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(The New York Times)   New York Times editor on Tesla report: "Yeah, my reporter was a dumbass, took poor notes, and didn't read the owners manual ... but he didn't lie about anything"   (publiceditor.blogs.nytimes.com) divider line 124
    More: Followup, educational assessment, integrity  
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8497 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Feb 2013 at 8:49 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-19 08:04:50 AM  
This story has now reached the "Ocean Cruise" saturation point, which is the point at which I want to gather up everyone involved in even the most insignificant way, load them onto a cruise ship, sail them about 2 days into Pacific, and then sink them all to the bottom.
 
2013-02-19 08:13:58 AM  
He didn't read the owner's manual? So, pretty much exactly like most actual car buyers.
 
2013-02-19 08:38:36 AM  
Once upon a time there was 'journalistic integrity'. The New York Times believed in it. Others, like The Washington Post believed in it. The end.

/well bird cages still need lining...
 
2013-02-19 08:54:34 AM  

Sybarite: He didn't read the owner's manual? So, pretty much exactly like most actual car buyers.


Quite.  Not to mention trying to follow the contradictory advice of the people from Tesla.  Mistakes on both sides, the car loses battery power in the cold, not a story.
 
2013-02-19 08:55:04 AM  
When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.

That being said, what else would you expect from the rag called The New York Times? I know it's the FarkLibtard's bible, but if this was posted in the politics tab, the FarkLibtards would be all red-assed about the Tesla company being a Bush tool of environmental destruction.
 
2013-02-19 08:57:44 AM  

Tumunga: When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.

That being said, what else would you expect from the rag called The New York Times? I know it's the FarkLibtard's bible, but if this was posted in the politics tab, the FarkLibtards would be all red-assed about the Tesla company being a Bush tool of environmental destruction.


This post is terrible, and you should be ashamed of yourself for posting it. .
 
2013-02-19 08:58:18 AM  
We wouldn't even know about Mr. Broder's "poor judgment" if Tesla didn't record the data from his test drive. The fact over a half dozen other model S drivers have done the same drive without incident makes me think the error in the NYTimes drive was behind the steering wheel not with the car.
 
2013-02-19 08:59:50 AM  

sno man: Once upon a time there was 'journalistic integrity'. The New York Times believed in it. Others, like The Washington Post believed in it. The end.

/well bird cages still need lining...


No, they didn't.  At least not in the last 100 years or so.  See:  Walter Duranty.
 
2013-02-19 09:01:38 AM  

Tumunga: When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.

That being said, what else would you expect from the rag called The New York Times? I know it's the FarkLibtard's bible, but if this was posted in the politics tab, the FarkLibtards would be all red-assed about the Tesla company being a Bush tool of environmental destruction.


That was lame. You need to change it up a bit because that bitter asshole schtick is worn out.
 
2013-02-19 09:01:45 AM  

Tumunga: FarkLibtard's


Did the whole "Fark lib" thing arise as some sort of nonsensical counter to "fark independent" (a phrase implying many of those who claimed they were 'independents' were, in fact, actually just republicans embarassed to admit they were so and/or republicans attempting to maintain a false air of impartiality)?

... Because, if it did, doesn't that, uh, mean the people using the whole "Fark independent" thing were *right*? If the counter is "Oh yeah? Well you're a FARK LIBERAL", which would imply... fake liberal, which would mean we're agreeing with you, which we're clearly not?

Or... ow. Trying to grasp the logic behind it makes my head hurt. What is it about the right-wing that makes them need to just steal ideas, phrases, and entire *websites* (CONSERVAPEDIA! TWITCHY!) from people they supposedly hate?
 
2013-02-19 09:01:46 AM  

Carth: We wouldn't even know about Mr. Broder's "poor judgment" if Tesla didn't record the data from his test drive. The fact over a half dozen other model S drivers have done the same drive without incident makes me think the error in the NYTimes drive was behind the steering wheel not with the car.


I'd be curious to have someone explain to me how much the range changed due to the cold, as it sounds like that was a factor.

