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(Slate)   Beef. The other white meat   ( slate.com) divider line
    More: Sad, Tyson Foods, Michael Pollan, boobs, Cargill, beef, positive feedback  
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13188 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Feb 2013 at 1:26 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-15 04:06:44 AM  
Zilmax?  No thank you.  I pretty much don't buy beef unless I know the guy who raised it.  It costs more than what's at the supermarket, so I eat steak a little less often. No big deal.

alienated: one can also get their own vacuseal thing and double bag and double seal.


There's also a second, completely underrated benefit of having a vacuum sealer:  For another $100, you can do sous vide poaching in your house.  It's nigh impossible to screw up, and the results you can get are amazing.  There is nothing, NOTHING like a perfectly medium rare steak sous vide that's been cooking for 6 or 8 hours.

tylerdurden217: useless bones


Obviously, you don't cook.  There's more beef flavor in those "useless bones" that in the meat.  And if you try to take my plate of sizzling marrow bones, I'll bite your freakin' hand.

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: We have such an anti-intellectual, primitivist view on the meat and agriculture industry, and it all boils down to different variations of the naturalist fallacy.


I get you here, but the thing is, hormones are tricksy bastards.  We really don't understand how they work very well.  You want to try out some experimental hormone therapy on one person, or ten people, or a hundred, that's fine.  But all 8 billion of us eat food.  I'd rather pay more and eat less beef, than spin that particular roulette wheel.

unamused: Ribeye steaks often have little or no marbling, and they suck.


Lean meat has more flavor than fatty meat.  What the animal was fed is more important than what cut you get.  The marbling is just about tenderness.  What are you, a sissy?  Get yourself a grass-fed hanger steak and a sharp knife.

planes: [www.global-air.com image 150x200]

The meat industry's biggest secret - how glue is being used to hold scrap cuts of meat together. (new window)

Meat glue

is the industry's biggest secret?   Not even close, homey.  It may seem like a weird idea, but it's actually one of the more harmless things that are done to meat.  Of all the shiat that goes down in feedlots and slaughterhouses, meat glue is the very last thing you should be worried about.
 
2013-02-15 04:06:46 AM  

ArcadianRefugee: planes: The meat industry's biggest secret - how glue is being used to hold scrap cuts of meat together. (new window)

FTA: "To most consumers, the resultant reconstituted "steak" is indistinguishable from a real slab of meat once it's cooked"

So what's the problem?


Horse and beef are indistinguishable to most consumers. Some people across the waves are having a problem with this.
 
2013-02-15 04:16:11 AM  
Z-clipped:

Good points . Especially about bones. You can try and  take the marrow superfood from me at your own peril.
 
2013-02-15 04:18:24 AM  
A meal of steak and vegetables is quick and easy to cook, relatively healthy and delicious.  It's probably under $10/person to make anywhere in America.  Why the hell don't more people have it regularly?
 
2013-02-15 05:06:41 AM  
Don't get me started.  It's not just meat.  It's not just food.  It's EVERYTHING.  Quality is a thing of the past.  And it's the consumers fault.  People settle for shiat, and that's what we get.  Even when there are those of us out there that are willing to pay for quality, the assholes that that just want to save a buck drive down the prices until the makers of quality can't compete, and we're left with shiat.

I don't want to live on this planet anymore.
 
2013-02-15 05:16:36 AM  
It makes me curious as to what they're doing in China when something like this is acceptable according to the FDA.
The Chinese "middle class" want to live Western lifestyles, but there's no chance in hell there's enough room on the planet to raise those cows without some acts against god.
 
2013-02-15 05:19:01 AM  

Z-clipped: sous vide poaching


hmmm...I must look into this.....
 
2013-02-15 05:20:06 AM  

Freeballin: Move to Texas.  $3.97/lb bone in ribeye.  Usually it's only $5/lb anyway, same with NY strip.  Texas beef doesn't have great marbling, however you can look through the pile and find a few that do every time.


No thanks. Here in PA farm country I just ask a lady at church who owns a cattle ranch and they slaughter them there upon request. Sausages, steaks, you name it-- cheap, fresh and organic.
 
2013-02-15 05:52:23 AM  
I think I found a solution to the beef problem...

4.bp.blogspot.com

/no Zilmax needed.
 
2013-02-15 06:03:27 AM  

HindiDiscoMonster: I think I found a solution to the beef problem...

