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(Orlando Sentinel)   New law lets HOA foreclose on house immediately if you miss a payment. Bonus: you can't legally challenge whether you actually owe the money   (orlandosentinel.com) divider line 192
    More: Florida, New Laws, HOA, De Land, secret ballots, homeowners associations, payments  
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16282 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Feb 2013 at 12:55 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-13 02:05:20 AM  
Yeah, I know a guy that lives on the 32nd floor of a condo. He is in the process of foreclosure with the bank. He also hasn't paid HOA fees for several months. They disabled his key fob for the elevator and yanked his underground parking. Now he has to get consierge to let him up (after a couple of days of climbing the stairs for a few days). I know the HOA prez and they bent over backward for him, but dude refused to attempt any payment at all.
 
2013-02-13 02:06:54 AM  
If only there were some way to combine cop hate, HOA-hate and cyclist hate into into 1 thread, it would be the ultimate hate trifecta!
 
2013-02-13 02:07:26 AM  

Aquapope: Sorry, I'm a dumbass about HOAs.  If I want to buy a house and I have the money and it's what the current owner is willing to sell for... how does the HOA have anything to say about it?  Why is an HOA agreement required for me to buy the house?  What's the dang deal?


There's this thing called Wikipedia...
 
2013-02-13 02:10:14 AM  
I'm okay with this.
This isn't a bill that is being 'voted on.' This is a bill that is being proposed, and even the person proposing it says that it's not in a complete form. It has to start somewhere, and from a business perspective it's bogus for the homeowners associations to have to wait years for someone to pay their HOA dues while benefiting from them. In it's current form it's not viable, but that's what the debate process is for.
So perhaps instead of blasting anything in support of HOAs, say how you would adjust the bill so that it remains legally viable and significantly addresses the HOA issues.
 
2013-02-13 02:12:26 AM  

CutBoard: This is a pure shiat deal in all ways. You protest the HOA and the only recourse you have is to pay the dues fully before you are able to file a lawsuit against them. So it means if I protest against your communist tactics, I have to pay to be able to keep you from foreclosing on my home because I am protesting against your communist tactics..yeah.....let's see how this one plays out.


Contesting a parking ticket can be like that. You have to pay the $30 ticket and an $80 administrative fee up front before being granted a hearing. Then if you win (you won't win) you get the $30 back, but the admin fee is gone. I think I should pay my property taxes the same way. They have to fill every pothole between my driveway and my office up front. Then if I don't see any road surface imperfections (there will be imperfections) I'll pay my taxes. Seems fair.
 
2013-02-13 02:15:28 AM  
Odd that HOA leaders don't "disappear" more often. Gators don't leave much evidence, and Florida is full of em.
 
2013-02-13 02:16:27 AM  

Aquapope: DarthBart: Aquapope: Sorry, I'm a dumbass about HOAs. If I want to buy a house and I have the money and it's what the current owner is willing to sell for... how does the HOA have anything to say about it? Why is an HOA agreement required for me to buy the house? What's the dang deal?

It's usually on the deed.

Ok, but why?  The seller shouldn't care anymore, they're selling.  So how does it get on a deed, a doc that pretty much only describes a property and defines ownership.  And if, as the buyer, I say "Take that shiat off the deed!" who do I say it to?  Who has authority to remove it (or modify it, for that matter)?  Are these deed codicils sunshined or is that property under HOA influence forever?   Is it a civil contract kind of thing, in which case it shouldn't involve anybody but the seller and buyer, or is the city/county somehow involved?  What the hell?  I want that house and I don't want HOA stinking up the place!  So why can't that happen?


It is usually placed on the deed by the developer of the neighborhood. To remove a deed restriction, you have to get all the parties who can enforce the restrictions to sign off on removing them. In this case you'd have to go to the HOA and ask them to remove the restrictions. Not gonna happen. The only way you could get a restriction removed without that hassle is if the restrictions violated laws, such as "this property may only be owned by a white male".
 
2013-02-13 02:17:11 AM  

BolloxReader: And once again I say, if you live in a HOA property you are giving up what few rights property owners otherwise might have.

