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(WXYZ Detroit)   Not your child? Fark you, pay ongoing support anyways. Child's an adult? Fark you, pay ongoing support anyways. Child's been dead for 20 years? Fark you, pay ongoing support anyways   (wxyz.com) divider line 259
    More: Obvious, child support, Action News  
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17722 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Feb 2013 at 7:48 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-16 08:06:06 PM  

cman: If its your sperm and if you dont help with money, then you are an asshole of epic proportions. You are the scummiest of the scum. You make Osama bin Laden look like Santa Claus. However, if it is not your child or the child is long dead, then why should you be punished for actions you had no part in?


I'll help cover the cost of the abortion.  If you want to keep the whelp, you pay for the rest.  I did my share.
 
2013-02-16 08:07:17 PM  
Michael's mother declined to comment on the story.

No doubt.

Arbitrary, malicious and mathematically challenged is no way to go through life, FoC.
 
2013-02-16 08:08:49 PM  

Flint Ironstag: GAT_00: antidisestablishmentarianism: GAT_00: Oh look, supposed personal experience used to condemn the system as a whole.

I got a bit off topic but the main problem is that a father is a father after conception whether he want's to be or not. After conception a mother has the choice to abort the baby or give it up for adoption.

Which is in fact still completely off topic.

To make the situation fair when a woman finds she is pregnant the father should have equal say. If he does not want to be a father but she wants to keep the child then he doesn't have to pay any support ever. The woman has a choice, keep the child and pay the bills or give the child up. If the father agrees to keep the child and they later split up he has to pay.


Yeah, because that would never be abused or anything by every ahole out there who wants to fark every woman he sees without consequences.

I'd be willing to say it should be an available option for men, but just once. After that it's either a mandatory vasectomy or if it happens again you're paying for the first kid, including back child support, along with the second kid.
 
2013-02-16 08:09:18 PM  

antidisestablishmentarianism: I got a bit off topic but the main problem is that a father is a father after conception whether he want's to be or not. After conception a mother has the choice to abort the baby or give it up for adoption.


Meh, I think that's still a fair trade off versus the whole "dying in childbirth" thingy.

/You play, you pay.
 
2013-02-16 08:10:00 PM  

DarkSoulNoHope: I goofed, wrong thread :)


I love how most mis-posts seem to work regardless of what thread they are meant for.
 
2013-02-16 08:11:50 PM  

antidisestablishmentarianism: The whole child support system needs an overhaul, it's a broken system that makes the child's father a victim to the whims of the mother.


Not always true.  My father got custody of me and my two sisters way back in 1981 and was supposed to receive child support from our mother.  She rarely paid.
 
2013-02-16 08:12:09 PM  

gibbon1: slayer199: I should say my EX was frustrated with no receiving her FoC Child Support payments on time. When we ended the FoC I paid her direct deposit until I received custody.

I'm pretty sure that FoC's are ripe for embezzlement. Sounds like the FoC in the FA needs to be audited top to bottom. If they can't get their numbers straight someones been stealing.


Friends of Carlotta?
 
2013-02-16 08:12:39 PM  
See?

This is why you only knock up women in the western hemisphere.

/I like to think there is a little half-asian MurphyMurphy skipping down a beach somewhere dancing with the Tide
//"Little MurphyMurphy" his mother would say "It's time to get dressed and go to the sneaker factory!"
 
2013-02-16 08:14:16 PM  

TommyymmoT: Why wasn't the mother arrested for fraud?


that's messed up
 
2013-02-16 08:16:17 PM  

FizixJunkee: antidisestablishmentarianism: The whole child support system needs an overhaul, it's a broken system that makes the child's father a victim to the whims of the mother.

Not always true.  My father got custody of me and my two sisters way back in 1981 and was supposed to receive child support from our mother.  She rarely paid.


I hate to quote Fox News, but mothers are less likely to pay than fathers who are ordered to pay child support (57% pay vs 68%).

