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(WBTV 3 Charlotte)   Women are being faced with the dilemma of violating federal law if they choose to defend themselves against rape   (wbtv.com) divider line 69
    More: Strange, federal law, locusts, pepper sprays  
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18143 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Feb 2013 at 6:00 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-02-21 07:56:46 AM
3 votes:

lewismarktwo: Most rapes are women who forgot to say no.


*cough*
Any non-consensual sex can be classified as rape. And yes, that includes them being too intoxicated to say no.

/Studied criminal psych
//Psychopathology of sex offenders makes you hate the world with a passion
2013-02-20 11:44:54 PM
3 votes:

doglover: Rape victims are only doubted because of people who make dubious rape claims. Like that Duke scandal. of a culture based on "Christian values" that assumes any women wearing a miniskirt and heels is asking for it and showing any skin beyond their ankle is asking for it since men cannot control themselves and are nothing more then savage animals holding it in


FTFY
2013-02-20 10:20:40 PM
3 votes:

BronyMedic: TheOmni: Already subtly trying to bring up the concept of false rape accusations. Rape victims are frequently not believed, accused of making it up, or otherwise blamed. This will not change that fact.

[24.media.tumblr.com image 400x400]

If I had wanted to go into a discussion about false rape accusations, I would have done so. Instead, you decided to run with something blatantly offensive and never said at all because you were shown to be wrong about your statement. A statement that has just as much propaganda as the previous one you decried.

The Point: Person A shoots an attacker who is attempting to rape her. Person B shoots someone she invited into her home, with no signs of defensive wounds, a struggle, or any violence to her person. Person A has a clear case for the use of stand your ground/self-defense. Person B has a lot HARDER case than Person A.

This does not take a genius to figure out.


You're still doing it. Using the fact that she invited the person into her home or didn't struggle hard enough to leave marks as evidence that it wasn't a rape. Most rapes aren't stranger leaping from bushes. They are dates and people the victim knows. Afterwards the rapist declares it was consensual, people don't believe her because it was someone she knew, invited up for coffee, didn't struggle enough to be believed. If the would be rapist ends up shot that will not help her be believed.

The idea that guns are any sort of a solution or help to the issue of rape depends on a complete and deliberate misunderstanding of actual rape and rape culture.
2013-02-20 10:15:49 PM
3 votes:

TheOmni: Already subtly trying to bring up the concept of false rape accusations. Rape victims are frequently not believed, accused of making it up, or otherwise blamed. This will not change that fact.


24.media.tumblr.com

If I had wanted to go into a discussion about false rape accusations, I would have done so. Instead, you decided to run with something blatantly offensive and never said at all because you were shown to be wrong about your statement. A statement that has just as much propaganda as the previous one you decried.

The Point: Person A shoots an attacker who is attempting to rape her. Person B shoots someone she invited into her home, with no signs of defensive wounds, a struggle, or any violence to her person. Person A has a clear case for the use of stand your ground/self-defense. Person B has a lot HARDER case than Person A.

This does not take a genius to figure out.
2013-02-20 10:00:36 PM
3 votes:

TheOmni: This headline is a bit misleading. The idea that women are being faced with this dilemma is a manufactured idea by gun lobbyists.


Well, true.

TheOmni: And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.


Well, false. In every state that has laws allowing the use of concealed firearms in self defense, the fear of impending rape during a physical attack is justification to use lethal force by a CCW holder.

Of course, you better hope that the forensics hold up on that. They CAN tell when you've been faking things.

Amos Quito: I'm one of the funniest guys on Fark.

Ask anyone.


You're funny in the same venue as Multi-Drug Resistant Gonorrhea in a 9 year old is.
2013-02-20 09:24:48 PM
3 votes:
Democrats: the real war on women.
2013-02-20 08:55:31 PM
3 votes:
Oh, pyrethrums? How creative! Home bug spray has just the perfect concentration to send your attacker into homicidal rage towards your face, while doing nothing to stop legitimate rape.

Leave the roach spray, and bring the radroach spray. 9mm or above.
2013-02-21 01:37:47 PM
2 votes:

PsiChick: Seriously, I'm stunned you think women benefit at all from misogyny. What, the man paying for a date somehow makes up for a lifetime of low wages, being seen as representative of your gender no matter what you do, being expected to 'civilize' a man, being called a frigid biatch for not dating stalkers, and all the other shiat that comes with it?


