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(Gawker)   Apparently some people question how a fire could burn a human body beyond recognition while leaving a perfectly intact drivers license handily available. Fark: The third copy of the license found in a week   (gawker.com) divider line 281
    More: Unlikely, Christopher Dorner, diplomatic recognition, Lindbergh Field, conspiracy theorists  
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20242 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Feb 2013 at 12:27 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-14 12:47:38 PM  

Captain Darling: From the comments

"I try not to be too tinfoil, but burning is really convenient since nobody can eyeball and identify the body that way. It's more important for the LAPD to publicly be seen to kill Dorner than for them to ACTUALLY kill Dorner. Think about it."


WTF? If Dorner wasn't really the guy in the cabin, he will surely attempt to kill again. How the hell would it profit the LAPD to fake his death?


Well, if you wanted to go full out Reynolds Wrap, you could say that Dorner planted the wallet there on his way out of the cabin, having first killed a guy about his size. If his plan is to make LE look like evil, murderous, jack-booted thugs (SUCCESS!) what better way than to make it look as if the idiots had burned an innocent man alive in a horrible overzealous case of mistaken identity.

No I don't actually believe this, but if we're using the heavy duty foil today...

I do, however, want an independent ME conducting the autopsy/ID. And an accurate wallet count.
 
2013-02-14 12:47:45 PM  

Rapmaster2000: This guy was standing up the jackboots of Obama's tyranny so had him silenced!


But he was an Obama supporter, also for gun control.  He was just particular about the form of jackbooted tyranny he wanted
 
2013-02-14 12:48:12 PM  

Surool: I'm confused... so NOW the big conspiracy is that the LAPD has faked this guys death to help him escape? I mean, if that isn't the case, all this guy would have to do to take down the department is pop up alive some place. I'm not sure what this particular piece of conspiracy theory would accomplish for the participants.


I believe the thinking is this:  The police would be embarrassed if it became public knowledge that the person who was killed in the fire was *NOT* Chris Dorner, therefore they are going to identify the body as him, even if it isn't.  Local cops on the scene wouldn't be able to tell anyway, just looking at crispy critter-type remains.

I don't agree with it, I think they got Dorner,  but I can see the logic there.
 
2013-02-14 12:48:17 PM  

fickenchucker: What a waste of conspiracy effort.  Who says a psycho didn't have multiple IDs, say a couple of credit cards left in a jacket he left behind while eluding police, a driver's license left somewhere else for the same reasons, and finally the bulk of his wallet with his old police ID passport at the final location?

And a body "burned beyond recognition" might simply be a melted head, but a portion of the body intact covering the final wallet.  It's not like the human body instantly degrades and self-immolates like a Fourth of July snake.


If you're planning to go on the run, why would you have multiple IDs in your own name, the one you would have already burned? You make multiple IDs in different names, not the same one. Also, the DMV doesn't let you keep your old license when they issue a new one.
 
2013-02-14 12:48:58 PM  

Snarfangel: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.

"I'm 007243911, and I have a license to drive."


No, Meester Bond, I expect you to MERGE!
 
2013-02-14 12:49:07 PM  
img842.imageshack.us
 
2013-02-14 12:49:08 PM  
Captain Darling:
From the comments

"I try not to be too tinfoil, but burning is really convenient since nobody can eyeball and identify the body that way. It's more important for the LAPD to publicly be seen to kill Dorner than for them to ACTUALLY kill Dorner. Think about it."


WTF? If Dorner wasn't really the guy in the cabin, he will surely attempt to kill again. How the hell would it profit the LAPD to fake his death?


He was actually caught alive earlier, somewhere else, and killed execution style to prevent him spilling some departmental beans at his trial.  Then they planted a dead hobo with his ID in the cabin to fake his death there.  This theory requires a massive cover-up involving numerous officers at multiple levels in the LAPD, as well as collusion from the medical examiner etc., so I don't really think it's very credible.
 
