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(Talking Points Memo)   Karzai to US Special Forces: GET. OUT. NOW   (talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 326
    More: Interesting, Provinces of Afghanistan, Afghans, u.s. special forces, coordinated attack, Jalalabad, CH-47 Chinook, Wardak provinces, Zabiullah Mujahid  
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23401 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Feb 2013 at 10:44 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



326 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-02-25 09:36:21 AM
We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?
 
2013-02-25 09:44:32 AM
I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.
 
2013-02-25 10:07:13 AM
Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!
 
2013-02-25 10:25:56 AM
Karzai had better tone it down.

If not, we could be going war in Afghanistan.
 
2013-02-25 10:30:04 AM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


This

/what are we accomplishing at this point besides making more money for KBR?
 
2013-02-25 10:30:55 AM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!
 
2013-02-25 10:46:32 AM
Did he throw their clothes on the lawn?
 
2013-02-25 10:48:33 AM
I wonder which of his drug operations they were disrupting, or potential payoffs he is lining up for....
 
2013-02-25 10:49:22 AM
24.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-02-25 10:49:28 AM
Karzai assassinated in 3...2...1...
 
2013-02-25 10:49:36 AM

Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!



The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.
 
2013-02-25 10:49:44 AM
So there is a point where you are so rich you can afford to bite the hand that feeds and protects you? Hope smiley has his escape pod ready. The warlords will eat him alive.
 
2013-02-25 10:49:46 AM
Would LOVE to see full withdrawal from the region.
 
2013-02-25 10:49:51 AM

Rapmaster2000: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!


www.crankycritic.com

"I'd like to summarize my feelings in the words of the titular character of Sylvester Stallone's epic movie, Rambo..."
 
2013-02-25 10:49:52 AM
I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.
 
2013-02-25 10:51:16 AM

ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.


Yeah, your leader is to blame.
Then when they beg for more money, glass parking lot.
 
2013-02-25 10:51:37 AM
Guess he don like the cornbread either.
 
2013-02-25 10:52:21 AM
Karzai makes the Vichy look like Churchill.
 
2013-02-25 10:52:52 AM
It doesn't really matter. We either spend 20 years fighting the Taliban now or 20 years fighting the Taliban after they crush Karzai's little empire and start harboring anti-US terrorists again. Either way, we will be fighting the Taliban for a long time.
 
2013-02-25 10:53:22 AM

Rapmaster2000: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!


Ok, bad Stallone impersonations aside...

Getting called "baby killer" by a group of semi-homosexual frat boys who wouldn't know how to survive in the woods more than a couple of hours and who think it might be cool one day to go shoot a gun (OMG!)..."you know...at one of those places that lets you rent one and burn a couple of clips on *full auto*, wouldn't that be cool!" is not a good afternoon.

I had to resist putting more than one of them through a plate glass window more than once...

Anyway, stupid motherfarker is getting cocky and thinks he actually has the nuts to keep the Taliban at bay.  Fine.  Have at it.  Just make sure our people are out of harm's way and don't beg for air support later.
 
2013-02-25 10:53:38 AM
"leave a strategically important eastern province"

Ummm, oh nvm.
 
2013-02-25 10:53:44 AM
What, don't you try to get everyone out of your place before your dealer shows up?
 
2013-02-25 10:54:44 AM
excelsior-recordings.com
GET.  OUT.
 
2013-02-25 10:54:52 AM

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Karzai assassinated in 3...2...1...



What are you droning on about now?
 
2013-02-25 10:56:34 AM

cgraves67: It doesn't really matter. We either spend 20 years fighting the Taliban now or 20 years fighting the Taliban after they crush Karzai's little empire and start harboring anti-US terrorists again. Either way, we will be fighting the Taliban for a long time.


Yeah, but if Karzai can tie them down for 20 years, we can have Terminators up and running by then.  Fighting them in 20 years will be punching some buttons on a computer and stepping out for an early lunch.
 
2013-02-25 10:56:55 AM
Karzai the Bipolar Puppet is going to have an intimate encounter with a Hellfire missile.
Our SF guys are clearly cutting into his business interests a little too hard.
 
2013-02-25 10:58:18 AM

Yogimus: Would LOVE to see full withdrawal from the region.



We can't leave yet.

They still hate us, and that's dangerous.

We have to stay there, bombing, shooting, and oppressing them until they love us.
 
2013-02-25 10:58:19 AM
Obama should use his time machine and send ODA 574 on a vacation.
 
2013-02-25 10:59:46 AM
not quite sure why there is a "WAR" going on there anyway.

Get out and blame this guy, unless you know you have a piece of an oil pipeline or international drug trade worth 10's of millions per day....
 
2013-02-25 11:00:39 AM

Amos Quito: We have to stay there, bombing, shooting, and oppressing them until they love us.


Just like my ex-girlfriend.
 
2013-02-25 11:00:48 AM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


24.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-02-25 11:02:26 AM
Karzai to US Special Forces: GET.OUT.NOW.

US Special Forces to Karzai: FIND.US.
 
2013-02-25 11:02:54 AM
I cant take anyone seriously who wears dumb hats.
 
2013-02-25 11:04:15 AM

spentshells: not quite sure why there is a "WAR" going on there anyway.


More like geopolitical maintenance.  We don't have the political will to commit (never did, not even on 9/12/2001), but we have special interests that won't let us forget the place entirely either.
 
2013-02-25 11:05:53 AM

Sensual Tyrannosaurus: Karzai to US Special Forces: GET.OUT.NOW.

US Special Forces to Karzai: FIND.US.


Guess who's hosting the Hide and Seek World Championship again.
 
2013-02-25 11:08:01 AM
It'll never happen.

The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home....
 
2013-02-25 11:08:04 AM
Alright, let's leave.   Let them have their shiat hole to continue killing each other in peace.  We've proven we don't care about borders anymore, next terrorist attack, we don't have to invade, just violate airspace, bomb the shiat out of the guilty party and fly back out.
 
2013-02-25 11:09:34 AM

Rapmaster2000: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!


John, I think you can come home now.  THIS MISSION IS OVER, Raven!

Seriously, we need to really draw it down.  Having been there and done that, the Afghans need to deal with their security and we need to pack up our huge bases and return home.   It is really costing us an assload of cash to be out there.
 
2013-02-25 11:12:52 AM
t3.gstatic.com
"Detriments you call us? Detriments? Well I want to remind you that it was detriments like us that built this bloody Empire AND the Izzat of the bloody Raj. Hats on."

Oops - wrong time period/empire/nation/etc.
 
2013-02-25 11:13:33 AM
Get to the choppa?
 
2013-02-25 11:13:41 AM

ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.


Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.
 
2013-02-25 11:13:50 AM
We are leaving...

Funny but with music

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ywt9a3lEQ
 
2013-02-25 11:14:02 AM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.
 
2013-02-25 11:14:24 AM

Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


Yes.
Opium.
It's always the opium.
All other headlines are misleading on purpose.
 
2013-02-25 11:14:26 AM

oldfarthenry: [t3.gstatic.com image 252x200]
"Detriments you call us? Detriments? Well I want to remind you that it was detriments like us that built this bloody Empire AND the Izzat of the bloody Raj. Hats on."

Oops - wrong time period/empire/nation/etc.


That movie had the most breathtaking muttonstaches ever filmed.
 
2013-02-25 11:14:31 AM
Guess our guys are harvesting more of the cash crop than he is comfortable with.
 
2013-02-25 11:17:22 AM

Rich Cream: The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


Was well under-way when the Soviets were there and they've been the #1 producer of Opium since 1992, long before we ever showed up.

But clearly, facts mean nothing to you.
 
2013-02-25 11:17:41 AM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


THIS, fark them ungratefull SOB's. Stoneage savages.
 
2013-02-25 11:18:14 AM

Parthenogenetic: Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.


A single tear rolls down my face........
 
2013-02-25 11:20:19 AM

Parthenogenetic: Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.


guycodeblog.mtv.com
 
2013-02-25 11:20:25 AM

Clemkadidlefark: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!

Yes.
Opium.
It's always the opium.
All other headlines are misleading on purpose.


Opium is probably the reason why the puppet no longer feels the hand in his ass.
 
2013-02-25 11:21:35 AM

cgraves67: It doesn't really matter. We either spend 20 years fighting the Taliban now or 20 years fighting the Taliban after they crush Karzai's little empire and start harboring anti-US terrorists again. Either way, we will be fighting the Taliban for a long time.


Why bother fighting them at all? They are a small group of borderline cave people on the other side of the earth. They are a problem for Pakistan, the Afghani people and a pain in the ass for a few countries around Afghanistan, let them deal with it.
 
2013-02-25 11:22:13 AM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


Terribly hard since we're not there to invade. The problem with US foreign policy is it is self defeating. You don't occupy someone's land to bring them 'freedom'. You go there to either invade, steal something, rescue someone or you don't go in at all.

Bringing 'freedom' to a group of folks who in their own minds are free anyway is not a tangible and attenable military objective which is why it will ALWAYS be a mission failure in the long run.
 
2013-02-25 11:22:15 AM
Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.
 
2013-02-25 11:22:27 AM

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Karzai assassinated in 3...2...1...


Nah, he acts up every so often, until he gets his bribe money.  This is hardly the first time.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 11:23:07 AM
Fine. Let's pull out ALL of our resources. EVERY-FARKING-THING.
1 little warning to him:
"Keep your shiat inside your borders. The second it spills over onto someone else' land and they ask for help from us we will deliver such shiat as you have never seen."
 
2013-02-25 11:23:08 AM
Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.
 
2013-02-25 11:23:21 AM

Parthenogenetic: Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.


It won't be America's heartland getting irradiated.
 
2013-02-25 11:24:30 AM
"Get out now"!! Stop pissing on our poppy's.
 
2013-02-25 11:25:46 AM
Just a little late to be pulling out there skippy

/best leave country before they expect child support
//whoops, wrong train of thought
 
2013-02-25 11:26:52 AM

HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.


And this is the mascot of the Taliban

www.petinsurance.com

Part monkey.  Part dog.  All opium induced breeding will eventually lead to this.
 
2013-02-25 11:29:09 AM
Good. Fire up the C-5s, collect everything of reusable value, bulldoze the rest into big piles and then light it all up as the last plane gets airborne. Drop leaflets saying "Goodbye you Fin messed up people. Don't call us, we'll call you"
 
2013-02-25 11:29:10 AM
In a related story, Karzai just bought several cats especially conditioned to make a fuss when they see a red 'laser pointer' dot.....
 
2013-02-25 11:29:18 AM

Mi-5: It is really costing us an assload of cash to be out there.


I think that depends on your definition of the word "us".
 
2013-02-25 11:30:48 AM
oldfarthenry

"Detriments you call us? Detriments? Well I want to remind you that it was detriments like us that built this bloody Empire AND the Izzat of the bloody Raj. Hats on."

Oops - wrong time period/empire/nation/etc.



Wrong movie pic too...
 
2013-02-25 11:31:51 AM
Get out!  Or I shall say Get out again!
 
2013-02-25 11:32:28 AM
Fine by me.  A bullet in Karzai's head on the way out would be appropriate.
 
2013-02-25 11:35:10 AM

MyToeHurts: Good. Fire up the C-5s, collect everything of reusable value, bulldoze the rest into big piles and then light it all up as the last plane gets airborne. Drop leaflets saying "Goodbye you Fin messed up people. Don't call us, we'll call you"


No, we're talking about Afghanistan, not Finland.
 
2013-02-25 11:35:16 AM
Thanks for keeping me propped up in power, now GTFO!!!!
 
2013-02-25 11:36:07 AM

Parthenogenetic: Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.


I salute you sir.
 
2013-02-25 11:36:34 AM
Boy oh Boy, Obama's smart diplomacy has really been a big success.   Can anyone else remember how everyone on TV was saying that the "Muslim World" would love us because Obama wasn't EvilBushMcHitler.  Ha ha jokes on us for thinking that he wasn't totally incompetent.   As much as it pains me to say this but Palin probably could have put together a better foreign policy.
 
2013-02-25 11:36:54 AM
3.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-25 11:37:15 AM
Would it be asking too much for the article to tell us which province they are talking about?
 
2013-02-25 11:41:43 AM
Karzai is just getting ready for Kabul 2020.

Clearly he needs the land for Olympic Training Facilities.

i139.photobucket.com

Opening Ceremonies (yt)
Gymnastics (yt)
Balance Beam (yt)
Water Sports (yt)
Cross Country (yt)
Obstacle Course (yt)
Skeet Shooting (yt)
Dressage (yt)
Closing Ceremony Fireworks (yt)
 
2013-02-25 11:42:07 AM
You don't have to go home...but you can't stay here.
www.mikechurch.com
 
2013-02-25 11:42:22 AM

SpdrJay: It'll never happen.

The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home....


Actually they have quite lucrative careers as contractors doing Force Protection in Afghanistan after US soldiers withdraw from Afghanistan.
 
2013-02-25 11:42:47 AM
I thought we were going to be their heros and they would have parades for us.
 
2013-02-25 11:42:50 AM

NullReferenceException: MyToeHurts: Good. Fire up the C-5s, collect everything of reusable value, bulldoze the rest into big piles and then light it all up as the last plane gets airborne. Drop leaflets saying "Goodbye you Fin messed up people. Don't call us, we'll call you"

No, we're talking about Afghanistan, not Finland.


Presumably "F'in" as in "farking".

Anyways, instinct reaction is to fark off and let 'em build their heroin plantations, but there are concerns.

Pakistan for one.  Pakistan has nuclear weapons and is basically 2 or 3 bad days from losing their capital city to fanatic rebels.
 
2013-02-25 11:43:03 AM

HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.


The American Heritage Dictionary disagrees with you. Afghani is one of the demonyms.
 
2013-02-25 11:43:56 AM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


If Karzai thinks the Chinese are going to be better partners after the US leaves, ohhhhhhhhBOY is he gonna get an education!
 
2013-02-25 11:44:43 AM

Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


Air America Fark Yea!!!!

// i say on the way out we set off 3 or 4 small TNW's
 
2013-02-25 11:44:54 AM
FTA: comments come a day after President Hamid Karzai ordered all U.S. special forces to leave Wardak province within two weeks because of allegations that Afghans working with them are torturing and abusing other Afghans.

So kick out the people actually abusing people... retarded country with retarded savages who have no clue and are retarded.

/retarded
 
2013-02-25 11:45:25 AM
Phase 1: Abuse Afghans. Phase 2: ?  Phase 3: Profit.
 
2013-02-25 11:45:45 AM
www.deviantart.com
 
2013-02-25 11:46:03 AM
Sequester the damn country.
 
2013-02-25 11:47:04 AM

Lando Lincoln: HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.

The American Heritage Dictionary disagrees with you. Afghani is one of the demonyms.


He's right. The point is the people call themselves Afghans and their currency Afghanis. If you call somebody an Afghani, to them it would sound like somebody calling you a dollar. And then opening up their own dictionary and saying "But it says right here that you are a dollar!"
 
2013-02-25 11:47:05 AM

johnny_vegas: Parthenogenetic: Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.

[guycodeblog.mtv.com image 575x350]


WOW  Just WOW

+10
 
2013-02-25 11:48:21 AM
Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.
 
2013-02-25 11:48:26 AM
Good.  Fark him/them.
 
