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(Telegraph)   Men's friendships with women 'driven by sexual attraction' according to Dr. N. S. Sherlock of the Institute For the Study of the Forehead-Slappingly Obvious   (telegraph.co.uk) divider line 143
    More: Obvious, sexual interest, female friends  
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6177 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Feb 2013 at 9:15 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-11 09:19:04 AM  
8 votes:

ranold: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

You're gay.


Hey, now.  She could be fat.
2013-02-11 10:18:40 AM  
7 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.


I like how women say men "grew up" when they stopped wanting sex out of a relationship. Because wanting sex is such a childish thing, and not wanting sex is so adult.
2013-02-11 09:47:00 AM  
7 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.


This is how women think. Guys know however that if it was offered they would hit it like the fist of an angry god simply because at one point they wanted to and that NEVER goes away until about 3 seconds afterward. Guys learn to say "Oh, I would never do that now, I think of you as a sister" because you would not accept any other answer and they have to say that if they hold a chance of keeping you as a friend and then over time getting into your pants.
2013-02-11 09:02:04 AM  
7 votes:
Sure, maybe if you're 25...but if you're 45 with a wife and kids it becomes tiresome and annoying to think with your dick 24/7, so at that point you can establish perfectly good friendships with women but Ann in HR is bent over the copier and dear LORD what I wouldn't give to wreck that for twelve or thirteen seconds.

I'm sorry, what was the article about?
2013-02-11 12:24:10 PM  
5 votes:
I know it's been mentioned obliquely in this thread a few times, but it seems to me that a lot of the disagreement on this topic stems from the conflation of "attraction," "attachment," and "intentionality."
The concepts are related, and there's certainly interplay between them, but one does not necessarily imply any of the other two.

Admitting (even if it's just to yourself) that you're attracted to a woman, or attracted to a woman that you sort of care about does not imply that you intend to make a move, or even that you're sitting around waiting for an opportunity. There are myriad reasons why this might be: you don't think it'll work out, your attraction is only moderate, you're otherwise spoken for, you know you have no shot, or pretty much any other situation in which the cost/benefit analysis doesn't seem worth it. It's certainly possible to feed attraction or attachment so that they grow to unhealthy levels or tempt you to do something stupid, but the presence of the first two mental states I mentioned does not imply the third.

...The caveat, that I would add, of course, is that people in general are very good about lying to themselves about their feelings and intentions. Low intentionality doesn't mean "none," and intentionality itself tends to be calculated based on opportunity.  If you find yourself claiming that your friendship with so-and-so "isn't like that" too often, don't be surprised if people don't believe you.

Also, about the linked article: Being a psychology study involving "young people in their '20's," and studying "pairs of male and female friends," that suggests to me that they were getting a lot of friendships with asymmetric attraction simply as a result of the way the study was set up. There is a difference between "I have a female friend; we hang out almost every day and talk about our hopes and dreams," and "I have a female friend, I she's part of the group I hang out with, and I talk to her every couple weeks on Saturday when we go our for drinks." I'm guessing pairs of friends in the latter category aren't going to be represented well in the surveys. Attraction is probably still there in those cases, of course, just less attachment - and certainly no intention of waiting around hoping that eventually she'll realize what a great guy you are, like it sounds like a lot of the guys in the study are doing.

/ I made up this analytical paradigm in the last five minutes, so if you want to help me improve my nomenclature, please do so
2013-02-11 11:23:48 AM  
5 votes:

Rik01: I know of Man Caves but not Woman Dens.


Craft Rooms.  Or the whole house minus the Man Cave.
2013-02-11 10:45:14 AM  
5 votes:

Ikahoshi: Nonsense. I have what... 5 female friends. They're like family and I would be horrified at the thought. A stranger pointed out that one good friend and I "made a good couple" and I felt physically ill at the thought. Yes, she's attractive but whatever attraction I might have had is totally subverted by the friendship.

I can't fully describe human attractions and friendships, because I'm no expert, but there's definitely a category where friends are just friends and will never be anything else, because the attraction aspect has been short circuited by a bond that approaches too close to the 'family' dynamic.


this is either complete utter bullshiat OR you are the world's biggest pussy.  In a world where dudes bang their cousins there is no way you have female friends that the thought of having sex with revolts you.  I can see not wanting to fark up a friendship but you know as well as I that if one of them dropped to her knees and started making with the cock sucking you'd blow chowder all in her hair.

Women - your guy friends all want to fark you and will given the chance.  Unless you are a hideous hose-beast (and even then they will think hard about it, hell all men have been hoggin' at one time or another) this is correct in ALL cases.  There is simply few cases of true platonic friendship between men and women.

My own wife had a friend that she SWORE was just a friend.  Right up until he asked her to leave me for him.  And this was a guy that had been her friend for over 5 years.

Just friends.  MMMHHHHMMM.

Women, don't buy our bullshiat.  We want in your pants.  That is why we hang around you, come sniffin' around when we hear you broke up with someone, call to check when we hear your cat died.

Pants.  We want in yours.

Because think about it - men don't NEED female "friends".  We have guy friends to do guy stuff with - playing xbox, talking about politics, watching sports, drinking beer, and our guy friends are ALL better and always will be better at that stuff than you women are, no matter HOW "tomboyish" you are.  We put up with female "friendship" so that we can get sex.

Why do you think "bad boys" get laid so much?  Because they dispense with the friendship bullcrap and just use women for what they actually WANT from women  - sex - and don't put up with the other crap.
2013-02-11 10:38:47 AM  
5 votes:
Ladies :

Unless you've known your friends since you were less than ,say, eight (see :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westermarck_effect ) Then yes, he wants to have sex with you.

Once you've had sex together he may no longer be interested, but he certainly wants it.

http://www.laddertheory.com/

and if you say you have 'lots of male friends' who don't want to sleep with you, then you're either ugly or a cocktease.

Think about it this way: How much of your restraint (how often you change partners, how soon a new partner gets to the cookie) is based on considerations like pregnancy, disease or even menstrual behavioral patterns? Many many women fail to have orgasms with vaginal intercourse. What if EVERY time you had sex with ANYONE you came? What if you never had cramps, or mood swings? What if you weren't the one getting pregnant?

... Then imagine that every man regularly is clean, well-groomed and better dressed, and suddenly becomes five times better looking (yes, this is the effect having boobs has on us... Ugly girl + nice boobs = Doable)

Because that is the reality of being male. Even ugly girls are attractive. Not in a 'I would shower them with attention' kind of way but in a 'three jagermeisters and then we'd be boning in the club bathroom' kind of way.

... and if you think that anything that you can do short of being a gigantic, acid-scarred, ball-busting biatch with a dyke haircut and strapped-down boobs will do anything to keep us away (and yes, we'd still fark you.)you're wrong.
2013-02-11 10:15:07 AM  
5 votes:
You can be friends with someone and acknowledge that there is a sexual attraction. That's O.K.

If you're friends with someone just because you're just trying to pull the Nice Guy/Girl backdoor gambit, then that's not O.K.
2013-02-11 09:34:04 AM  
5 votes:

MaliFinn: ranold: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

You're gay.

It may strike you as odd, but some men occasionally think of women as something other than a place to stick a penis.


Correct, many think of them as fun companions whose friendship is valued...and also a place to stick their penis in.
2013-02-11 09:16:36 AM  
5 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.


You're gay.
2013-02-11 11:39:43 AM  
4 votes:
Bottom line is that most men with women friends either secretly or not so secretly want to hook up with them and most women with a guy friends know this deep down and probably like the attention that he gives them but pretend to think otherwise so they don't feel bad.
2013-02-11 11:05:38 AM  
4 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: WhippingBoy: I hate to break it to ya darlin', but it sounds like you're what us married guys call "Plan B".

The difference being you're unhappily married...


happily married men want variety too.  i'm not kidding.
2013-02-11 01:46:52 PM  
3 votes:

Theaetetus: frepnog: I have told more than one woman "I don't want to be your "friend".  I have friends.  I want to have sex with you"... Example - my wife and I...

Now, there's a relationship that I'm sure will last.


my wife and I have a fantastic relationship.  She is everything I have ever wanted in a woman  - she likes metal, horror, gaming and having sex with me.  Been together now almost 5 years and have had sex with her almost every day since (had sex with her twice the first time we met in person).  Most people don't buy it, but as I have told her - "there are 24 hours in a day.  If you can find time to watch tv, play gameboy, care for the dogs, you can carve out an hour to have sex with your husband".

More couples should try it honestly, and honestly more people should be more honest about why they are with a person.

Kevin Smith said it best  - "I love farking my wife".
2013-02-11 01:43:28 PM  
3 votes:

Bored Horde: People in this thread are apparently incapable of forming genuine meaningful emotional connections, but sure are ready to fake them in order to bide their time and catch their 'friend' in an inebriated moment of weakness.

It must be  shockingto a lot of these  fine upstanding gentlemen that women get creeper vibes off them, and subsequently avoid them beyond suffering casual interactions.


not sure if you are serious.  men can and do genuinely like women as ppl.  it's just that we also want to fark most of them.  pretty simple concept.
2013-02-11 01:14:29 PM  
3 votes:

Theaetetus: frepnog: Theaetetus: frepnog: Women, don't buy our bullshiat.  We want in your pants.  That is why we hang around you, come sniffin' around when we hear you broke up with someone, call to check when we hear your cat died.

It's true. Women should be skeptical of lying douchebags  like youwho pretend to be their friends.

Mind you, it's an incredibly misandrist point of view you have to paint all guys as liars. Frankly, I disagree and don't think you should paint our gender with such a broad brush, simply because you're an asshole and want to feelnotquite so alone.

Someone has female friends that know his fark handle, eh?

Nope, someone just isn't as much of a pathological liar as you are.


I am no liar.  I have told more than one woman "I don't want to be your "friend".  I have friends.  I want to have sex with you".  I don't beat around the bush with women.  Hell, I'm the guy that after the 3rd date if sex has not happened, I am moving on because I just don't care to play the game.  If I am dating you, I find you attractive and you KNOW I want to bang you, so after the 3rd date or so if you aren't putting out there is a goddamn reason that I don't care to play with.  You are either not attracted to me, you like free dinners, or you have hangups about sex.  fark all that. 