2013-02-14 12:49:21 PM  
Not sure you have to be a "truther" to see that something doesn't add up here. Now, if you want to speculate and conclude that Dorner was actually an alien and is now living in Cleveland under an alias and with a sex change, that's going a bit far. But merely noticing the discrepancy and raising an eyebrow doesn't make you paranoid or shrill or anything else connoted by "truther".
 
2013-02-14 12:49:21 PM  

fickenchucker: It's not like the human body instantly degrades and self-immolates like a Fourth of July snake.


It is if you do it right.
 
2013-02-14 12:49:32 PM  

Mija: On 9/11 the government claimed one of the highjackers paasports was found in the debri of the trade centers. Farkers defended that.


But none of the black boxes designed to withstand head-on mid air collisions and the ensuing fall to the ground from 10,000 feet were recovered.
 
2013-02-14 12:49:49 PM  

tenpoundsofcheese: cretinbob: Third copy I can't explain but if had been laying on his back on the floor when the fire started and the wallet was in his pocket, yes it would have survived intact.

Well, that would explain why he first laid down before shooting himself (a well known suicide technique)

He wouldn't want to take the risk that if he was standing that when his body crumpled to the floor, that his wallet would have been at risk of burning. He probably also had some frequent buyer cards (jamba juice?) that he didn't want to ruin.


Could have had a Plan B of life insurance in case his felonious plan failed? I can't find mention of any kids, but he did have a mother.

I keep meaning to buy life insurance but spend my money on booze instead. Perhaps some Farkers could take up a collection to pay premiums and in exchange be beneficiaries? My sister's family doesn't need the money but maybe a struggling parent out there could gain by my eventual demise. (Just because I've survived some terrible & stupid shiat doesn't mean I'll NEVER die.) BIE. EIP.

I'm kind of disappointed the case is over already. And, though I understand the rationale, I'm dismayed that he killed his enemy's daughter and her boyfriend instead of a more reasonable target; on the other hand it seems they died pretty quickly and there are ~5 billion too many people on Earth already so I'm not bent out of shape about it. It's just that there are so few heroes out there anymore and I was hoping Dorner would be a black super-Rambo.

Still, maybe some radical-fringers out there will name a Liberation Front after him. It's not like there were ever any revolutionary saints with completely blameless lives: even Jesus pissed off a bunch of money-changers who were only trying to make an honest living.
 
2013-02-14 12:51:40 PM  
How fat was he?
 
2013-02-14 12:51:49 PM  
Even more curious is they still haven't found his long form drivers license. What is Dorner hiding?
 
2013-02-14 12:51:54 PM  
<b>Bit'O'Gristle</b>
<i>... So fark him. And fark all you jackasses who took this murdering asshole's side. Whatever valid point he had died when he started killing innocent people. </i>

Truth doesn't become lies just because you learned to hate the speaker.
 
2013-02-14 12:52:08 PM  

Oerath: I'm not a tinfoil hat wearing nutter (I swear!), but I would totally believe that the LAPD meant to kill him and set the fire on purpose. To keep it from going to trial and letting him accuse them of a bunch of stuff and drag the whole thing out.


He had already made his accusations and they were well documented. Him being dead changes nothing.
 
2013-02-14 12:52:37 PM  

DrPainMD: Stone Meadow: Okay class, who didn't get the memo that cop killers are going to die become the victims of first degree, premeditated murder when the cops catch up to them? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

FTFY


twimg0-a.akamaihd.net
 
2013-02-14 12:53:05 PM  

hasty ambush: Rapmaster2000: This guy was standing up the jackboots of Obama's tyranny so had him silenced!

But he was an Obama supporter, also for gun control.  He was just particular about the form of jackbooted tyranny he wanted


Yeah, that's what THEY want you to believe.
 
2013-02-14 12:53:19 PM  
i272.photobucket.com

NOT POSSIBLE!!!!

/wrong thread?
 
