If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(The Atlantic)   "The student loan crisis is a myth," says an article with many pretty charts that all somehow completely miss the point   (theatlantic.com) divider line 329
    More: Interesting, student loans, loans  
•       •       •

10743 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Feb 2013 at 9:03 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



329 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-02-21 06:15:49 PM
Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.
 
2013-02-21 06:58:13 PM

cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.


Yep. But unlike a mortgage, you can't discharge student loans through bankruptcy (except in extreme cases), so you're screwed for life if you fall behind or struggle to find a job and pay your loans.

I'm pretty sure the government is going to have to allow them in bankruptcy again, or people are in big, big trouble.
 
2013-02-21 07:22:41 PM

cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.


As a moral problem, sure. As a financial problem, I don't see it. Maybe growth will be slower than it otherwise would be, but I'm not able to convince myself of even that. I just don't think enough kids are in enough trouble, even if they do make quite a loud racket.
 
2013-02-21 08:01:18 PM

cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.


89% owe 50k or less.
72% owe 25k or less.

how is this a worse than the mortgage problem?

Yes, I know that there are examples of some whiny hipsters who is a 1%er (owing more than 150k).  But they are outliers and would probably mismanage debt and owe the same amount in Starbucks and car debt if they didn't have student loans.
 
2013-02-21 08:45:13 PM
If four years of college take more than four years to pay off, the system is broken. Or fixed.
 
2013-02-21 09:05:17 PM
College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.
 
2013-02-21 09:07:28 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: how is this a worse than the mortgage problem?


Biggest issue: No collateral attached to the loan. You can't repossess a degree like you can a house. A 25K debt with no collateral attached to it is a huge burden on someone, nothing you can walk away from.
Also a big issue: Lack of bankruptcy protections. Makes no sense. If you're really worried about people graduating and filing for bankruptcy (which has never really been a serious issue) make a 3 year "no bankruptcy" rule or something, not forever.

Doesn't help that these tend to be young people who want to save for their first houses. Lack of people with money to make a down payment on their first home is definitely contributing to a slower recovery for the housing market. It's all connected.
 
2013-02-21 09:08:53 PM

cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.


The thing is, letting students go through bankruptcy would exacerbate the pain the country is going through. The simplest solution is traveling back to 1979 and kicking anyone wanting to run for President square in the statisticals.
 
2013-02-21 09:09:12 PM

Kimothy: cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.

Yep. But unlike a mortgage, you can't discharge student loans through bankruptcy (except in extreme cases), so you're screwed for life if you fall behind or struggle to find a job and pay your loans.

I'm pretty sure the government is going to have to allow them in bankruptcy again, or people are in big, big trouble.


People aren't in trouble - the lenders are.   Who has more to lose, the penniless ex-student with 100K in debt, or the guy who is OWED the 100K ?
 
2013-02-21 09:10:32 PM
They complete the missed point? What was it then?
 
2013-02-21 09:10:59 PM
It's not a problem.
People without money cannot pay their loans back.
The loans are functionally undischargeable until death.
Hardship deferral for as long as necessary, then pay.
No problem.

The idiots who default are idiots.
 
2013-02-21 09:12:57 PM
If a recent graduate is paying $200 or more a month in student loans, they'll have trouble saving for a place to live or trying to purchase a reliable car to use for work / networking.  Remember this, parents.

There is such a thing as income-based repayments.  If heard the arguments that this is just an excuse for lazy kids to take lower paying jobs so they can pay back less.  I see the advantage of such a strategy if your loan payments at the normal rate would be particularly killing.
 
2013-02-21 09:13:02 PM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.

The thing is, letting students go through bankruptcy would exacerbate the pain the country is going through.


How so?
 
2013-02-21 09:13:48 PM

encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.


why?
 
2013-02-21 09:15:09 PM
So, this isn't really infringing on a woman's right to an abortion, it's merely *regulating* abortion.  Get ready,  gun nuts.  We've been watching your brothers pull this shiat for 40 years.
 
2013-02-21 09:15:37 PM

encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.


That's a factor, but at the same time there was a massive concerted effort to convince children they had to go to university right out of highschool or all kinds of bad things would happen to them. For many of them the debt turned out to be the worst thing that could have happened. Looking back now it all seems so sinister.
 