Of course, what I also find funny is my dad is a classic candidate to buy a Tesla- retired engineer looking for toys- but is conservative and now is listening to the NY Times for the first time in his life and telling us all how awful Tesla is etc.  I find it funny that he'd care about the cold weather aspect here, though, because he lives in Florida.
 
2013-02-19 09:02:17 AM  
Sure the NY times wants to make it about not knowing the best way to drive the car.  But,

He did SPECIFICALLY lie about certain things.  Also, the driving around in circles would appear to have been an attempt to purposefully run it out of battery power, which would suggest that the not knowing the best way to drive it wasn't the issue.
 
2013-02-19 09:03:11 AM  

Mager: Tumunga: When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.

That being said, what else would you expect from the rag called The New York Times? I know it's the FarkLibtard's bible, but if this was posted in the politics tab, the FarkLibtards would be all red-assed about the Tesla company being a Bush tool of environmental destruction.

This post is terrible, and you should be ashamed of yourself for posting it. .


Actually, the first sentence actually makes a good point:  Tesla *SHOULD* put in enough protections so that the battery never gets drained far enough that you need to repair it instead of just recharging it.  You just have to assume that at least some percentage of your users are dumbasses.
 
2013-02-19 09:04:42 AM  

Mager: This post is terrible, and you should be ashamed of yourself for posting it. .


Yes, and we should be thankful for any reporter brave enough to tell people driving a Tesla is like driving in a bathtub.  We have union jobs to protect.

/obscure?  Search Lustron.
 
2013-02-19 09:04:55 AM  
Penny Arcade guy said it when he said it was basically as rational as an Android versus iPhone fight.
 
2013-02-19 09:05:24 AM  

Tumunga: When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.


What evidence do you have of this? They send these test models back to the factory to make sure there wasn't something wrong with them. When it runs out of juice, you just plug it in, though it might have to be towed to a charging station, as most tow trucks don't carry super chargers, that my change soon.
 
2013-02-19 09:06:10 AM  

JosephFinn: Sybarite: He didn't read the owner's manual? So, pretty much exactly like most actual car buyers.

Quite.  Not to mention trying to follow the contradictory advice of the people from Tesla.  Mistakes on both sides, the car loses battery power in the cold, not a story.


My takeaway from the whole story:

1.  The Model S is an amazing car, if you can afford it.
2.  The Model S's range is cut by around 20% in cold weather.
3.  The Supercharger network needs to be set up with a charger about every 100 miles.
 
2013-02-19 09:07:05 AM  

dittybopper: Mager: Tumunga: When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.

That being said, what else would you expect from the rag called The New York Times? I know it's the FarkLibtard's bible, but if this was posted in the politics tab, the FarkLibtards would be all red-assed about the Tesla company being a Bush tool of environmental destruction.

This post is terrible, and you should be ashamed of yourself for posting it. .

Actually, the first sentence actually makes a good point:  Tesla *SHOULD* put in enough protections so that the battery never gets drained far enough that you need to repair it instead of just recharging it.  You just have to assume that at least some percentage of your users are dumbasses.


They do.  The car will not drain that far, unless you have gone out of your way to do something incredibly stupid.  It shuts down with a small percentage left to protect the battery.
 
2013-02-19 09:09:46 AM  
This story makes me want a Tesla even moreso.
 
2013-02-19 09:13:11 AM  

Pocket Ninja: This story has now reached the "Ocean Cruise" saturation point, which is the point at which I want to gather up everyone involved in even the most insignificant way, load them onto a cruise ship, sail them about 2 days into Pacific, and then sink them all to the bottom.

set the engine on fire and put norovirus in the water.
 
2013-02-19 09:16:17 AM  

Andromeda: Carth: We wouldn't even know about Mr. Broder's "poor judgment" if Tesla didn't record the data from his test drive. The fact over a half dozen other model S drivers have done the same drive without incident makes me think the error in the NYTimes drive was behind the steering wheel not with the car.

I'd be curious to have someone explain to me how much the range changed due to the cold, as it sounds like that was a factor.

