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(NPR)   Republican college students spell doom for the GOP: Many are leaning Libertarian because the GOP is medieval on social issues, and even those who parrot Fox News talking points admit the party may have lost voters for the next 50 years   (npr.org) divider line 467
    More: Obvious, Fox News, GOP, Republican, talking points, lecture hall, political parties in the United States, students  
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3762 clicks; posted to Politics » on 01 Mar 2013 at 11:39 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-01 12:00:29 PM  

HellRaisingHoosier: FTFA: Sophomore Miranda Onnen says after graduation, fiscal realities will begin to take hold for her generation and priorities will shift. "We're also the ones who are going to have to pay for Obamacare," Onnen says. "A lot of people don't necessarily connect those things. They say, 'Oh, well, health care is great. I get to be on my parents' health-care plan until I'm 26.' Well, once you turn 27, you have to pay for that. And especially with the joblessness rates being what they are, I think that's going to hit kids our age pretty hard."


What does a sophomore at Ohio State University know about the financial situation of life? Nothing. Mommy and daddy or John Q. Public is paying for her way right now.

Guess what kid? I don't want to pay for your education, healthcare, protection or social services either over the course of your life, but I did, because I want to live in a 1st world society and not some 3rd world libertarian shiat-hole.


I especially love "Well, once you turn 27, you have to pay for that." as an argument against Obamacare.  Because without it, you'd have to pay for that much earlier than 27.
 
2013-03-01 12:00:34 PM  
The only "libertarian" principles these Libertarians have is drugs and samer weddings.
 
2013-03-01 12:01:20 PM  
Conservatism, Real Conservatism, is strong in our nation's colleges and universities but the liberal media skewing the polls to make it seem like conservatism isn't strong.  In the 3 years I've been at Liberty University , not once has anyone asked what my political feelings are.  I bet the students at Stanford or the University of Michigan get asked all the time.
 
2013-03-01 12:01:20 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: hubiestubert: It wasn't Romney.

In other words you voted for Obama.


AHA!!!! Indisputable proof that hubie is a libby-libby-libby-lib and should never try to claim he is a moderate or conservative because ehe voted for the Kenyan socialist.  Get out of our party and never come back you traitor!!!
 
2013-03-01 12:01:24 PM  
"May have" lost voters for the next 50 years?  I'm 24 years old, and I can speak for myself and the vast majority of my friends (most of whom weren't particularly politically inclined before) when I say that the GOP has, without question, lost voters for 50 years at a minimum.  I currently don't plan to vote for any Republican at any level of government for the rest of my life, period.   I'm not saying I'm an automatic Democratic vote, but I'll vote for anyone short of Neo-Nazis before I vote GOP.

The GOP is profoundly screwed when the old people start dying off in droves.
 
2013-03-01 12:01:26 PM  

pdee: Mercutio74: dittybopper: So remind me again why I shouldn't vote libertarian?

The only thing that libertarian fiscal policy leads to is a failed nation?  That's a good enough reason for most.

Cite?


The entire third world.
 
2013-03-01 12:01:30 PM  

dittybopper: So remind me again why I shouldn't vote libertarian?


Because libertarianism is about as politically viable as communism? Less viable, actually. There are communist countries, but no libertarian ones. Unless you argue that Somalia is a libertarian state.

Libertarians just may as well call themselves "shamed Republicans."
 
2013-03-01 12:01:46 PM  

A Dark Evil Omen: "Libertarians" are a bunch of authoritarian corporatist gasbags who pay lipservice to social issues as a vote-getting strategy.


Citation please, otherwise, you're just coming off as an ignorant gasbag with zero understanding of the LP.

We're about as anti-authoritarian as you can get without being an anarchist.
 
2013-03-01 12:01:54 PM  

The Name: And even then, "Libertarian" is often just a stop on the road to outright "liberal."  It'll probably take just a couple more years of college (and if not by then, certainly grad school) for some of these kids to realize that libertarianism is just a big of a crock as regular old Republicanism.


It takes about that long for someone to figure out that "the free market will police itself" is bullshiat.
 
2013-03-01 12:01:56 PM  

slayer199: Ah, good to see all the Fark libs and conservatives hating on the LP.  Republicans hate us because of our social liberalism and Democrats hate us because of our fiscal conservatism.     Both sides do everything they can to exclude the LP (and the Green Party) from the process.  Why?  Fear.  A party that promotes social liberalism, fiscal conservatism, personal responsibility and smaller government will resonate with voters.