Example - my wife and I were watching some sitcom the other day.  In the episode, it was a flashback type thing to when the main character and his wife were dating.  It had been three months apparently and the guy still had not gotten laid.  My wife was like "see, that guy has been going out with her for three months and hasn't gotten laid, not all men are like you" and I told her "that is because he is desperate, fat, fairly unattractive and thinks he has no other options, so getting laid "someday, possibly" is better than "never getting laid".  She kinda shut up after that.
2013-02-11 12:24:12 PM  
3 votes:

Dafatone: yapopo: Dafatone: WhippingBoy: Dafatone: Guys often have women friends they aren't interested in

We're talking about straight guys here...

Ha.  I'm willing to knock it down from often to sometimes, but it does happen.

i think you need to knock it down a bit more to "rarely"

Depends on our definition of "interest."  Absolutely no attraction whatsoever?  Kinda rare.  Maybe a little attraction and might have it cross one's mind once in a while, but wouldn't act on it for like 8 different reasons?  Fairly common.


This.

There's a pretty big continuum between "eh, it wouldn't be so bad to hook up with her" and rubbing one out to fantasies of her 5 times a day.

I posit that it's rare for a straight man to have zero sexual interest in ANY woman, if we defined that as "would never bang under any circumstances whatsoever". (Westermarck may not even apply that strongly).

/except fat chicks, of course
2013-02-11 11:31:19 AM  
3 votes:
i propose that from now on, we make the following assumptions while reading any comment in any thread:

1.)  when someone says something that sounds like a huge generalization, they never mean literally 100%.  they know they are making a generalization.  it's just a pita to have to type out "i know this is a generalization" every time.

2.)  everyone is just speaking for themselves, even if it sounds like they are speaking for others.  they know they are just speaking for themselves.  it's just a pita to have to type out "i am only speaking for myself" every time.

haha k?
2013-02-11 11:01:14 AM  
3 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: Christian Bale: CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.

I like how women say men "grew up" when they stopped wanting sex out of a relationship. Because wanting sex is such a childish thing, and not wanting sex is so adult.

I was stating that we grew up together. Like from being 11 years old to 34 years old. In the purest form of growing up, considering we were children when we first met.

Anyways, they all have their hot wives to fark.


I hate to break it to ya darlin', but it sounds like you're what us married guys call "Plan B".
2013-02-11 10:59:00 AM  
3 votes:
I tell women this all the time, and every time I get the same horrified look.  Yes ladies, your male friends want to bang you.  Yes, *that one* too.

Where women go off the tracks here is they confuse "improbable" with "no desire".  The guy may be a pussy and it may take a series of extreme circumstances before he'll make his move (her passed out drunk on the hood of a car clutching signed consent forms with a huge blinking neon "Go for it!" sign pointing to her vag) but the fact that it would take *a lot* doesn't mean he *wouldn't*.

And I get why women are always in denial.  They want to think that they are charming and witty and these guys just *love* hearing stories about the jerk they are dating etc.  And so they deny what men are.  But this line of reasoning usually falls apart when I ask the same women how many times they've listened to the guy's stories / dating woes / etc.  The give-to-take ratio is typically highly unbalanced, thus it ain't a friendship.  A stand-in boyfriend, sure.  An "emotional tampon" situation, perhaps.
2013-02-11 10:31:28 AM  
3 votes:
I have female friends because there's nothing I like more than listening to hours of manufactured drama with no possibility of sex afterwards.
2013-02-11 10:18:38 AM  
3 votes:
CapeFearCadaver:

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.

no, they still want you.  they're just increasingly resigned to the fact that it can't happen.
2013-02-11 09:56:56 AM  
3 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.



So...your best friend reads Fark and knows your handle?
2013-02-11 09:48:06 AM  
3 votes:
Which is why you should never get into a serious relationship with a girl who has more guy friends than girl fiends, or a "best friend" who's a guy.

/fark em, get beejs from em, just don't date em
2013-02-11 09:07:01 AM  
3 votes:
The only people that need to read this is 20-something women that really think the guys they hang out with wouldn't go for it if they could.  Recently a pair of coworkers cracked my up with whole we're only friends when they snuggled up together while getting a smoke.  The girl gave me a strange look, but later when I had the guy alone I asked him, how long before he ask her out.  He tried playing it off, probably thinking I would run my mouth and blow it for him, but he finally admitted he was considering it.  The other young guys usually admit to that alot faster, but follows up with 'she has a boyfriend'.  Any woman who doesn't already knows this, should not be surprised when a guy-friend gets tired of waiting and walks away.

My wife doesn't always believe it either, but I watch the guys who talk to her at work.  Some of them are pervs.
2013-02-11 08:49:56 AM  
3 votes:

miss diminutive: The authors of the research, from the University of Wisconsin, said films and television programmes had helped instill the idea that normal friends could become "friends with benefits" - that is, who have sex with each other.

Is there a single person left on the planet who really needs an explanation of the term "friends with benefits"?


What, like a friend who comes with dental and vision? Kids are into weird stuff these days.
2013-02-11 03:55:12 PM  
2 votes:
My best friend is a woman, and I have sex with her all. the. time.
2013-02-11 03:53:50 PM  
2 votes:

argylez: 5monkeys: I'm glad. I wish there was a way to tell before you get attached to person. That was why I was upfront when I began dating again. I knew sex was going to be really important for me in any relationship that I had. I know its a weird first or second date statement but it would really help people from wasting their time with someone they aren't going to be compatible with. So I started throwing it out there as early as seemed appropriate. Though being a girl I can say something like I want sex everyday, more if possible and not sound creepy.

Ok, I will admit, I've heard this from a girl before, but she weighed more than I do.  I've dated a TON (I'm a really attractive guy), but never have I ever met someone who came close to verbalizing her needs like that.

I live in Philly - do you have any hot friends with a similar drive?

/how do you REALLY know what a persons sex drive is?


start having sex with them and keep having sex with them for an extended period of time.  say a year of so. by then you will know and it is really the only way. women often lie about their sex drive to get a man to stay around.  it's in that 7th month or so that the true scale of someone's sex drive is apparent.  take my wife for instance.  now, as I have said before, to her credit she does try her best to keep up with me and keep me happy.  her sex drive however is not nearly what she thought it was when we first got together.  she thought she had a high sex drive...  until she was with a man that TRULY has a high sex drive.  It was in our second year of marriage that she was like "i think maybe the sex could slow down abit" and i told her "as long as we have been together, our sex life has been this way.  I haven't changed.  Have you?"  "no...."  "so what is the problem?  it isn't like we got married and then I sprung this high sex drive on you.  years have passed."  "true..."  "so.  as long as you and I are together, you will be with a man that wants to have sex with you as often as possible.  cool?"  "yes".  marriage is about compromise.  I provide for her, care for her, love her completely and i am completely faithful.  in return i expect companionship, friendship, and sex.  i don't care if she can cook (altho she can).  I don't care if the house gets cleaned (altho we do keep it neat).  I don't care if the laundry gets done (she usually does it, but I do from time to time).  I DO care that most nights she is in my bed rythmically moving around on my penis.  She does, and does well.  Now when she is sick, or very tired, or the time just isn't right, great, I understand.  But last night is a good example.  "come have sex with me."  "i'm so sleepy tho."  "ok, let's go to bed and sleep"  "but I want to play my sims game before I go to sleep".  "fine.  then come give me 30 minutes and then do what ever you want babe." "but I am so sleepy."  "if you aren't so sleepy that you want to go to bed, if you are awake enough to play sims, you can come have sex with me." "true.."
2013-02-11 03:44:11 PM  
2 votes:

miss diminutive: I don't think we're all that different, really. I think the main difference I've noticed is that women (myself included) simply won't put up with being in the "friend zone" for as long men will.


Last month a woman I had been dating (and being intimate with) tried to friend-zone me.  I explained to her I was not going to put up with the pain of dating a single mom with none of the benefits.  Then I left and never called her again.

In defense of your statement, I had tolerated being friend-zoned in the past.  I finally got sick of that shiat and won't put up with it any more.

/and after I walked out I realized I had left my Firefly DVD set at her place
//I decided to buy a new set instead of going back for it
2013-02-11 03:28:56 PM  
2 votes:
Women are incredibly naive when it comes to relationships. For fear of being turned down, women will not generally be up front and direct with what they want. They would rather string along the other person and have them play the role they want them to play. Here is how it typically works:

Girl meets guy. Girl talks with guy and banters. Guy banters back or the two engage in a dialog. Girl thinks guy is interesting and fun to talk to. Guy thinks girl likes him and is flirting with him. Guy acts on this and becomes overt. Girl does not state they just want a friendship or that she is in a relationship for fear of losing this fun person to talk to. Guy takes this as cue to advance and is struck down by girl. Guy is pissed they wasted a bunch of time and girl led him on. Girl is upset guy hit on her. Things end awkward and any sort of friendship is out of the question. Now, it is weird whenever they see each other.

Girls have a hard time being direct. They should express and communicate exactly what they want. If they want a friendship or are in a relationship, let the guy know. If their wants align with yours, congratulations a potential friend! If they don't, well better cut things off before any time is wasted. I think it really is a selfishness thing. Girls intentionally lead guys on to get what they want out of the relationship. Guys are guilty of this as well, but usually it is in relation to the physical. Guys primarily pretend to be interested in girls to get easy access to sex.

The thing I am interested in however is that in both scenarios, girls either play dumb or are just naive.
2013-02-11 02:33:48 PM  
2 votes:
I wouldn't go as far to say that EVERY guy who tries to be friends with a woman is trying to get into her pants.

I would say that if a man became friends with a woman and a situation happened where he COULD get into her pants, he very well would consider it. Strongly.
2013-02-11 02:29:42 PM  
2 votes:
Meh.  ALL face to face social interactions are influenced by the attractiveness of people you are interacting with.  No one has transcended hardwired human psychology   Especially not the inevitable few who pretend they have.

That goes for men and women.  And not just friendships.  It could be the way the checkout person (male or female) that you (male or female) have never met and will never see again treats you.   Smiling and being friendly chatty with the attractive customer, acting curt and businesslike with the unattractive customer.

So..... let me guess.  A thread full of one part men who can be friends with someone they would be willing to have sex with, one part people very angry that men can be friends with someone they would be willing to have sex with, one part people pretending that they are above all this and have transcended the bestial evolutionary drives that lesser people have, one part women pretending to not realize that men want to have sex (even though they too want to have sex), one part men acting confused that there are women who don't want to have sex with them, and one part men hoping that if they act like white knights it will get them sex.

/DRTFA or thread
2013-02-11 02:06:59 PM  
2 votes:

yapopo: i propose that from now on, we make the following assumptions while reading any comment in any thread:

1.)  when someone says something that sounds like a huge generalization, they never mean literally 100%.  they know they are making a generalization.  it's just a pita to have to type out "i know this is a generalization" every time.

