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(NBC News)   Lutheran minister formally apologizes for taking part in prayer vigil for the victims of the Sandy Hook Massacre-because there were also clerics of other faiths also praying at the service, and you know, Jesus just HATES that   (usnews.nbcnews.com) divider line 86
    More: Asinine, Lutherans, hate, Jewish faith, Lutheran pastor  
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9088 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Feb 2013 at 2:03 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-02-07 12:28:05 PM
7 votes:
You have to be some kind of callous, god-uber-alles, dogmatic, bull-headed, pig-ignorant, self-important, know-nothing asshole to object.

Abraham prayed with "foreigners" (angels, kings and travelers). Jacob prayed with foreigners (Egyptians, mostly - but also Arameans). Joseph prayed with foreigners (Egyptians). Moses prayed with foreigners (Jethro was a 'foreign' Moabite priest, and Mo married his daughter). Jesus prayed with foreigners and others ALL THE DAMNED TIME.

As a Catholic friend of mine said recently: "Shiat like this is why people are leaving the Church in droves. The beliefs we can deal with on our own, or through discussions with our priests. The hypocrisies and lack of compassionate behavior evident in the behavior of Church officials - those same things the Church accuses the rest of the world of lacking - are far more off-putting."

// die in whatever hellfires you wish, peddlers of disharmony
// and take your closed-minded, petty little internecine conflicts with you
// and stop making genuine gestures of humanity into sins against the father, you dumb pricks
// yes, I know Catholics != Lutherans
2013-02-07 11:50:46 AM
7 votes:
Yep, called it: Missouri Synod
2013-02-07 12:20:15 PM
6 votes:
Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!"
He said, "Nobody loves me."
I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"
He said, "Yes."
I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?"
He said, "A Christian."
I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?"
He said, "Protestant."
I said, "Me, too! What franchise?"
He said, "Baptist."
I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?"
He said, "Northern Baptist."
I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"
He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist."
I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region."
I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?"
He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912."
I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.

--Emo Phillips
2013-02-07 02:30:45 PM
5 votes:
i174.photobucket.com
2013-02-07 12:22:17 PM
4 votes:
You know that bumper sticker that says, "God said it, I believe it, that settles it"?

Too many people have taken it too seriously.
2013-02-07 11:59:52 AM
4 votes:
*Sigh*, being logically consistent with your faith's teachings is obviously much more important than showing support in a time of tragedy.
2013-02-07 04:55:06 PM
3 votes:

George Babbitt: I believe that agnostics aren't sure of what the truth is but would like to know, apatheists don't know and don't care.


I can't speak for anyone else, but my apatheism was born out of being so goddamned tired of the same metaphysical arguments being made - can god microwave a burrito so hot he can't eat it, and all that - that, kind of like Jefferson, I set out to remove the metaphysics from the philosophy on my own terms.

What I'm left with is a moral-philosophical code that I can follow while cooking bacon on Saturday morning.

"Not caring" implies that I (or "we" in a general sense) simply chose to abandon the code, rather than come to the realization that IF I ever have to account for my life, I will make damn sure I can respond "I have lived it in the service of mankind" without lying. How many times I went to services will, IMO, be useless next to the number of times I cheered someone up. Making sure I have a mezuzah on every doorpost is far less important than making sure anyone who walks through my door as a guest feels as at home as in their own home.

// dunno if you meant it that way, but it sure sounded like you were coming close the the "immoral atheist" fallacy
2013-02-07 02:31:21 PM
3 votes:
randalrauser.com
2013-02-07 01:38:10 PM
3 votes:

Voiceofreason01: Yep, called it: Missouri Synod



Holy shiat, they've gotten crazier since I left. I was expecting this guy would have been WELS...


hinten: I wonder what Luther would say about this.



"Hey, let's persecute some Jews, that'll bring everyone together. We could go bowling afterwards."
2013-02-07 01:14:08 PM
3 votes:

hinten: Lutherans?

In any other country they are the most liberal libs that ever religioned.

I wonder what Luther would say about this.


You're thinking of the Evangelical Lutheran Church, this is the Missouri-Synod Lutheran Church. The former are the libbiest libs who ever religioned and the latter believe that anyone who teaches things contrary to the bible is an anti-Christ
2013-02-07 12:32:12 PM
3 votes:

propasaurus: Christian freedom!

Whoa! Don't go too far with that


Christian Freedom is an oxymoron.  The further you go with the Christianity, the less freedom anyone has.
2013-02-07 12:12:42 PM
3 votes:
Have the crazies gotten to the Lutherans, too? They used to be just about coffee and lemon bars. Fark religion.
2013-02-07 05:19:47 PM
2 votes:

George Babbitt: I know it because it has been shown to be true.


Shown? Prove it. Show me your PROOF. I don't want to hear what you believe. I want to hear what you can prove. Every follower of every religion that has ever lurched across our planet has believed in their religion with the same fervor and conviction that you do. Faith proves nothing.
2013-02-07 03:41:12 PM
2 votes:

Agent Smiths Laugh: Reason will always win because religion is dumb.


If you could reason with religious people, there wouldn't be any religious people.
2013-02-07 03:31:33 PM
2 votes:

pciszek: Not one of those prohibitions comes from Jesus.

Three of them are Jewish in origin:
1) Are Jewish commandments binding on Christians?
2) Does the Jewish God count as a "false god" as far as these prohibitions are concerned?
If you answered "yes" to number 2, then there can be no justification for answering "yes" to number 1.