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 425x550]

/no Zilmax needed.


Gross. Better solution...and saves the crops. Seriously.

i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-15 06:35:03 AM  

Caluth: This is why I go to an actual butcher shop down the road that has all local and chemical free cow.  It's sometimes still warm when I get it!


I buy beef for under 3 bucks a pound cut wrapped and farmer up the road paid.  My next order is 100 yards away and growing.

Beef hangs for 3-4 weeks to age before processing.  If it's warm when you get it, your butcher isn't keeping it chilled enough.
 
2013-02-15 07:05:18 AM  

log_jammin: Z-clipped: sous vide poaching

hmmm...I must look into this.....


Styrofoam Cooler + Vacuum Sealer + Temp Controller + Immersion Heater

Total Price: $162
(If you already have an old manual crockpot or rice cooker, you don't even need the first and last items)

Grill cooked Med Rare:

beta.images.theglobeandmail.com

vs. Sous Vide Med Rare:

people.ece.cornell.edu

cdn.biggestmenu.com

cdn.biggestmenu.com

And pictures don't do justice to the texture.  The long cooking process (hours and hours) breaks down the long fibers, but the vacuum environment keeps 100% of the fat and moisture inside the steak.  You can cook bottom round or chuck this way, and it will still come out as tender as any ribeye you've ever had.  Just pull it out of the bath, pop it in a hot cast iron for a few seconds on either side, and serve.  You don't even need to rest it.

And of course, that's just meat.  You can cook anything this way.  Set it to 62.0 C, and make the most perfect soft boiled egg of your life.  BBQ ribs, duck confit, lobster, chocolate pudding... fark, now I'm hungry.  Have a ball.
 
2013-02-15 07:23:14 AM  

Z-clipped: fark, now I'm hungry.


you and me both.
 
2013-02-15 07:40:33 AM  
Got called yesterday because the rancher we use delivered our steer to the butcher to hang and age.  We usually get about 700 - 800 lbs dress weight.  Comes to $2.08/pound after processing.  We also get the liver and other innerds made into jerky for dogs.

He only feeds his steers grain and grass.  And he will only use antibiotics if necessary.  No growth enhancers.  He also only raises enough each year to sell to individuals and for his own family.

Not for everyone of course, but if you have athletic teenage boys you know they eat 3 times as much as an adult and you can't afford meat prices in a grocery store.
 
2013-02-15 08:03:55 AM  
Z-clipped:
unamused: Ribeye steaks often have little or no marbling, and they suck.

Lean meat has more flavor than fatty meat.  What the animal was fed is more important than what cut you get.  The marbling is just about tenderness.  What are you, a sissy?  Get yourself a grass-fed hanger steak and a sharp knife.


I was talking about restaurant steaks.  The chain restaurants are all using the no fat/no juice/no flavor ribeyes.

When I do them at home I buy them "bone in" by the roll.
 
2013-02-15 08:41:31 AM  

log_jammin: Z-clipped: fark, now I'm hungry.

you and me both.


and me.  gonna have to give that-there fancy method a try.  thanks, Z.
 
2013-02-15 08:43:10 AM  
But let's face it - there's only one man for this job -

cdn.uproxx.com
 
2013-02-15 09:39:22 AM  
If you are in Seattle, Rain Shadow is where you want to go. Farms are checked by the owner, and primals are butchered right there. And the charcuterie is all made there - in front of you! It's Das Bomb.
 
2013-02-15 09:45:35 AM  
FTA:  As a result, the vast majority of calves are still born and reared on wide-open ranchland, where herds of them eat free grass and stick by their mother's side.

Anyone else do a double-take there?
 
2013-02-15 09:52:29 AM  

tylerdurden217: They need to find a way to turn their useless bones into muscle so we can eat that too. Just a mass of muscle and fat that we can feed until mature and then slaughter. Make sure it has a working brain and eyes so that it knows something is wrong... the fear will help with the marbling.


www.sivatherium.narod.ruwww.sivatherium.narod.ru
 
2013-02-15 10:03:41 AM  

Caluth: This is why I go to an actual butcher shop down the road that has all local and chemical free cow.  It's sometimes still warm when I get it!


Prole. I go to the artisan farmer down the block and cut my own from a living cow that's been fed on nothing but quinoa and prosciutto.
 
2013-02-15 10:29:40 AM  

Z-clipped: log_jammin: Z-clipped: sous vide poaching

hmmm...I must look into this.....