2013-02-14 12:53:24 PM  
I actually have a feeling this guy isn't dead. It's not as far-fetched as 9/11 or the birther's movement. The guy has military AND law enforcement experience, and knows exactly how they're going to operate. What better way to get some heat to die down than for your pursuers to think you're dead? Crazy may be crazy, but crazy is very smart, too.
 
2013-02-14 12:53:31 PM  

cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.


Driver's. Possessive apostrophe.
 
2013-02-14 12:55:06 PM  

Sandwyrm: <b>Bit'O'Gristle</b>
<i>... So fark him. And fark all you jackasses who took this murdering asshole's side. Whatever valid point he had died when he started killing innocent people. </i>

Truth doesn't become lies just because you learned to hate the speaker.


Whatever he said about the department doesn't suddenly justify murder.
 
2013-02-14 12:55:36 PM  

the ha ha guy: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.


No, it's "driver's license", not "driver license".


Apparently in CA, it IS driver license:

icenter.ucsd.edu
 
2013-02-14 12:56:27 PM  

Mikey1969: You have cops firing upon two completely unrelated vehicles that only look similar because they are the same type of vehicle(A truck). They shoot up both of these vehicles with no warning whatsoever, and the drivers look nothing like the suspect.


Based upon that behavior alone, Dorner may have had a valid self-defense argument against the cops he killed later on:  It's plain that they weren't going to give him the opportunity to surrender peacefully, and indeed, subsequent events show that do be true.  Wouldn't matter if he walked out with his hands up, the slightest movement on his part would have resulted in his being shot dead.   No opportunity for him to avail himself of due process.

Of course, the situation was entirely of his making, but it's still unacceptable behavior on the part of the police forces involved.  Two wrongs don't make a right.
 
2013-02-14 12:56:29 PM  

vpb: It's funny how these carefully scripted conspiracies always involve really careless oversights like multiple wallets and phony shooting victim photographs.

At least we know that reporters never make lazy mistakes so obviously it's a conspiracy between Obama, the Israelis and the sekrit muslins.

Oh, and the UN too.


I think that is totally plausible and probable, but yet these questions will go unanswered. I want to know the truth as to how the happened regardless of what it might be. This is just like in Sandy Hook how conflicting reports came out about the AR-15 not being used and video showing it being pulled out of the trunk, or what happened with the guy the arrested out in the woods and have both an adult and child eyewitness on the news saying someone was handcuffed and placed in the front seat of a cop car.

It probably is just media screwing  up, but we deserve to know the truth of how this happens and the news agency held accountable for reporting false information.
 
2013-02-14 12:56:59 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Surool: I'm confused... so NOW the big conspiracy is that the LAPD has faked this guys death to help him escape?

Conspiracy theorists are a funny bunch.


I think the theory is that he escaped and they're covering that up
 
2013-02-14 12:57:15 PM  

SkylineRecords: I actually have a feeling this guy isn't dead. It's not as far-fetched as 9/11 or the birther's movement. The guy has military AND law enforcement experience, and knows exactly how they're going to operate. What better way to get some heat to die down than for your pursuers to think you're dead? Crazy may be crazy, but crazy is very smart, too.


I would be inclined to agree with you if in fact they did not have a shoot out with a guy who they cornered in the cabin which they covered all of the entrances and set up road check points in the surrounding area. So what, he paid someone who happens to look like him to shoot at the cops, run inside, and kill himself? He had dug a 2 mile long tunnel that once inside the cabin, he was able to walk through to his get away car with a disguise in it?
 
2013-02-14 12:57:42 PM  

amindtat: the ha ha guy: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.


No, it's "driver's license", not "driver license".

Apparently in CA, it IS driver license:

[icenter.ucsd.edu image 225x146]


Huh. NY as well. Who knew?
 
2013-02-14 12:57:46 PM  

The One True TheDavid: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.

Driver's. Possessive apostrophe.



