tricycleracer: DHS even has a helpful page he could have read up on:

https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/1184/~/importing-a-boat -f or-personal-use-into-the-u.s.

Since what he was doing was consistent with the information on that page I'm not sure:
1. Why you think he didn't read up on that very link and
2. How exactly the information on that page would have helped him in this situation

China White Tea: I'm almost entirely certain that the people asserting that, "This idiot douchebag should have just done what he was told to do, he deserves it," would be the EXACT same group of people saying, "This douchebag should have obeyed the verbiage on the form, he deserves it," if he wound up getting in trouble for signing an incorrect document.

That is the fark way.

This Looks Fun: Ace Rimmer: This Looks Fun: Ace Rimmer: The only reason for the dollar amount is to calculate duty.... which, since he doesn't mention it at all, I assume they weren't going to charge him. In that case it truly didn't matter what amount was written in that block, on a form that is going to spend all of its life sitting in a cardboard box next to Indy's ark.

You're not referring to THIS part of TFA, are you? : My job was to show up and sign forms and then leave with Buddy (WA sales tax and registration fees come a week later).

WA sales tax and registration fees are not US Customs duties....
The state of WA would have used the invoice to calculate sales tax and fees not his customs declaration.

Possibly; I can't be certain. I know with out-of-state cars, they use the title. I'm not sure if they'd use an invoice or a customs document. Either way, if I knew the price was wrong and I wasn't sure what the price would be for signing a wrong document, I too would wait for the corrected form. This incident does not make him look bad. It makes DHS look bad.

Nobody looks at your customs documents except customs. Also, the correct from would have had him paying 1.5 percent of his purchase price as duty (paid at time of imprt). He was getting a break and decided to take out his bad experience buying the boat on someone else. If he wants his boat he'll have to file the proper paperwork just like anybody else.

JohnCarter: What the boat may look like, and I would have soooo swiped "Buddy"
wom

[coastalcraft.com image 850x566]

That boat is as ugly as a mud fence.

fnordfocus: orclover: SHES PAID $9 A farkING HOUR AND DOES NOT GIVE A fark, she hands you something, you sign it, she moves on to her smoke break.  If you rich farking idiots cant figure that out, then you lose your farking boat you farking assholes.  Yes hire a lawyer,  get righteously indignant.  All you are doing is making that boat even more farking expensive.  I hope the farking thing sinks and you get eaten by some god damn sockeye.

This is CBP, not TSA.  With locality, LEAP, etc. it's more like $40-50 an hour and up.

The Officer is much richer than the average American, and it's certainly not unreasonable to expect some level of competence for that compensation.

In Texas the border agents will barely make a living wage.  I highly doubt the socialist utopia of Washington State is paying their border agents doctors wages.  I have heard that la migra is only a slight step up from mall security work, almost on par with jail guards. She is not a lawyer, she's not an accountant, she probably barely has a high school education.   This is like asking the McDonald's cashier to make you crepes.  WTF is wrong with you people?  Sign the stupid thing and move on with your stuck up lives.  Be thankful the inspection didn't involve a arm, elbow deep up your ass with lube from the lowest bidder.

Just because all the Barrista's there have PHD's does not mean your import stamper is a FBI accountant for her night job.

redmid17: inglixthemad: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: He'll eventually get his boat back.
Of course, he will have to pay the storage fees.


What an idiot. I have less trouble carrying hunting rifles (3), dogs (2), and a travel trailer over the border than this dolt.

Probably because you aren't importing a half million dollar boat into the country that needs to be declared and properly recorded for tax purposes. You are probably just going hunting and need a couple of forms filled out along with your passport to get through. Just a bit different there hoss.

Not really that different, if he was unsure he should have had a broker help. We (my partners and I) bought a Mooney Acclaim Type S from a Canuck. We had to fill out similar paperwork. When you are buying that kind property, you make sure your I's are dotted and T's are crossed, hoss. You're not 100% sure go get some farking help. You spend that much money on something like that, don't whine about a couple thousand more if you can't figure the paperwork out yourself.

China White Tea: I'm almost entirely certain that the people asserting that, "This idiot douchebag should have just done what he was told to do, he deserves it," would be the EXACT same group of people saying, "This douchebag should have obeyed the verbiage on the form, he deserves it," if he wound up getting in trouble for signing an incorrect document.

