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(Reuters)   Britain to India: You know that big-ass diamond we stole from you about 150 years ago? Yeah, you're never getting that back   (reuters.com) divider line 318
    More: Obvious, Britain, Non-combatant, Koh, Tower of London, Mahatma Gandhi, Queen Elizabeth I, British Museum, cultural institutions  
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18616 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Feb 2013 at 3:09 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-21 03:29:42 PM
theinfosphere.org

Maybe they shouldn't have traded it for their land.

They probably didn't understand the concept of ownership back then
 
2013-02-21 03:31:16 PM
Damn bunch of Indian givers.
 
2013-02-21 03:31:35 PM

Fano: germ78: Kinda off-topic in a way, but I was very disappointed by the Hope diamond. I thought it would be a fist-sized gem, but it's only as big as 3 quarters stacked on each other. farking. Lame.

You must have been thinking of the famed Baseball Diamond.


The Cullinan Diamond was fist-sized.
 
2013-02-21 03:31:48 PM
Indian givers....

/slackers...
 
2013-02-21 03:32:09 PM
*brushes out mutton-chop, grabs pen and parchment, fixes monocle*

"Dear Sirs:

I am vexed -- most considerably vexed! -- at the squawks of discontent emenating from The Raj.   It is disconcerting that the Punjabs are not appreciative of Her Majefty's efforts to rehabilitate them up from their lowly station into something more noble and useful.  If it isn't 'quit stealing our treasures', 'quit filling our bellies full of jackfruit' it is some other mewling of dissatisfaction without a whit of appreciation for what the Empire has accomplished for them.    I strongly encourage the deployment of red-coats to straighten out these ungrateful malcontents.

Sincerely,
Willam J. Starchshirt, Esq."
 
2013-02-21 03:32:34 PM
A bunch of years ago Egypt was sending a guy around to retrieve all of the items that came out of the pyramids on the grounds that since the country was now stable for the long-term the excuse for holding it safely until they got their act together wouldn't fly.

So much for that one....eh?
 
2013-02-21 03:32:41 PM

Weaver95:  form and army


Is that a dance move?
 
2013-02-21 03:32:44 PM
And THIS is why I recommend people visiting London make the British Museum a primary stop.  Forget the London Eye, London Bridge, London Tower, Big Ben etc.  Hit the British Museum and maybe the Tate Modern.

Thousands of years of shameless plundering of other's cultures makes for a pretty awesome museum!
 
2013-02-21 03:34:05 PM
i1151.photobucket.com
Her majesty is showing the number of f**ks not given - and wants curry on her chips tonight.
 
2013-02-21 03:34:30 PM
The local Rajah gave that stone to Queen Vicki of his own free will.  With the help of a couple of British armies, of course, but those silly wogs couldn't be expected to do anything for themselves, now could they?
 
2013-02-21 03:34:30 PM

GoGoGadgetLiver: And THIS is why I recommend people visiting London make the British Museum a primary stop.  Forget the London Eye, London Bridge, London Tower, Big Ben etc.  Hit the British Museum and maybe the Tate Modern.

Thousands of years of shameless plundering of other's cultures makes for a pretty awesome museum!


I have photographic evidence to prove ^^ that.  Fantastic museum.
 
2013-02-21 03:35:47 PM

r1niceboy: Britain could always say, "We accept this gem, and the curry, in payment for your country not being ruled by men in pajamas, being a literate society, a democracy, giving your educated sons and daughters a place to earn a decent living, and less of a third world shiathole than would otherwise have been the case. You're welcome!"


You do realize that India fell into shiatholism because the EIC raped it blind, right?  Bengal was a top producer of cotton goods, for example, before the EIC got ahold of it - and got turned into a complete importer of sloth by the EIC taking a flame-thrower to the local economy  One o0f the things that allowed Britain to be the premier commercial empire was because it was yanking stuff out of India for cheap and then selling the largess at top-shelf prices.  Educating the Indians wasn't something done to help the Indians, but because the British needed more clerks than they could reasonably expect to ship over from Dorset.  and the idea was educate the Indians to show them that they were inferior to the British, so the Indians would serve as grateful inferiors to Britain.  It would be like saying Afro-Americans should be glad the Southern gentry taught them Western agricultural practices.  As far as democracy, the British fought tooth and nail to deny India any sort of democratic process.  When Canada was getting Dominion status (and the Americans had had local assemblies while colonies), Britain was actively tightening restrictions in India. At best, it was "you can be selected for a minority of seats in this completely toothless assembly that the Viceroy won't even pretend to listen to".  Number of Indian seats in Parliament?  Zero.  Number of local, democratic assemblies in India with deomcratically elected officials?  Zero. Anything India got from Britain was in spite of, not because of the British.
 
