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(CNN)   CNN Money decides to step into the spat between Tesla and the New York Times by driving the same Boston to D.C. route in the Model-S as the NYT's reviewer did. "With a full battery, there was no need -- none at all -- to nurse the car's battery"   (money.cnn.com) divider line 368
    More: Followup, Model S, cnnmoney, NYT, flatbed trucks, District of Columbia, New Jersey Turnpike  
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14363 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Feb 2013 at 7:46 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-15 08:22:26 AM  
Link to this? Because I've been following this pretty closely and haven't heard anything like that.

I find it pretty hard to swallow that someone from Tesla would tell him to go 62mi with only 32 rated miles left on dial. I find it harder still that he didn't even think to question it.


http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/14/that-tesla-data-what-it-s ay s-and-what-it-doesnt/

FTA: Beginning early in the morning of my second day with the car, after the projected range had dropped precipitously while parked overnight, I spoke numerous times with Christina Ra, Tesla's spokeswoman at the time, and Ted Merendino, a Tesla product planner at the company's headquarters in California. They told me that the loss of battery power when parked overnight could be restored by properly "conditioning" the battery, a half-hour process, which I undertook by sitting in the car with the heat on low, as they instructed. That proved ineffective; the conditioning process actually reduced the range by 24 percent (to 19 miles, from 25 miles).

It was also Tesla that told me that an hour of charging (at a lower power level) at a public utility in Norwich, Conn., would give me adequate range to reach the Supercharger 61 miles away, even though the car's range estimator read 32 miles - because, again, I was told that moderate-speed driving would "restore" the battery power lost overnight. That also proved overly optimistic, as I ran out of power about 14 miles shy of the Milford Supercharger and about five miles from the public charging station in East Haven that I was trying to reach


.....

I haven't followed this story religiously, but I've been in the same situation of receiving bad advice from poorly trained tech support (particularly with my Dell laptop).  If you don't know what you're doing, and tech support doesn't know what they're doing, it's a pretty painful mix and I could see that being a major contributing factor to the NYT reporter's experience.
 
2013-02-15 08:22:44 AM  

MayoBoy: Trapper439: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Unless you're on a German autobahn, why would you ever need a car that goes over 60 MPH? Last I heard, there are these things called "speed limits" and electric cars like the Tesla can reach them.

My commiserations about your tiny penis. Have you considered buying a great big fark-off gun to make yourself feel better?

You drive 60 MPH in the left lane too don't you?


Must be from Maryland
 
2013-02-15 08:23:01 AM  
Oh look, a Tesla thread where Farkers worship a car they will never be able to afford.
 
2013-02-15 08:23:45 AM  

Trapper439: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Unless you're on a German autobahn, why would you ever need a car that goes over 60 MPH? Last I heard, there are these things called "speed limits" and electric cars like the Tesla can reach them.

My commiserations about your tiny penis. Have you considered buying a great big fark-off gun to make yourself feel better?


I see from your profile that you are in Australia, It's been a while since Ive been there, but according to Wikipedia  "130 km/h speed limits are found on the Stuart, Barkly, Victoria and Arnhem Highways"

130kp/h is 81 mph - no Autobahn needed.

Most of the way from LA to Vegas is 65 MPH

Sorry about your ability to do math
 
2013-02-15 08:24:53 AM  
Would get a 650 hp Shelby for less, and have a lot more fun.
 
2013-02-15 08:25:23 AM  

Hotdog453: mekkab: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Hotdog453: verbaltoxin: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Except it's not a super car. It's a sedan.

Whoopee. A 100k+ sedan that you have to drive at 60MPH.

Super trolls at work, here. TAKE NOTES! This is how it is done!


/Totally gonna get one of these
//debating if I need the supercharging option...

I'm genuinely not trying to troll, but if I was going to spend my entire year's income on a car, I'd rather not have to wait 30 minutes every X miles to recharge. I just can't fathom who, beyond the super rich, this car is for.

