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(Reason Magazine)   Dear Media: Stop mixing up "Preppers" with "Survivalists" we are two very different groups. One group prepares in case of the worst and are sane people and the other are survivalist gun nuts   (reason.com) divider line 408
    More: Obvious, Jesse Walker, Rick Perlstein, morally superior, shooting sports, Wal, political action, Thomas Hobbes, Sandy Hook  
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6813 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Feb 2013 at 5:39 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-22 03:59:13 PM
They all said I was crazy! I'm not crazy! THEY'RE the ones who are crazy! I'll show them! I'll show them all! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAA!
 
2013-02-22 04:02:15 PM
Preppers are narcissistic idiots.

/and no, I don't mean you, guy who has a few extra cans of food and some batteries. relax.
 
2013-02-22 04:24:54 PM

JerseyTim: Preppers are narcissistic idiots.

/and no, I don't mean you, guy who has a few extra cans of food and some batteries. relax.



Batteries are for paranoid loons, all I need is some duck tape.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duct_tape_alert
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-22 04:25:34 PM
That's funny.  As though people didn't know that "Prepper" is just the new politically correct term for survivalist that people started using when survivalists got a reputation for being crazy and shooting people.

Now that people realize that Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?
 
2013-02-22 04:28:44 PM

vpb: Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?


Disastrousts?
 
2013-02-22 04:33:41 PM
What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?
 
2013-02-22 04:34:10 PM
Which is which?

sannekurz.files.wordpress.com
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-22 04:34:34 PM

Calmamity: vpb: Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?

Disastrousts?

How about Disastourists?  Apocyleptics?
 
2013-02-22 04:35:23 PM

what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?


The line is right at the point of poop bagging. Maybe a bit before that, but definitely in that neighborhood.
 
2013-02-22 04:39:30 PM
I don't even know what kind of batteries my flashlight uses. I can't tie a knot. My idea of camping is a private villa in the Caribbean. I panic if I run low on American Spirits.

I am SO farked in the pocky lips.
 
2013-02-22 04:40:55 PM
media-2.web.britannica.com

let god sort 'em out.
 
2013-02-22 04:41:27 PM

what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?


The first one is my mother, and she is far from a survivalist. Her brother is one though.
 
2013-02-22 04:44:24 PM

what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?


It's the difference between preparing for a sudden, but manageable disaster (fire, tornado, flood, etc.) and preparing for the chaotic collapse of civilization.
 
2013-02-22 04:45:10 PM
I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.
 
2013-02-22 04:46:40 PM

vpb: That's funny.  As though people didn't know that "Prepper" is just the new politically correct term for survivalist that people started using when survivalists got a reputation for being crazy and shooting people.

Now that people realize that Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?


"people who buy crap at full retail"?
 
2013-02-22 04:47:21 PM

what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.


It's a fun hobby.
 
2013-02-22 04:48:34 PM
I can't wait until the apocalypse finally goes down and I don't have to go to work any more.  Then you'll all be like "Oh, that Rapmaster2000 was right and I'm stupid.  I should have listened to that handsome devil!"
 
2013-02-22 04:50:01 PM

Rapmaster2000: I can't wait until the apocalypse finally goes down and I don't have to go to work any more.  Then you'll all be like "Oh, that Rapmaster2000 was right and I'm stupid.  I should have listened to that handsome devil!"


I'm pretty sure I'll be all "braaaaaaains".
 
2013-02-22 05:02:41 PM
While it's true that they're different, a Venn diagram of these two groups would have a lot of overlap.
 
2013-02-22 05:02:49 PM

what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.


You can get takeout sushi that is good in Boston? Maybe there is something to living up there. I can barely even get sushi down here
 
2013-02-22 05:03:42 PM

GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can get takeout sushi that is good in Boston? Maybe there is something to living up there. I can barely even get sushi down here


You're wondering if New England has seafood? Really?
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-22 05:06:42 PM

MisterTweak: vpb: That's funny.  As though people didn't know that "Prepper" is just the new politically correct term for survivalist that people started using when survivalists got a reputation for being crazy and shooting people.

Now that people realize that Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?

"people who buy crap at full retail inflated prices"?


FTFY.
 
2013-02-22 05:08:05 PM

what_now: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can get takeout sushi that is good in Boston? Maybe there is something to living up there. I can barely even get sushi down here

You're wondering if New England has seafood? Really?


Lobster and chowder are a completely different thing than good sushi.
 
2013-02-22 05:14:39 PM

what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.


I work with a prepper. He's an alright guy.

However, while it's good that he has a lot of supplies, his biggest impediment in a disaster is clearly going to be his weight.  It's going to be hard to evade back the rampaging zombie horde when you're defeated by a flight of stairs.
 
2013-02-22 05:15:47 PM
i1.kym-cdn.com

?
 
2013-02-22 05:42:48 PM
Rural people with lots of supplies and insufficient weaponry?    Nice... we needs lots more of them for the rest of us to survive.
 
2013-02-22 05:43:41 PM

vpb: That's funny.  As though people didn't know that "Prepper" is just the new politically correct term for survivalist that people started using when survivalists got a reputation for being crazy and shooting people.

Now that people realize that Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?


*checks dictionary*

Still plenty of room under "Retards"
 
2013-02-22 05:43:56 PM
Peppers and survivalists?
 
2013-02-22 05:44:00 PM

xanadian: [i1.kym-cdn.com image 400x371]

?


Now there's something I haven't thought about in a long time.
 
2013-02-22 05:44:02 PM
Me and your Mom,
We've been noticing lately you've been having a lot of problems,
And you've been going off for no reason.
And we're afraid you're gonna hurt somebody,
We're afraid you're gonna hurt yourself.
So we decided that it would be in your best interest
If we put you somewhere
Where you could get the help that you need.
 
2013-02-22 05:45:21 PM

GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.


FTFY.
 
2013-02-22 05:45:46 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?

It's the difference between preparing for a sudden, but manageable disaster (fire, tornado, flood, etc.) and preparing for the chaotic collapse of civilization.


This. I'm fairly well set for dealing with floods or snowstorms, or whatever that might leave me without power for a week or two. Beyond that might be a problem, but I'm not too concerned about it happening.
 
2013-02-22 05:46:08 PM
i47.tinypic.com
 
2013-02-22 05:46:08 PM

red5ish: Me and your Mom,
We've been noticing lately you've been having a lot of problems,
And you've been going off for no reason.
And we're afraid you're gonna hurt somebody,
We're afraid you're gonna hurt yourself.
So we decided that it would be in your best interest
If we put you somewhere
Where you could get the help that you need.


But all I want is a Pepsi, just one Pepsi!


/Pepsists?
 
2013-02-22 05:46:15 PM
I don't think it's strange that people prepare for the endtimes.


I do think its strange that people pray for the endtimes.
 
2013-02-22 05:46:55 PM
Sure, "Preppers" realize that even with weeks of anarchy, violence, and starvation, the police will always be there to protect them.
 
2013-02-22 05:47:29 PM

what_now: or the bar ran out of bitters


What are you trying to do, frighten us?
 
2013-02-22 05:47:48 PM
New word to learn, Preppers, Fark is an educational experience.
 
2013-02-22 05:48:53 PM

gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.


I'm pretty sure that a guy in Tennessee with a Chinese screen name isn't my go-to authority on sushi.

(There is plenty of excellent gourmet sushi take out in Vancouver and San Fran)
 
2013-02-22 05:48:57 PM

Rapmaster2000: work with a prepper. He's an alright guy.

However, while it's good that he has a lot of supplies, his biggest impediment in a disaster is clearly going to be his weight. It's going to be hard to evade back the rampaging zombie horde when you're defeated by a flight of stairs.


Sounds like this guy.
 
2013-02-22 05:49:50 PM

vernonFL: I don't even know what kind of batteries my flashlight uses. I can't tie a knot. My idea of camping is a private villa in the Caribbean. I panic if I run low on American Spirits.

I am SO farked in the pocky lips.


Barack?
 
2013-02-22 05:50:08 PM
The only supplies I'll need for the Pokky Clipse is a hockey mask and a Smith & Wesson Model 29.

images.wikia.com

Oh! And a sweet mobile PA system as well.
 
2013-02-22 05:50:11 PM
potayto, potahto
 
2013-02-22 05:50:23 PM
A guy I used to work with was a prepper.  He also bought into Facebook right when its IPO came out (i.e. before the nose dive in its stock price).  He was convinced that Facebook was going to make him rich.

So...yeah...it is not hard for me to believe that preppers are crazy and stupid.
 
2013-02-22 05:51:34 PM

Whatthefark: Rapmaster2000: work with a prepper. He's an alright guy.

However, while it's good that he has a lot of supplies, his biggest impediment in a disaster is clearly going to be his weight. It's going to be hard to evade back the rampaging zombie horde when you're defeated by a flight of stairs.

Sounds like this guy.


I swear there is some sort of corralation between how crazy the "Prepper" is and how much they weigh.
 
2013-02-22 05:51:54 PM
This is even worse than when people got "furries" mixed up with "weirdos wearing fuzzy animal suits with dickholes in them."
 
2013-02-22 05:52:08 PM

gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.



Nice, a sushi expert from Tennessee.  You are hilariously wrong.
 
2013-02-22 05:52:25 PM
When I say there's no crazy in the doomsday prepper crowd I mean there's a bit.
 
2013-02-22 05:52:45 PM
Whats wrong with planning for you in yours for the case of extreme emergency? How is that crazy?

Having said that there is a limit. I would say if you prepare for more than a month of social breakdown than your wasting your money. And if your really keen on being a survivor, just become a farmer.
 
2013-02-22 05:52:58 PM
Survivalists - keeping a few weeks of supplies in case of a major disaster.

Prepper - keeping supplies / extra guns because the LIBERALS are going to cause mass riots in order to breakdown society so the UN can take over.

I know a lot of people who think they're the former while openly bragging about being the latter.
 
2013-02-22 05:53:55 PM
1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-22 05:54:09 PM
Survivalists are the sane ones. Preppers are prepping and hoping for the end of the world. Survivalists are just practicing survival skills in case they ever need 'em.
 
2013-02-22 05:54:18 PM

Rapmaster2000: I can't wait until the apocalypse finally goes down and I don't have to go to work any more.  Then you'll all be like "Oh, that Rapmaster2000 was right and I'm stupid.  I should have listened to that handsome devil!"


Since you plan on surviving, feel free to use my corpse for food/tools/sex toys. It'll make dying a lot more comforting knowing that a Farker is getting first dibs.
 
2013-02-22 05:54:53 PM

JerseyTim: Preppers are narcissistic idiots.

/and no, I don't mean you, guy who has a few extra cans of food and some batteries. relax.


... and a week's worth of horse-cack tranny porn.
/Or so I've been told
 
2013-02-22 05:55:19 PM
I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.
 
2013-02-22 05:56:12 PM

vpb: That's funny.  As though people didn't know that "Prepper" is just the new politically correct term for survivalist that people started using when survivalists got a reputation for being crazy and shooting people.

Now that people realize that Preppers are just survivalists I wonder what new name they will come up with?


"The sane ones."
 
2013-02-22 05:56:41 PM
Still working on surviving having their feelings hurt, apparently.
 
2013-02-22 05:58:00 PM
Damn you forever, Nathan Holn!
 
2013-02-22 05:58:03 PM
What's the overlap between these groups and Rapture/Tribulation believers?
 
2013-02-22 05:59:12 PM
Its good to have a hobby, and survivalism seems like a decent one. Lots of intedting people, usefully skills learned etc. Plus maybe one day you get to pull the most epic I told you so ever on everyone.
 
2013-02-22 05:59:15 PM
i1151.photobucket.com
Preppers/survivalists - whatever, Dad. I think "sh*t-burgers insane" covers both.

You won't be so smug when those Lutherans break through the door, smart-ass!
 
2013-02-22 06:01:08 PM

titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.


This.  I've got a couple 30-gallon plastic water barrels in the crawlspace too.  Small generator with gas, some camping food, extra batteries, etc.

I don't think The Big One will fark Los Anglees up for several weeks, but I do think it could.
 
2013-02-22 06:01:19 PM

Ow! That was my feelings!: gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.


Nice, a sushi expert from Tennessee.  You are hilariously wrong.


Well, technically, it would still be sushi.  You can get that at the supermarket in little plastic boxes, too.  But Sushi involves sitting at a sushi bar and interacting with a sushi chef who lives his art and knows what you want before you do.  I don't know how Boston  or Tennessee fare, and I wouldn't assume that there's no great sushi joints there, but "take-out sushi" sounds kind of counterproductive.

/Los Angeles.
 
2013-02-22 06:02:34 PM

Flappyhead: Whatthefark: Rapmaster2000: work with a prepper. He's an alright guy.

However, while it's good that he has a lot of supplies, his biggest impediment in a disaster is clearly going to be his weight. It's going to be hard to evade back the rampaging zombie horde when you're defeated by a flight of stairs.

Sounds like this guy.

I swear there is some sort of corralation between how crazy the "Prepper" is and how much they weigh.


Check out his YouTube channel. There is some weapons grade paranoia going on with this guy. Still, he would be a god guy to have around when you need some Walker Bait.
 
2013-02-22 06:03:07 PM
What's the point? Something bad is going to happen anyway. Going to be shot dead or robbed or....
 
2013-02-22 06:03:12 PM

vernonFL: I don't even know what kind of batteries my flashlight uses. I can't tie a knot. My idea of camping is a private villa in the Caribbean. I panic if I run low on American Spirits.

I am SO farked in the pocky lips.


If I didn't know better, I'd think you were my wife's alt.
 
2013-02-22 06:03:58 PM
Our Attorney General wants the citizenry disarmed so badly that he smuggled weapons to Mexican drug cartels and tried to blame it on us. Our President is a former Constitutional law professor who is able to rationalize assassinating citizens abroad. Even small-town police departments are militarizing. Homeland Security just bought 1.6 BILLION rounds of ammunition. Emails and phone calls are being monitored. Warrantless searches are common. The legal mechanisms are in place for indefinite detentions without trials. Anticipating a ban, people are buying "assault weapons" as fast as they can be manufactured. They aren't buying them because they're going to turn them in. Part of me says, "It can't happen here". Another part of me says, "If I were seeing this in another country, I'd say both sides were preparing for civil war". I used to wonder if I was just being paranoid. Now I think that anyone who can't see a gathering storm is willfully blind. Being prepared can't hurt, and it's cheap insurance.
 
2013-02-22 06:04:14 PM

what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.


man, that is funny.  btw, you just described half of Montana.
 
2013-02-22 06:04:15 PM
Yeah, it's real important to me that I not get fools and idiots mixed up.
 
2013-02-22 06:05:52 PM

gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.


farm3.staticflickr.com

HUH?
 
2013-02-22 06:06:56 PM
One group prepares in case of the worst and are sane people

encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com
 
2013-02-22 06:06:59 PM
The government hates them both. People who suffer and die in a disaster are much more politically valuable.
 
2013-02-22 06:07:14 PM

thamike: Ow! That was my feelings!: gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.


Nice, a sushi expert from Tennessee.  You are hilariously wrong.

Well, technically, it would still be sushi.  You can get that at the supermarket in little plastic boxes, too.  But Sushi involves sitting at a sushi bar and interacting with a sushi chef who lives his art and knows what you want before you do.  I don't know how Boston  or Tennessee fare, and I wouldn't assume that there's no great sushi joints there, but "take-out sushi" sounds kind of counterproductive.

/Los Angeles.



Fair point.  The counter experience can be part of the enjoyment, for sure.  But my gf and I get take out sushi occasionally due to both our work schedules not always being compatible to 2 hours of counter time.  Same fish, same prep, takes 2 mins to get home from picking it up.  Still sushi, still damn good.
 
2013-02-22 06:07:26 PM
Someone tried to explain to me why they were a prepper, to which my response was basically that either things are ok enough that the government will still be standing, or else they aren't and I don't really want to be sitting on a stockpile of food and supplies because I don't personally believe that I could or would want to shoot someone to protect that stuff. It turns out they have family that are even more prepper-centered, and they feel guilty if they weren't hoarding as well, because they don't want to mooch in the case of an emergency.

Nothing wrong with bottled water, canned goods, batteries, and a good first aid kit. Imagining obscure situations you'll have to respond to with months of supplies? Kinda weird. Letting your family guilt you into hoarding months of supplies? Even weirder.
 
2013-02-22 06:07:29 PM
I'm a prepper, he's a prepper, she's a prepper
we're a prepper wouldn't you like to be a prepper too?
 
2013-02-22 06:07:45 PM
Wouldn't you like to be a prepper too?
 
2013-02-22 06:07:49 PM

Kanemano: gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.

[farm3.staticflickr.com image 483x362]

HUH?


That proves what he said.
 
2013-02-22 06:07:51 PM
So basically they're the same, except one is more fond of guns.
 
2013-02-22 06:09:19 PM

vernonFL: I don't even know what kind of batteries my flashlight uses. I can't tie a knot. My idea of camping is a private villa in the Caribbean. I panic if I run low on American Spirits.

I am SO farked in the pocky lips.


Relax, I'll tell you everything you need to know in one post...

Buy yourself something along the lines of a CheyTac .408 or other long range firearm. Spend a month learning how to shoot, then refresh your skills at the range a few times a year. Try to work your way up to consistently hitting human sized targets at 700 yards. Take the Barrett Long Range 1 course if you have the means, it's only 3 days.

When the sh*t goes down, all you'll need is your rifle and a decent initial supply of ammo. You'll be able to go out and get yourself a nice RV, antibiotics, food, more guns, more ammo, machetes, ninja weapons, and Twinkies all at your convenience. Simple.
 
2013-02-22 06:09:46 PM

titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.


Is it a bad thing to mention that my wife wants to have a 300 gallon water tank in the attic of our new house as well as replacing all the conifers in the yard with fruit trees? We already have all the good 'free' space devoted to vegetable gardens and a small amount of grapes. I make beer regularly, and enjoy making my own cheeses and Yogurts. She also wants a wood pellet stove (I am going to have to show her my Franklin stove, and show her how I handle and axe and maul) and a generator in the basement that can run off either gasoline or the heating oil in our tank. All this and we live in New York City. I am waiting for her to ask for a brace of hens.
 
2013-02-22 06:09:55 PM
Although they are delusional about a collapse being sudden and dramatic (think more like Greece where it's slow-rolling over the course of years, and more of a 'hollowing-out' than a wiping-away), I appreciate that preppers are into self-reliance and seem more interested in working together than the compound-in-Montana survivalists.

Now all they need to do is realize that capitalism is the catastrophe they've been waiting for.
 
2013-02-22 06:09:58 PM

what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.


I'm an eagle scout, have actually done the wilderness survival thing for fun, ect. Give me half the supplies of any one of these nuts and I'd probably last 10 times a long. Even given that, the bar running out of bitters means I can't get a proper manhattan or old fashioned, which is disaster on the scale of a small chemical plant exploding.
 
2013-02-22 06:11:17 PM
The one thing preppers and survivalist definitely have in common is that if the shiat really hits the fan, both of them are going to be doing exactly what the nice army reservists with the heavy weapons tell them to do.  Anybody who has survival fantasies where they are on their own for long periods, fighting for their lives, is delusional.
 
2013-02-22 06:11:54 PM

ZeroPly: a nice RV


Why would you want an RV? It's a gas hog and useless without infrastructure.

A quad with a muffler, a trailer, and some camping gear would be more helpful in the long run. If you find a good place, build a hut.
 
2013-02-22 06:12:54 PM
When the shiat hits the fan I am going to eat the preppers and take all of their stuff.
 
2013-02-22 06:14:06 PM
Unfortunately they're pretty much the same.  A couple of years ago, when I was cleaning out and replenishing my modest emergency supplies, I made contact with some local 'preppers', and it wasn't more than 30 minutes after meeting them in person than the New World Order/anti-Obama shiat-talk started flying.  That was disappointing.  Ever since, every time I've tried to make contact with like-minded/moderate/sane people who just want to discuss a good plan for emergencies, I end up dealing with the same bullshiat mentality.  TL;DR: I haven't seen any evidence that the vast majority of 'preppers' aren't teabagger extremists.
 
2013-02-22 06:15:52 PM
Dear Crazy Hoarders:

No.

Love, the Media
 
2013-02-22 06:17:40 PM

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Anybody who has survival fantasies where they are on their own for long periods, fighting for their lives, is delusional.


Not sure if they will be inclined to fantasize about fighting for their lives so much as trying to live on their own.  For that case a nice healthy stash of guns and ammo would be pretty helpful for both defense and gathering of meat.
 
2013-02-22 06:17:59 PM
I dunno, I'd say the main difference is one group will be okay once the canned goods run out, while the other will still be complaining about the lack of internet while they starve.
 
2013-02-22 06:18:00 PM

JesseL: The government hates them both. People who suffer and die in a disaster are much more politically valuable.


Ready.gov
 
2013-02-22 06:19:05 PM

doglover: Kanemano: gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.

[farm3.staticflickr.com image 483x362]

HUH?

That proves what he said.


Sushi is just fish and rice.....that's it. I am positive I can find better sushi at the deli counter in the Lawson's in Akahibara  than most places on the mainland,

it's like saying there are no hot dogs unless you are eating one at 72nd and Broadway.
 
2013-02-22 06:19:22 PM
I do not believe in TEOTWAKI, Mayan Doomsday, supernatural creatures in the sky or anything else, but I  DO believe in mathematics, economics and the laws of probability.

Corpus Christi has been hit seven times by hurricanes between 1919 and 1980; and since that---nothing.  It has been 33 years and we are long overdue.  In addition to this, the difference between the USSA sand the USSR is mostly a matter of percentages; the same factors which brought down one empire threaten to topple another.  I think another "financial crisis" is a foregone conclusion, and Amerika could easily follow the path of Greece.

As such I note that 75% of the people in this city have never seen a hurricane at all---and 90% have never seen a bad one.  They would know as I do, 20% of the damage comes from the storm; 80% derives from people being stupid.

Yes, I might be wrong---but I just might be right.  I prep for hard times the same way people keep roofs on their houses: They know it will rain sooner or later.  Like life insurance, I would rather have it and not need it than the other way round.
 
2013-02-22 06:19:48 PM
"Listen, this is gonna sound like a really stupid question, but, uh, aren't you guys gonna get really bored out here if society doesn't collapse?"

/obscure?
 
2013-02-22 06:21:30 PM
Which ones are the Mormons?
 
2013-02-22 06:22:31 PM
One's about a stone's throw away from the other. I've got a friend that's really into preparing for the fall of civilization thing, and he's doing pretty well with it too. He's basically started a small farm with rabbits chickens and goats, a garden, water filtration etc. He talks a lot about food sustainability for his family. He said the one thing he's really missing at this point is a gun. Thinking that he meant one for hunting, I suggested an over under game getter style of rifle. (rifle on the top, shotgun on the bottom break barrel) That's when he started talking bout machine guns and high volume mags. apparently he thinks that his little farm will be embattled by bloodthirsty starving people someday. The really weird thing about it is that he's only ever shot a .22 in his life and he's not one of those first person shooter Rambo wannabe freaks. I'm not sure why he thinks that one man with an Uzi would win a shootout against an entire starving population.
 
2013-02-22 06:22:49 PM
I don't see anything wrong with people having a small supply of food and water handy in case of an emergency.

- A fire in your home is very unlikely, but you should still plan and prepare in case it does happen.
- A burglar breaking into your home in the night isn't likely but you should still plan and prepare, and make sure your kids know what to do if you aren't there.
- If you live in an earthquake, tornado, flood, or fire zone you prepare in case these things happen even though they aren't likely.

I don't see any of those scenarios being very different from something like a multi-day blackout hitting my area, why wouldn't I want to be prepared?

Although I think it's a bit nutty, I don't begrudge those who want to take it to extremes and have a whole bunker built into their backyard either. As long as they aren't hurting anyone let them do their thing.
 
2013-02-22 06:22:59 PM
We are talking about a spectrum of mental disorders here which mainly fall under paranoid and obsessive-compulsive disorders and magical fetishism.

Survivalists can be distinguished from pure Preppers in their concerns over defense and stockpiling of guns and ammo.

Both often include "hoarding" - where the perceived importance of the hoarded items far exceeds their true value.

Gun Nuts who are not prepping survivalists still fit into this general area as paranoid fetishistic hoarders.
 
2013-02-22 06:23:34 PM
I live in suburbia, so there's only so much I can prepare for.  I've got the supplies I would need to filter the water in my hot tub.  I've got a vegetable garden (mostly because I like fresh veggies).  I've got 2 months worth of freeze dried food (definitely my most "prepper" like asset) for me, my wife, and our baby boy.

I figure the most insane natural disaster I can be prepared for is at most 2 months (like an earthquake breaking every water line in town, and a flood wiping out the roads.  Anything more serious than that, and you are kidding yourself if you think you're going to be okeedokie and self sufficient.  If something crazy like that were to happen I'd just move back to my Dad's ranch where I was living before I moved into town.  Being a farmer is really the only realistic way to survive something that serious.

That being said, it seems like the people really enthused about preparing for the end are the ones that are not prepared for the present - i.e. impoverished rednecks who are economic failures.  It's like they lost at life, so they make themselves feel better by convincing themselves they're going to be on top when society breaks down.
 
2013-02-22 06:23:35 PM
Didn't the United States used to encourage the entire country to be 'preppers' back in the 50's cold war? So if you had a fallout shelter 60 years ago you were a 'well prepared person' and now it makes you a 'crazy paranoid'?
 
2013-02-22 06:24:18 PM

doglover: ZeroPly: a nice RV

Why would you want an RV? It's a gas hog and useless without infrastructure.

