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(Kotaku)   The next Xbox will require an internet connection to use and will not play second-hand games as new games will ship with a one-time activation code   ( kotaku.com) divider line
    More: Fail, Xbox, second-hand, license key, internet access, Durango, connectedness  
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8863 clicks; posted to Geek » on 06 Feb 2013 at 3:30 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



391 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-02-06 01:44:02 PM  
I love the smell of FUD in the morning.
 
2013-02-06 01:44:17 PM  
Welcome to Sonytown, Xbox.
 
2013-02-06 01:45:14 PM  
The new X-Box will fail.
 
2013-02-06 01:45:44 PM  
If they're going to do that, may as well wait for the Steam box.
 
2013-02-06 01:47:53 PM  
Translation: this is what they want, but it will never happen. And if it does, the pirates will have a field day with it.
 
2013-02-06 01:48:26 PM  
I hope that ain't true.
 
2013-02-06 01:50:25 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.


Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.
 
2013-02-06 01:52:23 PM  
I seriously doubt this is true, it would be the death knell for the Xbox brand and Microsoft must know it.

Sony on the other hand would cream their pants.
 
2013-02-06 01:52:24 PM  
Well good thing I wasn't planning on getting an Xbox anyways
 
2013-02-06 01:53:13 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.
 
2013-02-06 01:54:22 PM  
We have not been able to confirm the veracity of this new report, which claims that Durango discs will ship with one-time-use activation codes that render them irrelevant to anyone but the person who first uses them.

Confirm it, then maybe I'll care.
 
2013-02-06 01:54:34 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.
 
2013-02-06 01:55:24 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.
 
2013-02-06 01:55:45 PM  

WalkingCarpet: I seriously doubt this is true, it would be the death knell for the Xbox brand and Microsoft must know it.


Hate to quote myself but I guess this is the company that released a product where 64% of the available disk space is taken up by the OS so maybe they are this stupid.
 
2013-02-06 01:57:08 PM  

whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.


unless of course ALL the major companies get together and (illegally) collude to lock down the console gamer market and make 'paywalls' an industry wide standard.

but right now this is just a rumor.  so, take it with a grain of salt.
 
2013-02-06 01:57:11 PM  
So who's gonna be the first to cast the stone in the inevitable PC vs. Console flamewar that these threads always devolve into?
 
2013-02-06 01:59:43 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.


Nah. I mean, what's going to replace them? Computers? People are getting away from desktops and laptops, and moving to tablets. And while stuff like Angry Birds is entertaining, there will still be demand for large, immersive games.

On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.
 
2013-02-06 02:00:39 PM  

Weaver95: whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.

unless of course ALL the major companies get together and (illegally) collude to lock down the console gamer market and make 'paywalls' an industry wide standard.

but right now this is just a rumor.  so, take it with a grain of salt.


And if they did that, then they would lose out to their own product. Remember how many years it took PS3 sales to get moving? Is the next system  reallygoing to provide so much added value that people would just HAVE to upgrade, depite those restrictions? I doubt it.

I think if they do this, new platform sales are flat to nonexistent, existing platform sales stay robust, developers respond accordingly, and the platform companies take a hit until they agree to undo this stupid idea.

I just don't see any way this can succeed, no matter how much the manufacturers might want it to.
 
2013-02-06 02:01:10 PM  
This was the same rumour with the PS4, it won't happen.  I would love to have cd-keys though that could lock the game down so I can install and not have to have the cd in the drive to play.
 
2013-02-06 02:02:12 PM  
Gamestop is SCREWED.

And if used games are no longer usable, I am done with any new gaming for good.

I'll keep playing the classic systems. There's enough from all the previous generations to keep me busy for good.
 
2013-02-06 02:06:20 PM  

scottydoesntknow: So who's gonna be the first to cast the stone in the inevitable PC vs. Console flamewar that these threads always devolve into?


Can't happen here. Well, I guess it could, but I'd like to see how a PC gamer would argue against a company essentially adopting Steam's business model, except for consoles.

It would be too easy to implement- if you take your XBox 720 disc to a buddy's house, you'd need to sign in on his machine to make it work... something along those lines. Maybe a 2-form authentication, where you'd need, say, a controller that's somehow "assigned" to your home machine, along with the name and password...
 
2013-02-06 02:07:04 PM  

whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.


That won't happen because they also all benefit if they join up.

I don't know about Nintendo, but I strongly suspect Sony will join the ban on reselling games.
 
2013-02-06 02:09:25 PM  
I mean i'm not saying companies like Sony aren't stupid enough to want to try something like this...i'm just saying this is still very much in the 'rumor' phase so lets not get all worked up about it till we hear something more solid and reliable.
 
2013-02-06 02:11:34 PM  
Note to self:  do not purchase the next generation of Xbox.

/like I use it all that much these days, anyway...
 
2013-02-06 02:15:16 PM  

Weaver95: I mean i'm not saying companies like Sony aren't stupid enough to want to try something like this...i'm just saying this is still very much in the 'rumor' phase so lets not get all worked up about it till we hear something more solid and reliable.


Since Sony is unveiling the PS4 in a couple of weeks we'll know a lot more then.

This is so stupid I can't believe Sony would do it.  In fact if Microsoft does do it, Sony would be stupid to do so as well as not doing so would give them an almost insurmountable (imho) advantage next-gen that would be too good to pass up.

Unless there's collusion among developers to make it happen.
 
2013-02-06 02:19:11 PM  
You're all arguing aver a Kotaku article? Good lord.
 
2013-02-06 02:20:04 PM  
images.wikia.com
www.userlogos.org
 
2013-02-06 02:20:58 PM  

Kazan: I love the smell of FUD in the morning.


Yep.
 
2013-02-06 02:23:26 PM  
I agree that this is not going to happen, but let me give my opinion on it happening anyway.

This would mean that if your xbox broke, you'd have to buy all of your games over again if you wanted to play them on the new machine.
 
2013-02-06 02:25:39 PM  
It requires an Internet collection, but they're still going to rely on optical disks and manually entered activation codes for distribution purposes?  If it wasn't Microsoft, I'd call bullshiat.

/Your iPhone can't run "secondhand apps" either.  Wonder if game prices will go down or not.
 
2013-02-06 02:26:52 PM  

jaylectricity: I agree that this is not going to happen, but let me give my opinion on it happening anyway.

This would mean that if your xbox broke, you'd have to buy all of your games over again if you wanted to play them on the new machine.


What are you talking about? Surely a huge computer corporation like MS would never make something that cost hundreds of dollars and then died after mere weeks due to shoddy components. Why, that would be unscrupulous!

www.instructables.com
 
2013-02-06 02:26:58 PM  

jaylectricity: I agree that this is not going to happen, but let me give my opinion on it happening anyway.