I'm sure they're fantastic, awesome, incredible vehicles with amazing torque and awesome handling and all of that jazz, but can you honestly imagine owning one in a day to day life, without having a second car? That just seems like such an awkward proposition.


For most people nearly every journey they make is well under the range of one charge. For them they drive the car, never stop at a gas station and the car magically has a full tank of "gas" every morning.
 
2013-02-15 08:25:25 AM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: Hotdog453: verbaltoxin: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Except it's not a super car. It's a sedan.

Whoopee. A 100k+ sedan that you have to drive at 60MPH.

And you have to spend an hour "refueling."

$100k supercar is a piece of crap. That's just what I want to do when I drive, constantly worry if I can make it to the next recharging station and then spend an hour cooling my heels. Who the fark would be retarded enough to buy one of these?


people with short commutes.  I test rode a Nissal Leaf a while ago.  Nice car, but the cruising range isn't good for me, and it's just too expensive for a second car.  I'll keep my trusty 02 Prius.
 
2013-02-15 08:25:55 AM  
Of course, I don't doubt that. But as it stands, if I bought a Tesla (or, given my income level, a Nissan Leaf), I'd still have to have a second car, as sometimes I like to drive longer distances. If I want to drive from Ohio to North Carolina, I'd rather not have to stop and wait for 30 minutes every X miles.

That's why I struggle with pure electric cars: Unless they can get charge time to like... 5 minutes, I can't see owning one. Hybrids? Sure. Makes sense.


That's the idea behind Better Place;
http://www.betterplace.com/How-it-Works

Instead of selling you the car they sell you the battery, so besides charging you can swap them out quickly.

nope, don't work for them, just like the idea.
 
2013-02-15 08:27:48 AM  

alowishus: How hard would it be to treat electric car batteries like propane tanks?  You stop at the station and and swap your empty one for a full one.  Or am I missing an obvious problem with that?


They're already doing it. Look up Better Place battery swapping. 1min automated change, and it can take all sizes and shapes of batteries, so companies won't be constrained in design (as long as the automated release catches are standardised).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lp_6VyIeSY

They're being installed in Japan, Israel and Denmark to start with. If they manage to be successful (we'll see), it could be expanded out. But the technology is definitely there.
 
2013-02-15 08:29:36 AM  

Hotdog453: Of course, I don't doubt that. But as it stands, if I bought a Tesla (or, given my income level, a Nissan Leaf), I'd still have to have a second car, as sometimes I like to drive longer distances. If I want to drive from Ohio to North Carolina, I'd rather not have to stop and wait for 30 minutes every X miles.

That's why I struggle with pure electric cars: Unless they can get charge time to like... 5 minutes, I can't see owning one. Hybrids? Sure. Makes sense.


Maybe not.  For most people, normal driving would be just fine in something like that.  Commuting back and forth to work, weekend trips to the grocery, etc.  For those longer weekend trips, rent the most appropriate vehicle.  It'd be cheaper that way for the majority of the population.
 
2013-02-15 08:30:31 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Except news media is just the ultimate outlet for a variety of sources.  The op-ed on the subject with which you are familiar comes from some local yahoo with his own byline, and the story about Palestine or whatever comes from the international AP wire, which employs actual investigative journalists.


The Gell-Mann Amnesia effect doesn't just apply to op-eds.  It applies to *ALL* reporting.

Think about it:  A journalist who reports on, say, medicine is almost certainly not a doctor or other medical professional themselves.  A journalist who reports on, well, pretty much anything is going to have a limited view of what they are looking at.  This is for a number of reasons:

1. They generally have limited knowledge, if any at all, on the subject they are reporting on.
2. They have a deadline, so the can't or won't fact check everything in their articles/stories
3. They have biases.  This isn't a value judgement, it's just an observation that all everyone has their own biases, and they color our view of the world.   Someone from an inner city area is unlikely to view guns as a net social positive, whereas someone from a rural area is, and that can color how they report a story about gun control initiatives, for example.  Note I'm not talking about a conscious decision here.
4. Access.  Being critical, even if it's truthful, can lead to a cut-off of access to a particular news source.  So you report what you can, without being seen as overly critical, but it's necessarily incomplete.  It's a form of self-censorship.
5. Agenda.  This is related to 3, but more "overt", and may be at the heart of the article we are discussing.  This is "spin", and it doesn't just happen in opinion pieces, though it's more likely to be blatantly obvious in those situations.
6.  A limited view of what happens.  There is a reason why kings and generals stopped leading from the front:  They could only see what was happening around them.  A reporter can only see what is around them.  Often focusing on the minutiae of something leads to a misunderstanding of the overall picture.