2.)  everyone is just speaking for themselves, even if it sounds like they are speaking for others.  they know they are just speaking for themselves.  it's just a pita to have to type out "i am only speaking for myself" every time.

haha k?


Whoa, whoa, whoa
t1.gstatic.com
You're asking that people accept comments within proper context and not at their most inflammatory and literal absolute, on FARK? Well that's... that's actually just crazy enough to work.
2013-02-11 01:41:31 PM  
2 votes:
PsiChick:

No, it's not normal to want to fark every woman in sight. Men and women have basically the same sex drive--the differences, if any, are minute. If only one gender expresses a serious difference, it ain't nature we're talking about.

it is normal.  only a woman would think that men and women have basically the same sex drive.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testoster on e

check out act 2, specifically. it's about a woman who takes testosterone.  she talks about how it affected her sexuality.
2013-02-11 01:23:18 PM  
2 votes:
frued put it simply, sex and glory.

the male hopes the female will mate with him

the female is using the male to bait a more aggressive competitive suitor.

consciously or subconsciously this is what is happening.

you can deny it all you want, but its a well documented observation, just like insecurity and envy its a taboo topic.
2013-02-11 12:44:42 PM  
2 votes:

jennies1897: I've been friends with all sorts of guys. Different personalities, different goals and drive in life. Like from the "I wanna be a washed-up drug addict" to "decent guy with aspirations, wife and kids" kinds of guys, plus quite a bit in between. What does that say about me?


www.redkid.net
2013-02-11 12:29:12 PM  
2 votes:
Harry Burns: Because no man can be friends with a woman that he finds attractive. He always wants to have sex with her.
Sally Albright: So, you're saying that a man can be friends with a woman he finds unattractive?
Harry Burns: No. You pretty much want to nail 'em too.

They could have saved all the effort on research and just watched the movie.
2013-02-11 12:23:04 PM  
2 votes:

Theaetetus: corn-bread: Theaetetus: corn-bread: Where women go off the tracks here is they confuse "improbable" with "no desire".  The guy may be a pussy and it may take a series of extreme circumstances before he'll make his move (her passed out drunk on the hood of a car clutching signed consent forms with a huge blinking neon "Go for it!" sign pointing to her vag) but the fact that it would take *a lot* doesn't mean he *wouldn't*.

ಠ_ಠ


Yes, as the preface to that said: "extreme circumstances".
Such is the nature of the subset known as the beta pussy male "friend".

(i) Yeah, I don't think talking about nailing passed out women as a reasonable circumstance to have sex with her is a good thing.
(ii) You keep using "pussy" as an insult, which makes me suspect you really dislike it. NTAAWWT, but maybe you should come clean about your desires.



(i) That's good.  Beause "extreme" was not meant to mean "reasonable" no matter how much you want it so.
(ii) Having spent part of my 20's as the "friend", it is an apt descriptor.  If you can't relate, consider yourself fortunate.
2013-02-11 11:59:24 AM  
2 votes:

Dafatone: WhippingBoy: Dafatone: Guys often have women friends they aren't interested in

We're talking about straight guys here...

Ha.  I'm willing to knock it down from often to sometimes, but it does happen.


The problem is that if I met a woman who was so cool and so interesting that I'd want to be her friend (on a non-sexual level), I'd eventually become so insanely attracted to her that thoughts of sex would eventually rear their ugly head.
2013-02-11 11:58:38 AM  
2 votes:
I can't speak for women as a whole, but I've had more than a few admit to me their attraction to a male friend, too. I don't really think there's a difference there.


What's different is, (1) women pick up on the 'I'm attracted to you' cues better than men, and (2) men are more tolerant of ambiguity in this. Sometimes *too* tolerant .... which is guaranteed to land them in the needy-guy friendzone.


Best advice I have? If you're attracted to an opposite-sex friend, tell them. If they don't reciprocate, respect that and move on with your dating. They may have a myriad of reasons but it doesn't matter - you can't push a rope. You can still remain friends this way - in fact by making things clear it takes a lot of tension away and you can really enjoy each other as friends.
2013-02-11 11:38:40 AM  
2 votes:

yapopo: i propose that from now on, we make the following assumptions while reading any comment in any thread:

1.)  when someone says something that sounds like a huge generalization, they never mean literally 100%.  they know they are making a generalization.  it's just a pita to have to type out "i know this is a generalization" every time.

2.)  everyone is just speaking for themselves, even if it sounds like they are speaking for others.  they know they are just speaking for themselves.  it's just a pita to have to type out "i am only speaking for myself" every time.

haha k?


But then how will I refute any argument that I find even marginally objectionable by pulling out the extreme edge-case that applies to only a statistically insignificant portion of the population.

/Don't tell me to lose weight because thyroid problems!
2013-02-11 11:35:40 AM  
2 votes:
I can't believe it took 90ish comments until Ladder Theory was busted out. Fark, you are slipping.
2013-02-11 11:23:02 AM  
2 votes:

miss diminutive: Rincewind53: My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

I'm curious, are you married or in a long term relationship with another woman? My friends and I were discussing this very scenario the other day and some of them said straight up that they wouldn't date a man who's best friend is a woman.
I thought that was pretty extreme, especially since many of them are hypocritically best friends with other guys (who, according to this article at least, probably want to bone them).


So, back in college, I become friends with this girl. And in the usual wackiness of college friend sharing, a guy friend of mine starts dating one of her girl friends. It was known at time that she had been a rape victim at some point.

Anyway, one day at some point he tells me that, "We had sex this weekend. It was was sort of awkward building up to it after a few months because of the rape thing, but we worked it out be with her trusting me and so forth..." And so on. I didn't think much of it afterwards.

A few days later, my friend comes running up to me all giddy, "OH have I got news to tell you! You'll never believe what happened! you can't tell anyone I told you, because I promised to keep it a secret." And she informs me that X and Y had sex.

Boy, did she get furious, that HE, (HE of all people) would be telling people about it! "Like it was some kind of conquest or something!" How dare he break the sacred trust between boyfriend and girlfriend. And became suspicious that I was "spreading the news."

//Women are hypocritically weird.
2013-02-11 11:18:29 AM  
2 votes:
Human relationships aren't really that fragile. Marriages can harbor deep resentment, yet still be considered "good" by both people involved. Friendships can survive intense jealously, you can love your family and they can piss you off constantly. So I think a male/female friendship can survive one person being attracted to the other and still be considered a legitimate friendship.


That being said, being in a 7 year relationship, I've slowly drifted away from most of my female friends. I miss a few of them, but I also know it's not right to spend a ton of time with another woman who isn't my girlfriend.
2013-02-11 11:09:36 AM  
2 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: WhippingBoy: No... even the most happily married men have a "Plan B" kicking about in the dark recesses of their minds...

yapopo: happily married men want variety too. i'm not kidding.

They can play inside the dark recesses of their minds all they want. It ain't going happen, regardless.


Doesn't change the probable fact that your male friends have likely thought about you at least once when rubbing one out.
2013-02-11 11:08:49 AM  
2 votes:

corn-bread: And I get why women are always in denial.  They want to think that they are charming and witty and these guys just *love* hearing stories about the jerk they are dating etc.


This. I've found that women who claim that their guy-friends have absolutely no interest in sleeping with them are more than a bit narcissistic and greatly over-rate how "interesting" and "fun" they are.
2013-02-11 10:51:23 AM  
2 votes:
Funny, I find that I'm sexually attracted to women who are NOT my friends, too.

/hint to the article writer and study doing guys: men want to fark women in general, whether they're friends or not
2013-02-11 10:43:30 AM  
2 votes:

rubi_con_man: Ladies :

Unless you've known your friends since you were less than ,say, eight (see :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westermarck_effect ) Then yes, he wants to have sex with you.

Once you've had sex together he may no longer be interested, but he certainly wants it.

http://www.laddertheory.com/

and if you say you have 'lots of male friends' who don't want to sleep with you, then you're either ugly or a cocktease.

Think about it this way: How much of your restraint (how often you change partners, how soon a new partner gets to the cookie) is based on considerations like pregnancy, disease or even menstrual behavioral patterns? Many many women fail to have orgasms with vaginal intercourse. What if EVERY time you had sex with ANYONE you came? What if you never had cramps, or mood swings? What if you weren't the one getting pregnant?

... Then imagine that every man regularly is clean, well-groomed and better dressed, and suddenly becomes five times better looking (yes, this is the effect having boobs has on us... Ugly girl + nice boobs = Doable)

Because that is the reality of being male. Even ugly girls are attractive. Not in a 'I would shower them with attention' kind of way but in a 'three jagermeisters and then we'd be boning in the club bathroom' kind of way.

... and if you think that anything that you can do short of being a gigantic, acid-scarred, ball-busting biatch with a dyke haircut and strapped-down boobs will do anything to keep us away (and yes, we'd still fark you.)you're wrong.


It's sad you have to point this out, then again no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the average woman.
db2
2013-02-11 10:38:49 AM  
2 votes:
i.imgur.com
2013-02-11 10:19:00 AM  
2 votes:

miss diminutive: Insaniteus: This study proved zilch other than the fact that men ADMIT to more on surveys.  My best chick friend has a tendency to deny up one side and down the other that she has any interest in Guy X, right up until she's single and seeking him out, at which point she'll go on and on about how she's been wanting to be with him since they first met.

Women are just more used to hiding their true intentions.  We need a study like this that actually measures arousal levels in the brain to see if women truly are so different from men in this regard.

I don't think we're all that different, really. I think the main difference I've noticed is that women (myself included) simply won't put up with being in the "friend zone" for as long men will. If I'm interested in a guy and we become friends I eventually move on and set my sights on someone else if things don't progress after a certain amount of time. On the other hand, I know guys who'll be friends with a woman they want for years and years even though it's been made pretty clear that she has no interest in pursuing a romantic relationship.


24.media.tumblr.com
2013-02-11 10:12:44 AM  
2 votes:

Ikahoshi: Nonsense. I have what... 5 female friends. They're like family and I would be horrified at the thought. A stranger pointed out that one good friend and I "made a good couple" and I felt physically ill at the thought. Yes, she's attractive but whatever attraction I might have had is totally subverted by the friendship.

I can't fully describe human attractions and friendships, because I'm no expert, but there's definitely a category where friends are just friends and will never be anything else, because the attraction aspect has been short circuited by a bond that approaches too close to the 'family' dynamic.