2013-02-21 03:35:55 PM

The 4chan Psychiatrist: And I'd give the edge to the Sikh warriors of India vs. the modern Brits, SAS excluded, ofc.



images3.wikia.nocookie.net

"For short range weapons:
Edge: Sikh Warriors with their curved blades and beards

For special weapons:
Edge: Sikh Warriors for their Turbans of Doom.

For long range weapons:
Edge: British Military with aircraft carriers, Apaches, and cluster bombs"
 
2013-02-21 03:36:39 PM
You can grow diamonds pretty cheap in a lab. They are actually quite worthless. The only way to tell which ones were dug out of the ground by some dying African slave worker is by looking for the imperfections that are hard to fake. The more perfect the diamond, the less value it has.

/people be chumps.
 
2013-02-21 03:38:58 PM

12349876: Somacandra: Weaver95: form and army and invade.

Why not point a nuke at the UK and say "hand it over motherfarker?" India is a nuclear power after all.

According to Wikipedia, the UK has about twice as many nukes to point back.


Plus there is that whole NATO thing India would have to worry about.


Although if the UK did give it back I am sure that India would be polite about it. They would probably say "Thank you, come again!".
 
2013-02-21 03:39:38 PM

MythDragon: Edge: British Military with aircraft carriers, Apaches, and cluster bombs"


ha.  when that show was popping, there was an episode where they gave Apache Warrior the edge over Roman Gladiator (mainly because as I recall, the bow and arrow was superior and more lethal than the gladiator's close-in weapons, but who cares.)

anywyas, there was a thread here and some dude was mega butthurt about that.  he was like, "that show is BULLshiat!  there is NO WAY a roman gladiator would lose to a stone age technology!  no freaking way, period.  I call bullshiat!  Didn't they see Russell Crowe in "Gladiator"?  this is bullshiat!  No freaking way Russell Crowe loses to Tonto.  Go watch "Gladiator", you assholes.  Seriously.  this is bullshiat and I'm boycotting the show FOREVER!"

it was like, 'gay for russell crowe much, Gladiatormitter?"
 
2013-02-21 03:40:05 PM

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: 1.  Sell item to foreigners
2.  Wait 100+ years, then claim it was 'stolen'.
3.  (Attempt to) Profit.


Exactly what I was thinking. Next regime change in Botswana, DR Congo etc, they should claim diamond companies were illegal and claim back millions of engagement rings.
 
2013-02-21 03:40:19 PM

hitlersbrain: You can grow diamonds pretty cheap in a lab. They are actually quite worthless. The only way to tell which ones were dug out of the ground by some dying African slave worker is by looking for the imperfections that are hard to fake. The more perfect the diamond, the less value it has.

/people be chumps.


Diamonds weren't even fashionable until the 1800's.  Given enough synthetic production, they'll become just as worthless once again, eventually.
 
2013-02-21 03:40:34 PM

MythDragon: The 4chan Psychiatrist: And I'd give the edge to the Sikh warriors of India vs. the modern Brits, SAS excluded, ofc.


[images3.wikia.nocookie.net image 680x541]

"For short range weapons:
Edge: Sikh Warriors with their curved blades and beards

For special weapons:
Edge: Sikh Warriors for their Turbans of Doom.

For long range weapons:
Edge: British Military with aircraft carriers, Apaches, and cluster bombs"


And now, a simulation where the British Military engages the Sikh Warriors in a hand to hand melee bear off.

Winner: Sikh Warriors
 
2013-02-21 03:40:34 PM

hitlersbrain: You can grow diamonds pretty cheap in a lab. They are actually quite worthless. The only way to tell which ones were dug out of the ground by some dying African slave worker is by looking for the imperfections that are hard to fake. The more perfect the diamond, the less value it has.

/people be chumps.


True enough. If the DeBeers cartel didn't have its boot on the throat of the diamond supply, that rock would be worth less than what Drew gave the copyright trolls in that lawsuit.
 
2013-02-21 03:40:45 PM
mayIFark: /Is that where the missionary position came from?