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,5 9963,00.html
 
2013-02-16 08:18:38 PM  

number8: Flint Ironstag: GAT_00: antidisestablishmentarianism: GAT_00: Oh look, supposed personal experience used to condemn the system as a whole.

I got a bit off topic but the main problem is that a father is a father after conception whether he want's to be or not. After conception a mother has the choice to abort the baby or give it up for adoption.

Which is in fact still completely off topic.

To make the situation fair when a woman finds she is pregnant the father should have equal say. If he does not want to be a father but she wants to keep the child then he doesn't have to pay any support ever. The woman has a choice, keep the child and pay the bills or give the child up. If the father agrees to keep the child and they later split up he has to pay.

Yeah, because that would never be abused or anything by every ahole out there who wants to fark every woman he sees without consequences.

I'd be willing to say it should be an available option for men, but just once. After that it's either a mandatory vasectomy or if it happens again you're paying for the first kid, including back child support, along with the second kid.


What about every woman who wants to fark men because they know exactly what the consequence will be?And that it will benefit her big time if she chooses?  It takes two to have sex, and two who can take care of contraception. But from the moment of contraception the woman has all the cards and can hold the man to eighteen years of payment while the man has no say whatsoever.

It takes two to have sex. Shouldn't it take two to make the decision of what happens if babby is formed? Why does only one person get to decide? And can make a decision that legally obliges the other to years of payout.

/Hasn't happened to me, so not bitter or biased.
//Just seems logical and fair.
///Contraceptive pill for guys is going to change things.
 
2013-02-16 08:18:41 PM  

Donnchadha: doyner: Donnchadha: GAT_00: Taking child support for a dead child isn't fraud?

Court ordered payments are legal because the court orders them. If the court says she's entitled to the child support, then she's entitled to it, whether or not the child that is supporting is 3, 12, 18, 34 or dead.

It's only fraud on her part if she initiated seeking child support for a child who didn't exist at that time.

[citation needed]

Trust me. I'm from The Internet.


Uh, Bonjour.
 
2013-02-16 08:20:04 PM  

ramblinwreck: FizixJunkee: antidisestablishmentarianism: The whole child support system needs an overhaul, it's a broken system that makes the child's father a victim to the whims of the mother.

Not always true.  My father got custody of me and my two sisters way back in 1981 and was supposed to receive child support from our mother.  She rarely paid.

I hate to quote Fox News, but mothers are less likely to pay than fathers who are ordered to pay child support (57% pay vs 68%).

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,5 9963,00.html


It was also the 1980s and the consequences of not paying weren't what they are now.
 
2013-02-16 08:20:11 PM  

FizixJunkee: antidisestablishmentarianism: The whole child support system needs an overhaul, it's a broken system that makes the child's father a victim to the whims of the mother.

Not always true.  My father got custody of me and my two sisters way back in 1981 and was supposed to receive child support from our mother.  She rarely paid.


The trouble is that that's incredibly rare- on the books I think it's supposed to be the most suitable parent, but in practice, it's always the mother, even if she's constantly drunk, can't hold a job, and regularly goes outside at 2AM to yell at fire hydrants at the top of her voice. The legal system simply stereotypes fathers as being the breadwinners, but completely clueless in raising children, while the mother is stereotyped as being wonderful at raising children but incapable of earning an income. If you get rid of those stigmas and weigh the parents equally as potential custodians rather than presuming that they should go to the mother and forcing any father who wants to raise his kids to basically prove the women should be institutionalized in order to get custody, you'll solve the vast majority of the issues in our child support system.
 
2013-02-16 08:21:25 PM  

dahmers love zombie: gibbon1: slayer199: I should say my EX was frustrated with no receiving her FoC Child Support payments on time. When we ended the FoC I paid her direct deposit until I received custody.

I'm pretty sure that FoC's are ripe for embezzlement. Sounds like the FoC in the FA needs to be audited top to bottom. If they can't get their numbers straight someones been stealing.

Friends of Carlotta?


