Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(The Raw Story)   This story has something for everyone: lesbian teen sues school after being suspended for anti-bullying shirt. It's like a Mad Libs brought to life   (rawstory.com) divider line 240
    More: Fail, lesbian teen, teen sues, Lambda Legal, coming out, dean of students, education network, GLSEN, southern district  
•       •       •

10471 clicks; posted to Main » on 27 Feb 2013 at 9:22 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



240 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2013-02-27 09:26:08 AM  
It needs a gun to have something for everyone, but yeah, it's right up there.
 
2013-02-27 09:26:13 AM  
What farking idiot has a problem with a woman who voluntarily shuts her trap for a whole day?
 
2013-02-27 09:27:07 AM  
Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.
 
2013-02-27 09:28:22 AM  
Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.
 
2013-02-27 09:29:25 AM  
Is it the fark HATE t shirt?

If so then she should have gotten in trouble for the language... Pushing back again bullying is a great idea, but you still have to abide the dress code in schools

/dnrtfa
 
2013-02-27 09:29:25 AM  

Ebbelwoi: What farking idiot has a problem with a woman who voluntarily shuts her trap for a whole day?


Jesus Tapdancing Christ on a Crutch, THIS!!!!!
 
2013-02-27 09:30:01 AM  
www.posterenvy.com
 
2013-02-27 09:30:23 AM  
It's not clear at all why the administration turned this into such a major issue. Or why the teacher sent her to the principal for such a minor disobedient act. She was using a whiteboard to communicate.

It's not even that I think she should be allowed to get away with anything, but in this case what exactly are they trying to pin on this girl?

It's ridiculous.
 
2013-02-27 09:30:41 AM  

spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.


No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.
 
2013-02-27 09:30:56 AM  

spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.


Rosa Parks also knew the punishment she faced for doing what she did.
 
2013-02-27 09:31:41 AM  
Not that I agree with it, but the issue here involves a little more than just a t-shirt subby.
 
2013-02-27 09:32:08 AM  
jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

I blame the parents.
 
2013-02-27 09:32:44 AM  

AverageAmericanGuy: It's not clear at all why the administration turned this into such a major issue. Or why the teacher sent her to the principal for such a minor disobedient act. She was using a whiteboard to communicate.

It's not even that I think she should be allowed to get away with anything, but in this case what exactly are they trying to pin on this girl?

It's ridiculous.


You'd think by this point, people would realize that they make a bigger deal out of shiat like this by making a big deal of it.  If they just ignored the little clam eater, there would be little to no attention paid to her.
 
2013-02-27 09:33:37 AM  
A teenager was volunteering to shut her mouth for the whole day and the school had a problem with this?
 
2013-02-27 09:33:55 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.


Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?
 
2013-02-27 09:34:06 AM  

AphoticStar: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

Rosa Parks also knew the punishment she faced for doing what she did.


She also accepted that punishment and didn't sue anyone.
 
2013-02-27 09:34:21 AM  
Good for her.  Glad there are still SOME people left in my current generation that give a crap about ANYTHING.  This school should be celebrating the fact that she's not on 16 and Pregnant, obsessed with Taylor Swift's newest ex, or trying to join some gang warfare in the South Bronx projects.

/Cheers ...
 
2013-02-27 09:35:19 AM  
Who would bully a teen lesbian? They're our most precious resource. Well teen bisexuals are anyway.
 
2013-02-27 09:35:22 AM  
FTA: She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board.

There's little facts in this on-sided article but communicating with a dry-erase board when there was no physical or school sanction reason for it, is what probably lead to her ISS and not the t-shirt.
 
2013-02-27 09:35:49 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.


Whether she was right or wrong aside, I do not understand that bit.  Establishing the right to peacefully demonstrate would benefit everyone.  Sure, she may be coming at it from a personal angle.  But that's how most people are attracted to their causes.
 
2013-02-27 09:36:13 AM  
She got in school suspension. Big deal. She still got to go to school and do her work and not have it count against her attendance. Big farking deal.
 
2013-02-27 09:36:27 AM  

dennysgod: FTA: She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board.

There's little facts in this on-sided article but communicating with a dry-erase board when there was no physical or school sanction reason for it, is what probably lead to her ISS and not the t-shirt.


Oh no, the horror, a god damn dry erase board ... this is clearly a disruption to the learning environment! EXECUTE HER!
 
2013-02-27 09:36:38 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU. THE SAME RIGHTS THAT YOU HAVE.

I blame the parents.


Fixed that for you.
 
2013-02-27 09:37:48 AM  
DeSoto County High School?  Well there's the problem, they don't allow them LGBT folks in Arcadia.
 
2013-02-27 09:38:03 AM  
so she was told multiple times "the school doesn't take part in protests" and she did it anyways. now she is suing? i'm sure they will hand her and her parents some huge settlement pulled from the schools general fund. this is why our future generations are getting worse....
 
2013-02-27 09:38:46 AM  
hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...
 
2013-02-27 09:38:51 AM  
This thread is worthless without a picture of the shirt in question....

....and pics of hot lesbians

/no "reality photos" please.
 
2013-02-27 09:39:59 AM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


Every day is Straight White Hardworking Family Man Day!!!

/oblig
 
2013-02-27 09:41:20 AM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


Every day is Unsalted Cracker Day.
 
2013-02-27 09:41:50 AM  

AverageAmericanGuy: It's not clear at all why the administration turned this into such a major issue. Or why the teacher sent her to the principal for such a minor disobedient act.


They thought she was...
www.thetoque.com
...Tinkeringwith their authority?
 
2013-02-27 09:42:49 AM  

WhippingBoy: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

Every day is Straight White Hardworking Family Man Day!!!

/oblig


Won't somebody think of the white people? We will!

/we will...
 
2013-02-27 09:43:47 AM  
"She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board. The dean of students punished Hatcher with an in-school suspension."
Sorry there sweetheart but using a dry-eraser board in all your classes to communicate IS a bit disruptive..........
 
2013-02-27 09:44:45 AM  

DarkVader: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.


Until Tinker is marginalized into "this is a different world, and a disruption is a disruption".

I'm waiting for someone at the ACLU to be arrested and changed because a lawsuit is considered a 'disruption of school'.
 
2013-02-27 09:45:04 AM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.
 
2013-02-27 09:46:33 AM  
April 20, 2012?

What's the significance of that date?
 
2013-02-27 09:47:28 AM  

Coolfusis: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.


www.muzakblog.com
 
2013-02-27 09:47:43 AM  
Peaceful protests against school board policy?  Violence that shiat up a bit then.

Seriously though, if the principal and or dean or whatever made up administrative position they have there to siphon money from the tax payers didn't make a big deal out of it, let her do her stupid little no talking ghey thing, nobody would have cared or even noticed.  If they are trying to prevent the ghey in their school, they are failing, and probably turning more kids ghey as a result.

Ipso facto, public schools are turning our kids gay.  Somebody get outraged.
 
2013-02-27 09:47:44 AM  

jack21221: Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.


IIRC, under the Supreme Court's Tinker v. Des Moines decision, an institution (such as a school) has a right to restrict activities (which may include speech) that are outside the purpose of that institution.

So, as admirable as the purpose of the student might be, from a legal standpoint she is not necessarily in the right.

/IANAL
 
2013-02-27 09:48:21 AM  

Coolfusis: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.


happens every day..some people are just blind to it cos its not minority race related so aint news worthy.and we dont jump up and down screaming about rights and descrimination
 
2013-02-27 09:48:49 AM  

Coolfusis: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.


Or we'll just use our power and privilege to force one on all you peons.
 
2013-02-27 09:49:06 AM  
...but the school's principal said "peaceful protests" were "against District Policy."

Wow. I mean, I've read my share of Nazi High School stories, I'm not exactly shocked by this, but to see it spelled out in such a way is pretty amazing.
 
2013-02-27 09:49:07 AM  
*insert attention whore pic here*
 
2013-02-27 09:49:11 AM  

Coolfusis: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.


Hum, we already have that day it's April 15th.
 
2013-02-27 09:49:19 AM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


We get it. They're minorities. (and therefore clearly not hardworking or pro-family.

+1 if trollin cause I fell for it.
-1 if not because you need a brain moran
 
2013-02-27 09:50:21 AM  

Coolfusis:
When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.


www.weirdspace.dk
 
2013-02-27 09:50:30 AM  
It's simple.  The school wants to teach it's curriculum.  If you allow one group to have a silent protest, then you must allow all groups to have their protests.  The school administration is removing itself from the morality judgement business entirely.   This does not equate to being pro bullying.   It's to keep a bunch of kids from waving their "LOOK AT ME, LOOK AT ME!  I'M SPECIAL!" beliefs around during education time.

No Anti Bullying, no LBGT, No Fundamentalist Christian, No KKK, No Hugs for Gunlovers, etc.   There are a lot of people with a lot of different moral codes, just shut up and pay attention in class.
 
2013-02-27 09:50:48 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

I blame the parents.


So who do you blame for 1/100 trollbait?

Apart from that, giving her more of a reason to stomp her feet and kick up dust hardly seems like the way to go. So. Yeah. You ended up wrong about all of it.
 
2013-02-27 09:51:41 AM  
What's the possibility of there being legal precedent that will finally bring down the hammer upon schools who use that pathetic "it's a distraction" excuse to get away with their fascist behaviors.
 
2013-02-27 09:51:45 AM  

OtherLittleGuy: Coolfusis:
When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.

[www.weirdspace.dk image 150x394]


Wut.

Also, he has several days.
 
2013-02-27 09:51:53 AM  

pDiablo: happens every day.


No it doesn't.
 
2013-02-27 09:52:20 AM  
James F. Campbell


Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?


Quit white knighting her. She has just as many rights in the school system as any other kid which is close to zero. Not only that but you are taking an article from Raw Story as fact, this rag is like reading the Consumerist.
 
2013-02-27 09:52:30 AM  
Sort of a bad P.R. move to put a 'National Day of [anything]' on Hitler's birthday.

Allows your opponents to imply all sorts of bad connections
 
2013-02-27 09:53:07 AM  
AW gets support because she claims to be gay. News at 10, 11, and 12
 
2013-02-27 09:53:43 AM  

Vlad_the_Inaner: Sort of a bad P.R. move to put a 'National Day of [anything]' on Hitler's birthday.

Allows your opponents to imply all sorts of bad connections


Also, that day is to remember Columbine, and smoke lots of ganja.  And sometimes Earth Day.
 
2013-02-27 09:54:07 AM  

pDiablo: happens every day..some people are just blind to it cos its not minority race related so aint news worthy.and we dont jump up and down screaming about rights and descrimination


I would expect a straight, white hardworking family man could speak American better.
 
2013-02-27 09:54:49 AM  
I am so annoyed with the LGBT moniker...
 
2013-02-27 09:55:46 AM  

James F. Campbell: Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?


THIS!
 
2013-02-27 09:56:07 AM  
I went to high school 89-93 in North Jersey. If this had happened then, other students would have joined in the protest and there would have been fire alarms pulled and a walk-out. Although, more than half the students participating would have done so not for the cause, but for the fun of making a ruckus. We didn't have a gay-staight alliance, but we had an Amnesty Chapter in the school that no doubt would have organized something. We even had an organized protest against the "no hats" rule. I personally reported a NJ-DEP violation. We loved stirring stuff up. But, that's the Northeast for ya.

There was a day I communicated with a note-pad. I had lost my voice. Instead of being punished, my classmates and teachers were only mildly amused.

Good for her for filing a law suit. It's public school. They have to allow this sort of expression. Folks who have a problem with it should send their kids to private religious schools or home school.
 
2013-02-27 09:56:24 AM  
Did not anyone, of all the "educators" involved in this hubbub, see the crazy irony of them bullying her to stop talking about/ protesting bullying?

Isn't it also great that, if they just shut up about it, we would have never heard this story -- but since they were bullies, we get more awareness of the cause?
 
2013-02-27 09:56:46 AM  
She should have gotten her tongue pierced the day before... Then she would have had a real excuse for when they called her shenanigans that were explicitly prohibited (because all protests are always sanctioned, right? right?? right.)


<csb
Someone I knew in high school told me about a thing that was similar to this... right around prom time, they would pick a random senior to be dead for a day. They would participate in all of their regular assigned duties, but nobody was supposed to talk to them, in order to make the students more aware of the teen drinking and driving problems that magically manifest around that same time.
/csb>
 
2013-02-27 09:57:20 AM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


it's every tuesday asshat. we have meetings.

/white straight guy here
//can't stand people who hate for something as stupid as who you like to bang.
 
2013-02-27 09:58:32 AM  
Oh, come on. It's not special rights or snowflake syndrome.  It's one kid wearing an inoffensive t-shirt and keeping quiet for one day. I participated (along with many others) when I was in school.  And guess what - nobody gave a shiat.  We were allowed to feel like we were upholding our beliefs and convictions, and the lunchroom was way quieter for a day.

I wonder how her civics teacher took that whole 'peaceful protest against policy' nonsense.  We're teaching kids. Teaching. So when the administrators do this stupid shiat, what are we teaching them? To not ask questions, to not stand up peacefully to defend their beliefs? To just lay down and do what you're told?  Sounds like a republican to me.
 
2013-02-27 09:59:23 AM  
FTFA: An openly lesbian student on Tuesday sued her high school in Florida after she was suspended for participating in an anti-bullying event.

Awwww...look how cute the li'l lesbian is, thinking her "rights" matter. She's all growed up now!

I refer you to "Bong Hits 4 Jesus v. Alaska," sweetheart...
 
2013-02-27 09:59:38 AM  
doyoulikelikeme.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-02-27 10:00:28 AM  

Meerlar: She should have gotten her tongue pierced the day before... Then she would have had a real excuse for when they called her shenanigans that were explicitly prohibited (because all protests are always sanctioned, right? right?? right.)