There are some other reasons, I think,  but those are the big ones.

Now, I've read a lot of stories about things which I had in-depth knowledge.  In almost every case (and I'm talking things like basic Newtonian physics, not just "X said Y" kind of reporting), the reporting is wrong in some critical way.    Yet I'm almost as guilty about taking news reports as gospel myself.  I don't often read a story and say "Hey, I wonder what they got wrong?", even though I've known about this phenomenon for years.
 
2013-02-15 08:30:53 AM  
If I was his editor, I'd demand to see his bank account statements for the last 6 months.
 
2013-02-15 08:31:44 AM  

Hotdog453: but can you honestly imagine owning one in a day to day life, without having a second car?


I wouldn't be in that position, but I can.   However I'm the same kind of person who thinks "an iPad is a computer" because most users don't do video editing/compile kernels/any programming at all, really/things that require a bigger general purpose CPU.  They read emails, the browse the web, they watch netflix, they youtube.  99% of your needs, taken care of.

I think this car fits into a very similar niche.  The niche being "this covers 90% of your driving." You can take a 100 mile drive in the country on weekends and not even think about recharging the car.

Tommy Moo: Also a green married couple that's solidly in the upper middle class. They could own two vehicles and just take the gas-hybrid one if they're worried about a long trip.



FTFY
 
2013-02-15 08:32:14 AM  
Like all liberal news outlets, the NYTs is full if nothing but lies and propaganda. The Enquirer is more legitimate.
 
2013-02-15 08:33:00 AM  

Kiwimann: Link to this? Because I've been following this pretty closely and haven't heard anything like that.

I find it pretty hard to swallow that someone from Tesla would tell him to go 62mi with only 32 rated miles left on dial. I find it harder still that he didn't even think to question it.

http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/14/that-tesla-data-what-it-s ay s-and-what-it-doesnt/

FTA: Beginning early in the morning of my second day with the car, after the projected range had dropped precipitously while parked overnight, I spoke numerous times with Christina Ra, Tesla's spokeswoman at the time, and Ted Merendino, a Tesla product planner at the company's headquarters in California. They told me that the loss of battery power when parked overnight could be restored by properly "conditioning" the battery, a half-hour process, which I undertook by sitting in the car with the heat on low, as they instructed. That proved ineffective; the conditioning process actually reduced the range by 24 percent (to 19 miles, from 25 miles).

It was also Tesla that told me that an hour of charging (at a lower power level) at a public utility in Norwich, Conn., would give me adequate range to reach the Supercharger 61 miles away, even though the car's range estimator read 32 miles - because, again, I was told that moderate-speed driving would "restore" the battery power lost overnight. That also proved overly optimistic, as I ran out of power about 14 miles shy of the Milford Supercharger and about five miles from the public charging station in East Haven that I was trying to reach

.....

I haven't followed this story religiously, but I've been in the same situation of receiving bad advice from poorly trained tech support (particularly with my Dell laptop).  If you don't know what you're doing, and tech support doesn't know what they're doing, it's a pretty painful mix and I could see that being a major contributing factor to the NYT reporter's experience.


It doesn't show that the Tech was fired, which was what I was inquiring after after you said it. The claim that he was told by a tech to drive off with only 32mi left is still uncorroborated - and like I said, I find that highly dubious.
 
2013-02-15 08:33:19 AM  

Hobodeluxe: Hotdog453: verbaltoxin: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Except it's not a super car. It's a sedan.