Well.... a resounding maybe. The problem is on the one hand Jesus' teachings come in to pretty direct conflict with the old testament... but on the other hand he also explicitly said not one word of the old testament was being overturned by his teachings, it's all supposed to still be in force.

But being that it's all made up bullshiat the truth is that whoever wrote the Jesus parts had some good philosophy they wanted people to live by, needed to shoehorn it in to an existing religion and were going to have to have some conflicts with the old religion because it's pretty damn barbaric if you actually examine it. But we're talking about "faith" here, so none of that really mattered much in the final analysis.

Christians would have a far more (or at all) internally consistent religion if they just ditched the old testament.
2013-02-07 03:17:34 PM
2 votes:
These religion threads never focus on the one guy being an asshole and immediately turn into an indictment and attack on religion (specifically Christianity).  I'm not the most religious person in the world but just because one guy was a jackass, doesn't mean all religious people are.

In any large population it is easy to pick individual targets or outliers and attribute their qualities on the entire population.  This type of generalization and stereotyping is the foundation of the bigotry and intolerance that is usually attacked on these boards in other circumstances.
2013-02-07 03:16:00 PM
2 votes:

Mija: Jesus does hate when others pray to false Gods. In fact, to clarify, Gods word says:

Isaiah 43:10
"You are my witnesses," declares the Lord, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.

Acts 4:12
And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."

1 Corinthians 8:6
Yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

Hosea 13:4
Yet I [am] the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for [there is] no saviour beside me.

Exodus 20:3
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.


Not one of those prohibitions comes from Jesus.

Three of them are Jewish in origin:
1) Are Jewish commandments binding on Christians?
2) Does the Jewish God count as a "false god" as far as these prohibitions are concerned?
If you answered "yes" to number 2, then there can be no justification for answering "yes" to number 1.
2013-02-07 03:10:11 PM
2 votes:

wellreadneck: Not a churchgoer myself, but when did one of the basic tenets of the majority of Chrisianity change?  When did the notion that Christ had no problem with the competition become so popular?  Sure, Christ was fairly tolerant of sinners, but he did insruct them to stop that stuffor suffer dire consequences.  Was there a part where he said there were several paths to heaven? I only remember hearing things like "Jesus said to him, 'I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me'." (John 14:6)



Indeed, according to the mythos the only way to salvation is through worship of Jehova and devotion to the teachings of Jesus - BUT you're missing the part of his teachings where he instructed everyone to be tolerant of one another and not to be obnoxious about their faith. You're supposed to live humbly according to his teachings so that when people notice how nice you always are and how you seem to be able to handle the things life throws at you and they ask you why, THEN you're supposed to tell them, "Jesus". But until then, Christians are absolutely supposed to be tolerant and friendly with people of other faiths.

Which really isn't such a bad set of teachings in general (some of the specifics are pretty terrible, like Jesus' approval of slavery). The problem is, so very few people who claim to be followers of Christ give a shiat about his teachings. And those who scream about their devotion the loudest usually seem to be the ones who in reality shiat all over those teachings the most.

Matthew 6:5
2013-02-07 03:07:21 PM
2 votes:
Jesus does hate when others pray to false Gods. In fact, to clarify, Gods word says:

Isaiah 43:10
"You are my witnesses," declares the Lord, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.

Acts 4:12
And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."

1 Corinthians 8:6
Yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

Hosea 13:4
Yet I [am] the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for [there is] no saviour beside me.

Exodus 20:3
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
2013-02-07 02:59:34 PM
2 votes:
"If you had known what  this means, 'I desire mercy and not sacrifice,you would not have condemned the guiltless." --Matthew 12:7

Seems the Lutheran church doesn't read scripture or do what it says, either. No surprise, there.

And people wonder why, though a follower of and believer in Christ, I rarely set foot inside a church and tend to be very careful about using the word Christian to describe myself except when it is simpler because it's the only word people understand. It is because of the church and actions like this: where a man who does what is right has to apologize for it because of the rules and traditions of men.

Church leaders might want to think about not only going back and reading scripture, but actually doing what it says.

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." --Ghandi (disputed)
2013-02-07 02:53:34 PM
2 votes:
Not a churchgoer myself, but when did one of the basic tenets of the majority of Chrisianity change?  When did the notion that Christ had no problem with the competition become so popular?  Sure, Christ was fairly tolerant of sinners, but he did insruct them to stop that stuffor suffer dire consequences.  Was there a part where he said there were several paths to heaven? I only remember hearing things like "Jesus said to him, 'I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me'." (John 14:6)
2013-02-07 02:52:51 PM
2 votes:

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: Raised in Missouri Synod. Practicing Deist. 'Nuf Said


How does one practice deism?

"Oh vague, disinterested, disconnected, unknown, possible creator of the universe, please continue to ignore my prayers..."
2013-02-07 02:34:37 PM
2 votes:
Is it that hard to have a religion that loves everyone and works on being nice to each other?
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-02-07 02:16:58 PM
2 votes:

Sass-O-Rev: Earguy: You know that bumper sticker that says, "God said it, I believe it, that settles it"?

Too many people have taken it too seriously.

So very much, "this."


Not only that.. but it's the Bible that said it, not God.
2013-02-07 01:51:05 PM
2 votes:
CSB, my (imaginary Canadian) girlfriend was brought up in a Missouri Synod Lutheran Church.
She switched to Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA), which despite the common connotation of "evangelical", is quite liberal.

