If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Hot Air)   Remember when overpopulation was going to kill us all? Now we're in the age of the "fertility panic"   (hotair.com) divider line 316
    More: Obvious, law of diminishing returns  
•       •       •

11865 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Feb 2013 at 9:21 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



316 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-02-18 11:50:16 PM
Remember when the [exaggeratedoversimplification of  an issue]? Well, now [oversimplification of a conflicting viewpoint]!
 
2013-02-18 11:56:23 PM

Mentat: The biggest side effect of the population leveling off is that once the baby boomers die off, there will be a massive world-wide worker shortage.  Countries will be fighting to let immigrants in.  It will be the greatest boon to the Middle Class since the Black Death.


I've been saying for year that the only way boomers will have enough people to wipe their butts and change their bedpans is if the illegals all have large catholic families, no way in hell their grandkids and great grandkids are going to want those jobs. I've also been saying for over a decade that H1B is nothing for competent IT folks to fear, some of my best coworkers are former H1B holders, much better for me that they're here working with me than in India working for an outsourcing firm at Indian wages.
 
2013-02-18 11:57:30 PM

Ishkur: You might think this will never be possible, but we're already almost there. Society is humming along now taking care of a great number of people who don't contribute any value to the system: The very poor, the very rich, the handicapped, the disabled, the sick, the elderly, children, students, and the unemployed, underemployed and unemployable are all being supported quite comfortably by the people who are..... and somehow this is not a net negative on society.


Economically, society can handle it.  Culturally, not so much.  Again, look to the subcultures where we're well along the road to 'comfortably sustained'.  HUD housing projects, native reservations, and the hundreds of rural trailer courts where the majority of residents are on Social Security Disability checks. So far, anyway, it follows a very common pathology.  People don't say, "gee, I don't have to worry about food, I'm going to spend time with loved ones, pick my banjo, read all of Shakespeare, and learn all the kanji" (as I desperately want to believe I'd say if I were unemployed) in that situation.  They start huffing glue and shooting each other over rims and generally become listless Jerry Springer addicts.
 
2013-02-18 11:57:36 PM
The Wall Street "We Hate Immigrants" Journal was whining about global population decline last week.  "We'll spend too much on health care" seemed to be the major issue.
 
2013-02-18 11:57:39 PM

Atomic Spunk: Open your legs, ladies. I'm here to help the country.


What opening your legs for atomic spunk might look like
weeklyworldnews.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-02-18 11:59:27 PM

Dafatone: GAT_00: Only if you're worried about the ratio of white people to everyone else.

This.

There was an article in the Wall Street Journal recently that began by saying "hey, the middle class is vanishing because of birth rates!  Let's use 'white and college educated' as a stand-in for middle class, because that's what we think when we think middle class."

fark the WSJ and fark this line of thinking.


I read that article also.  While starting off with whitey as the ideal sample was very poor taste, he did go on to talk about fertility rates of all Americans.  The rates were dropping among minorities as well.  He even talked about how the fertility rates of the nations have been sending most of our immigrants recently are also seeing fertility rates on the decline.
 
2013-02-18 11:59:59 PM
The great news?

As evidenced by this thread, idiots are not reproducing.

The first wife had three.

Working on a couple of caddies with the second.
 
2013-02-19 12:02:15 AM

GAT_00: Koodz: I'm with Gat on this one.  I see white racists complain about being out-bred by the browns all the time and all I can think is, "You can't stand your own women enough to fark them.  It's almost like subconsciously you aren't convinced of your own superiority after all."

Have you ever seen an attractive white supremacist?


Well, Hitler did have those puppy dog eyes.

/NTTIAWYT
//o wait yes there is
 
2013-02-19 12:08:29 AM

Amos Quito: super_grass:

What do you get when you mix half a cup of water and half a cup of coffee?

Think about it.

Hmmm... Let's see...

Weak-assed coffee?

Brawndo?

Garbage disposal lubricant?


Is weak coffee "coffee?"  Or "water?"