No, it's Driver License.  No s, no apostrophe.  Check the California DMV site

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/home/dmv.htm
 
2013-02-14 12:58:26 PM  

SkylineRecords: I actually have a feeling this guy isn't dead. It's not as far-fetched as 9/11 or the birther's movement. The guy has military AND law enforcement experience, and knows exactly how they're going to operate. What better way to get some heat to die down than for your pursuers to think you're dead? Crazy may be crazy, but crazy is very smart, too.


Plus the guy is seeped in pop culture. So much so he probably thinks that stuff in the movies would work and give it a try: Kill some homeless guy who fits the basic characteristics, plant evidence, burn down cabin and try to sneak out during the chaos.

I don't believe the cops would fake it.  This is personal, not some quick murder they want off the books.  They aren't about to let Dorner live free by faking his death so they can close the case.
 
2013-02-14 12:58:53 PM  
At this point, if the LAPD said that the sky was blue, I'd go running outside to see if the sky had turned red.  It's as if the Keystone Cops have been given loaded guns.
 
2013-02-14 12:59:32 PM  

MFAWG: Popcorn Johnny: Surool: I'm confused... so NOW the big conspiracy is that the LAPD has faked this guys death to help him escape?

Conspiracy theorists are a funny bunch.

I think the theory is that he escaped and they're covering that up


That is an ENORMOUS gamble. If he showed up anywhere, it would be like the Huck Finn funeral. I don't think they would gamble on that. They would be much better off saying he escaped after shooting two of their officers.
 
2013-02-14 12:59:49 PM  

No Such Agency: Captain Darling:
From the comments

"I try not to be too tinfoil, but burning is really convenient since nobody can eyeball and identify the body that way. It's more important for the LAPD to publicly be seen to kill Dorner than for them to ACTUALLY kill Dorner. Think about it."


WTF? If Dorner wasn't really the guy in the cabin, he will surely attempt to kill again. How the hell would it profit the LAPD to fake his death?

He was actually caught alive earlier, somewhere else, and killed execution style to prevent him spilling some departmental beans at his trial.  Then they planted a dead hobo with his ID in the cabin to fake his death there.  This theory requires a massive cover-up involving numerous officers at multiple levels in the LAPD, as well as collusion from the medical examiner etc., so I don't really think it's very credible.


Why not just plant the dead Dorner in the cabin?
 
2013-02-14 01:00:19 PM  

namegoeshere: amindtat: the ha ha guy: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.


No, it's "driver's license", not "driver license".

Apparently in CA, it IS driver license:

[icenter.ucsd.edu image 225x146]

Huh. NY as well. Who knew?


I knew
 
2013-02-14 01:01:27 PM  
How about this: guy in the cabin wasn't Dorner after all, and after the last few cases of mistaken identity on the LAPD's part, they decided that having one cop killer on the loose but too scared to kill any more cops right away would be more acceptable than admitting they screwed up yet again, and this time killed an innocent man in the most painful way imaginable. So the cops on the scene use their knowledge of forensics to ensure the body is completely unidentifiable except by a '"throw down" id, and otherwise go through the motions of doing their duty.

/or may be they actually got Dorner, but like the OJ case, decided some "extra evidence" needed to be introduced
//when the whole city is dependent on Hollywood to generate money, don't be surprised when everything is carefully staged
 
2013-02-14 01:01:51 PM  

dittybopper: Mikey1969: You have cops firing upon two completely unrelated vehicles that only look similar because they are the same type of vehicle(A truck). They shoot up both of these vehicles with no warning whatsoever, and the drivers look nothing like the suspect.

Based upon that behavior alone, Dorner may have had a valid self-defense argument against the cops he killed later on:  It's plain that they weren't going to give him the opportunity to surrender peacefully, and indeed, subsequent events show that do be true.  Wouldn't matter if he walked out with his hands up, the slightest movement on his part would have resulted in his being shot dead.   No opportunity for him to avail himself of due process.

Of course, the situation was entirely of his making, but it's still unacceptable behavior on the part of the police forces involved.  Two wrongs don't make a right.