Now when she visits home & goes to her parents' church (also her former church), she isn't allowed to take communion.

Apparently the Missouri and Wisconsin synods are pretty far right. I'd had no idea about any of this Lutheran stuff before.
2013-02-08 12:29:02 AM
1 votes:

George Babbitt: Ed Grubermann: George Babbitt: 3)God may send people to Hell. Hell in my mind has always been formed in the thought of being without His company for eternity. What's a little fire on top of that?

What's the difference between the life I've always led and me being set on fire?

I don't know the life you've lived, and it doesn't matter, for even if I did know I still couldn't say how things would turn out for you even if you spit in Jesus' eye and told Him to go to Hell, I still wouldn't know. "I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them. But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven."(Mark 3:28-29) and who would be silly enough to deny that which he has never known and cannot disprove? Also how could he deny something if he doesn't even believe it exists? The point is that God has set things up so that it is nearly impossible to go to Hell. Is it a possibility on the order of reaching zero, but always halving itself a little closer but infinitely far away? Yes. But that is not what God wants. He wants to reconciled with all people, no matter what they've done. Name the person in history that you would deem worthy of eternal torment and I'll show you someone who can be a mirror for God's infinite capacity for love.


Yay. More Bible quotes. You just can't stop failing, can you? This is the part you don't understand: your Bible is not a credible source, nor is it proof. It doesn't matter what it says because God didn't write it. Humans claiming to speak for Him did. And I don't have to disprove God. You have to prove Him. Which you have utterly failed to do so many times it's just pathetic. Please, prove that your God is real and all of the tens of thousands of gods people have worshiped over the hundreds of thousands of years we've existed are false. You can't.
2013-02-07 10:18:45 PM
1 votes:

Frederick: trappedspirit: Cometh! You bastard. Cometh! He didn't say let's all hold hands and respect these other religions. He said He was THE way. If you think you can just mix and meld religions together to get some foo-foo spiritual feeling going and that's going to do squat about the truth then you must/should be stoned.

So you interpret that as not needing to respect other religions?

Jesus said "I am the way" and to you that means fark all others.


If you are trying to get to Las Vegas, and a street had a sign that said, "This way to Las Vegas", how long would you ponder on that?  Jesus said,  "No man cometh unto the Father, but by me."  I don't think that's ambiguous.  Doesn't need some philosophy major with a flow chart to understand that message.  It doesn't say, fark all others, it says, all others are farked.
2013-02-07 10:08:31 PM
1 votes:
Churches: an obstructive and useless boil on the butt of society for 2,000+ years now.  Kindly retreat to your basements and get out of public life.  Religion sucks dead donkey dong.  Here's example #4,907,036.

Your Christ was good.  Your Christians lick dirty asshole.
2013-02-07 06:10:42 PM
1 votes:

George Babbitt: Ed Grubermann: George Babbitt: I know it because it has been shown to be true.

Shown? Prove it. Show me your PROOF. I don't want to hear what you believe. I want to hear what you can prove. Every follower of every religion that has ever lurched across our planet has believed in their religion with the same fervor and conviction that you do. Faith proves nothing.

"Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles,"

My life, if you knew me, and the lives of those that I know are the proof that I have, which are formed based on our belief and our faith, despite the path that I took which took me into all the dark corners of the world. I do not feel superior to those dark corners, for I would still be there if not for someone else.

"He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things-and the things that are not-to nullify the things that are, so that no one may boast before him." and so "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."

Are there many who leave those dark corners without their faith and belief? It would appear so on the surface, yet I see something else at work even in the lives of those that know nothing beyond the end of their nose.


I ask for proof and you give me Bible quotes. You fail, sir.
2013-02-07 05:26:11 PM
1 votes:

George Babbitt: To all the people that are condemning Christianity for sending folks to Hell...answer this, name one person you know   is in Hell? Nothing is known till the last day, when all will stand before the White Throne of Judgement and give account. Some will have an advocate in Christ, some who never leaned of him will stand or fall on their own deeds, some who lived before Him get a pass for living as God told them and some are a 'law unto themselves'. So it tells us in the last book of the Bible. The final story on each of us is not written until the last chapter is written. It's a sliding scale with more confidence on some paths, and less confidence on others. Yet, not one person has been eternally condemned to this day. God wishes to make all things right, and so the possibility and likelihood of that happening is high before the end comes for this age. Just sayin.


Why would God send anyone to hell anyway? Doesn't he have the power to make people good again and erase sin, because he's, you know, all-powerful and all-loving? Didn't he create everything in the first place because of his love? Sending people to eternal torture when he has the power to remove all evil and sin doesn't sound like the actions a loving, omnipotent being, it sound's like the actions of someone like Q, dicking around for his own amusement an reveling in the torment of others.
2013-02-07 05:25:18 PM
1 votes:

Truther: As a pastor, I can say with some confidence that God doesn't like His children fighting like this.

God loves us all, even atheists!  :)


Which is why He condemned us all to lives of pain, disease, predation, deformity, and death for the actions of one poor child who lacked the knowledge to understand that the serpent was tricking her. And why He threw a temper tantrum and drowned the world for the actions of people whom He had never bothered to tell wer making Him mad. Yeah, that's "love" alright.
2013-02-07 05:22:41 PM
1 votes:

Fark Rye For Many Whores: CheapEngineer: [skywriter2012.files.wordpress.com image 470x353]

\apologies are the new Black
\\except for the one in the White House

That's borderline informative/eye poison right there. Who is that and what the hell is growing on his face?