Might as well just rent, because you control zilch. And if you don't control, you don't own.

Enjoy your privatized government hell. I'd rather live in the ghetto (and I have) than a HOA community. At least when you are at the corner of The and Hood you know what's up.


Over-react much?
 
2013-02-13 02:19:22 AM  

SpdrJay: If only there were some way to combine cop hate, HOA-hate and cyclist hate into into 1 thread, it would be the ultimate hate trifecta!


How about this headline: Bicycle Cop Gets Off On Being Dick As Local HOA President, Stumps For Tea Party Candidate
 
2013-02-13 02:19:50 AM  

jjorsett: Gyrfalcon: OK.

Foreclose on 7 or 8 houses because they owe you each less than a thousand dollars in back dues. You win, the families move out, and nobody else can afford to buy the homes and move in. So now your neighborhood is half-empty and now nobody is paying dues.

I think I may have spotted the flaw in your brilliant plan, but you just go ahead and start foreclosing you geniuses you.

Right, it would be much better to let deadbeats persist months/years at other's expense, racking up an increasing arrearage while the association limps along trying to keep the property from deteriorating and to meet its expenses, rather than forcing the owners to either perform on their obligations or get out and let in some people who can actually pay their bills.  At least the property will likely be bought by somebody who can afford it, and if not, the association will be no worse off since the departees weren't paying anyway.


That's more of a problem for the bank, as they will forclose on any real deadbeats. HOA's shouldn't have this "right". Loosen your bootstraps a little.
 
2013-02-13 02:22:46 AM  

slashmonkey: Then again you could always bankrupt them with an OBAMA sign that was 4" over regulation height their own stupidity:

http://www.kansas.com/2013/02/10/2670545/homeowners-association-spat -b rings.html


That was a very satisfying read.  Thank you!
 
2013-02-13 02:30:32 AM  

marcre3363: In theory, I'm against this.

In reality, I've been stuck running a 13 unit Condo building with assessments. And I understand the premise.

I had one unit that has been a thorn in my ass for years. She played the game all that time. While I spent hours of my personal time with lawyers, she was killing time and I had to deal with other unit owners complaining about her unit reaking of weed 24/7.

I've had to Sic attorney's on her twice in the last 18 months. Once went as far as where we evicted her, changed her locks and kicked her out. She "magically" came up with $4500 in back payments within 24 hours. In the six months before, I supervised the Gas and Electric company turning off her service because she was more than $1K overdue.

She was the rule. The exception to the rule are those that might miss a payment or two between a situation. But she was more than happy to play our building for years. She bought a brand new VW SUV, which she had for month before it was repossessed, then had a cab pick her up every morning for work while the rest of us walked to the train.

I think alot of these rules are crap. But when someone eventually buys her unit, in addition to taking our property values, the building will only re-coup six-months of back assesments. We're eating the cost of the thousands of dollars we spent to evict her previously.

Life's a game. She played it well and my hard-working neighbors and I are left footing the costs.


So...okay. Since you're being reasonable and have a fairly balanced view of this:

What was she getting for her HOA fees? How much were they, and why were they being paid? What was in the C&Cs that allowed her to smoke dope on the property 24/7 that nobody could call the cops and have her arrested? (Bearing in mind that she is the OWNER of her own property and gets to do as she pleases inside her own home, regardless of what it does to your "property values")

HOAs are a delicate balance between trying to keep the neighborhood nice and livable, and trying to restrict what people do in their own homes and their own property. It's not like an apartment where someone else owns the building and they can make the tenants do what they say. Much as you and your neighbors didn't like it, she was perfectly within her rights to be a borderline felon, spend her money on new cars and not on her utilities, and decline to pay for the upkeep of the common areas she wasn't using. If YOU want to do so, that's your right. HOAs are to benefit everyone; but they are essentially asking everyone to give up some of their personal rights.