<csb
Someone I knew in high school told me about a thing that was similar to this... right around prom time, they would pick a random senior to be dead for a day. They would participate in all of their regular assigned duties, but nobody was supposed to talk to them, in order to make the students more aware of the teen drinking and driving problems that magically manifest around that same time.
/csb>


Hey, we did that too. Only "death" would come around and 'kill' ten people a period.  (our school was over 6000 ppl)
 
2013-02-27 10:01:04 AM  
I have another gem for ya. A friend of mind was kicked out of a pep rally and suspended for holding up a posterboard that said, "Who cares?" You would expect that in Texas, but not NJ. I wish we had protest that.

I work in a school system now that has an active GSA. Our television program ran a commercial actively promoting the Day of Silence and encouraging more kids to participate - in an INNER CITY SCHOOL - not some posh suburban land of entitled snowflakes. I think Florida and Texas just have to grow up.
 
2013-02-27 10:02:59 AM  
Lezbo Bondage
www.rawstory.com
 
2013-02-27 10:05:03 AM  
What kind of nerd would take a case like this, anyway?
 
2013-02-27 10:05:22 AM  

probesport: [doyoulikelikeme.files.wordpress.com image 339x344]


That was my first thought when reading the headline.
 
2013-02-27 10:05:41 AM  

AphoticStar: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

Rosa Parks also knew the punishment she faced for doing what she did.


Rosa Parks is also a load of horseshiat.  So much of our "history" is nothing but lies and bullcrap.
 
2013-02-27 10:05:46 AM  
I am sure many of my fellow Farkers will think I am a jerk (as if they didn't already), but I will throw in my 2 cents. I support gay/lesbian rights, marriage, adoption, etc. However, there is a difference between expressing your views and grandstanding. I feel pretty sure the entire school and most of the community realize Amber is a lesbian by now. Some will agree with her, some will not. It is Florida after all. I appreciate her courage to voice her opinion and to stand up for what is right in a free society. However, I hardly think she is a trailblazer in her plight. Sometimes the best way to get point across is to act like a human being instead of a lesbian human being. They already know her sexual orientation so there is no reason keep banging that drum. It is kind of the reverse Streisand effect. She is bringing it out to the public and media likes she wants, but she risks many people just thinking she is an attention whore that is looking for her 15 minutes of martyrdom.

This really isn't much different than from pulling out the ole race card, when race had nothing to do with a certain situation.
 
2013-02-27 10:06:24 AM  

DarkVader: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.


Children in school do not have the same freedoms adults do, this has been gone over time and time again in the courts. If a kid wants to break school rules, they have to be willing to be punished. This is not a case of a T-shirt, she was being a douche, pure and simple.

Want to end bullying? Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Christ, how hard is that? Teaching them to cry just enables it more.
 
2013-02-27 10:09:21 AM  

James F. Campbell: Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?


If he's being serious, RAB's thesis is wrong. Unfortunately, your cutting, rational point by point rebuttal does not prove that to be the case.

And reading your profile leads me to think that, psychologically, you have much in common with either the girl in the article or a 12 year old boy.
 
2013-02-27 10:09:34 AM  

xanadian: FTFA: An openly lesbian student on Tuesday sued her high school in Florida after she was suspended for participating in an anti-bullying event.

Awwww...look how cute the li'l lesbian is, thinking her "rights" matter. She's all growed up now!

I refer you to "Bong Hits 4 Jesus v. Alaska," sweetheart...


Wow, I'm surprised at you but yeah I can completely see the similarities in supporting what can be construed as an illegal and anti-bullying.
 
2013-02-27 10:10:57 AM  
We had these back when I was in school. The administration sent out announcements so that students wouldn't get in trouble.

It's a good civics lesson. It's an opportunity for History and English teachers to talk about the history of civil rights and peaceful protest. It's an opportunity to address bullying and discrimination.

Any school administrator too dense or narrow-minded to understand that this is part of their job description should be thrown out on their butt. It's also important to understand that allowing the students a little bit of a release like this prevents more serious infractions from occurring; did they fall asleep for four years when they were being taught this?
 
2013-02-27 10:13:22 AM  
The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.
 
2013-02-27 10:13:37 AM  
mafiageek1980

James F. Campbell: Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?

THIS!


Obviously you didn't read the article where it clearly states:

"peaceful protests" were "against District Policy.

She engaged in a "peaceful protest"

So am I an asshole because I think she deserves the same rights and has to operate under the same guidelines as every other student in the district or is it because you didn't bother reading the article.
 
2013-02-27 10:15:54 AM  

vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.


This ... I would've been the parent telling him to get farked.
 
2013-02-27 10:17:08 AM  

xanadian: FTFA: An openly lesbian student on Tuesday sued her high school in Florida after she was suspended for participating in an anti-bullying event.

Awwww...look how cute the li'l lesbian is, thinking her "rights" matter. She's all growed up now!

I refer you to "Bong Hits 4 Jesus v. Alaska," sweetheart...


This. It's not your grandma's Tinker.

/I don't agree with "Bong Hits", but it's the trend
//are we still hating on homeschooling?
 
2013-02-27 10:17:57 AM  

vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.


I'd totally go up to him and say "Hey man, you're wrong!!!", then I'd totally kick his ass.
 
2013-02-27 10:18:11 AM  
i527.photobucket.com
 
2013-02-27 10:20:03 AM  

Cybernetic: jack21221: Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

IIRC, under the Supreme Court's Tinker v. Des Moines decision, an institution (such as a school) has a right to restrict activities (which may include speech) that are outside the purpose of that institution.

So, as admirable as the purpose of the student might be, from a legal standpoint she is not necessarily in the right.

/IANAL


Respectfully, that's almost 100% backwards. In Tinker, the Supreme Court held that a school could not punish a student wearing a black armband as a Vietnam protest, absent any evidence that the punishment was necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. As they said in that decision:
"First Amendment rights, applied in light of the special characteristics of the school environment, are available to teachers and students. It can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate. This has been the unmistakable holding of this Court for almost 50 years. "

The white board is the only distinction here, but I'd say Tinker still applies. Specifically, the holding in Tinker noted that:
"The school officials banned and sought to punish petitioners for a silent, passive expression of opinion, unaccompanied by any disorder or disturbance on the part of petitioners. There is here no evidence whatever of petitioners' interference, actual or nascent, with the schools' work or of collision with the rights of other students to be secure and to be let alone. Accordingly, this case does not concern speech or action that intrudes upon the work of the schools or the rights of other students."
Similarly, use of a white board is a silent protest, unaccompanied by any disorder or disturbance.

Further, I'd be willing to bet that the school doesn't suspend kids who are deaf or mute and communicate via writing. This was a punishment specifically because of the student's political views.
 
2013-02-27 10:20:18 AM  
mafiageek1980

James F. Campbell: Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?

THIS!

Obviously you didn't read the article where it clearly states:

"peaceful protests" were "against District Policy.

She engaged in a "peaceful protest"

So am I an asshole because I think she deserves the same rights and has to operate under the same guidelines as every other student in the district or is it because you didn't bother reading the article.


Your stupid logic is trumped by her being a lesbian. Anything else, and everyone here would be piling on the AW teen, but since she is gay, you are now just a hateful bigot. Learn to be correct.
 
2013-02-27 10:21:05 AM  

Thunderpipes: Want to end bullying? Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Christ, how hard is that? Teaching them to cry just enables it more.



How about teachng your kid not to be a bully?
 
2013-02-27 10:21:15 AM  

dennysgod: FTA: She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board.

There's little facts in this on-sided article but communicating with a dry-erase board when there was no physical or school sanction reason for it, is what probably lead to her ISS and not the t-shirt.


I think it was the whole thing, but TFH from TFA makes it sound like it was the shirt 100%. I think it was th totality of the protest, the silence, the shirt, the dry erase board.

Either way, the school farked the pooch on this one, they should have just let her do her thing, it sounds like about the most tolerable protest int he history of protesting. What a bunch of dicks...

And just having a policy in place that "peaceful protests" aren't allowed doesn't mean that it's not a violation. Oh well, maybe they need to find out what the alternative to PEACEFUL protests are?
 
2013-02-27 10:22:14 AM  
I think we've all lost sight of what's truly important here: what does she look like?
How are we supposed to know how outraged we should be unless we know this?
 
2013-02-27 10:24:43 AM  

give me doughnuts: Thunderpipes: Want to end bullying? Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Christ, how hard is that? Teaching them to cry just enables it more.


How about teachng your kid not to be a bully?


It's okay ... kids have already figured out the relief valve here ... what you may ask? Well, guns equalize bullying ... bullies SHOULD be afraid for their lives.  I mean, could you imagine how polite everyone would be if they thought that little Jimmy with the ratty clothes might take 20 people out?

Thunderpipes should be all for this.  After all, an armed society is a polite society, right?

School shootings have equalized the playground.  Carry on.
 
b3x
2013-02-27 10:26:06 AM  
at some point the LGBT community is going to come to the realization that society doesn't hate them for being LGBT, we are just annoyed that some wont SHUT THE FARK UP about being LGBT. It is really just like anyone else is is completely obsessed with some topic, that they just won't shut up about ... people roll their eyes and walk away, and then make fun of them at the water cooler. It isn't about who they are having sex with, it's about having something to talk about other than your lifestyle. Work on your social skills, and stop being so farking angry.

PETA is the same way. Yes we all agree that animals shouldn't be abused, but really your totally over the top. Ease up.
 
2013-02-27 10:28:14 AM  

b3x: at some point the LGBT community is going to come to the realization that society doesn't hate them for being LGBT, we are just annoyed that some wont SHUT THE FARK UP about being LGBT. It is really just like anyone else is is completely obsessed with some topic, that they just won't shut up about ... people roll their eyes and walk away, and then make fun of them at the water cooler. It isn't about who they are having sex with, it's about having something to talk about other than your lifestyle. Work on your social skills, and stop being so farking angry.

PETA is the same way. Yes we all agree that animals shouldn't be abused, but really your totally over the top. Ease up.


Not gonna happen. These are the only things that give meaning to these people's poor, tragic, lives of desperation. Take away the "activism" and they're left with nothing.
 
2013-02-27 10:28:17 AM  
Stop approving The Raw Story links. Never works to read them in the mobile app.
 
2013-02-27 10:29:31 AM  
Done in two!
 
2013-02-27 10:31:32 AM  
I think a lot of you want the school to be in the morality business and just sneak it in under the auspices of civics.  It's kind of amusing watching the liberals try this same kind of crap that the conservatives used to pull.

I have a strong suspicion that that school already has anti bullying policies and education.  Slacktivist girl should have approached the administration and asked how she could participate on one of the already ongoing programs.  Instead she put herself on the same level of a student who chose to wear an "abortion is murder" t-shirt.  Vastly different message of course, but choosing to deliver it in the same inappropriate manner.

The policy protects this girl from having to put up other peoples crazy beliefs, and it protects the other students from having to put up with her every belief.
 
2013-02-27 10:38:00 AM  
Coolfusis:
When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.

That happens to me every single day!

Well, figuratively, anyway.
 
2013-02-27 10:39:25 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

I blame the parents.


better rights?   I'm sure this was slammed above this, but what exactly are the "better rights"?

the right to go to school to learn
the right to bring an age appropriate date to a school social function
the right not to have a living hell of a school experience day in and day out?
the right to not be shunned by the administration and the students for being different?
oh i know its her first amendment rights, those are the better ones.... right?

/hate that argument (better rights)
// its the SAME rights... stupid idjit
///comes in threes
 
2013-02-27 10:40:22 AM  

WhippingBoy: Take away the "activism" and they're left with nothing.


You know actually you're right, and if it hadn't been for activism we'd still have a legal system more anti-homosexual than those of some Warsaw Pact countries.
 
2013-02-27 10:43:07 AM  
It's "pink shirt" day here in Canada. You wear a pink shirt to school to show your support for anti-bullying.
Last year my seven year old son didn't wear a pink shirt to school. He was ostracized and "bullied" because of it.

Be careful when you fight the monsters, lest you become one.
 
2013-02-27 10:43:24 AM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


yeah, the majority of days that don't have a "name"  you have ALL of those really, that's just how it works in a white straight dominated culture.
 
2013-02-27 10:44:24 AM  
This is the most disappointing 'Lesbian Teen' story I have ever read. It was almost impossible to fap to.

Almost.
 
2013-02-27 10:46:42 AM  

OtherLittleGuy: Coolfusis:
When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.

[www.weirdspace.dk image 150x394]


well technically hes a Jew, and Jews don't count unless there are too few "other" white people...

/same for Italians
//eastern Europe
///then Slavs
 
2013-02-27 10:47:25 AM  

Theaetetus: Cybernetic: jack21221: Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

IIRC, under the Supreme Court's Tinker v. Des Moines decision, an institution (such as a school) has a right to restrict activities (which may include speech) that are outside the purpose of that institution.

So, as admirable as the purpose of the student might be, from a legal standpoint she is not necessarily in the right.

/IANAL

Respectfully, that's almost 100% backwards. In Tinker, the Supreme Court held that a school could not punish a student wearing a black armband as a Vietnam protest, absent any evidence that the punishment was necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. As they said in that decision:
"First Amendment rights, applied in light of the special characteristics of the school environment, are available to teachers and students. It can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate. This has been the unmistakable holding of this Court for almost 50 years. "

The white board is the only distinction here, but I'd say Tinker still applies. Specifically, the holding in Tinker noted that:
"The school officials banned and sought to punish petitioners for a silent, passive expression of opinion, unaccompanied by any disorder or disturbance on the part of petitioners. There is here no evidence whatever of petitioners' interference, actual or nascent, with the schools' work or of collision with the rights of other students to be secure and to be let alone. Accordingly, this case does not concern speech or action that intrudes upon the work of the schools or the rights of other students."
Similarly, use of a white board is a silent protest, unaccompanied by any disorder or disturbance.