This would mean that if your xbox broke, you'd have to buy all of your games over again if you wanted to play them on the new machine.


Again, this is not going to happen but if it did the key's should be tied to your gamertag not your box for it to be workable.  Like any of the current gen arcade games.
 
2013-02-06 02:34:22 PM  
There's a couple of game franchises that I've gotten into because I picked up an earlier game in the series used, then bought the sequels brand new as soon as they came out.

"Hey, have you played that? It's awesome!"
"I saw the ads, I thought it looked dumb."
"Dude, try it."
"Eh, not for $60. Hmm, they have a used copy..."
"Trust me."
"Oh wow, this is farking amazing! Part 2 comes out next month? I'm pre-ordering that shiat!"
 
2013-02-06 02:37:57 PM  

Beerguy: [images.wikia.com image 300x300]
[www.userlogos.org image 300x225]


Are you saying they are good alternatives, or pointing out that they don't accept used games, either?
 
2013-02-06 02:44:27 PM  

HulkHands: Beerguy: [images.wikia.com image 300x300] [www.userlogos.org image 300x225] Are you saying they are good alternatives, or pointing out that they don't accept used games, either?


I am saying that once you own a game on either Steam or G.O.G., you own the game for life and can download it as many times as you like.

Steam is also producing the SteamBox console which will give you access to your Steam account and thus all your games so you can play them on your TV.

"Why Valve's Steam Box is a console killer"

 
2013-02-06 02:46:38 PM  

Beerguy: HulkHands: Beerguy: [images.wikia.com image 300x300] [www.userlogos.org image 300x225] Are you saying they are good alternatives, or pointing out that they don't accept used games, either?

I am saying that once you own a game on either Steam or G.O.G., you own the game for life and can download it as many times as you like.Steam is also producing the SteamBox console which will give you access to your Steam account and thus all your games so you can play them on your TV."Why Valve's Steam Box is a console killer"


And as soon as steam starts getting in the way of Sony or Microsoft, they'll fall down an elevator shaft and land on some bullets.  I don't trust the big boys in the industry.  they play ROUGH!
 
2013-02-06 02:49:19 PM  
Why isn't there a game system that institutes a pay-for-play system where you pay a small fee to get the game, but each time you start the game, the system has to be connected to the internet and you pay a $0.10 fee or something like that? Or would that model even work technologically?
 
2013-02-06 02:49:49 PM  

WalkingCarpet: I seriously doubt this is true, it would be the death knell for the Xbox brand and Microsoft must know it.


Yeah, but Microsoft seems to be run by inept monkeys these days. Look at Office 360 and Windows 8. In the latter case, not only are they forcing a UI on people, but despite sales slumps the price recently went UP.
 
2013-02-06 02:54:15 PM  

HulkHands: Beerguy: [images.wikia.com image 300x300]
[www.userlogos.org image 300x225]

Are you saying they are good alternatives, or pointing out that they don't accept used games, either?


You won't care about reselling your games when you pay far less up front and never have to keep track of a disc.
 
2013-02-06 02:56:55 PM  

Gig103: WalkingCarpet: I seriously doubt this is true, it would be the death knell for the Xbox brand and Microsoft must know it.

Yeah, but Microsoft seems to be run by inept monkeys these days. Look at Office 360 and Windows 8. In the latter case, not only are they forcing a UI on people, but despite sales slumps the price recently went UP.


I think either both companies do it or none of them do it as the one who doesn't do it will have a huge advantage.

I guess we'll find out more when Sony unveils the PS4 on the 20th (or not, I don't think something like this would be featured in an announcement event).
 
2013-02-06 03:05:45 PM  
The next Xbox will not be purchased by GreenAdder.
 
2013-02-06 03:13:50 PM  

SurfaceTension: Why isn't there a game system that institutes a pay-for-play system where you pay a small fee to get the game, but each time you start the game, the system has to be connected to the internet and you pay a $0.10 fee or something like that? Or would that model even work technologically?


I do I need to be connected to the Internet to play a single player game?

What if my Internet is out and I need something to do?

Why does the model have to change when it has worked for decades? Innovation and good game should be the reason you buy a new game.

For the people who think this could lower prices, do you really think big companies will do that? How big of a change is it between Madden '12 and Madden '13 and yet one is more than twice the price
 
2013-02-06 03:19:23 PM  

SurfaceTension: Why isn't there a game system that institutes a pay-for-play system where you pay a small fee to get the game, but each time you start the game, the system has to be connected to the internet and you pay a $0.10 fee or something like that? Or would that model even work technologically?


A lot of companies wouldn't swing for that. If I could get a single player AAA title for, let's say $5, what's to stop me from doing a 24-hour gaming marathon, beat the whole game, and then put it away. The company makes $5.10 off a game they would've sold for $60. World of Warcraft does a subscription service, but they also charge full-retail upfront (unless you get a sale of course), so they get the maximum profit up front, then the subscription is just icing (well except for server maintenance costs). Microtransactions within a game seem to be where it's heading, but again you're usually paying full retail upfront, then doing microtransactions to get ahead in the game without doing the actual work.

Multiplayer would be your best bet, but again that's assuming you can keep them coming back for enough days to turn a profit, and knowing how ADD most gamers are, they've moved on to the next big title in about a month or two.

If you want to see the very dark side of microtransactions, check out Final Fantasy: All The Bravest. This is a shameless cashgrab and deserves to be ridiculed for being pure trash.
 
2013-02-06 03:21:21 PM  
I predict that both Sony and MS conspire to implement the no used games rule at the same time.

If there's anything that could save Nintendo, this is it.

Don't do it, too, Nintendo!!!
 
2013-02-06 03:24:35 PM  
Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.
 
2013-02-06 03:26:25 PM  

SurfaceTension: Why isn't there a game system that institutes a pay-for-play system where you pay a small fee to get the game, but each time you start the game, the system has to be connected to the internet and you pay a $0.10 fee or something like that? Or would that model even work technologically?


What if I do not have an internet connection, either because it is down or I choose to not have one?

Seems like a bad idea for single player games

What if the authentication server is taken offline?  (you cant play)

In many parts of the country, the internet is SLOW, slow, slow...will a crappy connection bar me from playing?

I would point to Amazon and books, both physical media and ebooks as a reference as to how this will never happen.  Go search for books on Amazon, now look at the paperback pricing vs the Kindle pricing.  Often Kindle is the same price, or even a dollar or three more.  Publishers do not see a Kindle download as essentially free money, rather, they see it as a loss - lack of physical media purchase = a lost sale.  Even though it costs them almost nothing to produce (short of some formatting), and they do not need to worry about a lost sale due to someone giving away/lending a physical book to a friend...even taking those things into account  they still see it as a loss.  I suspect game makers would have this same asinine mind set.
 