A quad with a muffler, a trailer, and some camping gear would be more helpful in the long run. If you find a good place, build a hut.


Bait.

/it's kind of sad I've thought this through that much...
 
2013-02-22 06:24:43 PM

Kanemano: I am positive I can find better sushi at the deli counter in the Lawson's in Akahibara than most places on the mainland,


And yet you post a picture of Inari and salad rolls.

Do you know what's always left over at the end of the day? Inari and salad rolls.

I just had sushi last night. It's an entirely different food when the chef has just popped it all together and the rice is still warm, the vinegar hasn't run off, and the fish hasn't dried hard on the corners yet.
 
2013-02-22 06:24:49 PM

HeadLever: Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Anybody who has survival fantasies where they are on their own for long periods, fighting for their lives, is delusional.

Not sure if they will be inclined to fantasize about fighting for their lives so much as trying to live on their own.  For that case a nice healthy stash of guns and ammo would be pretty helpful for both defense and gathering of meat.


Live on your own how and where?  Most people live in fairly urban environments, the military will round people up to control them more easily if martial law is declared.
 
2013-02-22 06:24:54 PM

rubi_con_man: titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.

Is it a bad thing to mention that my wife wants to have a 300 gallon water tank in the attic of our new house as well as replacing all the conifers in the yard with fruit trees? We already have all the good 'free' space devoted to vegetable gardens and a small amount of grapes. I make beer regularly, and enjoy making my own cheeses and Yogurts. She also wants a wood pellet stove (I am going to have to show her my Franklin stove, and show her how I handle and axe and maul) and a generator in the basement that can run off either gasoline or the heating oil in our tank. All this and we live in New York City. I am waiting for her to ask for a brace of hens.


Here's the one problem with all that.  If something bad enough happens where you'll need all those things, everyone who has ever seen your backyard will make your place the first stop on the world looting tour.
 
2013-02-22 06:25:25 PM

ZeroPly: Bait.


Whoa, that IS a good one.
 
2013-02-22 06:26:03 PM
You could also look at it like this: "Preppers" are often playing the disaster lottery. If they don't have the resources to get by in the current climate, they prepare for a different climate and hope they get 'lucky' with the climate change.
 
2013-02-22 06:26:31 PM

Kanemano: doglover: Kanemano: gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.

[farm3.staticflickr.com image 483x362]

HUH?

That proves what he said.

Sushi is just fish and rice.....that's it. I am positive I can find better sushi at the deli counter in the Lawson's in Akahibara  than most places on the mainland,

it's like saying there are no hot dogs unless you are eating one at 72nd and Broadway.


Congrats. You're half right.
 
2013-02-22 06:27:23 PM

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: The one thing preppers and survivalist definitely have in common is that if the shiat really hits the fan, both of them are going to be doing exactly what the nice army reservists with the heavy weapons tell them to do.  Anybody who has survival fantasies where they are on their own for long periods, fighting for their lives, is delusional.


Oh, really? Does Katrina not ring a bell? Or Sandy?
Where were nice army reservists where my friends were getting shot at by looters as they were trying to give out supplies in LA? Or days and weeks after the Sandy, as people were still freezing and trying to warm themselves by boiling water repeatedly? Or even further back, the 1992 LA riots? I distinctly remember police officers standing by doing nothing as looters burned stores and robbed koreans down to bare floors - until they started shooting back from the rooftops.

I think those who are too lazy / cheap to prepare like to make themselves feel better by calling those who do "delusional" "insane" and "gun nuts".

If you don't want to own a gun, that's fine - your call. I know several people who would willingly let looters take their food rather than put up a fight, and I respect them. But to insist that it's crazy to stockpile food, water, and basic shelter/hygiene supplies - and then expect government or your neighbors to take care of you - that's head-in-the-sand selfishness.

And I won't even begin to get into how history repeats itself and how every government in the history of man has had at least one crushing, oppressive, extended era of tyranny where the powerful trod all over the throats of its people.
 
2013-02-22 06:28:54 PM

FreetardoRivera: When the shiat hits the fan I am going to eat the preppers and take all of their stuff.

SSSS



Sounds like a plan for taking on heavily armed citizens...
But if you're coming around these parts, mind you don't step on a foot breaker.
They've been popular with the pot growers, and I'd imagine their numbers will multiply.

/Truth be told I'd be more afraid of the preppers doing the hunting.
/many of them have poorly thought out plans, lots of weapons, and a drive to survive.
 
2013-02-22 06:29:40 PM

Oblio13: Our Attorney General wants the citizenry disarmed so badly that he smuggled weapons to Mexican drug cartels and tried to blame it on us. Our President is a former Constitutional law professor who is able to rationalize assassinating citizens abroad. Even small-town police departments are militarizing. Homeland Security just bought 1.6 BILLION rounds of ammunition. Emails and phone calls are being monitored. Warrantless searches are common. The legal mechanisms are in place for indefinite detentions without trials. Anticipating a ban, people are buying "assault weapons" as fast as they can be manufactured. They aren't buying them because they're going to turn them in. Part of me says, "It can't happen here". Another part of me says, "If I were seeing this in another country, I'd say both sides were preparing for civil war". I used to wonder if I was just being paranoid. Now I think that anyone who can't see a gathering storm is willfully blind. Being prepared can't hurt, and it's cheap insurance.


You are a wise man.  I have seen the same things, in much greater detail, for a much longer period of time.

Governments do not go quietly away when they are no longer needed, and if there is a bad financial crisis, they WILL find a way to feed themselves, no matter whose feet they step on.  Also, our government is like a big snake with the head cut off: the tail does not know it is dead yet, and keeps thrashing around.  If the economy goes to hell in a handbasket, they WILL take as much as they want, no matter how much you think you might need.  If that means your children starve, that is just plain tough.

You've also got somewhere north of 50 million parasites who cannot feed themselves even in good times; what will they do when things really get bad?
 
2013-02-22 06:30:04 PM

olddinosaur: Corpus Christi has been hit seven times by hurricanes between 1919 and 1980; and since that---nothing.  It has been 33 years and we are long overdue.


When The End Of The World As We Know It comes, I will establish dominion over all those who don't understand how probability (expected frequency of uncorrelated events) works.
 
2013-02-22 06:30:32 PM
I've always kept a couple of months of canned goods like vegges, canned ham, tuna, and the like. There is usually anywhere from five to fifteen 5 gallon water jugs for the cooler here, flashlights, portable radios(one crank). I don't even consider myself a prepper. I just hate going hungry during wicked weather, or stumbling to the shiatter in the dark during a prolonged power outage. Any canned stuff that gets within 6 months of expiry before I get to it gets donated to the food pantry.
 
2013-02-22 06:30:47 PM
Stupid thread is making me hungry.  Nice to see some of you know wtf sushi is.
 
2013-02-22 06:31:30 PM
It's always nice to find more candidates for the Somalia citizen exchange program.
 
2013-02-22 06:32:49 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?

It's the difference between preparing for a sudden, but manageable disaster (fire, tornado, flood, etc.) and preparing for the chaotic collapse of civilization.


I've never understood 'prepping'.  IF (and that's a big if) things went all zombie/EMPish, the only thing you'd need is a detailed knowledge of hand to hand combat, and how to kill a man in the most humane way possible.  And neighbors that have stocked up for themselves.  People think the "event" is the threat, but it's the immediate year following the event you should spend some time thinking about.  That's when the shiat gets real.

Think of it like this;  Grocery cart behavior vs driving behavior.  People don't cut you off and flip you off in the checkout line because they have to face you and it's shameful behavior.  On the road, however, we are animals.  Should an event happen, people will revert to that animal behavior during face to face confrontations.  There isn't enough campbell's soup in existence to help you 'prep' or 'survive' that element.  Hence the comment about hand-to-hand and humane killing methods.
 
Ehh
2013-02-22 06:32:51 PM
Came for a Venn diagram, leaving disappointed.

/The people on the preppers TV show are crazy.
 
2013-02-22 06:32:52 PM

Securitywyrm: Didn't the United States used to encourage the entire country to be 'preppers' back in the 50's cold war? So if you had a fallout shelter 60 years ago you were a 'well prepared person' and now it makes you a 'crazy paranoid'?


It's a matter of letters: Prep for the USSR, you are a patriot; prep for the USSA, you are a dangerous gun nut.
 
2013-02-22 06:33:35 PM
Meh, call it what you want... the reality for me is that living in the mountains means being ready for the possibility that (like a few years ago) we'll get 7 feet of snow in 2 days. That means ya, I can catch a rabbit, skin it, and cook it right... it also means that I have plenty of ramen, canned food, and fuel to cook it with, and in a pinch, I could certainly start a fire. The gun isn't so much about hunting for me as it is about the time a large bear jumped off the top of a big trash bin near where I live and scared the piss out of me, or about the numerous times bears have stalked me on the way home, or when I see mountain cats (they're worse than bears, if they decide that they want you, you're pretty well farked). I get that not everyone lives this way (I lived in NYC before here)... but being here, where it's quiet, where I can go find waterfalls in the summer that make my brain feel totally turned off, where I can be alone and not have to see anyone for a week if I so choose... that doesn't make me crazy.
 
2013-02-22 06:34:20 PM

Securitywyrm: You could also look at it like this: "Preppers" are often playing the disaster lottery. If they don't have the resources to get by in the current climate, they prepare for a different climate and hope they get 'lucky' with the climate change.


I'd be willing to believe they don't believe in climate change, that it's a liberal conspiracy.

They're definitely hiding because they think socialists like Obama (sic) are going to collapse the economy. Don't kid yourself.
 
2013-02-22 06:34:46 PM
Think that those folks that live in the northeast after Sandy could not have used a week or so worth of supplies? Maybe a generator and some gas?
How about those in Kentucky after 2009's ice storm?
Or the June 2012 derecho that hit the mideast and midwest?
 
2013-02-22 06:34:56 PM

jfarkinB: olddinosaur: Corpus Christi has been hit seven times by hurricanes between 1919 and 1980; and since that---nothing.  It has been 33 years and we are long overdue.

When The End Of The World As We Know It comes, I will establish dominion over all those who don't understand how probability (expected frequency of uncorrelated events) works.


I am well aware my mathematical model is pessimistic, but so is life insurance: I am not the slightest bit disappointed when I don't die but have to pay anyway.
 
2013-02-22 06:36:19 PM

duenor: Where were nice army reservists where my friends were getting shot at by looters as they were trying to give out supplies in LA?


Have you had your meds checked recently? You seem delusional and prone to make up fantasies and then believe they actually happened.
 
2013-02-22 06:36:29 PM

ZeroPly: a nice RV


Actually RVs can be useful for emergencies. An RV has water, sanitation, heating, cooling, a place to cook, and a place to sleep all wrapped up in a somewhat mobile package. Mine even has a ham radio. It's where you'll find me if my house collapses after the big one.
 
2013-02-22 06:36:31 PM

olddinosaur: Securitywyrm: Didn't the United States used to encourage the entire country to be 'preppers' back in the 50's cold war? So if you had a fallout shelter 60 years ago you were a 'well prepared person' and now it makes you a 'crazy paranoid'?

It's a matter of letters: Prep for the USSR, you are a patriot; prep for the USSA, you are a dangerous gun nut.


Oh, so very well said. It's no coincidence at all that all the major anti-gun legislation started coming out right after the end of the cold war. Even the machine-gun ban didn't go into place until 1986.
 
2013-02-22 06:36:38 PM

olddinosaur: You've also got somewhere north of 50 million parasites who cannot feed themselves even in good times


Nice way to characterize retirees and veterans. You'll be offing yourself when you hit Social Security age, then, right?
 
2013-02-22 06:37:06 PM

Rev.K: what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?

The line is right at the point of poop bagging. Maybe a bit before that, but definitely in that neighborhood.


You'll konw it only when you've crossed it.
 
2013-02-22 06:37:13 PM

firefly212: Meh, call it what you want... the reality for me is that living in the mountains means being ready for the possibility that (like a few years ago) we'll get 7 feet of snow in 2 days. That means ya, I can catch a rabbit, skin it, and cook it right... it also means that I have plenty of ramen, canned food, and fuel to cook it with, and in a pinch, I could certainly start a fire. The gun isn't so much about hunting for me as it is about the time a large bear jumped off the top of a big trash bin near where I live and scared the piss out of me, or about the numerous times bears have stalked me on the way home, or when I see mountain cats (they're worse than bears, if they decide that they want you, you're pretty well farked). I get that not everyone lives this way (I lived in NYC before here)... but being here, where it's quiet, where I can go find waterfalls in the summer that make my brain feel totally turned off, where I can be alone and not have to see anyone for a week if I so choose... that doesn't make me crazy.


Dad?  Is that you?  I thought you were just going to get some cigarettes?  It's been like, 5 years :(
 
2013-02-22 06:38:01 PM
so one group is gay
and the other group is gay with guns
 
2013-02-22 06:38:07 PM

olddinosaur: I am well aware my mathematical model is pessimistic, but so is life insurance: I am not the slightest bit disappointed when I don't die but have to pay anyway.


I... actually can't argue with this at all.
 
2013-02-22 06:38:10 PM

what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?


The one I saw last week (because I was too lazy to get up and change the channel) had a girl who had come to NYC from New Orleans after Katrina. Her "prep" was to be prepared to evacuate across the bridges with all her gear on foot in case another hurricane hit. She carried on a daily basis a rucksack with AT LEAST 100 lbs of survival gear to and from work--food, extra clothes, first-aid equipment, radio, etc. etc.--on a bike. What she had not done was check to see if she could get out of the city on foot in the hour window she'd given herself to escape before the rising water closed the bridges. Guess what: She couldn't.

So there's your line right there.
 
2013-02-22 06:39:30 PM
the-simpsons.maxupdates.tv
Simpsons did it!  (Obligatory)
 
2013-02-22 06:39:49 PM
Have you ever noticed that on the Doomsday Preppers TV show, that almost every prepper uses the phrase "when the shiat hits the fan?"  It's like a universal saying for them.  Are they all reading the same website?

/not a prepper, but a country person.  We do a lot of canning and drying, have a 50 lb bag of potatoes in storage for the winter, and a freezer full of meat.  We don't store water, but live close enough to a river to get buckets of water and walk home with them.  We could live comfortable for a while if we had a collapse, but we're not living like that's actually going to happen.
 
2013-02-22 06:39:53 PM

jfarkinB: olddinosaur: You've also got somewhere north of 50 million parasites who cannot feed themselves even in good times

Nice way to characterize retirees and veterans. You'll be offing yourself when you hit Social Security age, then, right?


I think he's talking about Sharmika and her seven little piggies by different breeders.
 
2013-02-22 06:41:43 PM

HairBolus: duenor: Where were nice army reservists where my friends were getting shot at by looters as they were trying to give out supplies in LA?

Have you had your meds checked recently? You seem delusional and prone to make up fantasies and then believe they actually happened.


Ad Hominem, I see.

I can't validate my friends' stories because they were never covered by the media. But how about wikipedia?  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_Hurricane_Katrina_in_New_Orle a ns 

Incapacitated by the breakdown of transportation and communication, as well as overwhelmed numerically, police officers could do little to stop crime, and shopkeepers who remained behind were left to defend their property alone.[43] Looters included gangs of gunmen,[44] and gunfire was heard in parts of the city. Along with violent, armed robbery of non-essential valuable goods,[45] many incidents were of residents simply taking food, water, and other commodities from unstaffed grocery stores.[45] There were also reports of some police officers looting.[44] Significant looting continued in areas of the city with few, if any permanent residents, such as the Lakeview, Gentilly, and the Midcity regions.[46]


"Sniper fire" was also reported throughout the city, targeted at rescue helicopters, relief workers, and police officers
 
2013-02-22 06:42:13 PM
One thing people tend to forget about preparing for a disaster is hygiene/santitation. You can have all the food water and first aid you want but if you can't maintain a decent level of sanitization and cleanliness one infection can do you in. those of you that have emergency kits put together should connsider what you have in that department. MY experience is that is the most over looked.
 
2013-02-22 06:42:15 PM

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Live on your own how and where?  Most people live in fairly urban environments, the military will round people up to control them more easily if martial law is declared.


Really?  Where is your source for that besides a hypothetical pulled from your arse?  And how does this protect the folks that don't live in these urban areas?
 
2013-02-22 06:42:47 PM
Its not preppers its preppies
 
2013-02-22 06:42:54 PM

jfarkinB: olddinosaur: You've also got somewhere north of 50 million parasites who cannot feed themselves even in good times

Nice way to characterize retirees and veterans. You'll be offing yourself when you hit Social Security age, then, right?


Actually retirees and veterans are better prepared than average folk.  I was talking about unwed mothers with 1--6 children, no savings, no plan B when plan A collapses, able--bodied "men" who are not crippled or retarded but can't find work, 40--year--old "boys" who live with their parents and play video games all day, and in general anyone who is dumb enough to think that the system will still be there to provide for him when the shirt hits the fan.

Ask the Katrina/Sandy survivors how they liked being dependent on others.
 
2013-02-22 06:43:27 PM

Saracuda: almost every prepper uses the phrase "when the shiat hits the fan?" It's like a universal saying for them. Are they all reading the same website?


It's a saying your grandfather might have been acquainted with,  which says a lot about the demographic.

I'm reminded of that scene in Independence Day when all the RVs show up at Roswell.
 
2013-02-22 06:43:35 PM
sigh, so because they keep 6 months worth of food and water in barrels in my garage and have disposable hazmat suits they are sane.

but I keep a couple rifles and a hand gun just in case of civil disorder brought on by either natural or manmade disaster I'm a psycho....

let me know how things work out when your neighbors find out that you have a bunch of food and water and nothing to defend it. Sure, as long as the machines are working and you can dial 911 it'll be fine. But you take those things away, you throw people in the dark, you scare the shiat out of them - no more rules
 
2013-02-22 06:43:59 PM

Saracuda: Have you ever noticed that on the Doomsday Preppers TV show, that almost every prepper uses the phrase "when the shiat hits the fan?"  It's like a universal saying for them.  Are they all reading the same website?

/not a prepper, but a country person.  We do a lot of canning and drying, have a 50 lb bag of potatoes in storage for the winter, and a freezer full of meat.  We don't store water, but live close enough to a river to get buckets of water and walk home with them.  We could live comfortable for a while if we had a collapse, but we're not living like that's actually going to happen.


That's because you don't have to. Water for most city folk (in the absences of municipal pressure) is not within walking distance. Swimming pools do not count.
 
2013-02-22 06:44:11 PM

Saracuda: Have you ever noticed that on the Doomsday Preppers TV show, that almost every prepper uses the phrase "when the shiat hits the fan?" It's like a universal saying for them.  Are they all reading the same website?



That saying has been around for a long time.  Probably common in the military
 
2013-02-22 06:45:19 PM

titwrench: One thing people tend to forget about preparing for a disaster is hygiene/santitation. You can have all the food water and first aid you want but if you can't maintain a decent level of sanitization and cleanliness one infection can do you in. those of you that have emergency kits put together should connsider what you have in that department. MY experience is that is the most over looked.


Oh, we bring hand sanitizer whenever we go to Disneyland.
 
2013-02-22 06:45:34 PM
Since the earthquake in Christchurch here in NZ two years ago, I've made sure to have a few days surplus of bottled water and food available in my pantry, I also have a spade to dig a latrine in the backyard and a tarp to hang up for privacy. I've also got my important documents - insurance, passport and $100 cash in one place and I have purchased a combination wind-up radio/cellphone charger/lantern. I figure that will be enough to get me through until relief arrives in the event of a disaster.

The impression I get is that a lot of preppers actually seem to be rooting for some kind of disaster to happen so they can act out some post-social-collapse fantasy. There's a difference between making a risk assessment and hoping for that kind of massive change in the way people live their lives.
 
2013-02-22 06:47:29 PM

spiderpaz: I live in suburbia, so there's only so much I can prepare for.  I've got the supplies I would need to filter the water in my hot tub.  I've got a vegetable garden (mostly because I like fresh veggies).  I've got 2 months worth of freeze dried food (definitely my most "prepper" like asset) for me, my wife, and our baby boy.

I figure the most insane natural disaster I can be prepared for is at most 2 months (like an earthquake breaking every water line in town, and a flood wiping out the roads.  Anything more serious than that, and you are kidding yourself if you think you're going to be okeedokie and self sufficient.  If something crazy like that were to happen I'd just move back to my Dad's ranch where I was living before I moved into town.  Being a farmer is really the only realistic way to survive something that serious.

That being said, it seems like the people really enthused about preparing for the end are the ones that are not prepared for the present - i.e. impoverished rednecks who are economic failures.  It's like they lost at life, so they make themselves feel better by convincing themselves they're going to be on top when society breaks down.


Do you mind if i quote that last paragraph EVERWHERE? Because it is the most accurate description i have ever heard of some folks I know.
 
2013-02-22 06:48:16 PM

Soup4Bonnie: titwrench: One thing people tend to forget about preparing for a disaster is hygiene/santitation. You can have all the food water and first aid you want but if you can't maintain a decent level of sanitization and cleanliness one infection can do you in. those of you that have emergency kits put together should connsider what you have in that department. MY experience is that is the most over looked.

Oh, we bring hand sanitizer whenever we go to Disneyland.


I know you are joking but some people actually think a little purell is good enough.
 
2013-02-22 06:50:21 PM

firefly212: , or when I see mountain cats (they're worse than bears, if they decide that they want you, you're pretty well farked).


This is why you make friends with 6 foot long kitty. Imagine having mountain lions who like and are loyal to you.

\Or not.
 
2013-02-22 06:50:56 PM

titwrench: I know you are joking but some people actually think a little purell is good enough.


Not when you've got 6 day park hopper passes.  You'd run out by Frontierland.  Talk about your disaster scenarios!
 
2013-02-22 06:51:50 PM
Wouldn't you like to be a Prepper, too?
 
2013-02-22 06:51:59 PM
20 years ago: Citizens, be sure to have some food and water saved in case of emergency.

Now: Attention citizens. Do not prepare for emergencies. I repeat: Do not prepare for emergencies.
 
2013-02-22 06:52:16 PM

thisispete: Since the earthquake in Christchurch here in NZ two years ago, I've made sure to have a few days surplus of bottled water and food available in my pantry, I also have a spade to dig a latrine in the backyard and a tarp to hang up for privacy. I've also got my important documents - insurance, passport and $100 cash in one place and I have purchased a combination wind-up radio/cellphone charger/lantern. I figure that will be enough to get me through until relief arrives in the event of a disaster.


I'd get a gun to go with it - a nice 9mm and a belt holster, or small carbine that you can sling across your back. In the 1994 northridge earthquake,people found those to be much more useful than any big rifle. they had to work with both hands, sometimes with heavy equipment like chainsaws, and it was nice to not have to worry about looters. an earthquake (big one) can leave you without any kind of protecting structure, so security becomes a very real issue at that point.

again, I respect those who eschew firearms, but I do suggest them as a good addition to your general preparedness.

of greater importance, of course, is knowledge, general health, and a plan.
 
2013-02-22 06:52:31 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?

It's the difference between preparing for a sudden, but manageable disaster (fire, tornado, flood, etc.) and preparing for the chaotic collapse of civilization.


Its not really going to happen.  Sure, you can have a financial collapse, and there will be riots in the city..
but farmers will bring in food as the prices go up.  All that will happen is that the farmers will not agree to come inside city limits unless they have an armed escort.  I'm sure some donut cops will volunteer for this duty and hope to secure some of their own extra food..etc.

no problems unless some dufus has been nuking the land west of the farms.
 
2013-02-22 06:52:43 PM
When did it become a bad thing to be prepared for natural or man-made disasters? Keeping a lot of food on hand has other benefits, such as cutting down on emergency trips to the store to pick up that one thing you need for a recipe. I am shocked and disheartened by the number of people in this thread who are smug about their day-to-day dependence on the food supply chain and utilities. So smug, in fact, that they are mocking individuals who are trying to ensure they don't have to sit there and watch their family slowly starve to death.

The article seems to making the distinction based on who is prepared to defend their supplies and those who aren't. If you are willing to go through the process of preparing, why not have a gun to give yourself a CHANCE to defend yourself and your family in the event someone wants your stuff? Sure, you probably won't need it. Sure, your resistance may be futile. Would you rather ensure you and your family will be at the mercy of someone else? Why not give yourself a fighting chance?

There are many things that threaten our way of life. You don't have to be paranoid to prepare for a global pandemic that causes a collapse of utilities and the food supply. Everyone was freaking out about the flu, but imagine a virus with no available vaccine and a 50% mortality rate. Such a virus could be one mutation away from becoming a reality. How many people are going to go to the store or two work when they know there's a 50/50 shot they'll die if they get sick? Who's going to keep the lights on? Who's going to keep food in the stores? This is just one scenario.

For those of you who are mocking "preppers", why don't you leave your spare tire at home? After all, what's the chances of you getting a flat tomorrow?
 
2013-02-22 06:53:27 PM
Lame sauce.  This reminds me of the Trekkies vs Trekkers.

You're all...

ibankcoin.com
 
2013-02-22 06:54:06 PM

Ishkur: I don't think it's strange that people prepare for the endtimes.


I do think its strange that people pray for the endtimes.

In this farked world? Really? I'm not suprised at all.
 
2013-02-22 06:54:14 PM
Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.
 
2013-02-22 06:55:14 PM

lockers: Whats wrong with planning for you in yours for the case of extreme emergency? How is that crazy?


Mostly because if you're planning for that, you need to be in lock-up.
 
2013-02-22 06:56:17 PM

Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.


I have carpentry, medical, and metalworking skills for trade. I'm pretty sure I could work out a trade anywhere.
 