So you're replacing sexism with misogyny hoping nobody will notice now.  I can see the level of intellectual dishonesty I'm dealing with here.

If you don't think the legal system, and family court specifically discriminates against men, and favors women (especially white women), you've been living under a rock, or you're completely deluded.

Also ... the fact that women statistically make less than men isn't necessarily because they're being discriminated against.  There are a lot of other factors you're choosing to ignore, so that you can blame discrimination for women's problems.
2013-02-21 11:03:02 AM
2 votes:

doglover: Rape victims are only doubted because of people who make dubious rape claims. Like that Duke scandal.

Killing your attacker, or at least attempting to do so earnestly, adds a hundredweight of credibility to any claims you may have. It might even save your life.


...You're an idiot.

Rape victims are typically doubted because they're in a misogynist culture. In America, doubting rape victims has been brought to the spotlight because the GOP, wanting to deny women abortions, started attacking pregnant rape victims. That is not actually because of false rape claims. That's because of assholes.

Killing\attacking an attacker does  not add credibility if the lawyers are clever, because again, rape victims are typically doubted because of misogyny. Yes, even male rape victims--after all, how can a big strong man get raped, everyone knows that only happens to those weak women.

Seriously, what must it be like to go through life with no idea that sexism exists, much less that it could be you if you get unlucky? God, I would love to be male some days.

/...Well, not really, I like being a girl.
//But so little sexism I can claim some idiocy like that? Yes please.
2013-02-21 09:36:36 AM
2 votes:
It's barely seven bucks, but it makes Ms. X feel a whole lot safer.

That right there is the whole reason the myth of rape culture exists. Who needs facts, experiences, or research when you've got feelings. Clearly anyone who dashes your feelings by saying something like "For ten bucks more you can get the same size can of real pepper spray which totally legal and sprays better." is only trying to rape you.

Ugh, I'm going to be.
2013-02-21 08:35:09 AM
2 votes:
doglover:Fast Moon: How many documented instances are there of a gun carried outside the home preventing a rape?

Why do prevented rapes have to be documented?

Reported rapes are just the tip of the iceberg. Don't you know that for every rape survivor who bravely re-victimized herself by reporting her assault to the police, ten million go unreported? With 80,000 forcible rapes reported in 2009, that's almost 800,000,000,000 rapes a year the rape culture generates.


I realize this. However, if a shooting is involved, that tends to be much more well-documented, with "I was preventing him from raping me" as the defense. I took the advice from above and Googled "woman shoots rapist". It returns about 2.2 million results, however from browsing the first 10 pages, they're mostly repeats of the same 4-5 incidents, with about 75% of them referring to a single incident in Turkey, and almost all of the American ones dealing with a man breaking into the woman's home.

Whenever the word "rape" comes up, it seems like people immediately envision a woman walking alone in a remote area and being attacked by a man hiding in the dark who was turned on by her skimpy attire, when this type of incident is by far a statistical anomaly. But the majority of our "rape-prevention" suggestions deal primarily with that scenario. I'm all for women defending themselves, but it seems that defense preparation should be more focused on a more common scenario than a dramatic statistical outlier.
2013-02-21 08:13:43 AM
2 votes:
Officials at the St. Louis County Police Department responded to the story saying it's better to use items for their intended purpose and added it's against federal law to use wasp spray for purposes other than what's listed on the can.

"Repels pests"
2013-02-21 07:31:07 AM
2 votes:

doglover: Or, y'know, use a real weapon, which would be legal and more effective.


No the whole point of the story is women are afraid of defending themselves with a gun and going to jail for it, so they're using bug spray but then a law enforcement official says they'll still go to jail for using that.
2013-02-21 06:53:14 AM
2 votes:

Serious question:  How many documented instances are there of a gun carried outside the home preventing a rape?


I mean, they've already told us that wearing frumpy clothing is a valid form of defense, when the actual data proves otherwise, so I'm wondering what the actual data says about carrying a gun.

2013-02-21 06:38:53 AM
2 votes:
Well, flame me if you wish, but I completely disagree with

Frank N Stein: Because an event that last only 30 seconds is not just cause for murder


It's not murder in my eyes. In nature when a predator attacks prey and the prey turns on it and fatally wounds the predator, it's just the way that goes sometimes.
When that rapist attacked he had no care for the the target, and thus deserves no care in return.
And please don't drop to human live is precious. From what I have encountered from traveling to a handful of (I hate the term) third-world countries, a human live isn't worth a dime. There are far to many on the planet who would sell their mothers for a beer.