Further, I'd be willing to bet that the school doesn't suspend kids who are deaf or mute and communicate via writing. This was a punishment specifically because of the student's political views.


A deaf/mute example doesn't apply because it's an accommodation for a disability, and has nothing to do with any form of protest.

Also, I would argue that the whiteboard is a far more active protest than the black armbands in the original Tinker decision. Tinker allows restrictions where they are necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. Communicating via whiteboard has the effect of slowing down the class and interfering with the lesson, which impacts all of the students in her classes, even those who have no interest in or involvement with the protest. It also draws attention of the other students away from the task at hand, and generally makes it more difficult for the teachers to do their jobs. IMHO, that qualifies as disruptive, and therefore can be prohibited under the Tinker test. The rest of the students have the right to go about their school day without having their classes impeded by this student's chosen form of protest.
 
2013-02-27 10:48:30 AM  
Somebody didn't study school law, this was already decided in Tinker v. Des Moines,
 
2013-02-27 10:49:57 AM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: WhippingBoy: Take away the "activism" and they're left with nothing.

You know actually you're right, and if it hadn't been for activism we'd still have a legal system more anti-homosexual than those of some Warsaw Pact countries.


My comment was poorly worded. I didn't mean to imply that activism wasn't a good or necessary thing. It was instead intended to address those "professional" activists who's only purpose and sense of self-worth comes from their "activist" role. The day they get everything they ever want is the day they wither and die, because that thing that shaped their lives is no longer relevant.
 
2013-02-27 10:54:27 AM  

b3x: It is really just like anyone else is is completely obsessed with some topic


I've said this a thousand times to my family and friends who are LGBT:

The smartest thing to get the rights you want passed, is to STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride. The only thing it's doing is making people resent your lifestyle. At this point, the big city pride rallies that feature men in assless chaps riding a giant pink penis down main street for the past 30 years has turned people away from even hearing what you have to say about the topic. The same thing goes for marijuana, stop having the burnt out pot heads being your primary voice on the matter... You want people to take the issue seriously, start publicly acting like a sane, and rational everyday people and not acting like being gay/pothead is the ONLY thing that defines you as a person...

My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally, unlike the other person in the group who goes out of her way to throw it in everyone's faces, goes out of her way to be an attention whore, and who thinks being gay is what defines you as a person, instead of being a person who has a sexual preference to the same sex
 
2013-02-27 10:57:29 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: mafiageek1980

James F. Campbell: Random Anonymous Blackmail: I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

Do you work hard at being an asshole, or does it come naturally?

THIS!

Obviously you didn't read the article where it clearly states:

"peaceful protests" were "against District Policy.

She engaged in a "peaceful protest"

So am I an asshole because I think she deserves the same rights and has to operate under the same guidelines as every other student in the district or is it because you didn't bother reading the article.


Oh I read the article, Jerk. But your comment (the way it was worded at least) made it seem like you were against LBGT folks having the same rights as everyone else. She's not asking for special rights at all. She wanted to express herself, the school board said no to a rather over-active degree. Tell me this, if a straight-christian person (yes, I am going there) were to do the same thing, do you think THEY would be so quick to enforce their little "no peaceful protest" thing?
 
2013-02-27 10:59:28 AM  

Ker_Thwap: I have a strong suspicion that that school already has anti bullying policies and education.  Slacktivist girl should have approached the administration and asked how she could participate on one of the already ongoing programs.  Instead she put herself on the same level of a student who chose to wear an "abortion is murder" t-shirt.  Vastly different message of course, but choosing to deliver it in the same inappropriate manner.

The policy protects this girl from having to put up other peoples crazy beliefs, and it protects the other students from having to put up with her every belief.


I have three daughters in public elementary and middle schools in Florida, and the anti-bullying messages are pervasive. There are anti-bullying banners in the hallways and the gym, flyers and notices are sent home to the parents, and so on, and so forth. There are even a few kids in the middle school who openly identify as gay, and nobody really seems to care. Which is how it should be.

I would be VERY surprised to find out that the schools in De Soto County are not giving out the same kind of anti-bullying messages as the county where I live. And for what it's worth, the De Soto School District has a "Report a Bully Hotline" number on their web site. So there are already resources available and in place to deal with bullying situations.

I have a very strong feeling that this girl was primarily interested in drawing attention to herself, rather than her cause
 
2013-02-27 10:59:31 AM  

CeroX: My wife is bi,


Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.
 
2013-02-27 11:00:45 AM  
CeroX: b3x: It is really just like anyone else is is completely obsessed with some topic

I've said this a thousand times to my family and friends who are LGBT black:

The smartest thing to get the rights you want passed, is to STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride. The only thing it's doing is making people resent your lifestyle. At this point, the big city pride NAACP rallies that feature men in assless chaps riding a giant pink penis black people rapping down main street for the past 30 years has turned people away from even hearing what you have to say about the topic. The same thing goes for marijuana, stop having the burnt out pot heads being your primary voice on the matter... You want people to take the issue seriously, start publicly acting like a sane, and rational everyday people and not acting like being gay/pothead black is the ONLY thing that defines you as a person...

My wife is bi mixed, and her best friend is a lesbian black, my sister is a lesbian black, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay black if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians blacks actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally, unlike the other person in the group who goes out of her way to throw it in everyone's faces, goes out of her way to be an attention whore, and who thinks being gay black is what defines you as a person, instead of being a person who has a sexual racial preference to the same sex race
 
2013-02-27 11:03:32 AM  

Cybernetic: I have a very strong feeling that this girl was primarily interested in drawing attention to herself, rather than her cause


DING-DING-DING! We have a winnah!!!!
 
2013-02-27 11:04:46 AM  

WhippingBoy: tinfoil-hat maggie: WhippingBoy: Take away the "activism" and they're left with nothing.

You know actually you're right, and if it hadn't been for activism we'd still have a legal system more anti-homosexual than those of some Warsaw Pact countries.

My comment was poorly worded. I didn't mean to imply that activism wasn't a good or necessary thing. It was instead intended to address those "professional" activists who's only purpose and sense of self-worth comes from their "activist" role. The day they get everything they ever want is the day they wither and die, because that thing that shaped their lives is no longer relevant.


Oh, so you're building a straw-man.Have fun with that.
 
2013-02-27 11:05:39 AM  

vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.


seadoo2006: vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.

This ... I would've been the parent telling him to get farked.


WhippingBoy: vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.

I'd totally go up to him and say "Hey man, you're wrong!!!", then I'd totally kick his ass.


Like totally dude then like I would join you guy and like go back to my third period freshman math class.....

//the special needs class for you
 
2013-02-27 11:08:02 AM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.


a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry
 
2013-02-27 11:08:45 AM  

Cybernetic: Also, I would argue that the whiteboard is a far more active protest than the black armbands in the original Tinker decision. Tinker allows restrictions where they are necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. Communicating via whiteboard has the effect of slowing down the class and interfering with the lesson, which impacts all of the students in her classes, even those who have no interest in or involvement with the protest. It also draws attention of the other students away from the task at hand, and generally makes it more difficult for the teachers to do their jobs. IMHO, that qualifies as disruptive, and therefore can be prohibited under the Tinker test. The rest of the students have the right to go about their school day without having their classes impeded by this student's chosen form of protest.


The whiteboard certainly allows the school district to argue that his case is distinguishable from Tinker, and it's possible that a court would find the use of a whiteboard is sufficiently disruptive as to allow the school to prohibit it.  But, looking at what is alleged in the complaint (and at the document that are attached to the complaint), the school did not prohibited her protest because it was disruptive, but rather because it was a protest.  Rather, the school informed the student, when she sought permission in advance, that:

It is inconsistent with the district's past practice to approve student protests on any of our campuses.  [The student's request] is disapproved. . . . Since this is classified as a protest, . . . I will not approve the activity on our campuses.

The school informed the student that she would not be permitted to take part in this protext not because it was a disruptive protest, but simply because it was a protest, period.  In a later email, the school's principal informed all teachers at the school that:

[W]e have a group of students today who have an intention of protesting.  The district has an absolute policy against protesting on school campuses.  If you have students who are wearing placard in protest of an issue . . . please notify the dean or administration, and we will handle it.

Finally, after the protest, the principal described the student's conduct thusly:

Amber Hatcher [the student in question] was dressed in a shirt protesting the occasion.  When her teacher sent her up to the office she was belligerent to the Dean.  She initially refused to answer then refused to step into IR [presumably, IR = in-school-suspension].  She was talked to and did finally give the phone numbers of her parents.  She was placed in IR for the day as they could not be reached.

It is clear from these emails that the school's intent (and the school's policy) was not simply to prohibit disruptive protests.  The school's policy was an absolute prohibition of any protests, in any form.  The school's description of the student's conduct does not mention the whiteboard, only the t-shirt (her conduct after being sent to the office is irrelevant, as there was no indication that it occurred among other students or disrupted other students, and in any event she had already been sent to the office for the shirt).  While Tinker has been narrowed somewhat in the 40+ years since it was decided, an absolute prohibition of student protests, including the wearing of any "placard in protest of an issue" is clearly inconsistent with the First Amendment, as the Court has applied it in the school context.
 
2013-02-27 11:09:27 AM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: WhippingBoy: tinfoil-hat maggie: WhippingBoy: Take away the "activism" and they're left with nothing.

You know actually you're right, and if it hadn't been for activism we'd still have a legal system more anti-homosexual than those of some Warsaw Pact countries.

My comment was poorly worded. I didn't mean to imply that activism wasn't a good or necessary thing. It was instead intended to address those "professional" activists who's only purpose and sense of self-worth comes from their "activist" role. The day they get everything they ever want is the day they wither and die, because that thing that shaped their lives is no longer relevant.

Oh, so you're building a straw-man.Have fun with that.


No I'm not! You are!
 
2013-02-27 11:09:55 AM  
yeah, the majority of days that don't have a "name"  you have ALL of those really, that's just how it works in a white straight dominated culture.


Oh my god, it is!

Most societies do tend to be dominated by the majority. Shocking.
 
2013-02-27 11:10:04 AM  

CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.

a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry


You used your wife's sexuality to justify your own views on the matter.  Thus, you were doing the EXACT thing you were just railing on about (IE, the rightous self-justification of GBLTA members)
 
2013-02-27 11:10:54 AM  

KimNorth: vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.

seadoo2006: vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.

This ... I would've been the parent telling him to get farked.

WhippingBoy: vudukungfu: The principal also called her parents to tell them their daughter was prohibited from participating in the National Day of Silence.

I'm afraid if it were my daughter, the principal and I would be having a one way conversation and his head would get put on straight.
He would receive one verbal warning from me, apologize to my kid, and STFU after that.
Or he'd be in court, losing. A lot.
I'd get an uppity high profile lawyer and tell him, tear flesh and you get 90%.

I'd totally go up to him and say "Hey man, you're wrong!!!", then I'd totally kick his ass.

Like totally dude then like I would join you guy and like go back to my third period freshman math class.....

//the special needs class for you


Are you SERIOUS??? Do you know who you're dealing with here??? Didn't you read my comment??? I'm so totally gonna come over there and KICK. YOUR. ASS!!!!
 
2013-02-27 11:13:11 AM  
You go to school to learn, not be an attention whore. Dont want to talk the whole day? Call in sick and stay home. The shirt did not get her suspended subby, it was her refusal to communicate verbaly

/some people want more rights than other it seems.
 
2013-02-27 11:14:19 AM  
www.shoeboxblog.com
 
2013-02-27 11:15:49 AM  
You know seadoo2006, I think CeroX's advice is still valid even with your edit.  Fill in the blank with pretty much anything, and it's still solid advice.  When you have inflexible extremists championing a cause it's less convincing than having a spokesperson who's articulate and thoughtful.    To hyperbolize the example, abortion clinic bomber vs. Martin Luther King.  One is a footnote, one got something accomplished.
 
2013-02-27 11:16:33 AM  
seadoo2006

Not sure what you are trying to accomplish here, but if you are saying that having black skin is what defines a black person instead of their actions, then i think you missed the point...

Actions define a person not skin color or sexual preference...
 
b3x
2013-02-27 11:24:01 AM  

seadoo2006: CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.

a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry

You used your wife's sexuality to justify your own views on the matter.  Thus, you were doing the EXACT thing you were just railing on about (IE, the rightous self-justification of GBLTA members)



I thought he was bragging ...
 
2013-02-27 11:26:24 AM  

seadoo2006: CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.

a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry

You used your wife's sexuality to justify your own views on the matter.  Thus, you were doing the EXACT thing you were just railing on about (IE, the rightous self-justification of GBLTA members)


perhaps i just have bad writing skills, but i wasn't trying to justify... i don't need to, i have a viewpoint, i express these viewpoints to the people i know who happen to be gay/bi and generally speaking they would agree... except for one, if there's a counter to that argument, then i would openly hear it in a... wait for it... logical and rational manor... but if you want to tape your argument to a post-it note and sitck it on your hooha... don't expect to be taken serious...
 
2013-02-27 11:27:40 AM  

Ker_Thwap: You know seadoo2006, I think CeroX's advice is still valid even with your edit.  Fill in the blank with pretty much anything, and it's still solid advice.  When you have inflexible extremists championing a cause it's less convincing than having a spokesperson who's articulate and thoughtful.    To hyperbolize the example, abortion clinic bomber vs. Martin Luther King.  One is a footnote, one got something accomplished.


hey thanks... more articulate than i could put it...
 
2013-02-27 11:27:56 AM  
Seadoo2006


Thank you! It is excellent advice for all groups, in fact.
 