Yes
 
2013-02-21 03:41:02 PM

Spiralmonkey: phalamir: Ehh, what India needs to do is threaten to have the Anglo-Indian shut down all the curry shops in London.  The Koh-i-Noor will be back in India inside of a week

Nobody would notice, what with the Pakistani and Bangladeshi curry houses everywhere.


Tell the Pakistanis they can have Kashmir, and the Bangladeshis they can have Assam.  Get KiN back, tell them both to suck it long and hard.

Alternately, just contract with Nepal to borrow the Gurkhas for a few weeks (and since the brits have been laying off the little farkers for awhile now, you might even be able to wrangle the ones serving Her Majesty for a better retirement plan).  Throw in the Skihs, and ship them all off to land in Dover.  Battle of Hastings 2: Delhi Boogaloo?
 
2013-02-21 03:42:01 PM

give me doughnuts: How are they going to get to England? The Indian Navy? How much air-lift capacity does the Indian Air Force have?


I don't know about their air force, but they have been launching their own satellites since 1980.
 
2013-02-21 03:42:19 PM
Besides, if the British never took it in the first place, then the Doctor and Rose couldn't have used it to lazor-beam-pew-pew-pew a space werewolf to death.

So that's all right then.

/the manor lord's wife in that episode was freaking hot, too
 
2013-02-21 03:42:57 PM
I've never been to London... is there an entrance fee to go into the museum? Maybe people who had their crap stolen from them should have it waive by showing their passports. Because it's a dick move to steal someone's stuff but its an even more dickish move to charge them money to look at it.
 
2013-02-21 03:42:58 PM

MythDragon: The 4chan Psychiatrist: And I'd give the edge to the Sikh warriors of India vs. the modern Brits, SAS excluded, ofc.


[images3.wikia.nocookie.net image 680x541]

"For short range weapons:
Edge: Sikh Warriors with their curved blades and beards

For special weapons:
Edge: Sikh Warriors for their Turbans of Doom.

For long range weapons:
Edge: British Military with aircraft carriers, Apaches, and cluster bombs"


The Brits could just hire the Gurkhas to do their dirty work again.
 
2013-02-21 03:43:48 PM
Britain to Greece:
www.culturewars.org.uk France to Egypt:
www.crystalinks.com
/history is plunder
 
2013-02-21 03:46:24 PM
I hope no Americans comment on this on behalf of India - unless of course you are down with giving the native americans back everything that was taken from them
 
2013-02-21 03:47:45 PM

Fano: ITGreen: "One of the world's largest diamonds, some Indians - including independence leader Mahatma Gandhi's grandson - have demanded its return to atone for Britain's colonial past. "

So one diamond will atone for Britain's colonial wrongdoings?  No?  Then giving it back is only the first in a line of  "atonement" gestures to be demanded later by India.

I actually agree with the British on this one; nip this stunt of theirs in the bud.

Is Koh-i-noor the Arkenstone?


Thorin oakenshield? Is that you?

There's only the slight matter of the dragon.

/ perhaps, you should hire a burglar
 
2013-02-21 03:48:10 PM
Britain might have India's diamond, but Indians and other foreigners are taking over London and soon the rest of England.
 
2013-02-21 03:48:51 PM
Stuff taken before the Indians had a flag don't count.
 
2013-02-21 03:50:24 PM
People have been taking other people's shiat for a LONG time now.  If this was a Toyota Corolla you might get it back.  This is a gem that was presented to the queen of England (who was the state leader of your country at the time, whether you like that or not) and set in a crown.  It is now one of the symbols of state of a nation that ruled the whole of India for more than 100 years.

You can pretend that it rightfully belongs to you now if you really MUST, but you don't have any more claim to it than anyone else India.  Some serf dug the thing out of the farking ground 600 years ago and promptly got bludgeoned to shiat by his lord or mine owner or whatever, and the thing changed hands by invasion and war for a few hundred years till the brits took it and put it in a hat because it was really big.  It hasn't been in your country in almost 200 years, and for 400 before that its ownership was murky due to all the people getting murdered to seize it on a regular basis.

Nobody has clean hands in this, and the best you can do is say, "Well it was from OUR ground 600 years back," which nobody farking cares about except for you because you have a vested interest in people thinking it should be yours.
 
2013-02-21 03:50:26 PM
Yet anything valuable a private citizen happens to have will get taken from them and even charges filed in the name of cultural history.

Give it back, Britain, or let anyone who has culturally significant artifacts keep them free and clear.
 
