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(Engadget)   Triple the capacity of today's batteries? Full recharges in 10 minutes? More than 2,000 charging cycles? Shut up and take my money   (engadget.com) divider line 75
    More: Cool, anodes, lithium-ion battery, capability management  
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8578 clicks; posted to Geek » on 14 Feb 2013 at 11:14 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-14 11:19:44 AM
That sounds like a game changer. Lets hope it lives up to expectations.
 
2013-02-14 11:23:55 AM
COULD. New tech is great. Pursuit of better is also great. But, I'll wait until they actually build a battery that lives up to those expectations.
 
2013-02-14 11:31:39 AM
"Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years "

Translation: we will never see this technology hit the market
 
2013-02-14 11:35:04 AM

abigsmurf: "Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years "

Translation: we will never see this technology hit the market


MIT had a battery revolution last year as well. I guess we.ll have to see which tech fails to hit the market last.
 
2013-02-14 11:39:05 AM
Idk. Within a month of use, the battery from my brand new Galaxy SIII suddenly developed the ability to achieve full charge in less than 10 minutes. The trade off was, it also discharged in about 10 minutes. Software Defined Battery?
 
2013-02-14 11:41:04 AM

NBSV: COULD. New tech is great. Pursuit of better is also great. But, I'll wait until they actually build a battery that lives up to those expectations.


I'll wait until they can actually mass produce one.
 
2013-02-14 11:42:27 AM

abigsmurf: "Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years "

Translation: we will never see this technology hit the market


I dunno, that's on the border of actually believable. It takes time to tool up a production facility, after all. When they say "5-7 years" or "5-10 years" then you know it's vaporware.
 
2013-02-14 11:44:05 AM
Obligatory XKCD:
imgs.xkcd.com
 
2013-02-14 11:46:20 AM
I feel better about these kinds of stories when the story has a picture of an actual battery - so, basically... never.   Too many of these "Here's a microscopic sample of powder that theoretically would hold... blah blah blah"

And I REALLY WANT TO BUY IN TO THIS STUFF, seriously give me a 100% electric car.  Give me a washing machine sized battery pack that could power my house for 48 hours - hell I'd start digging the footers for the windmill that day!  But it can't cost 50x normal prices or be perpetually 5 to 10 years away.
 
2013-02-14 11:50:52 AM
much like Fark itself, this will not be available for Android.
 
2013-02-14 11:57:53 AM
My single biggest biatch about all my gadgets is the battery issue.

Fix it!
 
2013-02-14 12:06:32 PM
Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years, which isn't long to wait if the invention saves us from constantly hunting for the nearest wall outlet.

Fark "finding a wall outlet", this needs to be the direction they head in with electric cars. With higher capacity and lower recharge times, this could actually make it feasible to take an electric car on a real trip. I ride down to AZ every year, and we break the trip into halves, staying over in Vegas overnight. There's a recharge there. We usually have to stop every hour or two, with 2 adults, 2 teenagers and a 4 year old, it's hard to get everyone synced together on food, sodas and bathroom breaks. 2 stops at 10 minutes each is probably what we already do, so there are 2 more recharges right there. I could take this electric car on my 650 miles each direction trip. Otherwise, an electric car is a waste right now.
 
2013-02-14 12:07:01 PM
I expect to see one of the 8 or 10 new battery technologies in production within a decade. Don't know which one though.
 
2013-02-14 12:09:06 PM

Fizpez: I feel better about these kinds of stories when the story has a picture of an actual battery - so, basically... never.


To be fair, it sounds like the big breakthrough here is something that we couldn't see anyway(nanowires). Otherwise, the battery looks like a battery.

At least, that's my takeaway from this one.
 
2013-02-14 12:13:13 PM

Mikey1969: I could take this electric car on my 650 miles each direction trip. Otherwise, an electric car is a waste right now.


You could do that today in a Tesla model S with two stops of 45 minutes each (lunch and dinner?).  The rub is that they don't have chargers everywhere yet.  That'll no longer be true at the end of the year.
 
2013-02-14 12:14:20 PM

Mikey1969: Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years, which isn't long to wait if the invention saves us from constantly hunting for the nearest wall outlet.

Fark "finding a wall outlet", this needs to be the direction they head in with electric cars. With higher capacity and lower recharge times, this could actually make it feasible to take an electric car on a real trip. I ride down to AZ every year, and we break the trip into halves, staying over in Vegas overnight. There's a recharge there. We usually have to stop every hour or two, with 2 adults, 2 teenagers and a 4 year old, it's hard to get everyone synced together on food, sodas and bathroom breaks. 2 stops at 10 minutes each is probably what we already do, so there are 2 more recharges right there. I could take this electric car on my 650 miles each direction trip. Otherwise, an electric car is a waste right now.