2013-02-27 11:31:10 AM  
Teenagers don't have rights.
 
2013-02-27 11:31:21 AM  

Cybernetic: jack21221: Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

IIRC, under the Supreme Court's Tinker v. Des Moines decision, an institution (such as a school) has a right to restrict activities (which may include speech) that are outside the purpose of that institution.

So, as admirable as the purpose of the student might be, from a legal standpoint she is not necessarily in the right.

/IANAL


They can regulate speech.

Can the regulate not speaking?
 
2013-02-27 11:32:54 AM  

CeroX: seadoo2006: CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.

a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry

You used your wife's sexuality to justify your own views on the matter.  Thus, you were doing the EXACT thing you were just railing on about (IE, the rightous self-justification of GBLTA members)

perhaps i just have bad writing skills, but i wasn't trying to justify... i don't need to, i have a viewpoint, i express these viewpoints to the people i know who happen to be gay/bi and generally speaking they would agree... except for one, if there's a counter to that argument, then i would openly hear it in a... wait for it... logical and rational manor... but if you want to tape your argument to a post-it note and sitck it on your hooha... don't expect to be taken serious...


I'd like to ask a question. What do you consider examples of what you said here, "STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride" ?
 
2013-02-27 11:33:02 AM  

seadoo2006: CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.

a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry

You used your wife's sexuality to justify your own views on the matter.  Thus, you were doing the EXACT thing you were just railing on about (IE, the rightous self-justification of GBLTA members)


What i took away from CeroX's original post: 'I know three people that are LGBT(one is my wife). 2 of the 3 act like normal people when discussing it, the other is an attention whoring ass-hat. which do you think garners the most respect when speaking about it?'
 
2013-02-27 11:47:00 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail:  PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.


I really love this new conservative talking point that equal rights are "special rights" or "better rights."

It's like a flashing neon warning sign.  Makes things easier.
 
2013-02-27 11:54:59 AM  

El_Perro: It is clear from these emails that the school's intent (and the school's policy) was not simply to prohibit disruptive protests. The school's policy was an absolute prohibition of any protests, in any form. The school's description of the student's conduct does not mention the whiteboard, only the t-shirt (her conduct after being sent to the office is irrelevant, as there was no indication that it occurred among other students or disrupted other students, and in any event she had already been sent to the office for the shirt). While Tinker has been narrowed somewhat in the 40+ years since it was decided, an absolute prohibition of student protests, including the wearing of any "placard in protest of an issue" is clearly inconsistent with the First Amendment, as the Court has applied it in the school context.


Supreme Court jurisprudence has far more to say about lewd speech and drug-related speech than it does about protests or political speech (Papish, Bethel, Hazelwood, and Morse). But those rulings clearly establish that students in school do not have the same First Amendment rights as adults in other settings.

The Tinker decision hinges on the idea that the wearing of armbands was "entirely divorced from actually or potentially disruptive conduct," and refers to their conduct as "silent, passive expression of opinion, unaccompanied by any disorder or disturbance."

The whole concept of the Day of Silence appears to be an attempt to adhere to the letter of the Tinker decision while defying its spirit. Keeping silent adheres to the Tinker standard of "silent, passive expression". Communication by whiteboard is significantly slower than speaking, and thus inherently disruptive to the flow of instruction, and also serves to draw attention to the protester, and therefore constitutes a "disorder or disturbance".

The lawsuit itself admits that the student knew that she could not "materially and substantially disrupt the school environment or the rights of others," and describes the Day of Silence as "inherently expressive" and "a day of action." I find it difficult to reconcile that first statement with the other two.

The school's report may not mention the whiteboard, but that doesn't mean that the presence and use of the whiteboard was not disruptive or relevant to her removal from class.
 
2013-02-27 11:55:29 AM  

ciberido: Random Anonymous Blackmail:  PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

I really love this new conservative talking point that equal rights are "special rights" or "better rights."

It's like a flashing neon warning sign.  Makes things easier.


You're taking away the conservative "right to discriminate", you bigot. ;)
 
2013-02-27 11:55:30 AM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: seadoo2006: CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie: CeroX: My wife is bi,

Ahem, you just did what you're complaining about.

a bit confused, care to expand?

I'm open to a rational conversation, i know i've said something to upset you in the past, and i'm assuming it may be on this subject, so now is the time to air out the laundry

You used your wife's sexuality to justify your own views on the matter.  Thus, you were doing the EXACT thing you were just railing on about (IE, the rightous self-justification of GBLTA members)

perhaps i just have bad writing skills, but i wasn't trying to justify... i don't need to, i have a viewpoint, i express these viewpoints to the people i know who happen to be gay/bi and generally speaking they would agree... except for one, if there's a counter to that argument, then i would openly hear it in a... wait for it... logical and rational manor... but if you want to tape your argument to a post-it note and sitck it on your hooha... don't expect to be taken serious...

I'd like to ask a question. What do you consider examples of what you said here, "STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride" ?


Ok, i'll use our friend as an example, i love her to death, but she's not tasteful or tactful about the subject... going out with us to dinner, and wearing a black shirt with just the word F*G (starred for fark filters) on it to a family restaurant, then flying off the handle at complete strangers who might roll their eyes or give a disgusted look. She about got us thrown out of Red Robin for that one...

Here's another one, walking back to the car after going out to a club, she's in face, and just starts yelling at this group of girls standing at their car because they were pointing and whispering...

those the kind of examples you are looking for?
 
2013-02-27 11:58:22 AM  

Farce-Side: Peaceful protests against school board policy?  Violence that shiat up a bit then.

Seriously though, if the principal and or dean or whatever made up administrative position they have there to siphon money from the tax payers didn't make a big deal out of it, let her do her stupid little no talking ghey thing, nobody would have cared or even noticed.  If they are trying to prevent the ghey in their school, they are failing, and probably turning more kids ghey as a result.

Ipso facto, public schools are turning our kids gay.  Somebody get outraged.


Is there some reason you're using "gay" and "ghey" in the same post?  Are you having a stroke or are the different spellings supposed to have different meanings?
 
2013-02-27 12:02:24 PM  

ciberido: Farce-Side: Peaceful protests against school board policy?  Violence that shiat up a bit then.

Seriously though, if the principal and or dean or whatever made up administrative position they have there to siphon money from the tax payers didn't make a big deal out of it, let her do her stupid little no talking ghey thing, nobody would have cared or even noticed.  If they are trying to prevent the ghey in their school, they are failing, and probably turning more kids ghey as a result.

Ipso facto, public schools are turning our kids gay.  Somebody get outraged.

Is there some reason you're using "gay" and "ghey" in the same post?  Are you having a stroke or are the different spellings supposed to have different meanings?


Eh, no reason.  Just like to switch it up sometimes.  Variety is the spice of life, no?
 
2013-02-27 12:07:08 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: I'd like to ask a question. What do you consider examples of what you said here, "STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride" ?


You know... It's okay if you're gay, as long as I don't know about it. "Don't ask don't tell" never hurt anybody, right?
 
2013-02-27 12:07:26 PM  
Stop that! Your making the bullies feel bad.
 
2013-02-27 12:08:48 PM  
 PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

I really love this new conservative talking point that equal rights are "special rights" or "better rights."

It's like a flashing neon warning sign.  Makes things easier


I'll bet. Thank god for shortcuts to thinking.
 
2013-02-27 12:09:33 PM  

CeroX: Ok, i'll use our friend as an example, i love her to death, but she's not tasteful or tactful about the subject... going out with us to dinner, and wearing a black shirt with just the word F*G (starred for fark filters) on it to a family restaurant, then flying off the handle at complete strangers who might roll their eyes or give a disgusted look. She about got us thrown out of Red Robin for that one...

Here's another one, walking back to the car after going out to a club, she's in face, and just starts yelling at this group of girls standing at their car because they were pointing and whispering...

those the kind of examples you are looking for?


So you're saying you know one person ( a friend ) that does those things and acts out but it was relevant here. Anyway sorry but I'm sensing a concern troll but maybe that's just me and it's my opinion man.
 
2013-02-27 12:12:24 PM  

Diogenes: pDiablo: happens every day..some people are just blind to it cos its not minority race related so aint news worthy.and we dont jump up and down screaming about rights and descrimination

I would expect a straight, white hardworking family man could speak American better.


And except for spelling, comma splices, you're/your, it's/its, to/too, and the occasional subordinate clause ending with a period, you'd be right to expect so.
 
2013-02-27 12:12:29 PM  

GranoblasticMan: tinfoil-hat maggie: I'd like to ask a question. What do you consider examples of what you said here, "STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride" ?

You know... It's okay if you're gay, as long as I don't know about it. "Don't ask don't tell" never hurt anybody, right?


That's what I hear.
 
2013-02-27 12:15:42 PM  
What ever happened to say out of my bed room? Who gives a shiat who you like to fark if they are old enough?
Reminds me of the attention whores for jesus
 
2013-02-27 12:18:25 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: It's not clear at all why the administration turned this into such a major issue. Or why the teacher sent her to the principal for such a minor disobedient act.


When you disregard the content of her message, the answer is obvious -- she is being punished for being disobedient.

From the authoritarian's perspective, having an underling be disobedient (in this case by asserting something) is far more of a problem than the content of her assertion.

The school's highest value is extracting compliance, even if it's entirely symbolic.

That's the essence of all governmental operations, actually.  For example, they care far less that you pay your taxes than that you agree that you are obligated to pay taxes.  They don't need the money.  They'd much rather have your submission.
 
2013-02-27 12:20:16 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: It's not clear at all why the administration turned this into such a major issue. Or why the teacher sent her to the principal for such a minor disobedient act. She was using a whiteboard to communicate.

It's not even that I think she should be allowed to get away with anything, but in this case what exactly are they trying to pin on this girl?

It's ridiculous.


Next time, get a note from her gay doc that says she has laryngitis and cant speak and needs the whiteboard.

apparently, the school has a policy against protests.  Thats life.  You next boss might have a policy against nose piercings.  If you want to go there, dont get the nose pierced.
 
2013-02-27 12:27:29 PM  

dennysgod: FTA: She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board.

There's little facts in this on-sided article but communicating with a dry-erase board when there was no physical or school sanction reason for it, is what probably lead to her ISS and not the t-shirt.


What if everyone in the class did this.  Can you imagine trying to teach and having to wait 30 seconds for each response from students?  Suspend that biatch.  Go protest on your own time.
 
2013-02-27 12:29:48 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: dennysgod: FTA: She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board.

There's little facts in this on-sided article but communicating with a dry-erase board when there was no physical or school sanction reason for it, is what probably lead to her ISS and not the t-shirt.

What if everyone in the class did this.  Can you imagine trying to teach and having to wait 30 seconds for each response from students?  Suspend that biatch.  Go protest on your own time.


What are you talking about? *Her* protest is correct and valid. All other protests are wrong. She should get special privileges because I agree with what she's doing.
 
b3x
2013-02-27 12:31:44 PM  

El_Perro: Cybernetic: Also, I would argue that the whiteboard is a far more active protest than the black armbands in the original Tinker decision. Tinker allows restrictions where they are necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. Communicating via whiteboard has the effect of slowing down the class and interfering with the lesson, which impacts all of the students in her classes, even those who have no interest in or involvement with the protest. It also draws attention of the other students away from the task at hand, and generally makes it more difficult for the teachers to do their jobs. IMHO, that qualifies as disruptive, and therefore can be prohibited under the Tinker test. The rest of the students have the right to go about their school day without having their classes impeded by this student's chosen form of protest.

The whiteboard certainly allows the school district to argue that his case is distinguishable from Tinker, and it's possible that a court would find the use of a whiteboard is sufficiently disruptive as to allow the school to prohibit it.  But, looking at what is alleged in the complaint (and at the document that are attached to the complaint), the school did not prohibited her protest because it was disruptive, but rather because it was a protest.  Rather, the school informed the student, when she sought permission in advance, that:

It is inconsistent with the district's past practice to approve student protests on any of our campuses.  [The student's request] is disapproved. . . . Since this is classified as a protest, . . . I will not approve the activity on our campuses.

The school informed the student that she would not be permitted to take part in this protext not because it was a disruptive protest, but simply because it was a protest, period.  In a later email, the school's principal informed all teachers at the school that:

[W]e have a group of students today who have an intention of protest ...


Bottom line, is it is a stupid attention whoring and disruptive PROTEST at a school. Public schools are not an appropriate place to be protesting. I can imagine that if a bunch of (insert organized religion)'s were organizing a DAY OF SILENCE because (insert their high power) wasn't getting enough airplay at school, then groups like the LGBT groups that are OMG OPPRESSION at this girls suspension would be all totally OK with it. The primary focus of public high schools is to educate kids enough that they can get into a college, where they can go join a activist cult and do all kinds of fun protests every night. It is not a venue for attention whores, no matter what their cause, to stir up the media and every other over the top nutjob. Really, I put this kind of crap right up there with Westboro Baptist Church ... it all amounts to the same thing: Media Terrorism. Purposely provoking a reaction, and then becoming a BLOG sensation. I hope we can look back on these days, and lament our hyper-sensationalizing every kid who gets suspended from school for doing something they were told not to do.
 
2013-02-27 12:31:49 PM  

99.998er: I am sure many of my fellow Farkers will think I am a jerk (as if they didn't already), but I will throw in my 2 cents. I support gay/lesbian rights, marriage, adoption, etc. However, there is a difference between expressing your views and grandstanding. I feel pretty sure the entire school and most of the community realize Amber is a lesbian by now. Some will agree with her, some will not. It is Florida after all. I appreciate her courage to voice her opinion and to stand up for what is right in a free society. However, I hardly think she is a trailblazer in her plight. Sometimes the best way to get point across is to act like a human being instead of a lesbian human being. They already know her sexual orientation so there is no reason keep banging that drum. It is kind of the reverse Streisand effect. She is bringing it out to the public and media likes she wants, but she risks many people just thinking she is an attention whore that is looking for her 15 minutes of martyrdom.