2013-02-21 03:50:31 PM

hitlersbrain: You can grow diamonds pretty cheap in a lab. They are actually quite worthless. The only way to tell which ones were dug out of the ground by some dying African slave worker is by looking for the imperfections that are hard to fake. The more perfect the diamond, the less value it has.



Joe Rogan mentioned that recently on his podcast.  he was taken to some top secret facility in I think Russia, (he had to leave his iPod / smartphone so it couldn't make a GPS track of where he went) and engineers had perfected the synthetic diamond.  as you said, the synthetics was technically more "pure" (and thus, you'd think 'perfect') than "organic" diamonds, but were bizarrely nowhere near as valuable.  people would rather have the real thing, even with microscopic imperfections, than an artifical object that was technically a "better" product.
 
2013-02-21 03:52:21 PM

germ78: Kinda off-topic in a way, but I was very disappointed by the Hope diamond. I thought it would be a fist-sized gem, but it's only as big as 3 quarters stacked on each other. farking. Lame.


The folks who stole it at one point cut the f*ck out of it.

And the the people who sold this diamond to the brits for an insignificant sum do to unequal bargaining power are very dead.
 
2013-02-21 03:53:19 PM
Rule Britannia!

Anywho, I love what they did to our soap opera format.

I so adore Downton Abbey!
 
2013-02-21 03:53:30 PM
www.chiefhomeofficer.com
 
2013-02-21 03:55:00 PM

kbronsito: I've never been to London... is there an entrance fee to go into the museum? Maybe people who had their crap stolen from them should have it waive by showing their passports. Because it's a dick move to steal someone's stuff but its an even more dickish move to charge them money to look at it.


There is no entrance fee, but there is a large urn just inside the entrance for those who choose to give a recommended donation. It's quite interesting to see as it has money from all around the world inside. I doubt that it is emptied often.

As for returning their treasures, India is free to wait along with Greece and Egypt. The advantage of having built history's greatest empire is the legacy of stolen treasures from all over the planet and building the British Museum which is surely the world's greatest monument to theft on a grand scale. It may not be right, but at least it's all on display inside a genuinely stunning building for the world to see.

Besides, I can't imagine any sort of genuine global attempt to return property and land taken in the past through force and treachery without the lot of us returning to the Old Stone Age. There comes a point in which you really must stop fighting battles in retaliation of injustices committed against your long-dead ancestors against the other side's descendants born years or even centuries after the fact.
 
2013-02-21 03:55:07 PM
To the victors the spoils. If they have to return the diamond, we have to return our country to the brits... then they return it to the natives.

Easier to proceed as we are and learn to lock your shiat up better.


/Vishnu please...
 
2013-02-21 03:56:33 PM
Considering India itself was the crown jewel of the British Empire, I think they've lost enough. The Brits can't be giving all the good trophies back, otherwise the only things in their museums would be dug-up Anglo-Saxon burial boats.

We'd still probably be trying to unlock ancient Egyptian hieroglyphics if they hadn't swiped the Rosetta Stone, for example. These artifacts are better off in a place that hasn't been invaded in 1000 years.
 
2013-02-21 03:56:35 PM
The British Museum is pretty much a gallery of grand theft, but with the state of most of the countries since the end of Colonialism I doubt even 10% of that stuff would have survived today.  Britain should just tell India, we're still holding onto it for you until you grow up and act responsibly enough that we can give it to you.
 
2013-02-21 03:56:50 PM

phalamir: r1niceboy: Britain could always say, "We accept this gem, and the curry, in payment for your country not being ruled by men in pajamas, being a literate society, a democracy, giving your educated sons and daughters a place to earn a decent living, and less of a third world shiathole than would otherwise have been the case. You're welcome!"

You do realize that India fell into shiatholism because the EIC raped it blind, right?  Bengal was a top producer of cotton goods, for example, before the EIC got ahold of it - and got turned into a complete importer of sloth by the EIC taking a flame-thrower to the local economy  One o0f the things that allowed Britain to be the premier commercial empire was because it was yanking stuff out of India for cheap and then selling the largess at top-shelf prices.  Educating the Indians wasn't something done to help the Indians, but because the British needed more clerks than they could reasonably expect to ship over from Dorset.  and the idea was educate the Indians to show them that they were inferior to the British, so the Indians would serve as grateful inferiors to Britain.  It would be like saying Afro-Americans should be glad the Southern gentry taught them Western agricultural practices.  As far as democracy, the British fought tooth and nail to deny India any sort of democratic process.  When Canada was getting Dominion status (and the Americans had had local assemblies while colonies), Britain was actively tightening restrictions in India. At best, it was "you can be selected for a minority of seats in this completely toothless assembly that the Viceroy won't even pretend to listen to".  Number of Indian seats in Parliament?  Zero.  Number of local, democratic assemblies in India with deomcratically elected officials?  Zero. Anything India got from Britain was in spite of, not because of the British.