It would, if such a party existed. The libretartian party thinks we can simply free market the poor into not existing, which has never worked in the history of humanity, and the majority of this country doesn't think Dickensian England would be a nice place to live.
 
2013-03-01 12:02:04 PM  

DamnYankees: hubiestubert: winds of the Hell of Being Flayed Alive will still and stall

No way you just made this up. What Iron Maiden song is this a lyric from?


Former Republicans got a lot of hells.

// it's all in the reflexes
 
2013-03-01 12:03:38 PM  

slayer199: We're about as anti-authoritarian as you can get without being an anarchist.


Except getting screwed over and lorded over can come from factions that *aren't* the government.
 
2013-03-01 12:04:19 PM  

slayer199: Both sides do everything they can to exclude the LP (and the Green Party) from the process. Why? Fear.


No, it's because the Republicans already have the whole libertarian corporate will-to-power thing pretty well covered.  It's just redundant to have libertarians involved.

As for the Green Party, Republicans exclude them because they oppose the aforementioned corporate oligarchy, and the Democrats exclude them because they're largely a bunch of loons who don't even take politics seriously enough to try to compete.
 
2013-03-01 12:05:14 PM  

slayer199: A Dark Evil Omen: "Libertarians" are a bunch of authoritarian corporatist gasbags who pay lipservice to social issues as a vote-getting strategy.

Citation please, otherwise, you're just coming off as an ignorant gasbag with zero understanding of the LP.

We're about as anti-authoritarian as you can get without being an anarchist.


And yet the LP has a long list of legislative demands and when it comes to public policy they're always behind the "fiscal conservatives" and never seem to have any interest in doing anything on social issues. They take endless corporatism and expansion of corporate power as simply read.

I aman anarchist and it is plainly obvious that the LP is as authoritarian as the Dems and Repubs, if not moreso. At least the Democratic party tries to take the edge off the violent capitalist policies they support.
 
2013-03-01 12:05:30 PM  

Felgraf: Except getting screwed over and lorded over can come from factions that *aren't* the government.


Quiet you, or I'll wall you up in the old coke oven!
 
2013-03-01 12:05:42 PM  

Felgraf: Except getting screwed over and lorded over can come from factions that *aren't* the government.


Libertarians would be more trustworthy if they advocated for protection against monopolies.
 
2013-03-01 12:06:04 PM  

Libertarianism is often used as a rational for Social Darwinism which is hardly liberal on social issues.

These college students may be the subgroup where


Libertarian = Republican who likes marijuana and prostitutes.
 
2013-03-01 12:06:34 PM  

HairBolus: Libertarianism is often used as a rational for Social Darwinism which is hardly liberal on social issues.

These college students may be the subgroup where


Libertarian = Republican who likes marijuana and prostitutes.


Bingo.
 
2013-03-01 12:06:55 PM  

slayer199: Ah, good to see all the Fark libs and conservatives hating on the LP.  Republicans hate us because of our social liberalism and Democrats hate us because of our fiscal conservatism.     Both sides do everything they can to exclude the LP (and the Green Party) from the process.  Why?  Fear.  A party that promotes social liberalism, fiscal conservatism, personal responsibility and smaller government will resonate with voters.


Actually, I'm a liberal and I voted for the Green Party in the last elections.
- The Republicans are crazy, so they're out
- The Democrats are moderately conservative, so they're not necessarily out but certainly not my first choice
- The Libertarians can't do math. Austrian economics and consumption taxes have not worked, do not work, and will not work. Money flows up in an efficient capitalist system, every single time.

That leaves a write in candidate. I was torn between Jill Stein and writing in Larry Ellison, because he's one of a few people who I agree with on economic issues and literally can't be bribed should he take office.
 
2013-03-01 12:06:57 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: hubiestubert: It wasn't Romney.

In other words you voted for Obama.


He was the only sane choice. And I've been fairly free about that for over four years now. I gave up my party affiliation this year, after the Primary, because the party has lost its way. I tried for years to try to help steer us out of the hole, but folks kept saying "DIG FASTER! IT'S THE ONLY WAY!"
 