"Foc. It's when a man loves a woman. He puts his--"
"No, F.O.C."
 
2013-02-16 08:22:02 PM  

TommyymmoT: kronicfeld: TommyymmoT: Why wasn't the mother arrested for fraud?

Scanning article.

Evidence of fraud not found.

The wife wasn't receiving those payments all that time, knowing that the kid didn't exist?
I noticed she refused comment.


She might be as stupid as the father - assuming the payments for the one son were the same as two.
 
2013-02-16 08:23:31 PM  

Flint Ironstag: eighteen years of payment


haha, try 23
 
2013-02-16 08:23:35 PM  

FizixJunkee: Not always true.  My father got custody of me and my two sisters way back in 1981 and was supposed to receive child support from our mother.  She rarely paid.


This is the problem I have right now. The mother thinks she shouldn't have to pay because she chooses not to be a part of his life except for every other weekend.

quatchi: Meh, I think that's still a fair trade off versus the whole "dying in childbirth" thingy.

/You play, you pay.


I've paid, but only because I was told 'You don't need a condom, I'm on birth control'. I was dumb to believe it. Had mommy died in childbirth my son would be better off. The only reason she spends the minimal amount of time with him is because if she didn't it would look bad to her family.
 
2013-02-16 08:24:20 PM  

TommyymmoT: Why wasn't the mother arrested for fraud?




/It's free money. She's going to keep milking him for the dead kid for as long as she can squeeze another penny out of this guy's moob. Why would she say anything? She will just keep farking the dad over, as long as she keeps getting paid. Like they say, the farking you get isn't worth the farking you get.
 
2013-02-16 08:25:50 PM  

antidisestablishmentarianism: The whole child support system needs an overhaul, it's a broken system that makes the child's father a victim to the whims of the mother.

Remember a few years back the guy from Michigan who fought against paying support for the kid he never wanted? I bet he lost because the girl wanted her meal ticket. (Is it fair that a woman has a choice about abortion and the guy doesn't? What about adoption?)


Once the kid is born family courts don't give a crap about fairness. All they care about is what's best for the child.

If you don't want to pay child support, don't sleep with women you can't trust and/or take some responsibility for birth control.
 
2013-02-16 08:26:14 PM  
I know a guy who's ex pushed him into moving down here to Indiana just because the custody laws were more favorable to women, then dumped him a month later. She's now trying to baby lasso a third husband after divorcing the guy she left him for. He pays out the ass for his son, barely making ends meet, while she drives a Lexus and goes shopping.
 
2013-02-16 08:27:48 PM  

cman: If its your sperm and if you dont help with money, then you are an asshole of epic proportions. You are the scummiest of the scum. You make Osama bin Laden look like Santa Claus. However, if it is not your child or the child is long dead, then why should you be punished for actions you had no part in?


/Because you're a male, and someone has to pay. There has been many cases where the guy has proven, without a doubt, that it's not his biological kid.  But the courts tell him he has to pay anyway, because the kid would suffer without the financial assistance.  Nice huh?  They don't even bother going after the real father, why should they? They have this poor sap to milk.
 
2013-02-16 08:29:51 PM  

cptjeff: If you get rid of those stigmas and weigh the parents equally as potential custodians rather than presuming that they should go to the mother and forcing any father who wants to raise his kids to basically prove the women should be institutionalized in order to get custody, you'll solve the vast majority of the issues in our child support system.


Yup. Mom doesn't do shiat, can't hold a job or a stable living environment. The state doesn't care about that. They will only intervene if she has a drug or alcohol problem or is physically abusive to the kid. Developmental neglect or just simply being a bad example/influence just isn't a factor with the state when making a placement decision. The default thought is what is good for the kid is equal placement with both parents no matter what.
 
2013-02-16 08:30:14 PM  

Flint Ironstag: GAT_00: antidisestablishmentarianism: GAT_00: Oh look, supposed personal experience used to condemn the system as a whole.