I have a better word than "jerk."  How about "concern troll," if we must have a label for you.

Bravo for subtly, though.
 
2013-02-27 12:34:25 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: So you're saying you know one person ( a friend ) that does those things and acts out but it was relevant here. Anyway sorry but I'm sensing a concern troll but maybe that's just me and it's my opinion man.



It's not just the one friend with the chip on her shoulder... Take some of the big annual pride parades... been to one with floats and everything, there was a group of guys who were all wearing the assless and leather vest get ups... they were going down the parade ruote acting like they were f-ing and had pink supersoakers that they were sticking between their legs and spraying the crowd...
That is the kind of behavior that, in my opinion, destroys the credibility of the movement and has the exact opposite reaction from the very people that need to have their minds changed...
I'll use the Pot legalization movement as another example of having the wrong people in the public spotlight and out in public in general. When you had burn outs and cheech and chong doing stupid stuff, it was a major turn off for people. They look at that behavior and say "No, it's obvious what pot does to people, i'm not going to support it". Now that Cheech is acting respectably on TV and chong is seen as a sad washed up pot actor, and the movement has had respectable people like doctors and lawyers who are speaking up about it, the idea is starting to take hold...
And i KNOW the lgbt community have plenty of rallies that attempt to show people that there are people out there who aren't over the top, they get out there in normal clothes and hold up banners, but there are still, for lack of a better term, deviants out there who go to the extreme to make people uncomfortable and then demand that they act like nothing is wrong...
 
2013-02-27 12:34:28 PM  

jayhawk88: ...but the school's principal said "peaceful protests" were "against District Policy."

Wow. I mean, I've read my share of Nazi High School stories, I'm not exactly shocked by this, but to see it spelled out in such a way is pretty amazing.


Go protest on your own time.  Dry erase board not disruptive?   Does the school system deal with hearing disabled students?  Yes, in limited quantities in classed with a small teacher to student ratio.  You go try to teach 30 kids and have to keep walking to the back of the room to read a handwritten answer to your question.  Might as well take the entire day off for Gay Day, because no teaching is going to happen.
 
2013-02-27 12:34:57 PM  
As an alumni from that high school, this pleases me. I wish her the best of luck.
 
2013-02-27 12:39:53 PM  

doubled99: yeah, the majority of days that don't have a "name"  you have ALL of those really, that's just how it works in a white straight dominated culture.


Oh my god, it is!

Most societies do tend to be dominated by the majority. Shocking.


the fact is the complaint was "we don't have a day"
the wonders of this culture as some minorities DO get a day,  One cant be upset that you don't have a special day when all of the rest are yours by default

don't be a prat, you cant have both without looking like a petulant child
 
2013-02-27 12:41:02 PM  

Twigz221: Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU. THE SAME RIGHTS THAT YOU HAVE.

I blame the parents.

Fixed that for you.


Really?  Show me where hetero kids are allowed to engage in silent protests in that school district.
 
2013-02-27 12:43:09 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: Might as well take the entire day off for Gay Day, because no teaching is going to happen.


You say that as though teaching was going to happen.
 
2013-02-27 12:43:47 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: xanadian: FTFA: An openly lesbian student on Tuesday sued her high school in Florida after she was suspended for participating in an anti-bullying event.

Awwww...look how cute the li'l lesbian is, thinking her "rights" matter. She's all growed up now!

I refer you to "Bong Hits 4 Jesus v. Alaska," sweetheart...

Wow, I'm surprised at you but yeah I can completely see the similarities in supporting what can be construed as an illegal and anti-bullying.


I'm just saying that there's already precedent for stomping on free speech rights for teens, no matter if it's for a good cause or not.

navylostboy: /hate that argument (better rights)


It's "better rights" because THOSE PEOPLE aren't really "people," so we're doing them a great service by giving them "better rights" that we GOOD and NORMAL people take for granted.
 
2013-02-27 12:44:53 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: Twigz221: Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU. THE SAME RIGHTS THAT YOU HAVE.

I blame the parents.

Fixed that for you.

Really?  Show me where hetero kids are allowed to engage in silent protests in that school district.


Dude, this is fark.... some are more equal than others
 
2013-02-27 12:45:09 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: Oh, so you're building a straw-man.Have fun with that.


Better than building a mystery.

...
 
2013-02-27 12:46:40 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: GranoblasticMan: tinfoil-hat maggie: I'd like to ask a question. What do you consider examples of what you said here, "STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride" ?

You know... It's okay if you're gay, as long as I don't know about it. "Don't ask don't tell" never hurt anybody, right?

That's what I hear.


So the two of you are saying that being gay means being BOLD and HEY LOOK AT ME IM GAY!

I'm not talking about telling effeminate men to stop acting effeminate, i'm not talking about lesbians growing out their buzz cuts either... I'm talking about having the community recognize that there are extremists in their community that makes the community look bad in the public eye.

Look at it from the exact opposite... I know there are plenty of people who are religious, who are accepting of the gay community on a personal level, but it's the extremists that are the ones on TV and making the news on the anti-gay subject, and the rational ones don't do enough to put the extremists down, so that extreme view is the only one people think about
 
2013-02-27 12:48:13 PM  

CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,


Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?  Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.
 
2013-02-27 12:48:31 PM  

CeroX: And i KNOW the lgbt community have plenty of rallies that attempt to show people that there are people out there who aren't over the top, they get out there in normal clothes and hold up banners, but there are still, for lack of a better term, deviants out there who go to the extreme to make people uncomfortable and then demand that they act like nothing is wrong...


Well, I was surprised when you left out the parades earlier. Well you know what you don't get it. The pride parades aren't really about the politics those are for all the "deviants", even the ones that "attempt" not to be over the top. It's to celebrate the diversity and to show our own numbers and have fun.The politics takes place everyday.
 
2013-02-27 12:49:22 PM  
This is far less of a story than last year's Fark hate crime hoax in Nebraska.  Do better next time.
 
2013-02-27 12:53:55 PM  

CeroX: I'm not talking about telling effeminate men to stop acting effeminate, i'm not talking about lesbians growing out their buzz cuts either... I'm talking about having the community recognize that there are extremists in their community that makes the community look bad in the public eye.


You realize that this "extremism" you're complaining about doesn't actually hurt you, right?  Affects you not at all?  That it's all just words and symbolic actions that have nothing to do with you?

What is it with people who insist on asserting the right to control other people?  Why does it even register on your radar screen?  So what if some flamer waved a symbolic pink dong around?  He's TROLLING you.  Get it?
 
2013-02-27 12:54:32 PM  
yeah, the majority of days that don't have a "name"  you have ALL of those really, that's just how it works in a white straight dominated culture.


Oh my god, it is!

Most societies do tend to be dominated by the majority. Shocking.

the fact is the complaint was "we don't have a day"
the wonders of this culture as some minorities DO get a day,  One cant be upset that you don't have a special day when all of the rest are yours by default


Just plain idiocy. I bet you even felt you had a point when you typed that nonsense.
 
2013-02-27 12:56:18 PM  
If you don't agree that's fine, but i'm not some kind of anti-gay activist nor suggesting that anyone's rights be trampled, in fact i'm the opposite, i'm a supporter, but i think the community is going about it wrong is all... I'm sure one day it will all work out, but i personally think it's going to be a longer, harder battle to fight than people are expecting and it angers me that the community embraces the extremists and coddles extreme behavior...
 
2013-02-27 12:57:07 PM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU.

I blame the parents.


And today's Idiot Who Cried "Attention Whore" is... Thanks for being today's designated asshole. We salute you.
 
2013-02-27 12:59:16 PM  

CeroX: it angers me that the community embraces the extremists and coddles extreme behavior


You sound moderate.
 
2013-02-27 12:59:35 PM  

doubled99: yeah, the majority of days that don't have a "name"  you have ALL of those really, that's just how it works in a white straight dominated culture.


Oh my god, it is!

Most societies do tend to be dominated by the majority. Shocking.

the fact is the complaint was "we don't have a day"
the wonders of this culture as some minorities DO get a day,  One cant be upset that you don't have a special day when all of the rest are yours by default

Just plain idiocy. I bet you even felt you had a point when you typed that nonsense.


ah, so it is like trying to explain to a fish that he is wet... thanks  for bringing that into focus
 
2013-02-27 01:02:39 PM  

ciberido: CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,

Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?  Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.


Christ, we need an "Outraged Activists" bingo card. Must include "mansplaining".

/I'm on it!
 
2013-02-27 01:04:21 PM  

Phinn: CeroX: I'm not talking about telling effeminate men to stop acting effeminate, i'm not talking about lesbians growing out their buzz cuts either... I'm talking about having the community recognize that there are extremists in their community that makes the community look bad in the public eye.

You realize that this "extremism" you're complaining about doesn't actually hurt you, right?  Affects you not at all?  That it's all just words and symbolic actions that have nothing to do with you?

What is it with people who insist on asserting the right to control other people?  Why does it even register on your radar screen?  So what if some flamer waved a symbolic pink dong around?  He's TROLLING you.  Get it?


He never claimed it hurt him. He just said that intelligent, sober speech and actions are taken far more seriously than attention-whoring histrionics.
 
2013-02-27 01:06:31 PM  
tinfoil-hat maggie:
Well, I was surprised when you left out the parades earlier. Well you know what you don't get it. The pride parades aren't really about the politics those are for all the "deviants", even the ones that "attempt" not to be over the top. It's to celebrate the diversity and to show our own numbers and have fun.The politics takes place everyday.

And what i'm trying to point out is that those public displays of what you call fun, is extreme behavior that the other side is paying attention to... They don't ignore that, in fact, those are the displays that stick out in their mind more than anything else, and that image is a negative image to them...

I get it, i do, it's fun, it's Pride... It's not much different than a bunch of rednecks standing around a pile of fireworks drinking beer, shooting guns in the air, wrapping themselves up in American flags and screaming "USA, USA, USA" on the 4th of July because they love being American... the one difference is that they aren't oppressed and seeking equal rights from the rest of America...
 
2013-02-27 01:08:37 PM  

CeroX: I get it, i do, it's fun, it's Pride... It's not much different than a bunch of rednecks standing around a pile of fireworks drinking beer, shooting guns in the air, wrapping themselves up in American flags and screaming "USA, USA, USA" on the 4th of July because they love being American... the one difference is that they aren't oppressed and seeking equal rights from the rest of America...


You know how I know you don't know any rednecks?
 
2013-02-27 01:10:48 PM  

ciberido: CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,

Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?   Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.


You sound manaphobic
 
2013-02-27 01:13:48 PM  

Phinn: CeroX: I get it, i do, it's fun, it's Pride... It's not much different than a bunch of rednecks standing around a pile of fireworks drinking beer, shooting guns in the air, wrapping themselves up in American flags and screaming "USA, USA, USA" on the 4th of July because they love being American... the one difference is that they aren't oppressed and seeking equal rights from the rest of America...

You know how I know you don't know any rednecks?


;) love ya!
 
PJ-
2013-02-27 01:14:26 PM  
I don't understand why people are getting caught up over a child not being given certain rights.  I mean seriously, who cares what they think, at that age, they don't even know what they want in a year except for being rich and being able to party with their friends.  When I was in school, I didn't have those rights, I had to show up to school, listen to what the adults said, and if I didn't, I would get punished.  Now, adults go to jail because a child cries about being treated unfairly, losing their jobs because a kid doesn't get enough playtime with their sports team.  Who cares if they think they have a right to protest, who cares that they aren't being treated the same as an adult.  There are things like the Young Offenders Act for a reason, because kids haven't fully developed their critical thinking abilities, so they don't think everything through.  So, we can say 'well that kid can't be punished too harshly because they are too young to know better', but we can't say 'no, you can't protest because you are too young to know better'.

fark that shiat
 
2013-02-27 01:17:02 PM  

Joe Blowme: ciberido: CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,

Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?   Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.

You sound manaphobic


LUUUU-CY! You got some mansplaining to do!!!

www.epmonthly.com
 
2013-02-27 01:18:34 PM  

ciberido: 99.998er: I am sure many of my fellow Farkers will think I am a jerk (as if they didn't already), but I wicommunity realize Amber is a lesbian by now. Some will agree with her, some will not. It is Florida after all. I appreciate her courage to voice....

I have a better word than "jerk."  How about "concern troll," if we must have a label for you.

Bravo for subtly, though.


Thank you for the enlightenment, however I think the below might be a better fit since I am not terribly passionate about her cause one way or the other:

devil's advocate n. One who argues against a cause or position, not as a committed opponent but simply for the sake of argument or to determine the validity.
 
2013-02-27 01:21:30 PM  
IE of parents being dipshiats, and attention whoring out their first grader... so sad
http://www.denverpost.com/ci_22674172/transgender-fountain-1st-grade r- banned-from-girls-bathroom#ixzz2M7nLYvc7
 
2013-02-27 01:25:46 PM  

JohnCarter: I am so annoyed with the LGBT moniker...


Same here.  It's totally gay.
 
2013-02-27 01:28:02 PM  
ah, so it is like trying to explain to a fish that he is wet


You probably think the fish is dumb in that analogy
 
2013-02-27 01:28:17 PM  
I went in before reading the article thinking.. Oh boy, another idiot decision by a school.

Not the case here.  She was told WEEKS, then DAYS, then HOURS before NOT to do what she did.
fark her.

You wanna suck dick, or lick pussy.  Fine.  But Jesus.. keep it to yourself.
 
2013-02-27 01:29:14 PM  

seadoo2006: give me doughnuts: Thunderpipes: Want to end bullying? Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Christ, how hard is that? Teaching them to cry just enables it more.