2013-03-01 12:07:11 PM  

Mercutio74: pdee: Mercutio74: dittybopper: So remind me again why I shouldn't vote libertarian?

The only thing that libertarian fiscal policy leads to is a failed nation?  That's a good enough reason for most.

Cite?

Look at any country with a very conservative fiscal policy.


you can't govern a large and diverse country with a anarchistic or even minarchistic government. It just won't work. However, folding aspects of libertarianism into our modern, largely statist government is not a bad thing.
 
2013-03-01 12:07:31 PM  

Noam Chimpsky: The only "libertarian" principles these Libertarians have is drugs and samer weddings.


Deregulation is a big libertarian deal as well, and cuts to entitlements and military spending.  There's something of a division on infrastructure spending in the party, with many arguing that like a (smaller) military it's one of the things that voluntary, decentralized participation can't reasonably do, and the full-on nutters thinking every road should be a privately-owned toll road and municipal corporations should be barred from owning or managing utilities like water.

The fact that the latter group are the ones most of the actual candidates come from is sort of why the party's got a reputation as being more batshiat than it actually usually is.

//Albeit, "libertarian, but actually logical about it" is basically what the Green Party is, unlike the Libertarians they've fielded more than one or two candidates I've actually found worth voting for.
 
2013-03-01 12:08:41 PM  

Jim_Callahan: Deregulation is a big libertarian deal as well, and cuts to entitlements and military spending. There's something of a division on infrastructure spending in the party, with many arguing that like a (smaller) military it's one of the things that voluntary, decentralized participation can't reasonably do, and the full-on nutters thinking every road should be a privately-owned toll road and municipal corporations should be barred from owning or managing utilities like water.

The fact that the latter group are the ones most of the actual candidates come from is sort of why the party's got a reputation as being more batshiat than it actually usually is.


That's a good summary.
 
2013-03-01 12:08:52 PM  
I always thought it was for a different reason. College Republicans were my first experience with Republican talking-point spewing True Believers. Once you're exposed to those douche cadets, it really sours you on the party.
 
2013-03-01 12:08:57 PM  

Car_Ramrod: College Republicans creep me out.


During the election one came to our house for polling and out reach stuff.  I couldn't help but wonder how stupid he was for supporting a political party with a platform that was sure to screw him over.  That said... if you want to move up in a political party, there are probably more long term opportunities for a college kid in the GOP.
 
2013-03-01 12:09:22 PM  

slayer199: Ah, good to see all the Fark libs and conservatives hating on the LP.  Republicans hate us because of our social liberalism and Democrats hate us because of our fiscal conservatism.     Both sides do everything they can to exclude the LP (and the Green Party) from the process.  Why?  Fear.  A party that promotes social liberalism, fiscal conservatism, personal responsibility and smaller government will resonate with voters.


Yes, you're all about liberty...as in, yours. Not someone else's, but you are all about yours. F*ck everyone else.

That's why I couldn't stay with the Libertarian Party. Nobody gave a f*ck about anyone beyond their own interests. Libertarians love renting hotel conference rooms, quoting Ludwig Von Mises and kissing each other's ass, but once that conference is over, it's back to ineffectually b*tching about how nobody votes for them.

Here's the clue: it's because your ideas are non-executable. They would lead to a situation no better than America in the Gilded Age. It would reinforce the power and privilege of the already powerful (See the Koch Bros., out and proud, staunch libertarians). Nobody in the middle class would end up better off having the libertarian vision imposed on the country.

It doesn't mean sh*t if you pay little to no taxes, but have no money anyway, because the elite have already blocked off all the resources, monopolized industries, and cut competition off at the knees, leaving labor with scraps. Voting with your dollar doesn't mean sh*t if that dollar has no choice on where to go.

"But the free market!" no it won't. You already have huge, multinational actors with considerable power over resources, labor and governments. What do you think would happen if we took the few chains we have off? You think they'd be gracious benedictors and disband so little guys could compete? No! They'd go to war and the only victors would be modern day Rockefellers. It'd be Standard Oil and Carnegie Steel all over again.
 
2013-03-01 12:09:57 PM  

slayer199: A party that promotes social liberalism, fiscal conservatism, personal responsibility and smaller government will resonate with voters.


Even though it never has.

Americans, for a variety of mostly stupid reasons, like the words "smaller government," but hate the reality of smaller government.
 