I mean, its very sad that you got stuck with having to enforce this on a person who obviously didn't want to play the game your way; but consider that you and your fellow HOA owners and operators are basically saying "To live here, you must behave as if you lived in a home you don't fully own." That makes it good for everyone, but galling for many. If people tried to understand this on both sides of the equation, things might not come to this pass. Then we might not see court cases like yours, or people being sued for having fences the wrong shade of white.
 
2013-02-13 02:30:40 AM  
I predict an increase in arson
 
2013-02-13 02:41:18 AM  

Mikey1969: Because sometimes it's next to impossible to find a nice house in a nice neighborhood without one. Believe me, it's one of our top criteria for a home when we start looking.



If you buy a house built with the cheapest lumber and by the lowest bidding subcontractor, in about 10-15 years, being in a bad neighborhood or HOA is going to be the least of your worries.

In virtually every area in the country, empty property is relatively cheap. Once you have said property, you can get a home of your own design, with your own choice of materials, and your own choice of contractors, for about the same or less per sq ft as a similarly sized house on an HOA property, but without the inflated property costs and other fees thrown in by the developer.

Yes, you will have a hassle dealing with zoning and the various permit agencies, but that hassle lasts 2-4 months at most, and a good contractor will take care of most of that for you. A bad HOA lasts until you sell the house, and could very easily artificially devalue your house due to stunts like the one in TFA.

I've been yelled at for saying this before, but I still believe that anyone who lives in an HOA made a deliberate choice to live there. There are always other options available. Those options might not be wrapped up and stocked on the Wal-mart shelf like an HOA home, but they are available, and likely always will be.

The only downside to this option is that you might have to drive an extra 10 miles to get to the city. But given a choice between a long drive to my own house, or a slightly shorter drive to what essentially amounts to an expensive apartment, I'll take the long drive any day.
 
2013-02-13 02:55:17 AM  

fusillade762: So they can take away your house for unpaid HOA fees even if you're current on your mortgage?? How the flying f*ck does that work?


They are called DUES because you DUE have to pay them and they DUE take your house if you dont.  A realtor told me that while explaining I would be an idiot to buy a house I was looking at because that particular HOA was a nightmare.

So, remember that, people, if you are a pain in the ass HOA, it DOES drive your property value down worse than if someone has a non standard shade of peach on their mailbox.
 
2013-02-13 02:59:46 AM  
i40.tinypic.com

And don't even think about putting a basketball hoop in the driveway...
 
2013-02-13 03:02:49 AM  

boinkingbill: No one forced anyone to buy a house that has an HOA.  The homeowners have gotten exactly what they asked for.


Yeah, but repeated articles like this serve to educate the public about why they should not buy an HOA property.

Like I just said, they really serve no purpose, because a LOT of people would rather live between the clampets and the bundys than give up rights that usually come with ownership.

/ Al, not Ted.  I would rather have old Mrs Snoopybritches than a serial killer....
//  then again, *I* am not teds type.  hmmm
 
2013-02-13 03:10:20 AM  

the ha ha guy: I've been yelled at for saying this before, but I still believe that anyone who lives in an HOA made a deliberate choice to live there. There are always other options available.


Yeah, working through a contractor, even getting a spec home isn't in everyone's budget. Not all large scale builders are ripoffs, either. My wife and I were 100% able to afford a private contractor before we got screwed over and lost our down payment. Now, with the market recoverving, it will be iffy, but it is still going to be our first option.

And no, not everyone makes the "conscious" decision. Many don't know the alternative choices, can't afford it, or have taken bad advice. I see your point, but your "You've made your bed, now lie in it." response IS pretty much the dick response here.
 
2013-02-13 03:22:58 AM  
Because homeowners associations are never corrupt beyond all repair.

In 2006, condominium owners in Las Vegas' Vistana community were accused by a lawyer of dreaming up wild, Oliver Stone-like conspiracy theories as they complained about corruption in their community association.

After six years, more than two dozen guilty plea deals and four untimely deaths among witnesses or participants, the Vistana owners say they have been vindicated in their suspicions that...


/they're tracing this thing to Florida
 
2013-02-13 03:30:09 AM  

DigitalCoffee: SpdrJay: If only there were some way to combine cop hate, HOA-hate, cyclist hate, right-winger, and tipper hate into into 1 thread, it would be the ultimate hate trifecta superfecta High 5!