2013-02-22 06:57:08 PM

Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.


i'm just sellin him shiat.  but he keeps payin me those silver bars

here's your worthless veggies you perv
 
2013-02-22 06:58:07 PM

duenor: Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.

I have carpentry, medical, and metalworking skills for trade. I'm pretty sure I could work out a trade anywhere.


Yeah, well I have bartending, so line starts behind me, buddy.
 
2013-02-22 06:59:58 PM
One thing that I wish more people would get into is Community Emergency Response Teams (CERT). It's a US Government/Citizencorps program, designed specifically to get "trained" citizens to be able to communicate, coordinate and help first responders in a time of need.

The classes are excellent, typically taught by your local emergency management and firefighters, and pretty damned cool.

www.keizerfire.com

Our local programs coordinate with the state's fire training center, so we get to experience actual (but simulated) backdraft and flame rollover situations. They train in triage, first-aid, heavy lifting (1-ton "jersey barriers" with prybars and cribbing) building clearing and marking, emergency communications, disaster site mass-casualty setup points, community evacuations, chemical fire/smoke recognition, even optional classes in structural inspections. The shiat is pretty rad, free, and you get to meet all your local first responders. I highly recommend it.
 
2013-02-22 07:00:42 PM

titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.


Thanks for bringing the SD thing from a year or two ago.  People started freaking out because they couldn't pump gas or buy groceries for just 5 little hours.
Can you imagine an EQ large enough to knock out services for a week or two with emergency services redirected to even harder hit areas than yours?  I stockpile at least 2 weeks worth of drinking water, people food, pet food, never let the gas get under a half tank, etc.  That also Includes weapons and an evac plan with meet up points for loved ones, if necessary.  I am not going to be stuck in this hellhole when people start really losing it.

That's just prepared, not crazy at all.

Right?
 
2013-02-22 07:02:19 PM
Which of the two stock up on racist literature?
 
2013-02-22 07:02:25 PM

thamike: This is even worse than when people got "furries" mixed up with "weirdos wearing fuzzy animal suits with dickholes in them."


Well, some of those suits can be hard to get out of if you have to pee.

My former roommate didn't have to worry about that, since he was a furry and a diaper fetishist.
 
2013-02-22 07:05:13 PM
I'm presently building my hobby farm out in western New Hampshire. Septic went in this week, the well is being drilled next week. I'm going to put up some solar panels, windmills, gardens, keep horses, etc. When I tell people what I'm up to, they immediately accuse me of being a survivalist. It's like people are suspicious of anyone who seems a little *too* independent. They don't seem to like it when some people aren't being held hostage to modern society, like they are.  I just want to have fun with my hobby farm action playset, not set myself up as a warlord. I don't want society to collapse. I can't have fun foxhunting when surrounded by refugees...
 
2013-02-22 07:06:06 PM

PhaserQuest: Which of the two stock up on racist literature?


only both
 
2013-02-22 07:06:10 PM

Knucklepopper: duenor: Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.

I have carpentry, medical, and metalworking skills for trade. I'm pretty sure I could work out a trade anywhere.

Yeah, well I have bartending, so line starts behind me, buddy.


Distillation might be more useful. What good is bartending if the guy supplying you with bathtub gin thinks pinesol is a botanical?
 
2013-02-22 07:07:10 PM
Pretty much any time people have a stupid label for what they do, they are at least a little crazy. I've never heard anyone I know describe themselves as a "prepper" or "survivalist" despite a number of them having some basic sensible disaster preparedness (first aid kit, a bit of food and water, flashlight, etc). There is a real difference between taking basic measures for a disaster that is somewhat likely to happen in your lifetime (hurricane, earthquake, Justin Beiber concert) and stocking up tons of shiat because you think the apocalypse will happen and afterwards it'll be just like Fallout 3.
 
2013-02-22 07:08:00 PM
Here's the thing: We've HAD a huge, civilization-wide disaster of unimaginable proportions. It devastated an entire continent, killed one-third of the population, emptied entire towns. It's known today as the Black Death.

And yet: With people dropping and dying in the streets (some cities recorded death tolls as high as 70%), zero medical care except prayer and leeches, and virtually no social controls like we have today, society DIDN'T collapse, and cities DIDN'T devolve into anarchy. There were some bad things, of course, nobody would pretend the mass Jew burnings and witch hunts and Flagellants were great--but there wasn't mass chaos.

I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?
 
2013-02-22 07:09:06 PM
If what I've seen on "Dommsday Preppers" is any indication, the "preppers" are just survivalists with fancier houses who don't flaunt their racist tendencies.
 
2013-02-22 07:10:11 PM

Gyrfalcon: Here's the thing: We've HAD a huge, civilization-wide disaster of unimaginable proportions. It devastated an entire continent, killed one-third of the population, emptied entire towns. It's known today as the Black Death.

And yet: With people dropping and dying in the streets (some cities recorded death tolls as high as 70%), zero medical care except prayer and leeches, and virtually no social controls like we have today, society DIDN'T collapse, and cities DIDN'T devolve into anarchy. There were some bad things, of course, nobody would pretend the mass Jew burnings and witch hunts and Flagellants were great--but there wasn't mass chaos.

I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?




This
 
2013-02-22 07:11:27 PM

cptjeff: Knucklepopper: duenor: Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.

I have carpentry, medical, and metalworking skills for trade. I'm pretty sure I could work out a trade anywhere.

Yeah, well I have bartending, so line starts behind me, buddy.

Distillation might be more useful. What good is bartending if the guy supplying you with bathtub gin thinks pinesol is a botanical?


Mix it with flat club soda raided from the Wal-Mart because everyone takes soft drinks during crises but not the club soda, duh.
See? You didn't think of that. Line. Behind me, please!
 
2013-02-22 07:12:27 PM

HairBolus: We are talking about a spectrum of mental disorders here which mainly fall under paranoid and obsessive-compulsive disorders and magical fetishism.

Survivalists can be distinguished from pure Preppers in their concerns over defense and stockpiling of guns and ammo.

Both often include "hoarding" - where the perceived importance of the hoarded items far exceeds their true value.

Gun Nuts who are not prepping survivalists still fit into this general area as paranoid fetishistic hoarders.


Bingo...
 
2013-02-22 07:14:00 PM

duenor: HairBolus: duenor: Where were nice army reservists where my friends were getting shot at by looters as they were trying to give out supplies in LA?

Have you had your meds checked recently? You seem delusional and prone to make up fantasies and then believe they actually happened.

Ad Hominem, I see.

I can't validate my friends' stories because they were never covered by the media.


What I doubt is that you live in New Orleans and that you actually have face to face friends that were shot at while trying to be good Samaritans during Katrina. Lots of stuff was made up during Katrina to fit a "dangerous animal" narrative as was lots of stuff denied such as cops killing blacks for trying to walk out of NO.

I still think you are delusional and need of a med check and that you consider someone to be a "friend" if you have read something they wrote on the internet in a racist survivalist nutjob vein.
 
2013-02-22 07:15:11 PM

thisispete: Since the earthquake in Christchurch here in NZ two years ago, I've made sure to have a few days surplus of bottled water and food available in my pantry, I also have a spade to dig a latrine in the backyard and a tarp to hang up for privacy. I've also got my important documents - insurance, passport and $100 cash in one place and I have purchased a combination wind-up radio/cellphone charger/lantern. I figure that will be enough to get me through until relief arrives in the event of a disaster.

The impression I get is that a lot of preppers actually seem to be rooting for some kind of disaster to happen so they can act out some post-social-collapse fantasy. There's a difference between making a risk assessment and hoping for that kind of massive change in the way people live their lives.


There's a bit of Pascal's Wager here too.  The idea that you can't be too prepared because there is little to lose if you are.  I wonder how religious preppers are... I'm betting they're of the Christian types with a high focus on doomsday.
 
2013-02-22 07:15:25 PM
From my read of this article:
Preppers are the people who stood up in the movie theatre and cheered at the end of the new Red Dawn when it played in Tucson.
Survivalists are the people who for weeks, peered up at the sky watching for parachutes and still give Koreans and Asians in general, the side-eye.
That about it?
 
2013-02-22 07:16:06 PM
This is how I distinguish between normal and dingbat:

Survivalist/prepper = Okay, whatever. You're prepared.

Survivalist/prepper + conspiracy theorist = t.qkme.me
 
2013-02-22 07:16:35 PM

Saracuda: Have you ever noticed that on the Doomsday Preppers TV show, that almost every prepper uses the phrase "when the shiat hits the fan?"  It's like a universal saying for them.  Are they all reading the same website?

/not a prepper, but a country person.  We do a lot of canning and drying, have a 50 lb bag of potatoes in storage for the winter, and a freezer full of meat.  We don't store water, but live close enough to a river to get buckets of water and walk home with them.  We could live comfortable for a while if we had a collapse, but we're not living like that's actually going to happen.


It is a universal saying in the prepping community.  You'll always see it as "SHTF".  It's just a term for whatever you're prepping for actually happening.  SHTF is a major earthquake for me, could be a tornado for someone in Kansas, or an ice storm for someone in Maine, or the Mayan-EMP-Zombie-Apocolypse-RaceWar for Crazy Uncle Eddy.
 
2013-02-22 07:17:02 PM
Let's see. How would I do, unprepared, with basic human needs?

Fresh water? I live in Michigan. I can't drive twenty miles in any direction without being near fresh water.

Food? Plants and animals. I doubt the rabbit and squirrel population will fade immediately, and sometimes I might have a turkey (they're all over the place) or luck into some wild berries. I probably can't throw a rock without hitting something edible.

Oxygen? Well, if that's gone we're all screwed anyway.

Shelter? There are more houses and dwellings than there are people living in them. If anything, I'd have a BETTER shelter if the rule of law crumbled.

Protection? It's not too hard to fashion weapons and traps if I need them. I don't particularly care for guns, but I imagine they will be around after civilization falls if I need one. And honestly, if anyone comes to take what I have, I'll just leave. It's not worth fighting over squirrel bits and easily-acquired water. Really.

I really don't see how being a prepper or survivalist will make a huge difference. I'm pretty sure most of them are people with too much time and money on their hands, and a heaping helping of paranoia and/or xenophobia.
 
2013-02-22 07:19:52 PM
Ok First and foremost...  Since when does being from Tennessee mean anything when it comes to sushi?  A lot of high end sushi places fly in sushi flash frozen simply because they can't catch those fish in their local area (assuming they're near a coast).

Second, I probably wouldn't do takeout sushi.  The reason being, sushi (or specifically to my interests, sashimi) needs to be cold.  A proper sushi chef will minimize body to fish contact so to not increase the temperature of the fish.  Now, considering my last place of residence was Portland, I would probably get takeout sushi there. Its always cold and raining so the ambient temp of the sushi shouldn't go up that much.

That said, I've lived all over, and traveled all over.  I had great sushi in Amsterdam believe it or not.

I was born and raised in Tennessee and after 15 years absent, have moved back... So a little less predetermined notions regarding geographic location, k?

That said... You wanna talk survivalists?  I don't care how much ammo you have, or how many cans of food, none of you people will hold a CANDLE to smoky mountains hill folk.  They have lots of kids, to spread around the work and have been living off the land with anything ranging from a single tin roof above their head, to actual huts.  Many of them haven't had electricity since ever, haven't paid taxes in their life, and their kids probably don't have social security numbers.  The only use they have for a car is to drive into "town" for "supplies"...

Seriously, these people will out live all of you and eat your families.
 
2013-02-22 07:20:16 PM

way south: FreetardoRivera: When the shiat hits the fan I am going to eat the preppers and take all of their stuff.
SSSS

Sounds like a plan for taking on heavily armed citizens...
But if you're coming around these parts, mind you don't step on a foot breaker.
They've been popular with the pot growers, and I'd imagine their numbers will multiply.

/Truth be told I'd be more afraid of the preppers doing the hunting.
/many of them have poorly thought out plans, lots of weapons, and a drive to survive.


Too bad they lack the intelligence to devote their efforts to helping their civilization survive instead of wasting time and money on a long shot gamble that they will somehow survive it's failure. Most of the same people who always worry about "society's breakdown" are the same ones who cry like little biatches when they are asked to pay their taxes.
 
2013-02-22 07:20:25 PM
I'll admit it, I'm a prepper. I live in what many geologists consider the most dangerous land in the United States, due to the statistical likelihood of living in Mt. Rainier's lahar zone. My city is ringed with air-raid-esk sirens that they test monthly. The area also has an annual GTFO evacuations, to make sure we can get out of the valley within 30 minutes, before a 25' wall of 50mph liquid mud entombs everyone.
washingtondnr.files.wordpress.com
With that very real danger, along with the less likely, but also major consequence event, a Cascadia subduction earthquake, I make sure to have at least a month or two of food on hand at home, my truck fully fueled up, and caches of supplies and food kept at work and the homes of other family members.

I also have pretty serious back-up systems at my house and work (rooftop solar power, batteries + generators), in-case of prolonged outages. if there are fuel shortages, I have an electric car. And *if* there ever any teotwawki event, I could always bailout on my sailboat - which is always ready to cast off. She's got water for weeks, solar panels, an inverter system, and even an electrically powered tender.
 
2013-02-22 07:20:58 PM

thisispete: Since the earthquake in Christchurch here in NZ two years ago, I've made sure to have a few days surplus of bottled water and food available in my pantry, I also have a spade to dig a latrine in the backyard and a tarp to hang up for privacy. I've also got my important documents - insurance, passport and $100 cash in one place and I have purchased a combination wind-up radio/cellphone charger/lantern. I figure that will be enough to get me through until relief arrives in the event of a disaster.

The impression I get is that a lot of preppers actually seem to be rooting for some kind of disaster to happen so they can act out some post-social-collapse fantasy. There's a difference between making a risk assessment and hoping for that kind of massive change in the way people live their lives.


You're absolutely right about many of them deep-down hoping it happens.  I like reading their message boards every now and then to get a sense of what the crazies are talking about these days, and I'll often see posts like "Going on vacation to Florida next week, what preps should I bring?"  or  "Flying to Vegas for business, how worried should I be?"

A lot of these people seriously go through every minute of their lives worrying about how they'd deal with the End Of The World if it happens Right This Instant!  It's mind boggling to me how they can live like that.
 
2013-02-22 07:21:28 PM

netgamer7k: This is how I distinguish between normal and dingbat:

Survivalist/prepper = Okay, whatever. You're prepared.

Survivalist/prepper + conspiracy theorist = [t.qkme.me image 214x235]


egads both sides are gay.
using violence as a scapegoat for love
 
2013-02-22 07:22:07 PM

thamike: Well, technically, it would still be sushi. You can get that at the supermarket in little plastic boxes, too. But Sushi involves sitting at a sushi bar and interacting with a sushi chef who lives his art and knows what you want before you do. I don't know how Boston or Tennessee fare, and I wouldn't assume that there's no great sushi joints there, but "take-out sushi" sounds kind of counterproductive.

/Los Angeles.



One of my favorite things about Los Angeles are all the little hole in the wall sushi joints here. Sushi doesn't have to be a big production. You can just step into a mom and pop place and get a roll. And if there's a nice park or something across the street, you can take it out and eat it there. Personally, I think it's best eaten ASAP, so I wouldn't take it far.

Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.
 
2013-02-22 07:23:38 PM
Well, as long as you have SOME  sort of shoebox that's all your own and you rabidly defend the semantics, so nobody gets peanut butter in your chocolate.
 
2013-02-22 07:24:00 PM

ZeroCorpse: I really don't see how being a prepper or survivalist will make a huge difference.


Being prepared for having no power for a few weeks is a more likely scenario. Society has NEVER fallen globally nor permanently.

What you used to get is rape and genocide during a sack of an area. That was usually over quickly(unless you got rapocided) and the new masters set up on top of existing infrastructure and business as usually was back.

Even if the whole US fails, it will be weeks, not years, before we're all back to normal under some new flag. So by prepping you save yourself the need to go out and loot. You can play some dominoes with your buddies, watch a few DVDs with your generator bike, and generally ride out the disasters without noticing.

Also with 100 extra units of things, you can invite your friends over for some relaxation as well.

Back when there was that huge blackout in 2005? me and my buddies were camping. We never noticed.
 
2013-02-22 07:25:46 PM

Krieghund: Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.


I think it's unsophisticated to order food of a variety or in a manner that is supposedly impressive to others.  I like Ritz crackers, so don't mind me.
 
2013-02-22 07:25:55 PM

MrSteve007: Mt. Rainier's lahar zone


disgaea.neoseeker.com
 
2013-02-22 07:27:42 PM

Krieghund: thamike: Well, technically, it would still be sushi. You can get that at the supermarket in little plastic boxes, too. But Sushi involves sitting at a sushi bar and interacting with a sushi chef who lives his art and knows what you want before you do. I don't know how Boston or Tennessee fare, and I wouldn't assume that there's no great sushi joints there, but "take-out sushi" sounds kind of counterproductive.

/Los Angeles.


One of my favorite things about Los Angeles are all the little hole in the wall sushi joints here. Sushi doesn't have to be a big production. You can just step into a mom and pop place and get a roll. And if there's a nice park or something across the street, you can take it out and eat it there. Personally, I think it's best eaten ASAP, so I wouldn't take it far.

Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.


There's still such a thing as quality of fish and I would assume that price is non negotiable   It's not like a mexican food cart where the food STARTS cheap...

Also, FARK California.  The WHOLE state.  I'm a Christian if only because I want God to "accidentally" the whole state.
 
2013-02-22 07:28:35 PM
Sorry the headline is a total lie.
 
2013-02-22 07:30:05 PM
The ultimate "prepper" is Batman.
 
2013-02-22 07:30:47 PM

Krieghund: Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.


Yup. It's food people, not some exotic experience. That's like saying any steak eaten outside of a 5 star steakhouse isn't real steak. I mean, seriously?

It's food. You eat it. Takeout forms may not be as high quality a form of that food as the really nice stuff made in front of you, but the constituent ingredients are the same, and in the same form. It's sushi.
 
2013-02-22 07:31:25 PM

Krieghund: Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.


If the guy doesn't know me, I'm ordering my own sushi.

Omakase means "As you like" so basically you're asking the guy who owns the joint to serve what he'd like to serve at that time. I don't want what you think I want or what you've got too much left over of, I want tuna, salmon, octopus, buri(English?), mackerel, and horse(Mmm, raw horse meat). Usually in that order. Also some sea urchin wouldn't be so bad, either.

If I let the guy behind the counter choose I'm getting squid and lots of it because no one wants the squid.
 
2013-02-22 07:31:58 PM

Lucidz: Ok First and foremost...  Since when does being from Tennessee mean anything when it comes to sushi?  A lot of high end sushi places fly in sushi flash frozen simply because they can't catch those fish in their local area (assuming they're near a coast).

Second, I probably wouldn't do takeout sushi.  The reason being, sushi (or specifically to my interests, sashimi) needs to be cold.  A proper sushi chef will minimize body to fish contact so to not increase the temperature of the fish.  Now, considering my last place of residence was Portland, I would probably get takeout sushi there. Its always cold and raining so the ambient temp of the sushi shouldn't go up that much.

That said, I've lived all over, and traveled all over.  I had great sushi in Amsterdam believe it or not.

I was born and raised in Tennessee and after 15 years absent, have moved back... So a little less predetermined notions regarding geographic location, k?

That said... You wanna talk survivalists?  I don't care how much ammo you have, or how many cans of food, none of you people will hold a CANDLE to smoky mountains hill folk.  They have lots of kids, to spread around the work and have been living off the land with anything ranging from a single tin roof above their head, to actual huts.  Many of them haven't had electricity since ever, haven't paid taxes in their life, and their kids probably don't have social security numbers.  The only use they have for a car is to drive into "town" for "supplies"...

Seriously, these people will out live all of you and eat your families.



Definitely fair to call me out for the Tennessee crack.  I was expecting a Sushi snob from Seattle or San Fran and was like Tenn?  wth?   My apologizes to Tennessee Sushi.  I live in Denver and I'm sure some folks would think the same thing about getting Sushi here.  My favorite place gets it in flown in daily from Japan, so I have nothing to snark about.
 
2013-02-22 07:32:01 PM

Lucidz: here's still such a thing as quality of fish


Very true. But while cheap sushi may not be good sushi, it is still sushi. Make sense?
 
2013-02-22 07:32:55 PM

Whatthefark: Rapmaster2000: work with a prepper. He's an alright guy.

However, while it's good that he has a lot of supplies, his biggest impediment in a disaster is clearly going to be his weight. It's going to be hard to evade back the rampaging zombie horde when you're defeated by a flight of stairs.

Sounds like this guy.


About a minute in, I'm pretty sure shiat falls out of his vest and thumps on the floor. Poor guy can't even scoot over on the couch....
 
2013-02-22 07:34:26 PM
Lucidz:

Also, FARK California.  The WHOLE state.  I'm a Christian if only because I want God to "accidentally" the whole state.

Yikes
 
2013-02-22 07:34:56 PM

Lucidz: That said... You wanna talk survivalists?  I don't care how much ammo you have, or how many cans of food, none of you people will hold a CANDLE to smoky mountains hill folk.  They have lots of kids, to spread around the work and have been living off the land with anything ranging from a single tin roof above their head, to actual huts.  Many of them haven't had electricity since ever, haven't paid taxes in their life, and their kids probably don't have social security numbers.  The only use they have for a car is to drive into "town" for "supplies"...


Are you farking kidding me? Your population of inbreds has nothing on Mexicans. I'm one hour from the Mexican border and two hours from the Sierra Madre. First zombie comes shambling down my path and I'm off to the jungles of Sinaloa. You'll next hear from me when the beer grows warm.
 
2013-02-22 07:35:08 PM
Don't ask either one where they keep their wristwatch.
 
2013-02-22 07:35:30 PM
And if you are normal like me, living in California where earthquakes can hit and leave you without power or access to grocery stores, you have enough canned food and water for two weeks stashed and keep fuel available for the grill.  Even that kind of sensibility has been called "prepping" by members of my husband's family, who believe that thinking any further ahead than a golden retriever does is somehow un-American.
 
2013-02-22 07:35:57 PM

Lucidz: There's still such a thing as quality of fish and I would assume that price is non negotiable


Kaiten-sushi, the converyor belt stuff, became popular because sushi chefs used to charge you what they thought you could pay. So if you happened to be wearing a clean kimono for some reason, your bill was HUUUUUUGE. People got fed up with that highway robbery and started demanding fair price. So some one got the clever idea of putting the sushi on colored plates so you'd know what your paying if you took the piece.
 
2013-02-22 07:36:04 PM
A lot of these people seriously go through every minute of their lives worrying about how they'd deal with the End Of The World if it happens Right This Instant!  It's mind boggling to me how they can live like that.

Less then 50 years ago people had to deal with this mindset...cold war, WWII, etc. But remember, even as a society, we were back in the 'dark ages' 100 years ago where most hunted and grew their own food.

It's not a negative mindset at all.

They've said people who 'think about bad things' actually are the most 'prepared' for these situations because they've run through scenarios already and what they'd do. I'm not talking just end of the world stuff, but what happened if they were trapped, if someone broke into their house, if they were hit by a storm like Irene, etc.


Being prepared for having no power for a few weeks is a more likely scenario. Society has NEVER fallen globally nor permanently.

What you used to get is rape and genocide during a sack of an area. That was usually over quickly(unless you got rapocided) and the new masters set up on top of existing infrastructure and business as usually was back.

Even if the whole US fails, it will be weeks, not years, before we're all back to normal under some new flag. So by prepping you save yourself the need to go out and loot. You can play some dominoes with your buddies, watch a few DVDs with your generator bike, and generally ride out the disasters without noticing.


You really need to go read up on what happened to the Soviet Union. I'm sure many of those places had residents that thought the same thing. New flag doesn't mean back to normal dude. Could mean worse or hell itself. Ask the eastern block and those nations how they are doing since the collapse.

No one is saying globally society will fall, but nations will and always have.
 
2013-02-22 07:36:13 PM

doglover: Krieghund: Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.

If the guy doesn't know me, I'm ordering my own sushi.

Omakase means "As you like" so basically you're asking the guy who owns the joint to serve what he'd like to serve at that time. I don't want what you think I want or what you've got too much left over of, I want tuna, salmon, octopus, buri(English?), mackerel, and horse(Mmm, raw horse meat). Usually in that order. Also some sea urchin wouldn't be so bad, either.

If I let the guy behind the counter choose I'm getting squid and lots of it because no one wants the squid.


We're trying to have a serious discussion about surviving, prepping for disaster and you two are arguing sushi. This is why no Californian will ever survive a catastrophe.
 
2013-02-22 07:37:57 PM
Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.
 
2013-02-22 07:38:12 PM
Not all preppers are survivalists, but all survivalists are preppers. :)

In other words, survivalists are just a sub-set of preppers. The Venn diagram would be a big circle (Preppers) with a little circle (Survivalists) entirely inside it.

The people in this article are in another subset of preppers, also fully contained in the Venn diagram above, and partially overlapping with Survivalists. This group doesn't have a name but I would call them Sustainers, because they are already partially self-sustaining.

The difference between all these groups has very little to do with guns aside from the fact that basically all survivalists have firearms while only most of the non-survivalist prepper's have them. The real differences are about mindset, training, preparation, and organization.

Survivalists tend to have the mindset that when the SHTF (and they KNOW it will) they will go to a preplanned remote area and live off the land. They usually have formal training in wilderness survival techniques. Their preparation level varies from a backpack with survival gear to a pre-stocked car, cabin, or compound, and they have firearms. They are sometimes organized in large groups.

Sustainers tend to have the mindset that when the SHTF they will live where they already live, but spend more time on growing their own food and maintaining the property they are already living on and partly off of. They already know how to use all their equipment and need no training, they usually have firearms. Their preparation level is everything they own, so it is pretty high. They are rarely found in groups.