I got a bit off topic but the main problem is that a father is a father after conception whether he want's to be or not. After conception a mother has the choice to abort the baby or give it up for adoption.

Which is in fact still completely off topic.

To make the situation fair when a woman finds she is pregnant the father should have equal say. If he does not want to be a father but she wants to keep the child then he doesn't have to pay any support ever. The woman has a choice, keep the child and pay the bills or give the child up. If the father agrees to keep the child and they later split up he has to pay.


Your view of "the situation" is limited to the parents.  The child and society have interests in fairness, too.
 
2013-02-16 08:31:55 PM  

Skirl Hutsenreiter: All they care about is what's best for the child.


Except that the system winds up perverting that to an insane degree. It's sure as hell not unheard of for Mommy to become an unemployed addict who thinks she'll never have to do honest work in her life because she tricked an NFL player into knocking her up, and the kid then has to live in semi-poverty with her using child support money for herself, despite daddy, who has some decently invested money and a stable job after retiring from sports wanting to take care of the kid himself.

Our system tends to define "best interests of the child" as "staying with mamma regardless of how good a parent she is". Which is a problem.
 
2013-02-16 08:32:04 PM  

antidisestablishmentarianism: I've paid, but only because I was told 'You don't need a condom, I'm on birth control'. I was dumb to believe it. Had mommy died in childbirth my son would be better off. The only reason she spends the minimal amount of time with him is because if she didn't it would look bad to her family.


Cruel story, Bro.

Seriously, that must suck.
 
2013-02-16 08:36:31 PM  
My ex has me on garnishment even though I've always paid on time to 'guarantee' I pay. Once or twice a year CPS 'forgets' to do the transfer so I get an angry call from the ex and then have to deal with the morons at CPS.

At least I've gotten my payments down to a sane level. Early on in the process my child support payments were more than my net income.
 
2013-02-16 08:37:39 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: /Because you're a male, and someone has to pay. There has been many cases where the guy has proven, without a doubt, that it's not his biological kid. But the courts tell him he has to pay anyway, because the kid would suffer without the financial assistance. Nice huh? They don't even bother going after the real father, why should they? They have this poor sap to milk.


You'd think there would be a DNA database of unknown fathers.
 
2013-02-16 08:38:26 PM  

libranoelrose: Flint Ironstag: eighteen years of payment

haha, try 23


26, once we include healthcare premiums.
 
2013-02-16 08:38:36 PM  
I'm glad I received full custody of my daughter when we split up, and I'm glad I didn't pursue child support.
biatch chose not to see her daughter from age 5 to age 14.  I never said a bad word to my daughter about her.  She was smart enough to figure it out herself.
 
2013-02-16 08:39:50 PM  

Skirl Hutsenreiter: All they care about is what's best for the child.


That is seriously debatable. Family courts could a squirt of piss what's best for the child.

Skirl Hutsenreiter: If you don't want to pay child support, don't sleep with women you can't trust and/or take some responsibility for birth control.


A hard message to get across to a young guy who has been drinking that is told he doesn't have to worry about not having a condom because she is on birth control.
 
2013-02-16 08:39:54 PM  

FizixJunkee: ramblinwreck: FizixJunkee: antidisestablishmentarianism: The whole child support system needs an overhaul, it's a broken system that makes the child's father a victim to the whims of the mother.

Not always true.  My father got custody of me and my two sisters way back in 1981 and was supposed to receive child support from our mother.  She rarely paid.

I hate to quote Fox News, but mothers are less likely to pay than fathers who are ordered to pay child support (57% pay vs 68%).

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,5 9963,00.html

It was also the 1980s and the consequences of not paying weren't what they are now.


My only point was women are less likely to pay, regardless of the consequences. Sorry you had a deadbeat mother.
 
2013-02-16 08:40:34 PM  

antidisestablishmentarianism: This is the problem I have right now. The mother thinks she shouldn't have to pay because she chooses not to be a part of his life except for every other weekend.


What's the court say about that?
 