2013-02-21 09:15:42 PM
Did Sallie Mae pay them to publish this bullshiat?

/never took out loans but know many who did
 
2013-02-21 09:16:14 PM
I know this is American, and I know I won't be popular for this statement but: I just finished paying off my 30K student loan. I'm debt free at 32. It feels good.
 
2013-02-21 09:16:16 PM

encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.


And the quality of the base level product has declined.
 
2013-02-21 09:16:25 PM

Wendolyn the Wired: So, this isn't really infringing on a woman's right to an abortion, it's merely *regulating* abortion. Get ready, gun nuts. We've been watching your brothers pull this shiat for 40 years.


I suppose it could, if payments were high enough.  Huh.  We should protest loan repayment on these grounds. ;)
 
2013-02-21 09:16:57 PM

Acharne: I know this is American, and I know I won't be popular for this statement but: I just finished paying off my 30K student loan. I'm debt free at 32. It feels good.


And by this I meant to say. I know the charts are American and I had a Canadian Student Loan. Just got 'add comment' happy.
 
2013-02-21 09:17:32 PM
The feds are sitting on roughly $940 BILLION in student loans. That's effectively $1 trillion that they're making 4-6% on per year. The feds would NEVER let anyone discharge student loans via bankruptcy, there's too much $$ in it. Fun blog about the mess here http://edububble.com/dpp/
 
2013-02-21 09:18:22 PM

MemeSlave: People aren't in trouble - the lenders are.   Who has more to lose, the penniless ex-student with 100K in debt, or the guy who is OWED the 100K ?


Nah... oddly, student loans are the one type of debt where the lender usually ends up with more money when the holder of the debt defaults. Since fines are attached to it and it can't be discharged, they just end up garnishing wages (and eventually SS checks) for the rest of a person's life.
 
2013-02-21 09:18:35 PM
I paid off my student loan decades ago; crisis averted. Your financial problems are none of my concern.
 
2013-02-21 09:18:37 PM

Supes: You can't repossess a degree like you can a house.


You SHOULD be able to take someone's degree (at gun point) and freeze their transcripts if they default. And shame them publicly. Like the stocks of old with a thief sign around their necks.
 
2013-02-21 09:18:48 PM
The biggest problem will come with retirement.  As college educated people are living on the brink, never able to save for the future, for homes, and more, what happens when we have a generation of 67 year olds who can't afford to live but are unable to work?

Republicans would simply say, "fark 'em, let 'em die."  Americans, however, recognize this is a problem.
 
2013-02-21 09:18:56 PM

MemeSlave: Kimothy: cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.

Yep. But unlike a mortgage, you can't discharge student loans through bankruptcy (except in extreme cases), so you're screwed for life if you fall behind or struggle to find a job and pay your loans.

I'm pretty sure the government is going to have to allow them in bankruptcy again, or people are in big, big trouble.

People aren't in trouble - the lenders are.   Who has more to lose, the penniless ex-student with 100K in debt, or the guy who is OWED the 100K ?


The ex-student has more to lose. The lender will continue to hold the debt on their books, or if they deem it to be uncollectable, they write it off as "Bad Debt" and take the tax deduction. But other than that, they keep chugging along as they always have. Meanwhile, the ex-student has his credit report seriously damaged. He'll have a hard time buying a car to get to work. He may even have a hard time finding work, as many employers now check credit reports before hiring. He'll have a tough time getting a loan to buy a house, and if he does somehow swing it, he'll be stuck with an interest rate that's much higher than market rate. Given these likely scenarios, he'll probably have to live at home with mom and dad for a long time after graduation.
 
2013-02-21 09:19:00 PM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: The thing is, letting students go through bankruptcy would exacerbate the pain the country is going through. The simplest solution is traveling back to 1979 and kicking anyone wanting to run for President square in the statisticals.


I assume when you say "country" you mean "The incredibly wealthy profiteering off the backs of students undispellable debt slavery".
 