That's the lawyer Cheney shot, and apologized for offending him afterwards
2013-02-07 05:17:16 PM
1 votes:
Christians: driving people away from Christ for 2012 years
2013-02-07 05:14:31 PM
1 votes:

Earguy: You know that bumper sticker that says, "God said it, I believe it, that settles it"?

Too many people have taken it too seriously.


Our church handed out bumper stickers that read: Forgive Everything.
2013-02-07 05:13:04 PM
1 votes:

George Babbitt: To all the people that are condemning Christianity for sending folks to Hell...answer this, name one person you know   is in Hell?


Know is in Hell? No one is in Hell. They're just dead. No Hell. No Heaven. No Valhalla. Just dead. Your imaginary friend and his imaginary eternal torture chamber do not exist. But that's not the real point, is it?

No, the real point is the glee with which Christians judge others and wish them to go to Hell for things no one, especially a being that has teh power to create the entire universe, should care about.
2013-02-07 05:12:22 PM
1 votes:

hinten: eagles95: Our WELS church wasn't that bad when my wife and I started going there 12 years ago. But slowly went off the deep end. Few weeks ago they had a sermon about how befriending the ghey's will weaken your family. My wife who is very conservative told off the pastor (who also baptized our son) that some of our best friends are gay couples with kids and we were done with the church since they are basically teaching to hate people and Jesus taught to love and care for all people. He said it sounded like the devil has entered our heart since we now allow our son to be around gay kids.


Do grown-ups actually have conversations like that?  Must be a bible belt thing.


every Saturday night and 3x on Sunday. luckily my kid even knows its b.s. he sees nothing wrong hanging out at their house with us. mainly because they have an indoor pool(in Wisconsin so its a big deal) plus every video game system that is out right now. their kids are well mannered, polite, great students in school. i hope the debil makes my kid that nice
2013-02-07 05:04:30 PM
1 votes:
And Christians wonder why people are ignoring, laughing at, and leaving them more and more these days.

Didn't God say to love your neighbor as yourself? Didn't God say not to judge, lest you yourself be judged, because there is no other judge but God? Didn't God say that what you do to the least among you, you do to me? Didn't Jesus have some choice words about hypocrites? You also speak for him a lot about what he supposedly hates (which happens to be everything you hate, how about that), which confuses me because your book says God loves everything, and created everything out of love. If he hates those things so much, why doesn't he get rid of them? What, free will? What free will? If I don't spend every waking hour of my life kowtowing to God and declaring that he is real and is my master and all my works are for him, I'm going to spend eternity in unspeakable torture along with most of all of humanity that's ever existed. Christians can't even agree with each other about anything, that's why there's more sects of Christianity than there are species of bats, and every single one of them declares the rest are false and God will smite you for following any of them but the supposed "true" sect.
2013-02-07 04:43:26 PM
1 votes:

Waldo Pepper: Hey look it is another anti Christian tread on fark where all the farkers who have tickets to hell get to show off how little they know about God


Meanwhile, posts like yours tell us all we need to know about christians.

upload.wikimedia.org
/i can has ticket plz?
2013-02-07 04:36:47 PM
1 votes:

HortusMatris: George Babbitt: To all the people that are condemning Christianity for sending folks to Hell...answer this, name one person you know   is in Hell? Nothing is known till the last day, when all will stand before the White Throne of Judgement and give account. Some will have an advocate in Christ, some who never leaned of him will stand or fall on their own deeds, some who lived before Him get a pass for living as God told them and some are a 'law unto themselves'. So it tells us in the last book of the Bible. The final story on each of us is not written until the last chapter is written. It's a sliding scale with more confidence on some paths, and less confidence on others. Yet, not one person has been eternally condemned to this day. God wishes to make all things right, and so the possibility and likelihood of that happening is high before the end comes for this age. Just sayin.

Thank you, Pastor Babbitt, for informing us poor heathens on how God wishes for us to be judged, as it says in the Holy Bible.  Whatever would us withered souls, shrouded in the dark cloak of Satan's illusions, do without your enlightening words of spiritual wisdom?


George Babbitt: To all the people that are condemning Christianity for sending folks to Hell...answer this, name one person you know   is in Hell? Nothing is known till the last day, when all will stand before the White Throne of Judgement and give account. Some will have an advocate in Christ, some who never leaned of him will stand or fall on their own deeds, some who lived before Him get a pass for living as God told them and some are a 'law unto themselves'. So it tells us in the last book of the Bible. The final story on each of us is not written until the last chapter is written. It's a sliding scale with more confidence on some paths, and less confidence on others. Yet, not one person has been eternally condemned to this day. God wishes to make all things right, and so the possibility and likelihood of that happening is high before the end comes for this age. Just sayin.


How do you know this to be true?  Millions of people on this planet are not Christians, how do you know that their beliefs are not true?

I don't believe in an afterlife or the existence of souls. As science and medicine progress, we are learning that we are our physical brains. We are networks of electrochemical signals.  When the brain dies, the network is gone and cannot be revived. There's no getting out of your skull.
2013-02-07 04:27:23 PM
1 votes:
As a pastor, I can say with some confidence that God doesn't like His children fighting like this.

God loves us all, even atheists!  :)
2013-02-07 04:03:23 PM
1 votes:

dv-ous: jigger: Aigoo: Judaism and Christianity descend through lineage and through promise through Isaac from Abraham, and Islam descends through lineage and through promise through Ishmael:

If Judaism, Christianity, and Islam descended by heredity, why can people convert?