They had him completely surrounded, they could have just cut off his water at the street and waited a few days for him to get weak to the point he couldn't fight back and strolled in and picked him up off the floor.

Won't be long before they just mark guys like this a terrorist and drone strike his house now that "due process" is just a high-ranking bureaucrat giving the go ahead.
 
2013-02-14 01:01:54 PM  
Satanic_Hamster:

He really thinks we can't identify a burnt body?

It'll take a while. So if that was his plan he could have made it work long enough to get away. Remember the secret tunnel in The Thing? Still doubt it though, dammit.

As for police complicity, I learned from TV that cops all over hate anybody who kills a cop, even an ex-cop like him, so they'd be much less likely to let him live if they could do anything about it. And not only cops: it'd be open season on him all over the lower 48 at least, kill this guy and become an instant hero. You know, like Christopher Scarver.
 
2013-02-14 01:02:29 PM  

MFAWG: Popcorn Johnny: Surool: I'm confused... so NOW the big conspiracy is that the LAPD has faked this guys death to help him escape?

Conspiracy theorists are a funny bunch.

I think the theory is that he escaped and they're covering that up


...and the rest of my post pointed out that all he would have to do to completely destroy the department is be caught (or found) alive. That's why I said the idea of him being alive makes no sense.
 
2013-02-14 01:03:03 PM  

SkylineRecords: I actually have a feeling this guy isn't dead. It's not as far-fetched as 9/11 or the birther's movement. The guy has military AND law enforcement experience, and knows exactly how they're going to operate. What better way to get some heat to die down than for your pursuers to think you're dead? Crazy may be crazy, but crazy is very smart, too.


This.

i262.photobucket.com
Has anyone checked the back entrance to the mine?
 
2013-02-14 01:03:10 PM  

mizchief: It probably is just media screwing  up, but we deserve to know the truth of how this happens and the news agency held accountable for reporting false information.


You wanna know how it happens?

Money.

You see, news agencies are funded by advertising.  If a particular news agency can show higher ratings than its competitors, it can charge more money per unit of advertising.  In the news business, you get ratings by being the first with information.  It doesn't really seem to matter if it's *WRONG* information, so long as you get it out there first.  People want the most up-to-date information, and rarely does wrong information come back to seriously bite the news agency unless you can show they reported incorrect information intentionally, so the bias is towards getting information out as quickly as you can, with minimal fact checking, on breaking news stories.
 
2013-02-14 01:04:50 PM  

the money is in the banana stand: SkylineRecords: I actually have a feeling this guy isn't dead. It's not as far-fetched as 9/11 or the birther's movement. The guy has military AND law enforcement experience, and knows exactly how they're going to operate. What better way to get some heat to die down than for your pursuers to think you're dead? Crazy may be crazy, but crazy is very smart, too.

I would be inclined to agree with you if in fact they did not have a shoot out with a guy who they cornered in the cabin which they covered all of the entrances and set up road check points in the surrounding area. So what, he paid someone who happens to look like him to shoot at the cops, run inside, and kill himself? He had dug a 2 mile long tunnel that once inside the cabin, he was able to walk through to his get away car with a disguise in it?


All I'm saying is never underestimate what crazy has planned, and be even more afraid of what they haven't planned.
 
2013-02-14 01:05:41 PM  

Deep Contact: All police carry fire proof licenses. Everyone knows that.



Yup. Its probably made out of the same material as the 9/11 hijacker's passport.
 
2013-02-14 01:06:19 PM  

Mikey1969: Also, the DMV doesn't let you keep your old license when they issue a new one.



Yes and no - they do want your old license back when you are issued a new one, but it isn't mandatory (at least in Ohio). I have never given back any of my old driver's licenses. As long as you have another valid government ID you are good to go. I always take my passport with me when I get my license renewed and they have never made an issue of it.
 
2013-02-14 01:06:39 PM  

cfroelic: The One True TheDavid: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.