I'd bet a million bucks you're a few Jäger bombs and a crotch rub away from much more than "friends" with your gal pals.
2013-02-11 10:05:59 AM  
2 votes:
I don't understand the "it would be having sex with my sister" line. She was, at one point, either farkable or not farkable. I've had girl space friends for years who still fall into those categories, and barring any major changes in appearance (weight gain or weight loss, primarily) they tend to stay in the same category they were in the beginning. Sure, there are many other reasons not to do it - like the guy above ripping a hole in the space-time continuum and ending countless innocent lives - but the "Yeah, I'd fark you" thought never really goes away.
2013-02-11 10:05:42 AM  
2 votes:

dready zim: CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.

This is how women think. Guys know however that if it was offered they would hit it like the fist of an angry god simply because at one point they wanted to and that NEVER goes away until about 3 seconds afterward. Guys learn to say "Oh, I would never do that now, I think of you as a sister" because you would not accept any other answer and they have to say that if they hold a chance of keeping you as a friend and then over time getting into your pants.


Hate to say it but dready zim's 100% correct.
2013-02-11 09:52:19 AM  
2 votes:
This study proved zilch other than the fact that men ADMIT to more on surveys.  My best chick friend has a tendency to deny up one side and down the other that she has any interest in Guy X, right up until she's single and seeking him out, at which point she'll go on and on about how she's been wanting to be with him since they first met.

Women are just more used to hiding their true intentions.  We need a study like this that actually measures arousal levels in the brain to see if women truly are so different from men in this regard.
2013-02-11 09:39:25 AM  
2 votes:
Heteronormative study is heteronormative.
2013-02-11 09:36:12 AM  
2 votes:

miss diminutive: I thought that was pretty extreme, especially since many of them are hypocritically best friends with other guys


You can't be "best" friends unless you can fark. Sometimes life just calls for a good romp in the hay.

You can be dear, close, or even best with an asterisk but you can't really be the best of friends until fluids are exchanged.
2013-02-11 09:33:13 AM  
2 votes:
At my age I'm more interested in a woman who can hold up her end of the conversation. Helps if she's hot though, i ain't gonna lie about that.
2013-02-11 09:28:37 AM  
2 votes:

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: ranold: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

You're gay.

Hey, now.  She could be fat.


She could have a penis.
2013-02-11 09:25:23 AM  
2 votes:

ranold: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

You're gay.


It may strike you as odd, but some men occasionally think of women as something other than a place to stick a penis.
2013-02-11 09:21:07 AM  
2 votes:
That's because boobies.
2013-02-11 09:18:20 AM  
2 votes:
I find it easier to be friends with people I'm not sexually attracted to. I can't be the only one.
2013-02-11 09:10:28 AM  
2 votes:
Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.
2013-02-12 01:12:00 AM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.


Your wife knows your fark handle, right?
2013-02-11 09:11:06 PM  
1 votes:
no (straight) guy has ever met an attractive woman and thought, "wow, she's really hot, I'd like to listen to her complain about how insensitive her boyfriend is and how he didn't remember their anniversary and he doesn't seem to care that she can't stand his roommate, and blah blah blah blah... and not ever have sex with her"
2013-02-11 09:05:29 PM  
1 votes:

frepnog: Ikahoshi: Nonsense. I have what... 5 female friends. They're like family and I would be horrified at the thought. A stranger pointed out that one good friend and I "made a good couple" and I felt physically ill at the thought. Yes, she's attractive but whatever attraction I might have had is totally subverted by the friendship.

I can't fully describe human attractions and friendships, because I'm no expert, but there's definitely a category where friends are just friends and will never be anything else, because the attraction aspect has been short circuited by a bond that approaches too close to the 'family' dynamic.

this is either complete utter bullshiat OR you are the world's biggest pussy.  In a world where dudes bang their cousins there is no way you have female friends that the thought of having sex with revolts you.  I can see not wanting to fark up a friendship but you know as well as I that if one of them dropped to her knees and started making with the cock sucking you'd blow chowder all in her hair.

Women - your guy friends all want to fark you and will given the chance.  Unless you are a hideous hose-beast (and even then they will think hard about it, hell all men have been hoggin' at one time or another) this is correct in ALL cases.  There is simply few cases of true platonic friendship between men and women.

My own wife had a friend that she SWORE was just a friend.  Right up until he asked her to leave me for him.  And this was a guy that had been her friend for over 5 years.

Just friends.  MMMHHHHMMM.

Women, don't buy our bullshiat.  We want in your pants.  That is why we hang around you, come sniffin' around when we hear you broke up with someone, call to check when we hear your cat died.

Pants.  We want in yours.

Because think about it - men don't NEED female "friends".  We have guy friends to do guy stuff with - playing xbox, talking about politics, watching sports, drinking beer, and our guy friends are ALL better and always will be bett ...

s
See I've seen this argument made repeatedly on Fark, but if this were true then no woman would ever get turned down by a straight guy which simply isn't true.  Sure you can write it off as she's a hideous hose-beast, but I've seen moderately attractive girls get turned down by guys.  I've been turned down by guys before.  My assumption is the guy finds the girl repulsive in these cases, but then you guys keep arguing that even if you are hideous they would consider it.   I don't know, but I think every guy has a limit as to what level of unattractiveness they will "stoop" to.
2013-02-11 05:19:52 PM  
1 votes:
You can be the noblest, most decent guy in the world, delightedly married, and nevertheless at some point you're going to have a friend who is a) female and b) a genetic lottery winner. There will be an impulse, even if it's only a moment where the little devil on your left shoulder says "dayummmmmmmm...". You might never act on the impulse, even if an opportunity arose to act on it, because the risk/reward ratio is no good for you.  But that doesn't mean the impulse got switched off in you.

One of my female friends is one of the most thoroughly decent people I've ever known. But she's also staggeringly hot. Imagine, if you will, Fred Rogers in Kate Upton's body. It is disconcerting as hell to speak with her. You try having an adult conversation when the monkey part of your brain is making Tex Avery faces.

Thankfully she only uses her powers for good and not evil.
2013-02-11 04:16:40 PM  
1 votes:

zepillin: It's a difficult situation to maintain if you suddenly develop issues around her enjoying having multiple lovers In her life.

Friends and lovers does not equal exclusively engaged,
America

If only there was a word for frequent female companion in American,
the world would be a better place.


Normally I'd agree with you. We had very open lines of communication, she was fairly adamant that she doesn't sleep around and our situation was a very rare thing to happen to her.

Until suddenly it wasn't. A drunken weekend on her part and one long text message later I'm persona non grata. I wasn't really expecting that based on what she had told me several times....my own fault for enjoying her company and wanting to see where it was heading, I suppose. Thankfully it happened sooner rather then later.

Funnily enough, I never pursued her....she made the move on me initially. I was content to be only friends up until the point she jumped in my lap. Even afterwards I was keeping myself guarded and was waiting for the other shoe to drop. She kinda wormed her way through the defenses recently only to deliver this surprise last week.

It was only a couple of months, not like I expected anything special. A little up front honesty could have possibly salvaged the friendship. Coming across her in a pre-coital stealth mission kinda blew that up.

/At least I got my Firefly box set back
2013-02-11 04:13:24 PM  
1 votes:

OgreMagi: miss diminutive: I don't think we're all that different, really. I think the main difference I've noticed is that women (myself included) simply won't put up with being in the "friend zone" for as long men will.

Last month a woman I had been dating (and being intimate with) tried to friend-zone me.  I explained to her I was not going to put up with the pain of dating a single mom with none of the benefits.  Then I left and never called her again.

In defense of your statement, I had tolerated being friend-zoned in the past.  I finally got sick of that shiat and won't put up with it any more.

/and after I walked out I realized I had left my Firefly DVD set at her place
//I decided to buy a new set instead of going back for it


I've never tried to friend zone someone I have slept with. How does one even ask that?
2013-02-11 04:08:20 PM  
1 votes:

frepnog: Most people don't buy it, but as I have told her - "there are 24 hours in a day. If you can find time to watch tv, play gameboy, care for the dogs, you can carve out an hour to have sex with your husband".


No kids then? Those little twerps are cockblockers.
2013-02-11 03:55:11 PM  
1 votes:
miss diminutive:
I don't think we're all that different, really. I think the main difference I've noticed is that women (myself included) simply won't put up with being in the "friend zone" for as long men will. If I'm interested in a guy and we become friends I eventually move on and set my sights on someone else if things don't progress after a certain amount of time. On the other hand, I know guys who'll be friends with a woman they want for years and years even though it's been made pretty clear that she has no interest in pursuing a romantic relationship.

there's almost no such thing as a friend zone for guys, at least not in the same way as with women.  if you're a (non fugly biatch) woman in a man's "friend zone" it just means that he can't sleep with you for practical reasons.  he still wants to, he just won't (for example he's married).

on the other hand, when a girl puts a guy into friend zone, it means she basically has no sexual feelings for him at all.  it's much harder for a guy to get out of the friend zone, though not impossible.
2013-02-11 03:48:43 PM  
1 votes:

Millennium: 5monkeys: heh. my POF profile pissed off a bunch of women because it said clearly "i am adult and i desire an adult relationship. That means sex. if you are hung up on sex, or think sex is not important, don't waste my time and yours."

See? Woman find that honesty creepy. I don't get it. It makes sense to me that you should be able to voice that. Instead they hear that creep wants to have sex with me. If course he wants to have sex with you! What did you think he wants to buy you dinners and hang out all the time while meeting you on a dating site?

Mature people interact with people on many levels and in many ways, not all of which involve sex. If you cannot interact with someone of the gender to which you're attracted without bring sex into the equation, and you are not 14 years old, then you are being immature. This is creepy.


Of course it can't all be about sex. You have to be able to get along when you aren't naked. But if you have two opposite sex drives both people end up unhappy. You can be friends and not have or talk about sex, but if you are in a relationship sex is part if the equation.
2013-02-11 03:45:39 PM  
1 votes:

the money is in the banana stand: Women are incredibly naive when it comes to relationships. For fear of being turned down, women will not generally be up front and direct with what they want. They would rather string along the other person and have them play the role they want them to play. Here is how it typically works:

Girl meets guy. Girl talks with guy and banters. Guy banters back or the two engage in a dialog. Girl thinks guy is interesting and fun to talk to. Guy thinks girl likes him and is flirting with him. Guy acts on this and becomes overt. Girl does not state they just want a friendship or that she is in a relationship for fear of losing this fun person to talk to. Guy takes this as cue to advance and is struck down by girl. Guy is pissed they wasted a bunch of time and girl led him on. Girl is upset guy hit on her. Things end awkward and any sort of friendship is out of the question. Now, it is weird whenever they see each other.