2013-03-01 12:10:01 PM  

HellRaisingHoosier: FTFA: Sophomore Miranda Onnen says after graduation, fiscal realities will begin to take hold for her generation and priorities will shift. "We're also the ones who are going to have to pay for Obamacare," Onnen says. "A lot of people don't necessarily connect those things. They say, 'Oh, well, health care is great. I get to be on my parents' health-care plan until I'm 26.' Well, once you turn 27, you have to pay for that. And especially with the joblessness rates being what they are, I think that's going to hit kids our age pretty hard."


What does a sophomore at Ohio State University know about the financial situation of life? Nothing. Mommy and daddy or John Q. Public is paying for her way right now.

Guess what kid? I don't want to pay for your education, healthcare, protection or social services either over the course of your life, but I did, because I want to live in a 1st world society and not some 3rd world libertarian shiat-hole.


She certainly seems to have no idea what Obamacare is, if she thinks that her generation is going to somehow "have to pay for" my mandatory medical insurance 7 years from now.
 
2013-03-01 12:12:03 PM  

Muta: Conservatism, Real Conservatism, is strong in our nation's colleges and universities but the liberal media skewing the polls to make it seem like conservatism isn't strong.  In the 3 years I've been at Liberty University , not once has anyone asked what my political feelings are.  I bet the students at Stanford or the University of Michigan get asked all the time.


If you mean "real conservatism" as in the actual meaning of the word 'conservative' instead of a shoddy synonym for 'right-wing', plenty of college folk are openly conservative.  Those people are also Democrats, because the primary conservative factions in US politics are currently subdivisions of the Democratic party, as the GOP has chased all theirs out in favor of hard-line radical reactionaries, which aren't remotely the same thing.

//I think at some point I said I'd stop pointing this out, I should stop drinking at work.  And message-boarding at work, I guess, but meh.
 
2013-03-01 12:12:17 PM  
Libertarians these days aren't much different from mainstream Republicans except for their love of weed and bitcoins.
 
2013-03-01 12:13:33 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: hubiestubert: It wasn't Romney.

In other words you voted for Obama.


Why does it matter? What real conservative would vote for Romney?
 
2013-03-01 12:14:07 PM  

skullkrusher: you can't govern a large and diverse country with a anarchistic or even minarchistic government.


Anarchistic government? Is that where you vote for a president and he never shows up to work or immediately quits after election?
 
2013-03-01 12:14:35 PM  

skullkrusher: you can't govern a large and diverse country with a anarchistic or even minarchistic government. It just won't work. However, folding aspects of libertarianism into our modern, largely statist government is not a bad thing.


That's a different discussion altogether.

As far as that theory goes, one could argue that the US already has a disproportionately large amount of libertarianism already built into the system.  If it had a moderate to low amount of libertarianism class mobility wouldn't be as difficult as it is right now and there would be more than just the very rich prospering.

If anything, the US needs some more socialism... or more logically... reallocate some of  the socialist funding of the defense industry to infrastructure and the middle class.
 
2013-03-01 12:14:40 PM  
They lost me, already. I was registered as an R as late as 2008. After the shiat they pulled with the first debt ceiling mess, I refuse to vote for anyone with an R next to their name.
 
2013-03-01 12:15:17 PM  

IrateShadow: Libertarians these days aren't much different from mainstream Republicans except for their love of weed and bitcoins.


In Austin I saw a guy at a Ron Paul rally holding up a sign reading "SELF OWNERSHIP" on one side and "RAW MILK" on the other. If that doesn't get the kids fired up about Libertarianism, I don't know what will!
 
2013-03-01 12:16:21 PM  

Jim_Callahan: Noam Chimpsky: The only "libertarian" principles these Libertarians have is drugs and samer weddings.

Deregulation is a big libertarian deal as well, and cuts to entitlements and military spending.  There's something of a division on infrastructure spending in the party, with many arguing that like a (smaller) military it's one of the things that voluntary, decentralized participation can't reasonably do, and the full-on nutters thinking every road should be a privately-owned toll road and municipal corporations should be barred from owning or managing utilities like water.

The fact that the latter group are the ones most of the actual candidates come from is sort of why the party's got a reputation as being more batshiat than it actually usually is.

//Albeit, "libertarian, but actually logical about it" is basically what the Green Party is, unlike the Libertarians they've fielded more than one or two candidates I've actually found worth voting for.