To quote Texas "Some people just need killin' "
2013-02-20 11:01:59 PM
2 votes:

Frank N Stein: jaylectricity: Why couldn't she have strangled him in his post-coitus nap?

Because an event that last only 30 seconds is not just cause for murder.

[oi45.tinypic.com image 640x360]


You also won't know if the guy trying to rape you is just after some sex or BTK until after you're tied up with the curtain strings and being vivisected. Best not to take chances.
2013-02-20 10:52:06 PM
2 votes:

jaylectricity: One Bad Apple: This won't even go green until tomorrow morning and it's already been derailed from a gun thread to rape culture thread.

It was never a gun thread.


Who says it can't be both?

oi50.tinypic.com
2013-02-20 09:38:40 PM
2 votes:
This headline is a bit misleading. The idea that women are being faced with this dilemma is a manufactured idea by gun lobbyists. And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.
2013-02-20 09:12:41 PM
2 votes:
How long before Law & Order: SVU arrest a rape victim for wasp spray?  Next season opener maybe.
2013-02-22 03:30:22 PM
1 votes:

HoratioGates: heili skrimsli: Those 'statistics' you refer to are the dishonest results of a poorly done study that not even its author stands behind today. Arthur Kellermann is the Andrew Wakefield of the gun control lobby.

Citation please?


Arthur Kellermann's assertion that someone is 43 times more likely to be killed with a firearm if they have one in their home is one he no longer supports. After two more studies, he now claims it's 2.7 times more likely, not 43 times.

But the original number is still very often cited by anti-gun lobbyists.
2013-02-22 07:26:19 AM
1 votes:

HoratioGates: At home, statistics say you are way more likely to accidentally (or 'accidentally') shoot a family member sneaking in late. It's usually better to lock yourself in another room and call 911.


I'm glad I don't get my self defense advice from someone whose advice is 'Just don't.'

Those 'statistics' you refer to are the dishonest results of a poorly done study that not even its author stands behind today. Arthur Kellermann is the Andrew Wakefield of the gun control lobby.
2013-02-21 03:39:18 PM
1 votes:

Graffito: umad: Graffito: The fact that men fair worse in some family court situations is not necessarily because they're being discriminated against. There are a lot of other factors you're choosing to ignore so that you can blame discrimination for men's problems.

So you mean it is exactly like the "pay gap"? That never stopped anyone from claiming discrimination before.

No.  I'm saying that the men's rights whingers are not looking at the big picture.  They are certain that discrimination against them is real whilst discrimination against women is not.


So exactly like "women's rights whingers" then.
2013-02-21 03:26:22 PM
1 votes:

umad: Graffito: The fact that men fair worse in some family court situations is not necessarily because they're being discriminated against. There are a lot of other factors you're choosing to ignore so that you can blame discrimination for men's problems.

So you mean it is exactly like the "pay gap"? That never stopped anyone from claiming discrimination before.


No.  I'm saying that the men's rights whingers are not looking at the big picture.  They are certain that discrimination against them is real whilst discrimination against women is not.
2013-02-21 03:17:38 PM
1 votes:

Graffito: The fact that men fair worse in some family court situations is not necessarily because they're being discriminated against. There are a lot of other factors you're choosing to ignore so that you can blame discrimination for men's problems.


So you mean it is exactly like the "pay gap"? That never stopped anyone from claiming discrimination before.
2013-02-21 03:03:32 PM
1 votes:
I want to be clear about this.  I have never attacked anyone.  Much less a woman.  I have never raped anyone.  I have never punched a woman, or a man that didn't swing first.

I will beat the ever loving shiat out of anyone that so much as points a can of raid at me.
2013-02-21 02:31:04 PM
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: PsiChick: No, I implied that men are usually discriminated against in what we consider positive ways--higher wages, less expectations, etc.--and that therefore, if you tend not to be hugely empathetic, which some people aren't, it's very easy to forget that misogyny exists and has serious consequences for  both genders.

How exactly do you "know" how easy it is to be a man?


It is pretty obvious that she is right. If men had it so rough then the government programs for combatting problems like domestic violence and homelessness would apply to them as well instead of being for women and children. The family courts would stop screwing them over too. Real men are self-sufficient and don't deserve any help even if they say that they need it.
2013-02-21 01:29:54 PM
1 votes:

PsiChick: No, I implied that men are usually discriminated against in what we consider positive ways--higher wages, less expectations, etc.--and that therefore, if you tend not to be hugely empathetic, which some people aren't, it's very easy to forget that misogyny exists and has serious consequences for  both genders.


