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(Huffington Post)   Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state, yet their legislators are the fifth-highest paid and enjoy extremely generous pensions. It's almost like the two things are related   (huffingtonpost.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, Illinois, stipends, Michael Madigan, Manhattan Institute, sliding scale, U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, Federal Reserve Board chairman, Christine Radogno  
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883 clicks; posted to Politics » on 27 Feb 2013 at 3:04 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-27 02:55:56 PM  
Chicago-style gangster politics.  I blame Obama.
 
2013-02-27 03:06:32 PM  
If pensions make government worse, why do Republicans never make election promises to not use them?
 
2013-02-27 03:07:02 PM  
cdn.inquisitr.com
Calls all you politicians AMATEURS!  He would shake down a children's hospital for a year end bonus!
 
2013-02-27 03:07:21 PM  
This is why I teach in Indiana and not Illinois.  The Teacher's Retirement Fund is top notch in Indiana, not so much in Illinois.  Suck it Illinois.

/csb
 
2013-02-27 03:07:48 PM  
I bet this news is really knockin 'em dead in Chicago.
 
2013-02-27 03:09:54 PM  
Are the 4 higher-paid states in worse situation? By what metric are the pensions "generous"?

Without that information, I can only assume this is complete concern troll bullshiat
 
2013-02-27 03:10:53 PM  
imgs.xkcd.com
 
DGS [TotalFark]
2013-02-27 03:10:55 PM  

Amurica...Fark Ya!: This is why I teach in Indiana and not Illinois.  The Teacher's Retirement Fund is top notch in Indiana, not so much in Illinois.  Suck it Illinois.

/csb


You poor thing, teaching in the region. Eep.
 
2013-02-27 03:11:37 PM  
Things will be great when teachers are paid minimum wage and tossed out on the street after 20-30 years with no benefits.  I'm sure they will be lining up for miles to get those jobs!
 
2013-02-27 03:11:44 PM  

The_Forensicator: I bet this news is really knockin 'em dead in Chicago.


Does this mean there will be more votes for Democrats?
 
2013-02-27 03:12:07 PM  
The problem with this country is politicians themselves. They're all sleazeballs. They almost HAVE to be, because they have to sell-out at every opportunity in order to get campaign contributions.

Publicly-funded elections would solve a HUGE number of problems in this country. But it will never happen.
 
2013-02-27 03:12:17 PM  
>Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state

i48.tinypic.com

 i56.tinypic.com

So if a state like, for example, Kentucky borrowed at an ever-increasing rate for DECADES, they're not worse than Illinois (a state that, apparently, funds states just like Kentucky to have these ever-growing bootstrappy fantasies)?

Has Subby ever had to deal with actual money, or is Mitt Romney the OP?
 
2013-02-27 03:13:04 PM  
For those who haven't RTFA this story is about legislature salaries not teacher pensions.
 
2013-02-27 03:15:26 PM  

odinsposse: For those who haven't RTFA this story is about legislature salaries not teacher pensions.


And how, in OP's eyes, legislator pay is inversely proportional to an actual state's fiscal shape.

And, to avoid using the vernacular, OP would appear to be a British colloquialism for a cigarette.
 
2013-02-27 03:17:10 PM  
Politicians are elected by the voters.  Our politicians are only as good as we are as voters.  So just so we're all clear, our country is going to remain in the shiatter so long as voters think a statement like:

Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state, yet their legislators are the fifth-highest paid and enjoy extremely generous pensions.

Leads to a conclusion like:
It's almost like the two things are related
 
2013-02-27 03:18:04 PM  

Lost Thought 00: By what metric are the pensions "generous"?


Fair enough.
But by which metric are they earned?

/Decades of corruption, crime, inaction and outright governance  FAIL!
/You'd think the locals would be absolutely intolerant of the slightest party line bullshiat by now.
/Yet it just keeps going...
 
2013-02-27 03:18:19 PM  

Jackpot777: >Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state

[i48.tinypic.com image 800x588]

 [i56.tinypic.com image 522x622]

So if a state like, for example, Kentucky borrowed at an ever-increasing rate for DECADES, they're not worse than Illinois (a state that, apparently, funds states just like Kentucky to have these ever-growing bootstrappy fantasies)?

