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(CNN)   "We bemoan the loss of compassion in society, but we revere this severe level of aggression in these programs, and I think it is a real problem," said Captain Obvious   (cnn.com) divider line 78
    More: Obvious, Captain Obvious, racial harassment, bullying  
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7953 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 Mar 2013 at 3:24 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-01 05:31:27 PM

sure haven't: Human nature is human nature. No matter how many feel-good-but-ultimately-useless "stop x" campaigns you throw at it.


i.qkme.me
 
2013-03-01 05:36:09 PM
Rik01: ***snip***

What do you think about rap music?
 
2013-03-01 05:42:58 PM
www.joblo.com
 
2013-03-01 05:46:56 PM

Gyrfalcon: In big cities, where there has always been a measurable reluctance to help strangers; or in rural areas where people are much more willing to help others regardless of who they are or what recompense they will receive.


It's weird, I've encountered exactly the opposite in every city and every rural/suburban neighborhood I've ever lived in.
 
2013-03-01 05:50:34 PM
Funny, when I read the Fark headline I totally expected this to be about Congress.
 
2013-03-01 05:51:24 PM

iheartscotch: I've got a crazy idea; maybe someone should punch Gordon Ramsey in the face every time he yells at someone.



Nah, give him a Glasgow kiss every time he gets up in someone's face.
 
2013-03-01 05:54:32 PM

iheartscotch: I've got a crazy idea; maybe someone should punch Gordon Ramsey in the face every time he yells at someone. Either, he will eventually quit, or he'll loose the tv show spot because his face looks like it had a close encounter of the shop grinder kind.


Yes, nothing quite says "I do not approve of aggression" quite like a punch in the face.
 
2013-03-01 05:55:14 PM

thamike: Gyrfalcon: In big cities, where there has always been a measurable reluctance to help strangers; or in rural areas where people are much more willing to help others regardless of who they are or what recompense they will receive.


It's weird, I've encountered exactly the opposite in every city and every rural/suburban neighborhood I've ever lived in.

Likewise.  Course I'm a stranger here myself but generally I find the close-knit rural types much less friendly than city folks. The worse of all are the suburban fly-over-country people.

Human nature is human nature; we just slap a veneer of civilization over the basics and hope for the best.
 
2013-03-01 05:55:38 PM

Rik01: If so many people are victims of bullying, why do they come home and watch it on television?

Because it's getting harder and harder to find anything except aggressive reality shows on TV.

I watched and show called 'Hillbilly Blood' and found it refreshing as it dealt with two guys up in the backwoods who helped each other and their families carve a living out of the wilds when no long term jobs were available. No swearing. No snide remarks. No biatching. No fights. Just and bunch of ingenious and often laborious work and transactions.

There were 4 episodes. I haven't found it since. However, I can find marathons of those idiot back woods duck call makers, gator hunters, squabbles on 'Gold Rush' and near fist fights on Swamp Loggers. Not to mention the couple of towing and repossession shows.

I look at the channel lineup that I pay quite a bit for and find it loaded with lame shows, old movies and tons of infomercials. I still haven't figured out why, what with having a mandatory series of sports channels included in most cable packages, I still have to get one of the few good programs I like pre-empted for basketball.

Remember the old saying 'you are what you eat'? Well, as much as you might deny it, you are also what you watch. Think about this; 'Twix' candy came out with a series of commercials promoting sharing. The actors would snap the candy bar and the announcer would say 'and one for you'. Shortly after, they promoted a similar saying, only the actors kept the candy, saying 'and none for you'.

Ever watch 'Law and Order SVU'? Notice the 'subtle' message concerning any form of 'sex offender'. Basically, they're treated like dirt even if what they did was minor and as kids or are complying with the law and haven't re-offended.

'Leave It to Beaver' shows transformed into 'Roseanne'. Ads showing clips of new movies have been heavily edited to lie to you and make the movies seem much better than they are. Ever pay a small fortune to go see one and find out t ...


I don't know who you are, but I want to marry you.
 
2013-03-01 05:59:56 PM

Fluid: Hypocrisy isn't a particularly new phenomenon in people, so this comes as no surprise.

..

Exacly... if docors around the world swear by i, hen who are we o argue?
 
2013-03-01 06:52:42 PM

Rik01: If so many people are victims of bullying, why do they come home and watch it on television?