Though, I would have gone with 50/50 coffee and milk.  I like lattes.
 
2013-02-19 12:09:36 AM

basemetal: More than 6 billion people in the world, we wont run out any time soon.

/governments are more worried about future tax revenue


you must have fail at math...  Yes, 6 Billion is a lot BUT there's this thing call death. Imagine if no one procreates.. all 6 B will be gone in a lil over a 100 years.
 
2013-02-19 12:11:26 AM

GAT_00: Koodz: I'm with Gat on this one.  I see white racists complain about being out-bred by the browns all the time and all I can think is, "You can't stand your own women enough to fark them.  It's almost like subconsciously you aren't convinced of your own superiority after all."

Have you ever seen an attractive white supremacist?


well some of the Fox news anchors are pretty attractive..   :)
 
2013-02-19 12:12:40 AM

super_grass: Translation: white people are being bred out.

And as a progressive humanist, all I can say is: good. White people are oppressors, and they should have a taste of their own medicine at the hands of their victims.  I can't wait to see the day when Europe and America is majority nonwhite and their wealth and power stripped away. Only by then could the world be a peaceful and diverse society free of hate.


Ha ha, that's some koolaid... cause we all know hate is only found among white societies, all others are the Garden of Eden compared to civilization...
 
2013-02-19 12:14:01 AM
Anyone know of any economists who are modeling alleged post-scarcity societies by looking at sub-sets of current societies? It seems like we have some fiction, some hypothetical notions, and some anecdotes. Are there any data?
 
2013-02-19 12:14:47 AM

FizixJunkee: Fubini: Fertility panic isn't so much related to overpopulation as it is to funding the old people's pensions. If we don't have enough young people we're going to have to go all soylent green on the old folks homes.

I hate to admit it, but THIS.

You know, my grandparents as well as the other Junkee's grandparents are managing to their live old-aged lives better than any of their grandchildren are living our young lives.  They all have pensions, Social Security, savings, homes paid for, etc.  Not a single one of them had student loan debt or struggled to pay for childcare ($1,325/month here in Los Angeles).  They were able to buy decent homes on a single income rather than struggle to afford a mortgage on two incomes.


Your problem is that you're in CA, the most expensive place in America.  If I was in the midwest, I'd be able to buy a house with spare cash 7 years after I get out of school.  If I had gone to the Pacific Northwest, I'd have 0 student debt, a nice car (that would be paid off in 6 months), my own apartment, and $40K a year in surplus to spend on whatever I wanted.  But I'm in the Bay Area limping along paycheck to paycheck, spending the next 3-5 years paying off the $40K in debt I had coming out of school (and that's assuming that the company doesn't fold.  If it does, I'm utterly farked), and knowing that I will never, ever be able to afford a house.

/Mind you, I'm happy I'm here, since I hate working at big, slow corporations, but it does make my financial state precarious.
 
2013-02-19 12:16:50 AM
It's not that we have too few people, there are just too few people who are like me.  Educated, affluent, stable, productive 1st world people are rare.  There are tons of uneducated poor people from the backward parts of the world (including parts of my own country).
 
2013-02-19 12:16:55 AM

Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: So what would be the optimal number of people on this planet?  We'd need a number large enough to improve and maintain our existing systems yet not so large that they consumed every last resource on Earth.

/been playing Civilization all weekend


depends on consumption level. If everyone lives like an American I would say less than 1 Billion for sustainability. If all 7 Billion live like a typical American man, woman and child than the Earth is FARKED!
 
2013-02-19 12:17:42 AM

LadySusan: Anyone know of any economists who are modeling alleged post-scarcity societies by looking at sub-sets of current societies? It seems like we have some fiction, some hypothetical notions, and some anecdotes. Are there any data?


Excellent question, I don't have any data but I'd love to see some. With that I'm out, work week calls.
 
2013-02-19 12:18:20 AM

halfof33: The great news?

As evidenced by this thread, idiots are not reproducing.

The first wife had three.