Has Subby ever had to deal with actual money, or is Mitt Romney the OP?


I'm not going to say that your "welfare state" picture is wrong but I will say that it's recycled and out of date. The original was made in something like 2005 and the current year has been pasted onto it several times (you can GIS and find it for many years with only the date changed).

There are lots of good graphics and statistics that show what you're trying to show. There's no need to use out of date materials.
 
2013-02-27 03:18:21 PM  

realmolo: The problem with this country is politicians themselves. They're all sleazeballs. They almost HAVE to be, because they have to sell-out at every opportunity in order to get campaign contributions.

Publicly-funded elections would solve a HUGE number of problems in this country. But it will never happen.


Now now... lets be optimists... if everyone who thinks this is a solution contacts their representatives and continues to do so, this may happen.  Everyone agrees there is TOO MUCH MONEY in politics and most folks agree that publicly funded elections are the solution.

We just got to keep pushing the message and support the candidates that will work towards that goal once in office.
 
2013-02-27 03:22:12 PM  

way south: Lost Thought 00: By what metric are the pensions "generous"?

Fair enough.
But by which metric are they earned?


Hours labored.
 
2013-02-27 03:22:13 PM  
Sum up the article:

The politicians make a lot of money (comparatively) and do a shiatty farking job.

This ain't news HuffPo.
 
2013-02-27 03:28:49 PM  

GoodyearPimp: Things will be great when teachers are paid minimum wage and tossed out on the street after 20-30 years with no benefits.  I'm sure they will be lining up for miles to get those jobs!


It's the only way to be sure they really love teaching, which should be the only requirement.  Think of the children and what would happen if they were taught by highly paid and educated professionals instead of people who just really like teaching.
 
2013-02-27 03:30:17 PM  
Arguments for providing legislators with a good salary:

(1)  It is more democratic.  Allows at least the middle class a shot at being a legislator.
(2)  It is a way to deter corruption.  Traditionally, at least, corruption was one way to make up for low/non-existent salaries.

/not sure if these are in play anymore
//ok, (2) = no longer in play
 
2013-02-27 03:31:04 PM  
Legislator salaries make up roughly 0.000000000000001% of the state budget.

/not intended to be a factual statement
 
2013-02-27 03:32:50 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Are the 4 higher-paid states in worse situation? By what metric are the pensions "generous"?

Without that information, I can only assume this is complete concern troll bullshiat


On Fark?!
 
2013-02-27 03:46:21 PM  

ampoliros: Jackpot777: >Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state

[i48.tinypic.com image 800x588]

 [i56.tinypic.com image 522x622]

So if a state like, for example, Kentucky borrowed at an ever-increasing rate for DECADES, they're not worse than Illinois (a state that, apparently, funds states just like Kentucky to have these ever-growing bootstrappy fantasies)?

Has Subby ever had to deal with actual money, or is Mitt Romney the OP?

I'm not going to say that your "welfare state" picture is wrong but I will say that it's recycled and out of date. The original was made in something like 2005 and the current year has been pasted onto it several times (you can GIS and find it for many years with only the date changed).

There are lots of good graphics and statistics that show what you're trying to show. There's no need to use out of date materials.


It's the latest data available from a Libertarian source, and they're asking for donations to bring it up to date ..."recycled"? As in "you didn't create a new image from data that is already established"? Because your explanation as to why it's not up to date is "the current year has been pasted onto it several times"...?

Haven't used this Fark meme in a while. (cough)

IT'S 2013, YOU DOLT!

AND NOBODY HAD TAX YEAR 2005 FINAL DATA IN 2005, YOU DOLT!!


 
2013-02-27 03:47:49 PM  
While the states pension plan is its biggest economic detractor... the problem lies in that for decades the legislators have not put the money into the pension system and we get yahoos that invest the money that is in the plan mind numbing badly.  The pensions may be a little too generous and the workers asked for too little contribution but the problem is in Chicago Springfield.
 
2013-02-27 04:02:58 PM  
Which party controls Illinois?, humm let me guess.
 
2013-02-27 04:03:24 PM  
At least there is money to pay for snow removal on the highways which is more than I can say for Wisconsin.
 