I never hear the Libertarian Party jump into these fiscal fights. They aren't making noise about the federal government's usurpation of state powers. "Defense of Women Act", and so forth. I bet if you polled all the self-proclaimed "Libertarians", they'd be all in favor of that shiat.
 
2013-03-01 12:16:49 PM  

dr_blasto: skullkrusher: you can't govern a large and diverse country with a anarchistic or even minarchistic government.

Anarchistic government? Is that where you vote for a president and he never shows up to work or immediately quits after election?


Rick Perry and Sarah Palin would like a word...
 
2013-03-01 12:16:56 PM  

dittybopper: So remind me again why I shouldn't vote libertarian?


What do you mean by libertarian?
 
2013-03-01 12:17:06 PM  

slayer199: Ah, good to see all the Fark libs and conservatives hating on the LP.  Republicans hate us because of our social liberalism and Democrats hate us because of our fiscal conservatism.     Both sides do everything they can to exclude the LP (and the Green Party) from the process.  Why?  Fear.  A party that promotes social liberalism, fiscal conservatism, personal responsibility and smaller government will resonate with voters.


Ok, let's see:

Social liberalism?  Down with that.
Fiscal Conservatism?  No, sorry.  I'm more of a fiscal moderate (spend when we need to, save for a rainy day when we don't) and this is not a political stance anybody sane should take.
Personal responsibility?  Yeah, sure, try and do that with human nature being what it is.  If anybody thinks for a moment that people in Washington (past or present) will take responsibility for something bad happening, I have a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you, cheap.
Smaller government?  See Fiscal Conservatism; situations merit either significant involvement with the government or very little involvement.  It depends on the topic at hand.
 
2013-03-01 12:18:42 PM  
Here's the thing that keeps me from voting for Libertarians.

I do like what a lot of Libertarians say, but there's also a lot of their platform that just strikes me as having a total disregard for those who, for whatever reason, aren't able to "pull themselves up by their boot straps" and "take care of themselves". Their ideology never seems to address that in any detail.

Also, the idea that we can trust the private sector to regulate themselves and not put their own profit over the greater good of the citizens strikes me as extremely naive and ideologically based. We've seen time and time again what happens when the private sector is left to their own devices. The idea that poor people, the disabled and the elderly can be provided for by private sector and the "free market" is also extremely naive... One need only look at how the poor were "cared for" prior to and during the industrial revolution to see the end result of that kind of ideology.

It just strikes me as too ideological... very similar to Communism. They just aren't that concerned with the reality that exists and what to focus on the ideal world they want to create.

My Libertarian friends get all bent out of shape when they can barely managed to get double digit numbers of support for their candidates, but they fail to see that they are the ones who have to convince the voters why they should support the LP. They spout platitudes and ideals, but hardly ever explain how these ideals will be achieved in the real world.

It also doesn't help that half the time "Libertarian" Candidates are either former GOP politicians or complete loons.

My opinion, of course, but I've yet to be convinced by any Libertarian why I should vote for their party or candidates. It's their job to convince me if the want my vote. So far, they haven't.
 
2013-03-01 12:18:43 PM  
90% of Libertarians would never be arsed to vote if the government said "You can have all the drugs and guns and illegal porn you want".
 
2013-03-01 12:18:46 PM  

Maud Dib: RexTalionis: hubiestubert: Not that a lot Libertarians are any better.

Libertarians are Republicans who are embarrassed to call themselves Republicans.

[i865.photobucket.com image 360x450]


*Shudder* Those pictures always make that lifestyle seem much easier than it looks. It's that kind of imagery that probably comes to mind in the average Tea party "patriot"--gun in hand, foot-on-a-ledge ala George Washington overlooking some kind of view with bald eagles flying overhead.

Buffalo chips is the first thing that comes to my mind. Horrible existence ... but to fair, very bootstrapy.

i.imgur.com
 
2013-03-01 12:18:50 PM  

dr_blasto: skullkrusher: you can't govern a large and diverse country with a anarchistic or even minarchistic government.

Anarchistic government? Is that where you vote for a president and he never shows up to work or immediately quits after election?


heh yeah that should've been anarchism OR a minarchistic government though a system of governance is not necessarily antithetical to anarchism.
 
