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(New York Daily News)   Obama promises "swift and credible" action after latest North Korean nuclear test, which pretty much rules out Comic Sans for the strongly-worded letter   (nydailynews.com) divider line 84
    More: Followup, President Obama, North Koreans, United Nations Security Council, nuclear tests, Security Council resolutions, swifts, State of the Union, nuclear proliferation  
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593 clicks; posted to Politics » on 12 Feb 2013 at 11:17 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-12 11:19:28 AM  
Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?
 
2013-02-12 11:21:42 AM  

NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?


Well, it was that or he is an authoritarian dictator with the drones.

See also:  sin x as it relates to GOP outrage du jour
 
2013-02-12 11:22:34 AM  
What is there really to do? This happened under Bush as well.
 
2013-02-12 11:22:51 AM  
Oh man, I can't wait until whatever Obama does to handle this becomes a scandal.
 
2013-02-12 11:23:08 AM  
So did this one actually work?
 
2013-02-12 11:23:32 AM  

coeyagi: NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?

Well, it was that or he is an authoritarian dictator with the drones.

See also:  sin x as it relates to GOP outrage du jour


Or both.

/Is North Korea a scandal yet?
 
2013-02-12 11:24:43 AM  

Job Creator: coeyagi: NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?

Well, it was that or he is an authoritarian dictator with the drones.

See also:  sin x as it relates to GOP outrage du jour

Or both.


/Is North Korea a scandal yet?


Yeah, I said that.
 
2013-02-12 11:24:54 AM  

NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?


Um. No? At least not in the article linked here. But I'm sure we all appreciate your attempt to turn this thread into a right vs. left troll fest as soon as possible.
 
2013-02-12 11:27:59 AM  

Talondel: NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?

Um. No? At least not in the article linked here. But I'm sure we all appreciate your attempt to turn this thread into a right vs. left troll fest as soon as possible.


Um, yes, according to subby's headline.
 
2013-02-12 11:30:55 AM  

Talondel: NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?

Um. No? At least not in the article linked here. But I'm sure we all appreciate your attempt to turn this thread into a right vs. left troll fest as soon as possible.


Dude, read the headline.  It might not be the case in TFA, but the headline would indicate it.  Also....

images.thetruthaboutcars.com
 
2013-02-12 11:32:34 AM  

Saiga410: So did this one actually work?


Looks like it was about 10Kton.... so about 2/3rds of a fatman.  Not bad and not a dud this time, but they certainly have their work cut out to beat a 1945 technology level.
 
2013-02-12 11:34:42 AM  

Talondel: NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?

Um. No? At least not in the article linked here. But I'm sure we all appreciate your attempt to turn this thread into a right vs. left troll fest as soon as possible.


Did you read the headline? Or are you one of those bizarro people who read the article and not the headline. Strongly worded letter is Republican humor.
 
2013-02-12 11:35:01 AM  
Just once, I wish we had a leader who did leisurely but incredible action.

/"That's amazing! And it looked so effortless."
 
2013-02-12 11:35:46 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: What is there really to do? This happened under Bush as well.


we could try bribing them with food again? recent reports indicated they are (unsurprisingly) suffering a pretty significant famine again.

personally, i think NK isn't a good bribeable partner from their past efforts. they take the bribe and don't suitably modify their behavior, but i guess maybe to shut them up in the short term?
 
2013-02-12 11:35:50 AM  

Saiga410: Not bad and not a dud this time, but they certainly have their work cut out to beat a 1945 technology level.


They have their work cut out for them getting to a 1920 technology level.

cdn.theatlanticcities.com
 
2013-02-12 11:40:20 AM  

tlchwi02: HotWingConspiracy: What is there really to do? This happened under Bush as well.

we could try bribing them with food again? recent reports indicated they are (unsurprisingly) suffering a pretty significant famine again.

personally, i think NK isn't a good bribeable partner from their past efforts. they take the bribe and don't suitably modify their behavior, but i guess maybe to shut them up in the short term?


North Korea is an awful bribeable partner. The inducements, however, aren't really attempts to get the North Koreans to change their behavior; they're attempts to keep the Chinese on our side as much as possible. By giving the North Koreans food aid, we're helping prevent a horde of starving North Korean refugees from pouring across the border into China.
 