2013-02-25 11:48:35 AM
NullReferenceException


Good farking luck invading Finland in the first place.
 
2013-02-25 11:49:18 AM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


This
 
2013-02-25 11:50:08 AM
Meh, ok, good luck.

/charity begins at home, spend the money here instead.
 
2013-02-25 11:54:02 AM

Joe Blowme: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

THIS, fark them ungratefull SOB's. Stoneage savages.


Seriously! The nerve of those people to not appreciate all those bombs and predator drones we sent them...
 
2013-02-25 11:54:07 AM
Boy is his face going to be red when US forces leave and Afghans are still brutalizing one another.
 
2013-02-25 11:54:17 AM
Who the hell cares? Leave already.
 
2013-02-25 11:56:32 AM
Bush's fault.
 
2013-02-25 11:57:17 AM

Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


i0.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-02-25 11:59:20 AM

hdhale: Rapmaster2000: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!

Ok, bad Stallone impersonations aside...

Getting called "baby killer" by a group of semi-homosexual frat boys who wouldn't know how to survive in the woods more than a couple of hours and who think it might be cool one day to go shoot a gun (OMG!)..."you know...at one of those places that lets you rent one and burn a couple of clips on *full auto*, wouldn't that be cool!" is not a good afternoon.

I had to resist putting more than one of them through a plate glass window more than once...

Anyway, stupid motherfarker is getting cocky and thinks he actually has the nuts to keep the Taliban at bay.  Fine.  Have at it.  Just make sure our people are out of harm's way and don't beg for air support later.



Thank you for your service, but fark you. You're an asshole.

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.
 
2013-02-25 11:59:54 AM

boobsrgood: Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.


see: Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men
 
2013-02-25 12:00:04 PM
Afghanistan's president ordered all U.S. special forces to leave a strategically important eastern province within two weeks because of allegations that Afghans working with them are torturing and abusing other Afghans.

So we're getting thrown out because the Afghans were torturing their own people?

If Karzai has to play silly-arsed games like this to protect his power, what have we actually accomplished after expending all this time and money......and don't give any of that WE GOTS BIN LADEN blather.
 
2013-02-25 12:02:14 PM

gshepnyc: and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.


Here is the problem with your hypothesis:  The people yelling dumb shiat to seem edgy use the same old material
 
2013-02-25 12:02:50 PM

gshepnyc: hdhale: Rapmaster2000: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!

Ok, bad Stallone impersonations aside...

Getting called "baby killer" by a group of semi-homosexual frat boys who wouldn't know how to survive in the woods more than a couple of hours and who think it might be cool one day to go shoot a gun (OMG!)..."you know...at one of those places that lets you rent one and burn a couple of clips on *full auto*, wouldn't that be cool!" is not a good afternoon.

I had to resist putting more than one of them through a plate glass window more than once...

Anyway, stupid motherfarker is getting cocky and thinks he actually has the nuts to keep the Taliban at bay.  Fine.  Have at it.  Just make sure our people are out of harm's way and don't beg for air support later.


Thank you for your service, but fark you. You're an asshole.

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.



Ahem.  That was a tirade voiced at the end of the movie "Rambo" when the hero sufferes a breakdown.

Get it together.
 
2013-02-25 12:05:09 PM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


No real way we can't oblige him. Not like we aren't operatively his guests there.
 
2013-02-25 12:06:25 PM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


Yeah, time to getthepharkout.

It's going to turn into a bigger shiathole after we leave. But the world is full of shiatholes, and we can't fix those either.
 
2013-02-25 12:07:29 PM

MonoChango: Boy oh Boy, Obama's smart diplomacy has really been a big success.   Can anyone else remember how everyone on TV was saying that the "Muslim World" would love us because Obama wasn't EvilBushMcHitler.  Ha ha jokes on us for thinking that he wasn't totally incompetent.   As much as it pains me to say this but Palin probably could have put together a better foreign policy.


While the media is in love with OBOMBa for some reason, in practice his foreign policy is pretty much the same as that of Bush. We're bombing the same people, we're trading with the same people. Tangibly what has changed?
 
2013-02-25 12:08:27 PM

Glendale: Who the hell cares? Leave already.


Now come on - there's no money in that..
 
2013-02-25 12:08:27 PM

boobsrgood: Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.


I think we're going to be OK. Thanks for your concern though.
 
2013-02-25 12:08:47 PM
fark you, Karzai.


Maybe if you ran your country with a shred of dignity and the appearance of something other than graft-gorged puppet, our special forces wouldn't have to be there.

But when you put a gibbering, brutal desert-dwelling primitive in power, you can't expect them to act with sophistication and intelligence.  They only understand violence, domination and greed.  Oh, and violence against women; they have a penchant for that.
 
2013-02-25 12:10:34 PM
You'll be dining with the captain. And he requests you wear this.
Elizabeth: Well you may tell the captain that I am disinclined to acquiesce to his request.
Pintel: He said you'd say that. He also said that if that be the case, then you'll be dining with the crew. And you'll be naked.
[looks at him in disgust and hastily grabs dress]
Pintel: Fine.

/came here for this
//didn't see it yet
 
2013-02-25 12:10:44 PM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


Yep. Phuq 'em. Let the taliban clear Kabul out, then go back in, start in the south, and just pull a General Sherman on the place.
 
2013-02-25 12:10:44 PM

ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.


Wow.
(First part) Stole the words right out of my mouth.
The more I think about this, the more it makes sense, because now it will be the Afghani government that will be signing the contracts, not the army, so less scrutiny.
Those contractors will then need to be secured, so you (i mean they) bring Halliburton or Xiat, or whatever they are called now.

/if the pipeline goes through the mountains, there is NO way you can secure it
//have a lot of patches on hand
///slashed pipes
 
2013-02-25 12:15:12 PM

airsupport: fark you, Karzai.


Maybe if you ran your country with a shred of dignity and the appearance of something other than graft-gorged puppet, our special forces wouldn't have to be there.

But when you put a gibbering, brutal desert-dwelling primitive in power, you can't expect them to act with sophistication and intelligence.  They only understand violence, domination and greed.  Oh, and violence against women; they have a penchant for that.


That's a great point. It sure would be nice if we could stop doing it.
 
2013-02-25 12:16:45 PM
Couldn't happen soon enough, Mr. Karzai. Hope you enjoy all those bribes and kickbacks you and your family have been taking from both sides of the conflict.

If we've left any American dead behind, please send forward them to the following address:

Arlington National Cemetery
1 Memorial Drive
Arlington, VA 22202

And please don't smuggle any opium in with the corpses. Thanks, asshole.
 
2013-02-25 12:17:44 PM
The funny thing is that the way Afghan history had been going the original Taliban were about due to be pushed out by other warlords anyway, who'd gone from fighting each other, to fighting each other and the Afghan government, to fighting each other and the Afghan government and their Soviet suzerains, to fighting each other and the Afghan government again, then back to fighting each other.

Two days before "9/11" a suicide bomber assassinated Ahmad Shah Massoud, the Northern Alliance's main general, as they were preparing to attack the Talban anyway, and if y'all remember the USA had a small part in the beginning of Operation Enduring Freedom, mainly sending in a few CIA and Special Forces goons to "advise" the "freedom fighters" while bombing known Taliban bases from the air. It wasn't until after the Northern Alliance took Kabul that the US troops flew in to take the country over from our "protegees" and imported a puppet in a funny hat.

If the US had let the Afghans themselves handle it there would probably have been a few more scene changes in Kabul and the civil war might have gone on a while longer, but then it has anyway. All the Imperial Troopers did was to keep our puppet in his palace while the rest of the country kept on pretty much as before -- with the added result that the Taliban became equated with resistance to the invaders to their continual benefit. The Taliban itself would probably have ceased to exist a few years ago anyway, or become subsumed in another grand alliance of then-current warlords against newer warlords with a slightly different brand of pseudo-Islamic ideology and slightly different economic and/or ethnic interests. It's been that way for centuries; that's the way they like it.

The only real way to bring peace in Aghanistan, short of killing everybody there, is to divide the country between the Pashtuns and everybody else: the former would probably merge with (or take over) Pakistan, while the ethnically Persian rest of the country would do best to join Tajikistan which would then become Iranian allies like our Iraqi shiate friends.
 
2013-02-25 12:18:53 PM
Well, that and it's farking hard to rebuild your terrorist network and resupply the Taliban and Al-Qaeda when American drones and special forces keep blowing sh*t up and killing the leaders.

Maybe it's just the mood I'm in today, but if America was going to drop a nuke it should have been on the terrorist camps on the Pakistan/Afghan border back just after 9/11. It would have been justified.
 
2013-02-25 12:21:47 PM

Resident Muslim: Wow.
(First part) Stole the words right out of my mouth.
The more I think about this, the more it makes sense, because now it will be the Afghani government that will be signing the contracts, not the army, so less scrutiny.


Well I figure we always make fun of Iran for their god awful internal PR, this could just be the Afghani version of that.  Plus I note that all the withdraws are typically a second term thing.  Bush signed most of the paperwork in his second term, now Obama can give zero farks about any backlash over his Afghan policy since he is done.

The Afghan Army can be the center of Afghan nation building and the proud force that handles all security for the country, no dirty foreigner needed, and some other dirty money department can be on the phone with the CIA about calling in drone strikes.
 
2013-02-25 12:22:39 PM
Therion: "Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now."

Nah, he's just going to pay the warlords and Talibani protection money, out of the piles of cash the Chinese are giving him.
The drug thing is a footnote.  Poppies ain't got shiat on mineral rights.
 
2013-02-25 12:23:59 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

This

/what are we accomplishing at this point besides making more money for KBR?


Keeping the Taliban from taking over and providing another safe haven for terrorists?
 
2013-02-25 12:24:07 PM
ha-ha-guy:

Plus I note that all the withdraws are typically a second term thing.  Bush signed most of the paperwork in his second term, now Obama can give zero farks about any backlash over his Afghan policy since he is done.

Nixon did the same thing in Vietnam.
 
2013-02-25 12:24:20 PM

boobsrgood: Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.



I wouldn't go THAT far. In fact, we've probably accomplished quite a bit. Deposed the Taliban, installed a representative government, made the region less hospitable to Al Quaeda, avenged the 9/11 attacks, killed the mastermind of 9/11, provided a lot of training and equipment to the fledgling representative government, honed modern warfighting techniques, deployed and tested new weapons systems, rewrote the manual on counterinsurgency, had many of our best engage a foreign populace culturally (I know someone will snark on this one - but not all of it was bad. Most of it has probably been good, but doesn't grab headlines and will mostly pay dividends many years from now) during one of the longest occupations in our history, developed new technologies and honed our techniques for dealing with explosives being used against us, etc. etc....

There are down sides too, but I just don't think it's right to say we've accomplished nothing.

That said? Yeah... It's long past time for us to be getting the fark out. Considering how long and expensive this occupation has been we should have accomplished much more, IMHO. We had the right idea going in, but botched the execution in key ways that have been farking us ever since.
 
2013-02-25 12:24:52 PM

Gunslinger013: MonoChango: Boy oh Boy, Obama's smart diplomacy has really been a big success.   Can anyone else remember how everyone on TV was saying that the "Muslim World" would love us because Obama wasn't EvilBushMcHitler.  Ha ha jokes on us for thinking that he wasn't totally incompetent.   As much as it pains me to say this but Palin probably could have put together a better foreign policy.

While the media is in love with OBOMBa for some reason, in practice his foreign policy is pretty much the same as that of Bush. We're bombing the same people, we're trading with the same people. Tangibly what has changed?


And this is why people are not singing his praise in then same tune and the first election. He is still a whole lot better than that other guy that hated 47% of Americans including it's vets and seniors.
 
2013-02-25 12:29:35 PM

The One True TheDavid: If the US had let the Afghans themselves handle it there would probably have been a few more scene changes in Kabul and the civil war might have gone on a while longer, but then it has anyway.


We should have gone in hard on Tora Bora and other mountain areas, and left it at that.  As it was the Northern Alliance was contracted to handle some of the security for that area and rumor has it they let people bribe their way through and head to Pakistan.  Supposedly Bush didn't want lots of American troops up there because the mountains would limit our mobility and lead to higher KIAs due to the nature of the warfare (the Soviets always had problems in that region).

I was old and retired from the Marines by 9/11, but i can't imagine my unit would have been sitting around and going "Waaa, we have no mountain training, we're strictly a littoral warfare outfit, waaaa our trucks don't work up here."  It likely would have been "Get the flamethrowers, the white willy p, and fark the Geneva Conventions, we're BBQ a cave full of Taliban."
 
2013-02-25 12:31:08 PM

oldfarthenry: [t3.gstatic.com image 252x200]
"Detriments you call us? Detriments? Well I want to remind you that it was detriments like us that built this bloody Empire AND the Izzat of the bloody Raj. Hats on."

Oops - wrong time period/empire/nation/etc.


Nope! The British were in Afghanistan in 1878! They invaded three times. The first two times they had political goals that were never realized because the Afghanis are batshiat insane. The third time, in 1919, they just bombed the shiat out of them to keep them on their side of the NW Frontier.
 
2013-02-25 12:31:28 PM

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: boobsrgood: Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.

I think we're going to be OK. Thanks for your concern though.


When exactly are we going to be 'OK'? At the moment the government is busy wiping it's collective a$$ with the constitution / our civil liberties in the name of this asinine War on Terror (TM) with no signs of stopping. Not to mention the asinine War on Drugs (TM). Maybe you and I have vastly differing definitions of 'OK'.
 
2013-02-25 12:32:35 PM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


Or hope the russians don't give them surface to air missles
 
2013-02-25 12:33:08 PM

The One True TheDavid: The funny thing is that the way Afghan history had been going the original Taliban were about due to be pushed out by other warlords anyway, who'd gone from fighting each other, to fighting each other and the Afghan government, to fighting each other and the Afghan government and their Soviet suzerains, to fighting each other and the Afghan government again, then back to fighting each other.

Two days before "9/11" a suicide bomber assassinated Ahmad Shah Massoud, the Northern Alliance's main general, as they were preparing to attack the Talban anyway, and if y'all remember the USA had a small part in the beginning of Operation Enduring Freedom, mainly sending in a few CIA and Special Forces goons to "advise" the "freedom fighters" while bombing known Taliban bases from the air. It wasn't until after the Northern Alliance took Kabul that the US troops flew in to take the country over from our "protegees" and imported a puppet in a funny hat.

If the US had let the Afghans themselves handle it there would probably have been a few more scene changes in Kabul and the civil war might have gone on a while longer, but then it has anyway. All the Imperial Troopers did was to keep our puppet in his palace while the rest of the country kept on pretty much as before -- with the added result that the Taliban became equated with resistance to the invaders to their continual benefit. The Taliban itself would probably have ceased to exist a few years ago anyway, or become subsumed in another grand alliance of then-current warlords against newer warlords with a slightly different brand of pseudo-Islamic ideology and slightly different economic and/or ethnic interests. It's been that way for centuries; that's the way they like it.

The only real way to bring peace in Aghanistan, short of killing everybody there, is to divide the country between the Pashtuns and everybody else: the former would probably merge with (or take over) Pakistan, while the ethnically Persian rest of the cou ...


Wow!, could've said that shiat is shorter words, but it all comes down to, "we're here", you're welcome.
 