Whoopee. A 100k+ sedan that you have to drive at 60MPH.

once there are more charging stations that won't be necessary. also most people just use their vehicle for short commutes and an electric car would be ideal for that. also no carbon emissions,no noise pollution,no terrorist funding petrol.


Where are these magical electricity trees? There is still pollution, it is just shifted somewhere else.
 
2013-02-15 08:34:10 AM  

Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH


fta Instead, I found myself maneuvering around slower cars. Now, I normally spend most of my time on the New Jersey Turnpike out in the left lane going at least 10 or 15 miles an hour faster than I was in the Model S. But sitting in the middle lane, I was keeping up with traffic. I certainly didn't feel out of place -- except for the fact that I wasn't burning any gasoline.

Is it your point, Kanemano, that he should have been driving 80mph in 60mph traffic?
 
2013-02-15 08:34:41 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: Must be from Maryland

North Carolina

'First in flight', my ass!

/Marylanders suck, 'specially in precipitation, but North Carolinians in the I-95 corridor truly get my goat
 
2013-02-15 08:35:05 AM  

Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH


This won't be an issue as they add more charging stations.

This just in, in the stretches no-mans land in Texas and New Mexico where you see a gas station every 300 miles, you have to drive conservatively or you might run out of gas mid way.
 
2013-02-15 08:35:08 AM  

alowishus: How hard would it be to treat electric car batteries like propane tanks?  You stop at the station and and swap your empty one for a full one.  Or am I missing an obvious problem with that?


Liability problems. If a driver turns in a damaged/broken/messed up battery, and the service station gives it to someone else and it causes problems or injuries or death, they could get sued. Which is why places that swap propane tanks don't accept damaged or rusty ones. Unfortunately, with batteries, it's not as simple as seeing it's dented or rusty.

Supply problems. Every 'gas station' ('electron station'?) would need to have a good supply of these things, a place to store them while charging, equipment to move them around (batteries are heavy), etc. Oh, and the electrical capacity to charge them.

Standardization problems. Gas can be poured into any size or shape tank. But a battery pack needs to fit a specific receptacle. That means they must be a standard size/shape. Any change to the standard requires having both 'old' and 'new' types, (see 'Supply problems' above.)

Customer Service problems. "You're taking my fresh, new, shiny batteries, and giving me those nasty, dirty things? I'm the customer and I'm always right! I want -those- batteries. Whatta you mean they're not charged yet? I wanna see your manager!"
 
2013-02-15 08:35:33 AM  

tentaculistic: dittybopper: Remember this the next time you read *ANYTHING* in *ANY* news outlet.

Gell-Mann Amnesia.

Soooo... You linked to a conservative Catholic philosophical magazine that essentially says that we should discount all media accounts (except presumably theirs). You're not noticing how medieval Catholic that is? Discount science, discount that heathen Greek philosophy, don't read the Bible directly, just trust our version of everything... Hey, give us enough money you can go right to heaven!

/First Things is actually decent for what it is
//But that's a dangerous thing to advocate, given the history


Google "Gell-Mann Amnesia".  The idea itself was invented by Michael Crichton, based upon his discussions about the media with physicist Murray Gell-Mann.  I merely picked one of the first links that Google returned that quoted Crichton on the subject.  Doesn't really matter if it was Stormfront or a blog devoted to Mother Teresa's used underwear, it's the idea, not the source, that's important.
 
2013-02-15 08:35:59 AM  

Tommy Moo: "I don't think something is worth as much as what it's sold for, so no one else should be allowed to buy it and it should stop existing."


I didn't say any of that. By definition, since people are willing to buy the car for $100k, the car is worth $100k. If rich people want to waste money on stupid shiat, that's their problem, they're more than free to do so. I'm just trying to figure out why you would want to shell out twice what a bottom-end luxury car costs and get a far inferior driving experience. My car (not a luxury car) cost $28k, goes 450 miles between refueling stops (which take about two minutes to accomplish and can happen almost anywhere), doesn't need to be babied by driving at just 60mph, and I can set the cabin temperature to whatever I like. My driving experience and comfort are superior to the Tesla. The only thing I lose out on is (a) I don't look as cool, and (b) I can't be quite as smug about "saving the planet." I can achieve coolness and smugness for much less than the $72k price difference between the two cars.

