to public schools, I have done better in my life as a result of that. My choice at the time was public school in Boston the first year of forced busing.

I also think there needs to be accountability and I have yet to hear any side put a plan on the table that makes sense - send it to arbitration.

I also don't think tenure should exist in our educational system and don't think teachers' unions have the students best interests in mind but they do have a lot of power in determining policy - this isn't right.

I am not republican, democrat, conservative, etc..... I always look to find the logic and avoid the rhetoric.
 
2003-12-19 01:03:55 PM  
aesc,

1) You know, if the public school weren't cranking out idiots at an alarming pace you wouldn't need to worry about standardized tests.

We ranked 24th in match and science last year....there were only 25 countries tested. We just assumed we were smarter than the other 167 that were not tested.

2) Have trouble finding material on Clinton, the internet and the collapse of the soviet union? C'mon....you are a "professional educator" with unlimited internet and printing capabilities AND several months off.

3) Only three sick days off? But you still get snowdays, every conceivable holiday and an entire season, not to mention weekends? I'll trade you....pansy. I get twelve days off total....and I have to use those for holidays IF I get permission.

You get an insurance allowance? Does anyone besides a teacher know WTF that even is?

4) Vouchers put money into good schools and take it out of bad schools. It gives parents the most localized form of control over their childrens education. It also opens up the door for privatization.

What, are you afraid that a bunch on non-certified former professionals will be able to do something at a profit better than you can do while spending us into oblivion? Hey, if you're soooooooo good at your job you have NOTHING to worry about.

Please do go on.....take your time. I have a "free period" coming up.....no wait, I don't. I'm not a FARKIN teacher!!!!
 
2003-12-19 01:07:12 PM  
AFVet
Trust me, teacher's unions have very little power and absolutely none in Texas. We can't strike and heck, we technically can't even organize into anything other than "professional organizations". And as far as having the student's best interests, I promise you no one stays in the business longer than a couple of years if they don't. The working conditions just aren't worth it.

Most states got rid of tenure decades ago. And I wouldn't mind them cutting my days or insurance, but considering I spend about $2000 of my own money a year on supplies for my classroom, I think its kind of chicken-shiat to take what little benefits I do have away.

Now I recognize that there are some Republicans that are not anti-teacher. Rep. Toby Goodman does a pretty good job overall. Of course, his son is a teacher with a room right next door to mine, so that might have something to do with it.
 
2003-12-19 01:16:01 PM  
aesc,

(A) Name one "professional occupation" that doesn't have to pay for some of their own work expenses?

(B) Name another union whch has the power to negotiate raises before preliminary budgeting is done? IE, spend money on raises before money is spent on other areas?

In the private sector, raises are done after preliminary budgets are set which (since the raises are done with what money is left) tends to keep raises lower than 5-6 percent.

Don't take a five percent raises and then wonder why the band program is getting cut. People aren't stupid.
 
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