How about this headline: Bicycle Cop Gets Off On Being Dick As Local HOA President, Stumps For Tea Party Candidate

, Doesn't Tip Over 10% Because Jesus.
 
2013-02-13 03:41:01 AM  

jjorsett: Gyrfalcon: OK.

Foreclose on 7 or 8 houses because they owe you each less than a thousand dollars in back dues. You win, the families move out, and nobody else can afford to buy the homes and move in. So now your neighborhood is half-empty and now nobody is paying dues.

I think I may have spotted the flaw in your brilliant plan, but you just go ahead and start foreclosing you geniuses you.

Right, it would be much better to let deadbeats persist months/years at other's expense, racking up an increasing arrearage while the association limps along trying to keep the property from deteriorating and to meet its expenses, rather than forcing the owners to either perform on their obligations or get out and let in some people who can actually pay their bills.  At least the property will likely be bought by somebody who can afford it, and if not, the association will be no worse off since the departees weren't paying anyway.


Glad to see someone playing devil's advocate in favor of mongoloids.
 
2013-02-13 03:50:54 AM  

DarthBart: Aquapope: DarthBart: Aquapope: Sorry, I'm a dumbass about HOAs. If I want to buy a house and I have the money and it's what the current owner is willing to sell for... how does the HOA have anything to say about it? Why is an HOA agreement required for me to buy the house? What's the dang deal?

It's usually on the deed.

Ok, but why?  The seller shouldn't care anymore, they're selling.  So how does it get on a deed, a doc that pretty much only describes a property and defines ownership.  And if, as the buyer, I say "Take that shiat off the deed!" who do I say it to?  Who has authority to remove it (or modify it, for that matter)?  Are these deed codicils sunshined or is that property under HOA influence forever?   Is it a civil contract kind of thing, in which case it shouldn't involve anybody but the seller and buyer, or is the city/county somehow involved?  What the hell?  I want that house and I don't want HOA stinking up the place!  So why can't that happen?

It is usually placed on the deed by the developer of the neighborhood. To remove a deed restriction, you have to get all the parties who can enforce the restrictions to sign off on removing them. In this case you'd have to go to the HOA and ask them to remove the restrictions. Not gonna happen. The only way you could get a restriction removed without that hassle is if the restrictions violated laws, such as "this property may only be owned by a white male".


Pretty much this.  It's fundamentally not voluntary, if it were, there would be no need for a formal HOA, people would just paint houses the prescribed colors and voluntarily pay fines and whatnot.

It's tied to the deed and not optional.  Once you sign the deed, you agree to civil responsibilities of paying the HOA and being liable for their fines.

The state can force an involuntary dissolution in cases of fraud.  It's gotta be pretty gross though, HOAs thrive on fraud.

There's always a way for HOA to agree to disband forever, dissolve itself.  In some cases, it's the members, in other cases- get this- only the directors vote on dissolution.  That's right, the very people ripping you off may have the only control.  You'd have to elect new directors with no other platform than dissolution.

% vote varies.  Sometimes it can be like 80% for dissolution.  The count of Directors alone might be a lot of that.

There's a problem in that a housing development may have aspects which REQUIRE an HOA.  For example, a condo could never work without an HOA, the HOA is responsible for the roof and foundation and lawns, owners only own the interior.  I wouldn't be surprised if a neighborhood had features which could be a "difficult" issue if left with no management, e.g. a private park area not owned by the city which needs mowing.  And insurance for that area.  If no one volunteers, you can't request money, even if you requested it, no one would be authorized to collect it and buy insurance on residents' behalf.
 
2013-02-13 04:04:15 AM  

davidv: This just in...Florida is a shiathole.

Curious: the unpaid dues are awarded as a judgement to the HOA and against you. the HOA sells the property to satisfy the judgement. some states have laws that protect your primary residence. it seems FL doesn't.


So they kick you to the curb and sell your $300,000 house to recoup their $500?