2013-02-25 12:35:28 PM
24.media.tumblr.com
----
images.encyclopediadramatica.se
 
2013-02-25 12:35:36 PM

bilk2455: We are leaving...

Funny but with music

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ywt9a3lEQ


I like the one where they're waterboarding that feller. Waterboarding isn't so bad when professionals are doing it.
 
2013-02-25 12:37:42 PM

oldfarthenry: [t3.gstatic.com image 252x200]
"Detriments you call us? Detriments? Well I want to remind you that it was detriments like us that built this bloody Empire AND the Izzat of the bloody Raj. Hats on."

Oops - wrong time period/empire/nation/etc.


I remember my Dad, who was from London UK using the word KHARZI for a LATRINE
It seems so appropriate here.

From: http://www.toiletinspector.com/index.asp?pgid=166

Khazi

Lexicographer Eric Partridge derives khazi, also spelt karzy, kharsie or carzey, from a low Cockney word carsey originating in the late 19th century and meaning a privvy. Carsey also referred to a den or brothel. It is presumably derived from the Italian casa for house, with the spelling influenced by similar sound to khaki. Khazi is now most commonly used in the city of Liverpool in the UK, away from its cockney slang roots.
 
2013-02-25 12:38:42 PM

Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.
Peace With Honor is here!

The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.



So too, it seems the fried chicken empire just sprouted in the last decade. Coincidence? I think not.

[insert western imperialist pig admonishment here]

i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-25 12:39:36 PM

hdhale: Rapmaster2000: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

You just don't turn it off! It wasn't my war! You asked me, I didn't ask you! And I did what I had to do to win! But somebody wouldn't let us win! And I come back to the world and I see all those maggots at the airport, protesting me, spitting. Calling me baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me? Who are they? Unless they've been me and been there and know what the hell they're yelling about!

Ok, bad Stallone impersonations aside...

Getting called "baby killer" by a group of semi-homosexual frat boys who wouldn't know how to survive in the woods more than a couple of hours and who think it might be cool one day to go shoot a gun (OMG!)..."you know...at one of those places that lets you rent one and burn a couple of clips on *full auto*, wouldn't that be cool!" is not a good afternoon.

I had to resist putting more than one of them through a plate glass window more than once...

Anyway, stupid motherfarker is getting cocky and thinks he actually has the nuts to keep the Taliban at bay.  Fine.  Have at it.  Just make sure our people are out of harm's way and don't beg for air support later.



By chance do you have a newsletter I could subscribe to?
 
2013-02-25 12:41:05 PM
Mr. Karzai:

If your people would stop using death as a way to deal with each and every minute disagreement in political and daily life, we wouldn't have to be there.

Thanks,

Americans and the West in general
 
2013-02-25 12:41:21 PM

SpdrJay: The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home


We only hire winners at our company.  Why would someone hire someone who can't win a fight against an enemy armed with WWI era weapons?
 
2013-02-25 12:41:23 PM

Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.


That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.
 
2013-02-25 12:42:32 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.


How many Afghani for one clue, please?
 
2013-02-25 12:43:02 PM
Since the life of one American is worth more than that entire shiat country, we should be happy to oblige.
 
2013-02-25 12:44:42 PM

PapaChester: Gunslinger013: MonoChango: Boy oh Boy, Obama's smart diplomacy has really been a big success.   Can anyone else remember how everyone on TV was saying that the "Muslim World" would love us because Obama wasn't EvilBushMcHitler.  Ha ha jokes on us for thinking that he wasn't totally incompetent.   As much as it pains me to say this but Palin probably could have put together a better foreign policy.

While the media is in love with OBOMBa for some reason, in practice his foreign policy is pretty much the same as that of Bush. We're bombing the same people, we're trading with the same people. Tangibly what has changed?

And this is why people are not singing his praise in then same tune and the first election. He is still a whole lot better than that other guy that hated 47% of Americans including it's vets and seniors.


While I am no fan of the other guy I would argue he would in fact be better for us than Obama. Policy wise it would be same shiat different day. However when Bush pulled this crap at least the left would push back somewhat. Obama orders the assassination of an american citizen over seas and they just roll with it. In that regard I prefer the other guy.
 
2013-02-25 12:46:35 PM
www.busybeedogs.com
 
2013-02-25 12:47:14 PM

bilk2455: We are leaving...

Funny but with music

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ywt9a3lEQ


I'm pretty sure this is why they are being asked to leave.

/pretty sweet
 
2013-02-25 12:47:18 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.


Afghani is better than saying towel-head. Amirite?
 
2013-02-25 12:47:21 PM
I can't wait to unleash the killbots on them.
 
2013-02-25 12:48:34 PM
He's part of the empire now. Better tone it down a bit.
 
2013-02-25 12:48:55 PM

cgraves67: Guess who's hosting the Hide and Seek World Championship again.


Anne Frank?
 
2013-02-25 12:49:07 PM

Molavian: I can't wait to unleash the killbots on them.


Um we unleashed the killbots on them some time ago. Where have you been?
 
2013-02-25 12:50:10 PM

Parthenogenetic: Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.


In the pantheon of inspiring speeches, that's right up there with Bluto and the Germans bombing Pearl Harbor.

*salutes*
 
2013-02-25 12:50:39 PM
Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?
 
2013-02-25 12:50:49 PM

Tumunga: Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.

That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.


No, the libtards in charge are laughing every time a conservative troll comes up with some half-baked conspiracy theory in a vain attempt to lessen their butt-hurt over losing the election.

Hey...your daddy is calling......

i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-25 12:51:07 PM

Muta: SpdrJay: The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home

We only hire winners at our company.  Why would someone hire someone who can't win a fight against an enemy armed with WWI era weapons?


It's not the solders, it's the management.
 
2013-02-25 12:51:30 PM
AWESOME. Bye!

/Seriously, if the US-led Afghan troops are misbehaving, I am entirely willing to believe Karsai wants to kick their ass--it would be perfect political capital for him, since everyone hates us, and it might lead to him  actually getting a decent military that doesn't commit crimes on its own people.
//Plus, we do not belong there. At all.
 
2013-02-25 12:51:41 PM

Muta: SpdrJay: The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home

We only hire winners at our company.  Why would someone hire someone who can't win a fight against an enemy armed with WWI era weapons?


They can. We won't let them.

If the US wanted to, we could make war so terrible that the Afghans would get sick of it. We did it with the Confederates, we did it with the Germans, and we could do it here. It's just not pretty to do so.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 12:54:22 PM

Marine1: Muta: SpdrJay: The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home

We only hire winners at our company.  Why would someone hire someone who can't win a fight against an enemy armed with WWI era weapons?

They can. We won't let them.

If the US wanted to, we could make war so terrible that the Afghans would get sick of it. We did it with the Confederates, we did it with the Germans, and we could do it here. It's just not pretty to do so.


There is nothing pretty, attractive, or fun about war. War is the worst thing that man does so well. Sadly.
 
2013-02-25 12:54:37 PM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?


A terrorist network based in Afghanistan trained a number of Arabs to carry out successful attacks on the United States on Sept. 11th, 2001. The terrorist group, Al Queda, was a known and tolerated guest of the Taliban, which controlled the country at the time after a civil war that raged when the Soviets withdrew.

That's the Reader's Digest version.
 
2013-02-25 12:55:58 PM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?


From my vague recollection it was to get one man.  Who ended up not even being in that country.  Who was found and killed 2 years ago.  And yet...we are still there....doing something.
 
2013-02-25 12:58:58 PM

gja: Marine1: Muta: SpdrJay: The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home

We only hire winners at our company.  Why would someone hire someone who can't win a fight against an enemy armed with WWI era weapons?

They can. We won't let them.

If the US wanted to, we could make war so terrible that the Afghans would get sick of it. We did it with the Confederates, we did it with the Germans, and we could do it here. It's just not pretty to do so.

There is nothing pretty, attractive, or fun about war. War is the worst thing that man does so well. Sadly.


Indeed.

The sad irony is that the cleaner you try to make it, the worse and longer it gets.
 
2013-02-25 12:59:42 PM

PsiChick: AWESOME. Bye!

/Seriously, if the US-led Afghan troops are misbehaving, I am entirely willing to believe Karsai wants to kick their ass--it would be perfect political capital for him, since everyone hates us, and it might lead to him  actually getting a decent military that doesn't commit crimes on its own people.
//Plus, we do not belong there. At all.


As long as islam is in control, never happen.
 
2013-02-25 01:00:33 PM

Joe Blowme: PsiChick: AWESOME. Bye!

/Seriously, if the US-led Afghan troops are misbehaving, I am entirely willing to believe Karsai wants to kick their ass--it would be perfect political capital for him, since everyone hates us, and it might lead to him  actually getting a decent military that doesn't commit crimes on its own people.
//Plus, we do not belong there. At all.

As long as islam is in control, never happen.


Well, the brand they use, at least.
 
2013-02-25 01:00:34 PM

StrikitRich: Afghanistan's president ordered all U.S. special forces to leave a strategically important eastern province within two weeks because of allegations that Afghans working with them are torturing and abusing other Afghans.

So we're getting thrown out because the Afghans were torturing their own people?

If Karzai has to play silly-arsed games like this to protect his power, what have we actually accomplished after expending all this time and money......and don't give any of that WE GOTS BIN LADEN blather.


I don't think it's blather in the first place.... Bin Laden and the original hierarchy was more competent than the current batch.  For all our jokes about "Can't stop getting #2!", it's not like there's the next incarnation of Saladin in the current batch of AQ Leadership, despite the assertion that "Killing Terrorists only makes MOAR Terrorists" that has been bandied about over the past few years.

Of course, to be fair, Bin Laden was closer to a cross between Saddam Hussein and Genghis Khan -- the military competence of Saddam mixed with the utter disregard for life of Genghis.  They've not had a brilliant strategic or tactical mind in the Muslim world since...?  And I'd propose that our efforts have made it less likely they'll find one, not more.
 
2013-02-25 01:01:44 PM

Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


Yeah, leaving a theocratic government practicing dictatorial control over the populace can be effective in slowing down the drug trade however that same government has the power to not allow women to read, or gays to live. Oh yeah, and that whole 9/11 thing happened as well and almost everyone got on board with going after them, but I am sure we should have just left them alone.

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.
 
2013-02-25 01:06:42 PM

jdmac: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.

Yeah, leaving a theocratic government practicing dictatorial control over the populace can be effective in slowing down the drug trade however that same government has the power to not allow women to read, or gays to live. Oh yeah, and that whole 9/11 thing happened as well and almost everyone got on board with going after them, but I am sure we should have just left them alone.

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.


They are too busy admiring what moochel is wearing and to what event her fat ass is crashing to bother bout the wars.

/true watch dog journalism is dead
 
2013-02-25 01:08:43 PM
Worth a read...........

i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-25 01:10:26 PM

cgraves67: Guess who's hosting the Hide and Seek World Championship again.


Helen Keller?
 
2013-02-25 01:10:58 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life livein Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.


FFY no problem, sure you'd do the same for me
 
2013-02-25 01:11:48 PM

Joe Blowme: jdmac: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.

Yeah, leaving a theocratic government practicing dictatorial control over the populace can be effective in slowing down the drug trade however that same government has the power to not allow women to read, or gays to live. Oh yeah, and that whole 9/11 thing happened as well and almost everyone got on board with going after them, but I am sure we should have just left them alone.

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.

They are too busy admiring what moochel is wearing and to what event her fat ass is crashing to bother bout the wars.

/true watch dog journalism is dead


THIS.
 
2013-02-25 01:11:54 PM
we may as well get out as it won't matter when we do , as I foresee the warlords going at it again as soon as we leave.  not enough sense of national unity there.
 
2013-02-25 01:12:10 PM

Joe Blowme: PsiChick: AWESOME. Bye!

/Seriously, if the US-led Afghan troops are misbehaving, I am entirely willing to believe Karsai wants to kick their ass--it would be perfect political capital for him, since everyone hates us, and it might lead to him  actually getting a decent military that doesn't commit crimes on its own people.
//Plus, we do not belong there. At all.

As long as islam is in control, never happen.


What, us leaving? Um, that'd  better happen, occupying other countries does not end well for anyone.
 
2013-02-25 01:12:11 PM
It was inevitable that we'd leave (eventually).
It was inevitable that the "democratic" government will collapse into one corresponding more closely with the neolithic, tribal culture that is supported by the majority of Afghans.

Our goals there (and in Iraq) should have been simply to make an impression ("Don't fark with us"), break some crockery and make life expectancy arrangements for some fraction of the higher-ups, and then GTFO and let them sort themselves out however they wanted.  Most importantly, the local denizens should have been told in no uncertain terms to behave themselves until we GTFO, rather than getting hopped-up notions that they were running things.

Unfortunately, Bush got himself convinced (Rice, Powell -- I'm lookin' at you) that there was value in nation building and being their best friends.
 
2013-02-25 01:12:58 PM

Marine1: The sad irony is that the cleaner you try to make it, the worse and longer it gets.


This^
 
2013-02-25 01:13:55 PM

Marine1: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?

A terrorist network based in Afghanistan trained a number of Arabs to carry out successful attacks on the United States on Sept. 11th, 2001. The terrorist group, Al Queda, was a known and tolerated guest of the Taliban, which controlled the country at the time after a civil war that raged when the Soviets withdrew.

That's the Reader's Digest version.


Oh, well that certainly seems worth 2000+ dead, 50K injured American kids and a trillion dollars.

It's not as if we could have just bombed the shiat out of those training camps from the air.
 
2013-02-25 01:14:54 PM

homelessdude: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.
Peace With Honor is here!

The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


So too, it seems the fried chicken empire just sprouted in the last decade. Coincidence? I think not.

[insert western imperialist pig admonishment here]

[i.imgur.com image 520x650]



agrees.....
1-media-cdn.foolz.us
 
2013-02-25 01:15:02 PM

Parthenogenetic: Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

America could have totally destroyed Communism if Truman had the balls to let MacArthur cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China.   We had a second chance in Vietnam, but noooooo!  You libs had to go and ruin that for us too.

It's no different now, except that the Communists have been replaced my Islamofascist Jihadis.

And now you want our brave American fighting heterosexual men to cut and run, abandoning the field to our archenemies, who will not rest until every last American man, woman, and child is dead, converted to Islam, or gay married.

You swore you wouldn't forget 9-11.  Well, you did.

Don't blame me when the smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud over America's heartland.  We warned you.


Why would anybody forget that you dial 911 for emergency services?
 
2013-02-25 01:15:07 PM
We leave, and it's the Chinese invading next to maintain their mineral rights.  We at least pay lip service to human dignity and religion.  Have fun with them
 
2013-02-25 01:16:02 PM

Gunslinger013: Molavian: I can't wait to unleash the killbots on them.

Um we unleashed the killbots on them some time ago. Where have you been?


Pfft, get back to me when we do it Skynet style.
 
2013-02-25 01:16:20 PM

Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!



The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


Wrong.
 
2013-02-25 01:18:00 PM

Champion of the Sun: We leave, and it's the Chinese invading next to maintain their mineral rights.  We at least pay lip service to human dignity and religion.  Have fun with them


Should be interesting... I'll bring popcorn.
 
2013-02-25 01:18:38 PM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Marine1: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?

A terrorist network based in Afghanistan trained a number of Arabs to carry out successful attacks on the United States on Sept. 11th, 2001. The terrorist group, Al Queda, was a known and tolerated guest of the Taliban, which controlled the country at the time after a civil war that raged when the Soviets withdrew.