Driver's. Possessive apostrophe.


No, it's Driver License.  No s, no apostrophe.  Check the California DMV site

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/home/dmv.htm



A government agency that doesn't understand basic grammar does not overrule every other state (and country) that properly spells it with the possessive apostrophe.
 
2013-02-14 01:06:58 PM  

syberpud: SkylineRecords: I actually have a feeling this guy isn't dead. It's not as far-fetched as 9/11 or the birther's movement. The guy has military AND law enforcement experience, and knows exactly how they're going to operate. What better way to get some heat to die down than for your pursuers to think you're dead? Crazy may be crazy, but crazy is very smart, too.

Plus the guy is seeped in pop culture. So much so he probably thinks that stuff in the movies would work and give it a try: Kill some homeless guy who fits the basic characteristics, plant evidence, burn down cabin and try to sneak out during the chaos.

I don't believe the cops would fake it.  This is personal, not some quick murder they want off the books.  They aren't about to let Dorner live free by faking his death so they can close the case.


I believe it's him, personally. But if we're going with the theory that it's not, I think it would have been more a case of they thought they were burning him alive, but got in there and realized that they burned up the wrong person, and thought, "Oh shiat. If people were pissed about the old lady in the truck... Quick, leak that we found his wallet next to the body. Now shut up, it's him."
 
2013-02-14 01:08:31 PM  

cfroelic: namegoeshere: amindtat: the ha ha guy: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.


No, it's "driver's license", not "driver license".

Apparently in CA, it IS driver license:

[icenter.ucsd.edu image 225x146]

Huh. NY as well. Who knew?

I knew


Oh fine, Mr. DriveR License Nazi Smarty Pants Man. Enjoy your moment in the smart seat.
 
2013-02-14 01:10:48 PM  

cfroelic: The One True TheDavid: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.

Driver's. Possessive apostrophe.


No, it's Driver License.  No s, no apostrophe.  Check the California DMV site

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/home/dmv.htm


driver? don't even know her.
at least up here it's driver's license.  Take off eh?
 
2013-02-14 01:11:01 PM  

dittybopper: mizchief: It probably is just media screwing  up, but we deserve to know the truth of how this happens and the news agency held accountable for reporting false information.

You wanna know how it happens?

Money.

You see, news agencies are funded by advertising.  If a particular news agency can show higher ratings than its competitors, it can charge more money per unit of advertising.  In the news business, you get ratings by being the first with information.  It doesn't really seem to matter if it's *WRONG* information, so long as you get it out there first.  People want the most up-to-date information, and rarely does wrong information come back to seriously bite the news agency unless you can show they reported incorrect information intentionally, so the bias is towards getting information out as quickly as you can, with minimal fact checking, on breaking news stories.


Who goes back and forth between news channels trying to see who reported something first? Who decides to switch their allegance to one news channel because they're charting stories and they conclude that CNN reports news 4.37 minutes faster than MSNBC on average? FOX News has the highest ratings and they are the least reputable. I don't think your theory stands up.
 
2013-02-14 01:11:16 PM  

acaciaavenue: You can apply for your license and claim it got lost in the mail. They will send you a duplicate. It's pretty easy.


They send you a license in the mail if you apply for one? Wow.
 
2013-02-14 01:12:25 PM  

amindtat: the ha ha guy: cfroelic: It's driver license, not drivers license.


No, it's "driver's license", not "driver license".

Apparently in CA, it IS driver license:

[icenter.ucsd.edu image 225x146]


It's "Driver License" everywhere. Somebody is stupid or trollin.
 
2013-02-14 01:12:46 PM  

Therion: vpb: It's funny how these carefully scripted conspiracies always involve really careless oversights like multiple wallets and phony shooting victim photographs.

[www.trbimg.com image 600x392]

Yeah, photoshopped and obviously fake.


Well duh.  Have you ever seen a gun that leaves both square & numbered bullet holes?
 
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