Somewhere someone thought this was reasonable action?  F/ck them, f/cking losers.
 
2013-02-13 04:05:56 AM  
Quick, libs! Side with delinquent non-payers! Talk some rubbish about fairness so they feel good about letting others down! Demand new laws to protect them! And new taxes to literally buy their vote!
 
2013-02-13 04:35:44 AM  

Mikey1969: I see your point, but your "You've made your bed, now lie in it." response IS pretty much the dick response here.



No worse than the pro-HOA people who claim that the one and only alternative to buying a house with an HOA is ending up in a neighborhood with a dozen cars on blocks and at least two meth houses.
 
2013-02-13 05:01:52 AM  
We don't have this problem in the trailer park.
 
2013-02-13 05:30:39 AM  

THE GREAT NAME: Quick, libs! Side with delinquent non-payers! Talk some rubbish about fairness so they feel good about letting others down! Demand new laws to protect them! And new taxes to literally buy their vote!


This... I'd add tho, tax exemption to the deadbeat debtors to make sure they don't have to pay the tax increase. It's like buying a car but you refuse to make payments and are confused as to why you should. Deadbeats are deadbeats are deadbeats.
 
2013-02-13 05:35:51 AM  

Aquapope: Ok, but why? The seller shouldn't care anymore, they're selling. So how does it get on a deed, a doc that pretty much only describes a property and defines ownership. And if, as the buyer, I say "Take that shiat off the deed!" who do I say it to? Who has authority to remove it (or modify it, for that matter)? Are these deed codicils sunshined or is that property under HOA influence forever? Is it a civil contract kind of thing, in which case it shouldn't involve anybody but the seller and buyer, or is the city/county somehow involved? What the hell? I want that house and I don't want HOA stinking up the place! So why can't that happen?


As I understand it, it's just a contract, much like any other contract..  In this case, a contract entered by the initial buyer of the house with the HOA corporation.   Removing it from the deed would put the buyer in violation.  How it carries along following bankruptcies or foreclosures is an interesting question.  There may be state laws to create exceptions for HOA's, as most contractual obligations would be voided after a bankruptcy.

Bad description by subby.  This doesn't force homeowners to pay the HOA.  The bill just says that homeowners need to pay their dues into ESCROW before embarking on a voyage of destruction against their HOA. The HOA would not appear to get anything until the court has made a determination. If the court decides against the HOA, the homeowner would seem to recoup all monies put in escrow.

Seems quite reasonable.
 
SH
2013-02-13 05:40:31 AM  
Ahh yes... our weekly HOA hate thread.

About time!
 
2013-02-13 05:46:31 AM  

BolloxReader: And once again I say, if you live in a HOA property you are giving up what few rights property owners otherwise might have.

Might as well just rent, because you control zilch. And if you don't control, you don't own.

Enjoy your privatized government hell. I'd rather live in the ghetto (and I have) than a HOA community. At least when you are at the corner of The and Hood you know what's up.


You are so getting a fine for having the audacity to have independent thought.
 
2013-02-13 05:51:20 AM  

jehovahs witness protection: Odd that HOA leaders don't "disappear" more often. Gators don't leave much evidence, and Florida is full of em.


And pythons, too.
 
2013-02-13 05:54:23 AM  
If you sign into a HOA you are basically saying "I want to be raped if I put even a toe out of line."

Deal with the consequences. You can always vote with you feet - and your wallet.
 
2013-02-13 06:12:31 AM  

GleeUnit: Are they pretty ubiquitous?


In some areas, inescapable if you want to own a home.
 
2013-02-13 06:29:13 AM  
I still like my HOA better than my previous neighborhood where  one neighbor built a lean to for his chickens up to the property line. The other neighboor built his daughter a castle tower storage shed which was still only 80 percent finished after two years.

No more BS from my neighbors. You know who does not complain about HOA's, people who buy more expensive homes, but not enough land. The obsolutely love their HOA.
 