That's the Reader's Digest version.

Oh, well that certainly seems worth 2000+ dead, 50K injured American kids and a trillion dollars.

It's not as if we could have just bombed the shiat out of those training camps from the air.


We did that in, what, 1998? That sure didn't do anything about 9-11.

I don't like all of those figures any more than you do. It's a shiat deal. However, the alternative is allowing the Taliban to dispose of Karzai's government. They've used Afghanistan as a "house for rent" for terrorist organizations before; they'll probably (read: definitely) do it again. I mean... these are the same assholes who consider it acceptable for grown men to shoot a teenage girl in the head because she aspired to go to school. Let them run that place? Fark no. Not after the effort given so far.
 
2013-02-25 01:18:50 PM

ObeliskToucher: It was inevitable that we'd leave (eventually).
It was inevitable that the "democratic" government will collapse into one corresponding more closely with the neolithic, tribal culture that is supported by the majority of Afghans.

Our goals there (and in Iraq) should have been simply to make an impression ("Don't fark with us"), break some crockery and make life expectancy arrangements for some fraction of the higher-ups, and then GTFO and let them sort themselves out however they wanted.  Most importantly, the local denizens should have been told in no uncertain terms to behave themselves until we GTFO, rather than getting hopped-up notions that they were running things.

Unfortunately, Bush got himself convinced (Rice, Powell -- I'm lookin' at you) that there was value in nation building and being their best friends.


OK, and you are leaving Obama out of that equation because?

He has been in office 5 years and instead of saying "We made our point, do not fark with us or we come back" and removing our troops from harms way, he vastly increased the number of troops and continued the Bush policy of nation building.
 
2013-02-25 01:21:27 PM

SpdrJay: It'll never happen.

The US knows all those soldiers haven't got a chance in hell of finding a real job when they get home....


We could pay them better salaries to be back home with their families, not shooting at anything, and still save a lot of money on equipment and supplies.

Long past time to leave.
 
2013-02-25 01:22:19 PM
Parthenogenetic: ...smoking gun comes in the form of a mushroom cloud...

I all but forgot that this piece of bullshiat was uttered over and again leading up to the Iraq invasion.
 
2013-02-25 01:22:54 PM

jdmac: ObeliskToucher: It was inevitable that we'd leave (eventually).
It was inevitable that the "democratic" government will collapse into one corresponding more closely with the neolithic, tribal culture that is supported by the majority of Afghans.

Our goals there (and in Iraq) should have been simply to make an impression ("Don't fark with us"), break some crockery and make life expectancy arrangements for some fraction of the higher-ups, and then GTFO and let them sort themselves out however they wanted.  Most importantly, the local denizens should have been told in no uncertain terms to behave themselves until we GTFO, rather than getting hopped-up notions that they were running things.

Unfortunately, Bush got himself convinced (Rice, Powell -- I'm lookin' at you) that there was value in nation building and being their best friends.

OK, and you are leaving Obama out of that equation because?

He has been in office 5 years and instead of saying "We made our point, do not fark with us or we come back" and removing our troops from harms way, he vastly increased the number of troops and continued the Bush policy of nation building.


Clearly, we need to Stay the CourseTM
 
2013-02-25 01:24:36 PM

ProfessorOhki: jdmac: ObeliskToucher: It was inevitable that we'd leave (eventually).
It was inevitable that the "democratic" government will collapse into one corresponding more closely with the neolithic, tribal culture that is supported by the majority of Afghans.

Our goals there (and in Iraq) should have been simply to make an impression ("Don't fark with us"), break some crockery and make life expectancy arrangements for some fraction of the higher-ups, and then GTFO and let them sort themselves out however they wanted.  Most importantly, the local denizens should have been told in no uncertain terms to behave themselves until we GTFO, rather than getting hopped-up notions that they were running things.

Unfortunately, Bush got himself convinced (Rice, Powell -- I'm lookin' at you) that there was value in nation building and being their best friends.

OK, and you are leaving Obama out of that equation because?

He has been in office 5 years and instead of saying "We made our point, do not fark with us or we come back" and removing our troops from harms way, he vastly increased the number of troops and continued the Bush policy of nation building.

Clearly, we need to Stay the CourseTM


Well, that is the Obama plan.
 
2013-02-25 01:25:15 PM
GET OUT
static.ddmcdn.com
 
2013-02-25 01:28:18 PM

Gunslinger013: Obama orders the assassination of an american citizen over seas a traitor who turned his back on America and went all Durka Durka Jihad and they just roll with it. In that regard I prefer the other guy who would have sold my job to the ChiComs right out from under my feet and then laughed in my face and called me a lazy moocher who wanted free goodies for being unemployed.


You're an idiot.
 
2013-02-25 01:28:29 PM
Me to Obama: Get the Hell out of Afghanistan now.
 
2013-02-25 01:29:46 PM
gshepnyc:

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.

I worked with a guy who claimed he was called baby-killer upon his return from Vietnam.  Later, I learned that he never went to Vietnam.
 
2013-02-25 01:30:39 PM

Kittypie070: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.

Wrong.



I know, and I'm getting plenty of flak for my hyperbole.

amended: There was a reduction in production under the Taliban and an increase after our "introduction to freedom".
 
2013-02-25 01:34:01 PM
images.wikia.com
 
2013-02-25 01:35:17 PM

Rich Cream: Kittypie070: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.

Wrong.


I know, and I'm getting plenty of flak for my hyperbole.

amended: There was a reduction in production under the Taliban and an increase after our "introduction to freedom".


And?

There are better ways to get them to not grow smack than having some Islamic extremist government stone them to death.
 
2013-02-25 01:36:20 PM
Precisely what part of "Puppet Regime" do you not understand Mr. Kharzai?
 
2013-02-25 01:38:04 PM

hugram: GET OUT
[static.ddmcdn.com image 400x269]



When the house tells you to get out of the house, GET OUT OF THE HOUSE!
 
2013-02-25 01:41:06 PM
Totally cool. We are heading out right now.
www.thenewstribe.com www.thenewstribe.com
 
2013-02-25 01:41:20 PM

Duelist: hugram: GET OUT
[static.ddmcdn.com image 400x269]


When the house tells you to get out of the house, GET OUT OF THE HOUSE!


The pig faced boy said no.
 
2013-02-25 01:41:27 PM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


I more or less came here to say that...

I have yet to see any real reason why our forces are there to start with.  Unless I'm missing something, this is the timeline so far:
OBL was in that country under protection of the Taliban, who were, for all intents and purposes, the ones in power at the time.  So, our forces went in, removed the Taliban from power, and then spent the next few years searching for OBL, only to find out he'd been in our allie's country (Pakistan) the whole time.  So, since we literally started a cival war there, it was now our moral obligation to train the Afgans that are not terrorists to keep control and order in their own country.  To which they responded by becoming terrorists themselves and started killing the ones training them.

Every last one of our people should pack up and get the Fark out of there.  There is no point to ANY military opperations there.  And there hasn't been for over 10 years.
 
2013-02-25 01:43:27 PM

Marine1: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Marine1: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?

A terrorist network based in Afghanistan trained a number of Arabs to carry out successful attacks on the United States on Sept. 11th, 2001. The terrorist group, Al Queda, was a known and tolerated guest of the Taliban, which controlled the country at the time after a civil war that raged when the Soviets withdrew.

That's the Reader's Digest version.

Oh, well that certainly seems worth 2000+ dead, 50K injured American kids and a trillion dollars.

It's not as if we could have just bombed the shiat out of those training camps from the air.

We did that in, what, 1998? That sure didn't do anything about 9-11.


That's because instead of going after bin Laden, Clinton bombed an aspirin factory to distract America from the Lewinsky scandal.

Did you also not know that Sudan offered to hand bin Laden over to the USA on a silver platter in 1996, but Clinton refused because there "wasn't enough evidence to arrest him"?

Also, did you know that Col. Oliver North was grilled by a Senate committee packed with liberals and was soundly criticized for buying a $60,000 home security system? Ollie said he needed it to protect his family from the world's most dangerous terrorist... Osama bin Laden.  The senator in charge of the committee openly mocked Col. North and called him a pussy for being afraid of somebody that nobody had ever heard of, and would never pose a real threat to America.  That senator was none other than Al Gore.

If you don't believe me, kindly provide your email address and I will re-forward the emails containing all of the relevant information, which I have saved in my AOL email account.
 
2013-02-25 01:43:30 PM

ChuDogg: Lando Lincoln: HotIgneous Intruder: Afghan = the people who life in Afghanistan.
Afghani = the money they use.

/Purchase a clue, people.

The American Heritage Dictionary disagrees with you. Afghani is one of the demonyms.

He's right. The point is the people call themselves Afghans and their currency Afghanis. If you call somebody an Afghani, to them it would sound like somebody calling you a dollar. And then opening up their own dictionary and saying "But it says right here that you are a dollar!"


No, it would be more like them calling us Americanos. I'm okay with that demonym.
 
2013-02-25 01:43:47 PM

jdmac: ObeliskToucher: It was inevitable that we'd leave (eventually).
It was inevitable that the "democratic" government will collapse into one corresponding more closely with the neolithic, tribal culture that is supported by the majority of Afghans.

Our goals there (and in Iraq) should have been simply to make an impression ("Don't fark with us"), break some crockery and make life expectancy arrangements for some fraction of the higher-ups, and then GTFO and let them sort themselves out however they wanted.  Most importantly, the local denizens should have been told in no uncertain terms to behave themselves until we GTFO, rather than getting hopped-up notions that they were running things.

Unfortunately, Bush got himself convinced (Rice, Powell -- I'm lookin' at you) that there was value in nation building and being their best friends.

OK, and you are leaving Obama out of that equation because?

He has been in office 5 years and instead of saying "We made our point, do not fark with us or we come back" and removing our troops from harms way, he vastly increased the number of troops and continued the Bush policy of nation building.


It was an error in Grand Strategy by Bush -- failure to create a clearly-defined goal before deploying the troops -- that set things up.  The surge strategy worked in Iraq because errors by the foreign jihadists developed enough enmity amongst the Iraqis that they cooperated with the US & new-Iraqi goverments to put them down.  It dribbled out some, as these things do, but the surge allowed Obama to declare victory in Iraq and withdraw.

Obama tried to use the same strategy in Afghanistan, but there the predominant opposition is Afghan and the same dynamic doesn't apply  -- the surge only worked on a limited, short-term basis.  Once a region was "pacified", the surge troops leave and the Taliban return.

There's really no "good" withdrawal strategy from Afghanistan at this point -- whoever pulls the troops out is going to acquire the "lost Afghanistan" label.  Obama is as stuck as McCain or Romney would have been -- without a successful surge, there's no way to declare victory.

If Bush had gone in with an attitude of "We don't fecking care about Afghans (or Pakistanis) -- we're going in there and tear shiat up until we're satisfied that most of the al Queda infrastructure is scattered (for now) and it's too dangerous for any other nation to provide them with a base of operations", then all it would have taken to leave is a statement that "We're satisfied.. goodbye, and good luck with that Stone Age thing!"
 
2013-02-25 01:45:31 PM

randomjsa: I wonder which of his drug operations they were disrupting, or potential payoffs he is lining up for....


You mean he wants a bigger cut of our drug operations.
 
2013-02-25 01:49:25 PM
jdmac:

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.

This is because the war is now a stigmatized taboo and the news agencies aren't making as much money off of it as they used to.  It's like showing constant updates on Hummer sales now as opposed to 10 years ago.  Even if they were selling more now than they were (which they aren't), people would not care, and thus the media wouldn't be able to make money from it.

Remember, the news is not a benefit to society.  It's a business.
 
2013-02-25 01:50:47 PM

Marine1: Rich Cream: Kittypie070: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.

Wrong.


I know, and I'm getting plenty of flak for my hyperbole.

amended: There was a reduction in production under the Taliban and an increase after our "introduction to freedom".

And?

There are better ways to get them to not grow smack than having some Islamic extremist government stone them to death.



And....I was pointing out that saying Karzai asking troops to leave an eastern province is not an attempt to prop up a drug empire. It would be more endemic to our philosophy than theirs.

/Those methods you a referring to will be implemented in 3...2...1...never. Increased penalties are the answer to failures in our system too. We just frown upon stonings. They're "beneath" us.
 
2013-02-25 01:54:31 PM

Tumunga: Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.

That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.


Oh, COME ON. Next time, don't capitalize Democrat if you want to be taken seriously. True conservatives would rather die than use proper grammar in relation to their sworn enemies.
 
2013-02-25 01:55:03 PM
The only way to stop violence in afganistan would be thru total genocide. And that wouldn't last long.
 
2013-02-25 02:00:01 PM

FatherChaos: jdmac:

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.

This is because the war is now a stigmatized taboo and the news agencies aren't making as much money off of it as they used to.  It's like showing constant updates on Hummer sales now as opposed to 10 years ago.  Even if they were selling more now than they were (which they aren't), people would not care, and thus the media wouldn't be able to make money from it.

Remember, the news is not a benefit to society.  It's a business.


It's probably more a function of how rugged Afghanistan is vs. Iraq for foreign journalists, and the relative lack of Pashtun stringers compared to the large number of Arab stringers (from al Jazeera, etc) in Iraq.  You can drive into Iraq for a quick story from Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and be back across the border (and relative safety) by the evening.
 
2013-02-25 02:01:56 PM

Parthenogenetic: If you don't believe me, kindly provide your email address and I will re-forward the emails containing all of the relevant information, which I have saved in my AOL email account.


Well played. 9/11.
 
2013-02-25 02:04:38 PM
K thx bye
 
2013-02-25 02:06:15 PM
Maybe he did not want the pictures of boy love days getting out
 
2013-02-25 02:08:57 PM
gladly. Let that whole region simmer for awhile.
 
2013-02-25 02:15:01 PM

ObeliskToucher: FatherChaos: jdmac:

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.

This is because the war is now a stigmatized taboo and the news agencies aren't making as much money off of it as they used to.  It's like showing constant updates on Hummer sales now as opposed to 10 years ago.  Even if they were selling more now than they were (which they aren't), people would not care, and thus the media wouldn't be able to make money from it.

Remember, the news is not a benefit to society.  It's a business.

It's probably more a function of how rugged Afghanistan is vs. Iraq for foreign journalists, and the relative lack of Pashtun stringers compared to the large number of Arab stringers (from al Jazeera, etc) in Iraq.  You can drive into Iraq for a quick story from Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and be back across the border (and relative safety) by the evening.


Please stop trying to polish that turd of a comment with sense. You're in a clown thread, bro.
 
2013-02-25 02:16:16 PM

Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.


If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.
 
2013-02-25 02:21:40 PM

Gyrfalcon: Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.

If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.


Tolerance of evil is a crime.
Deal with the Talibal with 2000lb JDAM, no need for boots on the ground
 
2013-02-25 02:24:34 PM

Joe Blowme: Gyrfalcon: Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.

If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.

Tolerance of evil is a crime.
Deal with the Talibal with 2000lb JDAM, no need for boots on the ground


Who gets to define evil?
 
2013-02-25 02:26:18 PM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


or the brits!
or the greeks!

LOLOL
seriously, WHY are we still there? we got osama already ....