Of course, what I also find funny is my dad is a classic candidate to buy a Tesla- retired engineer looking for toys- but is conservative and now is listening to the NY Times for the first time in his life and telling us all how awful Tesla is etc.  I find it funny that he'd care about the cold weather aspect here, though, because he lives in Florida.


From what I've read you lose about 10-20% if you don't plug it in on cold nights. People in FL are weird they start complaining when it gets down to 40 degrees like the world is going to end.
 
2013-02-19 09:16:39 AM  
How much ad money does GM give the Times?
 
2013-02-19 09:22:00 AM  

dittybopper: sno man: Once upon a time there was 'journalistic integrity'. The New York Times believed in it. Others, like The Washington Post believed in it. The end.

/well bird cages still need lining...

No, they didn't.  At least not in the last 100 years or so.  See:  Walter Duranty.


At least the NYT Editors at the time had the stones to contradict him...
from your wiki:
"Duranty's reports were the source of much frustration from The Times readers in 1932, as his reports directly contradicted the paper's own editorial page."
 
2013-02-19 09:23:20 AM  
all new technologies go through growing pains.  look how far it took to get from the Model T to what we have now.  Electric cars are the future, just give them the time they need to strengthen the industry.

progress takes time and money, but we will get there
 
2013-02-19 09:31:48 AM  

BiffDangler: He did SPECIFICALLY lie about certain things. Also, the driving around in circles would appear to have been an attempt to purposefully run it out of battery power, which would suggest that the not knowing the best way to drive it wasn't the issue.


One drives in circles to find a parking spot at a busy mall.
 
2013-02-19 09:32:49 AM  

bhcompy: BiffDangler: He did SPECIFICALLY lie about certain things. Also, the driving around in circles would appear to have been an attempt to purposefully run it out of battery power, which would suggest that the not knowing the best way to drive it wasn't the issue.

One drives in circles to find a parking spot at a busy mall.


But it seems kind of silly if you have a reserved spot right in front, that is well lit, clearly marked and you've used in the past.
 
2013-02-19 09:33:35 AM  

Felgraf: Tumunga: FarkLibtard's

Did the whole "Fark lib" thing arise as some sort of nonsensical counter to "fark independent" (a phrase implying many of those who claimed they were 'independents' were, in fact, actually just republicans embarassed to admit they were so and/or republicans attempting to maintain a false air of impartiality)?

... Because, if it did, doesn't that, uh, mean the people using the whole "Fark independent" thing were *right*? If the counter is "Oh yeah? Well you're a FARK LIBERAL", which would imply... fake liberal, which would mean we're agreeing with you, which we're clearly not?

Or... ow. Trying to grasp the logic behind it makes my head hurt. What is it about the right-wing that makes them need to just steal ideas, phrases, and entire *websites* (CONSERVAPEDIA! TWITCHY!) from people they supposedly hate?


Because Conservatives (with a capital-C) are incapable of original thought.
 
2013-02-19 09:43:30 AM  

Carth: bhcompy: BiffDangler: He did SPECIFICALLY lie about certain things. Also, the driving around in circles would appear to have been an attempt to purposefully run it out of battery power, which would suggest that the not knowing the best way to drive it wasn't the issue.

One drives in circles to find a parking spot at a busy mall.

But it seems kind of silly if you have a reserved spot right in front, that is well lit, clearly marked and you've used in the past.


Yep, and when you look at the map/sat photos, he had 4 options when coming off the offramp. 1. Pull into the semi truck parking lot, 2. Pull into the McDonald's drive thru, 3. Go into the McD's parking lot (which from that side, was only about 20 stalls total, or 4. Drive straight, a hundred feet, to the well lit superchargers, right in front of the McDonald's.

Honestly, the NYT car reporter is arguing that he got lost in a tiny farking McDonald's parking Iot, after just having spun around downtown Manhattan without issue.
 
2013-02-19 09:43:32 AM  
encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com

I intend to borrow my friends Telsa S and I need to know how far past the E it will go.
 
2013-02-19 09:44:39 AM  

JosephFinn: Not to mention trying to follow the contradictory advice of the people from Tesla.


I've seen him claim he'd gotten bad advice but was there any acknowledgement from Tesla that such advice was given?
 