2013-02-06 03:30:27 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.


Yeah. And buy nothing but brand-new cars from now on. Think of all those people in the manufacturing sector who miss out every year because those cheap jerks bought used cars. Let's not forget all the architects put out of work by people buying pre-owned houses. And I don't even want to get into how much I hate it when people lend each other books.

You know what really honked me off? I wound up at this place called a "pawn shop," and it was full of used stuff. Clothes, electronics, guitars, movies...  I kept thinking to myself, "you cheap jerks! Gibson isn't making any money from the sale of that guitar!"
 
2013-02-06 03:34:33 PM  
Because when I think of a good time, I think of activation codes.

Actually, this might be good news for the pc gaming master race. Putting us on more even ground with the plug and play systems, as it were.
 
2013-02-06 03:34:35 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


But the Sony box will also play all your mini-discs.
 
2013-02-06 03:35:20 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.


Anything that kills the used car market is good to me.  Pay the auto-makers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.

Anything that kills the used textbook market is good to me.  Pay the authors you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale. 

Anything that kills the used DVD market is good to me.  Pay the studios you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.
 
2013-02-06 03:35:40 PM  
This is just moving the PC model to the console.  I doubt it will do much.

I still won't buy an XBox or the next Sony offering.

//Member of the most glorious PS2/SNES/PC gaming race.
 
2013-02-06 03:37:54 PM  
Meh, they said the same thing about the PS4 a few weeks back.

It's just paranoia at this point.
 
2013-02-06 03:38:07 PM  
I hope they don't do that but would be entirely unsurprised. They see that gamestop money as theirs and that might be all the motivation required.
 
2013-02-06 03:38:15 PM  
Customers, bend over, and prepare to get serviced.
 
2013-02-06 03:39:18 PM  

GreenAdder: BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.

Yeah. And buy nothing but brand-new cars from now on. Think of all those people in the manufacturing sector who miss out every year because those cheap jerks bought used cars. Let's not forget all the architects put out of work by people buying pre-owned houses. And I don't even want to get into how much I hate it when people lend each other books.

You know what really honked me off? I wound up at this place called a "pawn shop," and it was full of used stuff. Clothes, electronics, guitars, movies...  I kept thinking to myself, "you cheap jerks! Gibson isn't making any money from the sale of that guitar!"


Got battletoads for the Wii in yet?

/if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it.  If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam.  Do I buy a lot of games at the $60 mark?  Nope.  Do I buy a lot of first-hand games?  Yep.
 
2013-02-06 03:41:18 PM  
I believe this violates the 'Fair Use' clause... The MPAA tried legal action when used music stores started popping up and got denied...
 
2013-02-06 03:41:37 PM  
Ive been a console player for a while because Im honestly not very tech savvy and I dont have the disposable income to upgrade my pc often enough. If Xbox did try this, I would never purchase it.
 
2013-02-06 03:42:56 PM  

Gonz: FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.

Nah. I mean, what's going to replace them? Computers? People are getting away from desktops and laptops, and moving to tablets. And while stuff like Angry Birds is entertaining, there will still be demand for large, immersive games.

On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.


I suspect YGOI is probably right, but on the other hand, tablets are only one killer app away from blowing the hell out of the console market. One compelling, deep, highly-replayable multiplayer game is all it would take to make ipads the must-have gaming platform. They're already ubiquitous. You just need a really addictive game to play on them.
 
2013-02-06 03:43:28 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.


I downloaded games like a madman for about 10 years. Hundreds of games, dozens of "next big thing" games. about 7 percent were worth half of what they cost, and about 5% overall were worth their actual sticker price. With a "no return of opened software" policy, video game makers can eat a dick until they start putting out a decently priced quality product.

So there's that....
 
2013-02-06 03:44:18 PM  

BumpInTheNight: /if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it


Never felt vampiric to me, I get good titles at low prices.
 
2013-02-06 03:44:24 PM  

Weaver95: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.


I read a while back that Gamestop is seriously considering getting into the retro game business, which pisses me off royally. I'm selling most NES carts for effectively $2-$3 at best after shipping and before fees, and as soon as GS gets in, expect ebay to become a sudden storm of activity - both for civilians and for GS's future stock buyers outbidding the rest of us on just about everything.

/prediction
//I could be wrong of course
 
2013-02-06 03:44:24 PM  

BumpInTheNight: if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it


Yes. That's the only way I could ever get used games. Certainly not from eBay. Or Amazon. Or from my friend who just sold me a few old GBA games. Or from the numerous places I get games for the many old systems I have, from NES to Dreamcast and beoynd. And I certainly never go to my friendly neighborhood locally-owned shops like "Mind Games" to get myself some old 16-bit action.

My old games certainly must all come from GameStop, a place I haven't bought from since 2010.

Also, apparently I haven't ever spent money at Steam, Gog, IndieGala, IndieRoyale, HumbleBundle, etc. Nope. Never heard of them.
 
2013-02-06 03:45:20 PM  

SurfaceTension: Why isn't there a game system that institutes a pay-for-play system where you pay a small fee to get the game, but each time you start the game, the system has to be connected to the internet and you pay a $0.10 fee or something like that? Or would that model even work technologically?


It's called an arcade.
 
2013-02-06 03:46:45 PM  
This will end well.
 
2013-02-06 03:47:18 PM  
Still plenty of room here in the PC Gaming master race.
 
2013-02-06 03:47:27 PM  

whistleridge: What are you talking about? Surely a huge computer corporation like MS would never make something that cost hundreds of dollars and then died after mere weeks due to shoddy components. Why, that would be unscrupulous!


Xbox spend $3bn replacing RROD'd consoles under extended warranties. they were under NO OBLIGATION to extend those warranties.

if you want an example of a corporation being evil you should not use a situation in which the company went above and beyond their obligations to replace out of warranty hardware as a warranty replacement.
 
2013-02-06 03:48:42 PM  

Quality Unassured: If they're going to do that, may as well wait for the Steam box.


Ohpleaseohpleaseohplease!
 
2013-02-06 03:48:50 PM  
...And fark this "always connected" bullshiat. My stepson's XBox kills the entire wireless connection for the house every time he connects, and I can't find a setting for bandwidth throttling in the router. If this piece of shiat gaming console is going to eat up everyone else's connection, then he can be off of it when he doesn't need the connection.
 
2013-02-06 03:49:43 PM  

BumpInTheNight: if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it. If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam. Do I buy a lot of games at the $60 mark? Nope. Do I buy a lot of first-hand games? Yep.