2013-02-13 06:31:01 AM  
HOAs are a delicate balance between trying to keep the neighborhood nice and livable, and trying to restrict what people do in their own homes and their own property. It's not like an apartment where someone else owns the building and they can make the tenants do what they say. Much as you and your neighbors didn't like it, she was perfectly within her rights to be a borderline felon, spend her money on new cars and not on her utilities, and decline to pay for the upkeep of the common areas she wasn't using. If YOU want to do so, that's your right. HOAs are to benefit everyone; but they are essentially asking everyone to give up some of their personal rights.

I mean, its very sad that you got stuck with having to enforce this on a person who obviously didn't want to play the game your way; but consider that you and your fellow HOA owners and operators are basically saying "To live here, you must behave as if you lived in a home you don't fully own." That makes it good for everyone, but galling for many. If people tried to understand this on both sides of the equation, things might not come to this pass. Then we might not see court cases like yours, or people being sued for having fences the wrong shade of white.


I can't speak to HOA's (single family homes) but In the condominium form of ownership, what you "own" is essentially little more than airspace. The "unit" is a legal construct ---- it would neither exist nor be transferable as though it were real property, without the condominium law and the association bylaws. Therefore, you are subject to the use and occupancy restrictions in the bylaws, and any rules and regulations as enacted by the board.

/just sayin'
 
2013-02-13 06:34:50 AM  

Harry_Seldon: I still like my HOA better than my previous neighborhood where one neighbor built a lean to for his chickens up to the property line. The other neighboor built his daughter a castle tower storage shed which was still only 80 percent finished after two years.


Oh the horror?
 
2013-02-13 06:39:13 AM  
If you willingly finance your home loan through an HoA instead of an actual, reputable banking institution then I'm going to have to say you farking well deserve what you get, you astonishing moron.
 
2013-02-13 06:39:27 AM  
Even if you DON'T live in an HOA, your neighbors will still be assholes about petty shiat.
 
2013-02-13 06:44:24 AM  

fusillade762: So they can take away your house for unpaid HOA fees even if you're current on your mortgage?? How the flying f*ck does that work?


Mass. Real Estate attorney and HOA member here.

They're not "taking your house", you're failing to pay your bills, which is allowing them to go to court to ASK PERMISSION to force the sale of your house to pay said bills, AS YOU AGREED WHEN YOU BOUGHT THE PROPERTY.

The Founding Fathers trusted us enough to give us the Sixth Amendment right to make contracts; don't make them come up here :)

They don't get the house, and they're still in line behind the bank holding the mortgage, generally.

Also the HOA has a LEGAL DUTY to go after those fees, on behalf of all the other owners who aren't deadbeats.

If you can't afford a $200 a month condo fee, you're probably on the edge anyway...ownership isn't right for you, at least not right now.
 
2013-02-13 06:46:18 AM  
Oh, and the headline is, unsurprisingly, misleading.

You CAN challenge the amount due, you just have to pay up first, rather than dragging out the process.

If an HOA abuses this, you can still sue them for, let's see, loss of quiet enjoyment and tortious interference with contract, for starters...and I haven't even had my coffee yet.

This ain't the end of the world, even if it passes.
 
2013-02-13 06:47:42 AM  

ModernLuddite: Even if you DON'T live in an HOA, your neighbors will still be assholes about petty shiat.


Really?

I gave up my property for a week to let Extreme Makeover Home Edition build this next to me:

farm4.static.flickr.com

I couldn't take two steps out my own door without some pencil-necked rent-a-cop telling me where to stand 'because they're filming'.

Ultimately, hosting the tent town destroyed my lawn (and it never was repaired by the pro-bono folks who were finishing up the place- cause who cares once the PR opportunity is over, amirite?).

Despite all that, the lady had lost her home over a year ago, and her husband scarcely eight months earlier.  Despite the fact that she's still got about four kids she's raising on her own, I've only ever had to complain about them once.

Live next to better people maybe?
 
2013-02-13 06:51:51 AM  
Romero reports Florida becoming less habitable every day.
 
2013-02-13 06:53:44 AM  
I was looking at buying a nice, small house on a lake with some algae on it. The realtor mentioned that, "the families were trying to get a group together to pool money to remove the algae." The possibility there could be an HOA there someday was enough for me to leave running. I don't know who would think paying money for someone else to tell you what to do under threat of seizing your property was a good idea.