Because it's getting harder and harder to find anything except aggressive reality shows on TV.

I watched and show called 'Hillbilly Blood' and found it refreshing as it dealt with two guys up in the backwoods who helped each other and their families carve a living out of the wilds when no long term jobs were available. No swearing. No snide remarks. No biatching. No fights. Just and bunch of ingenious and often laborious work and transactions.

There were 4 episodes. I haven't found it since. However, I can find marathons of those idiot back woods duck call makers, gator hunters, squabbles on 'Gold Rush' and near fist fights on Swamp Loggers. Not to mention the couple of towing and repossession shows.

I look at the channel lineup that I pay quite a bit for and find it loaded with lame shows, old movies and tons of infomercials. I still haven't figured out why, what with having a mandatory series of sports channels included in most cable packages, I still have to get one of the few good programs I like pre-empted for basketball.

Remember the old saying 'you are what you eat'? Well, as much as you might deny it, you are also what you watch. Think about this; 'Twix' candy came out with a series of commercials promoting sharing. The actors would snap the candy bar and the announcer would say 'and one for you'. Shortly after, they promoted a similar saying, only the actors kept the candy, saying 'and none for you'.

Ever watch 'Law and Order SVU'? Notice the 'subtle' message concerning any form of 'sex offender'. Basically, they're treated like dirt even if what they did was minor and as kids or are complying with the law and haven't re-offended.

'Leave It to Beaver' shows transformed into 'Roseanne'. Ads showing clips of new movies have been heavily edited to lie to you and make the movies seem much better than they are. Ever pay a small fortune to go see one and find out the exciting scenes you saw in previews on TV are actually several separate parts of different actions edited together? (The movie 'Flight' with Denzel Washington seemed exciting when he flipped that jet liner over to fly it in for a safe landing. Turns out it was a lengthy, boring story about an alcoholic commercial pilot.)

We learned with early MTV Reality shows that behind the scenes, the producers egged the participants on to create conflict.

Look at 'Hardcore Pawn'. Customers, mainly the black ones (nothing like stereotyping) start fights at an instant's notice over stupid things. The son tries to sell the business out from under the Dad and he and his sister always squabble about something. Plus, you learn that if you ask for the full value of an item, you're only going to get 35 to 50% because resale profits these days have gone from 10% over cost to 100%.

Over the years, it's been known that as the entertainment media increases, people start to mimic the behavior. (Monkey see. Monkey do.) It became much more noticeable when GTA games came out -- and after the fuss, the designers refused to accept any responsibility and continued to churn out violent and warped versions with impunity.

Cowboy and Indian shows were popular when I was a kid, with the Indians being blood thirsty savages. Naturally, our play games imitated this. Hollywood took ample liberties with the facts. There was no mention until much later that we were the invaders on their lands.

Cable TV brought blood and guts into the home with HBO, the first station to show graphic gore in movies out of the theater. Previously to that, you could watch a WW2 movie and see soldiers getting bloodlessly killed, falling in dramatic poses.

After wards, you got to watch their heads explode in a red mist, if they stepped on a mine, you saw body parts fly into the air and a partially dismembered, still living man screaming on the ground. The entire horror genre went into high gore mode, with impossible amounts of blood and scattered guts. Displaying someone getting their limbs ripped off was 'cool'.

It's a psychological fact that if you are exposed enough to cruelties, you start to loose empathy and sensitivity.

Ever wonder why the pioneers had some harsh attitudes? No pain killers. Nearly every medical treatment hurt like hell. Surgery was done with the patient awake. Pain was a normal part of their lives and reflected in their attitudes.

People learn how to act from the TV. Then, we're surprised when the Internet openly teaches kids how to make pipe bombs -- and they do. That was followed by TV shows where they went into excruciating detail on how the cops tracked down criminals -- who promptly learned what traces not to leave.

There have been several family shows where the assorted characters are just nasty towards each other -- but that's made 'O.K.' because they profess their love. (I've hated 'Dallas' since the show began.)

Once you start to desensitize, your attitude changes in many ways. You carry it home to your family and friends.

I don't know about you, but that reality show about practical jokers sucks. If I had friends like that, they'd be gone.