How exactly do you "know" how easy it is to be a man?
2013-02-21 01:15:17 PM
1 votes:

spiderpaz: PsiChick: spiderpaz: PsiChick: Seriously, what must it be like to go through life with no idea that sexism exists, much less that it could be you if you get unlucky? God, I would love to be male some days.

/...Well, not really, I like being a girl.
//But so little sexism I can claim some idiocy like that? Yes please.

It must be nice to be a little biatch that blames everything on the opposite sex without recognizing all the other ways I benefit from sexism that I choose to ignore.

So how does sexism work out for, say, male rape victims? Bet they're just choosing to ignore all the benefits.

What?  I was just responding to your implication that being a man is so easy because they never get discriminated against.  I know we're in a rape thread here, but that's not what I was talking about.  Clearly the balance is heavily tilted against women on the subject of rape -> Statistically women get raped, and men do the raping, and in the vast majority of cases, they get away with it, and that sucks.

But that doesn't mean all us men who DON'T rape anyone (and actually have a conscience about how we use our penises and deal with the aftermath) have some kind of cushy life where everything is systematically working in our favor.


No, I implied that men are usually discriminated against in what we consider positive ways--higher wages, less expectations, etc.--and that therefore, if you tend not to be hugely empathetic, which some people aren't, it's very easy to forget that misogyny exists and has serious consequences for  both genders.

As far as rape goes, part of the reason for those statistics is that until I think about five years ago, female-on-male or male-on-male rape was not legally considered rape. That, again, traces back to misogyny. What you're complaining about, that men are considered predators? That originated in misogyny--a woman's job is to 'tame' a man, it goes as far back as  Gilgamesh--but it's also used today as a way for Muslim and Christian fundies (and probably other religions) to explain why women have to dress modestly, stay in the kitchen, and generally be someone's b*tch.

It's very easy to forget that misogyny is a problem if you're a man, because there are mild amounts of misandry aimed at you and a lot of  positive (or what we pretend is positive, I don't see how being expected to want to lay around playing COD instead of being expected to have goals and a career is positive myself, but whatever) effects from misogyny. That causes serious problems in almost every arena of life. Pretending that it doesn't--or that women somehow  benefit from it--is farking insane.

/Seriously, I'm stunned you think women benefit at all from misogyny. What, the man paying for a date somehow makes up for a lifetime of low wages, being seen as representative of your gender no matter what you do, being expected to 'civilize' a man, being called a frigid biatch for not dating stalkers, and all the other shiat that comes with it?
2013-02-21 11:53:41 AM
1 votes:

PsiChick: spiderpaz: PsiChick: Seriously, what must it be like to go through life with no idea that sexism exists, much less that it could be you if you get unlucky? God, I would love to be male some days.

/...Well, not really, I like being a girl.
//But so little sexism I can claim some idiocy like that? Yes please.

It must be nice to be a little biatch that blames everything on the opposite sex without recognizing all the other ways I benefit from sexism that I choose to ignore.

So how does sexism work out for, say, male rape victims? Bet they're just choosing to ignore all the benefits.


What?  I was just responding to your implication that being a man is so easy because they never get discriminated against.  I know we're in a rape thread here, but that's not what I was talking about.  Clearly the balance is heavily tilted against women on the subject of rape -> Statistically women get raped, and men do the raping, and in the vast majority of cases, they get away with it, and that sucks.

But that doesn't mean all us men who DON'T rape anyone (and actually have a conscience about how we use our penises and deal with the aftermath) have some kind of cushy life where everything is systematically working in our favor.
2013-02-21 11:31:18 AM
1 votes:

PsiChick: Seriously, what must it be like to go through life with no idea that sexism exists, much less that it could be you if you get unlucky? God, I would love to be male some days.

/...Well, not really, I like being a girl.
//But so little sexism I can claim some idiocy like that? Yes please.


It must be nice to be a little biatch that blames everything on the opposite sex without recognizing all the other ways I benefit from sexism that I choose to ignore.
2013-02-21 11:10:12 AM
1 votes:

Frank N Stein: jaylectricity: Why couldn't she have strangled him in his post-coitus nap?

Because an event that last only 30 seconds is not just cause for murder.