The remaining "general" preppers have a mindset that varies from believing things will never be bad for all that long and the government will put it right, to believing that the S will really HTF. They don't do little or no training, but have some survival guides and maybe watch some survival shows on TV, they usually have firearms. Their preparation level is only enough for their personal worst case scenario, and usually includes a backpack in case they have to "bug out". They are never found in groups.

Being a general prepper can be cheap and easy and take very little time. If something bad does happen a general prepper and their family are more likely to be comfortable during the crisis, and more likely to survive if it is a relative long lasting situation (like power and water are out for a month and roads are all blocked). Katrina and Sandy have shown us that natural disasters, if large enough, can make life much more difficult for a short while, and that is when being a prepper can pay off. Being a Survivalist or Sustainer in that same situation is a much worse position from a cost/benefit perspective because your situation is no better than most general preppers, but it cost you a LOT more to be that way.

That being said, if the SHTF, Survivalists really will do better than average. Yes, tons will fail miserably, but a far higher percentage of non-survivalists will fail worse. Sustainers will do the best, if for no other reason then because they have useful skills, land, and equipment they can barter for protection. General preppers will also do better on average because they will be better prepared to hide out during the earliest and most dangerous days, and also better prepared to survive anywhere they find themselves. Heck, if things ever did go down the tubes just owning a survival guide and a single small bottle of water purification tablets could be the difference between life and death... And that would only run you about $40.
 
2013-02-22 07:38:13 PM

what_now: He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine


Cool
and since you know their address, you do not need to pack one yourself you can simply take theirs and survive twice as long.
You should thank your friends for being so considerate.

// local bar does not serve bitters, and the nearest place to get good sushi is a mortal enemy of my hosts
/ got bitters
 
2013-02-22 07:39:51 PM

Knucklepopper: This is why no Californian will ever survive a catastrophe.


Maybe that's my clever Pennsylvanian plan. I never prepped for a thing in my life.

But my hobbies have already prepared me to live indefinitely without society's aid, not that I would because I like ibuprofin, gin, and the internet, but I know enough about most things I could hack it in the wilderness long enough to build a farm.
 
2013-02-22 07:43:12 PM

nmemkha: Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.


Very nice.  Don't bother preparing or stocking up because the much large number of unprepared will just take your stuff.

I suppose they'll get what I've got eventually, but there will be fewer of them to after the next guy by the time they get to my stuff.

I knew there was a reason I had you in retard red
 
2013-02-22 07:44:47 PM
There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.
 
2013-02-22 07:45:11 PM
^^^^^^^^^^

Well then, I guess I'm a Sustainer. Sounds so nuturing. I will gather the townsfolk at my farm, and they will be my peasants, and I their Lord, and we will work together to grow food under my benevolent guidance.

/at first...
 
2013-02-22 07:45:27 PM
The difference between preppers and survivalists? One group gets to keep the stuff they've saved and survive, the other gets to share their supplies with everyone who didn't make plans (whether they want to or not) and end up just at bad off as everyone else.
 
2013-02-22 07:45:29 PM

pedrop357: nmemkha: Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.

Very nice.  Don't bother preparing or stocking up because the much large number of unprepared will just take your stuff.

I suppose they'll get what I've got eventually, but there will be fewer of them to after the next guy by the time they get to my stuff.

I knew there was a reason I had you in retard red


BTW, I'm no prepper, but I do keep the cabinets and freezer stocked.
 
2013-02-22 07:45:55 PM
This is a thread full of dumb. I hope none of you have insurance either. I love how the new breed of ultra liberal is approaching GOP levels of thinking stupid shiat.

"Omg, a first aid kit and a few weeks of canned food and water", guy must be a psychopath who at best sits around praying for Yellowstone to blow, but is probably starting up an anti Obama militia!

I realize that closeted Boy Scouts may have touched you inappropriately as children, forever poisoning you against the idea of "be prepared", but c'mon guys.

As much as I dislike Mormons and Mormonism, as part of my disliking religious people in general, I never thought that their "years supply" ideas were stupid. Hint: being injured and out of work for an extended period of time, you might bless a pantry full of canned and dry goods.
 
2013-02-22 07:45:56 PM
This is my survival stash: a package of noodles that I've been carting around during various house moves for the past 20-some years. Because if financial disaster strikes and all I can afford to eat is Ramen, at least it'll be the good kind from the Korean store.
www.ezionmarket.com
 
2013-02-22 07:46:16 PM
I like to prepare for the zombie apocalypse  Not because I think one will actually happen, nor do I want one to happen, but because 95% of zombie apocalypse preparedness transfers over to other disasters, and zombie apocalypse preparations are fun. Supplies of food, water, medication and tools, printed maps of the area, physical fitness training, firearm readiness, knowing travel routes, getting to know my neighbors, all these things will help in the event of any other disaster. I live in the Bay Area, this could just as easily be labeled 'earthquake preparations' but then, honestly, it wouldn't be very high on the day to day priority list.
I think 'the line' is where you're taking actions that will only pay off in event of a huge total-collapse disaster. Someone who 'prepares for the end' by stocking up on ammunition is really just someone who wants to break the social contract. I've got a saying: "There's two kinds of people who follow the law: Those who believe in the purpose of the law, and those who fear punishment for breaking it." People in the second category like to fantasize about when they can go around shooting people without any response, usually with the idea that they're the only ones who 'have it figured out that the law is for suckers.'
 
2013-02-22 07:46:33 PM

arentol: Not all preppers are survivalists, but all survivalists are preppers. :)


A really good read. Thank you.
 
2013-02-22 07:46:57 PM

pedrop357: nmemkha: I knew there was a reason I had you in retard red


I'm sure the guys who have made bank off your paranoia think you're the best! There is a reason why 'Preppers' is on the same network as 'Amish Mafia'.

/A fool and his money
 
2013-02-22 07:47:51 PM

super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.


meta or poe's law?

What if they decide that independence from society is part of the "social contract"?  I mean anyone can assert damn near anything as being in the social contract given that it's not a real document.
 
2013-02-22 07:47:55 PM
My recent "prepper" experience (and I do use that term very, very lightly). In my 'hood we have overhead power lines.  Consequence is as such, at least several times each winter and even sometimes in the summer, due to high winds/snow/aliens/whatever our power goes out for a few hours.  Now, I was a Girl Scout, so I am usually prepared for minor emergencies.  Instead of sitting in the dark waiting for the power and heat to come back on, I pulled out my emergency box of candles (tea lights and lots of 'em), my Maglite and a fresh pack of batteries as well as located our extra blankets and sheets if we were all going to have to trap ourselves in one room to conserve heat (I live with 3 men, and no, not as giggity as it sounds).  I knew where everything was and it only took me about 10 minutes to get my house ok for the duration.  I was proud of me.  Ok, not quite prepper level but I used to be there.  I had a pantry with approximately 3 months worth of food for 2 people and over 100 rolls of TP at one point.  Trouble is now I don't have quite the space I used to, but I'm working on retrofitting the closet in the office to become our new backup supply storage area.  Oh yeah, and we have guns too, but not a whole bunch of them and everyone in my house goes to the shooting range at least once a year so that we ensure that we basically know how to operate them if we ever would need to-heaven forefend.
 
2013-02-22 07:48:12 PM

pedrop357: pedrop357: nmemkha: Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.

Very nice.  Don't bother preparing or stocking up because the much large number of unprepared will just take your stuff.

I suppose they'll get what I've got eventually, but there will be fewer of them to after the next guy by the time they get to my stuff.

I knew there was a reason I had you in retard red

BTW, I'm no prepper, but I do keep the cabinets and freezer stocked.


lol bullshiat. You're like a pedophile saying he just likes naked boy art.
 
2013-02-22 07:49:36 PM

super_grass: Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing


No you don't.

You can't force a contract upon people without their explicit consent. It's no agreement at all.

In fact, you're almost morally obligated to resist such a gross offense just out of principle. Luckily for all of us, society doesn't work how you say it does. Society is not an obligation, it's a choice.
 
2013-02-22 07:50:13 PM
For some people, having a decent supply of food (and grow some of their own), their own water supply as well as a way to heat their house without having to rely on oil or gas, is simply a way of life, and not some sort of wacko cult thing.

We just got tired of city life a few years ago, found a quiet place far from traffic, noise, crowds and all bad energy that goes along with it.

We're not interested in driving to town every week to load up on groceries, plus winters in these parts can be long with a lot of snow, so we're not "prepping" for a UN takeover, an alien invasion or "civil unrest". As for natural disasters, the only thing that could happen would be our mountain blowing apart, but fancy scientists from the big city have assured us, that it's not going to happen. If it does, we won't need our food supplies anyway.
 
2013-02-22 07:50:23 PM

Rapmaster2000: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

I work with a prepper. He's an alright guy.

However, while it's good that he has a lot of supplies, his biggest impediment in a disaster is clearly going to be his weight.  It's going to be hard to evade back the rampaging zombie horde when you're defeated by a flight of stairs.


www.murphysmayhem.com

I am not in peak physical condition, but I do exercise regularly and I maintain a body weight that, while not currently ideal, still classifies me as being of "normal" weight rather than overweight.

/Need more ammunition, however.
 
2013-02-22 07:52:26 PM
crazy vs insane

dumb vs stupid

scared vs petrfied


rich vs wealthy

poor vs broke

smart vs intelligent

finish vs done

derp vs herp
 
2013-02-22 07:52:37 PM

jso2897: way south: FreetardoRivera: When the shiat hits the fan I am going to eat the preppers and take all of their stuff.
SSSS

Sounds like a plan for taking on heavily armed citizens...
But if you're coming around these parts, mind you don't step on a foot breaker.
They've been popular with the pot growers, and I'd imagine their numbers will multiply.

/Truth be told I'd be more afraid of the preppers doing the hunting.
/many of them have poorly thought out plans, lots of weapons, and a drive to survive.

Too bad they lack the intelligence to devote their efforts to helping their civilization survive instead of wasting time and money on a long shot gamble that they will somehow survive it's failure. Most of the same people who always worry about "society's breakdown" are the same ones who cry like little biatches when they are asked to pay their taxes.




You've wrapped a half dozen stereotypes together into one big strawman... Congratulations, I think?
 
2013-02-22 07:53:01 PM

Securitywyrm: "There's two kinds of people who follow the law: Those who believe in the purpose of the law, and those who fear punishment for breaking it."


Most people who follow the spirit of the law have to break the letter of it.

Example
 
2013-02-22 07:53:03 PM

super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.


My society is me and my local neighbors. That's it. I look out for and defend them. Society at large? Government? Why do I have a "contract" with anyone that I neither know or care about? How many if them would stop to help me? How many people in, say, New York or LA would give a shiat about me? None?

In this world you can only rely on those in your knot of people. Look out for them, and be prepared for anything.

We as a society have lost a lot of what matters and our pride in living independently by believing this farking drivel about how society means interdependence and relying on others for your own basic well being and necessities.

You go join a city and be good little worker bee if you want to, I prefer to be independent as much as possible, including being prepared for situations where I might have to deal with losing power or something, so as to not be a burden on responders and such.
 
2013-02-22 07:54:14 PM

jfarkinB: olddinosaur: Corpus Christi has been hit seven times by hurricanes between 1919 and 1980; and since that---nothing.  It has been 33 years and we are long overdue.

When The End Of The World As We Know It comes, I will establish dominion over all those who don't understand how probability (expected frequency of uncorrelated events) works.


Hey, I'm good at math. Can I be on your team? I promise I won't bogart all the canned peaches...
 
2013-02-22 07:56:21 PM

titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.


So you survived a 12-hour blackout! What a survivor you are.

If my power went out for a whole 12 hours I'd probably starve to death or kill myself from a lack on internet and TV.

/went 8 days without power after a hurricane
//no AC all that time in August on the farking gulf coast
///lived to tell the tale - and rake up 70 garbage bags worth of tree branches and shiat that the storm brought down
 
2013-02-22 07:58:23 PM
img.myconfinedspace.com
 
2013-02-22 07:58:32 PM

pedrop357: super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.

meta or poe's law?

What if they decide that independence from society is part of the "social contract"?  I mean anyone can assert damn near anything as being in the social contract given that it's not a real document.


Your so called "rugged individualism" is delusion at best and a mental disorder at worst.

Civilization survives only when everyone in it depends on its survival.  Do you think that ant colonies can exist if individual ants were capable of realizing that they can survive on their own? Unfortunately, people have the free will to mistakenly separate themselves from the good of the many and this is why we evolved ridicule to keep people in check.  It's too bad that mockery alone is inadequate for the newest generation of idiots and now they're allowed to continue their retardation without being tarred and feathered.

Just don't be surprised when we come knocking at your door to take your hoarded supplies when disaster strikes.
 
2013-02-22 07:59:57 PM

super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.


Founding fathers though the opposite. They reckoned that dependence, (financial) stifled the free exchange of ideas. Would you contradict your employer? Your landlord? A big difference however, was that back then freedom was thought of as a national thing, and these days it's thought of as an individual thing.

I'm heading toward prepperville. In my view, though, the calamity would be losing my job. What I want is the land and wits to be self-sufficient. I'll still vote. Oddly enough, the deeper I get into technology, the more interested I get in the basics.
 
2013-02-22 08:00:25 PM

super_grass: Civilization survives only when everyone in it depends on its survival. Do you think that ant colonies can exist if individual ants were capable of realizing that they can survive on their own? Unfortunately, people have the free will to mistakenly separate themselves from the good of the many and this is why we evolved ridicule to keep people in check. It's too bad that mockery alone is inadequate for the newest generation of idiots and now they're allowed to continue their retardation without being tarred and feathered.

Just don't be surprised when we come knocking at your door to take your hoarded supplies when disaster strikes.


This has to be an example of Poe's law, right?
 
2013-02-22 08:00:43 PM

super_grass: Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.


That's cool. You tell that to the rioting mobs when the city looks like this:
iamkoream.com

promoreports.in

You'll see this view of me:
sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2013-02-22 08:01:05 PM

super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.


I am uncertain that I should accept advice regarding societal bonds from a psychopath who advocated executing all firearm owners.
 
2013-02-22 08:01:16 PM

WordyGrrl: This is my survival stash: a package of noodles that I've been carting around during various house moves for the past 20-some years. Because if financial disaster strikes and all I can afford to eat is Ramen, at least it'll be the good kind from the Korean store.
[www.ezionmarket.com image 300x300]


i got ippechan ramen

www.ramenplace.com
 
2013-02-22 08:01:28 PM

super_grass: Do you think that ant colonies can exist if individual ants were capable of realizing that they can survive on their own?


Ants can't survive on their own. They're mostly females without working reproductive systems and any males die after mating once, anyway. Even assuming they did break with the colony and strike out alone, the species would be extinct by the act. The colony is not a society, it is the family unit.
 
2013-02-22 08:02:22 PM

MrSteve007: super_grass: Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.

That's cool. You tell that to the rioting mobs when the city looks like this:
[iamkoream.com image 803x388]

[promoreports.in image 800x1124]

You'll see this view of me:
[sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net image 850x1133]


You'll either have your boat taken by pirates or mobs of angry, hungry people when you dock for supplies.

Thanks for the boat, by the way.
 
2013-02-22 08:05:16 PM

Jon iz teh kewl: WordyGrrl: This is my survival stash: a package of noodles that I've been carting around during various house moves for the past 20-some years. Because if financial disaster strikes and all I can afford to eat is Ramen, at least it'll be the good kind from the Korean store.
[www.ezionmarket.com image 300x300]

i got ippechan ramen

[www.ramenplace.com image 800x600]


That nutrition label is lying about the sodium content.
 
2013-02-22 08:06:08 PM
i know.  i have the same shiat at home and it lists 1900+ mg
 
2013-02-22 08:06:25 PM

thisispete: I also have a spade to dig a latrine in the backyard


If you ever make it to the US, whatever you do, don't call them that.
 
2013-02-22 08:06:30 PM
I didn't mean to sushijack this thread guys. I could have used artisan infused gin or locally sourced Brussels sprouts and gotten the same point across
 
2013-02-22 08:08:58 PM
www.ivy-style.com
 
2013-02-22 08:10:13 PM

jalora: Damn you forever, Nathan Holn!


Lol. Nice.
 
2013-02-22 08:10:42 PM
Car+ lasting food, distilled water, gas and blankets in the trunk. Bin-liners for waterproofing.
/bout $50, negligible weight, be stupid not to.
//only since I moved to the states though. Savages :/
 
2013-02-22 08:14:33 PM

timujin: While it's true that they're different, a Venn diagram of these two groups would have a lot of overlap.




I want you with me when the end comes - Venn diagrams are going to be very useful.

/I keed.
 
2013-02-22 08:15:27 PM

Knucklepopper: duenor: Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.

I have carpentry, medical, and metalworking skills for trade. I'm pretty sure I could work out a trade anywhere.

Yeah, well I have bartending, so line starts behind me, buddy.


Winemaking experience here, so take a step back, friend.
 
2013-02-22 08:17:08 PM
I like freeze dried strawberries.
 
2013-02-22 08:17:44 PM
Well of course they are going to demonize anyone with any bit of independence, how else are they going to get suckers to pay 10 dollars for a half quart of water when things get shiatty? They need to build a culture of dependence, in which a nation of children look at big daddy government and stretch out grubby hands whenever things get tough going "GIMMIE GIMMIE GIMMIE, PLEASE CHANGE MY POOPY PANTS!"

If they do not try to portray everyone who plans for the worst as crazies, then the common sense ideas might catch on.
 
2013-02-22 08:19:42 PM

Happy Hours: titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.

So you survived a 12-hour blackout! What a survivor you are.

If my power went out for a whole 12 hours I'd probably starve to death or kill myself from a lack on internet and TV.

/went 8 days without power after a hurricane
//no AC all that time in August on the farking gulf coast
///lived to tell the tale - and rake up 70 garbage bags worth of tree branches and shiat that the storm brought down


I see you glanced over the part where I was evacuated from my home once also just so you could be a smug asshole. Sometimes it takes a small inconvenience to realize what preparations you have made and what you may need to improve. I have also joined the CERT program so I can effectively help those that may not be ready when another wildfire blows through town.
 
2013-02-22 08:29:24 PM
years of fire evacuations, as well as living with earthquakes teach you that it's smart to prepare in small to moderate ways.  I'm not building a castle with gun turrets.  I'm simply aware that with very limited ways in and out of this town food will be gone from stores very quickly.  They tell you to prepare for 3 days.  Safe is more like two weeks.
 
2013-02-22 08:29:30 PM

thamike: Ow! That was my feelings!: gweilo8888: GAT_00: what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.

You can't get takeout sushi that is good in Boston?, anywhere. Full stop. If it's takeout, it's not sushi.

FTFY.


Nice, a sushi expert from Tennessee.  You are hilariously wrong.

Well, technically, it would still be sushi.  You can get that at the supermarket in little plastic boxes, too.  But Sushi involves sitting at a sushi bar and interacting with a sushi chef who lives his art and knows what you want before you do.  I don't know how Boston  or Tennessee fare, and I wouldn't assume that there's no great sushi joints there, but "take-out sushi" sounds kind of counterproductive.

/Los Angeles.


Sometimes you just want to eat rice and fish in a nice little package. What do you have against rice and fish?
 
2013-02-22 08:31:30 PM

foxyshadis: What do you have against rice and fish?


Currently? My small intestines.

Also don't forget horse. Horse is best sushi.
 
2013-02-22 08:33:40 PM

arentol: Not all preppers are survivalists, but all survivalists are preppers. :)

In other words, survivalists are just a sub-set of preppers. The Venn diagram would be a big circle (Preppers) with a little circle (Survivalists) entirely inside it.

The people in this article are in another subset of preppers, also fully contained in the Venn diagram above, and partially overlapping with Survivalists. This group doesn't have a name but I would call them Sustainers, because they are already partially self-sustaining.

The difference between all these groups has very little to do with guns aside from the fact that basically all survivalists have firearms while only most of the non-survivalist prepper's have them. The real differences are about mindset, training, preparation, and organization.

Survivalists tend to have the mindset that when the SHTF (and they KNOW it will) they will go to a preplanned remote area and live off the land. They usually have formal training in wilderness survival techniques. Their preparation level varies from a backpack with survival gear to a pre-stocked car, cabin, or compound, and they have firearms. They are sometimes organized in large groups.

Sustainers tend to have the mindset that when the SHTF they will live where they already live, but spend more time on growing their own food and maintaining the property they are already living on and partly off of. They already know how to use all their equipment and need no training, they usually have firearms. Their preparation level is everything they own, so it is pretty high. They are rarely found in groups.

The remaining "general" preppers have a mindset that varies from believing things will never be bad for all that long and the government will put it right, to believing that the S will really HTF. They don't do little or no training, but have some survival guides and maybe watch some survival shows on TV, they usually have firearms. Their preparation level is only enough for their personal worst case scenario, and usually includes a backpack in case they have to "bug out". They are never found in groups.

Being a general prepper can be cheap and easy and take very little time. If something bad does happen a general prepper and their family are more likely to be comfortable during the crisis, and more likely to survive if it is a relative long lasting situation (like power and water are out for a month and roads are all blocked). Katrina and Sandy have shown us that natural disasters, if large enough, can make life much more difficult for a short while, and that is when being a prepper can pay off. Being a Survivalist or Sustainer in that same situation is a much worse position from a cost/benefit perspective because your situation is no better than most general preppers, but it cost you a LOT more to be that way.

That being said, if the SHTF, Survivalists really will do better than average. Yes, tons will fail miserably, but a far higher percentage of non-survivalists will fail worse. Sustainers will do the best, if for no other reason then because they have useful skills, land, and equipment they can barter for protection. General preppers will also do better on average because they will be better prepared to hide out during the earliest and most dangerous days, and also better prepared to survive anywhere they find themselves. Heck, if things ever did go down the tubes just owning a survival guide and a single small bottle of water purification tablets could be the difference between life and death... And that would only run you about $40.


Well put. I wanted to say the same, but you hit the proverbial nail.
 
2013-02-22 08:34:13 PM

specialkae: Now, I was a Girl Scout  ... I had a pantry with ... over 100 rolls of TP


Why do women think that hoarding Toilet Paper is the same as being disaster  prepared? Every time that the local news says that there is a dangerous storm coming through the supermarket shelves are often empty of TP.

Maybe for women having TP is like an addiction. I haven't seen any storm stories about coffee or tobacco being bought out though stories about long lines at the liquor store are common.
 
2013-02-22 08:34:19 PM

super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.


That sounds really cute on paper. You obviously haven't been around when a portion of society runs amok. Get back to me when you see houses on your street on fire, hear constant gun fire and see law enforcement in dire straits trying to contain the situation. Been there, experienced it. Once is enough. Don't tell me I have no rights because I tried to stay alive, shmuck!

/ 60th & Vermont, L.A.
//4/29/92
///caucasian
 
2013-02-22 08:43:25 PM

nmemkha: pedrop357: BTW, I'm no prepper, but I do keep the cabinets and freezer stocked.

lol bullshiat. You're like a pedophile saying he just likes naked boy art.


i4.ytimg.com
 
2013-02-22 08:43:49 PM

SurelyShirley: super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.

That sounds really cute on paper. You obviously haven't been around when a portion of society runs amok. Get back to me when you see houses on your street on fire, hear constant gun fire and see law enforcement in dire straits trying to contain the situation. Been there, experienced it. Once is enough. Don't tell me I have no rights because I tried to stay alive, shmuck!

/ 60th & Vermont, L.A.
//4/29/92
///caucasian


You are attempting to employ reasoning with a known psychopath.
 
2013-02-22 08:53:29 PM
It's comforting to know that if something catastrophic really did happen, 95% of Farkers would be dead, but their pretentiousness would probably live on.
 
2013-02-22 08:56:18 PM

nmemkha: Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.


Any person who lives in our civilization, and doesn't realize that his only real hope for survival is the survival of that civilization is an idiot.
 
2013-02-22 08:59:19 PM
Without having read the article or the comment thread, please allow me to say this:

No. There is no difference. Both groups are nuts.
 
2013-02-22 09:03:16 PM

jso2897: nmemkha: Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.

Any person who lives in our civilization, and doesn't realize that his only real hope for survival is the survival of that civilization is an idiot.


Oh really? I think you must not be very well versed in parts of society not clogged with people.
 
2013-02-22 09:06:49 PM

ravenlore: spiderpaz: I live in suburbia, so there's only so much I can prepare for.  I've got the supplies I would need to filter the water in my hot tub.  I've got a vegetable garden (mostly because I like fresh veggies).  I've got 2 months worth of freeze dried food (definitely my most "prepper" like asset) for me, my wife, and our baby boy.

I figure the most insane natural disaster I can be prepared for is at most 2 months (like an earthquake breaking every water line in town, and a flood wiping out the roads.  Anything more serious than that, and you are kidding yourself if you think you're going to be okeedokie and self sufficient.  If something crazy like that were to happen I'd just move back to my Dad's ranch where I was living before I moved into town.  Being a farmer is really the only realistic way to survive something that serious.

That being said, it seems like the people really enthused about preparing for the end are the ones that are not prepared for the present - i.e. impoverished rednecks who are economic failures.  It's like they lost at life, so they make themselves feel better by convincing themselves they're going to be on top when society breaks down.

Do you mind if i quote that last paragraph EVERWHERE? Because it is the most accurate description i have ever heard of some folks I know.


quote your face off
 
2013-02-22 09:08:56 PM
"Only when the people have grown to where the government is wanted but not needed will there be government of the people, by the people, and for the people." - Robert Patrician
 
2013-02-22 09:12:18 PM

what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?