Perhaps if every time I stopped at a red light, the coolness factor of the Tesla caused nubile young women to hop in and provide copious amounts of road head, the additional $72k might be a good investment.
 
2013-02-15 08:36:02 AM  

Kanemano: Most of the way from LA to Vegas is 65 MPH


heck, most of Washington DC to Chicago is 65 - 70 mph.
 
2013-02-15 08:36:41 AM  

MyRandomName: Where are these magical electricity trees?


I have a 7.2kw photovoltaic array on my house.  It's as close as you can get. And I wouldn't call it a tree, more of a black-winged angel... (shout out to all y'all Godflesh fans!)

/yes, yes. pollution is shifted to the production of the panels...
 
2013-02-15 08:38:22 AM  

Thunderpipes: Would get a 650 hp Shelby for less, and have a lot more fun.


The honesty of the New York Times reporter depends on my ability to afford the product he reviewed? What a weird concept.
 
2013-02-15 08:38:51 AM  

MyRandomName: Where are these magical electricity trees? There is still pollution, it is just shifted somewhere else.


Electric cars still are far more efficient, and produce less emissions. There was a study done where they found that even with 70% of your power coming from coal, you still produce fewer emissions with an electirc than a petrol car. As only about 30% of US power now comes from coal, Electrics are far and away the better option.
 
2013-02-15 08:39:31 AM  
I would kill for an electric vehicle. I drive on average a max of 35 miles a day for my daily commute total, and on occasion make long drives up the East Coast to visit my family. I'm a perfect candidate for an EV, and unlike this chucklefark I would actually, you know, take the time to charge the battery and not be a pansy about it. I hate driving with a burning passion, and if I could use the excuse that the car needs to charge to take a half hour break in the middle of that 5.5 hour slog I would do it in a heart beat.
 
2013-02-15 08:40:56 AM  

SpdrJay: You know who ELSE tried to smear Tesla???

(it was Edison....)


J.P. Morgan?
 
2013-02-15 08:41:05 AM  
You get 265 miles from the Tesla, at 60 miles an hour you can drive for 4 hours straight.  That's time for lunch so unless you are eating fast food the time it takes you will mean the car is charged.

265 miles is a decent distance that not very many people drive very often.  If you are in sales and are all over the place then duh this isn't the car for you.  Pure electric is the way of the future and if we can get the government to drop a ton of money on infrastructure then we would be better off.
 
2013-02-15 08:42:22 AM  

Thunderpipes: Oh look, a Tesla thread where Farkers worship a car they will never be able to afford.


Yet, oddly, there's very little 'worship' going on. Project much?
 
2013-02-15 08:42:43 AM  

MindStalker: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

This won't be an issue as they add more charging stations.

This just in, in the stretches no-mans land in Texas and New Mexico where you see a gas station every 300 miles, you have to drive conservatively or you might run out of gas mid way.


Actually, probably not.   Most cars will go at least 300 miles even when driven very aggressively.   In my car, I lose around 4 to 5 MPG between driving very conservatively and driving very aggressively.  I've got an 11 gallon tank, and with "normal" driving, I get about 36 mpg.  Aggressive driving (all above 75 MPH, and often between 80 and 85) generally nets me about 33 MPG, and I can get up to about 38 MPG driving slowly (55 to 60 MPH).

Even if I were to drive so aggressively that my mileage were to drop to 30 MPG, I could still make a 300 mile stretch with 30 miles left in the tank as a reserve, and I could stretch that to nearly 40 miles if I had to.

/Yes, I do regularly measure my mileage.
//A 100 mile round trip commute will make you do that.
 