Styrofoam Cooler + Vacuum Sealer + Temp Controller + Immersion Heater

Total Price: $162
(If you already have an old manual crockpot or rice cooker, you don't even need the first and last items)

Grill cooked Med Rare:

[beta.images.theglobeandmail.com image 620x349]

vs. Sous Vide Med Rare:

[people.ece.cornell.edu image 600x401]

[cdn.biggestmenu.com image 500x375]

[cdn.biggestmenu.com image 500x375]

And pictures don't do justice to the texture.  The long cooking process (hours and hours) breaks down the long fibers, but the vacuum environment keeps 100% of the fat and moisture inside the steak.  You can cook bottom round or chuck this way, and it will still come out as tender as any ribeye you've ever had.  Just pull it out of the bath, pop it in a hot cast iron for a few seconds on either side, and serve.  You don't even need to rest it.

And of course, that's just meat.  You can cook anything this way.  Set it to 62.0 C, and make the most perfect soft boiled egg of your life.  BBQ ribs, duck confit, lobster, chocolate pudding... fark, now I'm hungry.  Have a ball.


Ok, this looks great.  Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

/currently googling
 
2013-02-15 11:32:07 AM  

DirkValentine: Z-clipped: log_jammin: Z-clipped: sous vide poaching

hmmm...I must look into this.....

Styrofoam Cooler + Vacuum Sealer + Temp Controller + Immersion Heater

Total Price: $162
(If you already have an old manual crockpot or rice cooker, you don't even need the first and last items)

Grill cooked Med Rare:

[beta.images.theglobeandmail.com image 620x349]

vs. Sous Vide Med Rare:

[people.ece.cornell.edu image 600x401]

[cdn.biggestmenu.com image 500x375]

[cdn.biggestmenu.com image 500x375]

And pictures don't do justice to the texture.  The long cooking process (hours and hours) breaks down the long fibers, but the vacuum environment keeps 100% of the fat and moisture inside the steak.  You can cook bottom round or chuck this way, and it will still come out as tender as any ribeye you've ever had.  Just pull it out of the bath, pop it in a hot cast iron for a few seconds on either side, and serve.  You don't even need to rest it.

And of course, that's just meat.  You can cook anything this way.  Set it to 62.0 C, and make the most perfect soft boiled egg of your life.  BBQ ribs, duck confit, lobster, chocolate pudding... fark, now I'm hungry.  Have a ball.

Ok, this looks great.  Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

/currently googling


You heat the water to a temperature around the med rare temperature for meat, so something around 130 degrees.  So the meat ends up uniformly done all the way through.  Then you put the caramelization on the outside by putting it in on a really hot surface for a short period of time.
 
2013-02-15 11:35:02 AM  

Cyno01: tylerdurden217: They need to find a way to turn their useless bones into muscle so we can eat that too. Just a mass of muscle and fat that we can feed until mature and then slaughter. Make sure it has a working brain and eyes so that it knows something is wrong... the fear will help with the marbling.

[www.sivatherium.narod.ru image 642x800][www.sivatherium.narod.ru image 651x800]


um, wtf is that ?
 
2013-02-15 12:07:59 PM  

DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.


The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.
 
2013-02-15 12:17:10 PM  

Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.


Thanks for the extra info. I've been reading up for a little bit now.  I've definitely seen this (think on Zimmern in St Paul) but didn't grok it in fullness.

Just got my tax refund back and now I know what a portion of that is going towards. Thanks!
 
2013-02-15 01:12:21 PM  

DirkValentine: Cyno01: tylerdurden217: They need to find a way to turn their useless bones into muscle so we can eat that too. Just a mass of muscle and fat that we can feed until mature and then slaughter. Make sure it has a working brain and eyes so that it knows something is wrong... the fear will help with the marbling.

[www.sivatherium.narod.ru image 642x800][www.sivatherium.narod.ru image 651x800]

um, wtf is that ?


Nightmare fuel.
 
2013-02-15 01:37:44 PM  

Cyno01: DirkValentine: Cyno01: tylerdurden217: They need to find a way to turn their useless bones into muscle so we can eat that too. Just a mass of muscle and fat that we can feed until mature and then slaughter. Make sure it has a working brain and eyes so that it knows something is wrong... the fear will help with the marbling.

[www.sivatherium.narod.ru image 642x800][www.sivatherium.narod.ru image 651x800]

um, wtf is that ?