Rules revisions implemented by Jesus and Mohammed. Supposedly.

Jews still stick to that line-of-the-mother thing.


Us Jews do actually have a process for conversion, by the way. It's not as quick and easy as the christian "ok I'm christian now", but there is indeed a process. Just thought I'd throw that in there.
2013-02-07 04:02:31 PM
1 votes:

BigSnatch: *Sigh*, being logically consistent with your faith's teachings is obviously much more important than showing support in a time of tragedy.


I was unaware such a thing was even possible.  Unfortunately, that is completely lost on your typical believer.

/farking tribal sky religions, why are they still here?
2013-02-07 03:59:47 PM
1 votes:

PirateKing: Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: Raised in Missouri Synod. Practicing Deist. 'Nuf Said

How does one practice deism?

"Oh vague, disinterested, disconnected, unknown, possible creator of the universe, please continue to ignore my prayers..."


I walked into that one, and I'm enough of a man to admit you snarked me.

+1 to you sir
2013-02-07 03:56:41 PM
1 votes:

jigger: Aigoo: Judaism and Christianity descend through lineage and through promise through Isaac from Abraham, and Islam descends through lineage and through promise through Ishmael:

If Judaism, Christianity, and Islam descended by heredity, why can people convert?


Because you cherry picked and didn't read the "through lineage and through promise." But I'll presume you're at work and therefore busy. ;)
2013-02-07 03:51:21 PM
1 votes:
To all the people that are condemning Christianity for sending folks to Hell...answer this, name one person you know   is in Hell? Nothing is known till the last day, when all will stand before the White Throne of Judgement and give account. Some will have an advocate in Christ, some who never leaned of him will stand or fall on their own deeds, some who lived before Him get a pass for living as God told them and some are a 'law unto themselves'. So it tells us in the last book of the Bible. The final story on each of us is not written until the last chapter is written. It's a sliding scale with more confidence on some paths, and less confidence on others. Yet, not one person has been eternally condemned to this day. God wishes to make all things right, and so the possibility and likelihood of that happening is high before the end comes for this age. Just sayin.
2013-02-07 03:51:04 PM
1 votes:

George Babbitt: pciszek:
1) Are Jewish commandments binding on Christians?
2) Does the Jewish God count as a "false god" as far as these prohibitions are concerned?
If you answered "yes" to number 2, then there can be no justification for answering "yes" to number 1.


1) No.
2) No.
3)Mark 12:29-30 ""The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength."


Must have missed Matt 5:

Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teachthem, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

And Exodus:

Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for itis a sign between me and you throughout your generations; thatye may know that Iam the LORD that doth sanctify you.14Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for itis holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doethany work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.15Six days may work be done; but in the seventhis the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doethany work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.16Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations,for a perpetual covenant.17Itis a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: forin six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

And Romans:

11I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation  has come to the Gentiles.12Now if their fall  is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!

13For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry,14if by any means I may provoke to jealousy  those who are my flesh and save some of them.15For if their being cast away  is the reconciling of the world, what  will their acceptance  be but life from the dead?

16For if the firstfruit  is holy, the lump  is also  holy; and if the root  is holy, so  are the branches.17And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,18do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast,  remember that you do not support the root, but the root  supports you.

19You will say then, "Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in."20Well  said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.21For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either.22Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in  His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.23And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.24For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who  are natural  branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

As those grafted in to the tree, we do have some requirements--one of which is to keep certain commandments, such as the Sabbath. If Jesus said that not one of the two smallest strokes in the entire Hebrew written language would pass from the Law until heaven and earth passed away, I'm inclined to rely more on what He said than what some preacher says so he can justify his use of "permissive grace" to act like an ass Monday through Saturday. Keeping the Sabbath, the day of rest, is a perpetual covenant and commandment that doesn't just go away--it was kept even after the crucifixion, so I think I'll just go ahead and stick with that.


TL;DR--yes, there are some Jewish commandments that are binding on Christians. Keeping the Sabbath, not eating blood, anything offered to idols or anything that has been strangled (our only eating prohibitions), loving the Lord our God (who is one, not three) with all our heart, soul, mind, and strength, and loving others--being merciful and not judging (scripture says to love others as we love ourselves, but I would say to love others more than we love ourselves because we often are very hard on ourselves--far harder than we are on others). These are actually commandments and they are what the entirety of Jewish Law boils down to in a nutshell.
2013-02-07 03:44:08 PM
1 votes:

Onkel Buck: But we are still cool with the way Sharia torments women right?


Nobody here was ever cool with that. Take your dishonesty elsewhere.
2013-02-07 03:38:26 PM
1 votes:

PsiChick: ...How the hell do you do a 'fire and brimstone wedding'?


"I am not here to celebrate your marriage, I am here to proclaim that you are both going to hell if you divorce!"
2013-02-07 03:38:09 PM
1 votes:
Reason will always win because religion is dumb.
2013-02-07 03:34:28 PM
1 votes:

Waldo Pepper: Hey look it is another anti Christian tread on fark where all the farkers who have tickets to hell get to show off how little they know about God


my eyes rolled out of my head

and


do you feel better now? Thinking you get to go to Heaven and kick it with Jesus while we all burn forever. Just warms your heart, doesn't it?
2013-02-07 03:33:26 PM
1 votes:

Waldo Pepper: Hey look it is another anti Christian tread on fark where all the farkers who have tickets to hell get to show off how little they know about God


I know all I need to know about god.