Now, I watch the Mentalist and Castle, both intriguing shows and humorous. You don't see the nasty squabbles among cops like on 'Southland'. I watch 'Dual Survival', but since one partner has been replaced, the new guy seems to want to argue more. I watch Survivor Man. I enjoy the new Law and Order with Jeff Goldblume.

I gave up on every 'real' ghost hunting show because, IMO, they're all faked crap. I love good science fiction, but the Syfi channel hasn't had anything resembling that on in years. Basically, it's a wrestling and game show channel now. I watch 'Pickers' and find it hard to grasp how someone will let stuff rot in a field and then ask major bucks for the stuff when the pickers arrive. However, the stars are cool. "Oddities' is cool, but the stuff they deal in is kind of gross. However, all of the characters are nice and there's no squabbles.

HBO and the writers strike changed TV forever and folks seem too stupid to realize they're being manipulated. (3/4 of the Reality shows are coached to make them more exciting.)

A little parable here. Years back, a little girl dying of cancer wrote a book. It was a big hit. Everyone made a fuss about it. Since then, more kids have written books and more folks die of cancer and now, no one really gives a shiat because they've been inundated with dying kids and people and cancer.

Plus our current technology allows the Lunatic Fringe to do almost what they want online in front of millions of people. It becomes harder to tell truth from fiction. (Like those faked Youtube videos.)

Subconsciously, it affects you.
(See how fast that crappy way of holding a gun sideways caught on from gangs? You're lucky if you hit the broad side of a barn that way, but it's 'cool' and people copy it to be 'tough'.)

So, what does this say about current society?

Monkey see. Monkey do.


You couldn't find a ghost hunting show that wasn't faked? The hell you say.
 
2013-03-01 06:56:29 PM

i upped my meds-up yours: Healthy people feel comforted when seeing another person mistreated because it's not them. Anyone who empathizes is maladjusted. Compassion kills, as that guy said in the bunker in Berlin just before he shot his wife, his dog, and himself.


You really shouldn't be quoting from "The Sociopath's Guide to Life" without the author's express permission. That guy will fark you up.
 
2013-03-01 07:04:13 PM
A friend of mine died not too long ago.  Real community guy.  I doubt the guy made anything more than the usual 15 minutes in the local news in his entire life, but seven hundred people attended his funeral.  When you go, how many people will give a rat's ass, let alone take the time out of their busy lives to celebrate your life?

No one said doing the right thing is easy.  Being an asshole, though. . . Even the most pathetic, stupid and useless piece of shiat society ever had the misfortune to put up with can do that.
 
2013-03-01 07:14:15 PM
The fact is, this is almost literally all Dr. Spock's fault. He created an entire generation of sociopaths. Now that generation is in charge.
 
2013-03-01 07:45:59 PM
'We' are not one person, or one group.

This is like asking 'why do we say we hate meat, with all these anti-meat ad campaigns, but then, so many people eat meat?'

The whole idea that America is filled with a bunch of people who think the same way is BS, obviously.

Are the people promoting the anti-bully stuff the same as the people who watch kitchen nightmare bride wars or whatever the fark?

Maybe.  Maybe not.  If they ARE the same people, that might mean those individual people are hypocrites.

Pretending like somehow there's  a unified culture that needs to be in agreement with itself?

Delusional and shtupid.
 
2013-03-01 07:51:22 PM

JWideman: The fact is, this is almost literally all Dr. Spock's fault. He created an entire generation of sociopaths. Now that generation is in charge.


I prefer to think of Spock as a multiple.  After all, people had to be gullible enough to accept his tripe as sound.
 
2013-03-01 07:56:59 PM

Pincy: Wasn't there a documentary about this a few years back?  I believe it was called Idiocracy.


www.fairfaxunderground.com
 
2013-03-01 07:58:12 PM
FFS

Pincy: Wasn't there a documentary about this a few years back?  I believe it was called Idiocracy.


25.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-03-01 09:58:59 PM

VendorXeno: A lot of people are approaching this from a, "you CAN'T HANDLE BULLYING?!" position, which is not the point. Here is the point.