[oi45.tinypic.com image 640x360]


We could try an actual experiment to test that statement. Let's find someone to violently rape you for 30 seconds, then you can tell us how you feel about it.

Oh, BTW, 30 seconds is an extreme low time. Try 10 or 15 minutes for a more reasonable estimate. Somethings victims are tied up somewhere soundproofed and raped repeatedly for days.

Do you have a cutoff time, before which murder is not the answer, and after which it is? Just wondering. All rhetorical questions, since I doubt that you will respond to them....
2013-02-21 10:29:06 AM
1 votes:

BronyMedic: TheOmni: And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.

Well, false. In every state that has laws allowing the use of concealed firearms in self defense, the fear of impending rape during a physical attack is justification to use lethal force by a CCW holder.

Of course, you better hope that the forensics hold up on that. They CAN tell when you've been faking things.


I would think that a woman using a gun on an attacker would be in the exact same position as George Zimmerman.  You have to prove you were being attacked and that you were in danger ... which is going to be hard if the only other person there is dead.
2013-02-21 10:06:22 AM
1 votes:

the ha ha guy


Show me the innocent bystander who is going to refuse to press charges or file a civil suit against the woman who aims the can sideways in a panic and blinds someone stepping out of their car.


Show me the attacker who is going to commit a dastardly deed when there is someone getting out of a car no more than 20 feet away.
2013-02-21 09:52:58 AM
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: Aren't articles like this just political fear-mongering? You'd better carry some sort of weapon because there's a big bad man waiting to rape you around every corner. (So people focus on the question of which weapon to carry instead of focusing on whether or not they realistically need to carry one)

My naive understanding is that the majority of rapes are committed by someone that the victims knows (and trusts, to some degree), or are committed when the victim is incapacitated (too drunk to give consent, etc.). How would a weapon help in those situations?


You're right. This whole debate is manufactured by gun advocates so they can point out how superior a gun would be and how it is protected by the Constitution.
2013-02-21 09:21:12 AM
1 votes:

Jon iz teh kewl: doglover: Tat'dGreaser: doglover: Or, y'know, use a real weapon, which would be legal and more effective.

No the whole point of the story is women are afraid of defending themselves with a gun and going to jail for it, so they're using bug spray but then a law enforcement official says they'll still go to jail for using that.

Pepper spray is still legal.

so is eating a slice of cheese pizza


Ideally you could defend yourself with nothing but the calories in a slice of cheese pizza fueling your brain to make wise choices in advance that will keep you safe before you need to consider wasp spray.
2013-02-21 08:36:28 AM
1 votes:

TheOmni: This headline is a bit misleading. The idea that women are being faced with this dilemma is a manufactured idea by gun lobbyists. And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.


Actually, in many, if not most states it's quite legal to shoot and kill someone trying to rape you.
2013-02-21 08:36:09 AM
1 votes:

dittybopper: So you're looking at costs of around $600 to $800 just to carry a handgun legally and safely, vs. $20 for a can of wasp spray.

Gee, wonder why the wasp spray is more popular?


Fair enough point.
Not to mention that we're at the peak of the Barakapocalypse firearmageddon (Sorry, I just like saying that).
The country is buying up stock as if it was on war footing, so anything decent is going to be even harder to come by.
2013-02-21 08:29:08 AM
1 votes:

GAT_00: Amos Quito: I'm one of the funniest guys on Fark.

I've seen plenty of people laughing at you, so sure.


Oh the irony.
2013-02-21 08:10:14 AM
1 votes:

TheOmni: This headline is a bit misleading. The idea that women are being faced with this dilemma is a manufactured idea by gun lobbyists. And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.


Using a gun to prevent a rape will *NOT* land a woman in jail.  That is false, and in fact, I can prove it.  This is Missouri law:

Use of force in defense of persons.
563.031. 1. A person may, subject to the provisions of subsection 2 of this section, use physical force upon another person when and to the extent he or she reasonably believes such force to be necessary to defend himself or herself or a third person from what he or she reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of unlawful force by such other person, unless:

(1) The actor was the initial aggressor; except that in such case his or her use of force is nevertheless justifiable provided:

(a) He or she has withdrawn from the encounter and effectively communicated such withdrawal to such other person but the latter persists in continuing the incident by the use or threatened use of unlawful force; or

(b) He or she is a law enforcement officer and as such is an aggressor pursuant to section 563.046; or

(c) The aggressor is justified under some other provision of this chapter or other provision of law;

(2) Under the circumstances as the actor reasonably believes them to be, the person whom he or she seeks to protect would not be justified in using such protective force;

(3) The actor was attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of a forcible felony.

