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(Washington Post)   State care pools to cover expensive, pre-existing conditions are running out of money. See? Obamacare is not working. Whaddya mean Obamacare hasn't even started yet? Well, it's just proof it's a failure   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 160
    More: Obvious, obamacare, pre-existing condition  
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1401 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Feb 2013 at 3:13 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-16 11:09:26 AM
This part of the program has started

It is already a failure unless you are one of the "lucky" first 100,000 to sign up
 
2013-02-16 11:52:02 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: This part of the program has started


Yeah, I'd be a little miffed if I wasn't lucky enough to get signed up already.  Moot point for me since I get insurance through my employer.

Looks like people only have to wait for 2014, though, at which point the economics that made this program a failure will be cast across the entire health care industry, thus making it a success according to liberal math.
 
2013-02-16 12:32:20 PM
Wow....Stunned, just stunned that government run health care is already a financial drain and ruin.  stunned!


Oh  all you need is more money, well that will fix everything.
 
2013-02-16 01:54:38 PM
Program lasted about 2.5 years before it ran out of money.  That is a huge success for 0bama.

Pelosi was right, we needed to pass the bill before we figured out what was in it...or whether they got anything right.
 
2013-02-16 01:56:49 PM

chiett: Wow....Stunned, just stunned that government run health care is already a financial drain and ruin.  stunned!
Oh  all you need is more money, well that will fix everything.


are you as dumb as your posting implies, immoral, heartless or just a troll?
or are you ok with these people dying because they can NEVER get insurance?
or are you ok with these people going to the ER daily to get treated and then everyone else having to pay anyway?

/It would have been much easier to just let all of these people into the medicare/medicaid system.
 
2013-02-16 02:01:55 PM
Funny what happens when wages are stagnant for 30 years. If wages spent the last 30 years growing like they did the previous 30 there'd be lots of money for stuff like this. But let's not ever try to put some pressure on the relevant people to get wages growing again, after all, they do no wrong. Well according to some people they do no wrong.
 
2013-02-16 02:02:31 PM

namatad: are you as dumb as your posting implies, immoral, heartless or just a troll?


yes
 
2013-02-16 02:05:19 PM

namatad: or are you ok with these people dying because they can NEVER get insurance?


It's their own fault for not being rich.
 
2013-02-16 02:05:22 PM

namatad: or are you ok with these people dying because they can NEVER get insurance?


but you okay with all the other people who can't sign up for the program DYING because 0bama failed?

That is what you are supporting?  Sad.
 
2013-02-16 02:07:05 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: but you okay with all the other people who can't sign up for the program DYING because 0bama failed?


so what brilliant plan do you have to help people who can't get insurance?
 
2013-02-16 02:08:22 PM

WhyteRaven74: Funny what happens when wages are stagnant for 30 years. If wages spent the last 30 years growing like they did the previous 30 there'd be lots of money for stuff like this. But let's not ever try to put some pressure on the relevant people to get wages growing again, after all, they do no wrong. Well according to some people they do no wrong.


who are those "relevant people" and what exactly do you want them to do?

0bama blamed ATMs and airline ticketing machines, should he outlaw those?
 
2013-02-16 02:11:59 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: but you okay with all the other people who can't sign up for the program DYING because 0bama failed?

That is what you are supporting? Sad.


FTFA: From the start, analysts questioned whether the $5 billion that Congress appropriated for the Pre-Existing Condition Insurance Plan - as the program is called - was sufficient.

I blame Congress for underfunding this bridge to Obamacare.

namatad: /It would have been much easier to just let all of these people into the medicare/medicaid system.


Yes.
 
2013-02-16 02:15:28 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: who are those "relevant people" and what exactly do you want them to do?


CEO's and others in charge of large employers.
 
2013-02-16 02:21:36 PM

WhyteRaven74: Funny what happens when wages are stagnant for 30 years. If wages spent the last 30 years growing like they did the previous 30 there'd be lots of money for stuff like this. But let's not ever try to put some pressure on the relevant people to get wages growing again, after all, they do no wrong. Well according to some people they do no wrong.


HEY! You forgot to say Amen when speaking about The Job Creators, (blessings of confederate jesus be upon them). I'll let you off with a warning this time, but watch it, buddy.
 
2013-02-16 02:22:37 PM

WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: who are those "relevant people" and what exactly do you want them to do?

CEO's and others in charge of large employers.


what exactly do you want them to do?

People whine about paying more for lettuce by paying Americans to do farming instead of the slave-labor prices of illegal immigrants.  How are you going to survive the whining when all prices go up.
 