2013-02-27 04:07:57 PM  

palelizard: GoodyearPimp: Things will be great when teachers are paid minimum wage and tossed out on the street after 20-30 years with no benefits.  I'm sure they will be lining up for miles to get those jobs!

It's the only way to be sure they really love teaching, which should be the only requirement.  Think of the children and what would happen if they were taught by highly paid and educated professionals instead of people who just really like teaching.


Tom Brady took a pay cut for the good of the team.  Why can't teachers be team players?
 
2013-02-27 04:08:13 PM  

NostroZ: [cdn.inquisitr.com image 453x422]
Calls all you politicians AMATEURS!  He would shake down a children's hospital for a year end bonus!


Is it weird that I read your post in Blago's voice?
 
2013-02-27 04:10:30 PM  

Jackpot777: ampoliros: Jackpot777: >Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state

[i48.tinypic.com image 800x588]

 [i56.tinypic.com image 522x622]

So if a state like, for example, Kentucky borrowed at an ever-increasing rate for DECADES, they're not worse than Illinois (a state that, apparently, funds states just like Kentucky to have these ever-growing bootstrappy fantasies)?

Has Subby ever had to deal with actual money, or is Mitt Romney the OP?

I'm not going to say that your "welfare state" picture is wrong but I will say that it's recycled and out of date. The original was made in something like 2005 and the current year has been pasted onto it several times (you can GIS and find it for many years with only the date changed).

There are lots of good graphics and statistics that show what you're trying to show. There's no need to use out of date materials.

It's the latest data available from a Libertarian source, and they're asking for donations to bring it up to date ..."recycled"? As in "you didn't create a new image from data that is already established"? Because your explanation as to why it's not up to date is "the current year has been pasted onto it several times"...?

Haven't used this Fark meme in a while. (cough)

IT'S 2013, YOU DOLT!

AND NOBODY HAD TAX YEAR 2005 FINAL DATA IN 2005, YOU DOLT!!


My point was that the data shown is 8 years out of date which in and of itself isn't bad; historic data is important. What is bad though is that nowhere on it does it state that the data is from FY 2005 but the graphic is continually updated with the newest election data and the election data date of 2004, 2006, 2008, 2010 and 2012 is the only one given. That implies that the data is current; it's misleading. Not on the level of a Fox News graphic but still not honest.
 
2013-02-27 04:15:04 PM  
Put them all up against a wall.
 
2013-02-27 04:16:17 PM  

ampoliros: Jackpot777: ampoliros: Jackpot777: >Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state

[i48.tinypic.com image 800x588]

 [i56.tinypic.com image 522x622]

So if a state like, for example, Kentucky borrowed at an ever-increasing rate for DECADES, they're not worse than Illinois (a state that, apparently, funds states just like Kentucky to have these ever-growing bootstrappy fantasies)?

Has Subby ever had to deal with actual money, or is Mitt Romney the OP?

I'm not going to say that your "welfare state" picture is wrong but I will say that it's recycled and out of date. The original was made in something like 2005 and the current year has been pasted onto it several times (you can GIS and find it for many years with only the date changed).

There are lots of good graphics and statistics that show what you're trying to show. There's no need to use out of date materials.

It's the latest data available from a Libertarian source, and they're asking for donations to bring it up to date ..."recycled"? As in "you didn't create a new image from data that is already established"? Because your explanation as to why it's not up to date is "the current year has been pasted onto it several times"...?

Haven't used this Fark meme in a while. (cough)

IT'S 2013, YOU DOLT!

AND NOBODY HAD TAX YEAR 2005 FINAL DATA IN 2005, YOU DOLT!!

My point was that the data shown is 8 years out of date which in and of itself isn't bad; historic data is important. What is bad though is that nowhere on it does it state that the data is from FY 2005 but the graphic is continually updated with the newest election data and the election data date of 2004, 2006, 2008, 2010 and 2012 is the only one given. That implies that the data is current; it's misleading. Not on the level of a Fox News graphic but still not honest.


You know what the latest data they'd be able to compile right now, based on the data available?

Tax Year 2013? We're still in it.

Tax Year 2012? I still haven't filed my federal taxes, like millions of others.