I bet if we left, that Karzi would continue to complain about drone strikes.
I can not imagine why!!
 
2013-02-25 02:26:19 PM

ChuDogg: The point is the people call themselves Afghans


No they don't. People who speak English call them "Afghans."
 
2013-02-25 02:28:00 PM

Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.


true sort of ... the Taliban had done a pretty good job of killing everyone.
 
2013-02-25 02:30:06 PM
indarwinsshadow:

Well, that and it's farking hard to rebuild your terrorist network and resupply the Taliban and Al-Qaeda when American drones and special forces keep blowing sh*t up and killing the leaders.

Then again there wouldn't be so many anti-American "Taliban" and "Al Qaeda" if the USA left those people the hell alone.

Here's one quick what-if: what do you think would happen if some bigger foreign power or alliance acted in America the way we did in Afghanistan and Iraq? Would you be thanking them for "liberating" you or would you be an "insurgent?"

9/11/01 was 12.5 years ago, and Afghans had zip to do with it anyway: the terrorists were SAUDIS.

Let it go man, it's over.
 
2013-02-25 02:30:15 PM
snag.gy
 
2013-02-25 02:30:46 PM
 
2013-02-25 02:33:27 PM
...But we must kill them. We must incinerate them. Pig after pig. Cow after cow. Village after village. Army after army ...
 
2013-02-25 02:35:02 PM

mongbiohazard: boobsrgood: Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.

I wouldn't go THAT far. In fact, we've probably accomplished quite a bit. Deposed the Taliban, installed a representative government


4/10.
 
2013-02-25 02:35:49 PM

Gyrfalcon: Joe Blowme: Gyrfalcon: Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.

If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.

Tolerance of evil is a crime.
Deal with the Talibal with 2000lb JDAM, no need for boots on the ground

Who gets to define evil?


Seriously? Stoning people not evil to you? Hanging people for being gay not evil to you? Treating women like property not evil to you?
/i hope you are just playing devils advocate and are not really just a retarded cultural relativist
 
2013-02-25 02:37:08 PM
If we acted like the Good Guy, this shiat wouldn't happen.  Apparently, Rumsfeld burned all the copies of the Art of War at the Pentagon, and nobody has bothered to buy new ones.

MORAL Law.  When you lose it, you've lost the war.
 
2013-02-25 02:38:02 PM

grimlock1972: we may as well get out as it won't matter when we do , as I foresee the warlords going at it again as soon as we leave.  not enough sense of national unity there.


Strangely enough, the BEST weapon that we have against the warlords is legalizing heroin.
By legalizing heroin, pot, and cocaine, we take close to 100% of the profit away from the drug lords in one fell swoop. We would either grow local or convince mexico/south america to legalize it and grow for us.

By removing the money, you remove any and all power that the drug lords have.
And yet, we will never do this .... LOL
 
2013-02-25 02:38:40 PM

Marine1: Mr. Karzai:

If your people would stop using death as a way to deal with each and every minute disagreement in political and daily life, we wouldn't have to be there.


On the other hand why not let them all kill each other, if that's what they're set on doing? Sell weapons to all sides and giggle till they're gone.
 
2013-02-25 02:39:32 PM

Joe Blowme: Gyrfalcon: Joe Blowme: Gyrfalcon: Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.

If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.

Tolerance of evil is a crime.
Deal with the Talibal with 2000lb JDAM, no need for boots on the ground

Who gets to define evil?

Seriously? Stoning people not evil to you? Hanging people for being gay not evil to you? Treating women like property not evil to you?
/i hope you are just playing devils advocate and are not really just a retarded cultural relativist


Why do you hate the Old Testament?
 
2013-02-25 02:42:39 PM
namatad:

LOLOL
seriously, WHY are we still there? we got osama already ....


Because we are still looking for Osama's really cool, scary, multi-tiered, underground, fortress
with computer & telephone systems, ventilation, hyrdro-electric systems and a place for
trucks to drive into that Donald Rumsfeld said there were many of.... (youtube)

i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-25 02:44:12 PM

cgraves67: It doesn't really matter. We either spend 20 years fighting the Taliban now or 20 years fighting the Taliban after they crush Karzai's little empire and start harboring anti-US terrorists again. Either way, we will be fighting the Taliban for a long time.


Maybe we could trick the Russians into invading again.

Worst mistake we've made since Vietnam, helping the Afghans kick them out...
 
2013-02-25 02:44:17 PM

jdmac: Rich Cream: Therion: Ok everybody, get on the plane. Karzai's going to prop up his drug empire with Afghani troops now.

Peace With Honor is here!


The "drug empire" was non-existent until US forces arrived.

Yeah, leaving a theocratic government practicing dictatorial control over the populace can be effective in slowing down the drug trade however that same government has the power to not allow women to read, or gays to live. Oh yeah, and that whole 9/11 thing happened as well and almost everyone got on board with going after them, but I am sure we should have just left them alone.

That being said, it is kind of funny how off-the-radar the Afghanistan war is in the media. During the Bush administration, networks like CNN ran a counter on the screen to constantly remind us how many troops have died. Since Obama has been elected I have not seen that counter once. More Americans have died in Afghanistan since Obama took office than during Bush's entire term. But Bush is a warmonger, and Obama has a Peace Prize. Go figure.



More Americans got killed in Chicago last year. Maybe CNN and the rest just went with the higher body-count
 
2013-02-25 02:44:20 PM

The One True TheDavid: indarwinsshadow:

Well, that and it's farking hard to rebuild your terrorist network and resupply the Taliban and Al-Qaeda when American drones and special forces keep blowing sh*t up and killing the leaders.

Then again there wouldn't be so many anti-American "Taliban" and "Al Qaeda" if the USA left those people the hell alone.

Here's one quick what-if: what do you think would happen if some bigger foreign power or alliance acted in America the way we did in Afghanistan and Iraq? Would you be thanking them for "liberating" you or would you be an "insurgent?"



It's simple:

-- US was committing genocide against it's own people or was trying to conquer the world, and the foreign power did not void our constitution: greet as liberators.
-- US was simply conquered by some other power, or that power decided we'd throw out the constitution and go with, say, dictatorship or theocracy: fight to death.

"My country, right or wrong" would not fly for us, why should it fly for them?
 
2013-02-25 02:47:04 PM

Gyrfalcon: Joe Blowme: Gyrfalcon: Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.

If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.

Tolerance of evil is a crime.
Deal with the Talibal with 2000lb JDAM, no need for boots on the ground

Who gets to define evil?



I do.
 
2013-02-25 02:47:20 PM
Karzai has a biatchin hat. I want his hat.
 
2013-02-25 02:49:20 PM

randomjsa: I wonder which of his drug operations they were disrupting, or potential payoffs he is lining up for....


Or maybe it's because we are torturing the locals.  Just maybe.
 
2013-02-25 02:51:21 PM
By all means, let's oblige him and get out of Afghanistan. Make a nice speech about how we wouldn't have come if they hadn't harbored our enemies. Remind them that any future such behavior will be met with the most cost effective response available.  Smart bombs are expensive, old chum. So are troop deployments.  Don't say you weren't warned.
 
2013-02-25 02:51:25 PM
Gyrfalcon:

Who gets to define evil?

I'll give it a shot for a while. Out of gratitude for all my SNAP (formerly known as Food Stamps). But if I do the rest of you have to sit down, shut up and take notes.

Y'all know where to find me.
 
2013-02-25 02:51:38 PM
Nobody wins in Afghanistan.

Except the Mongols. The Mongols always win.
 
2013-02-25 02:53:46 PM
The Southern Dandy:

If we acted like the Good Guy, this shiat wouldn't happen.  Apparently, Rumsfeld burned all the copies of the Art of War at the Pentagon, and nobody has bothered to buy new ones.

MORAL Law.  When you lose it, you've lost the war.


Who won? The USA lost that one some time after WW1.
 
2013-02-25 02:53:52 PM

Gyrfalcon: Lando Lincoln: ha-ha-guy: I've always wondered if this is the way to withdraw and let Karzai get street credit.  Look he kicked us out, he's not some American puppet.  Just ignore that plan we had in place about leaving the region by 2014.

Absolutely fine with me. I do not give a flying fark at this point. I feel bad for the Afghanis that want to live in a democratic society, but there's too many tribal savages in their land for that. I don't want another drop of blood spilled because of them. Let them fight each other for the kind of life that they want.

If they want a democratic society, they have to make their own. Democracy can't be imposed from without, because then it's not a democracy. And if the people don't want a democracy enough to fight for it on their own, they won't have one. If the only reason Afghanistan (or Iraq, or Congo, or wherever) is a "democracy" is because of the presence of foreign troops, then it isn't a democracy, it's a play-democracy, an act. It's a dictatorship pretending to be democratic at the point of a sword. You can't have a "fair election" when US troops have to enforce it any more than if the Ayatollahs have to bless it.

So if Afghanistan wants us out, and there's going to be a big civil war, and the Taliban takes over again--well, then that's what the Afghanis want, and are willing to accept, and the US will have to deal with the Taliban as their chosen government. And maybe if we DID, and stopped trying to say people have to have the kind of government WE like, they'd get along with us better.


Not that I agree with how the "war" has been handled at all, but the problem with letting a hostile regime rule in any given area is that like any virus, runs the risk of spreading and infecting other areas. You can do your best to try to quarantine and contain it, but eventually the problem will be larger than your countermeasures can handle. Therefore, it is best to immunize and try to shock the system so that it eventually cures itself. The problem, is that it was too far gone for this to be successful. They don't have to have a system identical to ours, it just can't be a farked up one that is hell-bent on destroying and oppressing. To say that this is the goal of the US is extremely disingenuous.
 
2013-02-25 02:56:15 PM

Gunslinger013: MonoChango: Boy oh Boy, Obama's smart diplomacy has really been a big success.   Can anyone else remember how everyone on TV was saying that the "Muslim World" would love us because Obama wasn't EvilBushMcHitler.  Ha ha jokes on us for thinking that he wasn't totally incompetent.   As much as it pains me to say this but Palin probably could have put together a better foreign policy.

While the media is in love with OBOMBa for some reason, in practice his foreign policy is pretty much the same as that of Bush. We're bombing the same people, we're trading with the same people. Tangibly what has changed?


People were fine with Bush's foreign policy when he went into Afghanistan.  90+ approval ratings...that's as good as it gets in a democracy.  It was Iraq that became the "wtf?" moment for a lot of people.  And, then, once Bush told us Bin Laden wasn't important anymore, people didn't see the point in spending our boys' lives, and all that money, in Afghanistan anymore.

Apparently, neocons just can't understand that not every war is equal, but it's REALLY not that difficult a concept.

Now, I'll grant you Obama still has time to become a Bush-style, half-assed interventionist with a debit card, but only wingnuts see the two men as equivalent at this point.
 
2013-02-25 02:56:36 PM

pciszek: randomjsa: I wonder which of his drug operations they were disrupting, or potential payoffs he is lining up for....

Or maybe it's because we are torturing the locals.  Just maybe.


We're also killing quite a number of them.

In a stark assessment of shootings of locals by US troops at checkpoints in Afghanistan, Gen. Stanley McChrystal said in little-noticed comments last month that during his time as commander there, "We've shot an amazing number of people and killed a number and, to my knowledge, none has proven to have been a real threat to the force."

In many cases, he added, families were in the vehicles that were fired on


Man, you'd have to be some kind of crazy raghead to get upset about that.

Then there is the part where we have a new version of Gitmo in Afghanistan that is much bigger than the one in Cuba ever was.

What occupied nation doesn't enjoy seeing it's people murdered or disappeared into political prisons without a trial by the invading force?
 
2013-02-25 03:00:36 PM
Pull everybody out and stick to using drones to keep an eye on things. Sucks that the Taliban will have free reign to terrorize the population, but we can't do anything to stop that.
 
2013-02-25 03:00:39 PM
Ron Paul has been saying that for years now.
 
2013-02-25 03:03:42 PM

Rapmaster2000: gshepnyc:

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.

I worked with a guy who claimed he was called baby-killer upon his return from Vietnam.  Later, I learned that he never went to Vietnam.


Apparently, we sent a half-million scared little girls to Vietnam, given all the "hippies spit on me when I got home" stories, coupled with the complete absence of "returning vet beats crap out of spitting hippy" tales...

Fun fact:  the only people caught on TV actually spitting on veterans in that era?

Young Republicans, spitting on antiwar veteran protestors.
 
2013-02-25 03:07:01 PM

Graffito: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

This

/what are we accomplishing at this point besides making more money for KBR?

Keeping the Taliban from taking over and providing another safe haven for terrorists?


Do you honestly think it's going to make a difference whether we leave now or a year from now?
 
2013-02-25 03:07:45 PM
Seal. Team. Six.
 
2013-02-25 03:08:53 PM

ObeliskToucher: jdmac: ObeliskToucher: It was inevitable that we'd leave (eventually).
It was inevitable that the "democratic" government will collapse into one corresponding more closely with the neolithic, tribal culture that is supported by the majority of Afghans.

Our goals there (and in Iraq) should have been simply to make an impression ("Don't fark with us"), break some crockery and make life expectancy arrangements for some fraction of the higher-ups, and then GTFO and let them sort themselves out however they wanted.  Most importantly, the local denizens should have been told in no uncertain terms to behave themselves until we GTFO, rather than getting hopped-up notions that they were running things.

Unfortunately, Bush got himself convinced (Rice, Powell -- I'm lookin' at you) that there was value in nation building and being their best friends.

OK, and you are leaving Obama out of that equation because?

He has been in office 5 years and instead of saying "We made our point, do not fark with us or we come back" and removing our troops from harms way, he vastly increased the number of troops and continued the Bush policy of nation building.

It was an error in Grand Strategy by Bush -- failure to create a clearly-defined goal before deploying the troops -- that set things up.  The surge strategy worked in Iraq because errors by the foreign jihadists developed enough enmity amongst the Iraqis that they cooperated with the US & new-Iraqi goverments to put them down.  It dribbled out some, as these things do, but the surge allowed Obama to declare victory in Iraq and withdraw.

Obama tried to use the same strategy in Afghanistan, but there the predominant opposition is Afghan and the same dynamic doesn't apply  -- the surge only worked on a limited, short-term basis.  Once a region was "pacified", the surge troops leave and the Taliban return.

There's really no "good" withdrawal strategy from Afghanistan at this point -- whoever pulls the troops out is going to acquire t ...


Mostly agree.   My only quibble is the "success" of the Iraq surge...which was coupled with massive payoffs to the locals not to shoot at our guys.

Giving aid to terrorists...like hard case...is treason if you or I do it.
 
2013-02-25 03:09:28 PM
That should be "hard CASH", not "hard case"...sigh.
 
2013-02-25 03:11:23 PM
easy there Karzai - or we'll bomb your rubble to rubble!

/a finer, less coarse rubble
 
2013-02-25 03:13:10 PM

homelessdude: Tumunga: Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.

That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.

No, the libtards in charge are laughing every time a conservative troll comes up with some half-baked conspiracy theory in a vain attempt to lessen their butt-hurt over losing the election.

Hey...your daddy is calling......

[i.imgur.com image 163x218]


FarkLibtards trying to twist theories around to hide their white-knighting of the BBC in charge will not help then get their chins lubed.
 
2013-02-25 03:14:03 PM

mongbiohazard: boobsrgood: Congratulations, America. You accomplished nothing, and it cost you your nation's wealth.