More than that, Bengal was one of the richest regions on earth before the brits got their mits on it. Now bengladesh could be a synonym for famine and dispare.
 
2013-02-21 03:57:20 PM

p the boiler: I hope no Americans comment on this on behalf of India - unless of course you are down with giving the native americans back everything that was taken from them


Funny, I was just thinking that the Indians have as much chance of getting that diamond as the Mohawks and Carnasee have of getting Manhattan.
 
2013-02-21 03:58:52 PM

It starts with one diamond.


thompsonblogs.org
 
2013-02-21 03:59:15 PM

PsiChick: Walker: "I certainly don't believe in 'returnism', as it were. I don't think that's sensible."

So you don't believe in "returnism" but you believe in stealing. Cool ethics bro!

THIS. Even if you're not giving it back, at least try and pretend you understand you stole it. FFS. I can understand why you wouldn't want to return it, politics is a dirty game, but you farked up, admit it and move on.


Funny thing, HE didn't steal it.  He wasn't even farking alive when it happened.  So no, he really doesn't need to understand that.

This is exactly like the blacks demanding reparations for slavery, in the United States.  fark you.  You weren't a slave, so unless you are going to do forced labor for the next few years, you aren't getting any reparations.  Wellfare I guess isn't a reparation.
 
2013-02-21 03:59:40 PM
I'm all for acknowledging our forebears mistakes and making up where we can, but Sir Harry Paget Flashman, VC, KCB, KCIE, didn't go through all that trouble during the First Sikh War smuggling the Koh-i-Noor out just to have it handed right back.
 
2013-02-21 03:59:41 PM

rickythepenguin: hitlersbrain: You can grow diamonds pretty cheap in a lab. They are actually quite worthless. The only way to tell which ones were dug out of the ground by some dying African slave worker is by looking for the imperfections that are hard to fake. The more perfect the diamond, the less value it has.


Joe Rogan mentioned that recently on his podcast.  he was taken to some top secret facility in I think Russia, (he had to leave his iPod / smartphone so it couldn't make a GPS track of where he went) and engineers had perfected the synthetic diamond.  as you said, the synthetics was technically more "pure" (and thus, you'd think 'perfect') than "organic" diamonds, but were bizarrely nowhere near as valuable.  people would rather have the real thing, even with microscopic imperfections, than an artifical object that was technically a "better" product.


They're not even really a big secret anymore. You can go to a website right now and for less than $500 get a rock so big and bright your girlfriend's panties will break the sound barrier hitting the ground.
 
2013-02-21 04:02:37 PM

Gordon Bennett: As for returning their treasures, India is free to wait along with Greece and Egypt.


Given the state of Greece and Egypt at this point, it may be for the best if Britain keeps them.

You can have them back when you prove to us that you're not going to destroy them in a riot or civil war.
 
2013-02-21 04:04:34 PM

Treygreen13: rickythepenguin: hitlersbrain: You can grow diamonds pretty cheap in a lab. They are actually quite worthless. The only way to tell which ones were dug out of the ground by some dying African slave worker is by looking for the imperfections that are hard to fake. The more perfect the diamond, the less value it has.


Joe Rogan mentioned that recently on his podcast.  he was taken to some top secret facility in I think Russia, (he had to leave his iPod / smartphone so it couldn't make a GPS track of where he went) and engineers had perfected the synthetic diamond.  as you said, the synthetics was technically more "pure" (and thus, you'd think 'perfect') than "organic" diamonds, but were bizarrely nowhere near as valuable.  people would rather have the real thing, even with microscopic imperfections, than an artifical object that was technically a "better" product.

They're not even really a big secret anymore. You can go to a website right now and for less than $500 get a rock so big and bright your girlfriend's panties will break the sound barrier hitting the ground.


That last sentence got a good laugh out of me.
 
2013-02-21 04:06:04 PM

germ78: Kinda off-topic in a way, but I was very disappointed by the Hope diamond. I thought it would be a fist-sized gem, but it's only as big as 3 quarters stacked on each other. farking. Lame.


Originally it was almost fist sized, but each person that owned it had it cut down, till it's at it's current size.
 
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