Working on a couple of caddies with the second.


Yup, there is no way we can overpopulate the planet. Feel free to have as many kids as you want. There are an infinite number of resources.
 
2013-02-19 12:20:28 AM

Ishkur: Without scarcity, there is no value. No value, no cost.


Which is why diamonds are so cheap.

Do you know what K-Mart, Wal-Mart, etc do with the tennis shoes that they don't sell?  They shred them and throw them away.  This is how they can justify selling $2 shoes for $100 a pair.  Artifical scarcity.

As long as people exist to limit the supply we'll never reach "post scarcity."  We'll shred all the shoes, if we have to.  Dig ditches to fill them back up.

Capitilism will never die.
 
2013-02-19 12:21:02 AM

machoprogrammer: halfof33: The great news?

As evidenced by this thread, idiots are not reproducing.

The first wife had three.

Working on a couple of caddies with the second.

Yup, there is no way we can overpopulate the planet. Feel free to have as many kids as you want. There are an infinite number of resources.


lolz, can I have as many as Muhammad in Somalia? Please?
 
2013-02-19 12:21:47 AM

LoneWolf343: GAT_00: Koodz: I'm with Gat on this one.  I see white racists complain about being out-bred by the browns all the time and all I can think is, "You can't stand your own women enough to fark them.  It's almost like subconsciously you aren't convinced of your own superiority after all."

Have you ever seen an attractive white supremacist?

Well, Hitler did have those puppy dog eyes.

/NTTIAWYT
//o wait yes there is


I don't want no mud grandbabies, so I've hired security
img151.imageshack.us
 
2013-02-19 12:22:25 AM
Came for Idiocracy pictures. Leaving disappointed.
 
2013-02-19 12:23:07 AM

Ishkur: 10,000 years ago, 100% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the tribe.
5,000 years ago, 80% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the city-state.
1,000 years ago, 60% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the kingdom.
200 years ago, 40% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the country.
Today, less than 10% of our population actively work on providing enough food for the rest of us.

This level of efficiency will soon spread to all industries. Automation, industrial processes, manufacturing and mass production will provide for all, with very little human labor required. Some companies are already so streamlined and efficient that they can execute business operations and move product with a skeleton force that keeps shrinking. Additionally, with service-oriented architecture, one man can run a complete business all by himself without the need for employees. His business operations are modular -- he hires labor when needed....part-time, temporary, contract work.

So what then? What happens when a businesses can be run perfectly fine without employees? Without payroll? Without you? What happens when one man can do the job of one million (like farmers do now)?

We are rapidly approaching that age. The age of post-scarcity and post-capitalism.


Very interesting post. Interesting to see trends being extrapolated.

Question: What about the human need to be... engaged in doing something? I'm convinced that humans need to operate under some stress, with some exertion. That humans operate best under eustress - positive stress. They've evolved from hunter gatherers and farmers. That ancient mechanism still is embedded in them.

I see some celebrities self-destructing because they have no purpose in life, no need to work, to follow some schedule. The circadian rhythms of life force some structure, the rising of the sun, the change of seasons. Celebrities who succeed are the ones who find a new purpose. The ones just chasing the next high are the ones who implode, like a character in a sci-fi novel who has a jack plugged into his/her brain's pleasure center, constantly stimulating it, forgetting to eat or get out of one's excrement.

In the movie "The Matrix", they talked about a perfect world being imposed on humans, but the human brain kept rejecting it. I think there might be some real-world truth to that.
 
2013-02-19 12:25:09 AM

Zombie Butler: Capitalism it's self has some egalitarian features.but tends towards monopolies that have no investment in the well-being of human beings or our finite earth.

Socialism with free-market features might be a good stepping stone. Protection for the earth and people with free market able to function.  However, the two systems are disparate in their very nature, so eventually one would subvert the other (honestly this is why I see civil war in China eventually).


I live in China.   The socialist, state owned companies are referred to as "monopolies."  Because that's what they are.