I wouldn't go THAT far. In fact, we've probably accomplished quite a bit. Deposed the Taliban, installed a representative government, made the region less hospitable to Al Quaeda, avenged the 9/11 attacks, killed the mastermind of 9/11, provided a lot of training and equipment to the fledgling representative government, honed modern warfighting techniques, deployed and tested new weapons systems, rewrote the manual on counterinsurgency, had many of our best engage a foreign populace culturally (I know someone will snark on this one - but not all of it was bad. Most of it has probably been good, but doesn't grab headlines and will mostly pay dividends many years from now) during one of the longest occupations in our history, developed new technologies and honed our techniques for dealing with explosives being used against us, etc. etc....

There are down sides too, but I just don't think it's right to say we've accomplished nothing.

That said? Yeah... It's long past time for us to be getting the fark out. Considering how long and expensive this occupation has been we should have accomplished much more, IMHO. We had the right idea going in, but botched the execution in key ways that have been farking us ever since.


I'm not convinced the "representative government" we propped up over there amounts to much more than, effectively, the mayor of Kabul.

And the manual on modern counter-terrorism was written by the British back in the 60s (no, not in Ireland...they forgot their own manual, same as we did)...what we did was more like reinventing the wheel.
 
2013-02-25 03:14:10 PM

PunGent: Mostly agree. My only quibble is the "success" of the Iraq surge...which was coupled with massive payoffs to the locals not to shoot at our guys.


It's the same strategy we've been trying in Afghanistan for years now.

dl.dropbox.com

/What pallets of cash look like
 
2013-02-25 03:14:26 PM

Lando Lincoln: Tumunga: Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.

That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.

Oh, COME ON. Next time, don't capitalize Democrat if you want to be taken seriously. True conservatives would rather die than use proper grammar in relation to their sworn enemies.


Damn. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
 
2013-02-25 03:27:08 PM

PunGent: Gunslinger013: MonoChango: Boy oh Boy, Obama's smart diplomacy has really been a big success.   Can anyone else remember how everyone on TV was saying that the "Muslim World" would love us because Obama wasn't EvilBushMcHitler.  Ha ha jokes on us for thinking that he wasn't totally incompetent.   As much as it pains me to say this but Palin probably could have put together a better foreign policy.

While the media is in love with OBOMBa for some reason, in practice his foreign policy is pretty much the same as that of Bush. We're bombing the same people, we're trading with the same people. Tangibly what has changed?

People were fine with Bush's foreign policy when he went into Afghanistan.  90+ approval ratings...that's as good as it gets in a democracy.  It was Iraq that became the "wtf?" moment for a lot of people.  And, then, once Bush told us Bin Laden wasn't important anymore, people didn't see the point in spending our boys' lives, and all that money, in Afghanistan anymore.

Apparently, neocons just can't understand that not every war is equal, but it's REALLY not that difficult a concept.

Now, I'll grant you Obama still has time to become a Bush-style, half-assed interventionist with a debit card, but only wingnuts see the two men as equivalent at this point.


I must be a wingnut then. It would be interesting to be able to do some sort of a double blind taste test with their polices and see how many people could match the policy to the president. I'm thinking some folks would be scratching their head. Look at the patriot act for instance - Obama took that baton and ran with it, baby.

/meet the new boss
/same as the old boss
 
2013-02-25 03:27:29 PM
Ok.  Before we pull out, we should boobytrap out gear so if the Taliban decides to loot them.  BAM!
 
2013-02-25 03:31:07 PM

Joe Blowme: Seriously? Stoning people not evil to you? Hanging people for being gay not evil to you? Treating women like property not evil to you?
/i hope you are just playing devils advocate and are not really just a retarded cultural relativist


Cultural relativist, no. I agree that is bad. I do not agree, however, that going to war with a country to impose our belief system on them because I think it is bad is any better or less evil. Any more than I think California should go to war with Kansas to impose our belief system on them.

The problem is, you're looking at one aspect of the culture--treating women like property--and not looking at the entire culture in which that aspect exists. You can't excise that element without totally revising the entire culture. For women to not be treated like property, women have to become educated, which means men ALSO have to become educated (most are not), and men and women have to have political power (most do not), and the right to own property (most do not), and many other rights that don't even exist yet in Afghanistan. You can't make social change happen at gunpoint, and you can't create rights overnight. People have to want them. But they also have to have the ability to want them.

So going over with soldiers and artillery and saying "Stop being so evil!" is like going into a plantation in 1820 and telling the slaves "Stop being so oppressed!" They'd like the idea and want to try--but they'd have no way of doing so without lots of help. Your standing there with an army would not magically give them education or civil rights or the ability to know what that even meant. Or more importantly, make their masters realize that their slaves were in fact people. Only when the slaves THEMSELVES rose up and demanded rights would anyone white accept them as people. Which is why slaves were given "rights" in 1865, but nobody really bothered to acknowledge it until 1950--when blacks took them back.

So when people suffering under "evil" as you say get tired of it and fight back, THEN there is social change and political change. Until then, well, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Like eleven years in Afghanistan where women are still being treated as property and people are still being stoned to death, regardless of our presence for "good", or Iraq where they still don't have a functioning democracy, or half a dozen countries in Africa where we half-heartedly made contributions toward establishing "democratic" regimes, or Central America, or Vietnam. We're good at acknowledging what we think is evil, but nobody asks the people suffering under it what THEY think about it before we intervene.
 
2013-02-25 03:36:49 PM

Gyrfalcon: Joe Blowme: Seriously? Stoning people not evil to you? Hanging people for being gay not evil to you? Treating women like property not evil to you?
/i hope you are just playing devils advocate and are not really just a retarded cultural relativist

Cultural relativist, no. I agree that is bad. I do not agree, however, that going to war with a country to impose our belief system on them because I think it is bad is any better or less evil. Any more than I think California should go to war with Kansas to impose our belief system on them.

The problem is, you're looking at one aspect of the culture--treating women like property--and not looking at the entire culture in which that aspect exists. You can't excise that element without totally revising the entire culture. For women to not be treated like property, women have to become educated, which means men ALSO have to become educated (most are not), and men and women have to have political power (most do not), and the right to own property (most do not), and many other rights that don't even exist yet in Afghanistan. You can't make social change happen at gunpoint, and you can't create rights overnight. People have to want them. But they also have to have the ability to want them.

So going over with soldiers and artillery and saying "Stop being so evil!" is like going into a plantation in 1820 and telling the slaves "Stop being so oppressed!" They'd like the idea and want to try--but they'd have no way of doing so without lots of help. Your standing there with an army would not magically give them education or civil rights or the ability to know what that even meant. Or more importantly, make their masters realize that their slaves were in fact people. Only when the slaves THEMSELVES rose up and demanded rights would anyone white accept them as people. Which is why slaves were given "rights" in 1865, but nobody really bothered to acknowledge it until 1950--when blacks took them back.

So when people suffering under "e ...


That's all fine and good, when the culture doesn't decide to become a haven for militant sociopaths that have delusions that they can become the next world power.  And act on it.
 
2013-02-25 03:50:39 PM
I would hate to think Obama is keeping all the wars going just so the unemployment figures don't rise.
 
2013-02-25 03:50:45 PM
fark Kraazi!
 
2013-02-25 03:52:16 PM

martid4: fark Kraazi!


Is that like Rock Nazi?
 
2013-02-25 03:54:32 PM

Marine1: If the US wanted to, we could make war so terrible that the Afghans would get sick of it. We did it with the Confederates, we did it with the Germans, and we could do it here. It's just not pretty to do so.


Not so sure about those. The Germans required the use of Soviets and that gummed up the place so bad we were stuck there for another 50 years. Meanwhile, the Confederates are still pissed about the Civil War and that was 150 years ago.
 
2013-02-25 03:55:08 PM

Tumunga: homelessdude: Tumunga: Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.
That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.
No, the libtards in charge are laughing every time a conservative troll comes up with some half-baked conspiracy theory in a vain attempt to lessen their butt-hurt over losing the election.
Hey...your daddy is calling......
[i.imgur.com image 163x218]
FarkLibtards trying to twist theories around to hide their white-knighting of the BBC in charge will not help then get their chins lubed.



heh heh .....is that the best you can do?
 
2013-02-25 04:11:59 PM

Igor Jakovsky: Ron Paul has been saying that for years now.


You still think a career Republican politician is something other than a career Republican politician?

How adorable!
 
2013-02-25 04:17:35 PM

BullBearMS: PunGent: Mostly agree. My only quibble is the "success" of the Iraq surge...which was coupled with massive payoffs to the locals not to shoot at our guys.

It's the same strategy we've been trying in Afghanistan for years now.

[dl.dropbox.com image 719x520]

/What pallets of cash look like


Pallets of cash? LOL, idiots; they should have asked for something valuable.
 
2013-02-25 04:24:48 PM

AngryJailhouseFistfark: Marine1: If the US wanted to, we could make war so terrible that the Afghans would get sick of it. We did it with the Confederates, we did it with the Germans, and we could do it here. It's just not pretty to do so.

Not so sure about those. The Germans required the use of Soviets and that gummed up the place so bad we were stuck there for another 50 years. Meanwhile, the Confederates are still pissed about the Civil War and that was 150 years ago.


The difference there is that there really aren't many "Confederates" today contrary to popular belief. People proud to be in the South sure, Confederates? Not so much.

A more apropos example would be Japan during WWII and the outcome of that bloody affair and final use of nuclear weapons. Can all wars be resolved in that manner? No probably not, but wars also can't be won when you have to go through multiple committees to get missions approved and have to farking document everything and take regular enlisted Army on SpecOps missions so they can testify that everything was carried out properly. When your enemy uses the rules of engagement against you and you play by the rules while they do not, you are at a distinct disadvantage. What we are in however isn't really a war but a half-assed attempt at World Policing.
 
2013-02-25 04:59:33 PM

AngryJailhouseFistfark: Marine1: If the US wanted to, we could make war so terrible that the Afghans would get sick of it. We did it with the Confederates, we did it with the Germans, and we could do it here. It's just not pretty to do so.

Not so sure about those. The Germans required the use of Soviets and that gummed up the place so bad we were stuck there for another 50 years. Meanwhile, the Confederates are still pissed about the Civil War and that was 150 years ago.


It was enough to get them to stop shooting.
 
2013-02-25 04:59:45 PM

PunGent: Rapmaster2000: gshepnyc:

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.

I worked with a guy who claimed he was called baby-killer upon his return from Vietnam.  Later, I learned that he never went to Vietnam.

Apparently, we sent a half-million scared little girls to Vietnam, given all the "hippies spit on me when I got home" stories, coupled with the complete absence of "returning vet beats crap out of spitting hippy" tales...

Fun fact:  the only people caught on TV actually spitting on veterans in that era?

Young Republicans, spitting on antiwar veteran protestors.


Ha, you've never met my dad, he had plenty of hippies spit on him...and then later spit out their broken teeth.

Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen.
 
2013-02-25 05:10:45 PM

Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.


Unfortunately we caused much of the destabilization and chaos to let the Taliban flourish.

I fear for the Afghani citizen who's caught in the middle. There was a time where it looked like women could go back to school and regain some control over their lives. Now, I fear the worst for them.

Here's an NBC Nightly News piece they did on my late friend Rosemary Stasek who fought for the women of Afghanistan when few others would. She was diagnosed with MS and had a fatal heart attack walking down the street in Kabul. Here's a interview series on her.

Not enough people see this side of the conflict -- that there are humans there caught in the crossfire and when the US leaves, it will most likely implode. We like to say we stand up to ethnic violence but here we go -- allowing the worst to happen when we could have done much better.

She worked herself to death trying to fix this little corner of the world.

Damn it.
 
2013-02-25 05:21:55 PM

lohphat: Grand_Moff_Joseph: I say we oblige him.  We've wasted far too much money and blood there as it is.

Unfortunately we caused much of the destabilization and chaos to let the Taliban flourish.

I fear for the Afghani citizen who's caught in the middle. There was a time where it looked like women could go back to school and regain some control over their lives. Now, I fear the worst for them.

Here's an NBC Nightly News piece they did on my late friend Rosemary Stasek who fought for the women of Afghanistan when few others would. She was diagnosed with MS and had a fatal heart attack walking down the street in Kabul. Here's a interview series on her.

Not enough people see this side of the conflict -- that there are humans there caught in the crossfire and when the US leaves, it will most likely implode. We like to say we stand up to ethnic violence but here we go -- allowing the worst to happen when we could have done much better.

She worked herself to death trying to fix this little corner of the world.

Damn it.


We didn't cause most of the instability that let the Taliban flourish. Afghanistan has an internationally-recognized central government for the first time in decades. Elections are being held, and a police force is being formed.

The Taliban caused the instability that allows them to flourish. They bomb police stations and government buildings, making it harder for the central government to... well... govern. They assassinate anyone who doesn't want a hard-line Islamic caliphate in Afghanistan. Then, they talk the game of, "this all stops if they just leave", which we know it won't.

The US and ISAF have been remarkably patient with Afghanistan, because it doesn't make sense to let those animals run the place. It was probably a mistake to let them start a theocracy to begin with (which is what any state based on Sharia Law is), but... well... there ya go.
 
2013-02-25 05:27:02 PM

Vectron: I would hate to think Obama is keeping all the wars going just so the unemployment figures don't rise.


There aren't THAT many soldiers over there. This isn't a very plausible theory.
 
2013-02-25 05:27:09 PM

Gunslinger013: /meet the new boss
/same as the old boss


Now with Indefinite Detention and Assassination Powers!
 
2013-02-25 05:30:51 PM

Marine1: We didn't cause most of the instability that let the Taliban flourish.


True but or Vietnam-esq policy of nickel and dimeing the fight instead of a massive offensive -- no matter where it takes us including Pakistan -- is why they flourish. Our presence is needed but being sloppy and doing stupid things like too many civilian casualties isn't helping.
 
2013-02-25 05:39:09 PM
i.imgur.com

Damn you, Fartbama!  Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

Isn't your peace prize big enough???  Huuuuuuhhhhh?


You freaking people are hilarious.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 05:44:15 PM

Tor_Eckman: [i.imgur.com image 500x352]

Damn you, Fartbama!  Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

Isn't your peace prize big enough???  Huuuuuuhhhhh?


You freaking people are hilarious.


Good troll. I give it 5/10.
Too bad it is such a poor analogy.
 
2013-02-25 05:50:25 PM

gja: Tor_Eckman: [i.imgur.com image 500x352]

Damn you, Fartbama!  Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

Isn't your peace prize big enough???  Huuuuuuhhhhh?


You freaking people are hilarious.

Good troll. I give it 5/10.
Too bad it is such a poor analogy.


How is it a poor analogy?  The GOP left Obama with an impossibly broken war in a broken country and people in here are biatching because he hasn't fixed it yet.

It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 05:53:03 PM

Tor_Eckman: [i.imgur.com image 500x352]

Damn you, Fartbama!  Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

Isn't your peace prize big enough???  Huuuuuuhhhhh?


You freaking people are hilarious.


I was pressed for time and didn't write my full retort, so here it is:

That comic is a gross, and massive oversimplification of an issue involving global macro socioeconomics.
It's is a capricious and glib, shallow view of what is the truth. But, the truth takes pages to explain, and patience coupled with the desire for critical thinking.
Not usually the watermark of those who seek to easily distill such matters in to soundbites or a few panes replete with catchphrases.
 