How about teachng your kid not to be a bully?

It's okay ... kids have already figured out the relief valve here ... what you may ask? Well, guns equalize bullying ... bullies SHOULD be afraid for their lives.  I mean, could you imagine how polite everyone would be if they thought that little Jimmy with the ratty clothes might take 20 people out?

Thunderpipes should be all for this.  After all, an armed society is a polite society, right?

School shootings have equalized the playground.  Carry on.


If you liberals would have actually had to stand up for yourselves as children, you might get some self-respect and real self-esteem, and not be so reliant on handouts and be terrified of anyone who doesn't think like you do.

But here is a trophy, you earned it for being alive.
 
2013-02-27 01:51:48 PM  

Ker_Thwap: You know seadoo2006, I think CeroX's advice is still valid even with your edit.  Fill in the blank with pretty much anything, and it's still solid advice.  When you have inflexible extremists championing a cause it's less convincing than having a spokesperson who's articulate and thoughtful.    To hyperbolize the example, abortion clinic bomber vs. Martin Luther King.  One is a footnote, one got something accomplished.


This is what I thought when the gay community responded to the whole Chik-fil-A Appreciation Day with the "kiss in" counter protest. All they did was give the bigots another reason to dislike them.

Personally, I thought the fact that Dan Cathy's comments became a scandal was in and of itself a sign of how far the country has moved forward on this issue. Ten years ago, it wouldn't have been a blip on the radar.

Another example, back in 1994 the TV show Roseanne fell into a whole heap of controversy over an episode where Mariel Hemingway gave Roseanne a kiss, which was obscured by the camera angle. Flash forward to 2011. Darren Criss plants a smooch directly on Chris Colfer's lips on Glee (both playing high school students), and the person who got into hot water over it was Victoria Jackson for calling it "disgusting".
 
2013-02-27 01:58:09 PM  

CeroX: If you don't agree that's fine, but i'm not some kind of anti-gay activist nor suggesting that anyone's rights be trampled, in fact i'm the opposite, i'm a supporter, but i think the community is going about it wrong is all... I'm sure one day it will all work out, but i personally think it's going to be a longer, harder battle to fight than people are expecting and it angers me that the community embraces the extremists and coddles extreme behavior...


I grant that you're sincere and mean well.

You can be well-intentioned and yet wrong.  As can I, for that matter.  The sincerity of my belief doesn't automatically make me right and you wrong, or vice-versa.
 
2013-02-27 01:59:26 PM  

Joe Blowme: ciberido: CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,

Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?   Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.

You sound manaphobic



Some of my best friends are men :-P  Hell, I even like YOU sometimes, Joe.
 
2013-02-27 02:00:07 PM  

KimNorth: "She arrived to school on the following day wearing a red T-shirt with the message "DOS April 20, 2012: Shhhhh" and communicated using a dry-erase board. The dean of students punished Hatcher with an in-school suspension."
Sorry there sweetheart but using a dry-eraser board in all your classes to communicate IS a bit disruptive..........


Actually, that would probably facilitate clearer communication, since most people have more legible printing than their spoken words. It's certainly not disruptive any more than someone wearing a flashing T-shirt, which is something I would count as 'if you have a problem with this you're a wuss'.
 
2013-02-27 02:05:53 PM  
Whatever. She's pretty hot.
 
2013-02-27 02:13:48 PM  

Thunderpipes: seadoo2006: give me doughnuts: Thunderpipes: Want to end bullying? Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Christ, how hard is that? Teaching them to cry just enables it more.


How about teachng your kid not to be a bully?

It's okay ... kids have already figured out the relief valve here ... what you may ask? Well, guns equalize bullying ... bullies SHOULD be afraid for their lives.  I mean, could you imagine how polite everyone would be if they thought that little Jimmy with the ratty clothes might take 20 people out?

Thunderpipes should be all for this.  After all, an armed society is a polite society, right?

School shootings have equalized the playground.  Carry on.

If you liberals would have actually had to stand up for yourselves as children, you might get some self-respect and real self-esteem, and not be so reliant on handouts and be terrified of anyone who doesn't think like you do.

But here is a trophy, you earned it for being alive.


You know, as a liberal, I prefer the term "Dirty hippie Liberal scum" rather than "you liberal". If you are gonna diss us, do it right! And enough with the stereotype of us being whimpy with no self esteem. That point is getting old. Why not talk to more than one of us for a change and you might be SHOCKED to find that we were raised by great families and have LOTS of self esteem, thank you very much.

and I won't waste my breath with the usual "you are what's wrong with society" rants. Nope, you aren't worth it. Times and people are changing and waking up to the fact (thanks to us opening our mouths) that you know what, WE DESERVE TO BE TREATED EQUALLY. So yeah, if we have to get a little loud and annoying to make the point of something as "minor" as you know, being treated EQUALLY, well then, until we are, DEAL WITH IT.
 
2013-02-27 02:14:51 PM  
I forgot to add in my last post

/Transgendered
 
2013-02-27 02:22:00 PM  
14"x14" whiteboard, $18.49
Day of Silence T-Shirt, $15.00

Learning who the real bullies are...priceless
 
2013-02-27 02:25:57 PM  

doubled99: ah, so it is like trying to explain to a fish that he is wet


You probably think the fish is dumb in that analogy


no, but unaware that there can be any different existence to his own. to a fish he is wet, all the time, so you cant explain wet to him.  not stupid or dumb but ignorant.

Stupid or dumb comes to play when you refuse to acknowledge that there can be any different kind of life to theirs
 
2013-02-27 02:26:46 PM  

ciberido: Joe Blowme: ciberido: CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,

Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?   Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.

You sound manaphobic


Some of my best friends are men :-P  Hell, I even like YOU sometimes, Joe.


NIce, i see what you did there
 
2013-02-27 02:28:24 PM  

KimNorth: Coolfusis: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

When a straight, white hardworking family man gets tied to a post and beaten to death just for being a straight, white hardworking family man, we'll give you your own day.

Hum, we already have that day it's April 15th.


Oh cool!  I didn't know that only straight, white hardworking family men have to pay taxes.  Since I'm divorced and no longer a "family man" - tax loophole!  Yay!
 
2013-02-27 02:38:41 PM  
One of my favorite games to play on Fark is ignoring people, then seeing them quoted and patting myself on the back for being such a good judge of character.
 
2013-02-27 02:48:49 PM  

CeroX: Phinn: CeroX: I get it, i do, it's fun, it's Pride... It's not much different than a bunch of rednecks standing around a pile of fireworks drinking beer, shooting guns in the air, wrapping themselves up in American flags and screaming "USA, USA, USA" on the 4th of July because they love being American... the one difference is that they aren't oppressed and seeking equal rights from the rest of America...

You know how I know you don't know any rednecks?

;) love ya!


Love ya too!

No homo.
 
2013-02-27 02:54:08 PM  
"The U.S. District Court for the Southern District of Ohio affirmed the student's with the slogan "Jesus Is Not a Homophobe" to school."

That's weird I recall previous cases in which the rulings almost always came down to:  As long as it's applied equally the schools can make up whatever rules they want as far as dress code.

Maybe I am mis-remembering.

Also holy hell does "Lambada Law Firm" paint an image of polyester suits.
 
2013-02-27 02:55:46 PM  

Cybernetic: Supreme Court jurisprudence has far more to say about lewd speech and drug-related speech than it does about protests or political speech (Papish, Bethel, Hazelwood, and Morse). But those rulings clearly establish that students in school do not have the same First Amendment rights as adults in other settings.

The Tinker decision hinges on the idea that the wearing of armbands was "entirely divorced from actually or potentially disruptive conduct," and refers to their conduct as "silent, passive expression of opinion, unaccompanied by any disorder or disturbance."

The whole concept of the Day of Silence appears to be an attempt to adhere to the letter of the Tinker decision while defying its spirit. Keeping silent adheres to the Tinker standard of "silent, passive expression". Communication by whiteboard is significantly slower than speaking, and thus inherently disruptive to the flow of instruction, and also serves to draw attention to the protester, and therefore constitutes a "disorder or disturbance".

The lawsuit itself admits that the student knew that she could not "materially and substantially disrupt the school environment or the rights of

others," and describes the Day of Silence as "inherently expressive" and "a day of action." I find it difficult to reconcile that first statement with the other two.

The school's report may not mention the whiteboard, but that doesn't mean that the presence and use of the whiteboard was not disruptive or relevant to her removal from class.


Yes, but while the Day of Silence at least "adhere[s] to the letter of the Tinker decision," the school's policy--as described prior to this incident, and as at least arguably applied to this incident--doesn't even come close to adhering to Tinker or its progeny.  This school district, by its own admission, has an absolute policy against protests.  That simply canot be squared with current First Amendment caselaw.  And, since the school has such a policy, and communicated this policy to the student, it becomes very difficult for the school to argue that its disciplinary action here was motivated by an attempt to prevent classroom disruption caused by the whiteboard, rather than being simply an application of its absolute policy against protests.  And, in light of the  policy, even if the whiteboard was disruptive and/or relevant to the student's removal from class, the fact that the school's report did not mention it, but did mention the shirt, makes the school's case that much more difficult.
 
2013-02-27 03:18:42 PM  

99.998er: ciberido: 99.998er: I am sure many of my fellow Farkers will think I am a jerk (as if they didn't already), but I wicommunity realize Amber is a lesbian by now. Some will agree with her, some will not. It is Florida after all. I appreciate her courage to voice....

I have a better word than "jerk."  How about "concern troll," if we must have a label for you.

Bravo for subtly, though.

Thank you for the enlightenment, however I think the below might be a better fit since I am not terribly passionate about her cause one way or the other:

devil's advocate n. One who argues against a cause or position, not as a committed opponent but simply for the sake of argument or to determine the validity.


Now that I think about it, I don't know that "concern troll" is really a good term for it anyway.  Calling you a "concern troll" would suggest that I think you're a kind of troll, which, on reflection, might not be right.  When people think of trolls they think of someone who's pretending to believe something they really don't, and I probably should call you insincere, at least without more evidence.

What I should perhaps say instead is that you're using a "more flies with honey," which may be completely sincere, but is still annoying.  Maybe I need a more pity term for this, like "honeyer" or "honey champion" or something.
 
2013-02-27 03:33:05 PM  

ciberido: CeroX: My wife is bi, and her best friend is a lesbian, my sister is a lesbian, and 2 of the 3 act like every day people who will openly talk about being bi and gay if the subject comes up and people who i normally hear talking down about gays and lesbians actually listen to what they have to say because they conduct themselves rationally,

Hey, you know what lesbians DON'T need?  Straight men mansplaining to them how to stand up for their rights.


Yeah, what would the Patriarchy know about expressing power?
 
2013-02-27 03:37:54 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: It's not clear at all why the administration turned this into such a major issue. Or why the teacher sent her to the principal for such a minor disobedient act. She was using a whiteboard to communicate.

It's not even that I think she should be allowed to get away with anything, but in this case what exactly are they trying to pin on this girl?

It's ridiculous.


"Substantial disruption of the educational process," but they always forget the "substantial" part.  There's a balance point between free speech and the right to education.

T-shirts I'm OK with.  Silence and whiteboards may well substantially disrupt the educational process.
 
2013-02-27 03:40:02 PM  

Ker_Thwap: It's simple.  The school wants to teach it's curriculum.  If you allow one group to have a silent protest, then you must allow all groups to have their protests.  The school administration is removing itself from the morality judgement business entirely.   This does not equate to being pro bullying.   It's to keep a bunch of kids from waving their "LOOK AT ME, LOOK AT ME!  I'M SPECIAL!" beliefs around during education time.

No Anti Bullying, no LBGT, No Fundamentalist Christian, No KKK, No Hugs for Gunlovers, etc.   There are a lot of people with a lot of different moral codes, just shut up and pay attention in class.


We can't accommodate everyone's rights so let's take everyone's rights away.  You're a genius.
 
2013-02-27 03:42:47 PM  

MattyBlast: What kind of nerd would take a case like this, anyway?


Darn. I was hoping for an "I see what you did there" response, but I guess I wasn't clever enough.

/or nobody caught the reference
 
2013-02-27 03:45:14 PM  

JohnCarter: I am so annoyed with the LGBT moniker...


It's been expanded to LGBTQIA:  Lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, questioning, intersex, and asexual.

You may kill yourself now. ;-)

Seriously, one can't win a game of Scrabble with that, let a lone a civil rights struggle.
 
2013-02-27 03:46:57 PM  

WhippingBoy: It's "pink shirt" day here in Canada. You wear a pink shirt to school to show your support for anti-bullying.
Last year my seven year old son didn't wear a pink shirt to school. He was ostracized and "bullied" because of it.

Be careful when you fight the monsters, lest you become one.


I get bullied for not wearing green on St. Patrick's Day.
 
2013-02-27 03:49:30 PM  

Cybernetic: Tinker allows restrictions where they are necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. Communicating via whiteboard has the effect of slowing down the class and interfering with the lesson, which impacts all of the students in her classes, even those who have no interest in or involvement with the protest. It also draws attention of the other students away from the task at hand, and generally makes it more difficult for the teachers to do their jobs. IMHO, that qualifies as disruptive, and therefore can be prohibited under the Tinker test. The rest of the students have the right to go about their school day without having their classes impeded by this student's chosen form of protest.


Perfect example of how the critical qualifier "substantial" gets lost.
 
2013-02-27 03:51:12 PM  

DarkVader: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.


Why is it people are always crying "first amendment" when the GOVERNMENT had nothing what so ever to do with anything, and therefore the first is not applicable at all?  Are you people so poorly educated as to not understand that?

The school is not a government arm, it made no law, and therefore the first is irrelevant.  PERIOD.  You may now continue ranting about school administrations looking like Nazi enforcers.  But please remember they only look that way, they don't actually have governmental authority.
 