It's callusion that leads to monopolies, not capitalism per se.

And while a civil war might happen "eventually," I'm betting that it won't happen soon.
 
2013-02-19 12:25:57 AM
The only way we can survive is to stop having so many children.  This is not going to happen on its own, it needs divine intervention to fix this.  Lots of options, not likely the one you were thinking about the most, or the one after that.
 
2013-02-19 12:29:32 AM

rev. dave: The only way we can survive is to stop having so many children.  This is not going to happen on its own, it needs divine intervention to fix this.  Lots of options, not likely the one you were thinking about the most, or the one after that.


Uh, agreed. Don't have children
 
2013-02-19 12:31:47 AM

JungleBoogie: I see some celebrities self-destructing because they have no purpose in life, no need to work, to follow some schedule.


"The number one killer of old people is retirement."

The solution is "Get a damned hobby."
 
2013-02-19 12:41:22 AM

Alexei Novikov: Got snipped when I turned 18. We already pay people to have babies. It's not working out very well. Article is farking stupid.


Here in the US it can be difficult to find a doctor who will perform a vasectomy on men under 30... or even under 40 if they don't have any kids. Most of them believe you'll change your mind about not wanting children so they try very hard to discourage having the procedure done.
 
2013-02-19 12:42:15 AM
Yeah, the overpopulation lie has been dead for some time. We probably have enough small-time eugenicists and child-haters here at FARK (you know, the type who still find the term "crotchfruit" amusing) where this type of story will still be found either revelatory, controversial, or morally wrong.
 
2013-02-19 12:49:36 AM

Fubini: Fertility panic isn't so much related to overpopulation as it is to funding the old people's pensions. If we don't have enough young people we're going to have to go all soylent green on the old folks homes.



Don't give Nurse Noakes any ideas...

3.bp.blogspot.com
/Seriously, though, can't we get past life as a Ponzi scheme before we destroy all biology on the planet?
 
2013-02-19 12:50:02 AM

Ed Willy: GAT_00: Only if you're worried about the ratio of white people to everyone else.

Don't forget the Japanese. Half the incentive for creating robots is so they can avoid having to open their borders to permanent immigration.

Meanwhile, China one child policy mixed with their preference of boys means you'll have a generation of working class men with no females around.

Hmmm.... Maybe Japan and China can finally reach piece by trading Japanese sex bot technology to help the Chinese government from having a revolution of sexually frustrated men.


Newsletter.
 
2013-02-19 12:53:11 AM
My example was the most efficient  organization of a 5-7 Million population group consisting of 10, groups 16, 58 story buildings in a square grid, with each of the groups supporting (400x16) 6400 people in the top 50 floors (1600, 5000 square ft apartments) with 4 floors of businesses, restaurants, etc, and 4 floors underground for food delivery, food shopping, parking and underground transport access for the outer 4 buildings of each 1/10th of a mile 16 building block.
10 16 building blocks make 1 side of the mile square and 10 more make up the other side, thus 160 x 160 = 25,600 buildings per square mile.

now lets take it to a real world example, which is about a 10 square mile complex supporting 5 million, and within the next 20 years is looking to expand to 6.9 million, due to immigration, and and a continued internal growth rate of ~1.3% combined. The country is Singapore, a city state on the southern tip of Malaysia.
They have grown, with levels of renovation and constant construction, in roughly 2 generations (48 years, since independence from being a colony and then from Malaysia as well, to be not only an economic powerhouse in the region, having univeral health care, a mixture of work and government subsidized retirement packages, the highest rate of literacy in Asia and challenging most of the rest of the world, having a 2.2% unemployment rate. All the while striving for independence from Malaysia, and succeeding in creating a water independent infrastructure that can support the population without needing to access the river that flows, but is controlable by Malaysian authority. They have the infrastructure of transportation to move 100,000 people per day through their airports, hosting world events like the Youth Olympic Games in 2010, and having a Formula 1 race event routed through their streets and still be able to have 100,000+ crowds navigate their way home in 15 to 20 minutes through their mass transit systems, busses, taxi's and rerouted traffic for personal cars.
Also they have integrated 5 national languages including English, have a Sharia Law Court system as well as the Queen's (British) court system. They provide education in 43 acknowledged "home dialects".
They are known for their love of food, which although mostly seafood, also includes a great deal of poultry, lamb, beef, and pork as the great diversity of peoples have strong culinary traditions and citywide competitions to be rated the best in specialized dishes and techniques.