Well, how are we supposed to keep entertained until the next caturday topic?

Has anyone come in to express sarcastic gratitude to Obama yet?

What's that Joni Mitchell song by Sondheim?

"Send in the ..."  hmmm  "Send in the ..."  (thinking)  "Send in the drones." yeah, that's it

Rostin: GoodyearPimp: People with lots of money sure do have lots of terrible problems.  "I can't take ownership of my boat due to some legalities."  Thanks, Obama.

I've heard liberals express confusion and frustration over the willingness of middle and lower class conservative people to defend tax cuts for the wealthy. Your comment helped me to see in a new way that this reflects a really fundamental difference in the thinking or maybe even the intuitions of the two groups. For conservatives, it really is about the principle of the thing. It doesn't matter to most of them that they'll never have enough money to import a boat and risk encountering problems such as this. It still pisses them off that someone has been treated this way.

For liberals, on the other hand, everything is about class. When that square peg won't fit in a round hole, pound harder.

For some, yes. I'm firmly in the "liberal" camp (which is actually fairly centrist as far as reality is concerned), but this is an asinine overreach of government bureaucracy. Last time I checked though, Obama didn't set up the DHS. He's just taken the ball and run with it.

But as for your comments on class, go look at the income changes over the last 30 years between the rich and the middle class. Note how the middle-class has mildly increased while the upper incomes have shot up. Class warfare isn't from the middle class up. It started with the rich buying favorable tax laws as compared to the rest of us.

So I'm guessing you're just implying that the main conservative principle is that rich people are better than the rest of us, and deserve to get preferential treatment as far as taxes and obligations are concerned?

Rapmaster2000: I'm enjoying how the "SUPPORT THE TROOPS" community is in here playing like they're rebels.  If you changed DHS to Marine Corps then who was in the wrong would turn 180 degrees.

Nope. Biatch in TFA would still be a drone, regardless of uniform.

nickerj1: The My Little Pony Killer: internut scholar: Ehcks: Or he could have calculated the exchange rate at the time of purchase and wrote in the amount of American Dollars he effectively paid.

You mean like he offered to do but wasn't allowed to? Yeah, that would have been a good idea. oh look FTA

I pointed out the error and suggested that we simply change the currency from US $ to CAD $ so that is was correct. Or instead, amend the amount so that it was correct in U.S. dollars.

Notice that his actual argument isn't that the amount they put down was wrong, just that they amount they had wasn't converted to be the currency he paid with, but rather the currency that the organization happens to deal with.

No, the amount they put down was wrong.

The invoice was for say... 20,000 CAD.
On the form they put down 20,000 USD.
However 20,000 CAD is only ~19600 USD, so he's paying import duty on ~400 more than he should be.

However, boat import duty rate is only 1.5% so... he should have just signed and payed the extra $6 USD.

In that case he can leave with his boat, file a protest based on the wrong value being used, he'd win, and get his precious six bucks back (possibly with interest since it wasn't his error)

Kome: As usual, I took the "or else" option. And the bastards stole my boat.
I'll probably get droned now, too.

Up until you decided to go all conspiracy nutter and think that you're important enough for domestic spying. ...

We really need a sarcasm font so stuff like this doesn't happen. Dude was obviously joking. And everybody in this thread that says he deserved to have the boat taken is insane.

He'll get the paperwork fixed. He'll get his boat back. It'll be fine. A bit of a hassle, but that's the just the beginning of hassles with boat ownership.

orclover: Sign the stupid thing and move on with your stuck up lives.  Be thankful the inspection didn't involve a arm, elbow deep up your ass with lube from the lowest bidder.

You know, I know some Constitution Loving Conservatives(TM) who told me that if they decided to do that in airports, I should be okay with that, because terrorism.  If I had a problem with that, I needed to be strapped to a chair and forced to watch 9/11 until I got it trough my goddamn stupid liberal head why it was okay.

When it affects people with money, though, THEN it's an outrage.  Huh.

dslknowitall: Kome: As usual, I took the "or else" option. And the bastards stole my boat.
I'll probably get droned now, too.

Up until you decided to go all conspiracy nutter and think that you're important enough for domestic spying. ...

We really need a sarcasm font so stuff like this doesn't happen. Dude was obviously joking. And everybody in this thread that says he deserved to have the boat taken is insane.

