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(Salt Lake Tribune)   Lawyer claims city's high legal bills are due to citizen's group requesting an accounting of the city's legal bills   (sltrib.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, responsible government, public records  
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1122 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Feb 2013 at 9:34 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



20 Comments   (+0 »)
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2013-02-16 08:42:44 AM  
As it turns out, when you ask a lawyer law firm to research something, even when that something is himself itself, hourly fees still get charged when they're actually doing it.
 
2013-02-16 09:12:11 AM  

ib_thinkin: As it turns out, when you ask a lawyer law fiuld rm to research something, even when that something is himself itself, hourly fees still get charged when they're actually doing it.


If a law firm takes more time researching how much it billed than it spent when doing the original work, the lawyers should be taken out and shot.
 
2013-02-16 09:39:45 AM  
Even if everyone Loses, the lawyers always win.
 
2013-02-16 09:52:53 AM  
 
2013-02-16 10:11:27 AM  

Zeb Hesselgresser: http://www.campaignmoney.com/trial_lawyer.asp


The lawyer in the article is about is named Ken Cromar. There is no one named Cromar on that list. I'm pretty sure he isn't a trial lawyer.

Were we supposed to infer something?
 
2013-02-16 10:14:03 AM  
"Do you know why this is a great country? Because anywhere else on Earth we'd line them up and shoot them."
-S. Colbert

/about bankers
//I'm sure it applies to lawyers as well
 
2013-02-16 10:16:25 AM  

Krieghund: Zeb Hesselgresser: http://www.campaignmoney.com/trial_lawyer.asp

The lawyer in the article is about is named Ken Cromar. There is no one named Cromar on that list. I'm pretty sure he isn't a trial lawyer.

Were we supposed to infer something?


Reading comprehension much? Cromar is the former councilman. The lawyer is named Eric Johnson.
 
2013-02-16 10:28:06 AM  

abb3w: ib_thinkin: As it turns out, when you ask a lawyer law fiuld rm to research something, even when that something is himself itself, hourly fees still get charged when they're actually doing it.

If a law firm takes more time researching how much it billed than it spent when doing the original work, the lawyers should be taken out and shot.


Yes.
But their accountant deserves a raise.
 
2013-02-16 12:51:05 PM  
I have worked with many lawyers in my life, and all but one of them ripped me off with their billings.
 
2013-02-16 01:20:22 PM  
City: Hey, your demands are costing us a fortune in legal bills!

Citizens: Really? Let's see those bills.

City: Uh .. ok, here, see?:

i45.tinypic.com
 
2013-02-16 01:43:11 PM  

Krieghund: Zeb Hesselgresser: http://www.campaignmoney.com/trial_lawyer.asp

The lawyer in the article is about is named Ken Cromar. There is no one named Cromar on that list. I'm pretty sure he isn't a trial lawyer.

Were we supposed to infer something?


I think we can infer that your reading comprehension leaves much to be desired. But please, for the good of all farkers, do deign to educate the plebiscites on the actors in this sordid affair. It always cracks me the fark up when people on their high horses try to correct others while being fundamentally wrong.
 
2013-02-16 02:30:07 PM  

ib_thinkin: As it turns out, when you ask a lawyer law firm to research something, even when that something is himself itself, hourly fees still get charged when they're actually doing it.


There's zero reason the city shouldn't have copies of the invoices that were sent to them, and copies of their AP records.  You shouldn't have to go through  the law firm for anything.
 
2013-02-16 02:40:28 PM  

Bender The Offender: Krieghund: Zeb Hesselgresser: http://www.campaignmoney.com/trial_lawyer.asp

The lawyer in the article is about is named Ken Cromar. There is no one named Cromar on that list. I'm pretty sure he isn't a trial lawyer.

Were we supposed to infer something?

I think we can infer that your reading comprehension leaves much to be desired. But please, for the good of all farkers, do deign to educate the plebiscites on the actors in this sordid affair. It always cracks me the fark up when people on their high horses try to correct others while being fundamentally wrong.


While you're being a smug cock by thinking Kreighund is a smug cock.  Let me show you why you are wrong and probably stupid:

- Zeb Hesselgresser is attempting to say that all the problems with Cedar Hills are because libs.  After all, look at how trial lawyers vote.

-  Cedar Hills is a toney suburb of Salt Lake City.  It is extremely conservative, and the county that Cedar Hills is in voted 88% for Romney.  It's not a city full of liberals.

-  Trial lawyers are not all lawyers.  Odds are the firm that represents the city doesn't even litigate.  They research, advise and if the city goes to court, they sub-contract or refer it out to trial attorneys.

- So therefore there is no evidence that this has anything remotely to do with libs other than you two idiots really want it to.

Let me know if I have to dumb it down for you a tad, and I'll rush out for a couple puppets.
 
2013-02-16 02:52:13 PM  

BSABSVR: Bender The Offender: Krieghund: Zeb Hesselgresser: http://www.campaignmoney.com/trial_lawyer.asp

The lawyer in the article is about is named Ken Cromar. There is no one named Cromar on that list. I'm pretty sure he isn't a trial lawyer.

Were we supposed to infer something?

I think we can infer that your reading comprehension leaves much to be desired. But please, for the good of all farkers, do deign to educate the plebiscites on the actors in this sordid affair. It always cracks me the fark up when people on their high horses try to correct others while being fundamentally wrong.

While you're being a smug cock by thinking Kreighund is a smug cock.  Let me show you why you are wrong and probably stupid:

- Zeb Hesselgresser is attempting to say that all the problems with Cedar Hills are because libs.  After all, look at how trial lawyers vote.