What about those of us who don't want to pay the "GOTTA HAVE IT NOWNOWNOW" premium, so we wait 3-6 months for the price to drop?

// just bought AC3 and Madden 13 for a combined $45
// (obviously) not at Gamestop
 
2013-02-06 03:50:43 PM  
Looks like I won't be buying any of the next gen consoles.
 
2013-02-06 03:50:46 PM  
BumpInTheNight:

/if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it.  If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam.  Do I buy a lot of games at the $60 mark?  Nope.  Do I buy a lot of first-hand games?  Yep.

Adjusted for inflation, most SNES games cost around $80 new and some went well above $100. Charticle
 
2013-02-06 03:51:19 PM  

whistleridge: Translation: this is what they want, but it will never happen. And if it does, the pirates will have a field day with it.


Hey, remember DIVX? Not the Codec, the original competitor to the DVD? Yeah well they never got their product cracked.

/I realize it was because DIVX failed before any serious effort was put into cracking it.

//I guess what I'm saying is, look, this is me not getting in line to buy the new XBOX.
 
2013-02-06 03:53:31 PM  

Sgt Otter: There's a couple of game franchises that I've gotten into because I picked up an earlier game in the series used, then bought the sequels brand new as soon as they came out.

"Hey, have you played that? It's awesome!"
"I saw the ads, I thought it looked dumb."
"Dude, try it."
"Eh, not for $60. Hmm, they have a used copy..."
"Trust me."
"Oh wow, this is farking amazing! Part 2 comes out next month? I'm pre-ordering that shiat!"


I've done this exact thing at least 3 or 4 times.
 
2013-02-06 03:53:51 PM  

ladyfortuna: I'm selling most NES carts for effectively $2-$3 at best after shipping and before fees, and as soon as GS gets in, expect ebay to become a sudden storm of activity - both for civilians and for GS's future stock buyers outbidding the rest of us on just about everything.

/prediction
//I could be wrong of course


I collect NES games. You got an ebay store you could link to? Or would you like to do some private selling?

/I need those damn cartridges.
 
2013-02-06 03:56:09 PM  

Dr Dreidel: BumpInTheNight: if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it. If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam. Do I buy a lot of games at the $60 mark? Nope. Do I buy a lot of first-hand games? Yep.

What about those of us who don't want to pay the "GOTTA HAVE IT NOWNOWNOW" premium, so we wait 3-6 months for the price to drop?

// just bought AC3 and Madden 13 for a combined $45
// (obviously) not at Gamestop


Well yah that's pretty much what I'm doing, there's a lot of games that initially release for $60 but I'm not enticed enough to pay that much so I just wait a month or two, voila the price on steam goes down due to either a sale or the game's initial price point didn't accurately reflect the demand for it.  Some publishers start games are a price lower then $60 right off the bat, its great.  Either way I buy games for the prices I want and know that the profits from the sale go back to a platform that lets me do all of this from the comfort of my home and to the developers who provided the game.
 
2013-02-06 03:56:52 PM  

Mikey1969: ...And fark this "always connected" bullshiat.


Yeah that gets to me more than the used games thing. My connection is spotty. It's bad enough when it interrupts netflix, but the idea that I can't play alone offline piques my nerd rage.
 
2013-02-06 03:57:22 PM  
As a long time gamer who lives in BFE and has crappy internet with a 5GB cap, all I can say is....

fark
YOU
MICROSOFT

/Time to dust off the library
 
2013-02-06 03:57:31 PM  
Isn't this what pc practically does already?  Like I care.  I'm probably going to buy the Sony thing anyways.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:32 PM  
whistleridge: What are you talking about? Surely a huge computer corporation like MS would never make something that cost hundreds of dollars and then died after mere weeks due to shoddy components. Why, that would be unscrupulous!

I still say that it was the push for RoHS compliance that killed that.

// hard to account for dumb stuff happening in the supply chain, for example
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague
 
2013-02-06 03:58:39 PM  

Burr: As a long time gamer who lives in BFE and has crappy internet with a 5GB cap, all I can say is....


5GB cap?! Holy shiat that's crazy.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:40 PM  
Now the console wars are just to see who can annoy their customers the most.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:58 PM  
If I had to guess I'd say this rumor was floated to gauge reaction and plant the idea for the future, not because it's likely to actually happen, but it's sort of a moot point. It's inevitable that at some point some asshole company will try it and succeed.

I'm guessing Ubisoft since that name is pretty much as synonymous with "asshole" as it can get when it comes to insanely stupid DRM schemes.

Gamers are about as masochistic of consumers as you can get. They'll biatch and moan and scream about every damn little thing to everybody who will listen, but they'll never actually stop buying their digital crank no matter what happens.
 
2013-02-06 03:59:42 PM  

magneticmushroom: ladyfortuna: I'm selling most NES carts for effectively $2-$3 at best after shipping and before fees, and as soon as GS gets in, expect ebay to become a sudden storm of activity - both for civilians and for GS's future stock buyers outbidding the rest of us on just about everything.

/prediction
//I could be wrong of course

I collect NES games. You got an ebay store you could link to? Or would you like to do some private selling?

/I need those damn cartridges.


Clicky-Profile :P

Honestly I expect I'll get out of the business in another year or so for various reasons (*cough FEEBAY, Paymenowpal), but it's allowed me to avoid having to take out a private loan while I'm back in school - I commute to school so gas & book money is super-important.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:29 PM  

cgraves67: Gonz: FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.

Nah. I mean, what's going to replace them? Computers? People are getting away from desktops and laptops, and moving to tablets. And while stuff like Angry Birds is entertaining, there will still be demand for large, immersive games.

On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.

I suspect YGOI is probably right, but on the other hand, tablets are only one killer app away from blowing the hell out of the console market. One compelling, deep, highly-replayable multiplayer game is all it would take to make ipads the must-have gaming platform. They're already ubiquitous. You just need a really addictive game to play on them.


Computers won't die because I've yet to find a tablet or console that could effectively play deep strategy games like my current obsession, Crusader Kings 2.  Those kinds of games simply don't play on anything except desktops and laptops, and there is plenty of market for them.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:33 PM  

doczoidberg: if used games are no longer usable, I am done with any new gaming for good.

I'll keep playing the classic systems. There's enough from all the previous generations to keep me busy for



Gamestop is screwed no matter what. They are the Borders of video games. There's no need for them with streaming/cloud computing and all digital media. They know they are dying too, and just bleeding the last bit of profit they can before they become obsolete.Side note - take a look at how much of a the profit of Gamestop comes from 2nd hand sales. The answer is almost all of it.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:41 PM  

ladyfortuna: magneticmushroom: ladyfortuna: I'm selling most NES carts for effectively $2-$3 at best after shipping and before fees, and as soon as GS gets in, expect ebay to become a sudden storm of activity - both for civilians and for GS's future stock buyers outbidding the rest of us on just about everything.