So, like I said if we simply re-plan our cities, we could still have great cities, but with a huge reduction in resources being held up in distribution channels. Think how many miles of water piping currently goes into delivering water to 2,000,000 individual building in the city of LA alone, Then think of the gas lines, the electrical grid, and the sewage lines. Not to mention the thousands of miles of roadways, expressways, bridges, government buildings, gas stations etc.
If we planned to condense LA from 100 square miles to even just 10 square miles, not the extreme case of 1 square mile as I presented as technically possible, the cost savings to our country in terms of upkeep, energy costs, government expenditures and other wasted resources, from just LA alone, would be roughly 1/3 of our current national debt (5.3 Trillion) every decade. If we extended the same consolodation to the other top 100 population cities in the country, we could double our economic status, and remove the national debt entirely in one decade, without changing anything else.
If we were include changes to our energy creation mechanism, included water recycling, thermal depolymerization for oil production and water purification, algal based oil production, superconductive national electrical distribution network of solar and wind energy to localized electrolisis and hydrogen/oxygen powered steam generating electrical distribution and storage area, we could cut another 90% off of our energy costs, while also eliminating 144 Billion dollars in direct costs of coal oil and natural gas for electrical generation alone, plus the 1.5 Trillion in costs for oil usage in the US for transportation, manufacturing etc.
All the tech is here, we just need to plan, implement, and change how we view what cities can and do for us, and what they can and will do for us in the future.
 
2013-02-19 01:06:16 AM

Mentat: The biggest side effect of the population leveling off is that once the baby boomers die off, there will be a massive world-wide worker shortage.  Countries will be fighting to let immigrants in.  It will be the greatest boon to the Middle Class since the Black Death.


Yeah, it was great other than the dying part!
 
2013-02-19 01:08:26 AM

super_grass: Translation: white people are being bred out.

And as a progressive humanist, all I can say is: good. White people are oppressors, and they should have a taste of their own medicine at the hands of their victims.  I can't wait to see the day when Europe and America is majority nonwhite and their wealth and power stripped away. Only by then could the world be a peaceful and diverse society free of hate.


I'm not oppressing anyone you bigoted farkwad
 
2013-02-19 01:11:11 AM
There was NEVER any overpopulation issue among scientists. There was only the overpopulation cover of Time Magazine. The scientists never thought that.

Sincerely,

Every Global Warming Apologist Ever
 
2013-02-19 01:11:39 AM
The real problem is the intelligence levels of the ones who ARE breeding.

There should be an "intelligence panic."
 
2013-02-19 01:15:10 AM

super_grass: Translation: white people are being bred out.

And as a progressive humanist, all I can say is: good. White people are oppressors, and they should have a taste of their own medicine at the hands of their victims.  I can't wait to see the day when Europe and America is majority nonwhite and their wealth and power stripped away. Only by then could the world be a peaceful and diverse society free of hate.


seriously? is hating white people a thing now?
 
2013-02-19 01:22:41 AM

GF named my left testicle thundercles: super_grass: Translation: white people are being bred out.

And as a progressive humanist, all I can say is: good. White people are oppressors, and they should have a taste of their own medicine at the hands of their victims.  I can't wait to see the day when Europe and America is majority nonwhite and their wealth and power stripped away. Only by then could the world be a peaceful and diverse society free of hate.

seriously? is hating white people a thing now?

 
2013-02-19 01:23:45 AM
I hit the wrong button. I blame whitey.
 