2013-02-21 09:19:45 PM
The problems with student loans is they target the young, who often aren't the best long term planners and don't really have a concept of what its like to live on a budget since many are leaving their parents house when they enter college, then it burdens them with a lifetime of debt.

It's basically a way of preying on the vulnerable. Some societies use education to guide youth into leading more productive lives. We us it to set them up to be impoverished for life.
 
2013-02-21 09:19:57 PM
Acharne I know this is American, and I know I won't be popular for this statement but: I just finished paying off my 30K student loan. I'm debt free at 32. It feels good.

Doesn't it though?  I paid mine off a few years ago.  Then I was able to pay for land and put up a place to live.  No student loans, no mortgage.  It is a good feeling.
 
2013-02-21 09:20:28 PM
funny, but my wife and I owe 100K total.  That's not the problem.

The problem is that she owes 5 different lenders, and it's $700 a month in payments.

We both have masters degrees.

That's as much as we pay in rent. and we make less than 3000 a month.

Both of us were unemployed in the past year and we both took pay cuts to find employment.

And our loans won't be paid off for 30 years.

That's 700 a month that's not going into retirement, or savings, or into the economy.  We'll never own a home, we'll never be out of debt.  Banks will accumulate huge profits and we will struggle.

We will all accept lower wages because we have to, we will all suffer because there will be no demand for goods and services that will keep the economy going.

Unlike the mortgage crisis we will have nothing to show for our debt.  No home, no kids, not helping the economy.

This recovery will never happen as long as consumers are saddled with never-ending debt.
 
2013-02-21 09:21:39 PM

DrPainMD: Your financial problems are none of my concern.


Short-sighted troll is...short-sighted. That's like saying you paid off your mortgage and BBQ'd the pink slip so the housing default doesn't affect you.

Are you really that stupid?
 
2013-02-21 09:21:59 PM

redly1: encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.

why?


Steady supply and increased demand (fueled by the government's "everybody should go to college" attitude).
 
2013-02-21 09:22:14 PM
I am really ahead of my student loans. So far they only send me statements, no payment coupons. I hold off on paying it off since they charge a premium on paying it off. What BS. I will finish paying in a couple of months, just because I want to no longer pay interest. But I don't want to pay their premium.

And it is the US Dept. of Education that holds the loans. You would think they would be happy I paid it off. No, they want interest.

/No job when I graduated in the 90's. Had to refinance.
//Never attend a state school without trying to become an 'in state' student.
///lesson learned, but too late.
 
2013-02-21 09:22:36 PM
Simple:

You construct an economic system that requires constant growth and expansion in consuming and then assemble said system so that each successive generation has less buying power, stagnant wages and ever-increasing student loan debt.

We'll recover in no time!
 
2013-02-21 09:22:43 PM

gadian: Acharne I know this is American, and I know I won't be popular for this statement but: I just finished paying off my 30K student loan. I'm debt free at 32. It feels good.

Doesn't it though?  I paid mine off a few years ago.  Then I was able to pay for land and put up a place to live.  No student loans, no mortgage.  It is a good feeling.


We won't be popular in this thread.
 
2013-02-21 09:22:44 PM
As a recent graduate in engineering with somewhat modest student loan debt, I chuckle. Oh, what's that? You have to pay for not suffering through the college experience by being sober at least half of the week?
 
2013-02-21 09:22:44 PM

redly1: encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.

why?


Because, Fark you they can! How else are you ever going to get a good job, but without a degree you will spend the rest of your life paying off, even with that good job...
 
2013-02-21 09:24:20 PM

Ted Kennedy's Brain Tumor: As a recent graduate in engineering with somewhat modest student loan debt


ME here...my total loan debt will be equal to the average starting salary for ME's.  

Hoping that means I can pay it off relatively quickly.
 
2013-02-21 09:24:25 PM

sno man: redly1: encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.

why?

Because, Fark you they can! How else are you ever going to get a good job, but without a degree you will spend the rest of your life paying off, even with that good job...


wrong thread, my puter bad, my too for not noticing...
 
2013-02-21 09:24:55 PM

gadian: There is such a thing as income-based repayments.  If heard the arguments that this is just an excuse for lazy kids to take lower paying jobs so they can pay back less.  I see the advantage of such a strategy if your loan payments at the normal rate would be particularly killing.