Girls have a hard time being direct. They should express and communicate exactly what they want. If they want a friendship or are in a relationship, let the guy know. If their wants align with yours, congratulations a potential friend! If they don't, well better cut things off before any time is wasted. I think it really is a selfishness thing. Girls intentionally lead guys on to get what they want out of the relationship. Guys are guilty of this as well, but usually it is in relation to the physical. Guys primarily pretend to be interested in girls to get easy access to sex.

The thing I am interested in however is that in both scenarios, girls either play dumb or are just naive.


I think both lie. Girls leave out that they aren't interested and guys act like they aren't waiting for opportunity to show up. When I got divorced I lost a few friends because suddenly I was available to fark. I had no interest in farking them and the "friendships" ended. I didn't know they were waiting on deck and when they struck out I was no longer useful. It was an eye opener about male/female relationships.
2013-02-11 03:33:07 PM  
1 votes:

argylez: 5monkeys: I'm glad. I wish there was a way to tell before you get attached to person. That was why I was upfront when I began dating again. I knew sex was going to be really important for me in any relationship that I had. I know its a weird first or second date statement but it would really help people from wasting their time with someone they aren't going to be compatible with. So I started throwing it out there as early as seemed appropriate. Though being a girl I can say something like I want sex everyday, more if possible and not sound creepy.

Ok, I will admit, I've heard this from a girl before, but she weighed more than I do.  I've dated a TON (I'm a really attractive guy), but never have I ever met someone who came close to verbalizing her needs like that.


This is why I date more than one person at a time.  I'm pretty voracious.  I've had guys tell me I wore them out.

/how do you REALLY know what a persons sex drive is?

If your partner isn't willing to be honest, for whatever reason - you'll never know.  Same if you aren't willing to trust them.  It's not like you can force them to wear an FMRI for weeks at a time.
2013-02-11 03:27:35 PM  
1 votes:

5monkeys: argylez: 5monkeys: Thanks. It's all the sex. Keeps me trim.
Seriously though, if you find her it will be awesome. I never realized how much my need not getting met affected my mood. It will be great for her too. Like I said before, most guys say they want that but can't keep up. You will be a happy change.

You give me hope.

I'm glad. I wish there was a way to tell before you get attached to person. That was why I was upfront when I began dating again. I knew sex was going to be really important for me in any relationship that I had. I know its a weird first or second date statement but it would really help people from wasting their time with someone they aren't going to be compatible with. So I started throwing it out there as early as seemed appropriate. Though being a girl I can say something like I want sex everyday, more if possible and not sound creepy.


heh.  my POF profile pissed off a bunch of women because it said clearly "i am adult and i desire an adult relationship.  That means sex.  if you are hung up on sex, or think sex is not important, don't waste my time and yours."
2013-02-11 03:14:20 PM  
1 votes:

reillan: My best friend is a woman who I have absolutely no sexual attraction to now, but I would be lying if I said that I didn't when we first met.


How long have you two been married?

/*rimshot*
2013-02-11 03:04:53 PM  
1 votes:

CtrlAltDestroy: lack of warmth: The only people that need to read this is 20-something women that really think the guys they hang out with wouldn't go for it if they could.

Many, yes. But not all. I'm perfectly content with having a female friend that I have no intention on boinking and wouldn't if I had the chance. Not all of us are ruled by our little head. I have no interest in casual sex. No romantic attraction (to the person as a whole) means no active desire to get my hands on said person. Although also aware that I'm an outlier in that regard.

/Mid 20's.
//Have always been this way.



roughly 80 pounds over weight too from the sounds of it girly man
2013-02-11 02:40:15 PM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.


I have to agree.  My best friend also happens to be female, and while I know she is attractive, I'd never screw up the friendship by trying to get into my sister's pants.

We CAN be "just friends".  I love her to death but I don't want to have sex.  We actually have worked together to set eachother up with others.  When we met, we dated, but it turned into friends rather than dating more, and we do our own things romantically... she really is like my sister.  And I'm 46 so I guess part of it is getting older and seeing that something really would be better as "just friends" and going with it.
2013-02-11 02:36:16 PM  
1 votes:

miss diminutive: I don't think we're all that different, really. I think the main difference I've noticed is that women (myself included) simply won't put up with being in the "friend zone" for as long men will. If I'm interested in a guy and we become friends I eventually move on and set my sights on someone else if things don't progress after a certain amount of time. On the other hand, I know guys who'll be friends with a woman they want for years and years even though it's been made pretty clear that she has no interest in pursuing a romantic relationship.


Penises have tenacity.  It's why we've made it this far.  Higher reason might dictate that moving on and setting sights on others is advisable, but as long as a hot woman remains on a man's list of regularly-encountered people, he's going to continue thinking about banging her, if not all the time than at least in passing.  Also, some situations make it challenging to completely remove an individual from one's social sphere, particularly with mutual friends involved.

Ironically, more than once I've known dudes who purposefully take steps to avoid women they're interested in because they know it's fruitless, only to be approached by the same women asking what's the matter and why don't they ever see them around anymore.

I'm surprised you haven't had more bites for this.  6/10
2013-02-11 02:34:30 PM  
1 votes:

PsiChick: yapopo: PsiChick: yapopo: PsiChick:

No, it's not normal to want to fark every woman in sight. Men and women have basically the same sex drive--the differences, if any, are minute. If only one gender expresses a serious difference, it ain't nature we're talking about.

it is normal.  only a woman would think that men and women have basically the same sex drive.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testoster on e

check out act 2, specifically. it's about a woman who takes testosterone.  she talks about how it affected her sexuality.

The effects of taking extra hormone supplements != the effect of natural levels of testosterone in either gender, especially when discussing someone who took so much testosterone I'm stunned she didn't poison herself.

yah but it's not totally irrelevant either.  it gives you some idea.  be honest about that.

...She  nearly farking poisoned herself, how,  how does that look like a relevant data point to you? If I poison myself with a pot of coffee, does that mean drinking coffee makes you farking hallucinate?

/Goddamnit, America,  this is why we do not take science or debate club out of schools.


no she did not poison herself.  you don't need to lecture me on science.  i'm a freakin scientist.  well, i was.  just because something is not backed by a million data points does not mean you should just close your eyes completely.  you are still allowed to use some common sense. this isn't proof positive of course.  but it gives you an indication.
2013-02-11 02:18:12 PM  
1 votes:

5monkeys: frepnog: Theaetetus: frepnog: I have told more than one woman "I don't want to be your "friend".  I have friends.  I want to have sex with you"... Example - my wife and I...

Now, there's a relationship that I'm sure will last.

my wife and I have a fantastic relationship.  She is everything I have ever wanted in a woman  - she likes metal, horror, gaming and having sex with me.  Been together now almost 5 years and have had sex with her almost every day since (had sex with her twice the first time we met in person).  Most people don't buy it, but as I have told her - "there are 24 hours in a day.  If you can find time to watch tv, play gameboy, care for the dogs, you can carve out an hour to have sex with your husband".

More couples should try it honestly, and honestly more people should be more honest about why they are with a person.

Kevin Smith said it best  - "I love farking my wife".

Most people don't believe that we have sex everyday either, but why wouldn't you want to? If you are both healthy there shouldn't be an obstacle that would stop you from wanting to make your partner feel great once a day.


because people like to pretend and put up the false front that sex is not generally the most if not one of the most important parts of a relationship.  people like to pretend that men don't get married because they REALLY like banging their wife.  it has been my experience that the happiest couples are ones that have sex very regularly.  Look, I love my wife with all my heart.  I would do ANYTHING for her.  I would take a bullet for her.  I have and will always sacrifice so that she can have.  Having said that if tomorrow she came to me and said "i love you and will always be with you but I will never have sex with you again" I would have to say

www.nationofblue.com
2013-02-11 02:07:16 PM  
1 votes:

5monkeys: yapopo: PsiChick:

No, it's not normal to want to fark every woman in sight. Men and women have basically the same sex drive--the differences, if any, are minute. If only one gender expresses a serious difference, it ain't nature we're talking about.

it is normal.  only a woman would think that men and women have basically the same sex drive.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testoster on e

check out act 2, specifically. it's about a woman who takes testosterone.  she talks about how it affected her sexuality.

See the problem with me is that I have a super high sex drive. I want sex once a day or I am not satisfied. As a woman I have found that guys talk a good game about being able to keep up with that when they first want to be with you, but unable to actually do it. I was really honest with my fiancée when we first started dating and he admitted years later that he thought I was exaggerating. But I wasn't. He has been able to keep up, and this had made our relationship a lot easier. I know I have an abnormally high drive, but it does happen.


i think I suprised my wife with this one too.  I have an incredibly high sex drive, made even worse by the fact that I find my wife just sexually irresistible.  I don't think she truly expected that after close to five years I would still be banging her every day.  Bless her, she does try to keep up.

/My wife is the closest I have found to my own sex drive, but I seriously don't think there is a woman alive that TRULY matches what I need.  every now and then I will ask the wife on a mutual off day to just let me have sex with her every time I REALLY want to.  After the 5th or 6th time she is usually "ok, enough for today".
2013-02-11 02:01:31 PM  
1 votes:

5monkeys: yapopo: PsiChick:

No, it's not normal to want to fark every woman in sight. Men and women have basically the same sex drive--the differences, if any, are minute. If only one gender expresses a serious difference, it ain't nature we're talking about.

it is normal.  only a woman would think that men and women have basically the same sex drive.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testoster on e

check out act 2, specifically. it's about a woman who takes testosterone.  she talks about how it affected her sexuality.

See the problem with me is that I have a super high sex drive. I want sex once a day or I am not satisfied. As a woman I have found that guys talk a good game about being able to keep up with that when they first want to be with you, but unable to actually do it. I was really honest with my fiancée when we first started dating and he admitted years later that he thought I was exaggerating. But I wasn't. He has been able to keep up, and this had made our relationship a lot easier. I know I have an abnormally high drive, but it does happen.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coolidge_effect

i actually did scientific research on this.  kinda funny.
2013-02-11 01:59:00 PM  
1 votes:

frepnog: Theaetetus: frepnog: I have told more than one woman "I don't want to be your "friend".  I have friends.  I want to have sex with you"... Example - my wife and I...