2013-02-12 11:43:26 AM  

Saiga410: Saiga410: So did this one actually work?

Looks like it was about 10Kton.... so about 2/3rds of a fatman.  Not bad and not a dud this time, but they certainly have their work cut out to beat a 1945 technology level.


The thing about this test that could be scary is if they used uranium instead of plutonium this time.  They actually do have uranium deposits in North Korea, so sanctions would be of rather limited use in stopping them if they can figure out how to make a nuke from uranium.
 
2013-02-12 11:44:44 AM  
Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook
 
2013-02-12 11:47:00 AM  

ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook


THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.
 
2013-02-12 11:48:01 AM  

NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.


Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.
 
2013-02-12 11:49:11 AM  

jake_lex: The thing about this test that could be scary is if they used uranium instead of plutonium this time. They actually do have uranium deposits in North Korea, so sanctions would be of rather limited use in stopping them if they can figure out how to make a nuke from uranium.


Since their fail safe delivery system is a soldier with a piece of U235 in each hand ready to bang them together as he is shot over the DMZ on a catapult, things could get interesting quickly.
 
2013-02-12 11:49:32 AM  

jake_lex: Saiga410: Saiga410: So did this one actually work?

Looks like it was about 10Kton.... so about 2/3rds of a fatman.  Not bad and not a dud this time, but they certainly have their work cut out to beat a 1945 technology level.

The thing about this test that could be scary is if they used uranium instead of plutonium this time.  They actually do have uranium deposits in North Korea, so sanctions would be of rather limited use in stopping them if they can figure out how to make a nuke from uranium.


I am far from a rocket sturgeon but  doesnt uranium makes for awfully large bombs.  I am not sure if such a large weapon would be deliverable by them nor would be easily sellable by the norkos.
 
2013-02-12 11:50:32 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: What is there really to do? This happened under Bush as well.


There are really only two options:

1) Get China to cut NK off. The sanctions we impose on NK are pretty much worthless because China is their largest trading partner as well as provides them all kinds of support. But I have no clue how to get China to do that.

2) Go to war either covertly or conventionally.
 
2013-02-12 11:51:07 AM  
It was good enough for the Higgs...
i0.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-02-12 11:52:12 AM  

qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.


We should tell China "Fix this or Taiwan is getting an embassy"
 
2013-02-12 11:52:33 AM  
The reality is that there is nothing to be done about North Korea. The world is on a prolonged death watch for that regime. Everyone knows that it will collapse eventually. While no one wants to provide much support for NK, no one is very eager to hasten the collapse either. The collapse will be a significant problem for both China, and South Korea. South Korea is going to wind up with responsibility for a large population without functioning modern infrastructure. China will get refugees and general instability on their border. The nukes are a sideshow as everyone waits.
 
2013-02-12 11:53:50 AM  

qorkfiend: North Korea is an awful bribeable partner. The inducements, however, aren't really attempts to get the North Koreans to change their behavior; they're attempts to keep the Chinese on our side as much as possible. By giving the North Koreans food aid, we're helping prevent a horde of starving North Korean refugees from pouring across the border into China.


sounds like we would need to bribe the chinese then. Of course, we probably have bigger issues than the NK sabre rattling we'd like to leverage with china, so we wont waste diplomatic capital on this issue
 
2013-02-12 11:54:12 AM  
swift and credible action!

he he he he
ha ha ha ha

run off to vegas!
 
2013-02-12 11:54:23 AM  

NateGrey: Oh Republicans are back to Obama is weak on Foreign Policy?


From the wording of the headline, subby apparently feels that, instead of a protest, the U.S. should have retaliated with an immediate nuclear attack.
 
2013-02-12 11:54:29 AM  

thornhill: 1) Get China to cut NK off. The sanctions we impose on NK are pretty much worthless because China is their largest trading partner as well as provides them all kinds of support. But I have no clue how to get China to do that.


China will not cut off NK because of their fear of waves of people crossing the boarder.... I wonder if I can sell them on my idea for internet rented remotely opperated armed guard towers.
 
2013-02-12 11:54:45 AM  
Be a damn shame if a W76 weapons at the site went off accidentally...
 