2013-02-27 03:54:33 PM  
I am absolutely shocked - SHOCKED I say that I scrolled through this ENTIRE thread and not one, NOT ONE pic of lesbian teens!!!!!
 
2013-02-27 03:54:47 PM  

CeroX: The smartest thing to get the rights you want passed, is to STOP with the overboard posturing. Stop throwing it in people faces, stop with the attention whoring, and stop being over the top with the pride. The only thing it's doing is making people resent your lifestyle. At this point, the big city pride rallies that feature men in assless chaps riding a giant pink penis down main street for the past 30 years has turned people away from even hearing what you have to say about the topic. The same thing goes for marijuana, stop having the burnt out pot heads being your primary voice on the matter... You want people to take the issue seriously, start publicly acting like a sane, and rational everyday people and not acting like being gay/pothead is the ONLY thing that defines you as a person...


When my teenaged son wanted to join Denver's 4/20 smoke-out "to get weed legalized," I told him that the hardcore protesters were in the nearby Capitol building, wearing neckties.

/still had to drive him to juvie court later
 
2013-02-27 03:55:44 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: WhippingBoy: It's "pink shirt" day here in Canada. You wear a pink shirt to school to show your support for anti-bullying.
Last year my seven year old son didn't wear a pink shirt to school. He was ostracized and "bullied" because of it.

Be careful when you fight the monsters, lest you become one.

I get bullied for not wearing green on St. Patrick's Day.


I always wear orange on that day. Fark the Catholics!
 
2013-02-27 03:58:28 PM  

WhippingBoy: BarkingUnicorn: WhippingBoy: It's "pink shirt" day here in Canada. You wear a pink shirt to school to show your support for anti-bullying.
Last year my seven year old son didn't wear a pink shirt to school. He was ostracized and "bullied" because of it.

Be careful when you fight the monsters, lest you become one.

I get bullied for not wearing green on St. Patrick's Day.

I always wear orange on that day. Fark the Catholics!


People wearing orange are fair game any day.
 
2013-02-27 04:00:58 PM  
ah, so it is like trying to explain to a fish that he is wet


You probably think the fish is dumb in that analogy

no, but unaware that there can be any different existence to his own. to a fish he is wet, all the time, so you cant explain wet to him.  not stupid or dumb but ignorant.

Stupid or dumb comes to play when you refuse to acknowledge that there can be any different kind of life to theirs


Interesting. I think the foolishness lies in the person actually attempting to explain to the fish that he is "wet", a concept that has no meaning in the fish's life. Much as anyone or anything trying to explain to you that you are "dry". You are applying your reality to the fish, then shaking your head when he doesn't understand what you mean.
In effect, you're doing the very thing you condemn.
 
2013-02-27 04:27:23 PM  

CeroX: And what i'm trying to point out is that those public displays of what you call fun, is extreme behavior that the other side is paying attention to... They don't ignore that, in fact, those are the displays that stick out in their mind more than anything else, and that image is a negative image to them...


And? fark those people! Why should anyone care what the people who hate them and want to deny them basic rights thinks about their behavior? If I were them, I'd do absolutely everything in my power to piss those people off and offend and annoy them as much as humanly possible!

Seriously, it sounds the same as saying to black people, "You know, if you'd just stop doing so much stereotypically black stuff, maybe the racists would hate you less!"... It's farking crazy... You don't cater to bigots and try to appease them; you defy them!
 
2013-02-27 04:27:58 PM  

DarkVader: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.


They probably don't want the school taken over by everyone's personal agenda. Sometimes,  things create distraction.
 
2013-02-27 04:35:09 PM  

octopied: They probably don't want the school taken over by everyone's personal agenda. Sometimes,  things create distraction.


Distracting a classroom by being quiet?  More kids should be so distracting.
 
2013-02-27 05:02:38 PM  
Using a whiteboard to communicate when she has the ability to speak deliberately mocks the truly mute students who cannot speak up for themselves.  She is the bully!
 
2013-02-27 05:05:12 PM  

Twigz221: Random Anonymous Blackmail: jack21221

Schools really need to lighten up. They had to have known that this was a legal minefield. Just let the student peacefully protest that day and get on with it.

Agreed, but also the spoiled snowflakes start stomping their feet and kicking up dust when they are not getting the attention they think they deserve. It sounds a lot like "no one is paying attention to me" PAY ATTENTION TO ME I'M A LESBIAN AND I DESERVE BETTER RIGHTS THAN YOU. THE SAME RIGHTS THAT YOU HAVE.

I blame the parents.

Fixed that for you.


Exactly
 
2013-02-27 05:27:54 PM  

pDiablo: Straight, white hardworking family man day



those dont exist anymore.
also would they have preferred she took part in the other think april 20th is known for?
 
2013-02-27 05:29:03 PM  

RobSeace: CeroX: And what i'm trying to point out is that those public displays of what you call fun, is extreme behavior that the other side is paying attention to... They don't ignore that, in fact, those are the displays that stick out in their mind more than anything else, and that image is a negative image to them...

And? fark those people! Why should anyone care what the people who hate them and want to deny them basic rights thinks about their behavior? If I were them, I'd do absolutely everything in my power to piss those people off and offend and annoy them as much as humanly possible!

Seriously, it sounds the same as saying to black people, "You know, if you'd just stop doing so much stereotypically black stuff, maybe the racists would hate you less!"... It's farking crazy... You don't cater to bigots and try to appease them; you defy them!


Thank you for that, big hug : )
 
2013-02-27 05:32:57 PM  

Kahabut: DarkVader: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.

Why is it people are always crying "first amendment" when the GOVERNMENT had nothing what so ever to do with anything, and therefore the first is not applicable at all?  Are you people so poorly educated as to not understand that?

The school is not a government arm, it made no law, and therefore the first is irrelevant.  PERIOD.  You may now continue ranting about school administrations looking like Nazi enforcers.  But please remember they only look that way, they don't actually have governmental authority.


That is "sovereign citizen" quality crazy.
 
2013-02-27 05:49:55 PM  

pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...


Those other groups arranged their own parades. If you want one for your group then you should arrange it yourself.
 
2013-02-27 06:00:38 PM  

kg2095: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

Those other groups arranged their own parades. If you want one for your group then you should arrange it yourself.


Yeah, I'm sure a straight, white, man parade would be met with nothing but tolerance and acceptance.
 
2013-02-27 06:13:01 PM  
Maybe, or maybe not. But gay parades were not accepted for a long time either.
 
2013-02-27 06:38:57 PM  

Thunderpipes: DarkVader: spyderqueen: Okay, I'm not saying that this school isn't administrated by total assholes, but it's not like she got surprised with this suspension.  She knew it was the punishment she faced for doing this anyway.

No.

An unconstitutional action taken by a public school is no less unconstitutional because the school announced it ahead of time.

Children in school do not have the same freedoms adults do, this has been gone over time and time again in the courts. If a kid wants to break school rules, they have to be willing to be punished. This is not a case of a T-shirt, she was being a douche, pure and simple.

Want to end bullying? Teach your kids to stand up for themselves. Christ, how hard is that? Teaching them to cry just enables it more.


Do you find anything odd about you seem to be suggesting the student simultaneously "sit down and shut up" and "stand up for herself?"
 
2013-02-27 06:51:20 PM  

Joe Blowme: Nutsac_Jim: 
Really?  Show me where hetero kids are allowed to engage in silent protests in that school district.

Dude, this is fark.... some are more equal than others


You know, if you had gone with the argument that silent protest was unacceptably disruptive in a school, that would have at least been rational. But instead you're claiming Fark-libs are oppressing your equal rights? Because of a strawman assumption that only lesbian students should have that right?

Seriously, I don't know how you can even justify your persecution complex to yourself.
 
2013-02-27 06:52:30 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Cybernetic: Tinker allows restrictions where they are necessary to avoid substantial interference with school discipline or the rights of others. Communicating via whiteboard has the effect of slowing down the class and interfering with the lesson, which impacts all of the students in her classes, even those who have no interest in or involvement with the protest. It also draws attention of the other students away from the task at hand, and generally makes it more difficult for the teachers to do their jobs. IMHO, that qualifies as disruptive, and therefore can be prohibited under the Tinker test. The rest of the students have the right to go about their school day without having their classes impeded by this student's chosen form of protest.

Perfect example of how the critical qualifier "substantial" gets lost.


It's possible for people to differ on what constitutes "substantial" disruption; the word is a qualifier, but not a quantifier.

IMHO, if this girl's protest actions are making it more difficult for other students to learn, then that's a "substantial" disruption--literally, a disruption to the substance of the school day.
 
2013-02-27 07:15:29 PM  
As a further add: i don't remember school much, but when I went there were always a few dumbass rules you had to follow and punishments for breaking the rules. In high school in phys ed we were expected to either wear school colors of blue shorts and red or grey tops. It was definatly a scam to sell clothes which they made.I seem to remember white shirts being okay too. You forgot your proper colors? I believe you were allowed one mulligan a semester and then they started  giving out "Non participation" and taking points off your grade
 
2013-02-27 07:50:36 PM  

tinfoil-hat maggie: RobSeace: CeroX: And what i'm trying to point out is that those public displays of what you call fun, is extreme behavior that the other side is paying attention to... They don't ignore that, in fact, those are the displays that stick out in their mind more than anything else, and that image is a negative image to them...

And? fark those people! Why should anyone care what the people who hate them and want to deny them basic rights thinks about their behavior? If I were them, I'd do absolutely everything in my power to piss those people off and offend and annoy them as much as humanly possible!

Seriously, it sounds the same as saying to black people, "You know, if you'd just stop doing so much stereotypically black stuff, maybe the racists would hate you less!"... It's farking crazy... You don't cater to bigots and try to appease them; you defy them!

Thank you for that, big hug : )


Normally, NORMALLY i would agree with you... but you have to remember one thing...

These are the people who will VOTE on these matters

Turn it around...

What happens if a presidential candidate instead of saying "I'm a christian and i don't believe homosexuals should get married" he turned to the camera and said "fark THOSE F_GS! You see a f_g on the street, you start making out with your wife in their faces! You throw rocks at them and tell them they are sinners! And when i'm president, i'm going to push to make homosexuality a federal crime!!!"? Then suddenly you have all the chik-fil-a nutters showing up in droves to show their support for the extremist candidate...

Yes it angers me when i hear the bigotry, enough to say something to people, but i don't go out of my way to throw fuel on a fire... And that's precisely what pissing them off will do, and THOSE are the people who vote for your rights... a bill doesn't get passed in congress because 25% of congress might support your opinion, another 15% don't care, but 60% hate you with a seething passion...

You don't shiat where you eat, and the meal ticket is on capital hill...
 
2013-02-27 08:43:43 PM  

WhippingBoy: kg2095: pDiablo: hmm lets see, gay pride, lesbian day, hmm oh yes notting hill carnival ( celebration weekend for afro carrbibean culture..hey how about this one... Straight, white hardworking family man day..gimme a date and we'll make it so...

Those other groups arranged their own parades. If you want one for your group then you should arrange it yourself.

Yeah, I'm sure a straight, white, man parade would be met with nothing but tolerance and acceptance.


Straight white men are not allowed to assemble.

When by chance they should happen to congrgate, they are not allowed to refer to their straight white maleness, or acknowledge it in any way.

Also, they are expected to disavow one another, disband as soon as possible, and take clear steps to ensure it does not happen again.

Even joking about these criteria as the reason for their proximity to one another is almost certainly prohibited, unless the comment is clearly self-derrogatory.

These are the rules. Govern yourselves accordingly.
 
2013-02-27 09:14:19 PM  

CeroX: tinfoil-hat maggie:
Well, I was surprised when you left out the parades earlier. Well you know what you don't get it. The pride parades aren't really about the politics those are for all the "deviants", even the ones that "attempt" not to be over the top. It's to celebrate the diversity and to show our own numbers and have fun.The politics takes place everyday.

And what i'm trying to point out is that those public displays of what you call fun, is extreme behavior that the other side is paying attention to... They don't ignore that, in fact, those are the displays that stick out in their mind more than anything else, and that image is a negative image to them...

I get it, i do, it's fun, it's Pride... It's not much different than a bunch of rednecks standing around a pile of fireworks drinking beer, shooting guns in the air, wrapping themselves up in American flags and screaming "USA, USA, USA" on the 4th of July because they love being American... the one difference is that they aren't oppressed and seeking equal rights from the rest of America...


It's true. I judge all straighys by how they act at Mardi Gras.
 
2013-02-27 10:52:02 PM  
This is really easy folks.

Kids have no rights in school. You don't get basic rights of free expression til you hit 18 and magic full rights until you are 21. Schools don't want people that are going to be different. It is easier to control a group that are essentially robots with no illusion of freedom. It is good preparation for the work force too, considering you have little if any rights there either. That is, unless you don't want a job anymore.
 
2013-02-27 11:53:03 PM  

gravebayne2: so she was told multiple times "the school doesn't take part in protests" and she did it anyways. now she is suing? i'm sure they will hand her and her parents some huge settlement pulled from the schools general fund. this is why our future generations are getting worse....


You don't really grasp how civil disobedience works, do you?
 
2013-02-27 11:54:45 PM  

DeathCipris: This is really easy folks.

Kids have no rights in school. You don't get basic rights of free expression til you hit 18 and magic full rights until you are 21. Schools don't want people that are going to be different. It is easier to control a group that are essentially robots with no illusion of freedom. It is good preparation for the work force too, considering you have little if any rights there either. That is, unless you don't want a job anymore.


No, this is really easy:

Tinker vs Des Moines Independent Community School District, 1969.
 
2013-02-28 06:20:38 AM  

CeroX: And that's precisely what pissing them off will do, and THOSE are the people who vote for your rights


i5.photobucket.com

"CIVIL RIGHTS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!"