2013-02-19 09:47:10 AM  
Moral of the story: The habits you learned on old technology aren't a 1:1 conversion to new technology.  Do your homework and you'll be fine.
 
2013-02-19 09:55:17 AM  

Tumunga: When you build a battery powered car that turns into a door stop if you run the battery completely dead, and it has to be sent to the factory to be repaired instead of just plugged into a charger, you're doing it wrong.

That being said, what else would you expect from the rag called The New York Times? I know it's the FarkLibtard's bible, but if this was posted in the politics tab, the FarkLibtards would be all red-assed about the Tesla company being a Bush tool of environmental destruction.


He pulled the troll and run! 

www.deviantart.com
 
2013-02-19 09:56:36 AM  
There would be no need to read the manual. Just read the range gauge. If the distance to travel is more than the distance the car says it can do with some wriggle room, then charge it for longer. Not really hard to understand except for some journos who'd clearly prefer to manufacture a story if it generates some extra hits.
 
2013-02-19 10:02:24 AM  
Driving the 2014 Ford/GM/Chrysler Testiclese

In spite ofthe cold weather, I ventured out to the new Ford/GM/Chrysler Integrated Test Center and picked up the 2014 Testiclese for a test drive.  At 2000 horse power, the V 24 super duper charger lets out a roar and lets everyone know that you are the One True Road Boss.

The spacious interior with leather appointments, heating, air conditioning, misting, suaning and biatch seat speakers that only play Kenny G, the auto is an impressing work of automotive art.  I was impressed with the fit and finish of the vehicle and the engineers were quick to point out that "This time, they're using real steel and plastic parts."  Kudos, I say.  Kudos to this.

Sadly, I had a lot of problems with the car the moment I got in the interstate.  Traffic was backed up because some kids in a school bus got stuck under a semi full of nuclear waste and the government was busy trying to round up little hulks and spidergirls and those stretchy people.  Because of this, I couldn't try the computer controlled supercharger that the engineers promised would "move the car above 300 mph like it was nothing" .  I can only take their word for it as I sat in traffic and watched a little she hulk pull the wheels off a semi.

I can not say how disappointed I was in the performance of the 2014 Testiclese and was saddened that so much hype has been made of this car.  Five hours later, as I drove my Mitsubishi MIEV back along the very same roads that earlier held back the 2014 Testiclese, I couldn't help but wonder What was GM/Ford/Chrysler thinking?  Here I am, cruising along at 60 mph in a battery powered auto on the very same roads where I was very lucky to get 10 mph with their so-called state of the art as powered behemoth.

Until Ford/GM/Chrysler can fix this, I can't recommend the 2014 Testiclese.
 
2013-02-19 10:04:21 AM  
www.randyclemens.com
 
2013-02-19 10:08:29 AM  
This whole thing would be so much less infuriating if there wasn't so much at stake.
 
2013-02-19 10:09:15 AM  

MrSteve007: Carth: bhcompy: BiffDangler: He did SPECIFICALLY lie about certain things. Also, the driving around in circles would appear to have been an attempt to purposefully run it out of battery power, which would suggest that the not knowing the best way to drive it wasn't the issue.

One drives in circles to find a parking spot at a busy mall.

But it seems kind of silly if you have a reserved spot right in front, that is well lit, clearly marked and you've used in the past.

Yep, and when you look at the map/sat photos, he had 4 options when coming off the offramp. 1. Pull into the semi truck parking lot, 2. Pull into the McDonald's drive thru, 3. Go into the McD's parking lot (which from that side, was only about 20 stalls total, or 4. Drive straight, a hundred feet, to the well lit superchargers, right in front of the McDonald's.

Honestly, the NYT car reporter is arguing that he got lost in a tiny farking McDonald's parking Iot, after just having spun around downtown Manhattan without issue.


I do love the reporter's excuse for it, though:
Mr. Straubel said Tesla did not store data on exact locations where their cars were driven because of privacy concerns, although Tesla seemed to know that I had driven six-tenths of a mile "in a tiny 100-space parking lot." While Mr. Musk has accused me of doing this to drain the battery, I was in fact driving around the Milford service plaza on Interstate 95, in the dark, trying to find the unlighted and poorly marked Tesla Supercharger. He did not share that data, which Tesla has now posted online, with me at the time.