Now, there's a relationship that I'm sure will last.

my wife and I have a fantastic relationship.  She is everything I have ever wanted in a woman  - she likes metal, horror, gaming and having sex with me.  Been together now almost 5 years and have had sex with her almost every day since (had sex with her twice the first time we met in person).  Most people don't buy it, but as I have told her - "there are 24 hours in a day.  If you can find time to watch tv, play gameboy, care for the dogs, you can carve out an hour to have sex with your husband".

More couples should try it honestly, and honestly more people should be more honest about why they are with a person.

Kevin Smith said it best  - "I love farking my wife".


Most people don't believe that we have sex everyday either, but why wouldn't you want to? If you are both healthy there shouldn't be an obstacle that would stop you from wanting to make your partner feel great once a day.
2013-02-11 01:57:35 PM  
1 votes:
It gets really complicated b/c some women will cheat and others never.  Some like persistence, others don't.  You don't want to bark up the right tree.
2013-02-11 01:57:32 PM  
1 votes:

argylez: I can be friends with a buddies wife b/c of the initial buddy friendship and not be attracted to her.


then why is it SO many times that a man's wife cheats on him with her husband's friend?

/heard a guy on a talk show put it best  - (guy who's wife cheated) "but you're my friend!" (guy that banged said dude's wife) "when it comes to pussy, I ain't got no friends".
2013-02-11 01:56:05 PM  
1 votes:

yapopo: PsiChick:

No, it's not normal to want to fark every woman in sight. Men and women have basically the same sex drive--the differences, if any, are minute. If only one gender expresses a serious difference, it ain't nature we're talking about.

it is normal.  only a woman would think that men and women have basically the same sex drive.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testoster on e

check out act 2, specifically. it's about a woman who takes testosterone.  she talks about how it affected her sexuality.


See the problem with me is that I have a super high sex drive. I want sex once a day or I am not satisfied. As a woman I have found that guys talk a good game about being able to keep up with that when they first want to be with you, but unable to actually do it. I was really honest with my fiancée when we first started dating and he admitted years later that he thought I was exaggerating. But I wasn't. He has been able to keep up, and this had made our relationship a lot easier. I know I have an abnormally high drive, but it does happen.
2013-02-11 01:40:33 PM  
1 votes:
My best friend is a woman, and I have no interest in her whatsoever.

Because she used to be a man.
2013-02-11 01:39:45 PM  
1 votes:
People in this thread are apparently incapable of forming genuine meaningful emotional connections, but sure are ready to fake them in order to bide their time and catch their 'friend' in an inebriated moment of weakness.

It must be  shockingto a lot of these  fine upstanding gentlemen that women get creeper vibes off them, and subsequently avoid them beyond suffering casual interactions.
2013-02-11 01:39:10 PM  
1 votes:
The article says that mens friendships with women are drive by sexual attraction, not if they'd actively pursue the women.

Yes, I only am friends with women if I'm sexually attracted to them - these are friendships that I actively seek out...not friends of friends, etc.  I can be friends with a buddies wife b/c of the initial buddy friendship and not be attracted to her.

If I really, REALLY think that a woman is interested, then I'd make a move if we were friends.
2013-02-11 01:37:21 PM  
1 votes:

Theaetetus: corn-bread: Sure, because constantly writing "he who is too cowardly to ask the woman for what he really wants" just gets tedious.
I'd say to go back and look again at my "complaining", but reading in general just isn't your style.

And what's wrong with "cowardly" as a term that you have to use "pussy"? Not enough expression of your anger towards women?


Because the connotations are different and it implies they are not acting as men.
This concept seems offensive to you.

I know a clerk posturing when I see it.

Nope, apparently, you don't.

Funny you bring up another conversation you weren't a part of, selectively quoted, and effectively train wrecked.

... says the guy who derailed this thread into a discussion of clerks. Pot, meet kettle.


Coming from King Troll, I'll take that as a compliment.

Wait you were the one making the gay blasts earlier.  Is this part where you profess your undying love?

"Gay blasts"? You know, for an alleged lawyer, you don't really have a great command of language.



Just dumbing it down for the intended recipient.
2013-02-11 01:30:24 PM  
1 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.


It would be a real touching display of long term friendship if you just blew them all. no honey they still think of you as a piece of ass ,but they like you too, and so they eased up off that ass grab all those years ago.Go ahead and give the  treat. a bit of their long lost youth back. Show them that you care.
2013-02-11 01:21:03 PM  
1 votes:

Ikahoshi: Nonsense. I have what... 5 female friends. They're like family and I would be horrified at the thought. A stranger pointed out that one good friend and I "made a good couple" and I felt physically ill at the thought. Yes, she's attractive but whatever attraction I might have had is totally subverted by the friendship.

I can't fully describe human attractions and friendships, because I'm no expert, but there's definitely a category where friends are just friends and will never be anything else, because the attraction aspect has been short circuited by a bond that approaches too close to the 'family' dynamic.



mentalpoo.files.wordpress.com
2013-02-11 01:17:23 PM  
1 votes:

dready zim: CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.

This is how women think. Guys know however that if it was offered they would hit it like the fist of an angry god simply because at one point they wanted to and that NEVER goes away until about 3 seconds afterward. Guys learn to say "Oh, I would never do that now, I think of you as a sister" because you would not accept any other answer and they have to say that if they hold a chance of keeping you as a friend and then over time getting into your pants.



THAT!
2013-02-11 01:05:37 PM  
1 votes:

MaliFinn: ranold: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

You're gay.

It may strike you as odd, but some men occasionally think of women as something other than a place to stick a penis.


When are you and your soon to be husband tying the knot?
2013-02-11 01:01:30 PM  
1 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: So, if women would often consider it too, why do they, as the study in the article and 100% of my anecdotal experience, always claim otherwise?


Fear of slut shaming. The social idiocy of stud vs. slut. Hell, for a guy it's "You wouldn't hit that? What are you, gay?" Hell, we've seen that in these comments.
2013-02-11 12:55:57 PM  
1 votes:
Theaetetus:
...that's why you're using a term for women's genitals in a derogatory fashion and complain that you were the "friend". Yeah, clearly you're not bitter towards women.

Wow, you suck at arguing.
2013-02-11 12:51:33 PM  
1 votes:

StashMonster: My main thought on the whole subject can be summed up like this: people, in general, tend to make friends with people they find attractive. They also begin to find people attractive that they spend a lot of time with. One of my (male) friends once pointed out that given enough time, people will eventually fantasise about everyone they spend time with. I didn't take this as especially a 'guy thing' and I don't think he expected it to be taken that way either.


 This is a long way from actively wanting to fark someone in particular. There can be varying degrees of attraction and/or intent. There can be all sorts of other considerations that come into play. I can believe that guys in general may be more likely to say 'yes' if sex is offered, simply because as another poster pointed out girls have to worry more about things like pregnancy, menstrual cycles, etc. *Maybe* they are also more horny but frankly my life experience leads me to doubt this.


------

Ok, but see if you're willing to accept that people make friends with those they find to be attractive, then why is it so hard to then believe that men would want to have sex with said attractive woman?  Is this a "guy thing"?  Well I've never heard a woman express similar.  Naturally it's possible, but I've yet to hear any women ever tell me that they "grew" into wanting a relationship.  Ya'all seem to pretty much decide early on whether or not it's going to happen.


As for that being "a long way from actively wanting to fark someone", I (and many in this forum) don't believe it is (at least for the guys).  Billy Crystal said it best: Women need a reason to have sex, guys just need a place.  Indeed women seem to put large complexities into their relationships.  At the risk of painting dudes as one step from the barbarian (yes, some are more sophisticated blah blah blah) with many guys I would submit to you that it is as simple as "She's attractive, I'd bang her."
2013-02-11 12:40:11 PM  
1 votes:
StashMonster:

Which brings me to my last point - it is well established that women habitually lie in surveys and of course in real life about their sexuality. How many partners, how often they masturbate, and of course who they may be attracted to. People used to believe that men were more promiscuous - now it's known fact that men simply lie to inflate the number of partners but women lie to pretend they haven't slept with as many people. There's a lot of pressure on guys to say that they'd 'hit that' but if a girl talks the same way she gets criticised and called a whore (been there, done that). I also expect that the fact that young guys are more likely to be unable to get regular sex than girls may be skewing the results.

men as a whole want sex more, but women as a whole are able to get sex more.  therefore it is entirely possible for a woman to have a higher count than a man if she is promiscuous enough.  i think you said as much.  but that doesn't change the fact that men want it more, including with their female friends.  some women no doubt want to bang their male friends too, but nearly in as high a proportion.

as i said, women have a friend-zone.  men do not.  in general.
2013-02-11 12:38:20 PM  
1 votes:
As someone who just went from friends, to friends with benefits, to not talking to each other anymore with a girl who lives in my apartment building over the past couple of months, I can testify that it's not impossible to transition from friend to FWB.....it is, however, a difficult situation to maintain.

Especially when she gives you a BJ on a saturday and the next time you see her a few days later she's sneaking out with an overnight bag and a random dude you've never seen. Then tells you she just wants to be friends.

/That was my weekend, how was yours?
//Non-CSB
2013-02-11 12:31:27 PM  
1 votes:

corn-bread: I tell women this all the time, and every time I get the same horrified look.  Yes ladies, your male friends want to bang you.  Yes, *that one* too.

Where women go off the tracks here is they confuse "improbable" with "no desire".  The guy may be a pussy and it may take a series of extreme circumstances before he'll make his move (her passed out drunk on the hood of a car clutching signed consent forms with a huge blinking neon "Go for it!" sign pointing to her vag) but the fact that it would take *a lot* doesn't mean he *wouldn't*.

And I get why women are always in denial.  They want to think that they are charming and witty and these guys just *love* hearing stories about the jerk they are dating etc.  And so they deny what men are.  But this line of reasoning usually falls apart when I ask the same women how many times they've listened to the guy's stories / dating woes / etc.  The give-to-take ratio is typically highly unbalanced, thus it ain't a friendship. A stand-in boyfriend, sure.  An "emotional tampon" situation, perhaps.


Not in the case of my friendships with men, no. I think too much here depends on the woman concerned. I don't expect that my male friends can be a particularly skewed sample, as I used to know a LOT of very different people.

My main thought on the whole subject can be summed up like this: people, in general, tend to make friends with people they find attractive. They also begin to find people attractive that they spend a lot of time with. One of my (male) friends once pointed out that given enough time, people will eventually fantasise about everyone they spend time with. I didn't take this as especially a 'guy thing' and I don't think he expected it to be taken that way either.