/prediction
//I could be wrong of course

I collect NES games. You got an ebay store you could link to? Or would you like to do some private selling?

/I need those damn cartridges.

Clicky-Profile :P

Honestly I expect I'll get out of the business in another year or so for various reasons (*cough FEEBAY, Paymenowpal), but it's allowed me to avoid having to take out a private loan while I'm back in school - I commute to school so gas & book money is super-important.


Thanks! I'll take a look.
 
2013-02-06 04:01:02 PM  
Cool! Something else I won't have to buy.

/No used games?
//Fark you XBOX!
 
2013-02-06 04:01:18 PM  

Quality Unassured: HulkHands: Beerguy: [images.wikia.com image 300x300]
[www.userlogos.org image 300x225]

Are you saying they are good alternatives, or pointing out that they don't accept used games, either?

You won't care about reselling your games when you pay far less up front and never have to keep track of a disc.


Because AAA console titles on steam sure as hell don't sell for 60$ (the same price as the console release) now do they?

Game companies will sell these at full price (likely 80$ in the next generation), and games will only recede in price years after release.
 
2013-02-06 04:02:36 PM  
Step 1: Create rumor that you'll kill used game sales.

Step 2a: Wait for Gamestop to panic.

Step 2b: Make a deal with Gamestop for a cut of all used game sales.

Step 3: Profit.
 
2013-02-06 04:02:39 PM  

scottydoesntknow: Burr: As a long time gamer who lives in BFE and has crappy internet with a 5GB cap, all I can say is....

5GB cap?! Holy shiat that's crazy.



That's what I was thinking.

I'll bet every ISP secretly wishes they could put a 5GB cap on all of us.

...And, one day, they probably will.
 
2013-02-06 04:02:48 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: Mikey1969: ...And fark this "always connected" bullshiat.

Yeah that gets to me more than the used games thing. My connection is spotty. It's bad enough when it interrupts netflix, but the idea that I can't play alone offline piques my nerd rage.


Pretty much why I didn't buy Diablo 3.  It sucks enough that if I do find a hard copy of a new PC game, it requires Steam, which just activation wouldn't be so bad if:

1.  It defaulted to installing from the disk THAT IS IN THE TRAY and not try to download the installation without required some sort of work-around
2.  It would let you play the damn game OUT OF THE BOX instead of forcing you to download a damn 1GB patch first (why can't I play the single player portion of the game while the patch downloads?) which at my connection means it takes all night and 20% of my monthly cap is used up

Yeah, I know you can turn off automatic updates, but it always forces you to download a damn patch after installation and before you can play it!
 
2013-02-06 04:03:24 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.


Pretty much... I'm already playing less and less console stuff, if they push through something like that I'd just give it up altogether.
 
2013-02-06 04:04:35 PM  

WalkingCarpet: Hate to quote myself but I guess this is the company that released a product where 64% of the available disk space is taken up by the OS so maybe they are this stupid.


This. Under Balmer's leadership any amount of stupid is eminently possible.
 
2013-02-06 04:05:47 PM  
Heard this same rumor for the other consoles, and it's becoming more of a thing for pc games.

I'm hopeful it's all just rumor though.  I don't buy many recent games used, but I have been known to pick up a lot of out of print ones like that.  About half my ps2 collection is used games from a local used/retro game store.
 
2013-02-06 04:06:32 PM  

BumpInTheNight: If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam.


Dude, even Steam sells new games for the $49.99 or $59.99 price tag. Don't get me wrong, I loves me my PC gaming (you, in fact helped point out a lot of kickass mods for several Bethesda games to me), but let's not act like PC gaming is superior in terms of cost, generally speaking... Looking at Steam now, the "season pass" for Black Ops 2 is still $50, Max Payne 3 is selling for $40 (even more expensive that a brand new 360 copy found on Amazon.com), and DMC is asking for $50 as well.

The prices for games have not really changed all that much over the years... Nintendo, Genesis and Super Nintendo games still retailed for $50 or higher, and compared to many current games, they don't have the "blockbuster" budget that modern ones do. If anything else, the price to game has actually gone down drastically in the last 20 years.While people blame piracy, 3rd party re-sellers and such for the high cost of games, if anything else, I'm shocked they aren't charging more. My copy of FF3 for the SNES cost me $60, and put maybe 200 hours into it. Skyrim? Same price, yet closing in on 500, and can easily put in a few hundred more with mods, not even relying on DLC for the extra hours.

I mean, compare that to a movie, which costs $10 at least for a mere couple hours, and we're getting a steal. This whole "need to be online" rumor thing that people are biatching about, if it happens, will likely be akin to Steam, where you can go into "offline" mode, but only for certain amounts of time before you have to "check in", and even that is dependent on whether or not the publishers of the game require a live connection in order to play DLC or even the base game. Diablo 3 was the biggest most recent example I can think of, but methinks permanent offline play is going away, along with second-hang game use. Hell, even Bioware requires you to have a unique key to use a lot of the in-game features (remember the Cerberus Network thing for ME2?), and if you don't have it, you don't pay the full retail cost, but a pittance of $10 or so.

/end rant
 
2013-02-06 04:06:40 PM  

doczoidberg: scottydoesntknow: Burr: As a long time gamer who lives in BFE and has crappy internet with a 5GB cap, all I can say is....

5GB cap?! Holy shiat that's crazy.


That's what I was thinking.

I'll bet every ISP secretly wishes they could put a 5GB cap on all of us.

...And, one day, they probably will.


The closest house with cable is about 5 miles away.  I have been using a Verizon moblie broadband connection for my internet for the past few years because satellite sucks as bad as dial-up it seems.

Its not too bad, I just can't game like I used to.  It does get me out of the house at least.
 
2013-02-06 04:06:40 PM  
In other "news", believing this story causing ball cancer. The kind that means they have to amputate.
 
2013-02-06 04:06:50 PM  
In an age where AAA game producers like Capcom are doing Day One DLC, on-disc characters, levels and endings that you have to pay to unlock or re-releasing an updated version of a game 6 months later, I have no doubt that this "rumor" will turn out to be true.

Someday we'll be telling our grandchildren of a time when video game companies sold you a game with all the content included. Then our grandkids will laugh in our faces and ask for $10 so they can unlock the second level of Resident Evil XLII.
 