Damn you whoever started buying into the HOA bullshiat. Damn you to hell.
 
2013-02-13 06:59:54 AM  

ModernLuddite: Even if you DON'T live in an HOA, your neighbors will still be assholes about petty shiat.


Do what I do and just don't have neighbors.  Of course that means living in the sticks, spotty employment, and no pizza delivery, but what is life without compromise.
 
2013-02-13 06:59:58 AM  

SpdrJay: If only there were some way to combine cop hate, HOA-hate and cyclist hate into into 1 thread, it would be the ultimate hate trifecta!


a bicycle riding cop who is the prez of his hoa perhaps?
 
2013-02-13 07:00:50 AM  

jehovahs witness protection: Odd that HOA leaders don't "disappear" more often. Gators don't leave much evidence, and Florida is full of em.


that would be cruel!!!

/to the gators
 
2013-02-13 07:03:18 AM  
Development I am in had an HOA. Everyone in the development decided to do away with it, and it lapsed.
 
2013-02-13 07:04:36 AM  

jjorsett: Gyrfalcon: OK.

Foreclose on 7 or 8 houses because they owe you each less than a thousand dollars in back dues. You win, the families move out, and nobody else can afford to buy the homes and move in. So now your neighborhood is half-empty and now nobody is paying dues.

I think I may have spotted the flaw in your brilliant plan, but you just go ahead and start foreclosing you geniuses you.

Right, it would be much better to let deadbeats persist months/years at other's expense, racking up an increasing arrearage while the association limps along trying to keep the property from deteriorating and to meet its expenses, rather than forcing the owners to either perform on their obligations or get out and let in some people who can actually pay their bills.  At least the property will likely be bought by somebody who can afford it, and if not, the association will be no worse off since the departees weren't paying anyway.


If they're such dickbags, who would move there?  At best, other, dickier bags.  It's like the Dead Sea effect in reverse.
 
2013-02-13 07:12:15 AM  

ModernLuddite: Even if you DON'T live in an HOA, your neighbors will still be assholes about petty shiat.



As is their right, just as it's my right to be an asshole right back.

But an argument over petty shiat is exactly that, petty. And without an HOA to take anyone's side, there's no possibility whatsoever that you'll be fined for dozens of false violations in an effort to run you out of the neighborhood, nor any chance that they'll foreclose on your house when you're unable to pay those dozens of fines within 30 days.
 
2013-02-13 07:16:23 AM  

RandomRandom: Aquapope: Ok, but why? The seller shouldn't care anymore, they're selling. So how does it get on a deed, a doc that pretty much only describes a property and defines ownership. And if, as the buyer, I say "Take that shiat off the deed!" who do I say it to? Who has authority to remove it (or modify it, for that matter)? Are these deed codicils sunshined or is that property under HOA influence forever? Is it a civil contract kind of thing, in which case it shouldn't involve anybody but the seller and buyer, or is the city/county somehow involved? What the hell? I want that house and I don't want HOA stinking up the place! So why can't that happen?

As I understand it, it's just a contract, much like any other contract..  In this case, a contract entered by the initial buyer of the house with the HOA corporation.   Removing it from the deed would put the buyer in violation.  How it carries along following bankruptcies or foreclosures is an interesting question.  There may be state laws to create exceptions for HOA's, as most contractual obligations would be voided after a bankruptcy.

Bad description by subby.  This doesn't force homeowners to pay the HOA.  The bill just says that homeowners need to pay their dues into ESCROW before embarking on a voyage of destruction against their HOA. The HOA would not appear to get anything until the court has made a determination. If the court decides against the HOA, the homeowner would seem to recoup all monies put in escrow.

Seems quite reasonable.


you think that's reasonable?
so it would be reasonable for someone to accuse you of owing them some arbitrary amount of money and you have to come up with that money and put it in an escrow account before you can even go to court? And if you don't they take your property? That is one of the dumbest things I have ever heard.
 
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