2013-02-15 08:43:02 AM  
As with so many of these innovations, it will be at least a few years before I can touch this car. Probably more than a few.

s20.postimage.org


Until then, I hope the Dork-Mobile holds out.......

images.dealer.com
 
2013-02-15 08:43:15 AM  

mekkab: MyRandomName: Where are these magical electricity trees?

I have a 7.2kw photovoltaic array on my house.  It's as close as you can get. And I wouldn't call it a tree, more of a black-winged angel... (shout out to all y'all Godflesh fans!)

/yes, yes. pollution is shifted to the production of the panels...


At least you saved me the response.

But even with solar, how much of U.S. electricity is generated from it. More could be but it is costly. Germany has a fairly large tax hit per citizen to subsidize their solar build up.
 
2013-02-15 08:43:18 AM  

Thunderpipes: Oh look, a Tesla thread where Farkers worship a car they will never be able to afford.


Oh look, someone hasn't been reading the posts.
 
2013-02-15 08:43:44 AM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: Tommy Moo: "I don't think something is worth as much as what it's sold for, so no one else should be allowed to buy it and it should stop existing."

I didn't say any of that. By definition, since people are willing to buy the car for $100k, the car is worth $100k. If rich people want to waste money on stupid shiat, that's their problem, they're more than free to do so. I'm just trying to figure out why you would want to shell out twice what a bottom-end luxury car costs and get a far inferior driving experience. My car (not a luxury car) cost $28k, goes 450 miles between refueling stops (which take about two minutes to accomplish and can happen almost anywhere), doesn't need to be babied by driving at just 60mph, and I can set the cabin temperature to whatever I like. My driving experience and comfort are superior to the Tesla.


The fact your car cost under $30k means you aren't in Telsa's market. A S600 costs $140k an A8 costs around $100k. Both these cars get under 15 mpg in the city and are likely second cars for someone who buys a Telsa for their daily commute and make it so the person never has to worry about stopping for gas since it charges while they sleep so it saves time.
 
2013-02-15 08:45:05 AM  

fredklein: alowishus: How hard would it be to treat electric car batteries like propane tanks?  You stop at the station and and swap your empty one for a full one.  Or am I missing an obvious problem with that?

Liability problems. If a driver turns in a damaged/broken/messed up battery, and the service station gives it to someone else and it causes problems or injuries or death, they could get sued. Which is why places that swap propane tanks don't accept damaged or rusty ones. Unfortunately, with batteries, it's not as simple as seeing it's dented or rusty.

Supply problems. Every 'gas station' ('electron station'?) would need to have a good supply of these things, a place to store them while charging, equipment to move them around (batteries are heavy), etc. Oh, and the electrical capacity to charge them.

Standardization problems. Gas can be poured into any size or shape tank. But a battery pack needs to fit a specific receptacle. That means they must be a standard size/shape. Any change to the standard requires having both 'old' and 'new' types, (see 'Supply problems' above.)

Customer Service problems. "You're taking my fresh, new, shiny batteries, and giving me those nasty, dirty things? I'm the customer and I'm always right! I want -those- batteries. Whatta you mean they're not charged yet? I wanna see your manager!"


They already have the technology, and it's already in action. Look up Better Place battery swapping. All of these issues can be over-come pretty easily.

And no one cares if a battery on the bottom of your car is a bit shabby, because it's right under your car, you can't see it. Assuming they keep them in good working order (and they'd be insured and removed from the system if damaged in an accident or whatever, I'm sure), no one will care.
 
2013-02-15 08:46:20 AM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: Hotdog453: verbaltoxin: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

Except it's not a super car. It's a sedan.

Whoopee. A 100k+ sedan that you have to drive at 60MPH.

And you have to spend an hour "refueling."

$100k supercar is a piece of crap. That's just what I want to do when I drive, constantly worry if I can make it to the next recharging station and then spend an hour cooling my heels. Who the fark would be retarded enough to buy one of these?


You DO realize that you're basically saying what people in the late 1800s did about gasoline- powered cars, right? This is how new technology is- the early ones have limitations, and are stupid expensive. Then, as the companies recoup their initial investment, the price drops and the limitations start disappearing.