2013-02-25 05:56:31 PM

Rapmaster2000: We could totally win this thing if we're willing to be more brutal than the Soviets.  How hard can it be?


Since there's no record of anyone having pacified Afghanistan since Alexander the Great; let's turn to alternate history. In all of fiction, the only reference I can find to Afghanistan being pacified is in "S&M" Stirling's Domination series. The Draka do this by exterminating two-thirds of the population, IIRC.

Yeah, we're not going to do that.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 05:56:47 PM

Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.


I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.
 
2013-02-25 05:58:02 PM

gja: Tor_Eckman: [i.imgur.com image 500x352]

Damn you, Fartbama!  Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

Isn't your peace prize big enough???  Huuuuuuhhhhh?


You freaking people are hilarious.

I was pressed for time and didn't write my full retort, so here it is:

That comic is a gross, and massive oversimplification of an issue involving global macro socioeconomics.
It's is a capricious and glib, shallow view of what is the truth. But, the truth takes pages to explain, and patience coupled with the desire for critical thinking.
Not usually the watermark of those who seek to easily distill such matters in to soundbites or a few panes replete with catchphrases.


If you cannot see that the cartoon accurately describes the GOP's  modus operandi over the last twenty or thirty years, you really haven't been paying much attention.
 
2013-02-25 06:01:14 PM

gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.


Your just jerking my chain now, right?
 
2013-02-25 06:04:32 PM

gja: That comic is a gross, and massive oversimplification of an issue involving global macro socioeconomics.
It's is a capricious and glib, shallow view of what is the truth. But, the truth takes pages to explain, and patience coupled with the desire for critical thinking.
Not usually the watermark of those who seek to easily distill such matters in to soundbites or a few panes replete with catchphrases.


farm9.staticflickr.com
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 06:05:14 PM

lohphat: Marine1: We didn't cause most of the instability that let the Taliban flourish.

True but or Vietnam-esq policy of nickel and dimeing the fight instead of a massive offensive -- no matter where it takes us including Pakistan -- is why they flourish. Our presence is needed but being sloppy and doing stupid things like too many civilian casualties isn't helping.


We need to leave if only to let the Afghan people simmer in their own kettle for a bit, so that they may see (after a while) what it is they have opted for.
One of a few things will happen, I posit.
1. They will realize who intolerable Taliban influenced rule is and there will be an awakening, followed by a period of unrest and perhaps an uprising of the common-folk (best case scenario). Then perhaps, with luck, and renaissance, even if only on a small scale.
2. The Taliban will cause widespread havoc and continue the slide into a socio-ecominc abyss and Afghanistan will be relegated to a somewhat lower than 3rd word country (worst case, as this will also form the basis for harboring the worst of the worst terroristically leaning groups).

I am sure there are many other nuanced and grey-lined possibilities, but given their predilection for extremist tendencies I think they will either float to the top, or sink to the bottom.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 06:12:54 PM

Abox: gja: That comic is a gross, and massive oversimplification of an issue involving global macro socioeconomics.
It's is a capricious and glib, shallow view of what is the truth. But, the truth takes pages to explain, and patience coupled with the desire for critical thinking.
Not usually the watermark of those who seek to easily distill such matters in to soundbites or a few panes replete with catchphrases.

[farm9.staticflickr.com image 476x351]


It looks funny, but I don't know the reference. Please enlighten me.
Am I being too serious? Sorry if I was harshing one's head, as it were.
But this thread needs some reality-checks. I have friends still over there in the beach-with-no-sea, and I would really love to go to dinner with them someday soon. Preferably before they end up like a few who came home via Dover w/honor guard. I am too old to keep crying, dammit.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 06:15:30 PM

Tor_Eckman: gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.

Your just jerking my chain now, right?


Wow, just....WOW. No I am not. It is not an proper word.
 
2013-02-25 06:15:56 PM
Watch the Bipolar Puppet leader dance.
 
2013-02-25 06:20:44 PM

gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.


Allow me to introduce you to another word: Neologism.
 
2013-02-25 06:23:11 PM

gja: Tor_Eckman: gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.

Your just jerking my chain now, right?

Wow, just....WOW. No I am not. It is not an proper word.


Ok, thanks.  I thought you were serious for a minute.  Carry on.
 
2013-02-25 06:23:34 PM

gja: lohphat: Marine1: We didn't cause most of the instability that let the Taliban flourish.

True but or Vietnam-esq policy of nickel and dimeing the fight instead of a massive offensive -- no matter where it takes us including Pakistan -- is why they flourish. Our presence is needed but being sloppy and doing stupid things like too many civilian casualties isn't helping.

We need to leave if only to let the Afghan people simmer in their own kettle for a bit, so that they may see (after a while) what it is they have opted for.
One of a few things will happen, I posit.
1. They will realize who intolerable Taliban influenced rule is and there will be an awakening, followed by a period of unrest and perhaps an uprising of the common-folk (best case scenario). Then perhaps, with luck, and renaissance, even if only on a small scale.
2. The Taliban will cause widespread havoc and continue the slide into a socio-ecominc abyss and Afghanistan will be relegated to a somewhat lower than 3rd word country (worst case, as this will also form the basis for harboring the worst of the worst terroristically leaning groups).

I am sure there are many other nuanced and grey-lined possibilities, but given their predilection for extremist tendencies I think they will either float to the top, or sink to the bottom.


There will be no uprising against the Taliban who are far more out gunned. There will only be subjugation and slaughter of civilians.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 06:26:27 PM

lohphat: gja: lohphat: Marine1: We didn't cause most of the instability that let the Taliban flourish.

True but or Vietnam-esq policy of nickel and dimeing the fight instead of a massive offensive -- no matter where it takes us including Pakistan -- is why they flourish. Our presence is needed but being sloppy and doing stupid things like too many civilian casualties isn't helping.

We need to leave if only to let the Afghan people simmer in their own kettle for a bit, so that they may see (after a while) what it is they have opted for.
One of a few things will happen, I posit.
1. They will realize who intolerable Taliban influenced rule is and there will be an awakening, followed by a period of unrest and perhaps an uprising of the common-folk (best case scenario). Then perhaps, with luck, and renaissance, even if only on a small scale.
2. The Taliban will cause widespread havoc and continue the slide into a socio-ecominc abyss and Afghanistan will be relegated to a somewhat lower than 3rd word country (worst case, as this will also form the basis for harboring the worst of the worst terroristically leaning groups).

I am sure there are many other nuanced and grey-lined possibilities, but given their predilection for extremist tendencies I think they will either float to the top, or sink to the bottom.

There will be no uprising against the Taliban who are far more out gunned. There will only be subjugation and slaughter of civilians.


THAT is precisely what I fear will happen.
For myself, I cannot suffer a person who feels it is acceptable to treat another as property. It is anathema to my very soul, and one of the few things that will make me lose my religion in a most horrific manner.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 06:30:43 PM

timujin: gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.

Allow me to introduce you to another word: Neologism.


That word at least (and I use that as a very loose metric) appears in the MW dictionary. So it is, if barely, accepted for use in a serious discussion.

If I come on too strong it is because this thread cuts so very close to my heart. I want my friends back and whole in body (if not in spirit, since there are things they have suffered there which shall never leave them, and that is as it SHOULD be, war is HELL, so that we may not wish to loiter in it unaware of its' consequences).
 
2013-02-25 06:37:58 PM

Parthenogenetic: Also, did you know that Col. Oliver North was grilled by a Senate committee packed with liberals and was soundly criticized for buying a $60,000 home security system?


So you're defending a drug running war criminal, and I can be pretty sure you're full of shiat because you think we had a significant amount of liberals on the national political level in the 90s or any time recently.
 
2013-02-25 06:38:37 PM

Tor_Eckman: [i.imgur.com image 500x352]

Damn you, Fartbama!  Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

Isn't your peace prize big enough???  Huuuuuuhhhhh?


You freaking people are hilarious.


Umm....Iraq was the one with.....oh never mind.
 
2013-02-25 06:39:40 PM

gja: That word at least (and I use that as a very loose metric) appears in the MW dictionary. So it is, if barely, accepted for use in a serious discussion.


From Merriam-Webster online:
cromulentThe word you've entered isn't in the dictionary. Click on a spelling suggestion below or try again using the search bar above.

The point is, new words are created all the time, that's part of the beauty of the English language.  If they are accepted by society at large and come into common usage, they are accepted into the lexicon.  Copacetic, for example.  Just because cromulent was created for a cartoon, doesn't make it any less of a neologism.  In fifty years, it will be part of the vernacular and most people probably won't even remember where it came from.
 
2013-02-25 06:40:15 PM

ACallForPeace: Parthenogenetic: Also, did you know that Col. Oliver North was grilled by a Senate committee packed with liberals and was soundly criticized for buying a $60,000 home security system?

So you're defending a drug running war criminal, and I can be pretty sure you're full of shiat because you think we had a significant amount of liberals on the national political level in the 90s or any time recently.


I uh... I'm not a specialist on political matters... but uh... Isn't Obama as liberal of an electable politician as you'll find in the US?
 
2013-02-25 06:42:46 PM

Marine1: "as liberal of an electable politician

" doesn't mean liberal
 
2013-02-25 06:45:01 PM

Marine1: ACallForPeace: Parthenogenetic: Also, did you know that Col. Oliver North was grilled by a Senate committee packed with liberals and was soundly criticized for buying a $60,000 home security system?

So you're defending a drug running war criminal, and I can be pretty sure you're full of shiat because you think we had a significant amount of liberals on the national political level in the 90s or any time recently.

I uh... I'm not a specialist on political matters... but uh... Isn't Obama as liberal of an electable politician as you'll find in the US?


He might be.  Put the current political climate has only allowed him to actually push a very few actual liberal ideas.  The repeal of don't ask/don't tell for example.  But anything that isn't pretty far right of center couldn't have passed through congress during his first term, and unless there is a seismic change in the makeup of congress in 2014, his second term will be similar.
 
2013-02-25 06:55:29 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-25 07:37:11 PM
Special Forces to Karzai:  STFU, EABOD and DIAF.
 
2013-02-25 07:38:52 PM
kazaa to US special forces:  STOP DOWNLOADING OUR shiat
 
2013-02-25 07:45:59 PM

gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.




They need to embiggen those dictionaries then.
 
2013-02-25 07:47:16 PM

advex101: Would it be asking too much for the article to tell us which province they are talking about?




Why, do you have a map, such as?

www.metapedia.com
 
2013-02-25 07:49:00 PM

timujin: Marine1: "as liberal of an electable politician" doesn't mean liberal


Obama isn't liberal? You're seeing a whole team of shrinks, aren't you?
 
2013-02-25 07:56:05 PM

Parthenogenetic: Marine1: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Marine1: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Remind me again why the fark we went there in the first place?

A terrorist network based in Afghanistan trained a number of Arabs to carry out successful attacks on the United States on Sept. 11th, 2001. The terrorist group, Al Queda, was a known and tolerated guest of the Taliban, which controlled the country at the time after a civil war that raged when the Soviets withdrew.

That's the Reader's Digest version.

Oh, well that certainly seems worth 2000+ dead, 50K injured American kids and a trillion dollars.

It's not as if we could have just bombed the shiat out of those training camps from the air.

We did that in, what, 1998? That sure didn't do anything about 9-11.

That's because instead of going after bin Laden, Clinton bombed an aspirin factory to distract America from the Lewinsky scandal.

Did you also not know that Sudan offered to hand bin Laden over to the USA on a silver platter in 1996, but Clinton refused because there "wasn't enough evidence to arrest him"?

Also, did you know that Col. Oliver North was grilled by a Senate committee packed with liberals and was soundly criticized for buying a $60,000 home security system? Ollie said he needed it to protect his family from the world's most dangerous terrorist... Osama bin Laden.  The senator in charge of the committee openly mocked Col. North and called him a pussy for being afraid of somebody that nobody had ever heard of, and would never pose a real threat to America.  That senator was none other than Al Gore.

If you don't believe me, kindly provide your email address and I will re-forward the emails containing all of the relevant information, which I have saved in my AOL email account.


Classic....the aol account really tied it together!
 
2013-02-25 07:59:14 PM
We should pull out, launch an investigation led my Afghan officials with US oversight, and punish any criminal act in accordance with US law.
 
2013-02-25 08:09:55 PM

Lt. Cheese Weasel: timujin: Marine1: "as liberal of an electable politician" doesn't mean liberal

Obama isn't liberal? You're seeing a whole team of shrinks, aren't you?


Obama's policies are center-right, most of the stuff he does is the same as Reagan.  The thing is, the right has moved so far right that he looks like he's on the left of the political spectrum
 
2013-02-25 08:14:23 PM

Lt. Cheese Weasel: timujin: Marine1: "as liberal of an electable politician" doesn't mean liberal

Obama isn't liberal? You're seeing a whole team of shrinks, aren't you?


When you're so far off to the right side of the scale, centrists seem liberal.

This country has not really seen a liberal progressive since FDR.
 
2013-02-25 08:33:16 PM
Karzai = USA's goat boy
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 08:45:23 PM

Repo Man: gja: Tor_Eckman: It's a perfectly cromulent analogy.

I hope you know that word is merely slang and not in any accepted dictionary. There is no proper etymology for that made-up word.

They need to embiggen those dictionaries then.


::snerk::: I laughed....thanks.
 
2013-02-25 08:47:38 PM
Well I guess we csn call thst whole sequester thing off now.
 
2013-02-25 08:55:29 PM

airsupport: But when you put a gibbering, brutal desert-dwelling primitive in power, you can't expect them to act with sophistication and intelligence.  They only understand violence, domination and greed.  Oh, and violence against women; they have a penchant for that.


www.ihatethemedia.com
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-02-25 08:56:04 PM

Dick Stallion: Karzai = USA's goat boy


Do NOT! GIS that phrase.....:::SHUDDERS:::
 
2013-02-25 10:42:18 PM

the money is in the banana stand: They don't have to have a system identical to ours, it just can't be a farked up one that is hell-bent on destroying and oppressing.


It's like you people don't even REMEMBER what the US did to Iran and has done to multiple other countries that elected pretty okay leaders who got in the way of the Divine Right of America(n businesses) to other people's stuff.

If America (and the UK) had have left Iran the fark alone instead overthrowing the democratically-elected government the entire Middle East would probably be a better place today.  That greedy, selfish, unnecessary action by America and the UK did worse damage to the last 60 years of history than any nuclear bomb could ever do.  Your government drafted convicted nazis (Zahedi, Shahrokh) to help overthrow a peaceful democratically elected government less than a decade after the end of WWII.  Just think about that next time you hear an American making a big deal about "saving the world from Nazis" and how we should all be so grateful.

So excuse me while I chuckle sadly at your naive belief that your country is happy to leave governments alone as long as they're not "hell-bent on destroying and oppressing".  Your country is rather very happy to support any number of vile oppressive dictatorships as long as they facilitate access to "stuff" they deem they have a right to. Saud, Pinochet, your buddy Saddam Hussein, Suharto, Noriega, Batista, Mubarak, Kamirov, Marcos.

What you wrote is pretty damn offensively wrong.  Quite a lot of people alive today are still suffering from the effects of your government's ongoing support for murderers and torturers.  What's sad is you probably actually believe what you wrote is true.
 