...well, the line is somewhere between "a week's worth of canned goods" and "enough canned goods that you never actually have to buy food again."

"Collecting your own urine" is a bit further past the latter.

"Collecting your own shiat" isn't on the map at all.
 
2013-02-22 09:12:51 PM
When y2k was approaching people asked if I was making any preparations.  I told them, "Yep. I have several thousand rounds of ammo.  I'm storing my supplies at my neighbors' houses, they just don't know it."

In reality, all I did was grab a couple of hundred dollars out of an ATM just in case there were any banking problems.
 
2013-02-22 09:13:53 PM

puppetmaster745: Knucklepopper: duenor: Nutsac_Jim: Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.

I have carpentry, medical, and metalworking skills for trade. I'm pretty sure I could work out a trade anywhere.

Yeah, well I have bartending, so line starts behind me, buddy.

Winemaking experience here, so take a step back, friend.


Well, shiat.
 
2013-02-22 09:14:41 PM

Gyrfalcon: Here's the thing: We've HAD a huge, civilization-wide disaster of unimaginable proportions. It devastated an entire continent, killed one-third of the population, emptied entire towns. It's known today as the Black Death.

And yet: With people dropping and dying in the streets (some cities recorded death tolls as high as 70%), zero medical care except prayer and leeches, and virtually no social controls like we have today, society DIDN'T collapse, and cities DIDN'T devolve into anarchy. There were some bad things, of course, nobody would pretend the mass Jew burnings and witch hunts and Flagellants were great--but there wasn't mass chaos.

I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?


Believe me, I'm more with you than the survivalists but what you said is totally irrelevant.  Back then they were an agrarian society.  They lived much more like the preppers do than you do.  They didn't depend on grocery stores.  Most people lived in the country.  Pandemic would be MUCH MUCH worse today.
 
2013-02-22 09:21:10 PM

Gyrfalcon: Here's the thing: We've HAD a huge, civilization-wide disaster of unimaginable proportions. It devastated an entire continent, killed one-third of the population, emptied entire towns. It's known today as the Black Death.

And yet: With people dropping and dying in the streets (some cities recorded death tolls as high as 70%), zero medical care except prayer and leeches, and virtually no social controls like we have today, society DIDN'T collapse, and cities DIDN'T devolve into anarchy. There were some bad things, of course, nobody would pretend the mass Jew burnings and witch hunts and Flagellants were great--but there wasn't mass chaos.

I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?


I'm sure the Jew burnings would have gone differently if all those Jews had filled their basements with guns and canned goods....
 
2013-02-22 09:27:22 PM

Ceiling Moran: Without having read the article or the comment thread, please allow me to say this:

No. There is no difference. Both groups are nuts.


You are correct. Any individual who prepares for the possibility that utilities, services and stores will be inaccessible for any duration is mentally unstable.
 
2013-02-22 09:31:13 PM
I've been in a major city that came within 24 hours of complete meltdown. I'm talking about Atlanta, and I'm talking about the gas shortage crisis a few years back that everyone has forgotten about. Towards the end everyone was running on fumes and there were about 3 gas stations that had fuel in a city of more than 5 million people.

The gasoline did start flowing again, but we were dangerously close to cars running out of gas on the interstate en masse, bringing traffic between states to a standstill. And if the gas had not come there would be no where for those people to go. They would just have to abandon their vehicles and fend for themselves. Seriously, another 12 hours and the National Guard would have had to have been called in.

And we never got so much as an explanation. Society almost failed in the 10th largest metropolitan area of a supposedly first world country and all we got was a collective shrug.

Don't take things for granted. Your security is not really as certain as you think.

/yeah, okay, that sounded crazy.
 
2013-02-22 09:36:54 PM

KrustyKitten: titwrench: I have enough food and water to last me a 2 weeks (not rationing) in case of emergency, 5 weeks if I ration and take in the bare minimum. It is packed in such a way that I can be out of the house within 5 minutes with everything including important documents, camping gear and my guns (taking them just so they are not left behind). I live in earthquake and fire land and have had to evecuate for a fire once. I also have a few survival related items in my truck at all times just in case I get stuck 4 wheeling I can hole up for a couple days. My friends think I am weird, at least they did until all of the power in San Diego and surrounding areas went out for 12 hours about a year and a half ago, I was the only one that had electricity (generator). You can be prepered without being a crackpot.

Thanks for bringing the SD thing from a year or two ago.  People started freaking out because they couldn't pump gas or buy groceries for just 5 little hours.
Can you imagine an EQ large enough to knock out services for a week or two with emergency services redirected to even harder hit areas than yours?  I stockpile at least 2 weeks worth of drinking water, people food, pet food, never let the gas get under a half tank, etc.  That also Includes weapons and an evac plan with meet up points for loved ones, if necessary.  I am not going to be stuck in this hellhole when people start really losing it.

That's just prepared, not crazy at all.

Right?


IMO, and I'm a fellow Californian, you are not crazy. A major earthquake is a definite possibility. I should be as prepared as you, but I only have a few days' worth of supplies and no firearms.

To me, it's all about a sense of proportion.

Two weeks' worth of supplies, one or two guns for personal defense (since you're a city dweller, I'm ruling out hunting firearms) and gas in the car so you can bug out as soon as roads clear is not unreasonable. But one earthquake won't wipe out an entire state, so CA will still have some functioning areas after "the big one" hits.

More than six months worth of supplies, more guns and ammo than you can carry and turning your home into a heavily fortified bunker so you can defend your stuff and wait out "TEOTWAKI" is not.
 
2013-02-22 09:37:12 PM
I don't hoard emergency supplies. I hoard nitrous oxide, the addresses of preppers, and I keep the tanks for my cutting torch full.
 
2013-02-22 09:37:58 PM
When the apocalypse hits, if I can't barter my skills I'll just pillage until I'm shot.  Who cares.
 
2013-02-22 09:56:15 PM
I think the primary difference is: survivalists have this apocalyptic hero fantasy and actually seem eager for shiat to go down, while preppers fervently hope they never have to use their emergency gear and guns. Or I may have that backwards. Anyway, there's preparedness and then there's paranoia.
 
2013-02-22 09:58:32 PM

atomicmask: Well of course they are going to demonize anyone with any bit of independence, how else are they going to get suckers to pay 10 dollars for a half quart of water when things get shiatty? They need to build a culture of dependence, in which a nation of children look at big daddy government and stretch out grubby hands whenever things get tough going "GIMMIE GIMMIE GIMMIE, PLEASE CHANGE MY POOPY PANTS!"

If they do not try to portray everyone who plans for the worst as crazies, then the common sense ideas might catch on.


Oh, bullshiat - stop with the 'gubmint wants us to be unprepared' crap, it's that sort of rhetoric that makes otherwise-sensible preppers sound stupid.

If you go to any state, county, or municipal website, they'll have links to information about being prepared for emergencies.  No government would be unhappy about people being able to sustain themselves in a natural or man-made disaster.
 
2013-02-22 10:11:57 PM

Dimensio: You are correct. Any individual who prepares for the possibility that utilities, services and stores will be inaccessible for any duration is mentally unstable.


The Government is ever- benevolent and all- knowing; the Government will always look after you, no matter how dire the emergency. If you doubt this, you are a crazy fringe extremist redneck.
 
2013-02-22 10:13:14 PM

WordyGrrl: This is my survival stash: a package of noodles that I've been carting around during various house moves for the past 20-some years. Because if financial disaster strikes and all I can afford to eat is Ramen, at least it'll be the good kind from the Korean store.
[www.ezionmarket.com image 300x300]


My god I love those noodles. Whenever I go to Tops they only have about a dozen packages on the shelf and I usually buy all of them.


As for preppers and survivalists... obviously it's open to interpretation.

I'm a prepper in the regard that I have just enough skills and firepower that I'm prepared to compete for resources against the rest of the population for food, clean water and the coveted title and office of 'He Who Runs Bartertown'

westernrifleshooters.files.wordpress.com


And that's what it would boil down to.

... but it's a future I'd rather not experience and preparation of such an event has nothing to do with the reasons I own my guns (I just like shooting!)

In the case of a disaster without societal recovery inside of a couple months there are two fundamental situational facts:

-by stockpiling resources you are (knowingly or otherwise) only staving off the time you have before you're forced to hunt/gather in the scary world vs all the rest of us.
-by stockpiling weapons and ammo you are trying to get a leg up on the inhumane realities you will most certainly experience

I'm not sure which one is the survivalist and which is the prepper, but I think the terminating line between sane and insane is in:
-what you are stockpiling and why
and more importantly
-could your survival plan best be described as one of "isolated survival"? (if yes you are most certainly stupid and possibly insane)

Food and other resources for you and yours makes sense for any interruption of grocery store supply lines. Though the degree at which this is done might take you out of "makes sense" category.

Guns and ammo stockpiling shows a deliberate preparation for war against your fellow neighbors. Having a few falls into the "being prepared to defend myself" category, while having much and many falls into either "prepared to kill all my neighbors before they kill me" category or the "ready to go out in a blaze of glory" category which notably has nothing to do with survival

No one but a very select few wants to see some dystopian future happen. While it's certainly possible, associating with a community that makes the guns and ammo stockpiling something their lives rotate around is unhealthy and antisocial at it's root... and while not a big deal for the fringe few to entertain, the larger a movement like that grows (to say, the larger population percentages of a society grow), the closer it's anti-society preparations have the chance of being a self-fulfilling prophecy.
And from that perspective, these people may be their own worst enemies.

And I say this as a vet with plenty of guns and ammo :P living in a very very rural, Republican, prepper/gunnut friendly community. (but you know the saying "above all else, to thine own self be true")

The only way to survive a collapse of society is to replace that lost society with a new one. Reintegration with your neighbors, building new supply lines and securing new alliances with others doing the same. Helping others so they will (hopefully) in turn help you.

All holing up in the ground or hiding on a ranch in the middle of nowhere does for you is isolates you from your two most important resources in a situation like that:

-like-minded non-insane people
-information about what is going on in the world around you.

Why most important?
Sheltering yourself from the world is the antithesis of preparation.
You cannot prepare for something you do not know about.

The only thing better than having enough guns and food to survive a one man war against whomever is not being one man (attacker dissuasion/safety in numbers) or to know their movements and avoid them entirely.

It reminds me of my favorite Patton quote: "No one ever defended anything successfully. There is only attack and attack and attack some more."
In this case, the thing a wise person will be attacking is the very collapse of society itself, by facilitating rebuilding and reintegration.

Attempting to preserve the integrity of your own little bubble is beyond idiotic and is the very reason we laugh at the typical stereotype we call prepper/survivalist.
 
2013-02-22 10:14:51 PM
If you aren't prepared to support yourself during emergencies, you're willing to entrust your well-being to divine providence or the charity of others. Either way you're an idiot.
 
2013-02-22 10:17:32 PM

HairBolus: duenor: HairBolus: duenor: Where were nice army reservists where my friends were getting shot at by looters as they were trying to give out supplies in LA?

Have you had your meds checked recently? You seem delusional and prone to make up fantasies and then believe they actually happened.

Ad Hominem, I see.

I can't validate my friends' stories because they were never covered by the media.

What I doubt is that you live in New Orleans and that you actually have face to face friends that were shot at while trying to be good Samaritans during Katrina. Lots of stuff was made up during Katrina to fit a "dangerous animal" narrative as was lots of stuff denied such as cops killing blacks for trying to walk out of NO.

I still think you are delusional and need of a med check and that you consider someone to be a "friend" if you have read something they wrote on the internet in a racist survivalist nutjob vein.


I can't speak for duenor, but I had a coworker that was doing boat rescues in New Orleans after Katrina (he lived out in Houma).  According to him, he stopped after the first or second run out there to help people because he was getting shot at.

So, yeah, I knew a face-to-face friend/colleague who said he was shot at while trying to be a good Samaritan.
 
2013-02-22 10:18:20 PM
I grew up in the Snow Belt, and we've always had extra food, batteries, radios, and other things to make life easier when you're snowed in or there's a blackout (or both). I keep enough to get by until I can get more. Have a couple guns, nothing fancy, and I don't fantasize about getting into any epic shootouts with the government, zombies, or aliens. (or government zombie aliens, whichever you prefer). The last thing I want to do in an extreme situation is to pick a fight. Even more so if I were on the move with just what I could carry on my back.

I do not know more than a few (four, to be exact) people who qualify for the term "prepper". I know one who's a "survivalist" hands down, but the other three are as normal as you'd expect to meet. No black helicopter discussions with those folks. The other guy is a little out there, but not dangerously so in my opinion. I still believe in the Boy Scout motto, "Be Prepared". It can't hurt, as long as you don't go overboard.
 
2013-02-22 10:27:18 PM
When did having a few extra supplies on hand become a liberal hate magnet?

For all the Haters a little punk tune:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAl3iQupaFU

I live in an earthquake zone... I need a couple weeks supplies. Is them meme now to beg and rob in case of disaster or 1992 riots?
 
2013-02-22 10:31:28 PM

SurelyShirley: super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.

That sounds really cute on paper. You obviously haven't been around when a portion of society runs amok. Get back to me when you see houses on your street on fire, hear constant gun fire and see law enforcement in dire straits trying to contain the situation. Been there, experienced it. Once is enough. Don't tell me I have no rights because I tried to stay alive, shmuck!

/ 60th & Vermont, L.A.
//4/29/92
///caucasian


Racist detected.
 
2013-02-22 10:31:33 PM

TerminalEchoes: It's comforting to know that if something catastrophic really did happen, 95% of Farkers would be dead, but their pretentiousness would probably live on.


Come now, that's a bit harsh; who says they'll be dead? Their meme- propagating skills, recondite knowledge of ephemeral pop- culture trivia, and total contempt for the lowly redneck trash that currently keep them warm, housed and fed would likely stand Farkers in good stead during a civilizational collapse. Rebuilding a new society would require the talents not only of farmers, carpenters, and technicians, but also of anime fans, jejune Internet atheists and cat- hoarding social isolates.
 
2013-02-22 10:32:34 PM

what_now: I have a good friend who has over a dozen guns, complete with cases, ammo and cleaning supplies hidden in various places in his apartment. He and his partner have a backpack each with disaster supplies and medicine.

Both of these men would shrivel up and die if they couldn't get takeout sushi, or the bar ran out of bitters. It's....really really weird.


have a go-bag in case of emergency. and if i have to walk anywhere near a mile with it i'll drop dead of a heart attack, no doubt. i've gone to funerals of people more physically fit than i.
 
2013-02-22 10:36:38 PM

super_grass: Racist detected.


I'm looking forward to the day when racist detectors are placed in every home like carbon monoxide detectors, except that the racist detectors will never run out of batteries and will wirelessly transmit information to a central data warehouse staffed exclusively by grumpy black women.
 
2013-02-22 10:39:43 PM
She plagiarized when she said "Mutant Zombie Bikers" from the book Light's Out. In Light's Out, the survivors call the people they are protecting themselves from are "Mutant Zombie Bikers". She did not credit the book!
 
2013-02-22 10:44:57 PM

spiderpaz: Gyrfalcon: Here's the thing: We've HAD a huge, civilization-wide disaster of unimaginable proportions. It devastated an entire continent, killed one-third of the population, emptied entire towns. It's known today as the Black Death.

And yet: With people dropping and dying in the streets (some cities recorded death tolls as high as 70%), zero medical care except prayer and leeches, and virtually no social controls like we have today, society DIDN'T collapse, and cities DIDN'T devolve into anarchy. There were some bad things, of course, nobody would pretend the mass Jew burnings and witch hunts and Flagellants were great--but there wasn't mass chaos.

I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?

Believe me, I'm more with you than the survivalists but what you said is totally irrelevant.  Back then they were an agrarian society.  They lived much more like the preppers do than you do.  They didn't depend on grocery stores.  Most people lived in the country.  Pandemic would be MUCH MUCH worse today.


Maybe...but out in the country, they had nothing in the way of backup when things turned to shiat. Lots of villages totally vanished as their populations died or relocated. Medicine was nonexistent, canceling out the so-called advantages of being "independent" of cities. Being able to grow your own food will not help you when your oxen are dead of the plague. The death rate in rural areas was at least as high as it was in the cities.

The point is, it wasn't having plenty of food available that kept people and society alive. It was society that kept people alive. It wasn't hunkering down in remote locations and hoarding one's food; it was carrying on in spite of the awful death rates and despair and misery. Where efforts were made to keep people fed and housed and the dead buried decently and some semblance of order maintained, then surprisingly, order WAS maintained and morale remained above rock-bottom. There were few or no recorded riots in the streets of Siena, or people breaking down neighbor's doors to steal all their food in Paris. And they didn't even have cops or armies to take control.

It seems like the best way to ensure social breakdown in the event of a major catastrophe is to plan as if there WILL be a massive social breakdown, and adhere to the idea of hiding in a bunker and shooting anyone who approaches. The all-against-all mentality the preppers seem to espouse will not serve them well AFTER the social breakdown, when they need to put society back together again, unfortunately. But have no thought for the morrow, I guess.
 
2013-02-22 10:45:38 PM

CheapEngineer: [www.ivy-style.com image 600x942]


upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-02-22 10:46:01 PM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: staffed exclusively by grumpy black women.


I'm pretty sure that would violate the Geneva Conventions.
 
2013-02-22 10:50:05 PM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: super_grass: Racist detected.

I'm looking forward to the day when racist detectors are placed in every home like carbon monoxide detectors, except that the racist detectors will never run out of batteries and will wirelessly transmit information to a central data warehouse staffed exclusively by grumpy black women.


encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com
 
2013-02-22 10:55:20 PM
The prepper or survivalist people I know are so ineffective in day to day life they live in a fantasy world. I'm not talking about some water, some food and some guns. I'm talking about we're preparing for the end of the world nut jobs. They can't keep a job, balance a checkbook have no friends but when the big bad gubmint (from which they derive most of their income) enacts the plan to kill them off then they'll finally be the successful popular person important person they were meant to be. It's a really sad and unhealthy way to live.
 
2013-02-22 10:59:04 PM
No subs, that's wrong. All preppers are survivalists, but not all survivalists are preppers. They're all nuts.
 
2013-02-22 11:00:19 PM

HairBolus: specialkae: Now, I was a Girl Scout  ... I had a pantry with ... over 100 rolls of TP

Why do women think that hoarding Toilet Paper is the same as being disaster  prepared? Every time that the local news says that there is a dangerous storm coming through the supermarket shelves are often empty of TP.


My scoutmaster had a great story about that. It involved being a supply officer at a stateside base during Vietnam, an early computer system, a TP order for an entire military base, and an extra zero.
 
2013-02-22 11:03:17 PM

Peppermint Rose: The prepper or survivalist people I know are so ineffective in day to day life they live in a fantasy world. I'm not talking about some water, some food and some guns. I'm talking about we're preparing for the end of the world nut jobs. They can't keep a job, balance a checkbook have no friends but when the big bad gubmint (from which they derive most of their income) enacts the plan to kill them off then they'll finally be the successful popular person important person they were meant to be. It's a really sad and unhealthy way to live.


So you don't think it is healthy to have a hobby? I flint knapp and make stone tools as a hobby. It could be interpreted by the MSM as dangerous thing.

With certain martial arts stone tools can be lethal.
 
2013-02-22 11:09:51 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: what_now: What's the line between "Has a backpack with flashlight and medical supplies, and a weeks worth of canned goods in cupboard" and "collects bags of own poop "?

because there has to be a line, right?

It's the difference between preparing for a sudden, but manageable disaster (fire, tornado, flood, etc.) and preparing for the chaotic collapse of civilization.


Didn't read the whole thread, but this.

In "prepper" terms there's "the shiat hitting the fan/TSHF" and there's "the end of the world as we know it/TEOTWAWKI"

TSHF is a disruption of moderate length, maybe up to a year where one would have to feed/water themselves.

TEOTWAWKI is a cataclysmic event that pretty much sends us back to the dark ages.

The former is "being prepared", the latter is nuttiness. Where you draw the line is up to you.
 
2013-02-22 11:16:50 PM
The survivalists are the guys who only stocked guns that the preppers with their food stocks will be fighting off.
 
2013-02-22 11:17:49 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyzNIa-U5Nc

History... Survival... Basics...
 
2013-02-22 11:18:08 PM
"They worry about ..."
TADA

we have the problem. insane people with irrational worries.
This one? worried about PEAK oil so they heat with wood.

I have NO PROBLEM with heating with wood or self-sufficiency. But when you are worried about something which wont happen in your lifetime (running out of oil/electricity for heating) then you are being a bit irrational.

/At any point in the future, the US and every other country could build massive numbers of fission power plants. More than enough to provide 100% of the needed electricity. This will happen the day after it becomes profitable to do so. (or a government subsidizes it. US DOD currently massively subsidizes OIL.)
 
2013-02-22 11:21:37 PM

spaten: When did having a few extra supplies on hand become a liberal hate magnet?


when did laughing at crazy people become "liberal hate magnet"??

/no, having supplies to deal with your local probable disaster is rational. having 10x the needed amount is crazy.
/planning for an unavoidable (meteors and nuclear war (nothing that you can do can avoid this)) or planning for running out of oil or global warming is just nutty
 
2013-02-22 11:22:03 PM

Thingster: In "prepper" terms there's "the shiat hitting the fan/TSHF" and there's "the end of the world as we know it/TEOTWAWKI"

TSHF is a disruption of moderate length, maybe up to a year where one would have to feed/water themselves.

TEOTWAWKI is a cataclysmic event that pretty much sends us back to the dark ages.

The former is "being prepared", the latter is nuttiness. Where you draw the line is up to you.


I'm not sure if you're saying that the expectation of TEOTWAWKI is nuttiness, or the preparation for it. If it's the latter, I'd be inclined to agree -- you can't reasonably expect to prepare for the permanent collapse of civilization, unless you're a Conan the Barbarian type (with an M-16 rather than a magic sword). But if it's the former, it should be pointed out that TEOTWAWKI though unlikely is not inconceivable; those of us who grew up in the 1980s were regaled with endless tales of the "nuclear winter" that would follow the next world war, for example -- you can watch the movie Threads to see what I mean. Civilization is neither as fragile as the more extreme survivalists suggest (that we're all nine meals away from anarchy etc.) or as guaranteed as the optimists might think.
 
2013-02-22 11:23:08 PM

Thingster: TSHF is a disruption of moderate length, maybe up to a year where one would have to feed/water themselves.

TEOTWAWKI is a cataclysmic event that pretty much sends us back to the dark ages.

The former is "being prepared", the latter is nuttiness. Where you draw the line is up to you.


holy crap! there are acronyms for this !!! 
tyverymuch!!
 
2013-02-22 11:27:41 PM
There is a bell curve of preparedness. In the middle are those of us who pretty much depend on the  grocery store to survive. In the hiest percentiles of preparedness there are people who are prepared for a range of likely scenarios, like natural disasters, civil unrest, power plant fire, etc...... All the way up to the nuts who are planning what to do when they look out the window and see flying dragons being ridden by Zombie overlords. 

But as wacky as those people are, down in the lowest percentiles of preparedness there are people who literally are only hours away from being essentially homeless with no food or even a map when the power cuts off. Most welfare families fall into this category. No supplies, living day to day off the SNAP card, more worried about getting a box of cigarettes than a gallon of fresh water. 

Given that in any emergency event we all start to slide to the bottom of the bell curve as our food runs out and our plans reach their time limits.....I'd rather be somewhere on the high end of the bell curve, about the 75th percentile.

For me this means about six weeks of food, 20 gallons of spare gasoline, strong doors and locks, a couple firearms in the home, and some idea of where to go if the food runs out or there are major riots. 

You can get this prepared for a couple thousand dollars. If you have kids you should be at least this prepared.

And before you start throwing stones at the preppers, just remember the old ladies on Staten Island, sitting in the cold and dark waiting for Mayor Bloomberg to send them food and water and heat. They were literally a 40 minute drive from civilization, but they still sat there freezing and complaining. 

Dont be a cranky staten island granny lady.
 
2013-02-22 11:28:29 PM

namatad: spaten: When did having a few extra supplies on hand become a liberal hate magnet?

when did laughing at crazy people become "liberal hate magnet"??

/no, having supplies to deal with your local probable disaster is rational. having 10x the needed amount is crazy.
/planning for an unavoidable (meteors and nuclear war (nothing that you can do can avoid this)) or planning for running out of oil or global warming is just nutty


I've been reading fark politics too much and the morans on there...

How to make an arrowhead.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6QO2DthGPc
 
2013-02-22 11:36:57 PM

Gyrfalcon: The point is, it wasn't having plenty of food available that kept people and society alive. It was society that kept people alive.


Well, to be more specific their "society" involved two other things we mostly don't have today: a shared religion that told you you'd go to hell if you committed murder, rape, robbery, etc.; and a shared culture which made it more likely that you'd help out your neighbour in case of an emergency, since he was likely to be closely or distantly related to you -- or at the very least, was someone who shared your language, traditions, and faith.

Now, if the Black Death were to strike the modern United States it'd be afflicting a population which is already bitterly divided amongst itself, whether politically, racially, or economically. Can you imagine the survivors of a blighted Los Angeles or Detroit deciding to pull together for the common good because of some abstract commitment to "society"? Not bloody likely. Those American preppers who are arming themselves for a societal breakdown are wiser than you might think: not because such a breakdown is inevitable, but because if one ever does arrive there will be rivers of blood in the streets.
 