2013-02-06 04:07:37 PM  

scottydoesntknow: Adjusted for inflation, most SNES games cost around $80 new and some went well above $100. Charticle


And you beat me to it while I was typing my rant. Good to know that sort if thing is quasi-common knowledge.
 
2013-02-06 04:07:47 PM  

scottydoesntknow: So who's gonna be the first to cast the stone in the inevitable PC vs. Console flamewar that these threads always devolve into?


ESDF Forever, FKN N00BS!
 
2013-02-06 04:09:08 PM  

Kazan: whistleridge: What are you talking about? Surely a huge computer corporation like MS would never make something that cost hundreds of dollars and then died after mere weeks due to shoddy components. Why, that would be unscrupulous!

Xbox spend $3bn replacing RROD'd consoles under extended warranties. they were under NO OBLIGATION to extend those warranties.

if you want an example of a corporation being evil you should not use a situation in which the company went above and beyond their obligations to replace out of warranty hardware as a warranty replacement.


The alternative would be getting sued.  RROD was a clear manufacturing/design defect, i'd have given the lawyers a goo shot at winning a court case on that grounds.
 
2013-02-06 04:09:29 PM  
The next Xbox will require an internet connection to use and will not play second-hand games as new games will ship with a one-time activation code in small quantities until it fails.
 
2013-02-06 04:09:53 PM  

thurstonxhowell: causing


* causes
 
2013-02-06 04:10:26 PM  

GAT_00: cgraves67: Gonz: FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.

Nah. I mean, what's going to replace them? Computers? People are getting away from desktops and laptops, and moving to tablets. And while stuff like Angry Birds is entertaining, there will still be demand for large, immersive games.

On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.

I suspect YGOI is probably right, but on the other hand, tablets are only one killer app away from blowing the hell out of the console market. One compelling, deep, highly-replayable multiplayer game is all it would take to make ipads the must-have gaming platform. They're already ubiquitous. You just need a really addictive game to play on them.

Computers won't die because I've yet to find a tablet or console that could effectively play deep strategy games like my current obsession, Crusader Kings 2.  Those kinds of games simply don't play on anything except desktops and laptops, and there is plenty of market for them.


Yeah. I play Civ V on my computer all the damned time. Tablets are good competition for laptops and a lot of the casual functions of computers. But I don't expect computers to disappear. I do think that tablets could kill consoles though. It just takes one good game.
 
2013-02-06 04:10:39 PM  
Requiring an Internet connection will make any company reviled.

See: Blizzard (Diablo 3)
 
2013-02-06 04:11:05 PM  

jaylectricity: I agree that this is not going to happen, but let me give my opinion on it happening anyway.

This would mean that if your xbox broke, you'd have to buy all of your games over again if you wanted to play them on the new machine.


I don't expect it to happen, but no it wouldn't - the games would be tied to your account, not a particular piece of hardware.
 
2013-02-06 04:11:53 PM  
Take that, Gamefly!  and all those game reselling stores!

/totally a kick to the junk
 
2013-02-06 04:13:03 PM  

FuryOfFirestorm: In an age where AAA game producers like Capcom are doing Day One DLC, on-disc characters, levels and endings that you have to pay to unlock or re-releasing an updated version of a game 6 months later, I have no doubt that this "rumor" will turn out to be true.

Someday we'll be telling our grandchildren of a time when video game companies sold you a game with all the content included. Then our grandkids will laugh in our faces and ask for $10 so they can unlock the second level of Resident Evil XLII.


when I was a kid, new games were $70+ in 1991 currency, produced for meager budgets by meager teams, and often followed up with sequels not too long after, expansion packs, etc and so forth.  Most games were, really, only about 4-5 hours long save for RPGS.

Total cost of ownership, over all, is about the same with inflation.
 
2013-02-06 04:13:38 PM  
Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.
 
2013-02-06 04:14:50 PM  
I'd be perfectly fine with them doing that to the PS4 as I can see no reason why I would ever upgrade from the PS3. I have zero complaints about the graphics or horsepower of the thing, I have a first generation 80 gb that is backwards compatible and there is a massive back-log of games I have yet to play and more awesome titles come out every day. If the thing would hold up, I could easily play it for another 20 years.
 
2013-02-06 04:15:22 PM  

ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.


Right, because that worked so well for 3do back in the day, and loads of major Pc releases are designed for Linux OS.

I'm a major steam gamer, but I'm not sure what the hell valve is thinking here.
 
kab
2013-02-06 04:15:27 PM  
Turn X-Box Live into a free service for all registered owners, follow Steam's lead as far as having frequent sales on fairly new titles, and I don't think you'll hear many people complaining THAT much when the dust settles.

Keep trying to nickel and dime your base, however, and charging $60 despite saving a good chunk of change on the lack of physical distribution, and MS deserves to be abandoned like a sinking ship.
 
2013-02-06 04:15:32 PM  

Dr Dreidel: BumpInTheNight: if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it. If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam. Do I buy a lot of games at the $60 mark? Nope. Do I buy a lot of first-hand games? Yep.

What about those of us who don't want to pay the "GOTTA HAVE IT NOWNOWNOW" premium, so we wait 3-6 months for the price to drop?

// just bought AC3 and Madden 13 for a combined $45
// (obviously) not at Gamestop


Dealzon.com has been a godsend. Thanks to them, I got a new copy of Prototype 2 for $20, and scored Dishonored and Sleeping Dogs together for $60, both new.
 
2013-02-06 04:15:38 PM  

ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.


I would love for that to happen as their launch title would HAVE to be a new half life.

/won't be right without Kelly Bailey though
 
2013-02-06 04:17:27 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Well yah that's pretty much what I'm doing, there's a lot of games that initially release for $60 but I'm not enticed enough to pay that much so I just wait a month or two, voila the price on steam goes down due to either a sale or the game's initial price point didn't accurately reflect the demand for it.  Some publishers start games are a price lower then $60 right off the bat, its great.  Either way I buy games for the prices I want and know that the profits from the sale go back to a platform that lets me do all of this from the comfort of my home and to the developers who provided the game.


I do the same thing, only with Half/eBay/NewEgg/etc. I'm running a 360, sue me. (Not knowing much about Steam - they don't do consoles, correct? I have bought a few GOGs - the Total Annihilation series is FARKING AWESOME - and even though my installed copy of Heroes of M&M 2 crashes my system, I love the ability to buy an old game I love for $6 and not worry about licensing, tracking a CD key, DRM or any of that shiat).

What will GameFly do if this goes through? Will they have to ship only new copies, then destroy them or recycle them for a new one? (I'm thinking of the retarded licensing issue that forced companies to literally print new DVDs any time someone wanted a rental then recycle the disc when it was returned, rather than keep a library of discs.)
 