I do not think there is anything in the context of his blog post that indicates that comment could be sarcastic. But, yes, I agree that his boat should not have been taken away. What happened to him was f*cked up. But the tone of the article indicated a severely warped view of government. E.g. the quote that is the headline - what does it matter that the person had a gun? The same meaning without ascribing nefarious authoritarianism can be conveyed by just saying "A government employee asked me to swear in writing that a lie was true today." The imagery of the gun is unnecessary and only serves as a rhetorical device to paint the situation as contrasting the citizen with the big bad government. The mention about being droned because of this moves it from "damn, you got screwed, I'm sorry" to "what happened really sucks, but you really need to put it in perspective because you're starting to sound crazy" territory.

mongbiohazard: Kome: mongbiohazard: Who else has she treated similarly who didn't have as loud a pulpit?

Yes. Who else can afford to import a boat and doesn't have access to the internet!?

/facepalm

Just having access to the internet doesn't mean anyone gives a shiat what you have to say. But because of who he is he has fans/followers/admirers who can ensure the story gets wider attention then just some dude buying a boat from his brother or something.

Is that really a difficult concept for you?

And yet, Facebook, Twitter, Linkedin, Fark, Reddit, Examiner, Imgur, Tumblr, Blogspot, Wordpress, Youtube, etc. etc. etc. It's amazing how many venues there are online for people to easily attain the sort of pulpit or following (in some capacity, obviously something like Fark/Reddit is different than Twitter/Tumblr) you think is a necessary precondition to make people aware of a perceived injustice (I only say perceived because not all rants on blogs reflect a true slight, even though in this case I genuinely believe the guy was royally screwed over). Even more amazing is how quickly word can spread because a person can link to their own blog. We have the ability to build our own pulpit and grow our own following (or at least, our own visibility). And if you can afford to import a vehicle, you can afford to sign up for all of those lovely free services (as this guy did) and share your own views. That's, you know, kind of what the Internet is for. That, and porn. Obviously. The internet is primarily for porn. But beyond porn, it gives anyone who has access to it the ability to create a niche for themselves to share whatever serious or inane thoughts they want to share.

Im pretty sure its HIS job to have the proper forms, not the customs agent. So she told him to sign or leave because frankly, its not her problem. Sort your own shiat out.

digitalrain: Rapmaster2000: I'm enjoying how the "SUPPORT THE TROOPS" community is in here playing like they're rebels.  If you changed DHS to Marine Corps then who was in the wrong would turn 180 degrees.

Nope. Biatch in TFA would still be a drone, regardless of uniform.

I don't recall the USMC seizing property imported from Canada, insisting  that a person  sign a false document  etc. Peeing on dead Taliban yes (and who cares) but this No.

Unfortunate US military is not as involved in border security as it should be.

Of course if this had been  in 20087 the Fark progressives would have been all OMG Bush-Cheney-Blackwater.  But now the President is even spared the blame for record gas prices..

I don't understand why so many of you try so hard to justify the actions of the woman, or dismiss them as inconsequential.

dslknowitall: Kome: As usual, I took the "or else" option. And the bastards stole my boat.
I'll probably get droned now, too.

Up until you decided to go all conspiracy nutter and think that you're important enough for domestic spying. ...

We really need a sarcasm font so stuff like this doesn't happen. Dude was obviously joking. And everybody in this thread that says he deserved to have the boat taken is insane.

We don't need a sarcasm font. As you say, he was obviously joking. Now you and I can laugh at those without the sense to see that. Come on, let's laugh at him, and point too. ahahah *points at him, ahahaha.

Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy.  http://joshuatopolsky.com/post/2791763076/dear-michael-arrington

tricycleracer: This guy is a farking drama queen.

Yeah, that must be it.  On the other hand, they can take your property if you refuse to sign an inaccurate form that "doesn't really matter".  I mean, cause, you know, for the security of the fatherland.  Welcome to the fourth reich.  You can have a comfy chair but if we say it's a threat to "security", it's gonna be our comfy chair, so eat sh*t while we steal from you.  You know what the opposite of a "drama queen" is?  A pissy little b*tch who sucks any dick stuck in her face cause "what UVER".