2013-02-22 11:38:53 PM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: it should be pointed out that TEOTWAWKI though unlikely is not inconceivable


meh
Part of the problem is that people are terrible at assessing risk and assigning probabilities.
While I am not sure how one calculates the probability of TEOTWAWKI, I do question the people who get all crazy about it.
I too remember the threat of MAD and nuclear winter. Even with it gone there are a huge number of other TEOTWAWKI scenarios.
Meteors, super volcanoes, toss in man-made viri/nano-whatever/run away AIs, massive solar flares. The list goes on and on.
The likelihood that the massive (and minor) extinction events were all caused by only one type of TEOTWAWKI is very unlikely.

On the other hand, we can calculate how often these various events happen over time and calculate how likely they are to happen.
In the end, meh.

/I dont remeber if I stopped fearing the bomb, became inured to it, 1989-1991 happened, or I just got to old to care.
/On the plus side, I live at ground zero Chicago. I would not have survived even a small-scale nuclear war, so why waste a second worried about it?
 
2013-02-22 11:42:41 PM
TEOTWAWKI

What does a Polynesian island have to do with Preppers?
 
2013-02-22 11:43:11 PM
spiderpaz
That being said, it seems like the people really enthused about preparing for the end are the ones that are not prepared for the present - i.e. impoverished rednecks who are economic failures. It's like they lost at life, so they make themselves feel better by convincing themselves they're going to be on top when society breaks down.

upload.wikimedia.org


TiiiMMMaHHH
Should an event happen, people will revert to that animal behavior during face to face confrontations.

farm4.static.flickr.com


duenor
I can't validate my friends' stories because they were never covered by the media. But how about wikipedia? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_Hurricane_Katrina_in_New_Orle a ns

You really, really should double-check those citations. The first one is The Globe and Mail. One of the citations is from an article titled "Katrina takes a toll on truth, news accuracy". This is why Wikipedia is not a valid source.


Nutsac_Jim
Oh.. and farmers will probably not take your worthless paper currency.
Better hope you have a lot of 5 ounce silver bars.


If things collapse to the point where fiat currency doesn't function, silver will just be shiny metal.


MurphyMurphy
The only way to survive a collapse of society is to replace that lost society with a new one. Reintegration with your neighbors, building new supply lines and securing new alliances with others doing the same. Helping others so they will (hopefully) in turn help you.

Like I said before, this is the difference between preppers and survivalists.
 
2013-02-22 11:44:58 PM

spaten: How to make an arrowhead.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6QO2DthGPc


I love these kind of videos. Watching the crafting of tools, of any sort. I actually spent a few minutes googling where to buy blocks of flint. Luckily I am lazy and stopped before buying rocks.

On the OTHER hand, I own a couple large amazing sharpening stones and know how to use them.  http://www.bestsharpeningstones.com/catalog/Razor-Edge-Sharpening-Sto n es.htm
So meh, when  TEOTWAWKI happens, if I survive, there will certainly be a lot of knives laying about, which I would be able to keep sharp until long after I am dead.
 
2013-02-22 11:54:56 PM

spaten: Peppermint Rose: The prepper or survivalist people I know are so ineffective in day to day life they live in a fantasy world. I'm not talking about some water, some food and some guns. I'm talking about we're preparing for the end of the world nut jobs. They can't keep a job, balance a checkbook have no friends but when the big bad gubmint (from which they derive most of their income) enacts the plan to kill them off then they'll finally be the successful popular person important person they were meant to be. It's a really sad and unhealthy way to live.

So you don't think it is healthy to have a hobby? I flint knapp and make stone tools as a hobby. It could be interpreted by the MSM as dangerous thing.

With certain martial arts stone tools can be lethal.


Hobbies are cool but there's a difference between a hobby (even if your hobby happens to be some sort of long term LARP) and the prepper survivalist thing. If you are seriously devoting significant time, energy and resources to being prepared for some sort of long term Mad Max primitive existence then you've checked out of reality. If you want a sustainable farm or like to hunt or even go out and live off the land with no modern conveniences for an extended period more power to you. However, when your whole life revolves around and a large portion of your self worth derives from the I'm going to be the lone survivor holed up with my canned goods and guns fantasy is batshiat insane and in my experience is most common among people who are or at least feel like failures in real life. They aren't strong enough (mentally and/or emotionally) to cope with reality so they escape and retreat to their fantasy while lying to themselves (and everyone else) about what reality is. They don't have time or care about their job or family or have time for fun they have the SERIOUS BUSINESS of preparing for the imminent apocalypse to tend to.
 
2013-02-22 11:56:07 PM

namatad: /I dont remeber if I stopped fearing the bomb, became inured to it, 1989-1991 happened


Trust your government, They have your best interests::


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1WAifopzFY


/Uncle was there in the infantry.
 
2013-02-23 12:17:47 AM

Peppermint Rose: However, when your whole life revolves around and a large portion of your self worth derives from the I'm going to be the lone survivor holed up with my canned goods and guns fantasy is batshiat insane and in my experience is most common among people who are or at least feel like failures in real life. They aren't strong enough (mentally and/or emotionally) to cope with reality so they escape and retreat to their fantasy while lying to themselves (and everyone else) about what reality is. They don't have time or care about their job or family or have time for fun they have the SERIOUS BUSINESS of preparing for the imminent apocalypse to tend to.


I don't totally disagree with you -- there are certainly people out there who would like civilization to collapse so that they could gratify their lust for domination, revenge or whatever else -- but we must be wary of the idea that we can psychoanalyze large numbers of people we haven't met just because they can imagine a scenario in which they might be isolated with their provisions in a hostile environment. There are, sadly, perfectly rational reasons to conclude that our current civilization is fracturing along various lines and is in danger of at least a partial collapse, and naturally enough some of the few people who have correctly anticipated the prospect of that collapse will have adopted the defensive posture of buying canned goods and firearms (however effective these might be in an actual prolonged emergency). Focussing on these people as representing some kind of problem in themselves only distracts us from addressing the structural weaknesses of our society that have given rise to their fears in the first place; after all, there has to be a reason why talk of social and economic collapse has recently been increasing other than supposing that everyone is going crazy or is secretly evil, a "loser", a racist, etc.
 
2013-02-23 12:30:15 AM
Trust your government: Electric Boogolooo:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BUJ4qralls
 
2013-02-23 12:53:07 AM
Preparing for hurricanes isn't paranoid.  Preparing for the collapse of society is.
 
2013-02-23 12:54:03 AM

edmo: Which is which?

[sannekurz.files.wordpress.com image 510x509]


After all these years, that picture is still disturbing.
 
2013-02-23 12:57:39 AM

Gyrfalcon: I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?


I would imagine they don't trust banks, either.  And grocery stores will be full of empty shelves. Gas will be 10 bucks a gallon.   Martial law.  Stuff like that.  I'm sure we could go on all night.

They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.
 
2013-02-23 12:57:41 AM
There is a much better chance of societal collapse than a hurricane here.
 
2013-02-23 12:59:22 AM

Rapmaster2000: I can't wait until the apocalypse finally goes down and I don't have to go to work any more.  Then you'll all be like "Oh, that Rapmaster2000 was right and I'm stupid.  I should have listened to that handsome devil!"


The pic in your profile proves you aren't handsome.  Even if you shaved.
 
2013-02-23 01:09:48 AM
 
2013-02-23 01:11:01 AM

spaten: [bronxbanter.arneson.name image 450x335]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYW7GnYEAik


Just post a picture of a red throbbing butt.  It's more you than any of the nonsense you've been trying to pull here.
 
2013-02-23 01:13:13 AM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: Peppermint Rose: However, when your whole life revolves around and a large portion of your self worth derives from the I'm going to be the lone survivor holed up with my canned goods and guns fantasy is batshiat insane and in my experience is most common among people who are or at least feel like failures in real life. They aren't strong enough (mentally and/or emotionally) to cope with reality so they escape and retreat to their fantasy while lying to themselves (and everyone else) about what reality is. They don't have time or care about their job or family or have time for fun they have the SERIOUS BUSINESS of preparing for the imminent apocalypse to tend to.

I don't totally disagree with you -- there are certainly people out there who would like civilization to collapse so that they could gratify their lust for domination, revenge or whatever else -- but we must be wary of the idea that we can psychoanalyze large numbers of people we haven't met just because they can imagine a scenario in which they might be isolated with their provisions in a hostile environment. There are, sadly, perfectly rational reasons to conclude that our current civilization is fracturing along various lines and is in danger of at least a partial collapse, and naturally enough some of the few people who have correctly anticipated the prospect of that collapse will have adopted the defensive posture of buying canned goods and firearms (however effective these might be in an actual prolonged emergency). Focussing on these people as representing some kind of problem in themselves only distracts us from addressing the structural weaknesses of our society that have given rise to their fears in the first place; after all, there has to be a reason why talk of social and economic collapse has recently been increasing other than supposing that everyone is going crazy or is secretly evil, a "loser", a racist, etc.


To be fair a lot of my point and laugh response comes from negative childhood experiences. My grandmother is a very abusive negative person and I don't know if she self identifies as a prepper or survivalist or not. But she definitely has the behaviors at almost 40 I don't remember a time when the government swooping down on her wasn't an imminent threat in her mind. The thing is her "preparations" would not only be useless if anything actually happened but significantly negatively impact not only her life but everyone around her. For instance I won't eat at her house because she doesn't think expiration dates nor refrigeration nor keeping foods hot are in any way useful so besides the food being bad tasting eating it could quite possibly give you severe food poisoning. Now I'm intellectually aware the whole population of survivalists preppers are not necessarily my insane grandmother but the whole mindset of the lone survivor against the world strikes me as a highly improbable if not downright delusional idea. Humans generally need a cooperative community for survival. Maybe it's out there and I don't know because I don't care enough to find out but I don't see much of the cooperative community in the canned goods and guns movement.
 
2013-02-23 01:18:37 AM

whidbey: spaten: [bronxbanter.arneson.name image 450x335]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYW7GnYEAik

Just post a picture of a red throbbing butt.  It's more you than any of the nonsense you've been trying to pull here.


What's up whipbey? Do you want to discuss Bastiat vs Marx? Or do you want to suck my dick?
 
2013-02-23 01:28:17 AM

Bucky Katt: Preparing for hurricanes isn't paranoid.  Preparing for the collapse of society is.


Because society cannot possibly collapse, or...?
 
2013-02-23 01:31:26 AM

whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.


That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.
 
2013-02-23 01:36:34 AM

HairBolus: duenor: HairBolus: duenor: Where were nice army reservists where my friends were getting shot at by looters as they were trying to give out supplies in LA?

Have you had your meds checked recently? You seem delusional and prone to make up fantasies and then believe they actually happened.

Ad Hominem, I see.

I can't validate my friends' stories because they were never covered by the media.

What I doubt is that you live in New Orleans and that you actually have face to face friends that were shot at while trying to be good Samaritans during Katrina. Lots of stuff was made up during Katrina to fit a "dangerous animal" narrative as was lots of stuff denied such as cops killing blacks for trying to walk out of NO.

I still think you are delusional and need of a med check and that you consider someone to be a "friend" if you have read something they wrote on the internet in a racist survivalist nutjob vein.


I never said I live in NO. I don't. What you believe is your choice, of course. Why you feel a need to conclude that I'm delusional and in need of meds because you prefer not to recognize that those things did happen, and have happened many times in many past disasters both man-made and natural, is also a choice of yours.

Indeed, I don't see how you can choose to believe that cops killed blacks for trying to walk out of NO (something I haven't heard of, but certainly plausible) and yet do not want to believe (or even recognize as plausible) that aid workers (my friends included) could have been shot at in spite of both references and my own description. I guess that says something for your social perspective.
 
2013-02-23 01:40:06 AM

nmemkha: Preppers are morons. I don't care how fortified you are, the unprepared outnumber you 100,000+ to 1. They will find a way to take your shiat eventually.


Therefore, why bother to prepare? Might as well resign yourself to joining the looters from the get-go.
Yep, it's people like you that convince me that I ought to be prepared to defend myself.
 
2013-02-23 01:44:25 AM

whidbey: Gyrfalcon: I'm just not sure what exactly the preppers think is going to happen even if there was some kind of pandemic (which takes time to develop) or disaster or war. And an economic collapse is very slow, it's not like the currency gets devalued and instantly stores vanish into the ground. What do folks think they're prepping FOR?

I would imagine they don't trust banks, either.  And grocery stores will be full of empty shelves. Gas will be 10 bucks a gallon.   Martial law.  Stuff like that.  I'm sure we could go on all night.

They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.


You are an useful idiot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot

fark you, Comrade.
 
2013-02-23 01:44:25 AM

RanDomino: If things collapse to the point where fiat currency doesn't function, silver will just be shiny metal.


Useful in a werewolf apocalypse, though. Prep-vivalists don't really need a better reason than that to hoard it.

Or they'll point out that silver compounds are used in massive quantities in the photography industry, then prepare for an apocalypse in which all commerce and civilization fails except for Fotomats. (Oh, and dentists. Society will collapse to the point that your grandchildren are barely human, but dentistry will still need silver for fillings.)

Also, since existing stores of silver polish will quickly be depleted, it'll actually just be dingy black metal. But yeah.
 
2013-02-23 01:45:19 AM

mesmer242: Letting your family guilt you into hoarding months of supplies?


Why is it that you believe it is "hoarding"? You know, the government spent your tax money to make sure they have adequately stocked shelters, just in case. They have years' worth of everything, just sitting around, just in case. Is the federal government a hoarding prepper? If their behavior is acceptable, why is it unacceptable for a private individual to act in the same manner? Also, we all have choices to make in life. If one person chooses to spend all their money on worthless crap, are they "hoarding" worthless crap? If you spend your money on beer, cigarettes, and strippers while someone else spends theirs on food, medical supplies, toilet paper, etc, haven't you both spent your money in the manner you each chose? Why is the guy who actually has something to show for it supposedly bad? I just don't understand people's mindsets sometimes.
 
2013-02-23 01:45:56 AM

Yes, these replies are in reverse chronological order. I can't be bothered fixing it. Deal with it.

Kanemano: Sushi is just fish and rice.....that's it. I am positive I can find better sushi at the deli counter in the Lawson's in Akahibara  than most places on the mainland,

it's like saying there are no hot dogs unless you are eating one at 72nd and Broadway.


Know how I know you've never had real sushi?

"In Japan becoming an itamae of sushi requires years of on-the-job training and apprenticeship. Typically, after five years or so spent working with a master or teacher itamae, the apprentice is given his first important task related to making sushi: preparation of the sushi rice. The rice is prepared according to the strict instructions of the senior itamae, and each sushi restaurant has its own "secret" recipe of rice, salt and rice vinegar. Once the senior itamae is satisfied with the consistency of the sushi rice made daily by the apprentice, the apprentice may then be promoted.

This promotion puts the apprentice in a more prominent location, next to the senior itamae. This position is called "wakiita", that means "near the cutting board". The wakiita's duties expand to include daily preparation of the fresh ingredients, such as preparing blocks of fish, grating ginger, and slicing scallions. Eventually the apprentice might begin to prepare sushi for clients with take away orders. The wakiita also learns the proper ways to interact with and treat the restaurant's customers by observing the senior itamae.

After additional years of training as a wakiita, the apprentice can be appointed an itamae, fully authorized to stand in front of the cutting board.  "


Ow! That was my feelings!: Fair point.  The counter experience can be part of the enjoyment, for sure.  But my gf and I get take out sushi occasionally due to both our work schedules not always being compatible to 2 hours of counter time.  Same fish, same prep, takes 2 mins to get home from picking it up.  Still sushi, still damn good.


Same fish and prep as your typical American sushi restaurant. Which again, has little to do with real sushi.

No self-respecting, properly-trained sushi chef would be caught dead making sushi to-go. And just because your local supermarket went the whole hog, found an Asian-American kid for "authenticity", and showed him how to squeeze rice and seaweed into a roll and slice it doesn't mean he's a sushi chef.

Kanemano: [farm3.staticflickr.com image 483x362]

HUH?


That is to sushi as a Twinkie is to cakes.

Ow! That was my feelings!: Nice, a sushi expert from Tennessee.  You are hilariously wrong.


Bill_Wick's_Friend: I'm pretty sure that a guy in Tennessee with a Chinese screen name isn't my go-to authority on sushi.

(There is plenty of excellent gourmet sushi take out in Vancouver and San Fran)


I'm pretty sure that the guy you're mocking has spent more than half his life living in Asia, and has eaten more authentic sushi than you've ever seen.
 
2013-02-23 01:46:29 AM

specialkae: My recent "prepper" experience (and I do use that term very, very lightly). In my 'hood we have overhead power lines.  Consequence is as such, at least several times each winter and even sometimes in the summer, due to high winds/snow/aliens/whatever our power goes out for a few hours.  Now, I was a Girl Scout, so I am usually prepared for minor emergencies.  Instead of sitting in the dark waiting for the power and heat to come back on, I pulled out my emergency box of candles (tea lights and lots of 'em), my Maglite and a fresh pack of batteries as well as located our extra blankets and sheets if we were all going to have to trap ourselves in one room to conserve heat (I live with 3 men, and no, not as giggity as it sounds).  I knew where everything was and it only took me about 10 minutes to get my house ok for the duration.  I was proud of me.  Ok, not quite prepper level but I used to be there.  I had a pantry with approximately 3 months worth of food for 2 people and over 100 rolls of TP at one point.  Trouble is now I don't have quite the space I used to, but I'm working on retrofitting the closet in the office to become our new backup supply storage area.  Oh yeah, and we have guns too, but not a whole bunch of them and everyone in my house goes to the shooting range at least once a year so that we ensure that we basically know how to operate them if we ever would need to-heaven forefend.


Well done. It's not about the catastrophic collapse of civilization, but rather being prepared enough to not have to be a burden on rescue workers, neighbors, family and friends at a time when they themselves are stretched thin. Granted, you can still get screwed by nature no matter how prepared you are. But I strongly believe that being prepared is not only the wise thing to do, but also the socially responsible thing to do. 

I'd much rather share my food and shelter with my neighbors than have to beg them to share what little they have with me and my family.
 
2013-02-23 01:52:09 AM

super_grass: pedrop357: super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.

meta or poe's law?

What if they decide that independence from society is part of the "social contract"?  I mean anyone can assert damn near anything as being in the social contract given that it's not a real document.

Your so called "rugged individualism" is delusion at best and a mental disorder at worst.

Civilization survives only when everyone in it depends on its survival.  Do you think that ant colonies can exist if individual ants were capable of realizing that they can survive on their own? Unfortunately, people have the free will to mistakenly separate themselves from the good of the many and this is why we evolved ridicule to keep people in check.  It's too bad that mockery alone is inadequate for the newest generation of idiots and now they're allowed to continue their retardation without being tarred and feathered.

Just don't be surprised when we come knocking at your door to take your hoarded supplies when disaster strikes.


Yep, this thread is full of looters. You need evidence that after a disaster there'll be those who'll use violence to get what they want? Well, no disaster's struck and already these folks are planning on surviving by pillaging neighbors.
 
2013-02-23 01:53:25 AM
Wait wait wait. FTFA:

My friend Ceredwyn Alexander lives on a homestead in the mountains of Vermont. She and her family raise a lot of their own food, from chickens to cabbage, and they heat their home with wood they chop themselves. (She won't live anywhere, she tells me, "without supplemental heat that operates without electricity.") They worry about peak oil. They try not to buy things on credit. They always keep a great deal of food and water and other supplies on hand. If everything goes to hell tomorrow, they want to be prepared.

Why not buy things on credit? If everything goes to hell tomorrow, I want to be sitting on a shiatload of stuff I bought on credit, don't I? Like, stuff I could never afford if I weren't maxing out my credit cards.

I'm just saying, it sounds like what she's prepping for is that society won't collapse.
 
2013-02-23 01:53:32 AM
And yes, I know my quote says "take away orders", but that's take away orders made by a chef who's already had half a decade and change of training and observation. And it's a take away order collected from a sushi restaurant by the customer and made fresh to order for the customer.

It's not a mass-produced, poorly-prepared roll made by a guy fresh out of his job at McDonalds, who got 48 hours of training from another guy who amazed him with his six months experience, stuck under cling film and bunged in a fridge for eight or ten hours.

Supermarket sushi often isn't even made with proper fish. It's made with the stuff scraped off the bones after the real sushi-grade meat is gone, even the lowest-grade stuff. Read: mechanically separated. Yes, that is much the same process used to made hot dogs and nuggets, and that should tell you everything you need to know about its "quality".

Citation:  http://www.nola.com/food/index.ssf/2012/04/supermarket_sushi_tuna_lin k ed.html
 
2013-02-23 02:01:40 AM
Mitch Taylor's Bro: More than six months worth of supplies, more guns and ammo than you can carry and turning your home into a heavily fortified bunker so you can defend your stuff and wait out "TEOTWAKI" is not.  l st ...

I would argue that as long as you aren't pouring your life savings into your preparedness plan, and that your family enjoys life and does not allow that preparedness to dictate one's life decisions entirely, you're fine. If Bill Gates had an underground bunker with 5 years worth of food and a million rounds of ammunition, would you consider him crazy? I wouldn't - and he probably has something like that (and probably far better) already.

Just don't let it become an addiction and fantasy. If that happens, get help.
 
2013-02-23 02:02:23 AM

untaken_name: Why is it that you believe it is "hoarding"? You know, the government spent your tax money to make sure they have adequately stocked shelters, just in case. They have years' worth of everything, just sitting around, just in case. Is the federal government a hoarding prepper? If their behavior is acceptable, why is it unacceptable for a private individual to act in the same manner?


Careful there, son. You start asking these questions and the next thing you'll also be wondering why the Department of Homeland Security has over the past couple of years purchased 2 billion hollow- point rounds for itself, as well as training targets with pictures of ordinary civilians on them. Such inquiries would have been vital and necessary during the Bush administration, but under the Obama presidency they are simply anti- American (and probably racist to boot).

What you must always remember is that the agents of the State are morally superior to you; this is why they are permitted to stock up on years' worth of supplies, assault weapons, and ammunition that is prohibited by international conventions -- but if you attempt to do any of these things you will be ridiculed as a paranoid survivalist, labelled a far- right- wing extremist, and may even attract the unwelcome attention of law enforcement. And then, of course, you'll deserve everything that is coming to you.
 
2013-02-23 02:04:24 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-jnTqKHAPM

Fighting Fists of Shanghai Joe:
 
2013-02-23 02:08:49 AM

Peppermint Rose: The prepper or survivalist people I know are so ineffective in day to day life they live in a fantasy world. I'm not talking about some water, some food and some guns. I'm talking about we're preparing for the end of the world nut jobs. They can't keep a job, balance a checkbook have no friends but when the big bad gubmint (from which they derive most of their income) enacts the plan to kill them off then they'll finally be the successful popular person important person they were meant to be. It's a really sad and unhealthy way to live.


That is because the non-mentally-unwell survivalists have the good sense to not let others know (other than close friends and family) what they have at home. The biggest gun safe in the world isn't as secure as nobody thinking that anything is even there.

As this thread shows, there are plenty of people whose disaster survival plan consists mostly of joining a mob and taking what they want by brute force.
 
2013-02-23 02:11:40 AM
semiotix
Why not buy things on credit? If everything goes to hell tomorrow, I want to be sitting on a shiatload of stuff I bought on credit, don't I? Like, stuff I could never afford if I weren't maxing out my credit cards.

Because after civilization collapses the debt collection agencies will still function, or something.
Actually, this might be the least crazy belief they have.
 
2013-02-23 02:16:56 AM
RanDomino:
duenor
I can't validate my friends' stories because they were never covered by the media. But how about wikipedia? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_Hurricane_Katrina_in_New_Orle a ns

You really, really should double-check those citations. The first one is The Globe and Mail. One of the citations is from an article titled "Katrina takes a toll on truth, news accuracy". This is why Wikipedia is not a valid source.


Any internet search, on any reputable academic catalog will return you plenty of evidence regarding the levels of violence during katrina. I did not go there, but I remember reading the newspapers, seeing the armored cars and superdome on tv, and the general state of disbelief most people had about why wasn't the government doing anything to help these people.

I gave wikipedia as a readily available starting point for research by anyone interested in finding out more. my job is not to prove my point to your satisfaction, nor will I feel hurt by your unwillingness to accept historical fact.
 
2013-02-23 02:18:37 AM

duenor: Peppermint Rose: The prepper or survivalist people I know are so ineffective in day to day life they live in a fantasy world. I'm not talking about some water, some food and some guns. I'm talking about we're preparing for the end of the world nut jobs. They can't keep a job, balance a checkbook have no friends but when the big bad gubmint (from which they derive most of their income) enacts the plan to kill them off then they'll finally be the successful popular person important person they were meant to be. It's a really sad and unhealthy way to live.

That is because the non-mentally-unwell survivalists have the good sense to not let others know (other than close friends and family) what they have at home. The biggest gun safe in the world isn't as secure as nobody thinking that anything is even there.

As this thread shows, there are plenty of people whose disaster survival plan consists mostly of joining a mob and taking what they want by brute force.


The scarier thing is government control via WW1 and WW2...

encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com

encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com

fark war...
 
2013-02-23 02:19:47 AM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: Gyrfalcon: The point is, it wasn't having plenty of food available that kept people and society alive. It was society that kept people alive.

Well, to be more specific their "society" involved two other things we mostly don't have today: a shared religion that told you you'd go to hell if you committed murder, rape, robbery, etc.; and a shared culture which made it more likely that you'd help out your neighbour in case of an emergency, since he was likely to be closely or distantly related to you -- or at the very least, was someone who shared your language, traditions, and faith.

Now, if the Black Death were to strike the modern United States it'd be afflicting a population which is already bitterly divided amongst itself, whether politically, racially, or economically. Can you imagine the survivors of a blighted Los Angeles or Detroit deciding to pull together for the common good because of some abstract commitment to "society"? Not bloody likely. Those American preppers who are arming themselves for a societal breakdown are wiser than you might think: not because such a breakdown is inevitable, but because if one ever does arrive there will be rivers of blood in the streets.