I'd be happy with this technology in an electric motorcycle. I like what Brammo is doing with bikes, and I'd consider one for commuting, but with an "at best, under ideal conditions" range of 42 miles, and a 40 mile round trip commute to work (plugging in at work would not be an option), they just wouldn't be feasible to me as they are now.
 
2013-02-14 12:20:33 PM
Best standard size batteries currently on market. 2500mAh.  I can pop my Speedlite flashes as fast as I can fire my camera trigger.  Recommend that you get a high-end Lacrosse charger like the 700.
i.ebayimg.com

// hot image yada yada
 
2013-02-14 12:21:17 PM
media.comicvine.com
interested
 
2013-02-14 12:21:40 PM
That f**kin' Energizer bunny is NEVER going to stop beating that goddamn drum - is it?
 
2013-02-14 12:32:31 PM
FWIW, the next big innovations in battery life, already in the pipeline, isn't the batteries themselves. It's phone efficiency. Basically smarter use of cell radios and their handling of signals (especially noticeable when your phone is far from a tower), better software power management, and more efficient components, especially screens.

Up till now cell phone manufacturers have focused on making things bigger, faster, and prettier. The "faster" part still applies, but the other factors are remaining stagnant in the interest of more efficiency. And while it won't happen right away, optimization of these things should ultimately double battery life.

Of course, combine that with these sort of "triple capacity" batteries, and then you get serious innovation.
 
2013-02-14 12:33:18 PM
Still not enough energy density for a death ray.

/disappointed
 
2013-02-14 12:33:38 PM

NBSV: COULD. New tech is great. Pursuit of better is also great. But, I'll wait until they actually build a battery that lives up to those expectations.


This right here. Don't we get this "There's gonna be great new battery technology with X more life and Y less charge time!!!!" every year or so?
 
2013-02-14 12:47:40 PM

Plant Rights Activist: [media.comicvine.com image 399x276]
interested


Gendou doesn't give a shiat about battery technology.

He's got S2 engines.
 
2013-02-14 12:52:02 PM
Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years, which isn't long to wait if the invention saves us from constantly hunting for the nearest wall outlet changes everything.

Fixed.
 
2013-02-14 01:07:57 PM

Plant Rights Activist: interested


Plus 1.

Ty for the chuckle
 
2013-02-14 01:09:07 PM
xenomorpheus: Best standard size batteries currently on market. 2500mAh. I can pop my Speedlite flashes as fast as I can fire my camera trigger.

Ahh, before I settled on landscape photography, my speedlite ate batteries for breakfast (was using 2700 mAh batteries at the end).

// for me, AA batteries get handed down to devices with lower and lower power requirements as they age.

The flow is something like

speedlite -> xbox 360 controller -> wall clocks -> remote controls -> thermostat
 
2013-02-14 01:13:05 PM
Elon Musk to sue the school for saying that batteries don't have enough range in  3...2...1...
 
2013-02-14 01:31:09 PM

mjohnson71: NBSV: COULD. New tech is great. Pursuit of better is also great. But, I'll wait until they actually build a battery that lives up to those expectations.

This right here. Don't we get this "There's gonna be great new battery technology with X more life and Y less charge time!!!!" every year or so?


And we see new battery tech all of the time. Not groundbreaking leaps, but improvements constantly happening.
 
2013-02-14 01:31:22 PM
"Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years, "

Well, either in two to three years, we'll all be driving electric cars and using laptops and tablets that don't really ever need to be charged or this yet another "just around the corner" technology that never comes to fruition.

The "that would be awesome" in me hopes the former; the bitter, sad, depressed me expects the latter.
 
2013-02-14 01:34:55 PM

Hollie Maea: Mikey1969: I could take this electric car on my 650 miles each direction trip. Otherwise, an electric car is a waste right now.

You could do that today in a Tesla model S with two stops of 45 minutes each (lunch and dinner?).  The rub is that they don't have chargers everywhere yet.  That'll no longer be true at the end of the year.


The rub is, also, that I don't have $80,000 to spend on a car.

However, this would make something like the Volt (heck, take away the charging motor) or Leaf worthwile as a day-to-day vehicle.
 
2013-02-14 01:39:44 PM
No link to the article? What journal was this published in? I'm trying to find it.
 
2013-02-14 01:40:02 PM
Quick! Someone tell the Farkette that submitted this headline
 
2013-02-14 01:41:21 PM
Mikey1969: And we see new battery tech all of the time. Not groundbreaking leaps, but improvements constantly happening.

We have laptops now that run for 4+ hours on a charge, meanwhile I recall old school laptops lasting for about an hour and a half at the most (long enough to get you through one meeting).

// battery capacity increases, weight goes down, and devices get built that suck up all of that additional power (do you really need a quad core CPU to work on word documents?)
 