2013-02-16 02:23:28 PM
The taxes have started.
 
2013-02-16 02:27:40 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: People whine about paying more for lettuce by paying Americans to do farming instead of the slave-labor prices of illegal immigrants.


Paying people $15/hr to pick lettuce would raise the price of a head of lettuce about 5 cents. Granted even at $15/hr you might have a hard time finding people to do it.  Also corporate profits are the highest they've ever been, there's plenty of money to pay people more without raising prices.
 
2013-02-16 02:28:59 PM

WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: who are those "relevant people" and what exactly do you want them to do?

CEO's and others in charge of large employers.


btw, what is a large employer?

99.6% of private employers in the US have less that 500 employees.
What do you want all of them to do?
 
2013-02-16 02:32:01 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: What do you want all of them to do?


Do what's right for the economy. Which ironically is also what's right for their business long term. And also I'd love a cite for the 99.6% stat.
 
2013-02-16 02:34:01 PM

WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: People whine about paying more for lettuce by paying Americans to do farming instead of the slave-labor prices of illegal immigrants.

Paying people $15/hr to pick lettuce would raise the price of a head of lettuce about 5 cents. Granted even at $15/hr you might have a hard time finding people to do it.  Also corporate profits are the highest they've ever been, there's plenty of money to pay people more without raising prices.



Oh look, you think that a decline in profit won't affect a companies stock price.  How naive.

Don't you care about all the teacher pensions, 401ks, mutual funds that would be hurt with a decline in company's stock price?
 
2013-02-16 02:45:14 PM
No biggie.  I'm sure the Free MarketTM will ride in on a white horse and take care of those people not covered.
 
2013-02-16 02:45:26 PM
Many people who are uninsured go untreated, exacerbating their medical problems. When they finally do get coverage through a high-risk pool, they are in immediate need of expensive care.

Therefore, had health reform passed sooner, we wouldn't be running out of money. The first few years of Obamacare will be very expensive indeed, but will ultimately lead to a reduction in health care costs because there will be no such thing as the uninsured. Healthcare will become proactive and small problems can be addressed before they become full-blown emergencies and chronic conditions.
 
2013-02-16 02:50:50 PM

WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: What do you want all of them to do?

Do what's right for the economy. Which ironically is also what's right for their business long term. And also I'd love a cite for the 99.6% stat.


You still haven't said what you want them to do.

Aren't you happy with the stock market doing well, the mutual funds and the 401ks and the pension funds for teachers and firefighters?  Do you want that to all go away by having profits decline?  Is that what you want.


99.6% stat
 
2013-02-16 02:52:30 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: What do you want all of them to do?

Do what's right for the economy. Which ironically is also what's right for their business long term. And also I'd love a cite for the 99.6% stat.

You still haven't said what you want them to do.

Aren't you happy with the stock market doing well, the mutual funds and the 401ks and the pension funds for teachers and firefighters?  Do you want that to all go away by having profits decline?  Is that what you want.


99.6% stat


fark didn't let me do the link
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405297020391430457663097384047 8 808.html

Maybe you can find by googling:

"The first question: How small is small? The SBA's Office of Advocacy, which produces the statistics, counts small businesses as those with fewer than 500 employees, which covers far more than garage tech start-ups and mom-and-pop stores. By that definition, 99.6% of the nation's 4.8 million private employers that have been monitored for job creation by the Bureau of Labor Statistics for nearly a decade are small businesses. "
 
2013-02-16 02:52:50 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Oh look, you think that a decline in profit won't affect a companies stock price.  How naive.

Don't you care about all the teacher pensions, 401ks, mutual funds that would be hurt with a decline in company's stock price?


Raising wages won't necessarily cause a decline in profits. People in the lower income brackets tend to spend their money instead of saving or investing, and increased spending boosts profits.

I'd be happy to pay a little more for consumer goods if it means employees are provided with health insurance. It's not only humane, but in the long run it will be economically advantageous.
 
2013-02-16 02:55:43 PM

CruiserTwelve: It's not only humane, but in the long run it will be economically advantageous.


Long run?  Any MBA will tell you tomorrow doesn't exist.
 
2013-02-16 03:09:41 PM

WhyteRaven74: Funny what happens when wages are stagnant for 30 years. If wages spent the last 30 years growing like they did the previous 30 there'd be lots of money for stuff like this. But let's not ever try to put some pressure on the relevant people to get wages growing again, after all, they do no wrong. Well according to some people they do no wrong.