Rapmaster2000: PaLarkin: abhorrent1: He's probably one of those douchebags that refuses to show his receipt when he leaves a store too.

So all someone has to do to be a douchebag is stand up for their rights?  That's bullshiat.  When I go to a store and buy something and get my receipt, I'm done.  If some door nazi wants to see my receipt, he's going to be disappointed.  I paid for it and I will not show them my receipt unless they can prove to my satisfaction  they have good cause to  see it.  One reason the country has gone down the toilet is so many people just submit to whatever crap government imposes on them.

Constitutional Tip:  There are no rights involved in shopping at Wal-Mart.  They offer low prices in exchange for receipt-checking.  If you are so opposed to receipt-checking, then you are free to shop at another store.

Nor, indeed, does having to show your receipt to the door greeter in any way involve submitting to the government.

My father-in-law, when he lived in South Carolina, decided to be a horse's ass on several occasions.  They banned him from the store.  They're a private business, it was their right.  The straw that broke the camel's back was when he started swearing at the CSM because there were CSMs going over the schedule up by the checkouts, and only four cashiers actually on duty.

Slaxl: I don't understand why so many of you try so hard to justify the actions of the woman, or dismiss them as inconsequential.

Because her actions were inconsequential?

In order to clear his boat from Customs he has to file the proper paperwork.
His paperwork had an error
The CBP officer told him the error was insignificant, wouldn't make any difference, and wasn't worth the time to leave the dock, go back to the office, correct, return to the dock, etc.thus ensuring that the man would have had to schedule a fourth try to clear his boat
The man refused to file the proper paperwork and didn't get his boat
When the man calms down and files the proper paperwork, he'll get his boat

Hint: When someone

crispyorganic: Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy.  http://joshuatopolsky.com/post/2791763076/dear-michael-arrington

He may be an e-jerk but if it was patriotic and OK to steal from jerks, Dick Cheney and the Koch Brothers would be living behind dumpsters.  We have allowed a class of sadists, gutless punks and thieves with tin badges to be installed in our country and the absolute authority granted to these jerkoffs attracts precisely the sort of people you would assume such a job might.

Pitabred: But as for your comments on class, go look at the income changes over the last 30 years between the rich and the middle class. Note how the middle-class has mildly increased while the upper incomes have shot up. Class warfare isn't from the middle class up. It started with the rich buying favorable tax laws as compared to the rest of us.


I agree with you somewhat (and I realize this is definitive thread-jack). There is unarguably an expanding gap between the rich and the middle class, but it has little to do with taxes. Liberals like you and me see this growing inequality and attempt to correct it with tax reform, but I believe that's simply punitive.


Why do we believe that our situations will improve if the rich are taxed more? What is the Federal government going to do with that extra income that will benefit us? The answer is nothing. Instead of trying to pull ourselves up, we are trying to drag them down. Satisfying, maybe. But it's not going to do us any real good.


The rich have further enriched themselves by cutting the middle class out of the equation. They use outsourcing and foreign manufacturing and automation and Wal-Mart to deprive the middle class of earning potential. This is a terrible thing for us, but fighting against it is no more productive than punching a river whose flood water is dragging your house out to sea. The solution is to grab what you can and build a new house somewhere else. Otherwise we are an entire population of travel agents fighting against the tyranny of Expedia.


Since the rich have removed us from the food chain, we now need to create our own food chain. The internet is the greatest equalizing technology ever created and even the homeless can use it for free at the library. Anyone with 10 dollars can create their own website and use it to create profitable content. This is the great economic opportunity of our time. Anyone can publish a kindle book through Amazon. Anyone can make a film and promote it on Youtube. Anyone can glue raccoon hair to a rock and sell it on Etsy. Anyone can import plastic garbage from China and sell it to whoever.


The middle class is desperately clinging to a boat that threw them overboard decades ago. Anyone who depends on a salary as their sole source of income is voluntarily enslaving themselves. Class warfare is real. Correction, was real. It's over and they won. It's just taken a while for us to notice. But the government won't save us. It can't even save itself. It's up to us to provide for our own salvation and look to the examples of those who have done it. Check out the guy in the article. I don't know anything about him except he started some blog I've never read and now his biggest problem is getting his brand-new, enormous, hand built yacht through customs. And we hate him for it when we should be looking to his example.