2013-02-14 01:43:18 PM
 
2013-02-14 01:53:21 PM

Tommy Moo: Found it:

http://nanolab.usc.edu/pdf%5CM_Ge_n_C_Zhou%20Porous%20doped%20Si%20N W% 20for%20Li%20Ion%20battery%20anode%20with%20long%20cycle%20life.pdf

Solving the thermal expansion problem was huge.



We wouldn't want a thermal curtain failure.


/Jinx put Max in space!
 
2013-02-14 01:53:29 PM

Fizpez: And I REALLY WANT TO BUY IN TO THIS STUFF, seriously give me a 100% electric car.


The Nissan Leaf is available now, if you're in the U.S. you can get a Federal credit of $7500, and if you're in California, another $2500 credit, for a price of $25k. And the range is fine for most people's daily commute. Supposedly Nissan is offering 10 annual days of the use of another car if you want to go on long distance trips.

Not to leave out Ford -- the Focus Electric is $29k after Fed & CA credits.

And then there's Tesla, Mitsubishi, Honda and Toyota with all-electric cars this year. +/- price and looks.
 
2013-02-14 02:01:13 PM

fluffy2097: deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrp...


FTFY...threadshiatter.  There is a whole 200+ comment thread devoted to that topic, this thread is about R & D level battery tech, and even the article mentions it is envisioned for small personal electronic devices and not cars.

/sigh
 
2013-02-14 02:05:56 PM

StopLurkListen: Fizpez: And I REALLY WANT TO BUY IN TO THIS STUFF, seriously give me a 100% electric car.

The Nissan Leaf is available now, if you're in the U.S. you can get a Federal credit of $7500, and if you're in California, another $2500 credit, for a price of $25k. And the range is fine for most people's daily commute. Supposedly Nissan is offering 10 annual days of the use of another car if you want to go on long distance trips.

Not to leave out Ford -- the Focus Electric is $29k after Fed & CA credits.

And then there's Tesla, Mitsubishi, Honda and Toyota with all-electric cars this year. +/- price and looks.


I will probably buy one of these used in a couple years - I can swing $30k for a new car but philosophically I won't.

Drove a '92 Camry with 225k miles on it that gets 15-17 mpg to work today - the inside is clean and the body is in great shape.  With a V6 it actually has great pick up.   Paid $1000 for it 3.5 years ago when it had 195k miles...  You can afford a lot of gas when you only paid a grand for a car you've driven for over 3 years but I will look to do better with the milage when it finally dies - hybrid or full electric if I can.
 
2013-02-14 02:08:50 PM

my_cats_breath_smells_like_cat_food: fluffy2097: deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrp...

FTFY...threadshiatter.  There is a whole 200+ comment thread devoted to that topic, this thread is about R & D level battery tech, and even the article mentions it is envisioned for small personal electronic devices and not cars.

/sigh


Time to stop farking brosephina. u mad.
 
2013-02-14 02:15:26 PM
This is more of a windfall for phones and tablets coming out in 2016.
All they need now is to get some color e-paper with a better refresh rate and you could have a really killer product.
 
2013-02-14 02:16:28 PM

fluffy2097: my_cats_breath_smells_like_cat_food: fluffy2097: deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrp...

FTFY...threadshiatter.  There is a whole 200+ comment thread devoted to that topic, this thread is about R & D level battery tech, and even the article mentions it is envisioned for small personal electronic devices and not cars.

/sigh

Time to stop farking brosephina. u mad.


/sigh
 
2013-02-14 02:20:24 PM

Fizpez: Drove a '92 Camry with 225k miles on it that gets 15-17 mpg to work today


Gawd... that would drive me nuts. The worst mileage I've ever gotten is our present Subaru which gets 20/27 mpg, but you pay for AWD somehow. Even my beater 1982 BMW 528e got 25/29. I spent 7 years getting 41/46 mpg in my Civic hybrid, more if I felt like hypermiling.
 
2013-02-14 02:21:06 PM

my_cats_breath_smells_like_cat_food: fluffy2097: my_cats_breath_smells_like_cat_food: fluffy2097: deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrp...

FTFY...threadshiatter.  There is a whole 200+ comment thread devoted to that topic, this thread is about R & D level battery tech, and even the article mentions it is envisioned for small personal electronic devices and not cars.

/sigh

Time to stop farking brosephina. u mad.

/sigh


stop shiatting up the thread with your sighs and whining about thread shiatting

/threadshiatter
//threadshiatting
///same difference.
 
2013-02-14 02:27:38 PM

lordargent: Mikey1969: And we see new battery tech all of the time. Not groundbreaking leaps, but improvements constantly happening.

We have laptops now that run for 4+ hours on a charge, meanwhile I recall old school laptops lasting for about an hour and a half at the most (long enough to get you through one meeting).