Is that anything like taking a minimum wage job so you can pay less in taxes?
 
2013-02-21 09:25:01 PM
It would be a good time to see the government offering incentives for Government projects after graduation.  Even more for those who work in the private sector in their chosen field for 5 years prior to government work.  Engineers: Civil engineers, architects, chemical engineers, electrical engineers, software engineers could help build all types of infrastructure as a smaller cost than a bidding contract.  Work for 5 years after graduation for 30k and live on govt barracks would save tens of billions.  Have doctors clear their student loans in 7 years, research scientists in 10 and many others after this example.    It is a government methodology, despite the manufactured hatred for government work, working for a heartless corporation can hardly be considered by reasonable people as something moral.   So make people fend for themselves while buying contracts from a potentially corrupt company or have people trade service for government clearance of student debt.
 
2013-02-21 09:26:11 PM

Supes: Nah... oddly, student loans are the one type of debt where the lender usually ends up with more money when the holder of the debt defaults. Since fines are attached to it and it can't be discharged, they just end up garnishing wages (and eventually SS checks) for the rest of a person's life.


It's hilarious, innit?
They won't get their money. ever.
 
2013-02-21 09:26:19 PM

DrPainMD: I paid off my student loan decades ago; crisis averted. Your financial problems are none of my concern.


You should be. Historically, the "haves" don't make out so in societal collapse. Sure you make be ok financially, but less and less of your peers are. Unless things improve your wealth just makes you a target.

When there are 50 muggers for every full wallet, its safer to be a mugger.
 
2013-02-21 09:26:48 PM
So, keeping in mind that I am not computer stupid and this browser has shown SVGs fine before, anyone know why this is blank for me?
 
2013-02-21 09:27:02 PM

sno man: sno man: redly1: encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.

why?

Because, Fark you they can! How else are you ever going to get a good job, but without a degree you will spend the rest of your life paying off, even with that good job...

wrong thread, my puter bad, my too for not noticing...

sno man: sno man: redly1: encyclopediaplushuman: College costs have gone up many times the rate of inflation for many, many years.

why?

Because, Fark you they can! How else are you ever going to get a good job, but without a degree you will spend the rest of your life paying off, even with that good job...

wrong thread, my puter bad, my too for not noticing...


potato.

/too many tabs
 
2013-02-21 09:27:29 PM

Jesus Farking Christ: The biggest problem will come with retirement.  As college educated people are living on the brink, never able to save for the future, for homes, and more, what happens when we have a generation of 67 year olds who can't afford to live but are unable to work?

Republicans would simply say, "fark 'em, let 'em die."  Americans, however, recognize this is a problem.


Mandatory smoking and intravenous Velveeta.
 
2013-02-21 09:28:18 PM
You should be required to present a "business plan" before you're approved for a student loan:
- what are you planning to major in?
- why did you choose that course of study?
- how viable is your career path?
- how do you intend to pay off your student loan?

If your plan isn't viable (e.g. if you're going to college to "find yourself"), no student loan for you.
 
2013-02-21 09:28:22 PM

MemeSlave: Kimothy: cretinbob: Yeah, bullshiat on that. It's worse than the mortgage problem was.

Yep. But unlike a mortgage, you can't discharge student loans through bankruptcy (except in extreme cases), so you're screwed for life if you fall behind or struggle to find a job and pay your loans.

I'm pretty sure the government is going to have to allow them in bankruptcy again, or people are in big, big trouble.

People aren't in trouble - the lenders are.   Who has more to lose, the penniless ex-student with 100K in debt, or the guy who is OWED the 100K ?


You do realize who the lenders are right? They have their loans backed by the federal government. So yeah, this is OUR problem.
 
2013-02-21 09:29:08 PM
Wow without seeing the numbers those "infographics" are based on I seriously doubt their conclusions.

Probably spinning it by only counting successful graduates and the initial principle of the loan, not any of the drop outs or the additional cost to the loan of the interest.

/banks pull the same shyt with home loans
//sure you borrow 150k but by the time 30 years rolls by  you end up paying 400k
 
Displayed 50 of 329 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report