Or are we still using 8- bit computers that run at 1 MHz, have 128k of RAM, and cost the equivalent of $3,000 in today's dollars? I also remember that Apple had a 10 MB hard drive back in 1985.It was called the Sider. (because it sat on the side, and was an apple. har har.) Anyhow, that thing was about the size of a cinder block and cost $700- about $1400 or so in today's dollars.

My point is that these things will get better and cheaper. Give it some time.
 
2013-02-15 08:46:26 AM  

Grimble Crumble: SpdrJay: You know who ELSE tried to smear Tesla???

(it was Edison....)

J.P. Morgan?


I can think of some things I would have smeared on Jaye P. Morgan in her prime.
 
2013-02-15 08:46:48 AM  

Notabunny: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

fta Instead, I found myself maneuvering around slower cars. Now, I normally spend most of my time on the New Jersey Turnpike out in the left lane going at least 10 or 15 miles an hour faster than I was in the Model S. But sitting in the middle lane, I was keeping up with traffic. I certainly didn't feel out of place -- except for the fact that I wasn't burning any gasoline.

Is it your point, Kanemano, that he should have been driving 80mph in 60mph traffic?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Jersey_TurnpikeSpeed limitsThe minimum speed limit for all zones on the Turnpike is 10 mph (16 km/h) below the maximum speed limit. Between the southern terminus and milepost 97.2, the maximum speed limit is 65 mph (105 km/h) with a minimum speed of 55 mph (89 km/h), for example.

In reality, as someone who has driven on the NJ Turnpike, 70 is what the right lane is driving.
 
2013-02-15 08:49:23 AM  

TNel: You get 265 miles from the Tesla, at 60 miles an hour you can drive for 4 hours straight.  That's time for lunch so unless you are eating fast food the time it takes you will mean the car is charged.

265 miles is a decent distance that not very many people drive very often.  If you are in sales and are all over the place then duh this isn't the car for you.  Pure electric is the way of the future and if we can get the government to drop a ton of money on infrastructure then we would be better off.


As the price for all-electric cars drops, demand for charging stations will increase. My guess is that municipalities will then begin buying all-electric cars for their fleets. I think the infrastructure will grow quickly at that point.
 
2013-02-15 08:49:24 AM  

maddermaxx: And no one cares if a battery on the bottom of your car is a bit shabby, because it's right under your car, you can't see it.


You've never had a Customer Service job, have you? Customers biatch about anything/everything.
 
2013-02-15 08:51:51 AM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: $100k supercar is a piece of crap. That's just what I want to do when I drive, constantly worry if I can make it to the next recharging station and then spend an hour cooling my heels. Who the fark would be retarded enough to buy one of these?


For all the knee-jerk hatred people are spewing about these cars in the wake of this scandal, the truth is that if these cars really were so bad and unlikable, the NYT reviewer wouldn't have needed to lie in order to disparage them.
 
2013-02-15 08:52:00 AM  
And yet still nobody talks about the fact it went from a 90 mile range to 25 overnight for no apparent reason, and that loss of range was the only reason the NYT reviewer wasn't able to drive the car like an end user would and make it from whats its fark to Boston on 3 incomplete charges.

The only interesting discrepancy in the data logs and nobody will farking talk about it.

Kiwimann: Apparently the NYT reporter received some really poor advice from a Tesla spokesperson about how much battery charge was required.  He kept calling that same spokesperson for help during the trip and received more bad advice.

That spokesperson no longer works for Tesla.


you shut the fark up here with your facts! THIS IS AN ELON MUSK CIRCLE JERK!
 
2013-02-15 08:53:06 AM  
Broder, talking about Elon Musk: "He did not share that data, which Tesla has now posted online, with me at the time. "

In other words, I got caught lying because I didn't know there was data to rebut what I was saying.
 
2013-02-15 08:53:19 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Prank Call of Cthulhu: $100k supercar is a piece of crap. That's just what I want to do when I drive, constantly worry if I can make it to the next recharging station and then spend an hour cooling my heels. Who the fark would be retarded enough to buy one of these?