This is a long way from actively wanting to fark someone in particular. There can be varying degrees of attraction and/or intent. There can be all sorts of other considerations that come into play. I can believe that guys in general may be more likely to say 'yes' if sex is offered, simply because as another poster pointed out girls have to worry more about things like pregnancy, menstrual cycles, etc. *Maybe* they are also more horny but frankly my life experience leads me to doubt this.

Which brings me to my last point - it is well established that women habitually lie in surveys and of course in real life about their sexuality. How many partners, how often they masturbate, and of course who they may be attracted to. People used to believe that men were more promiscuous - now it's known fact that men simply lie to inflate the number of partners but women lie to pretend they haven't slept with as many people. There's a lot of pressure on guys to say that they'd 'hit that' but if a girl talks the same way she gets criticised and called a whore (been there, done that). I also expect that the fact that young guys are more likely to be unable to get regular sex than girls may be skewing the results.
2013-02-11 12:28:38 PM  
1 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: dready zim: CapeFearCadaver: Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.

The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.

This is how women think. Guys know however that if it was offered they would hit it like the fist of an angry god simply because at one point they wanted to and that NEVER goes away until about 3 seconds afterward. Guys learn to say "Oh, I would never do that now, I think of you as a sister" because you would not accept any other answer and they have to say that if they hold a chance of keeping you as a friend and then over time getting into your pants.

I think their wives might have a problem with that....


That doesn't mean that it's not in the back of their minds.  Doesn't necessarily mean that they would act on it if given the chance either.  And they would most likely never admit to it to you, for fear of ruining the friendship.   But if you are attractive to them, then the thought is there.
2013-02-11 12:27:44 PM  
1 votes:

Ikahoshi: Nonsense. I have what... 5 female friends. They're like family and I would be horrified at the thought. A stranger pointed out that one good friend and I "made a good couple" and I felt physically ill at the thought. Yes, she's attractive but whatever attraction I might have had is totally subverted by the friendship.


Here's a secret: people you like, regardless of gender, are more physically appealing to you. If you were physically ill at the thought of your friend being something more, she's not a friend.
2013-02-11 12:26:11 PM  
1 votes:

corn-bread: Theaetetus: 
(ii) You keep using "pussy" as an insult, which makes me suspect you really dislike it. NTAAWWT, but maybe you should come clean about your desires.

(ii) Having spent part of my 20's as the "friend", it is an apt descriptor.  If you can't relate, consider yourself fortunate.


So, because you're bitter about your relationship with one girl, you now hate women's genitalia? Overreact much?

/heh - "ovary-act much"
2013-02-11 12:20:22 PM  
1 votes:

rubi_con_man: . What if EVERY time you had sex with ANYONE you came? What if you never had cramps, or mood swings? What if you weren't the one getting pregnant?


Then you'd be a man?
2013-02-11 12:15:56 PM  
1 votes:

CtrlAltDestroy: lack of warmth: The only people that need to read this is 20-something women that really think the guys they hang out with wouldn't go for it if they could.

Many, yes. But not all. I'm perfectly content with having a female friend that I have no intention on boinking and wouldn't if I had the chance. Not all of us are ruled by our little head. I have no interest in casual sex. No romantic attraction (to the person as a whole) means no active desire to get my hands on said person. Although also aware that I'm an outlier in that regard.

/Mid 20's.
//Have always been this way.


You're trying to get laid in this thread using this approach, and women see right through it.

/I kid
2013-02-11 12:15:33 PM  
1 votes:

corn-bread: Theaetetus: corn-bread: Where women go off the tracks here is they confuse "improbable" with "no desire".  The guy may be a pussy and it may take a series of extreme circumstances before he'll make his move (her passed out drunk on the hood of a car clutching signed consent forms with a huge blinking neon "Go for it!" sign pointing to her vag) but the fact that it would take *a lot* doesn't mean he *wouldn't*.

ಠ_ಠ


Yes, as the preface to that said: "extreme circumstances".
Such is the nature of the subset known as the beta pussy male "friend".


(i) Yeah, I don't think talking about nailing passed out women as a reasonable circumstance to have sex with her is a good thing.
(ii) You keep using "pussy" as an insult, which makes me suspect you really dislike it. NTAAWWT, but maybe you should come clean about your desires.
2013-02-11 12:05:00 PM  
1 votes:

Magnanimous_J: Human relationships aren't really that fragile. Marriages can harbor deep resentment, yet still be considered "good" by both people involved. Friendships can survive intense jealously, you can love your family and they can piss you off constantly. So I think a male/female friendship can survive one person being attracted to the other and still be considered a legitimate friendship.


This...but usually you have to have been around the track a few times for this to dawn on you.

I've always had a lot of women friends, both before and after I met Mrs. Eel. Women make the best wingmen when you're single, and when you're married they can help you figure out your wife's psyche. (Knowledge Item 1: Apparently, women, and married women with small need-machine children in particular, are prone to batshiat-irrational-harpy moments, but they'll calm down soon enough - just as long as you don't ask them to calm down. I still have trouble remembering this one.)
2013-02-11 12:00:50 PM  
1 votes:

Dafatone: yapopo: Dafatone: WhippingBoy: Dafatone: Guys often have women friends they aren't interested in

We're talking about straight guys here...

Ha.  I'm willing to knock it down from often to sometimes, but it does happen.

i think you need to knock it down a bit more to "rarely"

Depends on our definition of "interest."  Absolutely no attraction whatsoever?  Kinda rare.  Maybe a little attraction and might have it cross one's mind once in a while, but wouldn't act on it for like 8 different reasons?  Fairly common.


the article doesn't talk about acting on.  it just states that women's male friends are highly likely to be sexually attracted to them.  clearly just by looking around us, we can see that most men don't actually act on it.
2013-02-11 12:00:45 PM  
1 votes:

Dafatone: WhippingBoy: Fissile: At my last job, I had a "work wife".   We were very friendly at work and got along really well.   People kept asking us if we were married because we would bicker like an old married couple.  I doubt she was interested in my sexually, but even if she was, I probably would not have gone for it.  Like the old saying goes, "Once a cheater, always a cheater."

You may not actually go for it, but you'd at least consider it, wouldn't you?

Not that this is directed at me, but what I'm trying to say is that women often would consider it too.  Liking sex isn't a one-way street.

Side note:  what's up with all the comments about "oh, well if a guy doesn't want her she must be unattractive.  Unless she has great boobs, in which case maybe that makes up for it."   Are great boobs not part of being attractive?


So, if women would often consider it too, why do they, as the study in the article and 100% of my anecdotal experience, always claim otherwise?

I've heard "Oh, Josh, he's just a friend, I'd never make out with him, gross" 100 times from women. I've never once heard, "Todd, from work? We hang out sometimes, and yeah, if he was interested in me, I'd bang him."
2013-02-11 11:56:46 AM  
1 votes:

yapopo: Dafatone: WhippingBoy: Dafatone: Guys often have women friends they aren't interested in

We're talking about straight guys here...

Ha.  I'm willing to knock it down from often to sometimes, but it does happen.

i think you need to knock it down a bit more to "rarely"


Depends on our definition of "interest."  Absolutely no attraction whatsoever?  Kinda rare.  Maybe a little attraction and might have it cross one's mind once in a while, but wouldn't act on it for like 8 different reasons?  Fairly common.
2013-02-11 11:56:44 AM  
1 votes:

Dafatone: Side note: what's up with all the comments about "oh, well if a guy doesn't want her she must be unattractive. Unless she has great boobs, in which case maybe that makes up for it." Are great boobs not part of being attractive?


i.imgur.com
2013-02-11 11:53:08 AM  
1 votes:

Fissile: At my last job, I had a "work wife".   We were very friendly at work and got along really well.   People kept asking us if we were married because we would bicker like an old married couple.  I doubt she was interested in my sexually, but even if she was, I probably would not have gone for it.  Like the old saying goes, "Once a cheater, always a cheater."


You may not actually go for it, but you'd at least consider it, wouldn't you?
2013-02-11 11:50:07 AM  
1 votes:

Dafatone: Guys often have women friends they aren't interested in


We're talking about straight guys here...
2013-02-11 11:47:30 AM  
1 votes:
Where is the blindingly obvious tag?
2013-02-11 11:45:08 AM  
1 votes:
Whole lotta assholes up in this thread.

Between all the "I know a woman who did something dumb/hypocritical once, so I'm gonna draw conclusions about women!" posts and the "women, you're idiots if you think your guy friends don't want to fark you" posts and the various posts about different types of "these women."

Women aren't mysterious and naive creatures who don't understand what sexual attraction is, and the fact that men have dicks doesn't make men super-tremendously different.  People are attracted to each other.  That's all.

Guys often have women friends they aren't interested in, women friends they're very interested in, and women friends they're not terribly interested in but given the chance, why not because, hey, sex.
2013-02-11 11:34:42 AM  
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: CapeFearCadaver: WhippingBoy: I hate to break it to ya darlin', but it sounds like you're what us married guys call "Plan B".

The difference being you're unhappily married...

No... even the most happily married men have a "Plan B" kicking about in the dark recesses of their minds...


I have a plan DD that lives across town
2013-02-11 11:23:46 AM  
1 votes:
Made me laugh: The men also assumed that the women were more sexually interested in them than they actually were - and the women tended not to realise this.
2013-02-11 11:20:00 AM  
1 votes:

WhippingBoy: corn-bread: And I get why women are always in denial.  They want to think that they are charming and witty and these guys just *love* hearing stories about the jerk they are dating etc.

This. I've found that women who claim that their guy-friends have absolutely no interest in sleeping with them are more than a bit narcissistic and greatly over-rate how "interesting" and "fun" they are.



Amen.
The farked up part that always gets me is how these same women will actively try to screw up any relationships her male "friends" have.  They ain't interested in breaking the poor soul off a piece, but if another women comes around suddenly she has "interest".  It's quite sick, but on the other hand if the guy is so beta that he lets that shiat happen then he deserves it.
2013-02-11 11:10:24 AM  
1 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: WhippingBoy: No... even the most happily married men have a "Plan B" kicking about in the dark recesses of their minds...

yapopo: happily married men want variety too. i'm not kidding.

They can play inside the dark recesses of their minds all they want. It ain't going happen, regardless.


i didn't say they're going to jump on you.  the article simply states that your male friends are sexually attracted to you.  taking action on it is a whole different thing and obviously involves a lot of factors.
2013-02-11 11:05:16 AM  
1 votes:

CapeFearCadaver: WhippingBoy: I hate to break it to ya darlin', but it sounds like you're what us married guys call "Plan B".