Nightmare fuel.


Ok, i'm 2 minutes into this and am a little bothered.

Thanks!

/reminescent of Galapagos by Vonnegut.
 
2013-02-15 07:32:58 PM  

Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.


Many thanks for turning me onto this, as this is the first I have heard of it, and I do a ton of cooking.Cheers
 
2013-02-15 11:05:35 PM  
Just use better ketchup, dang.
 
2013-02-16 01:18:09 AM  

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: It seems to weird to me that we embrace technological and scientific advancement when it comes to medicine, transportation, communication, etc... but when it comes to food we're like bewildered tribespeople. We have such an anti-intellectual, primitivist view on the meat and agriculture industry, and it all boils down to different variations of the naturalist fallacy.

"Remember when food tasted like food" yeah, about two hours ago when I had shrimp and asparagus for dinner. Tasted great to me! I'm fortunate to live in a time when food is abundant and cheap.


You are exactly right... except for the part where growth hormones are screwing up humans, pesticides likely causing cancer, and we are screwing up ecosystems with intensive livestocking and farming practices that nature can't handle. But other than that spot on.

Last night I had an awesome steak. Surprise, surprise the steakhouse gets their meat from a local guy that doesn't use growth hormone crap. When scientists can come up with a seasoning that can trick me into believing that Wal-Mart steaks are as good as natural grass-fed beef cuts, you'll have a point. (Pro-tip, the omega fatty acid profile between grass and grain-fed beef are completely different, let alone the change when you add growth hormones.) Go eat your tasteless franken-food if that's what you like. I'll stick to meats that taste like nature intended: delicious.
 
2013-02-17 07:38:43 AM  

DirkValentine: Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.

Thanks for the extra info. I've been reading up for a little bit now.  I've definitely seen this (think on Zimmern in St Paul) but didn't grok it in fullness.

Just got my tax refund back and now I know what a portion of that is going towards. Thanks!



alienated: Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.

Many thanks for turning me onto this, as this is the first I have heard of it, and I do a ton of cooking.Cheers


Glad to hear it!  Post pictures of your experiments in the next Steak thread!
 
2013-02-17 07:45:08 AM  

Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.

Thanks for the extra info. I've been reading up for a little bit now.  I've definitely seen this (think on Zimmern in St Paul) but didn't grok it in fullness.

Just got my tax refund back and now I know what a portion of that is going towards. Thanks!


alienated: Z-clipped: DirkValentine: Though i'm having a hard time understanding how the meat stays so rare.

The trick is that instead of putting the meat in contact with a very hot surface and creating a large temperature gradient, you're using the high latent heat of water to ensure that no part of the steak ever rises above your target temp.  Since the "doneness" is based solely on the temp, it never cooks past med rare, no matter how long you leave it in the bath.  It will turn to mush if you leave it in too long though... but we're talking like, 6 hours too long.

I guarantee that if you invite people over for steak, and don't tell them what you're doing, the looks on their faces as they try to figure out how you got the meat so perfect will be priceless.

Many thanks for turning me onto this, as this is the first I have heard of it, and I do a ton of cooking.Cheers

Glad to hear it!  Post pictures of your experiments in the next Steak thread!


Oh, dude, I will for sure.   I'm wondering - recommendations for the vaccum sealing?  I've used them for my, um, "flowers", but perhaps there is a best option?
 
2013-02-17 10:06:32 AM  

DirkValentine: Oh, dude, I will for sure.   I'm wondering - recommendations for the vaccum sealing?  I've used them for my, um, "flowers", but perhaps there is a best option?


Vacuum sealers all pretty much work on the same principle, and they all last for about as long as you can keep the pump from getting full of gunk from blood/marinades/sauces and that sort of thing.  Since it's going to fail eventually, I'd start with a cheap one.  The one I linked above is the cheapest I saw on Amazon (~$40), and the reviews say it works just fine.  You'll need either some sealing bags (easy to find) or a roll of sealing plastic that you can make into bags with the sealer.

Just toss your meat in with some fresh herbs and whatever marinade you want. The cool thing about the vacuum is, it causes the cell membranes near the edges of the food to burst, so you get great capillary action on whatever liquid you put in the bag. The marinade is almost instant. (Also, you can use this action to make awesome pickles out of any vegetable you want basically instantly.  At my restaurant the cooks called them "quickles".)
 
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