2. A person may not use deadly force upon another person under the circumstances specified in subsection 1 of this section unless:


(1) He or she reasonably believes that such deadly force is necessary to protect himself, or herself or her unborn child, or another against death, serious physical injury, or any forcible felony;

Last I checked, rape is a forcible felony.  You can use a gun to defend yourself against a rapist.

Also, there is an economic reason why women are facing this dilemma.

A can of Wasp spray costs under $20.

To get a concealed carry permit in Saint Louis, you need to:
1. take a training class.  The class costs $125 and it takes 8 hours.
2. Apply to the police.  The fee for that is $76.

So, just to get a permit to carry, it's going to cost you a minimum of $201.  That doesn't include the cost of the gun (likely another $200 bare minimum, and more likely double that for a decent carry gun), and of course a couple boxes of ammo, and a holster.  So you're looking at costs of around $600 to $800 just to carry a handgun legally and safely, vs. $20 for a can of wasp spray.

Gee, wonder why the wasp spray is more popular?
2013-02-21 07:52:32 AM
1 votes:
FTA: South County resident Carol Dickinson hasn't left home without it since buying a can about a month ago.

"I keep a can of wasp spray in my car in the console where the cup holder is," said Dickinson.


Hilarity to ensue in 5, 4, 3, July, August...
2013-02-21 07:50:53 AM
1 votes:

NameDot: BTW mace and pepper spray are not the same. Mace is tear gas and is harder to use.


Gas?
dl.dropbox.com

Point is that, if you're willing to cause harm, you should buy a weapon that harms by approved methods.
If you don't want to create a permanent injury, buy something that's designed with that in mind.

When you improvise you can create all kinds of unintentional issues that the law isn't written to protect you from.
We've got tested and approved technology. Use it.

ReapTheChaos: "Wasp spray goes 20 feet and you can really direct it at somebody and it really brings them down,"

If you're needing to spray it 20 feet you may be a tad paranoid. How exactly do you know who's about to rape/attack you at that distance?


Its possible.
Someone chasing a woman across a parking lot, someone forcing their way into a house, angry/crazy people can make their intentions clear from a pretty good distance.

The 20 foot thing reminds me of the Tueller drill, which proposes than an attacker can cover that distance and maul you before you can pull a gun.   It wasn't an argument against guns so much as justification for why  you might draw on threats who otherwise seem to be a safe distance away.

If the weapon only makes contact in the last five feet when someones charging at you, you're going for a roll in the dirt even if its a successful hit.

/Shootings past twenty feet are very rare.
/But there we go, gambling on statistics.
2013-02-21 07:47:09 AM
1 votes:

BronyMedic: Well, false. In every state that has laws allowing the use of concealed firearms in self defense, the fear of impending rape during a physical attack is justification to use lethal force by a CCW holder.

Of course, you better hope that the forensics hold up on that. They CAN tell when you've been faking things.



You mean like when your body doesn't shut that whole thing down because it wasn't legitimate rape?
2013-02-21 07:35:45 AM
1 votes:
This guy sprays himself in the face with wasp spray all the time. Usualy because he just stuck his bare face in a wasp nest.

cp91278.aetv.com

Feel sorry for the lady who uses pyrethrin wasp spray on an attacker. She'll get raped and smell of crysthanamums after.
2013-02-21 07:23:53 AM
1 votes:
"Wasp spray goes 20 feet and you can really direct it at somebody"

I can see that as being affective if you're running from somebody who has made their intentions clear, but to get it out and shoot someone at 20 feet you have to know by about at least 30 feet their intent.....so unless their wiener is out while running at you screaming "I'M GOING TO RAPE YOU", I don't get the point about the distance.

Then again it seems like we've evolved into a culture that once the sun starts to go down everyone thinks everyone else is going to rape or shoot someone.

/might be true in Chicago
2013-02-21 07:17:05 AM
1 votes:
"Wasp spray goes 20 feet and you can really direct it at somebody and it really brings them down,"

If you're needing to spray it 20 feet you may be a tad paranoid. How exactly do you know who's about to rape/attack you at that distance?
2013-02-21 07:08:45 AM
1 votes:

AverageAmericanGuy: C18H27NO3: I think a woman should be able to defend herself from rape by any means necessary.