The more I learn, the less I like him.
2013-02-07 03:32:32 PM
1 votes:

mongbiohazard: pciszek: Not one of those prohibitions comes from Jesus.

Three of them are Jewish in origin:
1) Are Jewish commandments binding on Christians?
2) Does the Jewish God count as a "false god" as far as these prohibitions are concerned?
If you answered "yes" to number 2, then there can be no justification for answering "yes" to number 1.


Well.... a resounding maybe. The problem is on the one hand Jesus' teachings come in to pretty direct conflict with the old testament... but on the other hand he also explicitly said not one word of the old testament was being overturned by his teachings, it's all supposed to still be in force.

But being that it's all made up bullshiat the truth is that whoever wrote the Jesus parts had some good philosophy they wanted people to live by, needed to shoehorn it in to an existing religion and were going to have to have some conflicts with the old religion because it's pretty damn barbaric if you actually examine it. But we're talking about "faith" here, so none of that really mattered much in the final analysis.

Christians would have a far more (or at all) internally consistent religion if they just ditched the old testament.


Ditch the OT and the NT.  Much better.
2013-02-07 03:32:17 PM
1 votes:

Anderson's Pooper: PsiChick: ...How the hell do you do a 'fire and brimstone wedding'?

Step 1 - Pregnant bride, load shotgun
Step 2 - Thunder and lightning during sermon (probably coincidental)
Step 3 - "You think you know each other well now, just wait until you spend the rest of your lives together!

People that attended that as a couple left separately.  There were a bunch of very scared college kids.

Couple is still together after 25 years and 6 kids so it turned out all right.

/Groom was my roommate sophmore year.


...Welp, that's terrifying.

Inflatable Rhetoric: What's the difference between religion and superstition?

Anyone?


You could go take an Anthropology course, or you could just Google.
2013-02-07 03:28:29 PM
1 votes:
Because hating your neighbor is more important than children's souls.
2013-02-07 03:27:35 PM
1 votes:

Mija: Jesus does hate when others pray to false Gods. In fact, to clarify, Gods word says:

Isaiah 43:10
"You are my witnesses," declares the Lord, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.

Acts 4:12
And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."

1 Corinthians 8:6
Yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

Hosea 13:4
Yet I [am] the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for [there is] no saviour beside me.

Exodus 20:3
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.


Yeah except in this specific case no one was worshiping a false God. Jews were for Jehovah, Christians for God, and Muslims for Allah. Last time I checked they were all the same God, just with different prophets, Moses, Mohammad, and Jesus. In fact most of those are taken from the Old testament which is also known as the Torah, which is the main book for Jewish faith. Your copying the Jewish Gods words to prop up your Christian Gods law.

Does Christianity define Jesus as God and therefore if your NOT worshiping him your WRONG, yes. But in the end every Jew, Muslim, and Christian is still worshiping the same deity,

Quite being a jackass, go back and read religious history, then come back and have a real conversation.
2013-02-07 03:24:45 PM
1 votes:

George Babbitt: Mark 12:29-30 ""The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength."


Kind of ironic, then, that one of the first major acts of the New Christianity was to split god into three (and that's Deuteronomy 6:8-9, IIRC).

// I thought the Christians translated that as "...the lord our god, the lord ALONE" to avoid that weirdness
2013-02-07 03:20:41 PM
1 votes:
pciszek:
1) Are Jewish commandments binding on Christians?
2) Does the Jewish God count as a "false god" as far as these prohibitions are concerned?
If you answered "yes" to number 2, then there can be no justification for answering "yes" to number 1.



1) No.
2) No.
3)Mark 12:29-30 ""The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength."
2013-02-07 03:15:08 PM
1 votes:

SkunkWerks: Apatheosis


If you meant Apotheosis, I did not mean that or Apatheosis. Apatheist is a made up word I came across a few years ago to refer to the reality of most 'atheists', that most are not true atheists, but rather apathetic non-believers who act with apathy, disregard, or lack of interest towards belief or disbelief in a deity.
2013-02-07 03:10:04 PM
1 votes:

All2morrowsparTs: Dr Dreidel: As a Catholic friend of mine said recently: "Shiat like this is why people are leaving the Church in droves. The beliefs we can deal with on our own, or through discussions with our priests. The hypocrisies and lack of compassionate behavior evident in the behavior of Church officials - those same things the Church accuses the rest of the world of lacking - are far more off-putting."

Is your friend Martin Luther (name sake of Lutherans), because he nailed a note to a church door that pretty much boiled down to this which is kind of ironic.


Heh, no. My 7th-grade Earth Sciences teacher. Interestingly enough, she's Pakistani-born, raised Muslim, converted to Roman Catholicism and taught at my Orthodox Jewish middle school.

// an AWESOME woman, who I think is now a social worker in London
2013-02-07 03:04:44 PM
1 votes:
FTA: "There is sometimes a real tension between wanting to bear witness to Christ and at the same time avoiding situations which may give the impression that our differences with respect to who God is, who Jesus is, how he deals with us, and how we get to heaven, really don't matter in the end," Harrison wrote.

So, basically he's apologizing for behaving in a reasonable, genial manner, and generally being a decent human being.

Nifty.

ct.fra.bz

You know, people wonder why we faithless waggle eyebrows at the claims that the religious have the market cornered on human decency.