2013-02-12 11:55:33 AM  
I have the same suggestion to Obama as I had to Bush:
If North Korean tests a nuclear device on the Korean peninsula, then the United States also should carry out a nuclear test.  On the Korean peninsula.
 
2013-02-12 11:55:52 AM  

Publikwerks: qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.

We should tell China "Fix this or Taiwan is getting an embassy"


China:  #2

/it's a pretty useful response (for them)
 
2013-02-12 11:57:40 AM  

Philip Francis Queeg: The reality is that there is nothing to be done about North Korea. The world is on a prolonged death watch for that regime. Everyone knows that it will collapse eventually. While no one wants to provide much support for NK, no one is very eager to hasten the collapse either. The collapse will be a significant problem for both China, and South Korea. South Korea is going to wind up with responsibility for a large population without functioning modern infrastructure. China will get refugees and general instability on their border. The nukes are a sideshow as everyone waits.


I don't know about that. China has a vested interest in propping NK up. NK serves as a boarder between them and a very friendly US ally. They don't want a US base ANYWHERE near them, as they know that things will eventually heat up between us. Even if you don't think we are going to openly fight, we can conduct signals intelligence and other forms of espionage with a land boarder. They like the buffer, and will take the steps needed to maintain the NK government, even if it means backing a coup and a puppet government.
 
2013-02-12 11:57:53 AM  

Publikwerks: qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.

We should tell China "Fix this or Taiwan is getting an embassy"


Well we certainly can't use the economic card much anymore.
 
2013-02-12 11:58:14 AM  
This will stop when China gets with the program on dealing with those farkwits running that country.
 
2013-02-12 12:00:31 PM  

ObeliskToucher: Publikwerks: qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.

We should tell China "Fix this or Taiwan is getting an embassy"

China:  #2

/it's a pretty useful response (for them)


The problem with #2 is that we have the cards. They would threaten cutting economic ties, but they can't without shooting themselves in the foot. It would hurt them as much as us.
 
2013-02-12 12:00:34 PM  

Publikwerks: qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.

We should tell China "Fix this or Taiwan is getting an embassy"


To which China will say, "Good luck with that."
 
2013-02-12 12:01:50 PM  

qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.


China might just be getting sick of NK's shennanigans.

http://news.msn.com/world/china-grows-increasingly-frustrated-with-n or th-korea
 
2013-02-12 12:02:00 PM  

theknuckler_33: This will stop when China gets with the program on dealing with those farkwits running that country.

never end.

/FTFY
 
2013-02-12 12:02:08 PM  

Publikwerks: Philip Francis Queeg: The reality is that there is nothing to be done about North Korea. The world is on a prolonged death watch for that regime. Everyone knows that it will collapse eventually. While no one wants to provide much support for NK, no one is very eager to hasten the collapse either. The collapse will be a significant problem for both China, and South Korea. South Korea is going to wind up with responsibility for a large population without functioning modern infrastructure. China will get refugees and general instability on their border. The nukes are a sideshow as everyone waits.

I don't know about that. China has a vested interest in propping NK up. NK serves as a boarder between them and a very friendly US ally. They don't want a US base ANYWHERE near them, as they know that things will eventually heat up between us. Even if you don't think we are going to openly fight, we can conduct signals intelligence and other forms of espionage with a land boarder. They like the buffer, and will take the steps needed to maintain the NK government, even if it means backing a coup and a puppet government.


China has probably looked at a map and noticed that there are US bases quite near them in South Korea and Japan.
 
2013-02-12 12:05:21 PM  

theknuckler_33: qorkfiend: NateGrey: ObeliskToucher: Obama to China:  "They're your problem.  Fix it."

China:  see standard response #2

/#2:  Stop interfering in our internal affairs
//#1:  We are not a crook

THIS

Go to the UN and solve it as a collective body, no unilateral actions or sabre rattling.

Difficulty: China has veto power in the Security Council.

China might just be getting sick of NK's shennanigans.

http://news.msn.com/world/china-grows-increasingly-frustrated-with-n or th-korea


North Korea:   #2!
China:  Yeah, about that...