Mm, maybe, but again, you (and the preppers) are missing the larger point. Social "breakdown" is never fast, complete or sudden. Any calamitous breakdown is always localized and self-limiting. There's just no mechanism that would utterly destroy all social cohesion everywhere for everyone all at once and never let it re-form. You say, for instance "survivors of a blighted Los Angeles." No, the survivors of LOS ANGELES plague might not pull together to re-form Los Angeles...but the various cities and neighborhoods within LA would very certainly pull together and form enclaves within the greater whole. The greater LA area might fragment, but you wouldn't see wild anarchy seething and boiling in the LA basin for years on end.

Which is why this idea that holing up in some remote area and waiting for the anarchy to pass is ridiculous at best, and self-defeating at worst. If the disaster is some kind of plague or economic disaster, it will be very slow to build, and people will have time to adjust (as they did with the Black Death or the decline of Rome). If it is war or an asteroid strike (that beloved ultimate prepper disaster), it will initially be localized and the chaos will burn out quickly at the epicenter. Barring global alien invasion, there's just no way the whole world or even the whole country will collapse into anarchy all at once.

And even if it could, these preppers are operating on mutually exclusive scenarios: That it will be so sudden and all-encompassing they will need all that food, ammo, bombproof bunkers, etc.--BUT--they will nevertheless have time to get themselves and their families safely from wherever they all are to their bunkers and sealed in before the ravening hordes get there. I'm not sure they get both options.
 
2013-02-23 02:28:41 AM

Gyrfalcon: EvilRacistNaziFascist: Gyrfalcon: The point is, it wasn't having plenty of food available that kept people and society alive. It was society that kept people alive.

Well, to be more specific their "society" involved two other things we mostly don't have today: a shared religion that told you you'd go to hell if you committed murder, rape, robbery, etc.; and a shared culture which made it more likely that you'd help out your neighbour in case of an emergency, since he was likely to be closely or distantly related to you -- or at the very least, was someone who shared your language, traditions, and faith.

Now, if the Black Death were to strike the modern United States it'd be afflicting a population which is already bitterly divided amongst itself, whether politically, racially, or economically. Can you imagine the survivors of a blighted Los Angeles or Detroit deciding to pull together for the common good because of some abstract commitment to "society"? Not bloody likely. Those American preppers who are arming themselves for a societal breakdown are wiser than you might think: not because such a breakdown is inevitable, but because if one ever does arrive there will be rivers of blood in the streets.

Mm, maybe, but again, you (and the preppers) are missing the larger point. Social "breakdown" is never fast, complete or sudden. Any calamitous breakdown is always localized and self-limiting. There's just no mechanism that would utterly destroy all social cohesion everywhere for everyone all at once and never let it re-form. You say, for instance "survivors of a blighted Los Angeles." No, the survivors of LOS ANGELES plague might not pull together to re-form Los Angeles...but the various cities and neighborhoods within LA would very certainly pull together and form enclaves within the greater whole. The greater LA area might fragment, but you wouldn't see wild anarchy seething and boiling in the LA basin for years on end.

Which is why this idea that holing up in so ...


Where did you get the idea that preppers intend to shut themselves away from society? They just don't want to be victims. Most have other prepper friends and in the event of a disaster they will share resources and help each other rebuild.
 
2013-02-23 02:31:51 AM
The Useful Idiots need a little DK Holiday in Cambodia:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KTsXHXMkJA

scm-l3.technorati.com
 
2013-02-23 02:42:05 AM

super_grass: There is something disturbing about people trying to assert their independence from society. It gives them less of a stake in the government and social stability in general and therefore less motivation to support these institutions.

Society is a contract that you sign by simply existing and you have no right to bail on it and fend for yourself once things get hairy. Those who think otherwise should have no rights as human beings and should be treated as such.


I agree there's a social contract...but contracts are two-way streets.  How about if your society itself gets 'hairy'?

If your country slides into, say, fascism, THEN can you 'bail' on it?
 
2013-02-23 02:53:29 AM

gweilo8888: Yes, these replies are in reverse chronological order. I can't be bothered fixing it. Deal with it.

Kanemano: Sushi is just fish and rice.....that's it. I am positive I can find better sushi at the deli counter in the Lawson's in Akahibara  than most places on the mainland,

it's like saying there are no hot dogs unless you are eating one at 72nd and Broadway.

Know how I know you've never had real sushi?

"In Japan becoming an itamae of sushi requires years of on-the-job training and apprenticeship. Typically, after five years or so spent working with a master or teacher itamae, the apprentice is given his first important task related to making sushi: preparation of the sushi rice. The rice is prepared according to the strict instructions of the senior itamae, and each sushi restaurant has its own "secret" recipe of rice, salt and rice vinegar. Once the senior itamae is satisfied with the consistency of the sushi rice made daily by the apprentice, the apprentice may then be promoted.

This promotion puts the apprentice in a more prominent location, next to the senior itamae. This position is called "wakiita", that means "near the cutting board". The wakiita's duties expand to include daily preparation of the fresh ingredients, such as preparing blocks of fish, grating ginger, and slicing scallions. Eventually the apprentice might begin to prepare sushi for clients with take away orders. The wakiita also learns the proper ways to interact with and treat the restaurant's customers by observing the senior itamae.

After additional years of training as a wakiita, the apprentice can be appointed an itamae, fully authorized to stand in front of the cutting board.  "


Ow! That was my feelings!: Fair point.  The counter experience can be part of the enjoyment, for sure.  But my gf and I get take out sushi occasionally due to both our work schedules not always being compatible to 2 hours of counter time.  Same fish, same prep, takes 2 mins to get home from picking it up.  ...


I live in Honolulu, I have eaten in a real sushi restaurants more time than you I bet. I have also been to Japan several times  it's a farking meal nothing more I don't jerk off when I get a great piece of hamachi, or toro, you just say arigato, pay your check and get out, they really don't give a fark I know this because I drink the the staff of Nobu's quite often, they have 1/2 appetizers on Sundays after 6:30PM if you are ever in Honolulu by the way.
 
2013-02-23 02:55:34 AM

Gyrfalcon: Mm, maybe, but again, you (and the preppers) are missing the larger point. Social "breakdown" is never fast, complete or sudden. Any calamitous breakdown is always localized and self-limiting. There's just no mechanism that would utterly destroy all social cohesion everywhere for everyone all at once and never let it re-form.


I don't think anyone has suggested that social cohesion could never re-form (after all, "never" is a very long time), but it can only re-form to the extent that it was formed to begin with... and of course there are mechanisms that could destroy the social fabric across the US, even if its effects would only be most concentrated in certain areas; suppose for example that a currency collapse and resulting hyperinflation made it impossible for the government to honour its food stamp and Social Security commitments in any meaningful way -- wouldn't this cause chaos to populations scattered across the country who had no other means by which to provide for themselves? Such a collapse could indeed happen relatively rapidly, over a matter of weeks, for example.

The greater LA area might fragment, but you wouldn't see wild anarchy seething and boiling in the LA basin for years on end.

I completely agree. The one thing you can guarantee in any really anarchic situation is that some strongman or other will eventually rise to prominence in at least a limited area, promising protection from violence in return for some kind of allegiance. But once Los Angeles is fragmented, there is no particular reason to suppose that it will necessarily ever be reunited. And an LA with socially fragmented neighbourhoods (however internally cohesive they might be) pitted against each other in local turf wars isn't really all that far off from the "seething and boiling" you describe.

If the disaster is some kind of plague or economic disaster, it will be very slow to build, and people will have time to adjust (as they did with the Black Death or the decline of Rome).

I'm not sure about that. A plague or an economic crash could take place within a matter of weeks. Did 14th- century people really see the Black Death coming and adjust for it? From what I've read, one third of the population of Europe died, so whatever preparations they might have made were ultimately in vain; whether or not you survived was a matter of luck. As for the decline of Rome, that was a very long drawn- out process that is obvious to us in retrospect but may not have been apparent to those living through it, as they lacked the historical precedent to make sense of the whole business (at least until the barbarians were at the gates).

Bottom line is, we don't know what is going to happen in the future, so why not set aside a few provisions in case of a rainy day? If we're wrong and nothing bad is going to happen, we at least can consume the provisions later, but if we're right and bad times are ahead we'll be glad that we have them. What could be more reasonable than that?
 
2013-02-23 02:59:40 AM
images2.wikia.nocookie.net ]

static.zenimax.com
 
2013-02-23 03:01:42 AM
duenor
Any internet search, on any reputable academic catalog will return you plenty of evidence rumors regarding the levels of violence during katrina.

FTFY
 
2013-02-23 03:02:18 AM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.

That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.


Dude, inheriting a Preperation H Factory wouldn't help you at this point.
 
2013-02-23 03:06:14 AM

whidbey: EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.

That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.

Dude, inheriting a Preperation H Factory wouldn't help you at this point.


Is that all you have? whippy...
 
2013-02-23 03:08:01 AM
I've spoken to people who were actually there, as opposed to reading about it from a thousand miles away, and they all agree that the greatest purveyors of violence, by far, were the police.

also, this:
miami.media.indypgh.org
 
2013-02-23 03:22:22 AM

gweilo8888: And yes, I know my quote says "take away orders", but that's take away orders made by a chef who's already had half a decade and change of training and observation. And it's a take away order collected from a sushi restaurant by the customer and made fresh to order for the customer.

It's not a mass-produced, poorly-prepared roll made by a guy fresh out of his job at McDonalds, who got 48 hours of training from another guy who amazed him with his six months experience, stuck under cling film and bunged in a fridge for eight or ten hours.

Supermarket sushi often isn't even made with proper fish. It's made with the stuff scraped off the bones after the real sushi-grade meat is gone, even the lowest-grade stuff. Read: mechanically separated. Yes, that is much the same process used to made hot dogs and nuggets, and that should tell you everything you need to know about its "quality".

Citation:  http://www.nola.com/food/index.ssf/2012/04/supermarket_sushi_tuna_lin k ed.html


Fair point.  But your earlier post sounded a bit like Japanophile snobbery, which gets tedious (only real Japanese can make real sushi, only Japanese can be sumo wrestlers, kendo is the only real form of fencing, the katana is the best melee weapon ever, etc)
I like Japan, but they're not immune to snobbery.
 
2013-02-23 03:24:51 AM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.

That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.



I'm glad to see you've found friends to help you feel good about your problems. Keep it up, as long as it's working for you. Everyone has a hole to fill. Yours is is in your head. Probably another in your heart, but who's counting?
 
2013-02-23 03:31:50 AM

whidbey: EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.

That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.

Dude, inheriting a Preperation H Factory wouldn't help you at this point.


I have little idea what this is supposed to mean, but I can at least tell that it doesn't bear even the slightest resemblance to a rational argument. By the way, it's preparation.
 
2013-02-23 03:38:34 AM

rappy: EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.

That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.


I'm glad to see you've found friends to help you feel good about your problems. Keep it up, as long as it's working for you. Everyone has a hole to fill. Yours is is in your head. Probably another in your heart, but who's counting?


Wow, all you have are insults. We can discuss Smith, Hume, Bastiat, Marx, Engles, Even Athenian democracy vs Spartan top down socialism or the Roman Republic vs Rome as an empire... Socialism vs Individualism has been a war for a long time. The Shaolin were persecuted by multiple times by the Chinese governments.

The slaughter by government has always exceeded,  the fight of the individual...
 
2013-02-23 03:41:09 AM

RanDomino: I've spoken to people who were actually there, as opposed to reading about it from a thousand miles away, and they all agree that the greatest purveyors of violence, by far, were the police.

also, this:
[miami.media.indypgh.org image 671x518]


May I ask why these two news items are continually trotted out as examples of racism when they were written by entirely different people? You might have a point about hypocrisy and possibly even racism if the same correspondent had identified one Katrina victim as "looting" items and the other as "finding" items -- though even then it wouldn't have proven anything more than the hypocrisy or racism of that single person.
But when two different people are giving their opinions of the acts involved, it is hardly surprising that they have arrived at two different conclusions. The only way that you can work yourselves up into a frenzy of self- righteousness over this is if you first presume that the anonymous reporters involved are both white, and then presume that white people partake of some kind of collective hive mind when it comes to race. This is what passes for advanced left- liberal thought, I suppose.
 
2013-02-23 03:44:37 AM

WordyGrrl: This is my survival stash: a package of noodles that I've been carting around during various house moves for the past 20-some years. Because if financial disaster strikes and all I can afford to eat is Ramen, at least it'll be the good kind from the Korean store.
[www.ezionmarket.com image 300x300]


Yes.

/yes.
 
2013-02-23 03:46:42 AM

rappy: I'm glad to see you've found friends to help you feel good about your problems. Keep it up, as long as it's working for you. Everyone has a hole to fill. Yours is is in your head. Probably another in your heart, but who's counting?


Dear me, the mindless Obama fanboys are out in full force tonight... you'd think at least they'd have a rational point or two to make, but it's all accusations of heartlessness and haemorrhoids! I suppose this passes for advanced thought among them, the poor bastards.
 
2013-02-23 03:47:21 AM

semiotix: Why not buy things on credit? If everything goes to hell tomorrow, I want to be sitting on a shiatload of stuff I bought on credit, don't I? Like, stuff I could never afford if I weren't maxing out my credit cards.

I'm just saying, it sounds like what she's prepping for is that society won't collapse.


If I die a billion dollars in debt, well, I am dead, wtf do I care and I got to spend a billion dollars.
But expecting rational thought from preppers is probably not rational of us.
 
2013-02-23 03:48:01 AM

spaten: The slaughter by government has always exceeded,  the fight of the individual...


EvilRacistNaziFascist: Dear me, the mindless Obama fanboys are out in full force tonight..



You've got to be kidding me. I've been further even more decided to use even go need to do look more as anyone can. Can you really be far even as decided half as much to use go wish for that? My guess is that when one really been far even as decided once to use even go want, it is then that he has really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like. It's just common sense
 
2013-02-23 03:52:57 AM

rappy: spaten: The slaughter by government has always exceeded,  the fight of the individual...

EvilRacistNaziFascist: Dear me, the mindless Obama fanboys are out in full force tonight..


You've got to be kidding me. I've been further even more decided to use even go need to do look more as anyone can. Can you really be far even as decided half as much to use go wish for that? My guess is that when one really been far even as decided once to use even go want, it is then that he has really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like. It's just common sense


Sure it's all Common Scene, collectivist sponsored terror:

c3e308.medialib.glogster.com
 
2013-02-23 03:57:52 AM

rappy: You've got to be kidding me. I've been further even more decided to use even go need to do look more as anyone can. Can you really be far even as decided half as much to use go wish for that?


Have you had a stroke? Are you reading from Finnegans Wake? Maybe it's just past your bedtime.
 
2013-02-23 04:26:36 AM

RanDomino: duenor
Any internet search, on any reputable academic catalog will return you plenty of evidence rumors regarding the levels of violence during katrina.

FTFY


Attempting rational, evidence-based discourse with you is impossible. Rather than research, you resort to base denial and clever single-word replacements that are meaningless. Well, it's a free country and you aren't required to be prepared. Have it your way. I'll prefer to not be a squealing victim.
 
2013-02-23 04:30:39 AM

RanDomino: I've spoken to people who were actually there, as opposed to reading about it from a thousand miles away, and they all agree that the greatest purveyors of violence, by far, were the police.

also, this:
[miami.media.indypgh.org image 671x518]


I can't tell for sure as I wasn't there. But in one it looks like people are getting what they need; in another it seems like a guy is filling a trash bag with as much goodies as he can carry off.
 
2013-02-23 04:50:30 AM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: EvilRacistNaziFascist: whidbey: They're not worried about a pandemic. They think Obama is some kind of ultimate socialist whose Presidency is the culmination of 50 years of "big government."  Never mind that some of his predecessors were some of the worst human beings on the planet.

That Obama's predecessors were awful does not mean that he himself is not (even more) awful.

Dude, inheriting a Preperation H Factory wouldn't help you at this point.

I have little idea what this is supposed to mean, but I can at least tell that it doesn't bear even the slightest resemblance to a rational argument. By the way, it's preparation.


Like you had a rational argument to begin with.

And by the way, it's humor.Something you clearly cannot appreciate.
 
2013-02-23 04:51:27 AM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: the mindless Obama fanboys are out in full force tonight.


*plonk*
 
2013-02-23 04:56:45 AM

whidbey: EvilRacistNaziFascist: the mindless Obama fanboys are out in full force tonight.

*plonk*


You still haven't broken any arguments, But

encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com
 
2013-02-23 05:02:45 AM

TerminalEchoes: It's comforting to know that if something catastrophic really did happen, 95% of Farkers would be dead, but their pretentiousness would probably live on.


thingist.com
 
2013-02-23 05:14:46 AM

Oblio13: Our Attorney General wants the citizenry disarmed so badly that he smuggled weapons to Mexican drug cartels and tried to blame it on us. Our President is a former Constitutional law professor who is able to rationalize assassinating citizens abroad. Even small-town police departments are militarizing. Homeland Security just bought 1.6 BILLION rounds of ammunition. Emails and phone calls are being monitored. Warrantless searches are common. The legal mechanisms are in place for indefinite detentions without trials. Anticipating a ban, people are buying "assault weapons" as fast as they can be manufactured. They aren't buying them because they're going to turn them in. Part of me says, "It can't happen here". Another part of me says, "If I were seeing this in another country, I'd say both sides were preparing for civil war". I used to wonder if I was just being paranoid. Now I think that anyone who can't see a gathering storm is willfully blind. Being prepared can't hurt, and it's cheap insurance.


 You're not the only one noticing these things.

 I have relatives that have zero interest in guns, and when they were told what the current purchasing stats are in casual conversation (and being familiar with Fast and Furious from people who told them about it) have come to the same conclusion.

 The times are more interesting than any of us would like right now.

/hopefully it'll blow over...but not going to hold my breath right now.
 
2013-02-23 05:41:20 AM

duenor: Peppermint Rose: The prepper or survivalist people I know are so ineffective in day to day life they live in a fantasy world. I'm not talking about some water, some food and some guns. I'm talking about we're preparing for the end of the world nut jobs. They can't keep a job, balance a checkbook have no friends but when the big bad gubmint (from which they derive most of their income) enacts the plan to kill them off then they'll finally be the successful popular person important person they were meant to be. It's a really sad and unhealthy way to live.

That is because the non-mentally-unwell survivalists have the good sense to not let others know (other than close friends and family) what they have at home. The biggest gun safe in the world isn't as secure as nobody thinking that anything is even there.

As this thread shows, there are plenty of people whose disaster survival plan consists mostly of joining a mob and taking what they want by brute force.


I think an important part of determining whether or not the person is crazy is the kind of scenario they are preparing for and then whether their plans in regard to that scenario are actually reasonable. I don't think anyone would argue that a person who lives in an area where the power regularly goes out in the winter is crazy for having a generator, a supply of canned food, batteries, lanterns, fresh water, etc and so forth. That is a reasonable, likely thing they are preparing for, and wanting to be prepared for an outage that lasted a couple of weeks instead of a couple days isn't unreasonable. That could realistically happen.

Preparing a full on bunker for the hitler commie obama godless heathen UN socialist deathpanel zombie apocalypse however is already crazy even before you got to the bunker part. That's part of the breakdown here, many of these people are preparing for things that are simply not likely to happen, and have a deep disconnect with reality.
 
2013-02-23 05:57:54 AM
Hmmm. A distinction with no practical value to normal people.
 
2013-02-23 06:12:57 AM

duenor: Where did you get the idea that preppers intend to shut themselves away from society? They just don't want to be victims. Most have other prepper friends and in the event of a disaster they will share resources and help each other rebuild.


Perhaps the views I've gotten are biased for effect/controversy/drama, but everything I've seen seems to indicate the majority of preppers are not socially minded friends&neighbors types, but hide in the wilds of Montana types. Admittedly, I've not been looking too closely, but the impression I'm getting is that a) they will not be sharing resources, and b) they are not even remotely prepared to rebuild.

They have lots and lots of MREs and dehydrated water and ammunition and so on; but based on what I've seen and heard, the place I'M going to take over when the apocalypse happens is going to be a hardware and garden supply store. These folks are going to be ready for the immediate breakdown, perhaps, but they will be SOL when their bunker begins to leak, or they need nails and bolts and WD-40 for their bulletproof house, and they start to run out of wild plants and want to grow food in the thin and rocky soil of their urban backyard.

They're not prepared. As I said, one gal I happened to catch on that dumb show last week was all set to hike out of NYC in case of a hurricane attack, but hadn't bothered to check if she could actually do it on foot as planned in the time allotted (she couldn't); and another guy who had his family all set to go from the same city with two-way radios and timed routes in and out of the city had not checked to see if his (very expensive) radios would work down in the city. Lo and behold--the cityscape seriously f*cked with reception and made his radios nearly worthless. Meantime, since his scenario was fear of nuclear/biological attack, the "prep-checker" asked him if he knew how to be sure he wasn't walking into the potential nuclear fallout. The guy had never thought about it--and staying upwind of an attack in Central Park added ten hours to his "escape plan."

My entire prep plan consists of staying put, staying quiet, riding out the initial anarchy, and then quietly acquiring what I need from whatever is still standing. And if it looks like the world is really going to end, I know the long-range markers to look for, and I'll be in Northern Nevada at least two weeks in advance.
 
2013-02-23 07:27:48 AM

olddinosaur: Oblio13: Our Attorney General wants the citizenry disarmed so badly that he smuggled weapons to Mexican drug cartels and tried to blame it on us. Our President is a former Constitutional law professor who is able to rationalize assassinating citizens abroad. Even small-town police departments are militarizing. Homeland Security just bought 1.6 BILLION rounds of ammunition. Emails and phone calls are being monitored. Warrantless searches are common. The legal mechanisms are in place for indefinite detentions without trials. Anticipating a ban, people are buying "assault weapons" as fast as they can be manufactured. They aren't buying them because they're going to turn them in. Part of me says, "It can't happen here". Another part of me says, "If I were seeing this in another country, I'd say both sides were preparing for civil war". I used to wonder if I was just being paranoid. Now I think that anyone who can't see a gathering storm is willfully blind. Being prepared can't hurt, and it's cheap insurance.

You are a wise man.  I have seen the same things, in much greater detail, for a much longer period of time.

Governments do not go quietly away when they are no longer needed, and if there is a bad financial crisis, they WILL find a way to feed themselves, no matter whose feet they step on.  Also, our government is like a big snake with the head cut off: the tail does not know it is dead yet, and keeps thrashing around.  If the economy goes to hell in a handbasket, they WILL take as much as they want, no matter how much you think you might need.  If that means your children starve, that is just plain tough.

You've also got somewhere north of 50 million parasites who cannot feed themselves even in good times; what will they do when things really get bad?


And people wonder why I think we'd all be better off if natural selection were still allowed to work on humans. Keeping every retarded, crippled, farked up human alive because "humans are sacred" or some bullshiat is what has led us to this state.
 
2013-02-23 07:55:47 AM
Prepper.
www.al-sharq.com
 
2013-02-23 08:42:27 AM
Really, I think the problem is that they think these are primarily descriptors of ideology; that being called a prepper/survivalist means "Conservative Nutjob." The truth is, "Prepper/Survivalist" more describes that you believe in some low-order doomsday scenario and spend a lot of time/money acquiring the goods/skills to survive it, to a level that the rest of society just thinks is odd.

Meanwhile, yes, a vast majority of these preppers/survivalists are right-wing nutjobs. Not all of them, but most. But really, you're complaining about a common usage of a word with implications...where the definition ABSOLUTELY fits you, but you dislike the implications. Oh well. Good luck trying to change English. You're welcome to try, but don't expect much.
 
2013-02-23 08:49:22 AM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: It's the difference between preparing for a sudden, but manageable disaster (fire, tornado, flood, etc.) and preparing for the chaotic collapse of civilization.


This.

I used to live in the San Francisco Bay Area. Due to the risk of earthquakes it was perfectly sensible to have basic stuff like food and water to last a few weeks, sleeping bags and a tent, a generator, chainsaw, and some stabilized fuel, the wrenches for turning off gas and water, etc. I also did some recreational and competitive shooting, so there was already a couple guns and some ammo in the safe. We had some basic plans like locations where we could meet if we were unable to remain at the house, who to call in an emergency (e.g. family members both in California and in other states), copies of important documents like insurance policies, etc. I like to think that's well on the side of "reasonably prepared for a disaster likely to affect the area" without crossing into the realm of "crazed survivalist". Other than staying alive and reasonably comfortable after a disaster, our main thought was that we didn't want to be a burden on rescuers or relief organizations who could instead be helping people in greater need.

It turns out that we mostly used the generator and fuel when winter storms would hit the area and knock out power. Keeping the sump pump in the basement running helped prevent significant property damage on our property and a neighbor's (without the pumps running the basements of our houses would flood and they were new to the area and didn't consider that before the first storm struck). Keeping the fridge cold was nice too: nothing like a cold beer in the middle of a big storm.

/not really concerned about the collapse of civilization, as we'd all be pretty much boned then
 
2013-02-23 08:53:42 AM

LanceDearnis: But really, you're complaining about a common usage of a word with implications...where the definition ABSOLUTELY fits you, but you dislike the implications.


Well, people who don't save their money can rightly be called wastrels, too, but what does name-calling accomplish for either side?
 
2013-02-23 09:01:54 AM

duenor: I never said I live in NO. I don't. ...

Indeed, I don't see how you can choose to believe that cops killed blacks for trying to walk out of NO (something I haven't heard of, but certainly plausible) and yet do not want to believe (or even recognize as plausible) that aid workers (my friends included) could have been shot at in spite of both references and my own description.