Tax Year 2011? It may be too premature for that too. The other side of the equation is states reporting their full federal expenditure.

Please proceed.
 
2013-02-27 04:20:06 PM  
At this point about the only thing that could improve this state is if they arrested every single member of the general assembly and drove them straight to prison.  And then arrested their replacements and did exactly the same thing.
 
2013-02-27 04:20:46 PM  
Illinois is in the worst fiscal shape of any other state

When are people going to realize that governments services ARE NOT EVER going to make any money or be profitable?
 
2013-02-27 04:29:11 PM  
I thought Illinois raised taxes last year which puts them at the top of the list of highest state taxes as well.  My company just announced that it is shutting down the Batavia plant and those products will now be made in Tenn and AZ.  Just too expensive to operate in Illinois these days.
 
2013-02-27 04:30:09 PM  

maxalt: Which party controls Illinois?, humm let me guess.


The Madigans
 
2013-02-27 04:35:12 PM  
The problem is that all our tax dollars in this state go to 3 huge moneymaking organizations: City of Chicago, Cook County and the State of Illinois, along with the bureaucracies of do-nothings.  For example, you have the Cook Co. Dept. of Human Rights, Chicago Human Rights Commission, and the Illinois Human Rights Commission.  Or the Chicago Housing Authority, the Chicago Dept of Housing, the Housing Authority of Cook Co. and the Illinois Housing Development Authority.

Each of these vital departments need lawyers, secretaries, filing clerks, IT staff, inspectors, presidents, vice-presidents, office managers, etc., and they all get nice pensions, nice healthcare, some get new cars every 1-2 years. Some even have fun titles like "Deputy Director of Communications", in case the agency's Director of Communications is too busy with their stressful job!

 Yeah, there's no government waste here in Illinois!
 
2013-02-27 04:39:37 PM  
Jackpot777: <snip>You know what the latest data they'd be able to compile right now, based on the data available?

Tax Year 2013? We're still in it.

Tax Year 2012? I still haven't filed my federal taxes, like millions of others.

Tax Year 2011? It may be too premature for that too. The other side of the equation is states reporting their full federal expenditure.

Please proceed.


Still doesn't explain whey they don't state that it's FY 2005 data on the graphic but make sure you know that the red/blue is 2012.

And sure, recent FY data may not be completely ready. But even by lax standards, that still leaves half a decade of data out there. It should also be noted that this was first published in 2007. So yeah, FY 2006-2010 should be easily obtainable. But just for arguments sake, let's say that this group of 20+ lawyers and economists working for an 80 year old foundation don't have the money to again hire 2 interns to compile the data. How long can we say this data is valid? We're fast approaching 10 years for this set, is that when we retire it? Maybe 15 years?

Look, I'm not saying the data is wrong. But what it's doing is mixing data sets from two periods and veiling the fact that it does so and every year it gets worse and worse as the data periods become less relevant to each other. It's a bad graphic and needs to go away.
 
2013-02-27 04:41:26 PM  

lennavan: way south: Lost Thought 00: By what metric are the pensions "generous"?

Fair enough.
But by which metric are they earned?

Hours labored.


dl.dropbox.com

You overpaid for the results their labors achieved.
You should probably see about getting your money back.

whidbey: When are people going to realize that governments services ARE NOT EVER going to make any money or be profitable?


Worse, people have come to think that services are free and not deducted from the populations wealth.
Everything the state gives it first has to take. To give alot, must take alot.
If we don't see a strong return on the investments the state has made in our name then the system is prone to collapse.
 
2013-02-27 04:42:57 PM  

DGS: Amurica...Fark Ya!: This is why I teach in Indiana and not Illinois.  The Teacher's Retirement Fund is top notch in Indiana, not so much in Illinois.  Suck it Illinois.

/csb

You poor thing, teaching in the region. Eep.


I know, I know.  The payoff is that I live 5 minutes from the boat launch on Lake Michigan and I spend most of my 9 weeks off during the summer with the wife on our boat.

/Sacrifices
 
2013-02-27 04:46:45 PM  
But Illinois politicians have got this thing and it's farking golden, and, uh, uh, they're just not giving it up for farkin' nothing. They're not going to do it.
 