In my opinion, having the government take more money from the rich and hope it trickles down to us is just as ridiculous as Reagan's proposal ever was.

Barricaded Gunman: FTFA: What struck me the most about the situation is how excited she got about seizing the boat. Like she was just itching for something like this to happen. This was a very happy day for her.

This is the part that galls me, perhaps the most. Putting seizure authority in the hands of resentful idots who should rightfully be bagging groceries is a bad idea, and telling them they're some kind of Super Patriots protecting America from terrorists is worse.

Have you considered that the point of view of the potential boat owner might be biased, and he might be trying to paint the DHS in a more negative light?

AxemRed: When it looked like it was going to become a big deal, I would have just scribbled out the USD and changed it to CAD myself and then signed it rather than asking.

Either fix the value or the units.  If she says "you can't do that" after you've already done it, start from scratch with a new document that can be done correctly.

Would love to hear the other side of this story.

He shouldn't be complaining. At least he didn't have some guy come over and start playing pool with his johnson.

bunner: He may be an e-jerk but if it was patriotic and OK to steal from jerks, Dick Cheney and the Koch Brothers would be living behind dumpsters.

A man can dream......

Ace Rimmer: Slaxl: I don't understand why so many of you try so hard to justify the actions of the woman, or dismiss them as inconsequential.

Because her actions were inconsequential?

In order to clear his boat from Customs he has to file the proper paperwork.
His paperwork had an error
The CBP officer told him the error was insignificant, wouldn't make any difference, and wasn't worth the time to leave the dock, go back to the office, correct, return to the dock, etc.thus ensuring that the man would have had to schedule a fourth try to clear his boat
The man refused to file the proper paperwork and didn't get his boat
When the man calms down and files the proper paperwork, he'll get his boat

Hint: When someone

Oops just saw I didn't finish that last thought

I think the real problem here was the DHS person was a biatch both literally and figuratively.

Giving women authority is a questionable move at best

xria: he might be trying to paint the DHS in a more negative light?

This, and a few other alphabet soup clusterf*cks emerged, whole cloth, about an hour and a half after those buildings got blown up.   Replete with foot thick manuals outlining their powers and authority.  Kind of makes you wonder how long the paperwork was sitting idle, waiting for a bolt hole.  When a federal agency that can't manage to assign parking spaces effectively grants broad and sweeping power to a newly minted array of goons and failed pizza delivery drivers - inside of a month - you can bet your sweet cheeks that it's not in the interests of the populace of the country at large

THIS IS AN OUT...oh. Michael Arrington. The only person I'd feel less pity for is Jason Calacanis, so... here's hoping he's next!

GO DHS
USA
USA
USA

Magnanimous_J: Pitabred: But as for your comments on class, go look at the income changes over the last 30 years between the rich and the middle class. Note how the middle-class has mildly increased while the upper incomes have shot up. Class warfare isn't from the middle class up. It started with the rich buying favorable tax laws as compared to the rest of us.

I agree with you somewhat (and I realize this is definitive thread-jack). There is unarguably an expanding gap between the rich and the middle class, but it has little to do with taxes. Liberals like you and me see this growing inequality and attempt to correct it with tax reform, but I believe that's simply punitive.

Why do we believe that our situations will improve if the rich are taxed more? What is the Federal government going to do with that extra income that will benefit us? The answer is nothing. Instead of trying to pull ourselves up, we are trying to drag them down. Satisfying, maybe. But it's not going to do us any real good.

The rich have further enriched themselves by cutting the middle class out of the equation. They use outsourcing and foreign manufacturing and automation and Wal-Mart to deprive the middle class of earning potential. This is a terrible thing for us, but fighting against it is no more productive than punching a river whose flood water is dragging your house out to sea. The solution is to grab what you can and build a new house somewhere else. Otherwise we are an entire population of travel agents fighting against the tyranny of Expedia.

Since the rich have removed us from the food chain, we now need to create our own food chain. The internet is the greatest equalizing technology ever created and even the homeless can use it for free at the library. Anyone with 10 dollars can create their own website and use it to create profitable content. This is the great economic opportunity of our time. Anyone can publish a kindle book through Amazon. Anyone can make a film and promote it on Youtube. Anyone can glue raccoon hair to a rock and sell it on Etsy. Anyone can import plastic garbage from China and sell it to whoever.