2013-02-06 04:18:12 PM  

mainstreet62: Requiring an Internet connection will make any company reviled.

See: Blizzard (Diablo 3)


While the internet connection thing didn't help them very much, Diablo 3 was just kind of lackluster as a game.
 
kab
2013-02-06 04:18:19 PM  

scottydoesntknow: So who's gonna be the first to cast the stone in the inevitable PC vs. Console flamewar that these threads always devolve into?


No need to argue about something as obvious as the color of the sky.

/silly rabbit, consoles are for plebs.
 
2013-02-06 04:18:21 PM  

whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.


Yeah that totally worked for unlimited data on cell phones
 
2013-02-06 04:19:04 PM  

Antimatter: Kazan: whistleridge: What are you talking about? Surely a huge computer corporation like MS would never make something that cost hundreds of dollars and then died after mere weeks due to shoddy components. Why, that would be unscrupulous!

Xbox spend $3bn replacing RROD'd consoles under extended warranties. they were under NO OBLIGATION to extend those warranties.

if you want an example of a corporation being evil you should not use a situation in which the company went above and beyond their obligations to replace out of warranty hardware as a warranty replacement.

The alternative would be getting sued.  RROD was a clear manufacturing/design defect, i'd have given the lawyers a goo shot at winning a court case on that grounds.


maybe, however they did it without being sued, they admitted it was a manufacturing defect without getting sued, and they had a lenient policy that would replace boxes that probably didn't have the defect just because they showed similar symptoms.

manufacturing defects happen, doesn't matter how big the company is. it matters how they handle it.
 
2013-02-06 04:19:54 PM  

ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.


Since when do people make games for Linux?
 
2013-02-06 04:20:18 PM  
Meh.I never buy anything just released anyway. By the time I get around to buying something, the price of new or used is almost negligible. It's the same with Steam. I wait for sales with deep discounts. Either way, I win.

/In other words, I'm married.
//Probably won't get a next gen console until at least 2 years after it's been released.
 
2013-02-06 04:22:45 PM  

moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?


There are at least two low-cost android based consoles coming out. Not sure if they will play with the big boys in terms of game quality but they've may steal some of their business
 
2013-02-06 04:23:35 PM  

kab: scottydoesntknow: So who's gonna be the first to cast the stone in the inevitable PC vs. Console flamewar that these threads always devolve into?

No need to argue about something as obvious as the color of the sky.

/silly rabbit, consoles are for plebs.


It was nice back when we could say we didn't have to deal with patches. At least we don't have to deal with drivers and faders and shiat. I still blame you for screenshots of pixels and the term "FPS" not meaning a game like Doom.
 
2013-02-06 04:24:00 PM  

WalkingCarpet: This is so stupid I can't totally believe Sony would do it.


FTFY

You're talking about the same people who thought it was a good idea to put rootkits on their cds.
 
2013-02-06 04:24:40 PM  

Farking Canuck: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?

There are at least two low-cost android based consoles coming out. Not sure if they will play with the big boys in terms of game quality but they've may steal some of their business


So everyone's going to turn on a dime for the new thing, while no one buys it because there are no games for it.
 
2013-02-06 04:25:27 PM  
If Sony doesn't do it and Microsoft does do it, oh boy...

/Value's Box says that consoles aren't the problem, Apple is the problem BTW.
 
2013-02-06 04:28:06 PM  

Antimatter: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Right, because that worked so well for 3do back in the day, and loads of major Pc releases are designed for Linux OS.

I'm a major steam gamer, but I'm not sure what the hell valve is thinking here.


First off the 3DO is an apple to oranges comparison for a number of reasons.  First off Panasonic didn't really have name brand appeal within in the gaming community.  People are much more likely to buy a Steam console due to a general trust in Valve not to screw them.

Secondly cross platform development doesn't have to be hard anymore.  If Valve rolls a well designed version of Linux for their console and dev tools to go with it, it is a lot different than Panasonic begging people to pick up a whole new platform and develop for it in 1993.  If Valve lays the foundation well, making it work on Valve Linux won't be hard.

/plus Valve can release its operating system for general download and instantly get market share since millions of people will download it and set up a dual boot on their PC
//Valve can release a beta, stick some of their games on it for free (or on trial) and suddenly have X% of the market share without ever shipping a piece of hardware.
/especially if they drop strong hits about launch day Half Life, Team Fortress, Left 4 Dead, and all the other IPs they control
 
2013-02-06 04:28:58 PM  

moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?


Linux pretty much is a game.
 
2013-02-06 04:30:03 PM  

mcreadyblue: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?

Linux pretty much is a game.


A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of chess?
 
2013-02-06 04:30:24 PM  
My comments after reading through this:

1.  RoHS solder is garbage.  Guys at my company couldn't get it to melt properly with our soldering irons.
2.  Microsoft meet gun.  Gun meet foot.  Microsoft pull trigger.
3.  The point about this violating fair use is valid and might be a possible route to prevent this style of marketing.  The only way around this is to not use physical media in the console.  Although, EA is already doing this in SSX (hence why i haven't bought SSX).
4.  Steam will take over if major console providers shift to this activation marketing style.  T
5.  It probably wouldn't hurt gamestop much.  They'll shift to selling new games only.  It wont be such high profit margin though.
6.  A used game is also how I got introduced to a series.  It also lets me catch up on an episode in a series I may have missed that is no longer offered as a New Game.
 
2013-02-06 04:30:32 PM  

moothemagiccow: Farking Canuck: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?

There are at least two low-cost android based consoles coming out. Not sure if they will play with the big boys in terms of game quality but they've may steal some of their business

So everyone's going to turn on a dime for the new thing, while no one buys it because there are no games for it.


The way Valve was talking, there were going to go in and make their own flavor of Linux that was easy and attractive to make games for.  They would then populate the title list with their own IP.  I'd imagine they could also get some of the indy studios to dip their toes in the water if Valve makes dev costs low.

/as in, not games for any flavor of Linux, but just Valve's version that has specific features added and is only 100% assured to work with specific hardware configurations
 
2013-02-06 04:31:20 PM  
This thread: "Yeah, if Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo refuse to let you play used games, then everybody would switch to Valve! Woohoo, hooray for Steam!"
Reality: Valve sued in Germany over the Right to Resell Games "Because Valve forbids its users to sell or transfer their accounts to another person, the exchange of games that can only be played online is impossible, she said. This means that a Steam user only partially owns games, Elbrecht said. "If I pay the full price for a game, then why am I not allowed to do with it what I want," she added."
 