-  Cedar Hills is a toney suburb of Salt Lake City.  It is extremely conservative, and the county that Cedar Hills is in voted 88% for Romney.  It's not a city full of liberals.

-  Trial lawyers are not all lawyers.  Odds are the firm that represents the city doesn't even litigate.  They research, advise and if the city goes to court, they sub-contract or refer it out to trial attorneys.

- So therefore there is no evidence that this has anything remotely to do with libs other than you two idiots really want it to.

Let me know if I have to dumb it down for you a tad, and I'll rush out for a couple puppets.


While you're being a smug projecting angry cock, let me point out that my only point was that he was wrong from the begining since the lawyer isn't named Ken Cromar, now keep raging sunflower, It's good to know room is for rent for so cheap inside your head, lol. You created this vast fantasy in your head. Well done/.
 
2013-02-16 04:50:39 PM  

BSABSVR: ib_thinkin: As it turns out, when you ask a lawyer law firm to research something, even when that something is himself itself, hourly fees still get charged when they're actually doing it.

There's zero reason the city shouldn't have copies of the invoices that were sent to them, and copies of their AP records.  You shouldn't have to go through  the law firm for anything.


FTFA: Later the city publicly accused the CHCRG in Cedar Hills attorney Eric Johnson said he has a flat $2,000 monthly rate for providing administrative help to city staff, and bills $150 an hour for additional litigation work. He said his higher than usual annual billing mostly dealt with battling residents at state records committee hearings, which he considers "a form of litigation."

Except that he didn't just request "Hey, give me your invoices," he filed Freedom of Information Act requests. And, depending on the particulars of Utah's FOIA law, he probably wasn't entitled to all of them. Even if all of his FOIA requests have to do with the legal bills (or, rather, especially if all of his FOIA requests have to do with legal bills) it costs time and money to review the documents that need to be released. Seriously, check out your State's FOIA law when you get a chance. In CT, I know there are exceptions related to personal information of state employees, and extra exceptions to certain particular kinds of employees (firefighters, for example).

If he's requesting information on legal proceedings involving a public entity, you bet your bippy that there's going to be quite a bit of information that needs to be sorted through, organized, and redacted to ensure compliance.
 
2013-02-16 08:23:33 PM  
I came for a yo dawg leaving sad.
 
2013-02-17 02:19:46 AM  

ib_thinkin: BSABSVR: ib_thinkin: As it turns out, when you ask a lawyer law firm to research something, even when that something is himself itself, hourly fees still get charged when they're actually doing it.

There's zero reason the city shouldn't have copies of the invoices that were sent to them, and copies of their AP records.  You shouldn't have to go through  the law firm for anything.

FTFA: Later the city publicly accused the CHCRG in Cedar Hills attorney Eric Johnson said he has a flat $2,000 monthly rate for providing administrative help to city staff, and bills $150 an hour for additional litigation work. He said his higher than usual annual billing mostly dealt with battling residents at state records committee hearings, which he considers "a form of litigation."

Except that he didn't just request "Hey, give me your invoices," he filed Freedom of Information Act requests. And, depending on the particulars of Utah's FOIA law, he probably wasn't entitled to all of them. Even if all of his FOIA requests have to do with the legal bills (or, rather, especially if all of his FOIA requests have to do with legal bills) it costs time and money to review the documents that need to be released. Seriously, check out your State's FOIA law when you get a chance. In CT, I know there are exceptions related to personal information of state employees, and extra exceptions to certain particular kinds of employees (firefighters, for example).

If he's requesting information on legal proceedings involving a public entity, you bet your bippy that there's going to be quite a bit of information that needs to be sorted through, organized, and redacted to ensure compliance.


*sigh*

"To check that claim, the group - city's legal billing invoices."

"But on Thursday, the Utah State Records Committee ruled that the city had not violated open records laws by redacting dates, times and names on the invoices. "

Any more points you want to miss, you ignorant shiat?

Bender The Offender: While you're being a smug projecting angry cock, let me point out that my only point was that he was wrong from the begining since the lawyer isn't named Ken Cromar, now keep raging sunflower, It's good to know room is for rent for so cheap inside your head, lol. You created this vast fantasy in your head. Well done/.


Which was not my argument.  Continuing my case:

Any more points you want to miss, you ignorant shiat?
 
2013-02-17 03:33:17 AM  
BSABSVR:

-  Cedar Hills is a toney suburb of Salt Lake City.  It is extremely conservative, and the county that Cedar Hills is in voted 88% for Romney.  It's not a city full of liberals.

Cedar Hills isn't any sort of suburb of SLC, unless by "suburb" you mean "in the same state as".  It is "toney" only in the sense that households with four or five incomes tend to have greater total household incomes than those with only one or two.
 
2013-02-17 11:13:06 AM  

BSABSVR: "But on Thursday, the Utah State Records Committee ruled that the city had not violated open records laws by redacting dates, times and names on the invoices. "

Any more points you want to miss, you ignorant shiat?


What do you think that shows, exactly, you arrogant twat? That there weren't costs involved in research and redaction? What the fark is wrong with you?
 
2013-02-17 11:19:43 AM  
Seriously, watch this one play out.

Lawyer says, "Over the past 1.5 years, you've cost the city $160,000 in legal fees by requesting documents."
Crank says, "Show me the unredacted versions of those invoices that show me those costs!"
Lawyer says, "Hang on, let me check. No."
Committee says on Thursday, February 14, "Lawyer's right."
Crank says, "Wah, the city says it has cost too much money to tell me how much money I've cost the city."

I've worked in the legal office of a state agency and had some cursory experience with the work that goes on around FOIA requests. If you're having outside counsel do that, shiat's expensive. You might want to see a doctor about all that jerking your knee's doing.
 
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