The middle class is desperately clinging to a boat that threw them overboard decades ago. Anyone who depends on a salary as their sole source of income is voluntarily enslaving themselves. Class warfare is real. Correction, was real. It's over and they won. It's just taken a while for us to notice. But the government won't save us. It can't even save itself. It's up to us to provide for our own salvation and look to the examples of those who have done it. Check out the guy in the article. I don't know anything about him except he started some blog I've never read and now his biggest problem is getting his brand-new, enormous, hand built yacht through customs. And we hate him for it when we should be looking to his example.

In my opinion, having the government take more money from the rich and hope it trickles down to us is just as ridiculous as Reagan's proposal ever was.

See, the thing is that I'm not wanting the government to take more money from the rich, think it'll trickle down, or anything like that. It's my basic sense of fairness that says "Hey, I'm paying 20% of my income in taxes, why should the Romney's pay 15%? Shouldn't they pay at least the same rate as I do?" I think that everyone in this country, after we have taken care of their basic needs, has a duty to help pay for the public infrastructure that helps all of us. The deficit is almost entirely because of political shenanigans, handouts of government funds to corporate suppliers who are now not paying taxes on that money they made from it. Healthcare, military, DHS, all of it. Our GNP has grown year over year, but we somehow can't seem to do anything but bleed money, and now the poor are poorer than they've ever been, and the rich are richer, but the country is in deep in debt. And according to the GOP, it's all the fault of those 47% of poor people, and we just need to cut taxes on the richest more so that money trickles down. There's a problem with that.

hasty ambush: I think the real problem here was the DHS person was a biatch both literally and figuratively.

Giving women authority is a questionable move at best

I'd love to think otherwise, but almost every woman I've ever encountered with any position of authority over others usually put on whatever costume off the rack that said "AUTHORITY" to her and proceeded to affect a type of disagreeable behavior that reeked of "This is me, being in charge".  You know, when little girls play "grown up" by lining up all their dolls on the bed and putting their hands on their imaginary hips and start chastising the hapless toys with finger wags and annoyed warnings and reproach.  Most women I've met who are "running things" largely think that endless posturing and mild annoyance = authority and leadership.  Mommy is upset with you and you better be worried.  I hope that I simply ran into a sampling of dolts and charlatans and never managed to meet the vast group of honest, capable women for whom authority is more than an affectation and a masked ball.  I really do.

bunner: xria: he might be trying to paint the DHS in a more negative light?

This, and a few other alphabet soup clusterf*cks emerged, whole cloth, about an hour and a half after those buildings got blown up.   Replete with foot thick manuals outlining their powers and authority.  Kind of makes you wonder how long the paperwork was sitting idle, waiting for a bolt hole.  When a federal agency that can't manage to assign parking spaces effectively grants broad and sweeping power to a newly minted array of goons and failed pizza delivery drivers - inside of a month - you can bet your sweet cheeks that it's not in the interests of the populace of the country at large

Uh...I don't know what the hell you're talking about.  The guy was dealing with US Customs, which I assure you has existed long before 9/11, complete with their immensely annoying bureaucratic attitude.

tricycleracer: I'm waiting for the rest of the story.  You don't go from "clerical error" to "seizure" in one easy step like he suggests.

I'd like to believe that.  I'd like to believe that a lot of things that "can't happen here because that's not how stuff works" aren't happening every friggin' day, but I ain't holding my breath.

NEDM: Uh...I don't know what the hell you're talking about.  The guy was dealing with US Customs, which I assure you has existed long before 9/11, complete with their immensely annoying bureaucratic attitude.

And they are new newly empowered with sweeping powers and jurisdictions from other federal agencies because "security" is what the golly gee I'm talking about.

tricycleracer: bunner: tricycleracer: I'm waiting for the rest of the story.  You don't go from "clerical error" to "seizure" in one easy step like he suggests.

I'd like to believe that.  I'd like to believe that a lot of things that "can't happen here because that's not how stuff works" aren't happening every friggin' day, but I ain't holding my breath.

I've read more boat forums than I should have today and I cannot find a single example of his experience.

Then maybe he'll go to jail for saying things that aren't true about the glorious protectorate of the fatherland.  Something stinks someplace and my best guess is it has a .gov job.  It's usually the case.