This also plays a significant part in the Social Security funding shortfall. When Congress and St. Ronald fixed the Social Security trust fund in the '80's, assumptions were made about future middle class wage increases that did not happen. Lower compensation meant fewer dollars have been paid into the trust fund over the last 30 years.

Many of the problems facing the US economy are a direct or indirect result of income inequality, which is already at third world levels. Worse yet, neither party has the political will to begin to address it because most politicians are owned by the people who benefit from the current system.
 
2013-02-16 03:20:04 PM

CruiserTwelve: tenpoundsofcheese: Oh look, you think that a decline in profit won't affect a companies stock price.  How naive.

Don't you care about all the teacher pensions, 401ks, mutual funds that would be hurt with a decline in company's stock price?

Raising wages won't necessarily cause a decline in profits. People in the lower income brackets tend to spend their money instead of saving or investing, and increased spending boosts profits.

I'd be happy to pay a little more for consumer goods if it means employees are provided with health insurance. It's not only humane, but in the long run it will be economically advantageous.


It's one of the reasons that people institute governments to uphold laws, promote general welfare, ensure domestic tranquility - the kind of stuff a lot of those guys with the funny three-pointed hats talked about. ;-)

No, not the ones on Fox News with an AR-15, the ones who lived in the 1770's and 80's...
 
2013-02-16 03:20:45 PM

Mitt Romneys Tax Return: When Congress and St. Ronald fixed the Social Security trust fund in the '80's, assumptions were made about future middle class wage increases that did not happen.


i45.tinypic.com
 
2013-02-16 03:22:33 PM
So has the Obamacare critics come up with a solution to the "can't get insurance due to a pre-existing condition crowd"?

Or are we going to continue to make cute and witty talking points without talking about the context of the article?
 
2013-02-16 03:24:55 PM

Lsherm: tenpoundsofcheese: This part of the program has started

Yeah, I'd be a little miffed if I wasn't lucky enough to get signed up already.  Moot point for me since I get insurance through my employer.

Looks like people only have to wait for 2014, though, at which point the economics that made this program a failure will be cast across the entire health care industry, thus making it a success according to liberal math.


chiett: Wow....Stunned, just stunned that government run health care is already a financial drain and ruin.  stunned!


Oh  all you need is more money, well that will fix everything.


tenpoundsofcheese: Program lasted about 2.5 years before it ran out of money.  That is a huge success for 0bama.

Pelosi was right, we needed to pass the bill before we figured out what was in it...or whether they got anything right.


So I'm open to suggestions.

How do you suggest we remedy the "pre-existing condition" problem?

Or should these people just die already?
 
2013-02-16 03:25:04 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: who are those "relevant people" and what exactly do you want them to do?

CEO's and others in charge of large employers.

what exactly do you want them to do?

People whine about paying more for lettuce by paying Americans to do farming instead of the slave-labor prices of illegal immigrants.  How are you going to survive the whining when all prices go up.


Tax breaks for companies that raise their employees' paychecks would help. A $2 head of lettuce is only expensive if you're making $4 an hour (THIS IS AN EXAMPLE).
 
2013-02-16 03:25:38 PM

CruiserTwelve: tenpoundsofcheese: Oh look, you think that a decline in profit won't affect a companies stock price.  How naive.

Don't you care about all the teacher pensions, 401ks, mutual funds that would be hurt with a decline in company's stock price?

Raising wages won't necessarily cause a decline in profits. People in the lower income brackets tend to spend their money instead of saving or investing, and increased spending boosts profits.

I'd be happy to pay a little more for consumer goods if it means employees are provided with health insurance. It's not only humane, but in the long run it will be economically advantageous.


Looks like you don't know what happened last time the minimum wage went up.
 
2013-02-16 03:25:47 PM

Lsherm: Looks like people only have to wait for 2014, though, at which point the economics that made this program a failure will be cast across the entire health care industry, thus making it a success according to liberal math.


So you prefer the Republican health care plan? "Buy your own expensive overpriced insurance, and if you can't, we'd prefer you'd just hurry up and die."
 
2013-02-16 03:26:57 PM
Oh, Obamacare has started all right. I just got a letter saying that my insurance premiums are going up 32%.
 
2013-02-16 03:27:34 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: 99.6% of private employers in the US have less that 500 employees.
What do you want all of them to do?


Invest in education.
 
2013-02-16 03:27:50 PM

jigger: Oh, Obamacare has started all right. I just got a letter saying that my insurance premiums are going up 32%.


And that NEVER happened prior to Obamacare did it?
 
