Oh, FFS? Really? Really really?

I thought the "you can keep the team names but have to give up the mascots" thing was a decent compromise.

Rep. Sherri Sprenger (R-Scio), said she plans to introduce a bill in the House that would allow just that. Under her proposal, if a school district with a Native American mascot could reach an agreement with the local tribal government, they could apply for a waiver. If the school and the tribe fail to reach an agreement, the rule would stand.

WTF is this happening?

Roseburg High School, where Kruse played football in his teens, abandoned its Indian mascot more than a decade ago in deference to the Cow Creek Band of Umpqua Tribe of Indians, but kept the name.

Ok, got it.

That laser-like focus on jobs strikes again, I see.

I read that many of the North American Tribes embraced Christianity responding, "It's easy for us to believe in your Jesus, because we already believe in your God."

Why not treat these mascot situations the same way?

Thought police on the prowl again in Oregon. Republicans stand up for tradition and get shouted down by edgy libs.

Nothing new under the sun.

Dickheads on the prowl again in Oregon. Decent people stand up for tolerance & respect and get shouted at by edgy "conservatives".

Nothing new under the sun.

Well, at least their not using dead kids to try to claim inanimate objects have intent.

Fluorescent Testicle: That laser-like focus on jobs strikes again, I see.

Are you saying bringing those Mascot Jobs back won't turn Oregon's economy completely around?

Wow, you're pretty cynical.

*clicks on profile*

Okay, scratch the cynical part.

/Yes, just being silly now.
//It's 3:49 and the mods are still awake so I can't post ponies. >.<
///Also I'm out of pie.

The bill:

Prohibits State Board of Education from adopting rules or imposing sanctions related to use of mascots by public schools.

OMG the humanity!!!

Among right-wingers this is also a 'thing' here in Wisconsin -- there's a teabagger legislative agenda wishlist out there for the current session and IIRC somewhere in the top ten items they'd like to accomplish is overturning Wisconsin's ban on Native American-related team nicknames, buried in there among the other things like emasculating appeals courts, making it harder to vote, etc.

Shouldn't we just leave this fake debate about Indians to a fake Indian like Elezabeth Warren?

Republicans have political capital???

The Republicans have political capital?

lordjupiter: Republicans have political capital???

13 seconds, damn you!

As a person with 1/4 Apache heritage through my grandmother, I tend to find most Native American mascots as an honor towards the fighting spirit of the Native Americans. They are the ones who gave us the term "brave" after all, and to brush aside their fearlessness and bravery shown against a stronger and better armed "enemy" should not be forgotten.

Of course one thing I notice what seems to be forgotten is it was the white European Christian settlers that many on the political "right" consider as "traditional Americans", who were the "enemy" stealing the Native Americans' land and attempting a genocide of their culture and people. It is fighting them that gave Native Americans the image of being fearless warriors. I'll bet if you made the teaching of that fact to the student body as a condition of reinstituting the Native American mascots, the Republicans would balk.

That being said, this is just another "wedge issue" that even if the Republicans win absolutely nothing will be accomplished. People will continue to be unemployed, schools will continue to be underfunded, homelessness will continue, crime will not be reduced, etc. This seems to be the Republican's M.O. Go after issues that do nothing to fix the problems you can blame on the "liberal strawman", but allows you to score political points and divide the populace.

With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

Keep this crap off the sports tab, pls.

AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

veedeevadeevoodee: Keep this crap off the sports tab, pls.

At least we're talking actual sports and not wrasslin'.

Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

I am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

Good point.  Still doesn't justify them continuing a useless fight when the energy could be used towards something productive, but that can be applied to both sides.  You are correct, it shows all parties involved have their priorities in the wrong place.

keylock71: shotglasss: Shouldn't we just leave this fake debate about Indians to a fake Indian like Elezabeth Warren?

It makes me smile that you clods still have chafed asses over this...

And that's Senator Elizabeth Warren to you, clod.

I like your butthurt over the way I pointed out what a liar she is.

AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

I am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

It's interesting that you could get that wrong.  What are you afraid of?

heavymetal: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

Good point.  Still doesn't justify them continuing a useless fight when the energy could be used towards something productive, but that can be applied to both sides.  You are correct, it shows all parties involved have their priorities in the wrong place.

At the local level, once the budget is worked out, this is all that really remains of the legislators' jobs.

Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

I am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

It's interesting that you could get that wrong.  What are you afraid of?

Are you afraid of offending me? LOL. Give it your best shot.

Are Native Americans allowed to establish new tribes?

Dracolich: It's interesting that you could get that wrong.  What are you afraid of?

Psst: He's a troll, he's not really "A black" (come on, who the hell says that?).

Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

Good point also.  While what is considered to be "offensive" can be often debated, it is amusing how the Republicans always seem to take the side which wants to continue offending or oppressing. Then they wonder why their party seems to have the image problem they do regarding minorities and women despite all the Rubio's, Jimdal's, Cains, and Bachmans they march out.

AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

I am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

It's interesting that you could get that wrong.  What are you afraid of?

Are you afraid of offending me? LOL. Give it your best shot.

You've already lost this one.  It's pretty clear that you weren't willing to put out real information by the decoy information that you used.  This means you're a coward.

Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

I am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

It's interesting that you could get that wrong.  What are you afraid of?

Are you afraid of offending me? LOL. Give it your best shot.

You've already lost this one.  It's pretty clear that you weren't willing to put out real information by the decoy information that you used.  This means you're a coward.
 I have to disagree. I've dealt with racism and prejudice all my life. I take no offense at this kind of thing. It's just a mascot.
But you still want to teach me a lesson here? Go on. Show me what it's like on "the other side".

AverageAmericanGuy: I  am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

And I'm an 8 1/2 foot tall sasquatch, good to meet you.

AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

Good point.  Still doesn't justify them continuing a useless fight when the energy could be used towards something productive, but that can be applied to both sides.  You are correct, it shows all parties involved have their priorities in the wrong place.

At the local level, once the budget is worked out, this is all that really remains of the legislators' jobs.

So it is in many ways the voters' fault.  Rather than holding their legislators acountable they allow themselve's to get "sucked in" to these political games and become pawns rather than participants in the political process.  But Hell, that is almost the whole farking country nowadays.  No wonder wh can't have nioce things.  Sigh................................

quatchi: AverageAmericanGuy: I  am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

And I'm an 8 1/2 foot tall sasquatch, good to meet you.

quatchi: And I'm an 8 1/2 foot tall sasquatch, good to meet you.



It's a farkin' samsquanch!

AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: Dracolich: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: With Republicans today It is not about making our nation a better place to live, but rather scorring political points to win the next election while not upsetting their wealthy donors/handlers.

And the move to ban the mascots made the nation better to live in? Because from here it looks like cheap political point grabbing.

It's really racist.  These kinds of things may be easier to see from the other side.  If you tell us your heritage, we can assist by using it to try to offend you.

I am a black from Nashville, Tennessee.

It's interesting that you could get that wrong.  What are you afraid of?

Are you afraid of offending me? LOL. Give it your best shot.

You've already lost this one.  It's pretty clear that you weren't willing to put out real information by the decoy information that you used.  This means you're a coward.
 I have to disagree. I've dealt with racism and prejudice all my life. I take no offense at this kind of thing. It's just a mascot.
But you still want to teach me a lesson here? Go on. Show me what it's like on "the other side".

Look, coward, it's clear you're still pretending so let's go ahead and teach you anyway to aid your shame.  You're trying to view it from someone else's perspective, but you're still not able to get outside of your own head.  This is fairly typical.  You believe that just because you personally could get over something that everyone in that position should have to.  Do you see the flaw?  Let's imagine that this caricature that you're using has kids.  Should they have to put up with it because you could?  Perhaps everyone in the world should have to endure insults, wouldn't that be a great place to live?  It's ironic that you don't get it, given that you didn't want to face it yourself.  Coward.

heavymetal: So it is in many ways the voters' fault.  Rather than holding their legislators acountable they allow themselve's to get "sucked in" to these political games and become pawns rather than participants in the political process.  But Hell, that is almost the whole farking country nowadays.  No wonder wh can't have nioce things.  Sigh................................

Yes. No. It's impossible to pin the blame on any one party here. Whether it be the voters or the Democrats or the Republicans. The voters can only vote for those who they are presented with. They are only ever presented with a rosy picture of the candidates, and many with their hands in the pie aren't going to vote against their own interests.

It's a cultural thing. The people feel very disconnected with the government, seeing it as this monstrous 'other' that either helps pay the bills or is a heavy handed good squad. Tie that with a two party system that guarantees that independent voices are drowned out, and you've built a system that doesn't promote engagement with local government. Not many people are going to get involved if it looks like a waste of time. Only the very vain and the very driven put themselves up for candidacy.

It's not solvable. And that's fine with me, if the local government isn't a bunch of busybodies looking to wield their power at the expense of the locals, which is what I see the mascot ban as.

AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: So it is in many ways the voters' fault.  Rather than holding their legislators acountable they allow themselve's to get "sucked in" to these political games and become pawns rather than participants in the political process.  But Hell, that is almost the whole farking country nowadays.  No wonder wh can't have nioce things.  Sigh................................

Yes. No. It's impossible to pin the blame on any one party here. Whether it be the voters or the Democrats or the Republicans. The voters can only vote for those who they are presented with. They are only ever presented with a rosy picture of the candidates, and many with their hands in the pie aren't going to vote against their own interests.

It's a cultural thing. The people feel very disconnected with the government, seeing it as this monstrous 'other' that either helps pay the bills or is a heavy handed good squad. Tie that with a two party system that guarantees that independent voices are drowned out, and you've built a system that doesn't promote engagement with local government. Not many people are going to get involved if it looks like a waste of time. Only the very vain and the very driven put themselves up for candidacy.