2013-02-27 04:53:03 PM  
and yall keep voting Democrat...

media.npr.org
 
2013-02-27 05:00:06 PM  

ampoliros: Still doesn't explain whey they don't state that it's FY 2005 data on the graphic but make sure you know that the red/blue is 2012.

And sure, recent FY data may not be completely ready. But even by lax standards, that still leaves half a decade of data out there. It should also be noted that this was first published in 2007. So yeah, FY 2006-2010 should be easily obtainable. But just for arguments sake, let's say that this group of 20+ lawyers and economists working for an 80 year old foundation don't have the money to again hire 2 interns to compile the data. How long can we say this data is valid? We're fast approaching 10 years for this set, is that when we retire it? Maybe 15 years?

Look, I'm not saying the data is wrong. But what it's doing is mixing data sets from two periods and veiling the fact that it does so and every year it gets worse and worse as the data periods become less relevant to each other. It's a bad graphic and needs to go away.


It appears to me that the IRS does not publish very current numbers on taxes, and I'm not even sure how to read the numbers they do publish. But here's the IRS Tax Stats webpage which has a whole pile of Excel docs and other things in there that supposedly can be made to show how much tax is paid by each state. I'd recommend looking under "Products, Publications, & Papers" for starters, but at least some of the reports in there cost money to get. It appears that this page might have the information you're looking for, although I'm not sure. It shows that the Feds took in roughly $2.4T in total taxes for FY11, though - don't know if that's accurate or not.
 
2013-02-27 05:02:06 PM  

clane: and yall keep voting Democrat...

[media.npr.org image 850x637]


You're not from Illinois are you Mr. Clane?
www.frugal-cafe.com
We've tried both... maybe it's not the Republican / Democrat who are corrupt, maybe there's something deeper?
 
2013-02-27 05:03:16 PM  

Jackpot777: You know what the latest data they'd be able to compile right now, based on the data available?

Tax Year 2013? We're still in it.

Tax Year 2012? I still haven't filed my forms...


I'd love to use your line of reasoning when I'm compiling data for the boss.  "I haven't filed my tax forms for last year, so I'm going to have to give you 2005's numbers."
 
2013-02-27 05:06:14 PM  

way south: Everything the state gives it first has to take. To give alot, must take alot.


You will never get a progressive pseudo-economist to admit this - or if they do, they will say that money needs to circulate in order to create wealth.  doesn't matter why or what for, just that the more people who touch it, the wealthier and better off we are in the aggregate.

Government redistributing wealth is akin to a 100% tax on casinos to be made in cash payments to low income casino patrons in the hopes that circulating money will grow the economy.  If it sounds stupid, it is because it is.
 
2013-02-27 05:06:30 PM  

clane: and yall keep voting Democrat...

[media.npr.org image 850x637]


Sarah Palin?  Really?  That's your snark image?
Were you cryogenically frozen in 2008 and reanimated now?
 
2013-02-27 05:10:38 PM  

clane: and yall keep voting Democrat...

[media.npr.org image 850x637]


I know that for a fan of Sarah Palin, you have an all consuming allergy to facts, but here is what the political map of Illinois Congress breaks down into:
farm8.staticflickr.com
Notice the heavy red parts.
How about you do a little reading, instead of jerking it to Palin.
 
2013-02-27 05:11:08 PM  

fat_free: The problem is that all our tax dollars in this state go to 3 huge moneymaking organizations: City of Chicago, Cook County and the State of Illinois, along with the bureaucracies of do-nothings.  For example, you have the Cook Co. Dept. of Human Rights, Chicago Human Rights Commission, and the Illinois Human Rights Commission.  Or the Chicago Housing Authority, the Chicago Dept of Housing, the Housing Authority of Cook Co. and the Illinois Housing Development Authority.

Each of these vital departments need lawyers, secretaries, filing clerks, IT staff, inspectors, presidents, vice-presidents, office managers, etc., and they all get nice pensions, nice healthcare, some get new cars every 1-2 years. Some even have fun titles like "Deputy Director of Communications", in case the agency's Director of Communications is too busy with their stressful job!

 Yeah, there's no government waste here in Illinois!


Which dept sold the parking meters?
 
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