2013-02-19 01:26:02 AM
Stone Meadow:
thehaberboschprocess.files.wordpress.com 

IOW, we're going to top out at about 50% higher than we are now.

Which is still freaking terrifying. The resources that had to sustain one person just 50 years ago will need to support five people, in fifty years time.
 
2013-02-19 01:29:49 AM
Can't we just sell the old people off to medical experiments?
 
2013-02-19 01:40:19 AM

Amos Quito: GAT_00: Only if you're worried about the ratio of white people to everyone else.


[previews.agefotostock.com image 540x374]

[cdn.theatlanticcities.com image 608x416]

"Dreams of the future of humanity"

Paradise, eh, GAT_00?

~
GAT_00 is a white-hating racist PoS.

"pay attention to me I hate white people check me out ladeez!"
 
2013-02-19 01:42:18 AM

xcv: I'm not even white and I mourn the loss of Young White Women that are in sharp decline against the world's total population. Nearly every heterosexual man of every ethnicity prefers them, with increased competition for a shrinking supply, YWW are going to become an extremely valuable commodity on the planet, again. Wars were fought over them in the past, hopefully 3D printers and gene expression therapy will solve some of the demand.



Bullworth: All we need is a voluntary, free-spirited, open-ended program of procreative racial deconstruction. Everybody just gotta keep farkin' everybody 'til they're all the same color.

i47.tinypic.com
 
2013-02-19 01:44:53 AM

Big Ramifications: Amos Quito: GAT_00: Only if you're worried about the ratio of white people to everyone else.


[previews.agefotostock.com image 540x374]

[cdn.theatlanticcities.com image 608x416]

"Dreams of the future of humanity"

Paradise, eh, GAT_00?
~
GAT_00 is a white-hating racist PoS.

"pay attention to me I hate white people check me out ladeez!"


FALK YOU Big Ram takes one to know one.
 
2013-02-19 01:51:31 AM
Luckily we have these "quiver full" religious whack jobs to save us.
farm1.staticflickr.com
 
2013-02-19 01:54:03 AM

SevenizGud: There was NEVER any overpopulation issue among scientists. There was only the overpopulation cover of Time Magazine. The scientists never thought that.

Sincerely,

Every Global Warming Apologist Ever


Then Norman Borlaug worked his ass off to feed all the new people for shiats and giggles?

Please. The scientists and engineers have been busy finding ways to get water, food, power, and communications to the teeming masses...who f*cking cares what we call it. Go cry in a low flow toilet.
 
2013-02-19 01:54:13 AM

GAT_00: Only if you're worried about the ratio of white people to everyone else.


Soylent Green is pensioners!

Delicious pensioners.
 
2013-02-19 01:57:39 AM

Cybernetic: Paul Ehrlich was so very wrong on so many levels.

I hope that Julian Simon's heirs still have the framed check.


came here to say
THIS!
Ehrlich is such a worthless POS.  "Well, my predictions never came true, but here are some NEW predictions. I am certain that this time I wont be wrong."
DIAF you POS.

Strangely enough, Simon has never been proved "wrong".
A quick look at oil and gas in the US fits everything that he ever wrote.
Human intellect is unbound.
 
2013-02-19 02:02:21 AM

Ishkur: HeadLever: Problem is, what do you replace it with?

Well, the Age of Post-Scarcity is coming, and it will be a slow burn over a couple hundred years rather than a complete overhaul within a single generation, which is how all economic systems transform into new ones (ie: Manorialism--->Mercantilism--->Capitalism). And it's going to start with the biggest issue of the 21st century (besides overpopulation, global warming, and dwindling resources): Employment.

As automation replaces the jobs that humans used to do, we're going to see an increasing amount of society capable of running itself. And when it gets to a point where only a fraction of full-time jobs exist and the system is capable of supporting up to 80% unemployment without totally collapsing1.

Why do we work? To make money, obviously. Why do we want to make money? So we can buy stuff that makes our lives more comfortable. Why does this stuff cost money? Because there is only so much of it about. If there's not enough of something, it has value. It's worth something. Rarity is expensive. Everything abundant is worthless. It is free. I'll come back to this point later.