Even knocking over a child so the attacker gets the kid first? You're a farking monster.


www.cleverdonkey.com
2013-02-21 07:08:37 AM
1 votes:
Women!  If there is a penis inside of you, just shoot the man attached to the penis.  If it is a legitimate rape, the weapon will fire.  Guns have a way of misfiring if the rape isn't legitimate.
2013-02-21 07:01:26 AM
1 votes:
If she was raped, why didn't she try to defend herself?

Said rape culture.
/just for those doubting its existence
2013-02-21 07:00:11 AM
1 votes:

Fast Moon: How many documented instances are there of a gun carried outside the home preventing a rape?


Why do prevented rapes have to be documented?

Reported rapes are just the tip of the iceberg. Don't you know that for every rape survivor who bravely re-victimized herself by reporting her assault to the police, ten million go unreported? With 80,000 forcible rapes reported in 2009, that's almost 800,000,000,000 rapes a year the rape culture generates.
2013-02-21 06:57:32 AM
1 votes:
2013-02-21 06:49:08 AM
1 votes:

jtown: It has nothing at all to do with guns or gun control laws. It's about the fact that it's illegal to use wasp spray in this manner.


That's mostly because no one knows what the fark will happen. We can guesstimate because the pesticides are known, but really almost all research and legislation has gone to keeping humans AWAY from these chemicals. If you're that fearful, just buy pepper spray or a gun. Not only do we know they work, but they're legal and have a better range.

Wasp spray has like 30' tops. Pepper spray isn't like the movies. It's not a mist. They have a gel version that's at a higher PSI and goes 30' or more as well as not breaking up into drops like wasp spray will.
2013-02-21 06:42:30 AM
1 votes:
I don't understand the wasp spray angle.  Why that?  I've got a can of bear spray that claims a 35' range in still air.  Seems more effective than their 20' wasp  spray and just as illegal to use to deter humans.

Because it's against federal law to use any pesticide in a manner inconsistent with its labeling.

In case y'all missed it,  that is what the headline means by "violating federal law".  It has nothing at all to do with guns or gun control laws.  It's about the fact that it's illegal to use wasp spray in this manner.
2013-02-21 06:38:42 AM
1 votes:
Most rapes are women who forgot to say no.
2013-02-21 06:26:34 AM
1 votes:
Officials at the St. Louis County Police Department responded to the story saying it's better to use items for their intended purpose and added it's against federal law to use wasp spray for purposes other than what's listed on the can.

...And here I am, agreeing with the cops.
The mornings off to a weird start.

You are always responsible for your actions, and your attacker is responsible for his.
If he forces you to fight for your life, fark him and the horse he rode in on. Show him the consequences of being a dick.

/If you've got something against guns or killing, get some mace or pony up for a taser.
/Really... bug spray?  How the hell did that get to be a plan?!
2013-02-21 06:24:54 AM
1 votes:
But it's still OK to cap a punk kid for being black and in your housing estate?

/ Skittles
2013-02-21 06:07:39 AM
1 votes:
I think a woman should be able to defend herself from rape by any means necessary.
2013-02-21 05:29:08 AM
1 votes:

Frank N Stein: jaylectricity: Why couldn't she have strangled him in his post-coitus nap?

Because an event that last only 30 seconds is not just cause for murder.

[oi45.tinypic.com image 640x360]


What the bull?!

Rape isn't about getting sex and maybe embarrassing her, it is about taking all control that person has of themselves away.  A power that ends when the attacker either stops or is stopped.  Here is a crazy thought, how often does rape end in murder and how is the woman to know that sex is all the rapist wants, because that's what rapist are good for is telling you ahead of time so you are cool with it.  Even if he isn't carrying a weapon, doesn't mean he won't kill her.
2013-02-21 01:52:33 AM
1 votes:

zedster: doglover: We have to keep rapists and pedos in their own section of jail or they get abused. Even criminals don't like 'em.

Heard of that with pedos, any source on it with rapists? I kind of doubt it based on the number of gang bangers with sexual assault convictions


Sexual assault =! rape to criminals.

Hell rape =! rape sometimes. Once the social contract breaks down rules get bent.