// battery capacity increases, weight goes down, and devices get built that suck up all of that additional power (do you really need a quad core CPU to work on word documents?)


My laptop from 2003 could run 4.5-5 hours with the brightness and processor turned all the way down. If I didn't do that, it would run for 2 hours tops.
 
2013-02-14 02:32:57 PM

Supes: FWIW, the next big innovations in battery life, already in the pipeline, isn't the batteries themselves. It's phone efficiency. Basically smarter use of cell radios and their handling of signals (especially noticeable when your phone is far from a tower), better software power management, and more efficient components, especially screens.

Up till now cell phone manufacturers have focused on making things bigger, faster, and prettier. The "faster" part still applies, but the other factors are remaining stagnant in the interest of more efficiency. And while it won't happen right away, optimization of these things should ultimately double battery life.

Of course, combine that with these sort of "triple capacity" batteries, and then you get serious innovation.


They're always improving electronics efficiency. They've been doing it from the start. My iPad cranks out better graphics than my laptop and barely gets warm. Meanwhile, the laptop is getting crazy hot and is super loud from the fans running full speed.
 
2013-02-14 02:39:37 PM

Mikey1969: Researchers estimate that there should be products with silicon-equipped lithium-ion packs inside of two to three years, which isn't long to wait if the invention saves us from constantly hunting for the nearest wall outlet.

Fark "finding a wall outlet", this needs to be the direction they head in with electric cars. With higher capacity and lower recharge times, this could actually make it feasible to take an electric car on a real trip. I ride down to AZ every year, and we break the trip into halves, staying over in Vegas overnight. There's a recharge there. We usually have to stop every hour or two, with 2 adults, 2 teenagers and a 4 year old, it's hard to get everyone synced together on food, sodas and bathroom breaks. 2 stops at 10 minutes each is probably what we already do, so there are 2 more recharges right there. I could take this electric car on my 650 miles each direction trip. Otherwise, an electric car is a waste right now.


The limitation with electric car charging isn't due to the ability of the battery to charge -- the Tesla supercharger can fill a Model S in 1 hr -- but rather the power delivery. The supercharger requires 440V at 200A, or roughly 90kW of electricity. Most homes and even office buildings don't have that kind of juice in a single circuit. And imagine trying to charge 6+ cars at the same time.

The only way I see around this would be if there were generators on-site at each charging station to create that kind of electricity. But then you just have the problem of waste again....
 
2013-02-14 02:52:45 PM

imgod2u: The limitation with electric car charging isn't due to the ability of the battery to charge -- the Tesla supercharger can fill a Model S in 1 hr -- but rather the power delivery. The supercharger requires 440V at 200A, or roughly 90kW of electricity. Most homes and even office buildings don't have that kind of juice in a single circuit. And imagine trying to charge 6+ cars at the same time.

The only way I see around this would be if there were generators on-site at each charging station to create that kind of electricity. But then you just have the problem of waste again....


The limitation is short run times+charging. Obviously, the infrastructure would have to change, but if they had the types of batteries available to make these cars actually travel a decent distance AND recharge in 10 minutes, then gas stations would start having charging terminals as well. I wasn't planning on running an extension cord out from my hotel room...
 
2013-02-14 03:00:42 PM
Tobin_Lam: My laptop from 2003 could run 4.5-5 hours with the brightness and processor turned all the way down. If I didn't do that, it would run for 2 hours tops.

Meanwhile there's a Thinkpad now that will run for 12 hours (stated) on the 9 cell battery.
 
2013-02-14 03:05:02 PM

imgod2u: The limitation with electric car charging isn't due to the ability of the battery to charge -- the Tesla supercharger can fill a Model S in 1 hr -- but rather the power delivery. The supercharger requires 440V at 200A, or roughly 90kW of electricity. Most homes and even office buildings don't have that kind of juice in a single circuit. And imagine trying to charge 6+ cars at the same time.


Most homes run off 200 amps TOTAL.

/The hilarity of our decades old power grid trying to support all these electric cars is going to be amazing.
 
2013-02-14 03:09:20 PM

xenomorpheus: Best standard size batteries currently on market. 2500mAh.  I can pop my Speedlite flashes as fast as I can fire my camera trigger.  Recommend that you get a high-end Lacrosse charger like the 700.
[i.ebayimg.com image 422x500]

// hot image yada yada


Darn...

I've been with the Ray-o-vac Hybrids for years and they've been outdoing everything else (The other popular brands) very easily.

They changed them last year and now they have two levels, regular and platinum and just looked them up and found that the platinum are 2000mAh.

I have no idea where I'd find these Sanyo ones locally... would probably need to order them... but price wise, are they worth it?..

Checking... hmm...found a local store that does and are 25$ the four pack.

A bit pricy (the Ray-o-Vac are barely 10-12$ for the 4-pack), gonna have to consider.
 
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