The difference being you're unhappily married...


No... even the most happily married men have a "Plan B" kicking about in the dark recesses of their minds...
2013-02-11 11:02:31 AM  
1 votes:

lack of warmth: The only people that need to read this is 20-something women that really think the guys they hang out with wouldn't go for it if they could.


Many, yes. But not all. I'm perfectly content with having a female friend that I have no intention on boinking and wouldn't if I had the chance. Not all of us are ruled by our little head. I have no interest in casual sex. No romantic attraction (to the person as a whole) means no active desire to get my hands on said person. Although also aware that I'm an outlier in that regard.

/Mid 20's.
//Have always been this way.
2013-02-11 10:58:16 AM  
1 votes:
lotta betas in this thread...

boys do what they can, men do what they want!
 www.betaclub.org
2013-02-11 10:51:30 AM  
1 votes:
I remember stories, movies and songs about guys lamenting that girls can't be more like a man. I also recall many observations and discussions about the bond formed between guys. Then I heard assorted complaints from women about their husbands insisting on spending a lot of time out with their guy pals.

When you think about it, you can see the obvious line drawn between most relationships between boys and girls until around 10 or 11, when the boys hormones start stirring just prior to puberty.

It seems obvious enough but I suspect that there's more to it than just sexual attraction.

Though, I've never heard of 20 something year old women getting all obsessive about something like a Gameboy or X-box like I've known guys to do. There's not that many women who go insane over things like Superbowl Sunday either.

Most women who act like guys or who do traditionally guy jobs tend to wind up looking like guys. If you recall, in old pictures of farms back about 100 years, the farmers wife tended to look rather rough and grim. Calamity Jane of Western Lore was NOT the cute, little woman as played by cute little actresses in movies, but one who could pass in appearance as a man.

Now guys have slaughtered each other by the thousands over a woman -- but they've done the same thing just because they're pi$$ed and irritable and mad at some local government.

The Human Condition is extremely complex to say the least. Toss in sex and it just becomes a confusing mess.

I know of Man Caves but not Woman Dens. I have observed many friendships between homosexual guys and straight girls though. The implications there get a tad confusing.

All in all, I don't have enough data and haven't actually paused to consider the whole friendship thing.
2013-02-11 10:50:03 AM  
1 votes:

MaliFinn: ranold: Rincewind53:

You're gay.

It may strike you as odd, but some men occasionally think of women as something other than a place to stick a penis.


Have you had your T-level checked? I agree that I present as a friend to most women (Those with their cleavage or bootie on permanent display are exempt) and use my upper head to think with, mostly...BUT if the topic is sex, I'd say yes if conditions are favorable, even for a long-time friend.
2013-02-11 10:48:46 AM  
1 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: It's sad you have to point this out, then again no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the average woman.


I don't think "intelligence" is the correct word. I think the word you're looking for is "naivety".
2013-02-11 10:42:48 AM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.


Not even if she said no attachments, just for fun? My wife has a friend (kinda sorta mine, too) who's at least 1K-cat crazy and I wouldn't EVER want to hook-up 'cause she's been thru, at least, one new husband a year for ten+ years, BUT, if the wife would give her Ok, and Nat promised to be civil (ya never know...ya know?), I'd tap it, just to add it to my bucket list (she's a good hittable, even though aged). You wouldn't? Then I have to agree with ranold:

You're gay.
2013-02-11 10:22:24 AM  
1 votes:

Ikahoshi: Nonsense. I have what... 5 female friends. They're like family and I would be horrified at the thought. A stranger pointed out that one good friend and I "made a good couple" and I felt physically ill at the thought. Yes, she's attractive but whatever attraction I might have had is totally subverted by the friendship.

I can't fully describe human attractions and friendships, because I'm no expert, but there's definitely a category where friends are just friends and will never be anything else, because the attraction aspect has been short circuited by a bond that approaches too close to the 'family' dynamic.


yeah that category is "ugly".
2013-02-11 10:21:57 AM  
1 votes:

miss diminutive: LewDux: weapon13: miss diminutive: The authors of the research, from the University of Wisconsin, said films and television programmes had helped instill the idea that normal friends could become "friends with benefits" - that is, who have sex with each other.

Is there a single person left on the planet who really needs an explanation of the term "friends with benefits"?

Friends with free drugs? Unemployed people on the dole?

Friends with breasts and all the rest

A friend in need is a friend indeed.


A friend with weed is better.


Oh, and this:

alwaysjaded: You can be friends with someone and acknowledge that there is a sexual attraction. That's O.K.

If you're friends with someone just because you're just trying to pull the Nice Guy/Girl backdoor gambit, then that's not O.K.



... is spot on and reflects exactly how I feel about it. Wanting to get physical with a female friend is basic evolutionary behaviour. Not acting upon that due to various conditions, such as already being in a relationship, is plain ol' maturity.
2013-02-11 10:19:43 AM  
1 votes:
I'm a guy who typically has female friends. I don't fantasize about having sex with them, but if they asked me to have sex, I'd say yes. If you're fairly attractive and you offer sex to a man, he says yes. Always.

But I'm not pursuing friendship for that. That's not going to happen, and it's unrealistic. They are friends who don't judge me for not being hypermasculine (monster trucks, beer, football, ungh) and can talk about philosophy and things. Where I live, finding a thinking man to befriend is rather difficult, because it's a working class town full of people who aren't interested in reading.
2013-02-11 10:19:18 AM  
1 votes:

meanmutton: Well, here's the thing -- either the women are unattractive, in which case I wouldn't want to have sex with them, or they're attractive, in which case they wouldn't want to have sex with me.


And that sums it up nicely.
2013-02-11 10:15:39 AM  
1 votes:

LewDux: weapon13: miss diminutive: The authors of the research, from the University of Wisconsin, said films and television programmes had helped instill the idea that normal friends could become "friends with benefits" - that is, who have sex with each other.

Is there a single person left on the planet who really needs an explanation of the term "friends with benefits"?

Friends with free drugs? Unemployed people on the dole?

Friends with breasts and all the rest


A friend in need is a friend indeed.
2013-02-11 10:04:24 AM  
1 votes:

Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: Heteronormative study is heteronormative.


That was an amazingly derptastic statement.
2013-02-11 10:00:49 AM  
1 votes:

Insaniteus: This study proved zilch other than the fact that men ADMIT to more on surveys.


Like the various studies where straight men claim more sexual partners than women. Yup.
2013-02-11 09:58:47 AM  
1 votes:

Insaniteus: This study proved zilch other than the fact that men ADMIT to more on surveys.  My best chick friend has a tendency to deny up one side and down the other that she has any interest in Guy X, right up until she's single and seeking him out, at which point she'll go on and on about how she's been wanting to be with him since they first met.

Women are just more used to hiding their true intentions.  We need a study like this that actually measures arousal levels in the brain to see if women truly are so different from men in this regard.


I don't think we're all that different, really. I think the main difference I've noticed is that women (myself included) simply won't put up with being in the "friend zone" for as long men will. If I'm interested in a guy and we become friends I eventually move on and set my sights on someone else if things don't progress after a certain amount of time. On the other hand, I know guys who'll be friends with a woman they want for years and years even though it's been made pretty clear that she has no interest in pursuing a romantic relationship.
2013-02-11 09:49:28 AM  
1 votes:
The article is not written for the average person, submitter.

It was written for the naive idiots who think that men and women can get along without involving sex somehow. Everyone knows that there is no such thing as platonic relationships between two different genders. Think about it, why do you think we held off on having women serve in combat all this time - they gunk up the works!
2013-02-11 09:48:01 AM  
1 votes:

Ninja Otter: Researchers found that single and attached women had the same level of attraction to their male friends - but attached women only wanted something more if their own relationship was on the rocks.

So... exactly the same as men.

Unless you believe men are the majority of cheaters... but then who are they cheating with?


single women is the obvious answer.
2013-02-11 09:44:28 AM  
1 votes:
Researchers found that single and attached women had the same level of attraction to their male friends - but attached women only wanted something more if their own relationship was on the rocks.

So... exactly the same as men.

Unless you believe men are the majority of cheaters... but then who are they cheating with?
2013-02-11 09:38:54 AM  
1 votes:

lack of warmth: The only people that need to read this is 20-something women that really think the guys they hang out with wouldn't go for it if they could.  Recently a pair of coworkers cracked my up with whole we're only friends when they snuggled up together while getting a smoke.  The girl gave me a strange look, but later when I had the guy alone I asked him, how long before he ask her out.  He tried playing it off, probably thinking I would run my mouth and blow it for him, but he finally admitted he was considering it.  The other young guys usually admit to that alot faster, but follows up with 'she has a boyfriend'.  Any woman who doesn't already knows this, should not be surprised when a guy-friend gets tired of waiting and walks away.

My wife doesn't always believe it either, but I watch the guys who talk to her at work.  Some of them are pervs. normal males.


Really dude? I had to correct THAT one for you?
2013-02-11 09:34:39 AM  
1 votes:

biyaaatci: but for the most part, we've been honest about this kind of thing and decided that to pursue anything would be a remarkably bad idea and has the potential to ruin a bunch of innocent lives.


Are these women from the future or a parallel universe that would cause some kind of cascade through space-time if you dated?
2013-02-11 09:29:12 AM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.


The majority of my friends are guys. We've known each other going on 23 now, all met as pre-teens. And as I do realize that each and every one of them at some point during that 23 years has wanted something more, it never happened; and everyone... you know, grew up. Since we did grow up together and became adults together we're all family. That same thought they had as teenagers would revolt them as incestuous now.
2013-02-11 09:26:04 AM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: Certainly true for some people, but the idea that men are only friends with women because they want to get into their pants is utter hogwash. Hogwash, I say.

My best friend is a woman, and the thought of having sex with her is like the thought of having sex with a sister. No. Thanks.


What's wrong with having sex with black girls?
2013-02-11 09:19:55 AM  
1 votes:

Nurglitch: I find it easier to be friends with people I'm not sexually attracted to. I can't be the only one.


I think what he meant to say is that without the possibility of sex, women would have been exterminated centuries ago.
2013-02-11 07:02:23 AM  
1 votes:
The authors of the research, from the University of Wisconsin, said films and television programmes had helped instill the idea that normal friends could become "friends with benefits" - that is, who have sex with each other.

Is there a single person left on the planet who really needs an explanation of the term "friends with benefits"?
 
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