2013-02-16 08:42:28 PM  
Only date nice people.
 
2013-02-16 08:44:46 PM  
I moved to a small town college, and my dorm roomate warned me directly:

"You look like you're from the big city.  The girls in this town are going to see you as their one shot at escaping this place. They will stop at nothing to get you to impregnate them.  They'll lie that they're on the pill, they'll poke a hole in the condom, they will do whatever it takes.  Don't trust anything they tell you"

The friend was cool, he'd had to fend off these succubi for years and felt the need to warn me away from disaster.
 
2013-02-16 08:44:53 PM  

clear_prop: My ex has me on garnishment even though I've always paid on time to 'guarantee' I pay. Once or twice a year CPS 'forgets' to do the transfer so I get an angry call from the ex and then have to deal with the morons at CPS.

At least I've gotten my payments down to a sane level. Early on in the process my child support payments were more than my net income.


Sounds like the "down to the minute" monthly transfer crazy awareness applies to this one. (See previous posts)

How is that even possible for the court to order more than net income? Did you have some shiatty lawyer or was the court that bat shiat insane?
 
2013-02-16 08:45:06 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: What's the court say about that?


The court says the less time you spend with your child the more you pay. It isn't worth my lawyers fees to adjust payments for someone who is unemployed and technically homeless. But that goes back to the whole states 'equal time' bologna.
 
2013-02-16 08:46:22 PM  

YouPeopleAreCrazy: libranoelrose: Flint Ironstag: eighteen years of payment

haha, try 23

26, once we include healthcare premiums.


I'd gladly keep him covered his entire life. The issue I have is paying his mother's lawyers fees so that she can continuously sue me for more money year after year. He doesn't see a dime of it while he is going to school full time, and working a part time job at the age of 20.
 
2013-02-16 08:46:34 PM  

studebaker hoch: I moved to a small town college, and my dorm roomate warned me directly:

"You look like you're from the big city.  The girls in this town are going to see you as their one shot at escaping this place. They will stop at nothing to get you to impregnate them.  They'll lie that they're on the pill, they'll poke a hole in the condom, they will do whatever it takes.  Don't trust anything they tell you"

The friend was cool, he'd had to fend off these succubi for years and felt the need to warn me away from disaster.


Any CSBs regarding his advice?
 
2013-02-16 08:50:09 PM  

libranoelrose: YouPeopleAreCrazy: libranoelrose: Flint Ironstag: eighteen years of payment

haha, try 23

26, once we include healthcare premiums.

I'd gladly keep him covered his entire life. The issue I have is paying his mother's lawyers fees so that she can continuously sue me for more money year after year. He doesn't see a dime of it while he is going to school full time, and working a part time job at the age of 20.


Makes sense. Her number one concern is keeping you down instead of elevating her son (who happens to be little you, who she probably despises).
 
2013-02-16 08:50:43 PM  

libranoelrose: I'd gladly keep him covered his entire life. The issue I have is paying his mother's lawyers fees so that she can continuously sue me for more money year after year. He doesn't see a dime of it while he is going to school full time, and working a part time job at the age of 20.


Right. I was just making comment on what counts as 'child' nowadays.
 
2013-02-16 08:52:42 PM  
This is why no one should ever have children.
 
2013-02-16 08:54:28 PM  

GAT_00: antidisestablishmentarianism: GAT_00: There we go.  Everyone on child support is lazy, they just want a handout.

Not everyone. I receive it and don't even really need it, the money is going to pay for college for the kid. I would be happy if mommy went away and left us alone. She only had the child to collect free money from whoever the daddy was going to be. I was a week late with my payment and I got a phone call about how terrible a person I was because I was robbing the child of meals and clothing because she couldn't be bothered to find a job of any kind to support herself and the child. She wasn't saving it for the kids college fund, she was spending it on whatever she wanted to.

Oh look, supposed personal experience used to condemn the system as a whole.


The system should be condemned.
 