In other words, "I only drove around for half a mile because I didn't know you could track my mileage and speed."
 
2013-02-19 10:10:18 AM  

thefonz37: This whole thing would be so much less infuriating if there wasn't so much at stake.


People who can't get even simple things right the first time irritate me, I agree.
 
2013-02-19 10:12:36 AM  
www.taxguru.net
 
2013-02-19 10:17:43 AM  

Clemkadidlefark: [www.taxguru.net image 439x618]


And they don't dig comic sans.
 
2013-02-19 10:37:30 AM  

JosephFinn: Sybarite: He didn't read the owner's manual? So, pretty much exactly like most actual car buyers.

Quite.  Not to mention trying to follow the contradictory advice of the people from Tesla.  Mistakes on both sides, the car loses battery power in the cold, not a story.


It's not just about an electric car. It's about the new journalistic standard of the truth not being sexy enough for the public. TV shows implicitly claim to be reporting facts, but then in small print they say "for entertainment purposes only". Top Gear tried the same thing, where they went for the great shot of four guys pushing the dead Tesla into a hangar, even though it's computer showed a 25% charge.

If you say your cruise was set to 50mph, and your car accelerated on its own to over 80mph on a downhill with the cruise still on, either you're lying or you're withholding information from your review that just might be important to safety. If you're a veteran reporter, and doing a story specifically about mileage, you would have to be amazingly incompetent to make the kinds of mistakes Broder is claiming to have made.

Broder was lying, plain and simple. He was writing a sexy story, not reporting on the dull facts. Until sh*tbags like that start getting caught and having their peepees smacked, this will continue.
 
2013-02-19 10:42:37 AM  
It starts with the Times. Then it'll move on to congressional hearings. Rest in peace, Preston Tucker Elon Musk and Tesla.

/Left a service station for a 60+ mile trip with 32 miles of range on the gauge
//"Your car underperforms!"
///derp
 
Xai
2013-02-19 10:45:29 AM  
I think everyone gets bogged down on the minor details and ignores the fact;

He set off on a 61 mile journey with 32 miles of fuel
 
2013-02-19 10:50:16 AM  
Haven't they agreed to another test drive?

Sounds like both parties need a do-over...
 
2013-02-19 10:53:40 AM  

PunGent: Sounds like both panties need a do-over...


Yeah, that's how I read it.
 
2013-02-19 11:00:40 AM  

Sybarite: He didn't read the owner's manual? So, pretty much exactly like most actual car buyers.


I agree with this a lot but I also think that if you're testing a somewhat new technology you'd stop and read the manual.

/ oh, and maybe not listen to a phone rep who tells you you're totally okay to go double the amount of fuel you have left.
 
2013-02-19 11:02:24 AM  
twistedsifter.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-02-19 11:10:13 AM  

ltdanman44: all new technologies go through growing pains.  look how far it took to get from the Model T to what we have now.  Electric cars are the future, just give them the time they need to strengthen the industry.

progress takes time and money, but we will get there


This.  Wind turbines, electric cars, solar panels:  "OMG, they don't work right on the first draft!  It failed, forget the whole project!"  I can imagine Edison, the Wright Bros., Bell.. they all had idiots telling them their prototypes sucked, and they should give up.

Huzzah to those who ignore the skeptical.
 
2013-02-19 11:17:26 AM  

santadog: Huzzah to those who ignore the skeptical.


You mean like the Times editor who's ignoring accusations that his reporter did an obvious fluff piece- and is seemingly a shill of one sort or another for having done so?

I dunno.  I think "the skeptical" are pretty essential to endeavors of any kind.
 
2013-02-19 11:28:31 AM  

SkunkWerks: I dunno. I think "the skeptical" are pretty essential to endeavors of any kind.


There's a fine line between skepticism and denial. Skepticism can be cured through rigorous argument and evidence... denial goes to the bone.
=Smidge=
 
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