2013-02-16 03:28:45 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Program lasted about 2.5 years before it ran out of money. That is a huge success for 0bama.


It was only ever intended to last for 3.5 years and it stopped accepting new applicants after 2.75 (For those existing applicants, it will provide coverage for the entire duration).

It would be nice if it had remained open for new applicants during its last nine months, but the program was certainly better than nothing.
 
2013-02-16 03:29:01 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: WhyteRaven74: tenpoundsofcheese: who are those "relevant people" and what exactly do you want them to do?

CEO's and others in charge of large employers.

btw, what is a large employer?

99.6% of private employers in the US have less that 500 employees.
What do you want all of them to do?


54% of firms have fewer than 500 employees, 36% have fewer than 100 employees. http://www.bls.gov/web/cewbd/table_f.txt  99 or fewer employees constitutes a small business as per the the BoLS. There is no revenue or financial valuation that determines "small" or "large" companies so a plumber is lumped in with a law office.
 
2013-02-16 03:29:20 PM

Mrtraveler01: jigger: Oh, Obamacare has started all right. I just got a letter saying that my insurance premiums are going up 32%.

And that NEVER happened prior to Obamacare did it?


They went up and down sometimes, depending on what plan I had but never a huge jump like that.
 
2013-02-16 03:29:50 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Oh look, you think that a decline in profit won't affect a companies stock price. How naive.


Oh look, you think that a company's stock price is determined by its performance.
 
2013-02-16 03:33:38 PM
Since Obamacare was passed, we've watched the Dow Jones Industrial Average climb to 14,000.  Would some Free Marketeer please explain to me how it is bad for business?  Or is the DJIA something you only point at when it is going down and we have a Democrat in the White House?
 
2013-02-16 03:33:49 PM

ImpendingCynic: Lsherm: Looks like people only have to wait for 2014, though, at which point the economics that made this program a failure will be cast across the entire health care industry, thus making it a success according to liberal math.

So you prefer the Republican health care plan? "Buy your own expensive overpriced insurance, and if you can't, we'd prefer you'd just hurry up and die."


Seems that way to me.

I haven't heard any objections to this.
 
2013-02-16 03:35:24 PM

chiett: Wow....Stunned, just stunned that government run health care is already a financial drain and ruin.  stunned!


The Heritage Foundation must be really butthurt that their idea was a failure.
 
2013-02-16 03:35:48 PM

WhyteRaven74: Funny what happens when wages are stagnant for 30 years. If wages spent the last 30 years growing like they did the previous 30 there'd be lots of money for stuff like this. But let's not ever try to put some pressure on the relevant people to get wages growing again, after all, they do no wrong. Well according to some people they do no wrong.


Whose wages have been stagnant for 30 years. Mine haven't. Unless you plan on being the last boat that floats in the rising tide, a lot of times those gloom and doom charts don't have to apply to you personally.
 
2013-02-16 03:37:09 PM
Well no shiat, you mean to tell me that a program for people who can't get health insurance through the private market because they have conditions that no health insurance company will touch is running out of money?  You think so?
 
2013-02-16 03:37:19 PM

Mrtraveler01: So has the Obamacare critics come up with a solution to the "can't get insurance due to a pre-existing condition crowd"?

Or are we going to continue to make cute and witty talking points without talking about the context of the article?


Check the top of your browser
Look for the address bar

Does it say something like
Www.fark.com...etc?

See that means you are at the fark website. You seem to think that you are at www.publicpolicyseriousdiscussion.com.
 
2013-02-16 03:37:51 PM
Obamacare is a scheme for FUNDING healthcare.

In the event and to the extent it can even be shown to have "failed" (which is highly subjective), that can only serve to show us once and for all that a functioning healthcare sector is perfectly incompatible with the existence of for-profit healthcare providing entities.
 
2013-02-16 03:38:19 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: www.publicpolicyseriousdiscussion.com


Link appears to be broken.
 
2013-02-16 03:39:25 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Mrtraveler01: So has the Obamacare critics come up with a solution to the "can't get insurance due to a pre-existing condition crowd"?

Or are we going to continue to make cute and witty talking points without talking about the context of the article?

Check the top of your browser
Look for the address bar

Does it say something like
Www.fark.com...etc?

See that means you are at the fark website. You seem to think that you are at www.publicpolicyseriousdiscussion.com.


So you don't have any serious suggestions to this problem then?

Good to know.

It's refreshing to confirm my belief that the right-wing has absolutely NOTHING to offer when it comes to this serious issue.

Thanks for confirming my biases there cheesy. :)
 
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