10,000 years ago, 100% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the tribe.
5,000 years ago, 80% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the city-state.
1,000 years ago, 60% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the kingdom.
200 years ago, 40% of the population worked on providing enough food to sustain everyone in the country.
Today, less than 10% of our population actively work on providing enough food for the rest of us.

This level of efficiency will soon spread to all industries. Automation, industrial processes, manufacturing and mass production will provide for all, with very little human labor required. Some companies are already so streamlined and efficient that they can execute business operations and move product with a skeleton force that keeps shrinking. Additionally, with service-oriented architecture, one man can run a complete business all by himself without the need for employees. His business operations are modular -- he hires labor when needed....part-time, temporary, contract work.

So what then? What happens when a businesses can be run perfectly fine without employees? Without payroll? Without you? What happens when one man can do the job of one million (like farmers do now)?

We are rapidly approaching that age. The age of post-scarcity and post-capitalism.

We've seen what happens to media (cf. internet) when it reaches a state of absolute abundance -- it becomes worthless. It becomes free. It becomes accessible to everyone everywhere, equally, all the time. Now stretch this same paradigm across all sectors, all industries, all segments of human consumption. What happens?

Maintenance and upkeep of our system is being handled by fewer and fewer personnel. Automation makes things cheaper, more efficient, more abundant. Without scarcity, there is no value. No value, no cost. No cost, no need to pay for it. And if you don't need to pay for anything, then why need money? And if you don't need money, then why work?

Since Capitalism is a resource-based system that requires scarcity to operate, it will ultimately be discarded -- abundance makes it meaningless. What will people live/work for then? Since everything is taken care of, social acceptance within a peer group and self-actualization become prime goals (youtube is a perfect example of this: When people can't find work, they invent their own things to do...even if its just dumb Gangnam Style and Harlem Shake parodies).

I like to envision a Star Trekian future where the essential work (the 2%ers) is handled by different segments of the population during different stages of their lives, like shifts. It would be a mandatory service thing (ie: every 10 years, you must put in six months of labor) that rotates through the populace. So in an average life, most people would only work about 6000 hours. The rest of their lives they do whatever they like.

But I can't see any of this being a feasible reality for another century or so, when technology/AI improves and money becomes even more of an abstraction than it is now. But the key economic indicator is scarcity: Things have value because they are rare. We obtain them by exchanging them with other rare/finite things, namely currency. Once we get over this notion and officially annihilate scarcity (and the need to work for it), then Capitalism will be truly dead and done away with.

But it will come naturally, through social and technological progress, not through revolution. And it will come gradually, over the course of several generations. Not all at once, and certainly not within our lifetimes.

But before all that, we have to evaluate what we live and work for, and why. And we must come to accept the notion that a life of work isn't our destiny (even if we want it). We must evolve beyond the the idea that our lives are governed by the salary and the paycheck.

That might be a difficult thing to do.

/1 You might think this will never be possible, but we're already almost there. Society is humming along now taking care of a great number of people who don't contribute any value to the system: The very poor, the very rich, the handicapped, the disabled, the sick, the elderly, children, students, and the unemployed, underemployed and unemployable are all being supported quite comfortably by the people who are..... and somehow this is not a net negative on society.


Pardon me if someone else already said it, but have you read Neal Stephenson's "The Diamond Age"?
 
2013-02-19 02:05:29 AM

SevenizGud: There was NEVER any overpopulation issue among scientists. There was only the overpopulation cover of Time Magazine. The scientists never thought that.

Sincerely,

Every Global Warming Apologist Ever


I don't know if you have magical powers to see the future but scientists back then certainly didn't.  The human race would be farked if we didn't change our reproduction habits to respond to the advances in health care. It would have been hard to know for sure the reproduction habits would change, especially if you were trying to predict the future before contraceptives and women's rights.
 
Displayed 50 of 316 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report