But seriously, while sex crimes are Bad with a capital B, most people treat them as BAD caps lock. Nobody likes a pervert. Even the twisted morality of violent thugs has lines. Rape is almost always the worst thing. That's why I don't get this "rape culture" bullshiat. If that were true, we'd see mujadeen style attacks as just ho hum and not evidence North Africa is hell.
2013-02-21 01:13:50 AM
1 votes:

jaylectricity: zedster: number of gang bangers

Wait...are we talking about murder or rape?


Rape is one of those weird status. Raping a "biatch" or a "ho" or "stuck-up member another race/sexuality" is commended. If its a nice person, a family member, then it's horrific.

Pedos are totally hated. Instant death sentence.

Rape in prison...happens all the time.
2013-02-21 01:01:20 AM
1 votes:

doglover: We have to keep rapists and pedos in their own section of jail or they get abused. Even criminals don't like 'em.


Heard of that with pedos, any source on it with rapists? I kind of doubt it based on the number of gang bangers with sexual assault convictions
2013-02-20 11:01:56 PM
1 votes:

One Bad Apple: Are those for real ?


"murder" is an illegal killing btw


No, they were made a while back to troll the brady campaign facebook page
2013-02-20 10:57:29 PM
1 votes:

jaylectricity: Why couldn't she have strangled him in his post-coitus nap?


Because an event that last only 30 seconds is not just cause for murder.

oi45.tinypic.com
2013-02-20 10:44:35 PM
1 votes:

One Bad Apple: This won't even go green until tomorrow morning and it's already been derailed from a gun thread to rape culture thread.


It was never a gun thread.
2013-02-20 10:36:45 PM
1 votes:

Tigger: TheOmni: This headline is a bit misleading. The idea that women are being faced with this dilemma is a manufactured idea by gun lobbyists. And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.

Gun lobbyists ignoring statistically valid outcomes? There's absolutely no evidence for that...


I guess both of you missed the end of the article? The federal law is using bug spray not consistent with its labeling. Nothing to do with guns. NOTHING.
2013-02-20 10:34:44 PM
1 votes:

BronyMedic: Rape is about power, control, and violence.


How do you know what motivates rapists so well?
2013-02-20 10:29:50 PM
1 votes:
0bama's war on woman continues.
2013-02-20 10:26:44 PM
1 votes:

TheOmni: You're still doing it. Using the fact that she invited the person into her home or didn't struggle hard enough to leave marks as evidence that it wasn't a rape. Most rapes aren't stranger leaping from bushes. They are dates and people the victim knows. Afterwards the rapist declares it was consensual, people don't believe her because it was someone she knew, invited up for coffee, didn't struggle enough to be believed. If the would be rapist ends up shot that will not help her be believed.


Please don't lecture me on rape culture. I've spoken enough about it, and about how rape is glorified by many posters on FARK through several threads that the fact you seem to think because I point out that "I shot him because he attacked me" is a common claim made by people in shootings means I'm some sort of Anti-feminist Mens Rights Activist is laughable.

I didn't even mention rape. I mentioned the use of a firearm. A woman who says she was being raped will ALWAYS have an uphill legal battle in the climate of the US Justice System if the forensic evidence or eyewitness statements do NOT back up her story in the use of lethal force against her attacker. That was the original point, and the point you seem to continue to miss.

At any rate, if you're going to carry a firearm, be sure you shoot to kill. Scumbags can't claim they're being framed for rape if they have a bullet in their cranium.

TheOmni: The idea that guns are any sort of a solution or help to the issue of rape depends on a complete and deliberate misunderstanding of actual rape and rape culture.


Rape is about power, control, and violence. Sexual gratification plays a small part in the pathology that predators, both men and women, exhibit when they target others. Seems to me that empowering a woman, or man, to defend themselves against their rapist would be a pretty good solution.

Especially given the fact that most people who rape are NOT on their first victim, OR going to stop with one, and removing them from the equation by lead poisoning protects more down the road.
2013-02-20 09:53:12 PM
1 votes:

TheOmni: This headline is a bit misleading. The idea that women are being faced with this dilemma is a manufactured idea by gun lobbyists. And it completely ignores the fact that using a gun to prevent rape will land her in jail.


No it won't. Not for long, anyway.
2013-02-20 09:01:27 PM
1 votes:
FTFA : "Wasp spray goes 20 feet and you can really direct it at somebody and it really brings them down," said Christensen. "Mace you have to be a little closer and someone could actually get the mace and put it on you," she said.


But not bug spray ?


lh3.ggpht.com


You gonna' get raped ...and your paralyzed body covered with hungry larvae.
 
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