2013-02-25 11:01:25 PM

Giltric: Obama should use his time machine and send ODA 574 on a vacation.


Incredibly well played!
 
2013-02-25 11:03:08 PM

Amos Quito: Karzai had better tone it down.

If not, we could be going war in Afghanistan.


Like it makes a bit of farking difference what he says. As if our special forces need his permission, or are even currently seeking it.
 
2013-02-25 11:27:16 PM

if_i_really_have_to: the money is in the banana stand: They don't have to have a system identical to ours, it just can't be a farked up one that is hell-bent on destroying and oppressing.

It's like you people don't even REMEMBER what the US did to Iran and has done to multiple other countries that elected pretty okay leaders who got in the way of the Divine Right of America(n businesses) to other people's stuff.

If America (and the UK) had have left Iran the fark alone instead overthrowing the democratically-elected government the entire Middle East would probably be a better place today.  That greedy, selfish, unnecessary action by America and the UK did worse damage to the last 60 years of history than any nuclear bomb could ever do.  Your government drafted convicted nazis (Zahedi, Shahrokh) to help overthrow a peaceful democratically elected government less than a decade after the end of WWII.  Just think about that next time you hear an American making a big deal about "saving the world from Nazis" and how we should all be so grateful.

So excuse me while I chuckle sadly at your naive belief that your country is happy to leave governments alone as long as they're not "hell-bent on destroying and oppressing".  Your country is rather very happy to support any number of vile oppressive dictatorships as long as they facilitate access to "stuff" they deem they have a right to. Saud, Pinochet, your buddy Saddam Hussein, Suharto, Noriega, Batista, Mubarak, Kamirov, Marcos.

What you wrote is pretty damn offensively wrong.  Quite a lot of people alive today are still suffering from the effects of your government's ongoing support for murderers and torturers.  What's sad is you probably actually believe what you wrote is true.


I agree, but that doesn't help us figure out what to do about the situation now. If we leave, it could very well have all sorts of negative consequences others have mentioned. We have created a monster, yes, but it is still a monster, and it needs to be dealt with somehow.
 
2013-02-26 01:48:52 AM

BullBearMS: PunGent: Mostly agree. My only quibble is the "success" of the Iraq surge...which was coupled with massive payoffs to the locals not to shoot at our guys.

It's the same strategy we've been trying in Afghanistan for years now.

[dl.dropbox.com image 719x520]

/What pallets of cash look like


You know putting a rifle in the hands of some stooge from Ernst and Young.......well,.... he just looks like a stooge from Ernst and Young ....holding a rifle.
 
2013-02-26 03:04:19 AM

lohphat: airsupport: But when you put a gibbering, brutal desert-dwelling primitive in power, you can't expect them to act with sophistication and intelligence.  They only understand violence, domination and greed.  Oh, and violence against women; they have a penchant for that.


Yeah, Texas does have deserts.
 
2013-02-26 03:59:53 AM

if_i_really_have_to: the money is in the banana stand: They don't have to have a system identical to ours, it just can't be a farked up one that is hell-bent on destroying and oppressing.

It's like you people don't even REMEMBER what the US did to Iran and has done to multiple other countries that elected pretty okay leaders who got in the way of the Divine Right of America(n businesses) to other people's stuff.

If America (and the UK) had have left Iran the fark alone instead overthrowing the democratically-elected government the entire Middle East would probably be a better place today.  That greedy, selfish, unnecessary action by America and the UK did worse damage to the last 60 years of history than any nuclear bomb could ever do.  Your government drafted convicted nazis (Zahedi, Shahrokh) to help overthrow a peaceful democratically elected government less than a decade after the end of WWII.  Just think about that next time you hear an American making a big deal about "saving the world from Nazis" and how we should all be so grateful.

So excuse me while I chuckle sadly at your naive belief that your country is happy to leave governments alone as long as they're not "hell-bent on destroying and oppressing".  Your country is rather very happy to support any number of vile oppressive dictatorships as long as they facilitate access to "stuff" they deem they have a right to. Saud, Pinochet, your buddy Saddam Hussein, Suharto, Noriega, Batista, Mubarak, Kamirov, Marcos.

What you wrote is pretty damn offensively wrong.  Quite a lot of people alive today are still suffering from the effects of your government's ongoing support for murderers and torturers.  What's sad is you probably actually believe what you wrote is true.


What globally irrelevant country are you posting from so that we may pick apart your govenment's policy and what they may have done had they become world police in place of US and the UK?
 
2013-02-26 08:21:11 AM
encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com

Try not to get any Afghan acid-blood on you on the way out, guys.
 
2013-02-26 09:35:49 AM

MACvSOG: BullBearMS: PunGent: Mostly agree. My only quibble is the "success" of the Iraq surge...which was coupled with massive payoffs to the locals not to shoot at our guys.

It's the same strategy we've been trying in Afghanistan for years now.

[dl.dropbox.com image 719x520]

/What pallets of cash look like

You know putting a rifle in the hands of some stooge from Ernst and Young.......well,.... he just looks like a stooge from Ernst and Young ....holding a rifle.


You will respect Poindexter's authoratah.
 
2013-02-26 09:39:41 AM

Tor_Eckman: Damn you, Fartbama! Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?


By all means, let's ignore the fact that he tripled the size of the war in Afghanistan and tried to keep us in Iraq past the treaty date for total withdrawal.
 
2013-02-26 09:58:17 AM

Girion47: PunGent: Rapmaster2000: gshepnyc:

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.

I worked with a guy who claimed he was called baby-killer upon his return from Vietnam.  Later, I learned that he never went to Vietnam.

Apparently, we sent a half-million scared little girls to Vietnam, given all the "hippies spit on me when I got home" stories, coupled with the complete absence of "returning vet beats crap out of spitting hippy" tales...

Fun fact:  the only people caught on TV actually spitting on veterans in that era?

Young Republicans, spitting on antiwar veteran protestors.

Ha, you've never met my dad, he had plenty of hippies spit on him...and then later spit out their broken teeth.

Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen.


Where, and when, exactly?  The common thread to these undocumented stories is the lack of detail.
Frankly, most of it smells like dolchstoss...the same stuff that WWI German vets used to convince themselves they'd been stabbed in the back by the Jews.

Not saying there weren't specific instances...just that there's a HUGE disparity in the frequency, and only solid evidence for one party doing ANY spitting.

The interesting thing to me is that 1) these stories had a big uptick after the first Rambo movie, and 2), I'd bet a lot of the people telling them would pass a lie detector test...even though what they recount never actually happened.
 
2013-02-26 09:59:33 AM

BullBearMS: Tor_Eckman: Damn you, Fartbama! Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

By all means, let's ignore the fact that he tripled the size of the war in Afghanistan and tried to keep us in Iraq past the treaty date for total withdrawal.


Yes, how dare he try to fix the enormous screwups of the Bush era.
 
2013-02-26 10:24:27 AM

PunGent: BullBearMS: Tor_Eckman: Damn you, Fartbama! Why come you no fix the country that we invaded and then forgot about for a few years while we invaded a country that some guy told us had WMDs already?

By all means, let's ignore the fact that he tripled the size of the war in Afghanistan and tried to keep us in Iraq past the treaty date for total withdrawal.

Yes, how dare he try to fix the enormous screwups of the Bush era.


By expanding and extending them?

We've been occupying Afghanistan for well over a decade now. We haven't fixed shiat.
 
2013-02-26 11:34:37 AM

Girion47: PunGent: Rapmaster2000: gshepnyc:

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.

I worked with a guy who claimed he was called baby-killer upon his return from Vietnam.  Later, I learned that he never went to Vietnam.

Apparently, we sent a half-million scared little girls to Vietnam, given all the "hippies spit on me when I got home" stories, coupled with the complete absence of "returning vet beats crap out of spitting hippy" tales...

Fun fact:  the only people caught on TV actually spitting on veterans in that era?

Young Republicans, spitting on antiwar veteran protestors.

Ha, you've never met my dad, he had plenty of hippies spit on him...and then later spit out their broken teeth.

Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen.


Hippies did that. My Dad's friend's SISTER told him that when he got called up for the draft at 18.

Imagine being in the army during Vietnam with the last name "McNamara" like my Dad. Made everything awkward.

/Hates learning about the Vietnam war in school
//Everyone stares at me
 
2013-02-26 01:40:07 PM

PunGent: Girion47: PunGent: Rapmaster2000: gshepnyc:

/and I do not for a minute believe you were ever called "a baby killer." That's like UFO abductees always managing to describe their UFO encounters exactly the way one appeared in a movie they saw once.

I worked with a guy who claimed he was called baby-killer upon his return from Vietnam.  Later, I learned that he never went to Vietnam.

Apparently, we sent a half-million scared little girls to Vietnam, given all the "hippies spit on me when I got home" stories, coupled with the complete absence of "returning vet beats crap out of spitting hippy" tales...

Fun fact:  the only people caught on TV actually spitting on veterans in that era?

Young Republicans, spitting on antiwar veteran protestors.

Ha, you've never met my dad, he had plenty of hippies spit on him...and then later spit out their broken teeth.

Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Where, and when, exactly?  The common thread to these undocumented stories is the lack of detail.
Frankly, most of it smells like dolchstoss...the same stuff that WWI German vets used to convince themselves they'd been stabbed in the back by the Jews.

Not saying there weren't specific instances...just that there's a HUGE disparity in the frequency, and only solid evidence for one party doing ANY spitting.

The interesting thing to me is that 1) these stories had a big uptick after the first Rambo movie, and 2), I'd bet a lot of the people telling them would pass a lie detector test...even though what they recount never actually happened.


early 70's, Louisville KY, mostly at the GE plant and then in the J-town region of town, that's about as specific as I can get as I wasn't born then and he isn't particularly happy to talk about those situations.

You know what?  fark you, these people risked their lives, got blown the fark up and abused by their peers upon their return to the U.S. and for you to question that is worse than the people that did the actual spitting, so why don't you go shove your pampered life up your ass.
 
2013-02-26 02:39:02 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_-TBirrPiQ

/no hate like entitled snowflake hate
 
2013-02-26 03:41:42 PM

homelessdude: Tumunga: homelessdude: Tumunga: Yogimus: Look, either murder the lot of them, or leave them alone. No more of this half assing.
That would work, but I think the Libtards in charge are trying to figure out how to provide the Afghans amnesty so they will vote Democrat.
No, the libtards in charge are laughing every time a conservative troll comes up with some half-baked conspiracy theory in a vain attempt to lessen their butt-hurt over losing the election.
Hey...your daddy is calling......
[i.imgur.com image 163x218]
FarkLibtards trying to twist theories around to hide their white-knighting of the BBC in charge will not help then get their chins lubed.


heh heh .....is that the best you can do?


Yep.
 
2013-02-26 07:14:58 PM

johnny_vegas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_-TBirrPiQ

/no hate like entitled snowflake hate


As opposed to conservatives booing a gay active-duty military member?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuqFkbLkST4
 
2013-02-26 11:52:38 PM
A persistent criticism leveled against those who protested the United States's involvement in the Vietnam War is that protesters spat upon and otherwise derided returning soldiers, calling them "baby-killers", etc. Lembcke says he found no evidence to suggest this ever happened and suggests it may have come in part from the common chant by protesters aimed at President Lyndon Baines Johnson, "Hey, hey, LBJ, how many kids did you kill today?" One of the hallmarks of the period's anti-war movement was its stated support for the troops in the field and the affiliation of many returning veterans with it. At the time he wrote The Spitting Image he had not found a single media report to support the claims of spitting. He theorizes that the reported "spitting on soldiers" scenario was a mythical projection by those who felt "spat upon" and was meant to discredit future anti-war activism. He suggests that the images of pro-war antipathy against anti-war protesters helped contribute to the myth. Lembcke argues that memories of being verbally and physically assaulted by anti-war protesters were largely conjured, arguing that not even one case could be documented.

However, some news accounts that mention spitting do exist, although there has been no evidence to support those accounts. After a review of contemporary news sources, Northwestern Law School professor James Lindgren claimed to have found news accounts that discussed spitting incidents. Lembcke provided an 18-point response to Lindgren at http://www.slate.com/id/2159470/sidebar/2159648/ expressing interest in one of Lindgren's claims. A December 27, 1971 CBS Evening News report on veteran Delmar Pickett who said he was spat at in Seattle appears to also have some validity as a claim, but not as evidence that the incident reported actually happened.[2][3]

Covering this same topic is author and columnist Bob Greene's 1989 book Homecoming in which Greene prints several letters he had solicited from veterans, asking to hear from them if they had been spat upon and focuses on firsthand accounts of their treatment.[4] Greene's book includes 63 accounts involving spitting, and 69 accounts from veterans that did not believe anyone was spat upon after returning from Vietnam. Like Lembke, Greene questions whether the spitting stories even made sense, noting "Even during the most fervent days of anti-war protest, it seemed that it was not the soldiers whom protesters were maligning. It was the leaders of government, and the top generals-at least, that is how it seemed in memory. One of the most popular chants during the anti-war marches was, "Stop the war in Vietnam, bring the boys home." You heard that at every peace rally in America. "Bring the boys home." That was the message. Also, when one thought realistically about the image of what was supposed to have happened, it seemed questionable. So-called "hippies," no matter what else one may have felt about them, were not the most macho people in the world. Picture a burly member of the Green Berets, in full uniform, walking through an airport. Now think of a "hippie" crossing his path. Would the hippie have the nerve to spit on the soldier? And if the hippie did, would the soldier-fresh from facing enemy troops in the jungles of Vietnam-just stand there and take it?" While Greene admits he couldn't validate the authenticity of the accounts in the letters he received, he did believe spitting occurred, stating,"There were simply too many letters, going into too fine a detail, to deny the fact." Greene concluded, "I think you will agree, after reading the letters, that even if several should prove to be not what they appear to be, that does not detract from the overall story that is being told."[5] Lembke claims that some of the stories that Green published "have elements of such exaggeration that one has to question the veracity of the entire account." He also points out that there were several newspaper accounts of pro-war demonstrators spitting on anti-war demonstrators and suggests that these accounts may have been reinterpreted over the years.[6] In The Spitting Image Lembcke acknowledges that he cannot prove the negative-that no Vietnam veteran was spat on-saying (p. 68) it is hard to imagine there not being expressions of hostility between veterans and activists.

The Spitting Image asserts that the claims of abuse of soldiers by antiwar demonstrators became ingrained in the American consciousness only some years after the war had come to a close; Lembcke attributes the legend's growth to films relating to Vietnam, notably Rambo. He writes that these claims were used by President George H. W. Bush as a way to help sell the Gulf War to the American people. Lembcke believes that the myth is currently useful in promoting the yellow ribbon campaign; it has led some to think that for one to support troops, one must also support the war, because it ties together the ideas of anti-war sentiment and anti-troop sentiment, although a common chant has been "Support the Troops: Bring them Home!"


The Spitting Image
 
2013-02-27 12:24:55 AM

lohphat: johnny_vegas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_-TBirrPiQ

/no hate like entitled snowflake hate

As opposed to conservatives booing a gay active-duty military member?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuqFkbLkST4


but thats not what the discussion was about.  My post was relevant to the previous posts, i do not think you can honestly say the same...unless you agree with the protestors and their actions of course, which is fine.
 
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