For all the knee-jerk hatred people are spewing about these cars in the wake of this scandal, the truth is that if these cars really were so bad and unlikable, the NYT reviewer wouldn't have needed to lie in order to disparage them.


Exactly. Had the reviewer finish the trip and said "The Tesla made the journey but it took 14 hours instead of 10 and I was forced to find a hotel I could plug in my car" it would have been a completely valid criticism.
 
2013-02-15 08:54:19 AM  

Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH


I really thought this would be too stupid for anyone to seriously comment on. But look, a whole thread just running with it. Congrats, I guess.
 
2013-02-15 08:54:45 AM  

Notabunny: As the price for all-electric cars drops, demand for charging stations will increase. My guess is that municipalities will then begin buying all-electric cars for their fleets. I think the infrastructure will grow quickly at that point.


Charging a Tesla S with the supercharging system requires 90Kw of power.

That's as much electricity as the average house uses in an entire year.

To charge your car.

If you think quick charging stations are going to stay cheap, or that our electrical grid can handle them without a 100% complete overhaul to double plant and transmission line capacity, you are insane.
 
2013-02-15 08:54:49 AM  
Notabunny:

As the price for all-electric cars drops, demand for charging stations will increase. My guess is that municipalities will then begin buying all-electric cars for their fleets. I think the infrastructure will grow quickly at that point.

They need to get the military to switch to them like they had them switch to E85, that would get the ball rolling faster.
 
2013-02-15 08:55:46 AM  

Kanemano: Notabunny: Kanemano: Whoopee a $100K +super car that you have to drive at 60 MPH

fta Instead, I found myself maneuvering around slower cars. Now, I normally spend most of my time on the New Jersey Turnpike out in the left lane going at least 10 or 15 miles an hour faster than I was in the Model S. But sitting in the middle lane, I was keeping up with traffic. I certainly didn't feel out of place -- except for the fact that I wasn't burning any gasoline.

Is it your point, Kanemano, that he should have been driving 80mph in 60mph traffic?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Jersey_TurnpikeSpeed limitsThe minimum speed limit for all zones on the Turnpike is 10 mph (16 km/h) below the maximum speed limit. Between the southern terminus and milepost 97.2, the maximum speed limit is 65 mph (105 km/h) with a minimum speed of 55 mph (89 km/h), for example.

In reality, as someone who has driven on the NJ Turnpike, 70 is what the right lane is driving.


The speed limit isn't the point. The point is that he was staying with the flow of traffic without a problem.

Also fta But as I drove into Connecticut, I realized something amazing. Not only did I have enough battery range left, I had plenty. I had at least 40 miles -- more than an entire Chevy Volt's worth of electricity -- left to play with. I sped up, cruising over 70, riding in the left lane, mashing the gas pedal just to feel how fast the car could shoot from 65 to 80. I was practically giddy.
In the end, I made it -- and it wasn't that hard.


So, he stayed with the flow of traffic, and then, when the opportunity presented itself, he sped up and had a little fun. According to tfa, the car completed the task and exceeded expectations.

At issue here isn't the capability of the car. At issue is the integrity of the NYT reporter.
 
2013-02-15 08:57:33 AM  
I see the usual collection of people stilll can't grasp why anyone would buy something that doesn't 100% logically fit their supposed needs.  Personally I've driven a CNG Opel minivan for years.  Yes the range is a constraint but if you're the kind of person who can organize their shiat, the running costs are amazingly low.  It's a simple question of are you the kind of person who can efficiently deal with the disadvantages and turn the advantages to your favor, all the while furthering the R&D necessary to achieve much more viable future solutions..

And, if all consumers truly made auto purchase decisions based on their actual needs, we wouldn't have Soccer Moms and other single drivers driving around in behemoth 4WD SUVs whose offroad capabilities will never, ever be utillized.  Probably half of American consumers buy the type of wasteful cars they don't really need.  As a country in economic decline, that's the kind of capital we shouldn't really be squandering.
 
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