I have watched about ten minutes total of Gordon Ramsey, who is a perfect example of this phenomenon. In the course of that, he screamed insults at a guy, staged a dramatic scene of running to the bathroom and throwing up because food he was served was so bad, etc. Now, the issue here is not whether people can endure that abuse, or whether farkers could, or whether an, "army drill instructor is SO MUCH WORSE," or whether your hate you abusive father, etc. The issue is that people seem to like watching this, which is, honestly, kind of revolting. Being able to handle some twatsicle acting like Ramsey is one thing. Wanting anyone to act like that, encouraging it, paying for it, considering it entertaining? That's another. That's a, "what the fark's wrong with you people," issue.


The other issue is that some level of this kind of thing may be essential to preserving society. How many wars would we have lost without drill sergeants?
 
2013-03-01 10:10:51 PM
The funny thing is, some people get all wound up about video games causing violence totally forgetting or ignoring that crime rates have been dropping at least since the advent of pixel-based violence, perhaps even earlier. I actually see violent video games when played by people in their mid to late teens or adulthood as typically being an outlet for latent aggression that doesn't cause harm to actual people. I would guess most people occasionally still have violent urges, but blasting up zombies, aliens or some other computerized foe seems to be enough for most people. People seem to forget that humans can and have been very violent without playing video games.  Unfortunately some people aren't going to find gaming a sufficient outlet for violent urges, the majority of such people are probably mentally disturbed somehow. Our falling crime rates suggest to me that those more violence-prone people are rarer than those that play violent games and are not inclined towards violent activity. Some of the sickest torture and execution methods were created well before computers or consoles existed. You can't blame the implementation of "hanging, drawing and quartering" people on WoW.

I would guess that the advent of birth control also has had an effect on the situation since there's probably less people in poverty than there otherwise would have been, more attention can be paid to children in smaller families, and more resources can be allocated per child. Less people means less crime typically for an array of reasons, including that there's less people to commit crimes in the first place.

Anyway, back to my point about humanity earlier. I don't think we're any less compassionate than a generation or even a dozen generations ago were. People have every bit as much potential now as they did in the past for behavior across the spectrum. Generally it seems more likely for a group to somehow treat outsiders as pariahs or at treating them cautiously instead of with generosity, unless of course they're being paid to treat the outsider with hospitality. Tribalism still exists today, it's just formatted a bit differently than it once was.

I also don't think "kids these days" are less respectful than they were years ago, it's just a perception issue for the adults, seemingly noticed by adults particularly after they've hit middle age. Once you get to a certain crotchety level, people think kids are all malevolent little turds, and the generation they came from was somehow filled with perfect, authority-figure respecting, little angels by comparison. I can almost guarantee that their crotchety brains are either refusing to recall correctly or have lost the ability to rationally compare how they behaved with how kids today do because the time elapsed since their youth has colored their perception. I'm pretty sure kids have always found ways to get in trouble doing things like having sex, drinking alcohol, doing drugs, vandalism and so forth, older currently living generations were no exception. There's no magical generation of perfectly obedient kids, nor do I expect there ever will be. Kids have always done stupid things because their brains weren't done developing.
 
2013-03-01 10:13:47 PM
What no Donald Trump or are they still kissing his ass?
 
2013-03-01 10:15:24 PM

Great Janitor: Gordon Rasmey is a bully???  Clearly the person who thinks that has never had any real experience with an Army or Marine drill instructor or drill sergeant.  And that's really how I view Gordon Rasmey.  He's a restaurant drill sergeant.  He's going to ride you and expect a certain level of output from you in all areas, but it's not because he's a sadist, but because he's your last chance at keeping your restaurant alive.


He's not, apparently, though God help me for linking to a Cracked article as proof of anything.
 
2013-03-01 10:28:23 PM

Great Janitor: Slaves2Darkness: Active introvert: In a hundred years, I envision a world were people are locked up in small rooms. We have no physical interaction with others for fear of being bully, disrespected, offended or placed in any other discomfort. All interaction will be done by video after it has been screened by the government to "protect us".

In a hundred years, I envision a world where the word bully is considered old English, it has to be looked up, and the school children of the time can't even conceive of the concept. A world where socialism is the norm and paying your taxes means giving 10% of your time to the state. Where capitalism is dead, because there is no need for it, but the way we compete is with new ideas for which our rewards are social not monetary.

Much like my nephews can't hardly conceive of judging some one because of their sex or skin color. Where the biggest fights they have are with bigots, particularly religious bigots.

So, in 100 years you want us all to be slaves?  When you say that all must give 10% of their time to the government without compensation, it's slavery pure and simple.