It's not solvable. And that's fine with me, if the local government isn't a bunch of busybodies looking to wield their power at the expense of the locals, which is what I see the mascot ban as.


And what of the Native American "locals"? Should they be ignored?

Philip Francis Queeg: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: So it is in many ways the voters' fault.  Rather than holding their legislators acountable they allow themselve's to get "sucked in" to these political games and become pawns rather than participants in the political process.  But Hell, that is almost the whole farking country nowadays.  No wonder wh can't have nioce things.  Sigh................................

Yes. No. It's impossible to pin the blame on any one party here. Whether it be the voters or the Democrats or the Republicans. The voters can only vote for those who they are presented with. They are only ever presented with a rosy picture of the candidates, and many with their hands in the pie aren't going to vote against their own interests.

It's a cultural thing. The people feel very disconnected with the government, seeing it as this monstrous 'other' that either helps pay the bills or is a heavy handed good squad. Tie that with a two party system that guarantees that independent voices are drowned out, and you've built a system that doesn't promote engagement with local government. Not many people are going to get involved if it looks like a waste of time. Only the very vain and the very driven put themselves up for candidacy.

It's not solvable. And that's fine with me, if the local government isn't a bunch of busybodies looking to wield their power at the expense of the locals, which is what I see the mascot ban as.


And what of the Native American "locals"? Should they be ignored?

The troll's basically dead.  If you have any fire or acid, you can finish the job.

Dracolich: You're trying to view it from someone else's perspective, but you're still not able to get outside of your own head.  This is fairly typical.  You believe that just because you personally could get over something that everyone in that position should have to.  Do you see the flaw?  Let's imagine that this caricature that you're using has kids.  Should they have to put up with it because you could?  Perhaps everyone in the world should have to endure insults, wouldn't that be a great place to live?

So the power of government should step in and eliminate school mascots? LOL. You've completely lost all sense of scale.

Philip Francis Queeg: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: So it is in many ways the voters' fault.  Rather than holding their legislators acountable they allow themselve's to get "sucked in" to these political games and become pawns rather than participants in the political process.  But Hell, that is almost the whole farking country nowadays.  No wonder wh can't have nioce things.  Sigh................................

Yes. No. It's impossible to pin the blame on any one party here. Whether it be the voters or the Democrats or the Republicans. The voters can only vote for those who they are presented with. They are only ever presented with a rosy picture of the candidates, and many with their hands in the pie aren't going to vote against their own interests.

It's a cultural thing. The people feel very disconnected with the government, seeing it as this monstrous 'other' that either helps pay the bills or is a heavy handed good squad. Tie that with a two party system that guarantees that independent voices are drowned out, and you've built a system that doesn't promote engagement with local government. Not many people are going to get involved if it looks like a waste of time. Only the very vain and the very driven put themselves up for candidacy.

It's not solvable. And that's fine with me, if the local government isn't a bunch of busybodies looking to wield their power at the expense of the locals, which is what I see the mascot ban as.


And what of the Native American "locals"? Should they be ignored?

They have recourse with the courts.

C'mon Indians have no political clout in this country. If you going to denigrate an ethnic group, they're the ones to go with. Right now the repubs can't make fun of blacks or Latinos, much as they'd like to, and they're simply not happy unless they're allowed to feel superior to some despised group or another. Bad enough there's a black president, the repubs now have to pander to the help if they want to win elections. In fact, the modern conservative is going through a severe case of contempt withdrawal. Will nobody think of the racists?

Fluorescent Testicle: It's a farkin' samsquanch!

Bubbles rules!

He gets to live when the Sasquatchs ride up and take over this silly country.

/Someone is gonna hafta take care of all the kitties.

AverageAmericanGuy: Philip Francis Queeg: AverageAmericanGuy: heavymetal: So it is in many ways the voters' fault.  Rather than holding their legislators acountable they allow themselve's to get "sucked in" to these political games and become pawns rather than participants in the political process.  But Hell, that is almost the whole farking country nowadays.  No wonder wh can't have nioce things.  Sigh................................

Yes. No. It's impossible to pin the blame on any one party here. Whether it be the voters or the Democrats or the Republicans. The voters can only vote for those who they are presented with. They are only ever presented with a rosy picture of the candidates, and many with their hands in the pie aren't going to vote against their own interests.

It's a cultural thing. The people feel very disconnected with the government, seeing it as this monstrous 'other' that either helps pay the bills or is a heavy handed good squad. Tie that with a two party system that guarantees that independent voices are drowned out, and you've built a system that doesn't promote engagement with local government. Not many people are going to get involved if it looks like a waste of time. Only the very vain and the very driven put themselves up for candidacy.

It's not solvable. And that's fine with me, if the local government isn't a bunch of busybodies looking to wield their power at the expense of the locals, which is what I see the mascot ban as.


And what of the Native American "locals"? Should they be ignored?

They have recourse with the courts.

On what basis? You've said that the government should stay out of this.