2013-02-16 08:55:36 PM  

ramblinwreck: Makes sense. Her number one concern is keeping you down instead of elevating her son (who happens to be little you, who she probably despises).


She lied to the state about me being 2 years behind after her second husband left her. I won the appeal by simply showing the court the cashed checks she had received, yet they continue to fight for that money that was already paid. She actually had the gall to tell the mediator that the money I was sending her was not child support.

YouPeopleAreCrazy: Right. I was just making comment on what counts as 'child' nowadays.


Yeah, this is a farked up time to not be a custodial parent.
 
2013-02-16 08:55:58 PM  

YouPeopleAreCrazy: libranoelrose: Flint Ironstag: eighteen years of payment

haha, try 23

26, once we include healthcare premiums.


Which is farked up. You become an adult when you're 18.  No parent should be mandated to pay support for an able-bodied, reasonably intelligent adult.

If the parents hadn't separated or divorced, they wouldn't be required to pay college tuition, for example.  Why must divorced parents have to pay?
 
2013-02-16 08:56:30 PM  

GAT_00: antidisestablishmentarianism: GAT_00: Oh look, supposed personal experience used to condemn the system as a whole.

I got a bit off topic but the main problem is that a father is a father after conception whether he want's to be or not. After conception a mother has the choice to abort the baby or give it up for adoption.

Which is in fact still completely off topic.


Topics can expand and diverge if they want. Whiner.
 
2013-02-16 08:59:20 PM  

libranoelrose: ramblinwreck: Makes sense. Her number one concern is keeping you down instead of elevating her son (who happens to be little you, who she probably despises).

She lied to the state about me being 2 years behind after her second husband left her. I won the appeal by simply showing the court the cashed checks she had received, yet they continue to fight for that money that was already paid. She actually had the gall to tell the mediator that the money I was sending her was not child support.

YouPeopleAreCrazy: Right. I was just making comment on what counts as 'child' nowadays.

Yeah, this is a farked up time to not be a custodial parent.


Jeebus, that's farked up. She probably GENUINELY thinks she's entitled to it, too. Why? Because female reasons.
 
2013-02-16 09:00:00 PM  

antidisestablishmentarianism: BarkingUnicorn: What's the court say about that?

The court says the less time you spend with your child the more you pay. It isn't worth my lawyers fees to adjust payments for someone who is unemployed and technically homeless. But that goes back to the whole states 'equal time' bologna.


Well, yeah, if she's chronically unemployed then her payment would be some minimum set by State law.  No sense in you paying to get it adjusted if it can only go down.  She does have to pay it, but few CSE units will get serious about arrearages before they hit $5K.

One of these days, it will be worth going after mom.  Probably when the child needs it most.  Keep good records, be patient and vigilant.  Try not to lose track of mom.
 
2013-02-16 09:03:04 PM  
"We kept doing "audits" and lowering the amount, each time, but he ain't going for it."

"Sh*t.  Well, we got to get SOMETHING out of this motherf*cker.  I mean, he has testicles, so he gots to pay."

"Damn straight.  I got an over due Verizon bill and I need a night out.  I mean, it's not like we have to give it the mother."

"Next time he's here, just tell him to put whatever is in his wallet on your desk, and write him a receipt on a napkin."
 
2013-02-16 09:03:25 PM  

Jesda: GAT_00: antidisestablishmentarianism: GAT_00: Oh look, supposed personal experience used to condemn the system as a whole.

I got a bit off topic but the main problem is that a father is a father after conception whether he want's to be or not. After conception a mother has the choice to abort the baby or give it up for adoption.

Which is in fact still completely off topic.

Topics can expand and diverge if they want. Whiner.


Exactly. Not to call GAT_00 out but I know he is pro choice for women. In an endlessly gray area like this how can you not be pro-choice for men too?

Having to take responsibility for a child changed my life, it's hard to wonder what would have happened if I had the choice not to be forced to take responsibility for a child I wasn't ready for and didn't want to raise with that person.
 
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