If they did, interracial marriage would still be illegal in many places... (Hell, for that matter, slavery might still be legal some places!) Those people can try to vote away people's rights, but they will ultimately have their bigoted and unconstitutional laws overturned by the courts... Just as happened with interracial marriage, and just as has been happening and continues to happen with gay marriage... People's civil rights just can't be taken away by popular vote...
 
2013-02-28 08:06:47 AM  

RobSeace: CeroX: And that's precisely what pissing them off will do, and THOSE are the people who vote for your rights

[i5.photobucket.com image 320x240]

"CIVIL RIGHTS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!"

If they did, interracial marriage would still be illegal in many places... (Hell, for that matter, slavery might still be legal some places!) Those people can try to vote away people's rights, but they will ultimately have their bigoted and unconstitutional laws overturned by the courts... Just as happened with interracial marriage, and just as has been happening and continues to happen with gay marriage... People's civil rights just can't be taken away by popular vote...


Wow, you fail at government...

First... off, civil rights are voted on, here's one called the Civil Rights Act, and again with the Equal Rights Act (not really a gay issue so much as just an example of rights), both of which were... wait for it... VOTED on...

On the subject of interracial marriage - In that you are right, but only on the basis that miscegenation laws were around before the US existed, and when the states that had the laws were formed, they were incorporated... So i'll give you that one...

But your argument fall apart at the slavery bit because again, it was amended to the constitution, which guess what? Takes a VOTE, and not just any kind of vote either, it takes a 2/3 vote, you can read more about that here

Lets move onto your next statement "They can try and vote away people's rights..." You are correct for some rights that aren't explicitly stated, but in 1996 congress VOTED on the Defense of Marriage Act which prohibited recognition of same-sex marriage by the federal government AND prohibited same-sex marriages from being recognized by any other state other than the state in which the couple was married. And until the supreme court decides to actually move on the 5 pending appeals to DOMA, it remains law.

I would assume that statement was regarding the court overturning prop 8, but you should recognize that that over half the states in the US have voted an amendment into their state constitution that prohibits same-sex marriage... Again, that is a ratification requiring a VOTE... and the question of constitutional legality is not in question like it is in CA.

Lastly, sexual preference isn't even protected by the Civil Rights Act and i believe it was left out on purpose, but that is an entirely different matter...

Now, if you happen to live in a state that favors same-sex marriage and protects same-sex rights, hooray! We have a foothold... but the problem is that the moment Massachusetts passed their pro same-sex laws, all the red states panicked and very quickly voted AGAINST the rights of LGBT people... so...

CIVIL RIGHTS CAN WORK THAT WAY...  sadly
 
2013-02-28 08:46:13 AM  

CeroX: And until the supreme court decides to actually move on the 5 pending appeals to DOMA, it remains law.


The Supreme Court is hearing a DOMA challenge right now! (Well, the oral arguments take place in March...) I'm fully confident they will strike it down...

all the red states panicked and very quickly voted AGAINST the rights of LGBT people

Yeah, and eventually they'll all be challenged in court, and they'll all be overturned... It may take a while, but it'll happen... As I said, they can try to vote away people's civil rights, but they'll ultimately fail... Because, civil rights just aren't subject to the whim of popular vote... They're something we all have, even if the majority would prefer that some minority of us not have them...
 
2013-02-28 09:29:01 AM  

RobSeace: CeroX: And until the supreme court decides to actually move on the 5 pending appeals to DOMA, it remains law.

The Supreme Court is hearing a DOMA challenge right now! (Well, the oral arguments take place in March...) I'm fully confident they will strike it down...

all the red states panicked and very quickly voted AGAINST the rights of LGBT people

Yeah, and eventually they'll all be challenged in court, and they'll all be overturned... It may take a while, but it'll happen... As I said, they can try to vote away people's civil rights, but they'll ultimately fail... Because, civil rights just aren't subject to the whim of popular vote... They're something we all have, even if the majority would prefer that some minority of us not have them...


I agree with you on DOMA...

But I think you're still missing the point of voting... once they put it to a vote, only during the electorial process are they in a "trying" state... after that, it's completed... the vote has been tallied, and the people have spoken... now... we are arguing semantics here, but semantics aren't just arbitrary in law... So you have to understand that the states that count LGBT as a protected community are the minority, and thus they only have civil rights in THOSE states... there is no federal provision classifying LGBT for protection under civil rights, therefore, in the federal government's view, there is no such thing as LGBT civil rights... You and I might argue that everyone SHOULD have those rights, but the reality is, they don't except for a select few states... and even though, one day in the future, we will see LGBT rights protected, and thus things like same-sex marriage be a non-issue, that isn't the way it is NOW

right NOW there is a fight over these rights, and until the day comes when the federal government recognizes sexual preference as a protected right, this fight will continue on. The thing about it is that it's the "conservatives last stand" era. Since 1965, conservatives in this country have been losing ground regarding their power and privilege, which has been based on the oppression of others, children, minorities, women to name a couple, while racism and misogyny still run rampant in the hearts and minds of those that were the oppressors, they are at least protected at the government level... They have been backed into a corner, they are losing ground and like a rabid animal, they are now fighting back in frenzy out of fear of losing everything they have stood for... But they are still the majority, and not only that, on the subject of LGBT rights, they have suckered some of the previously oppressed into fighting on their side by using religion as the armored tank in this little battle. Minorities and women who were once oppressed by these assholes have been blinded by the cross and is now fighting alongside their one time enemy against the threat of "the gays"...

Will LGBT rights get pushed through? sure, someday, it might even be within my lifetime, but it's not going to be now, and it's not going to be next year either... And where i stand on this, we COULD see a change in the next year or so if people would stop purposely trying to piss off the rational thinkers in congress on purpose and start appealing to their rational side... you can't expect to be taken serious on capitol hill if your wearing a strap on and playing "Sword Fight" in the congressional mall...  the irrational will hold mouth frothing arguments claiming that that type of behavior will be everywhere if they pass any sort of rights protection, while the rational people will agree with them because look how immature they are acting now...

Civil Rights are not "all fun and games" and in a civil rights movement, all eyes are on you, and your not acting on your best behavior...
 
2013-02-28 09:38:44 AM  
by you, i'm not really pointing directly at you RobSeace...
 
2013-02-28 10:28:00 AM  

CeroX: once they put it to a vote, only during the electorial process are they in a "trying" state... after that, it's completed... the vote has been tallied, and the people have spoken...


Until the courts overturn it, and then the vote is shown to have been all for naught... While their attempt may have seemed to have succeeded temporarily, it ultimately was shown to be a total failure...

So you have to understand that the states that count LGBT as a protected community are the minority, and thus they only have civil rights in THOSE states...

No, everyone has civil rights... You don't need to be a member of a protected minority or "community" to have civil rights... Star Trek fans are not a protected class of people, but Trekkies do have civil farking rights! If I wanted to have a Klingon-themed wedding, I could do it, and the government couldn't stop me!

I think the only thing you need for arguing that any anti-gay-marriage laws are unconstitutional is the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment... That doesn't just protect specific groups; it protects "any person" and guarantees them equal protection of the laws...
 
2013-02-28 12:07:03 PM  

RobSeace: everyone has civil rights...


yes, but the government doesn't recognize, protect, or enforce all civil rights for all people...

That's why there was a civil rights act to begin with, because even though black americans at the time were citizens, they didn't share the same rights as whites by law... and it comes down to what you and i are discussing... yes, we all have rights, but the LAW doesn't protect or recognize all people for all rights...

You seem to have this illusion that because someone has the abstract right to something, that in America it means they have a Legal Right to something, and sadly, they don't... When the bill of rights was written, it was implied that people had "certain inalienable rights" and that when it was put in the constitution, it was understood that even though people have rights to a lot, those rights can be taken away through legislation and popular vote, but these 10, these "inalienable rights" cannot be touched.

Your rights, my rights, my coworkers rights, can go away under legal process... it happens every day... Smokers would argue they have a right to smoke, yet law here was passed that states they DON'T have the right to smoke in public...

Right now, you have the right to BE gay, but you don't have the right to marry someone of the same sex unless you live in a state that has recognized and protected that right...

Marriage is considered a Civil Right under the law of the federal government IF that marriage is between 1 man and 1 woman, therfore, marriage is a civil right recognized, and protected, for people who are straight...

It would be nice if the government recognized the rights of everyone, but the reality is that it doesn't...
 
2013-02-28 12:50:30 PM  

CeroX: yes, but the government doesn't recognize, protect, or enforce all civil rights for all people...


True enough... But, the correct response to that, as someone with your rights not currently recognized, is not to meekly plead with your oppressors to pretty please be granted your rights, and try to be as friendly and inoffensive to them as possible in the hopes that they take pity on you and eventually decide you're actually a human being after all... But rather, you should stand up and demand those rights, and go to court and fight for them! Which is precisely what has happened in the past, and continues to happen to this day...

Yes, lawmakers, and even the majority of the voting public, can be assholes and often make bad laws... But, those laws can be overturned, and often are... The Constitution is pretty clear on things, and even though SCOTUS has made some boneheaded decisions on occassion, they usually are fairly decent about protecting people's civil rights... I'm not saying it's the easy or fast path of accomplishing things... It would be nice if idiots didn't make laws that need to be overturned in the first place... But, I'm merely saying that popular votes are not the final word on what rights you have...

I think it's just wrong to suggest that an oppressed minority should basically beg for their rights from the majority... That seemed to be what you were saying... That they should try not to be offensive or do anything that might upset the majority who want to oppress them... You may be right that that's an easier way of proceding, and they might indeed be able to endear themselves to enough people to get their rights that way... But, it just leaves a really horrible taste in my mouth... "Hide your true selves, don't do anything these bigots might object to, and maybe, just maybe, they might deign to treat you as fellow human beings!" It's just plain offensive... Personally, I say the more noble approach is to tell the bigots to go fark themselves, and just take their rights in spite of what the bigots want... *shrug*
 
2013-02-28 01:45:54 PM  
We agree, but you misunderstand what i am telling the community...

the community should demand equal rights, and they should do so with fire and fervor. What they shouldn't do is go to the supreme court, go to capitol hill, and one representing group stand before the lawmakers and demand for equal rights with fire and fervor, while another representing group is gather in Washington Mall dressed in outrageous outfits and making a lude spectacle of themselves, because the moment the people in capitol hill get wind of those kinds of events, they will either cement their anti-gay position, or they will reverse any progress the right group made when they demanded their case...

Do you understand the correlation that exists between a serious demand for equal rights, and the mocking gestures of people doing extreme behavior who represent the same people?

It seems to me that all this push back from people is just a giant chip on their shoulders who are not taking a legal battle serious enough to play by the rules...

Imagine this scenario and see if you are getting the picture now...

You are a tough, smart, aggressive attorney presenting a case to the court. The opposition is grim, stone-faced and just as aggressive, as you. The opposition clients are up tight, business suit, brief case, serious face types, while  most of your clients are well dressed and down to earth, except for one, who is wearing a clown suit, a strap on, and making masturbation motions with the dildo to the judge... How easy do you think your job as an attorney is going to be?

Does the clown have the same case as your other clients? Sure... do you think that judge is going to seriously consider your case? probably not...

that's my final analogy on this subject for this thread... i'm going home for the day
 
2013-02-28 03:10:10 PM  

CeroX: What they shouldn't do is go to the supreme court, go to capitol hill, and one representing group stand before the lawmakers and demand for equal rights with fire and fervor, while another representing group is gather in Washington Mall dressed in outrageous outfits and making a lude spectacle of themselves, because the moment the people in capitol hill get wind of those kinds of events, they will either cement their anti-gay position, or they will reverse any progress the right group made when they demanded their case...


Yes, I understand what you're saying... I just think the bad guys in the scenario are the assholes who use such events to justify denying rights to a group of people, not the subset of people from that group who happen to be partying and enjoying themselves... It would be like looking at a St. Patrick's Day parade/party and using that to justify denying rights to Irish people, because they're all obviously a bunch of rowdy drunks... Every group has their own "party like madmen" occassions now and then, and they may not always look the prettiest to outsiders on that occassion...

Also, with any large group of people, you aren't going to be able to operate with any kind of unified representative face... Everyone is still an individual, and makes their own choices of how to behave... It's crazy to judge an entire group by how a subset of members choose to behave... It reminds me of how people will talk about how all Farkers believe this or they all behave a certain way (eg: we're all Christian-hating atheists, or all ultra-liberal commies, or whatever)... Just because you've run into a handful of them in the past who believe or do those things doesn't say anything about all the rest of us... (Plus, you also have the irony of they themselves being a Farker, and simultaneously complaining that all Farkers believe something that they themselves clearly do not... But, they never seem to get the irony of that...)

You are a tough, smart, aggressive attorney presenting a case to the court. The opposition is grim, stone-faced and just as aggressive, as you. The opposition clients are up tight, business suit, brief case, serious face types, while most of your clients are well dressed and down to earth, except for one, who is wearing a clown suit, a strap on, and making masturbation motions with the dildo to the judge... How easy do you think your job as an attorney is going to be?

Except this isn't exactly a good analogy for this situation at hand, is it? Gay people aren't actually fighting court cases in assless chaps or Village People outfits, are they? It seems a more apt analogy would be that one of your clients, while perfectly presentable and respectable in court, was once seen at a wild party dressed that way and doing those things, and the judge decided to unfairly hold that against him (and everyone else in his group, even though they never did so themselves)... In that case, I don't blame the guy who once went to a wild party; I blame the asshole judge who is unfairly penalizing him for having done so, when it's none of his farking business and has absolutely nothing to do with the case at hand!
 
Displayed 240 of 240 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
Advertisement
On Twitter





In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report