I'm not surprised that you, embedded in your racist survivalist fantasy bubble, have never heard of the Danziger Bridge shootings. Many gun nuts denied the initial reports up until 5 officers were convicted and received long prison sentences, and many still are unaware, deny it happened, or actually support the cops' actions.

That is the only instance of Katrina violence with enough evidence to prosecute, no matter what rumors your imaginary friends on the internet repeat.
 
2013-02-23 10:09:18 AM

foxyshadis: Sometimes you just want to eat rice and fish in a nice little package. What do you have against rice and fish?


Nothing.
 
2013-02-23 10:10:55 AM
I'm a Christian if only because I want God to "accidentally" the whole state.


That's mighty "Christian" of you to believe in a god soley so that his "wrath" could be brought down on peope who may have only moved to Cali for their jobs, etc.

/// The FSM frowns upon your shenanigans ! Ramen.
 
2013-02-23 10:14:35 AM

Krieghund: One of my favorite things about Los Angeles are all the little hole in the wall sushi joints here. Sushi doesn't have to be a big production. You can just step into a mom and pop place and get a roll. And if there's a nice park or something across the street, you can take it out and eat it there. Personally, I think it's best eaten ASAP, so I wouldn't take it far.

Folks that think ordering omakase is the only way to eat sushi actually come as less sophisticated than they realize.


Eh. I was just trying to put a damper on what would turn into a provincial slapfight between two people who don't even really care much about the topic, followed by the inevitable arrival of phony know-it-alls throwing out contrarian bullsh*t.  T
 
2013-02-23 10:38:46 AM

edmo: Which is which?


Hey, where's that picture even from? I've seen it floating around on the web but never known who the drooling inbreds in it are.
 
2013-02-23 10:50:05 AM

untaken_name: mesmer242: Letting your family guilt you into hoarding months of supplies?

Why is it that you believe it is "hoarding"? You know, the government spent your tax money to make sure they have adequately stocked shelters, just in case. They have years' worth of everything, just sitting around, just in case. Is the federal government a hoarding prepper? If their behavior is acceptable, why is it unacceptable for a private individual to act in the same manner? Also, we all have choices to make in life. If one person chooses to spend all their money on worthless crap, are they "hoarding" worthless crap? If you spend your money on beer, cigarettes, and strippers while someone else spends theirs on food, medical supplies, toilet paper, etc, haven't you both spent your money in the manner you each chose? Why is the guy who actually has something to show for it supposedly bad? I just don't understand people's mindsets sometimes.


If you're barely making ends meet, and are putting MREs on your christmas wish list, then it's hoarding. That's, in fact, why this came up at all in conversation with the person I was talking about - they wanted me to gift them this stuff for christmas. If your emergency preparations are such that I hear about it, then it's overboard. If you have the space and money, do what you want. But if it becomes an obsession, a lifestyle, or if you ask me for help with your preparations... there's something wrong with that.

It would take you about two seconds to click on my profile and realize the chances of me wasting my money on alcohol, cigarettes or strippers are pretty much zero. The extra money in our household goes in to our child's college fund, which seems much more likely than a scenario where I need months of food and water in the house. A week's worth? Sure, that could be worthwhile. But I'm not going to walk around telling people about it. And I'm not going to self identify as a prepper. I'm just going to keep the pantry full. That's the difference I was pointing out.
 
2013-02-23 11:53:45 AM

untaken_name: LanceDearnis: But really, you're complaining about a common usage of a word with implications...where the definition ABSOLUTELY fits you, but you dislike the implications.

Well, people who don't save their money can rightly be called wastrels, too, but what does name-calling accomplish for either side?


That whether you're a 'Prepper' or a 'Survivalist' by their definitions, I'm going to think you a nutjob either way...

...And that the only difference to me, in my mind about their labels, if it implies conservative or not. And I don't really think any political labels should be 'dirty words', so...

(And, by the way, I don't mean preparing for calamities is ridiculous; I'm saying that if you worry so much you feel the need to make sure you can grow your own food, you ARE overdoing it.)
 
2013-02-23 01:19:11 PM

jfarkinB: olddinosaur: You've also got somewhere north of 50 million parasites who cannot feed themselves even in good times

Nice way to characterize retirees and veterans. You'll be offing yourself when you hit Social Security age, then, right?


Sooner would be better....
 
2013-02-23 01:20:22 PM
The thing that preppers seem to have cornered the market on, as evidenced by every thread on the matter ever? Whiny-assed passive aggressive victimhood.
 
2013-02-23 01:30:43 PM

rappy: spaten: The slaughter by government has always exceeded,  the fight of the individual...

EvilRacistNaziFascist: Dear me, the mindless Obama fanboys are out in full force tonight..


You've got to be kidding me. I've been further even more decided to use even go need to do look more as anyone can. Can you really be far even as decided half as much to use go wish for that? My guess is that when one really been far even as decided once to use even go want, it is then that he has really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like. It's just common sense


It's the same person. Put them both on ignore, I do bid you.
 
2013-02-23 02:10:53 PM
www.gazillionmovies.com
 
2013-02-23 02:46:14 PM

HairBolus: duenor: I never said I live in NO. I don't. ...

Indeed, I don't see how you can choose to believe that cops killed blacks for trying to walk out of NO (something I haven't heard of, but certainly plausible) and yet do not want to believe (or even recognize as plausible) that aid workers (my friends included) could have been shot at in spite of both references and my own description.

I'm not surprised that you, embedded in your racist survivalist fantasy bubble, have never heard of the Danziger Bridge shootings. Many gun nuts denied the initial reports up until 5 officers were convicted and received long prison sentences, and many still are unaware, deny it happened, or actually support the cops' actions.

That is the only instance of Katrina violence with enough evidence to prosecute, no matter what rumors your imaginary friends on the internet repeat.


I find it fascinating that this is the third time you've taken to calling me a racist, on meds, fantasizing... all the while refusing to acknowledge criminal activity in the wake of disasters except where it's precipitated by police (so that it fits your skewed view of the world).
You, HairBolus, are an idiot.
 
2013-02-23 03:08:51 PM
First of all: Zombies will never happen. Seriously, I am seeing more and more young men "preparing for the zombie apocalypse" without a hint of irony. They need to know that zombie attack is an impossible thing, and that Max Brooks' survival-porn isn't based in reality.

Second: Gryfalcon has it right. Stay quiet, stay put, and then go out and salvage when the dust settles.

Third: If the more extreme survivalists have it right, and the government (new or old) starts going door-to-door rounding up people for imprisonment or execution, there's not much you can do about it. They're ALWAYS going to be better-armed, better staffed, and better organized than you. You may have an arsenal in your shelter, but they have tanks, bombs, planes, helicopters, missiles, and no problem surrounding you and burning you to death. If the weak-ass LAPD can do it to a mad-dog killer with military training and an deep understanding of police procedures, the army you're defending against will have no problem turning you into barbecue if they suspect you're going to put up a fight. You're not Mad Max, and this is the real world. There are a lot of ways to end you before you get to use all your black market toys. Simply put: You'll be outnumbered and you'll go down. If you feel like you need to go down fighting, that's fine... Just don't have any illusion that you're going to Rambo your way out of it.
 
2013-02-23 03:09:36 PM

MrSteve007: One thing that I wish more people would get into is Community Emergency Response Teams (CERT). It's a US Government/Citizencorps program, designed specifically to get "trained" citizens to be able to communicate, coordinate and help first responders in a time of need.

The classes are excellent, typically taught by your local emergency management and firefighters, and pretty damned cool.

[www.keizerfire.com image 320x240]

Our local programs coordinate with the state's fire training center, so we get to experience actual (but simulated) backdraft and flame rollover situations. They train in triage, first-aid, heavy lifting (1-ton "jersey barriers" with prybars and cribbing) building clearing and marking, emergency communications, disaster site mass-casualty setup points, community evacuations, chemical fire/smoke recognition, even optional classes in structural inspections. The shiat is pretty rad, free, and you get to meet all your local first responders. I highly recommend it.


 My work sponsored one of those a few years ago. I took it. It was awesome! We got to do our final day simulation in the remains of a 40 year old abandoned small town hospital. It was perfect!

/definitely recommend it too.
 
2013-02-23 03:19:28 PM

LanceDearnis: That whether you're a 'Prepper' or a 'Survivalist' by their definitions, I'm going to think you a nutjob either way...


Well, that sounds like the worst consequence that could possibly ever happen in any world ever. I can't believe anyone would risk that.
 
2013-02-23 03:22:37 PM

mesmer242: untaken_name: mesmer242: Letting your family guilt you into hoarding months of supplies?

Why is it that you believe it is "hoarding"? You know, the government spent your tax money to make sure they have adequately stocked shelters, just in case. They have years' worth of everything, just sitting around, just in case. Is the federal government a hoarding prepper? If their behavior is acceptable, why is it unacceptable for a private individual to act in the same manner? Also, we all have choices to make in life. If one person chooses to spend all their money on worthless crap, are they "hoarding" worthless crap? If you spend your money on beer, cigarettes, and strippers while someone else spends theirs on food, medical supplies, toilet paper, etc, haven't you both spent your money in the manner you each chose? Why is the guy who actually has something to show for it supposedly bad? I just don't understand people's mindsets sometimes.

If you're barely making ends meet, and are putting MREs on your christmas wish list, then it's hoarding. That's, in fact, why this came up at all in conversation with the person I was talking about - they wanted me to gift them this stuff for christmas. If your emergency preparations are such that I hear about it, then it's overboard. If you have the space and money, do what you want. But if it becomes an obsession, a lifestyle, or if you ask me for help with your preparations... there's something wrong with that.

It would take you about two seconds to click on my profile and realize the chances of me wasting my money on alcohol, cigarettes or strippers are pretty much zero. The extra money in our household goes in to our child's college fund, which seems much more likely than a scenario where I need months of food and water in the house. A week's worth? Sure, that could be worthwhile. But I'm not going to walk around telling people about it. And I'm not going to self identify as a prepper. I'm just going to keep the pantry full. That' ...


So what you're basically saying is that people around you better not have any hobbies or interests that you don't share, or, if they have the effrontery to violate that basic rule of life, they better not talk about it with you. Got it. You sound like a great friend.
 
2013-02-23 04:32:58 PM
There are millions of people in this world who expect things to stay the same for the entirety of their lives. They feel that the governments of the world have their best interests well in hand, and they will never need to do anything to ensure their own survival in a catastrophe because people better than them are working hard to keep them safe and secure.

If anyone thinks otherwise they are demonized as being crazy. Only a crazy person would prepare for the collapse of society. Only a crazy person would think random strangers would try to attack them for things like food and water.

And until society does collapse, this stigma will always be there. Always.
 
2013-02-23 05:15:09 PM

untaken_name: If you're barely making ends meet, and are putting MREs on your christmas wish list, then it's hoarding. That's, in fact, why this came up at all in conversation with the person I was talking about - they wanted me to gift them this stuff for christmas. If your emergency preparations are such that I hear about it, then it's overboard. If you have the space and money, do what you want. But if it becomes an obsession, a lifestyle, or if you ask me for help with your preparations... there's something wrong with that.

It would take you about two seconds to click on my profile and realize the chances of me wasting my money on alcohol, cigarettes or strippers are pretty much zero. The extra money in our household goes in to our child's college fund, which seems much more likely than a scenario where I need months of food and water in the house. A week's worth? Sure, that could be worthwhile. But I'm not going to walk around telling people about it. And I'm not going to self identify as a prepper. I'm just going to keep the pantry full. That' ...

So what you're basically saying is that people around you better not have any hobbies or interests that you don't share, or, if they have the effrontery to violate that basic rule of life, they better not talk about it with you. Got it. You sound like a great friend.


What I'm saying is that if your paranoid fantasies get to the point where you ask me at Christmas for food you're never actually going to eat and just shove in a closet, then I'm going to think you're weird, and I'm not going to buy it for you. And if you complain that you're struggling to pay your bills but think it's more important that you stock up on ammo, then I'm going to think you have poor decision making skills. Finally, preparing for the end times isn't a hobby. Hobbies have some element of enjoyment or recreation to them, and those are interesting to hear about (not just in spite of, but especially when it's something I'd never participate in myself). But buying stuff doesn't count. I'd be just as bored with a conversation with someone who spent an excessive amount of time and effort buying shoes "just because they might need them sometime" even though "money is really tight right now." That's the real equivalent in this situation.
 
2013-02-23 06:36:44 PM
The rule of thumb for this is pretty much the one you use for any mental illness. Are they causing themselves or others harm? I admit I watched some episodes of Doomsday Preppers but I stopped because it just made me sad. Those people were mentally ill. They were blowing thousands of dollars, sometimes all of their savings, into preparing for an event that probably will never happen. The show was enabling their illness. Their families should have been saying "Look dad, you've spent all our money on bunkers and ammunition that we're never going to use. You need to tone it way down and we'll be glad to get you the help you need." Instead of just shrugging their shoulders and saying "I guess he just wants us to be safe" while muttering under their breath "but it would be nice if we could go on a vacation every once in a while."

Yes, being prepared for an emergency is a good idea. It is just as good and important idea as brushing your teeth. You don't spend all your money on every dental attachment out there. You don't spend your free time daydreaming about the best ways to brush your teeth. You don't form tooth brushing clubs. You buy your toothbrush and floss and you take care of it. If prepping is taking over your finances and your social life it means you're compensating for something else and you should probably look into that before you start taking dates to your bunker and eating bugs "for practice."
 
2013-02-23 08:25:49 PM

odinsposse: The rule of thumb for this is pretty much the one you use for any mental illness. Are they causing themselves or others harm? I admit I watched some episodes of Doomsday Preppers but I stopped because it just made me sad. Those people were mentally ill. They were blowing thousands of dollars, sometimes all of their savings, into preparing for an event that probably will never happen. The show was enabling their illness. Their families should have been saying "Look dad, you've spent all our money on bunkers and ammunition that we're never going to use. You need to tone it way down and we'll be glad to get you the help you need." Instead of just shrugging their shoulders and saying "I guess he just wants us to be safe" while muttering under their breath "but it would be nice if we could go on a vacation every once in a while."

Yes, being prepared for an emergency is a good idea. It is just as good and important idea as brushing your teeth. You don't spend all your money on every dental attachment out there. You don't spend your free time daydreaming about the best ways to brush your teeth. You don't form tooth brushing clubs. You buy your toothbrush and floss and you take care of it. If prepping is taking over your finances and your social life it means you're compensating for something else and you should probably look into that before you start taking dates to your bunker and eating bugs "for practice."


Comparing the subjects of Doomsday Preppers with real life people who are prepared for crises is apples to oranges. It is a TV SHOW. It is ENTERTAINMENT.
Do you also believe that Survivor, Bachelor, and other "reality tv" shows are actually real and not staged / scripted / edited for maximum shock/entertainment value?

The only reality TV show I've ever seen where most of it was real was Mike Rowe's Dirty Jobs. Even then, he freely admitted that he often had to put entertainment before getting the job done, safety, or even the real picture.
 
2013-02-23 09:16:06 PM
I really enjoy how this thread became a mishmash of Obama, gun rights, preppers, nutjobs, and sushi.
 
2013-02-23 09:31:29 PM

mesmer242: What I'm saying is that if your paranoid fantasies get to the point where you ask me at Christmas for food you're never actually going to eat and just shove in a closet, then I'm going to think you're weird, and I'm not going to buy it for you.


Oh, I get it. You don't understand how stored food rotation works, and you can't be bothered to learn about anything once you've made your mind up with no actual experience. Hey, that's fine. Let's see how well that works out for you in life.

mesmer242: And if you complain that you're struggling to pay your bills but think it's more important that you stock up on ammo, then I'm going to think you have poor decision making skills.


Okay, that's reasonable.

mesmer242: Finally, preparing for the end times isn't a hobby. Hobbies have some element of enjoyment or recreation to them, and those are interesting to hear about (not just in spite of, but especially when it's something I'd never participate in myself).


Good to know that you are the arbiter of what is and is not a hobby, and what is and is not interesting. Not sure who elected you to that position, but whatever.

mesmer242: But buying stuff doesn't count.


Buying stuff doesn't count as a hobby? Better tell comic book collectors, stamp collectors, ANYTHING THAT COSTS MONEY COLLECTORS, then, because they all disagree with you.

mesmer242: I'd be just as bored with a conversation with someone who spent an excessive amount of time and effort buying shoes "just because they might need them sometime" even though "money is really tight right now." That's the real equivalent in this situation.


So you should be able to tell everyone else how to spend their money, and if you aren't allowed to do so, then people are wrong and bad and stupid. Well, it's a good thing you're the boss of everyone else, since you're so much better at making their decisions for them.
 
2013-02-23 10:11:31 PM

Kanemano: I live in Honolulu, I have eaten in a real sushi restaurants more time than you I bet. I have also been to Japan several times  it's a farking meal nothing more I don't jerk off when I get a great piece of hamachi, or toro, you just say arigato, pay your check and get out, they really don't give a fark I know this because I drink the the staff of Nobu's quite often, they have 1/2 appetizers on Sundays after 6:30PM if you are ever in Honolulu by the way.


Breaking news: Uninformed people sometimes frequent good restaurants too. That doesn't necessarily make them informed. If a regular McDonalds patron walks into the finest steakhouse in the world, they don't suddenly become a master in the intricacies of fine dining. Not even if they know the owner of the restaurant.

If you think there's no difference between real sushi and the shiat you get given by a supermarket, you are without doubt uninformed. (Or simply lacking in the ability to taste and appreciate food.)

PunGent: Fair point.  But your earlier post sounded a bit like Japanophile snobbery, which gets tedious (only real Japanese can make real sushi, only Japanese can be sumo wrestlers, kendo is the only real form of fencing, the katana is the best melee weapon ever, etc)
I like Japan, but they're not immune to snobbery.


Nope, not snobbery at all. I am sure a Caucasian or any other nationality can prepare sushi just as well, given the same extremely detailed training.

Anybody who is familiar with Dashan is aware that Caucasians can succeed at the very highest levels in any area, even when most would have believed a native upbringing to be a prerequisite to success. And the same is true for Asians who have had great success outside of Asia in any number of disciplines.

Race / ethnicity mean absolutely nothing. A willingness and ability to learn, good and patient teachers, and the physical attributes of the individual (patience, coordination, sense of taste / smell, etc.) are everything.
 
2013-02-23 10:12:58 PM

untaken_name: mesmer242: What I'm saying is that if your paranoid fantasies get to the point where you ask me at Christmas for food you're never actually going to eat and just shove in a closet, then I'm going to think you're weird, and I'm not going to buy it for you.

Oh, I get it. You don't understand how stored food rotation works, and you can't be bothered to learn about anything once you've made your mind up with no actual experience. Hey, that's fine. Let's see how well that works out for you in life.

mesmer242: And if you complain that you're struggling to pay your bills but think it's more important that you stock up on ammo, then I'm going to think you have poor decision making skills.

Okay, that's reasonable.

mesmer242: Finally, preparing for the end times isn't a hobby. Hobbies have some element of enjoyment or recreation to them, and those are interesting to hear about (not just in spite of, but especially when it's something I'd never participate in myself).

Good to know that you are the arbiter of what is and is not a hobby, and what is and is not interesting. Not sure who elected you to that position, but whatever.

mesmer242: But buying stuff doesn't count.

Buying stuff doesn't count as a hobby? Better tell comic book collectors, stamp collectors, ANYTHING THAT COSTS MONEY COLLECTORS, then, because they all disagree with you.

mesmer242: I'd be just as bored with a conversation with someone who spent an excessive amount of time and effort buying shoes "just because they might need them sometime" even though "money is really tight right now." That's the real equivalent in this situation.

So you should be able to tell everyone else how to spend their money, and if you aren't allowed to do so, then people are wrong and bad and stupid. Well, it's a good thing you're the boss of everyone else, since you're so much better at making their decisions for them.


1) I am completely within my rights to choose what I do and do not give people as Christmas gifts. The people asking me for these gifts will not stoop to eating MREs normally, so I have no reason to believe they will use the gifts they were asking for.
2) and 5) I don't have any right to tell anyone how to or have an opinion on how people spend their money UNLESS THEY talk to ME about it. Otherwise it's none of my business. I don't seek out opportunities to get into people's finances, nor will I ever.
3) When someone is truly passionate about a hobby, it shows and it is enjoyable. When someone's hobby consists of being worried, feeling guilted into buying things, and spouting off easily disproven theories about the state of the world, that's not fun. That's not enjoyable. Yes, I'm going to judge.
4) They can disagree with me - that's fine. Most people who collect things do it because they enjoy those things.... not so they can blather about it to others. I've never been at a party and had someone tell me about their collectible anything, even though I know plenty of people who collect things. Part of good social graces is *not* boring others. It's the flipside of listening politely to others.

I find it hard to believe that out of all the comments in this thread, you chose to latch on to mine. I have no problem with people quietly stockpiling reasonable amounts of stuff for an emergency, and in my initial comments all I said is that I found stockpiling large amounts kinda weird. That's it. Are you really so insecure that you need to put me down to feel better about yourself? The internet must be difficult for you.
 
2013-02-24 01:12:35 AM
Prepper/survivalist, tomato/tomahto, it's all just some Americans selling other Americans more things they don't need and will never use.  It's the American way
 
2013-02-24 10:11:58 AM

gweilo8888: Kanemano: I live in Honolulu, I have eaten in a real sushi restaurants more time than you I bet. I have also been to Japan several times  it's a farking meal nothing more I don't jerk off when I get a great piece of hamachi, or toro, you just say arigato, pay your check and get out, they really don't give a fark I know this because I drink the the staff of Nobu's quite often, they have 1/2 appetizers on Sundays after 6:30PM if you are ever in Honolulu by the way.

Breaking news: Uninformed people sometimes frequent good restaurants too. That doesn't necessarily make them informed. If a regular McDonalds patron walks into the finest steakhouse in the world, they don't suddenly become a master in the intricacies of fine dining. Not even if they know the owner of the restaurant.

If you think there's no difference between real sushi and the shiat you get given by a supermarket, you are without doubt uninformed. (Or simply lacking in the ability to taste and appreciate food.)

PunGent: Fair point.  But your earlier post sounded a bit like Japanophile snobbery, which gets tedious (only real Japanese can make real sushi, only Japanese can be sumo wrestlers, kendo is the only real form of fencing, the katana is the best melee weapon ever, etc)
I like Japan, but they're not immune to snobbery.

Nope, not snobbery at all. I am sure a Caucasian or any other nationality can prepare sushi just as well, given the same extremely detailed training.

Anybody who is familiar with Dashan is aware that Caucasians can succeed at the very highest levels in any area, even when most would have believed a native upbringing to be a prerequisite to success. And the same is true for Asians who have had great success outside of Asia in any number of disciplines.

Race / ethnicity mean absolutely nothing. A willingness and ability to learn, good and patient teachers, and the physical attributes of the individual (patience, coordination, sense of taste / smell, etc.) are everything.


Concur...and supermarket sushi is...risky, at best.
 
2013-02-24 12:43:24 PM

EvilRacistNaziFascist: Thingster: In "prepper" terms there's "the shiat hitting the fan/TSHF" and there's "the end of the world as we know it/TEOTWAWKI"

TSHF is a disruption of moderate length, maybe up to a year where one would have to feed/water themselves.

TEOTWAWKI is a cataclysmic event that pretty much sends us back to the dark ages.

The former is "being prepared", the latter is nuttiness. Where you draw the line is up to you.

I'm not sure if you're saying that the expectation of TEOTWAWKI is nuttiness, or the preparation for it. If it's the latter, I'd be inclined to agree -- you can't reasonably expect to prepare for the permanent collapse of civilization, unless you're a Conan the Barbarian type (with an M-16 rather than a magic sword). But if it's the former, it should be pointed out that TEOTWAWKI though unlikely is not inconceivable; those of us who grew up in the 1980s were regaled with endless tales of the "nuclear winter" that would follow the next world war, for example -- you can watch the movie Threads to see what I mean. Civilization is neither as fragile as the more extreme survivalists suggest (that we're all nine meals away from anarchy etc.) or as guaranteed as the optimists might think.


That preparing for it and revolving your life around TEOTWAWKI is a bit nutty. Not the realizing it could happen.

But if it's the guys "hobby", or how he spends his spare time and disposable income, I won't say he's wrong, just that I see it as nutty.
 
2013-02-24 01:21:11 PM
HairBolus
That is the only instance of Katrina violence with enough evidence to prosecute, no matter what rumors your imaginary friends on the internet repeat.

+657. Totally unfounded rumors of black people looting and raping? All true. Prosecutions from a case of racist police vigilantism? Haven't heard of it.
Usually it's not so easy.
 
2013-02-24 01:32:39 PM

duenor: "Sniper fire" was also reported throughout the city, targeted at rescue helicopters, relief workers, and police officers


From the same link:

In a case of reported sniper fire, the "sniper" turned out to be the relief valve of a gas tank popping every few minutes.[46]

Also:

Additional acts of unrest occurred following the storm, particularly with the [51] Also, one-third of New Orleans police officers deserted the city in the days before the storm, many of them escaping in their department-owned patrol cars. This added to the chaos by stretching law enforcement thin.[52] Additionally, several NOPD officers were arrested weeks after Katrina for suspicion of vehicle theft.

I think we can all agree that there was mayhem during Katrina without being absolutist ninnies.
 
2013-02-24 01:48:06 PM
At any rate, if you really want to see an example "prepping" or "survilaism" in the face of real and prolonged looting, rioting, and murder, look at Koreatown in 1992.  And it still isn't a positive example.
 
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