No, it's not, and it's really sad that you're incapable of seeing that.

As for the rest, about people giving voluntarily, there's a book called "Shantung Compound" that puts that myth to rest.  If your goal is to be smug, then sure, go for a purely voluntary system.  If your goal is to see that hungry people actually get fed, then you need some degree of compulsion.  Such as taxes, for example.
 
2013-03-01 10:33:18 PM

sure haven't: Human nature is human nature. No matter how many feel-good-but-ultimately-useless "stop x" campaigns you throw at it.


I remember a thought I had when I read "Lord of the Flies" as a kid in school: If human nature is so terrible and society is such an unnatural, fragile construct that will break down as soon as people begin to show the true darkness lurking within, then how did we get society in the first place?  And why didn't it all break down yesterday or last week?
 
2013-03-01 10:59:43 PM

ciberido: Great Janitor: Slaves2Darkness: Active introvert: In a hundred years, I envision a world were people are locked up in small rooms. We have no physical interaction with others for fear of being bully, disrespected, offended or placed in any other discomfort. All interaction will be done by video after it has been screened by the government to "protect us".

In a hundred years, I envision a world where the word bully is considered old English, it has to be looked up, and the school children of the time can't even conceive of the concept. A world where socialism is the norm and paying your taxes means giving 10% of your time to the state. Where capitalism is dead, because there is no need for it, but the way we compete is with new ideas for which our rewards are social not monetary.

Much like my nephews can't hardly conceive of judging some one because of their sex or skin color. Where the biggest fights they have are with bigots, particularly religious bigots.

So, in 100 years you want us all to be slaves?  When you say that all must give 10% of their time to the government without compensation, it's slavery pure and simple.

No, it's not, and it's really sad that you're incapable of seeing that.

As for the rest, about people giving voluntarily, there's a book called "Shantung Compound" that puts that myth to rest.  If your goal is to be smug, then sure, go for a purely voluntary system.  If your goal is to see that hungry people actually get fed, then you need some degree of compulsion.  Such as taxes, for example.


Yes, that is pretty much the very definition of slavery. Report somewhere against your will, do work for the betterment of someone that's not you, for free or be punished.  Not pay your taxes and you go to prison.  I would imagine that failure to submit your required 10% of your free time to the community would also result in fines or imprisonment.  Again, if you don't back up compulsory service with a fine or prison for not doing it, then there is no way to force people into doing it.  It also backs up my claim that it's slavery.

And as for taxes, let's put a farking stop to the idea that we need to raise taxes so the government can care for the hungry and homeless.  The more taxes increase, the more the middle class suffers.  Let's cut federal spending.  In 2011 the Federal Government collected almost 2.5 Trillion dollars in taxes.  Instead of saying "Let's raise taxes to feed the poor and homeless", why not cut the spending so we can find the money collected to feed the poor and homeless.  We have a spending problem when in a nation where we have less than a million people homeless, we collect $2.5 trillion in taxes and we STILL can't find the money to feed the homeless without raising taxes???  No, we have the money, we just need to spending on projects that aren't needed.
 
2013-03-01 11:22:08 PM

Rik01: Because it's getting harder and harder to find anything except aggressive reality shows on TV.


Not really.

There's plenty of stuff on that isn't "reality programming". People just don't want to watch it.

People may think news programs are boring. You may think opinion programs are too partisan and polarized. You may think sitcoms are not funny. You may think dramas are shallow and not very interesting. But there are plenty of them out there.

And of course there's always the off button. I don't think they've started selling TVs without that yet.
 
2013-03-02 02:06:46 AM

Slaves2Darkness: Much like my nephews can't hardly conceive of judging some one because of their sex or skin color. Where the biggest fights they have are with bigots, particularly religious bigots.


They've managed to trade castigating entire genders and races based on the worst examples for castigating entire societies based on the worst examples. Truly, they are the best generation ever.
 
2013-03-02 05:13:06 AM

FriarReb98: JWideman: The fact is, this is almost literally all Dr. Spock's fault. He created an entire generation of sociopaths. Now that generation is in charge.

I prefer to think of Spock as a multiple.  After all, people had to be gullible enough to accept his tripe as sound.


It came out when tobacco companies were still advertising that their cigarettes were recommended by 4 out of 5 doctors. So, pretty much.
 
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