To be clear: This would be why.
2013-02-07 03:03:42 PM
1 votes:

ManRay: Craptastic: ManRay: Thou Shalt Have No Other Gods Before Me.

I've always wondered about that commandment. Isn't that Old Testament God admitting that there are other gods out there flying around?

Apparently he was jealous of a Golden Calf.


And there lies the problem. Apparently god has a lot of issues. From sending his only son to death (what, he forgot to take out the trash), his only son, mind you, that was conceived via "spiritual" rape. He's a jealous god, an angry god, but he loves you. But don't fark him over or he'll fark you back. He works in mysterious ways, oh yes he does. OH OH! My favorite of you "christians": person dies in a hospital during surgery, doctor's fault. Said person lives, it's a miracle and it was god's will for him to survive. yearh, fark religion.
2013-02-07 03:03:33 PM
1 votes:

Anderson's Pooper: mrmyxolodian: tallguywithglasseson: Voiceofreason01: Yep, called it: Missouri Synod

Was going to say, either Missouri or Wisconsin.

I thought WELS. I know they have similar rules.
My wife is a recovering member of that church. Sad, sad stuff they indoctrinate them with,

I grew up LC-MS and am now ELCA.  I knew it was LC-MS without reading it because the WSLC wouldn't have gone in the first place. The only Wisconsin Synod thing I've ever been to was a fire and brimstone wedding.  Yeah, read that again, fire and brimstone wedding.

/The Lutheran church, where "take drink ye all of it" means chug it!!


...How the hell do you do a 'fire and brimstone wedding'?
2013-02-07 03:02:45 PM
1 votes:

PirateKing: Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: Raised in Missouri Synod. Practicing Deist. 'Nuf Said

How does one practice deism?

"Oh vague, disinterested, disconnected, unknown, possible creator of the universe, please continue to ignore my prayers..."



+1, and you owe my company a new keyboard.
2013-02-07 03:02:41 PM
1 votes:

Craptastic: ManRay: Thou Shalt Have No Other Gods Before Me.

I've always wondered about that commandment. Isn't that Old Testament God admitting that there are other gods out there flying around?


You know how in English, the word "god" can mean "a thing people worship" or it can mean "a deity, like the one claimed by the Abrahamic faiths"?

Like that. "Thou shalt not place an intermediary between thyselves and ME." Kind of like they would soon do with the Golden Calf (reading the story, the people were concerned they had lost Moses, so they built a thing that could act as intermediary, as Mo had).

// in Judaism, anyway
// the same way the text refers to "the strange gods" of other faiths
// I have heard opinions state that there are other "powers" in the cosmos; and we should recognize that these powers are not "before" god, they act according to his will as well
// but what do I know, I'm one of those "armchair apatheists" that only spent 16 years in religious schools
2013-02-07 03:00:10 PM
1 votes:

Dr Dreidel: As a Catholic friend of mine said recently: "Shiat like this is why people are leaving the Church in droves. The beliefs we can deal with on our own, or through discussions with our priests. The hypocrisies and lack of compassionate behavior evident in the behavior of Church officials - those same things the Church accuses the rest of the world of lacking - are far more off-putting."


Is your friend Martin Luther (name sake of Lutherans), because he nailed a note to a church door that pretty much boiled down to this which is kind of ironic.
2013-02-07 02:58:51 PM
1 votes:
The thing about these versions of Christianity that I never got is how they deal with the Bible...do they have their own versions in which 90% of what Jesus did and said is redacted to avoid undermining their views?
2013-02-07 02:52:02 PM
1 votes:
Someone needs to nail some theses on the  Missouri Synod's front door.
2013-02-07 02:51:51 PM
1 votes:

ecmoRandomNumbers: Have the crazies gotten to the Lutherans, too? They used to be just about coffee and lemon bars. Fark religion.


Key words: Missouri Synod.  Anything with "MIssouri" in the name has got to be bad news.
2013-02-07 02:46:58 PM
1 votes:

OminousAnonymous: I am starting a new religion where everyone has to be nice to each other. That's the only rule.


We tried that 2000 years. A good chunk of the people who got in on the ground floor were killed for it.
2013-02-07 02:46:13 PM
1 votes:

Onkel Buck: But we are still cool with the way Sharia torments women right?


Being mad about one thing does not mean that everything else is cool.  I can think that this apology was needless and stupid, and still believe that sharia law treats women like crap.  In fact, I can simultaneously find displeasure with A LOT of things about A LOT of religions.
2013-02-07 02:39:59 PM
1 votes:

OminousAnonymous: Anybody want to come to my house for Kahlua coffee and "special" lemon bars?  I am starting a new religion where everyone has to be nice to each other.  That's the only rule.


Are we talking cyanide/Jim Jones "special", or chronic/Snoop Lion "special"?
2013-02-07 02:36:21 PM
1 votes:

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: [www.turnbacktogod.com image 800x684]


Damn, there sure are a lot of white people in that picture depicting life in the MIDDLE EAST 2000 years ago.  But then again, they all seem to do that.
2013-02-07 02:26:32 PM
1 votes:

ecmoRandomNumbers: Have the crazies gotten to the Lutherans, too? They used to be just about coffee and lemon bars. Fark religion.


My understanding is there are some crazy sects of Lutheranism.  I was raised Lutheran and taught quite the opposite of what's being told in this article.  The church I went to recognized all Christian faiths and welcomed them all in.  While I was still there one of the members became an ordained pastor - and she was... a she.  The pastor in charge of the church also had a wife and kids.