2013-03-01 12:19:03 PM  

thurstonxhowell: I always thought it was for a different reason. College Republicans were my first experience with Republican talking-point spewing True Believers. Once you're exposed to those douche cadets, it really sours you on the party.


Though, in all fairness to the poor sods, you can say this about basically  any political, social, or philosophical opinion being expressed by an undergraduate (usually extremely stridently).  Basically if you're an undergraduate, you're having a political discussion, and you're sober you're probably both coming off as a holier-than-thou know-it-all douchebag and also factually incorrect on a number of important points.  Five minutes with an undergrad proclaiming its merits could probably sour most people on respiring Oxygen.

I don't except myself from this, or hold it against anyone; I was a stuck-up prick that knew everything as a teenager too.  Still just the raw truth, though.  "Sophomoric" is not a complimentary word for a good reason, it's a stage everyone goes through.

//The problem with the GOP is that most of the  adult adherents aren't measurably better.  I mean, some are (McCain's usually not that bad, though he's inconsistent and kinda senile, for instance) but most aren't and electing folks like TX's new senator isn't helping the average.
 
2013-03-01 12:19:05 PM  

Dr Dreidel: DamnYankees: hubiestubert: winds of the Hell of Being Flayed Alive will still and stall

No way you just made this up. What Iron Maiden song is this a lyric from?

Former Republicans got a lot of hells.

// it's all in the reflexes


 If you have an influence over your youthful friend, you'd better exert it now. Otherwise, I will have you both sent to the hell where people are skinned alive it's that simple, understand?
 
2013-03-01 12:19:30 PM  

Muta: Conservatism, Real Conservatism, is strong in our nation's colleges and universities but the liberal media skewing the polls to make it seem like conservatism isn't strong.  In the 3 years I've been at Liberty University , not once has anyone asked what my political feelings are.  I bet the students at Stanford or the University of Michigan get asked all the time.


Uh, right.  Keep telling yourself that.  Liberty (aka Jerry Falwell U)...right, keep telling yourself that.
 
2013-03-01 12:20:25 PM  

dr_blasto: Anarchistic government? Is that where you vote for a president and he never shows up to work or immediately quits after election?


If he quits, you just up-twinkle somebody else for the job. It's all good, brah.
 
2013-03-01 12:20:29 PM  

Mercutio74: skullkrusher: you can't govern a large and diverse country with a anarchistic or even minarchistic government. It just won't work. However, folding aspects of libertarianism into our modern, largely statist government is not a bad thing.

That's a different discussion altogether.

As far as that theory goes, one could argue that the US already has a disproportionately large amount of libertarianism already built into the system.  If it had a moderate to low amount of libertarianism class mobility wouldn't be as difficult as it is right now and there would be more than just the very rich prospering.

If anything, the US needs some more socialism... or more logically... reallocate some of  the socialist funding of the defense industry to infrastructure and the middle class.


abolition of corporations as we know them is entirely compatible with libertarianism and I'd argue necessary under it.
 
2013-03-01 12:20:40 PM  

The Name: And even then, "Libertarian" is often just a stop on the road to outright "liberal."  It'll probably take just a couple more years of college (and if not by then, certainly grad school) for some of these kids to realize that libertarianism is just a big of a crock as regular old Republicanism.


Personally, I found leaving college and getting a job to be far more effective at shattering any "libertarian" illusions about how the world is run. It's one thing to sit around and talk about how the government is going to take your money and slow down your talents, but once you become a corporate drone and realise that your employer is going to use you and screw you the earliest chance they get, you learn to appreciate some of these "socialist" ideas like workers rights, and social insurance.
 
2013-03-01 12:21:33 PM  

Jim_Callahan: Deregulation is a big libertarian deal as well, and cuts to entitlements and military spending. There's something of a division on infrastructure spending in the party, with many arguing that like a (smaller) military it's one of the things that voluntary, decentralized participation can't reasonably do, and the full-on nutters thinking every road should be a privately-owned toll road and municipal corporations should be barred from owning or managing utilities like water.


Depends on where the deregulation is going to take place.  Any area expected to police itself has to be one where lots of people have easy access to full disclosure about the topic, otherwise the assumptions of the free-market won't hold true and the model collapses.  One can be in favor of stem cell research and drug legalization while acknowledging something like the EPA is needed.
 
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