/Save us, Hu Jintao... you're our only hope
 
2013-02-12 12:08:17 PM  

qorkfiend: North Korea is an awful bribeable partner. The inducements, however, aren't really attempts to get the North Koreans to change their behavior; they're attempts to keep the Chinese on our side as much as possible. By giving the North Koreans food aid, we're helping prevent a horde of starving North Korean refugees from pouring across the border into China.


well maybe we can bribe the chinese then to exert some leverage on north korea.

frankly all these reports about how we're all tough guy and promising bad shiat are ridiculous. we need to tell them something doable then do it. this posturing makes us look stupid. and weak.
 
2013-02-12 12:14:12 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: Publikwerks: Philip Francis Queeg: The reality is that there is nothing to be done about North Korea. The world is on a prolonged death watch for that regime. Everyone knows that it will collapse eventually. While no one wants to provide much support for NK, no one is very eager to hasten the collapse either. The collapse will be a significant problem for both China, and South Korea. South Korea is going to wind up with responsibility for a large population without functioning modern infrastructure. China will get refugees and general instability on their border. The nukes are a sideshow as everyone waits.

I don't know about that. China has a vested interest in propping NK up. NK serves as a boarder between them and a very friendly US ally. They don't want a US base ANYWHERE near them, as they know that things will eventually heat up between us. Even if you don't think we are going to openly fight, we can conduct signals intelligence and other forms of espionage with a land boarder. They like the buffer, and will take the steps needed to maintain the NK government, even if it means backing a coup and a puppet government.

China has probably looked at a map and noticed that there are US bases quite near them in South Korea and Japan.


Well, the DMZ is about 200 miles from China, and Kadena AFB is 400 miles.

200 miles is Washington DC to NYC. That's a good buffer.
 
2013-02-12 12:18:05 PM  

Publikwerks: Philip Francis Queeg: Publikwerks: Philip Francis Queeg: The reality is that there is nothing to be done about North Korea. The world is on a prolonged death watch for that regime. Everyone knows that it will collapse eventually. While no one wants to provide much support for NK, no one is very eager to hasten the collapse either. The collapse will be a significant problem for both China, and South Korea. South Korea is going to wind up with responsibility for a large population without functioning modern infrastructure. China will get refugees and general instability on their border. The nukes are a sideshow as everyone waits.

I don't know about that. China has a vested interest in propping NK up. NK serves as a boarder between them and a very friendly US ally. They don't want a US base ANYWHERE near them, as they know that things will eventually heat up between us. Even if you don't think we are going to openly fight, we can conduct signals intelligence and other forms of espionage with a land boarder. They like the buffer, and will take the steps needed to maintain the NK government, even if it means backing a coup and a puppet government.

China has probably looked at a map and noticed that there are US bases quite near them in South Korea and Japan.

Well, the DMZ is about 200 miles from China, and Kadena AFB is 400 miles.

200 miles is Washington DC to NYC. That's a good buffer.


Buffer for what? Intelligence gathering? Nope. Aerial combat? Nope.

The only thing it's a buffer against is ground combat. Strategically that buffer benefits the US and South Korea far more than the China. China isn't concerned about US armored divisions streaming across the border bound for Beijing.
 
2013-02-12 12:40:05 PM  
China may soon become one of our strongest allies because of shiat like this.
 
2013-02-12 12:43:34 PM  
commence with the sabre-rattling and dick-waving.

that'll show'em.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-12 12:51:51 PM  

jake_lex: Saiga410: Saiga410: So did this one actually work?

Looks like it was about 10Kton.... so about 2/3rds of a fatman.  Not bad and not a dud this time, but they certainly have their work cut out to beat a 1945 technology level.

The thing about this test that could be scary is if they used uranium instead of plutonium this time.  They actually do have uranium deposits in North Korea, so sanctions would be of rather limited use in stopping them if they can figure out how to make a nuke from uranium.


Well, you make plutonium from uranium.  There aren't any plutonium mines.
 
2013-02-12 12:52:52 PM  
Anybody else think "strongly worded letter" is hackneyed?
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-12 12:54:20 PM  
Publikwerks:

We should tell China "Fix this or Taiwan is getting an embassy"

They would just cut us off from out cadmium laced pet food supply and we would have to give in.
 
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