I've since converted to Pastafarianism but there are at least some sane versions of Lutheranism out there.
2013-02-07 02:21:02 PM
1 votes:
Give the Lutherans credit - they do know how to throw a kickass potluck dinner.
2013-02-07 02:20:15 PM
1 votes:
Thou Shalt Have No Other Gods Before Me.
2013-02-07 02:20:15 PM
1 votes:
whitedsepulchres.files.wordpress.com
2013-02-07 02:17:21 PM
1 votes:
I'm an atheist, and I  love religion. I really do! And I don't love religion in a snarky, mean-spirited way. I unabashedly, sincerely love that we have religion because, if we didn't, we wouldn't be here right now. Being all post-modern and ironic. There'd be no civilization! If no one had been in religion, we'd be farked right now.

Because, at the dawn of man, civilization was ... the biggest and the strongest. And that's as far as we were gonna go. It was whoever was the biggest farked, killed, ate anything they wanted. That was it! Civilization was a huge psychopath with a club goin', "I'm gonna have rape fer dinner." That was it! That's as far as we were gonna go!

And then, one of my ancestors, some  weakling, said, "Look, there's no way I can beat that guy. But what if I  trick him into thinking that if he doesn't kill and rape people while he's down here, when he dies, there's a magic city in the clouds, and he can go up and have all the cake he wants?!"

Now, that's not a very well-formed plan, but he went and told the big psycho, and the psycho heard that, and said, "Yeah, I like cake." BOOM! There ya go! That was the beginning of civilization. Now we can work on fire and writing and agriculture. That's religion! It's the old sky cake dodge. It worked!

But ... and, by the way, things were great for awhile. But then, what was happening was, that shiat was going on all over the planet. Then we just used different desserts. They would tell 'em about sky cookies or sky pie or sky baklava. So, as each of these civilizations grew, they built ships, they'd go visit each other, and the one guy would walk off the boat and go, "Hey, did ya hear the good news about the sky baklava?" And the first guy went,  "IT'S CAKE, MOTHERFARKER, YER DEAD!"

And then, oh my God, there were the Dessert Wars, it was a nightmare. They were just killin' people. It got so bad that, every now and then, some dude would show up and go, "Hey, got good news! There's cake and pie and cookies, for EVERYONE, we can all share!" And people said, "NAIL HIM TO A FARKIN' CROSS! IT IS  ONLY CAKE! OH MY GOD! THE ONLY WAY SKY CAKE TASTES GOOD IS IF, UP IN THE SKY, THE SKY COOKIE AND SKY PIE PEOPLE CAN'T HAVE THE SKY PIE!  THAT'S THE ONLY WAY SKY CAKE TASTES GOOD! I DID NOT SPEND MY LIFE  NOT RAPING AND KILLING PEOPLE TO NOT GO UP IN THE SKY AND HAVE CAKE!

SKY CAKE!"

So the next time you see some douchebags in front of an abortion clinic, or trying to ban a  Harry Potter novel, just go, "Oh, Sky Cake.  Why are you so delicious?!"
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-02-07 02:16:18 PM
1 votes:
Make "Christianity" the official religion in the U.S. and immediately the fight changes to "what type."

This is why the separation is in the constitution.  And don't tell me it's not there, either...
2013-02-07 02:10:47 PM
1 votes:
There were forty religious representatives there.

That's as many as four tens, and that's terrible.
2013-02-07 02:06:21 PM
1 votes:

Voiceofreason01: Kyosuke:
I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.

--Emo Phillips

Awww, it's so sad because it's often so true.

/at least the Lutheran Church of America is still OK


It's just another McWorship franchise shucking suckers for a tithe.
If you want lemon bars, stay home on Sunday and make your own.
2013-02-07 01:54:36 PM
1 votes:

tallguywithglasseson: CSB, my (imaginary Canadian) girlfriend was brought up in a Missouri Synod Lutheran Church.
She switched to Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA), which despite the common connotation of "evangelical", is quite liberal.

Now when she visits home & goes to her parents' church (also her former church), she isn't allowed to take communion.

Apparently the Missouri and Wisconsin synods are pretty far right. I'd had no idea about any of this Lutheran stuff before.


Many ELCA folks are't too fond of the "evangelical" pejorative thrown around these days as a synonym for right-wing fundies.  Of course, to an ELCA Lutheran, A Prairie Home Companion is evangelizing.
2013-02-07 01:42:33 PM
1 votes:

Voiceofreason01: Yep, called it: Missouri Synod


Was going to say, either Missouri or Wisconsin.
2013-02-07 12:41:39 PM
1 votes:
So, for a memorial service, for a community, for a group of people who were killed that happened to be of varying religions... It would have been better if the Lutherans stayed away entirely?

I bet what this is really about is doing something that somehow cooperated with Obama.
2013-02-07 12:25:04 PM
1 votes:
Kyosuke:
I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.

--Emo Phillips


Awww, it's so sad because it's often so true.

/at least the Lutheran Church of America is still OK
2013-02-07 12:24:59 PM
1 votes:
I could go for some coffee and lemon bars...
2013-02-07 12:04:44 PM
1 votes:
"I apologize where I have caused offense by pushing Christian freedom too far, and I request you charitably receive my apology."

moral of the story: don't abuse Christian Freedoms by feeling bad about the massacre of people who aren't Real Christians. 'cause jesus and the constitution.
 
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