2013-02-06 04:31:49 PM  

ha-ha-guy: /plus Valve can release its operating system for general download and instantly get market share since millions of people will download it and set up a dual boot on their PC


I didn't think millions of people could set up a dual boot on their PC
 
2013-02-06 04:32:09 PM  
Got an e-mail from Amazon promoting the Ouryo (sp?) console that a group of folks is using Kickstarter to run.  I can certainly imagine the companies deciding to avoid or trying to hinder used game sales.  Well, let's just say that I didn't get a Wii and an XBox until last summer; before that, I went something like four years without a console.  Outside of the occasional PC game, I won't live or die without consoles.

Besides, I have a HEPC I put together on my own hooked up to my TV.  I built it a little over a year ago, so it will need some upgrades, but I'll just go back to PC gaming and Steam Sales.

\Just Cause 2 for 2.99?
\\yes, please
\\\meanwhile, Gamestop sells it for 18.99 used
 
2013-02-06 04:32:19 PM  

Theaetetus: This thread: "Yeah, if Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo refuse to let you play used games, then everybody would switch to Valve! Woohoo, hooray for Steam!"
Reality: Valve sued in Germany over the Right to Resell Games "Because Valve forbids its users to sell or transfer their accounts to another person, the exchange of games that can only be played online is impossible, she said. This means that a Steam user only partially owns games, Elbrecht said. "If I pay the full price for a game, then why am I not allowed to do with it what I want," she added."


See, for example:

theresnothinglft: 4.  Steam will take over if major console providers shift to this activation marketing style.

 
2013-02-06 04:33:47 PM  
Why not include a mandatory peripheral that requires the user to clamp it around their scrotum in order to allow the console to operate, which will occasionally squeeze down hard on said user's scrotum just to let them know who's boss?

(Don't even ask what the female version is like. It involves 2000 volts.)
 
2013-02-06 04:35:27 PM  

ha-ha-guy: The way Valve was talking, there were going to go in and make their own flavor of Linux that was easy and attractive to make games for. They would then populate the title list with their own IP.


Aren't these guys famous for making vaporware?
 
2013-02-06 04:35:42 PM  
xria:

I don't expect it to happen, but no it wouldn't - the games would be tied to your account, not a particular piece of hardware.

Yep, so if they decide arbitrarily to ban your account (something I am delighted to say has never happened to me but has to countless others) they would be confiscating perhaps thousands of dollars worth of games in an irrevocable fashion. Sign me up.
 
2013-02-06 04:35:59 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.


that 3rd console curse
 
2013-02-06 04:36:01 PM  

ha-ha-guy: /plus Valve can release its operating system for general download and instantly get market share since millions of people will download it and set up a dual boot on their PC
//Valve can release a beta, stick some of their games on it for free (or on trial) and suddenly have X% of the market share without ever shipping a piece of hardware.
/especially if they drop strong hits about launch day Half Life, Team Fortress, Left 4 Dead, and all the other IPs they control


You do realize people can already use Steam and play those games without dual-booting, right? Like, there is an application that you can run to play those games right now? Why would anyone want to dual boot their machine so it can do only one thing? At that point, your PC is nothing but a console, but even more limited than the 360 and PS3 is right now (being able to surf the web, do youtube, videos, music, etc.)
 
2013-02-06 04:36:11 PM  

Farking Canuck: There are at least two low-cost android based consoles coming out. Not sure if they will play with the big boys in terms of game quality but they've may steal some of their business


I read a Q&A on Engadget with some devs who are working with the Ouya dev kit and they say it can do late-PS2 graphics at best.

For me, I'll pass on that.  If I want to play a mobile-type game, I'll fire up an iPad.  For my big-ass HDTV, I want amazing visuals to go along with the gameplay (where appropriate).
 
2013-02-06 04:36:18 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.


You're not paying the developers by buying a console game new. You're paying the distributor.
 
2013-02-06 04:36:44 PM  
Glad out of gaming then.
 
2013-02-06 04:38:03 PM  

mcreadyblue: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?

Linux pretty much is a game.


It does often remind me of Myst, that's for sure.
 
2013-02-06 04:38:33 PM  

moothemagiccow: whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.

Yeah that totally worked for unlimited data on cell phones


That's a poor comparison, and you know it. A better one would be how the iPhone was jailbroken and unlocked like crazy, and sales REALLY took off once it was opened to other carriers. And how sales would have been muuuuuch lower if the carriers hadn't subsidized the cost via contracts.

If the console makers want to try to move to that model, I suppose I could see that working: $100 for a PS4, plus a 3 year contract at $10/month plus having to buy the games through their online (locked) marketplaces. But it would take  years to get that infrastructure in place, and we would surely have heard about it by now.

And again: this isn't even a rumor. It's a rumor of a rumor. I still think nothing major comes of it.
 
2013-02-06 04:38:36 PM  

Theaetetus: This thread: "Yeah, if Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo refuse to let you play used games, then everybody would switch to Valve! Woohoo, hooray for Steam!"
Reality: Valve sued in Germany over the Right to Resell Games "Because Valve forbids its users to sell or transfer their accounts to another person, the exchange of games that can only be played online is impossible, she said. This means that a Steam user only partially owns games, Elbrecht said. "If I pay the full price for a game, then why am I not allowed to do with it what I want," she added."


You can transfer games.  You can't transfer an account.  The idiot suing Valve should learn how to use the transfer game function built into Steam instead.

/wait why are you even off my ignore list?
//I think you were being so dumb in some other thread I just had to remove you and see
 
2013-02-06 04:38:46 PM  

GAT_00: Crusader Kings 2


I literally cannot even get started on that farker. Makes my head all melty.
 
2013-02-06 04:39:00 PM  
Wouldn't that violate EU Law?
 
2013-02-06 04:41:35 PM  

moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: The way Valve was talking, there were going to go in and make their own flavor of Linux that was easy and attractive to make games for. They would then populate the title list with their own IP.

Aren't these guys famous for making vaporware?


Do you really not know who Valve is? I don't think this is the thread you are looking for. Go back to your Angry Birds.
 
2013-02-06 04:42:41 PM  

RevMercutio: BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.

You're not paying the developers by buying a console game new. You're paying the distributor.


A console game?  Eww. :P  Thanks Mr Technically correct I know the charges on my credit card are going to Valve not Bethesda but I do know inevitably some of it will make it back to Bethesda, unlike when you buy a used game from Gamestop.
 
2013-02-06 04:43:29 PM  

whistleridge: If the console makers want to try to move to that model, I suppose I could see that working: $100 for a PS4, plus a 3 year contract at $10/month plus having to buy the games through their online (locked) marketplaces. But it would take years to get that infrastructure in place, and we would surely have heard about it by now.


I can't tell if you're being sarcastic. Xbox Live? PS+?
 
2013-02-06 04:44:20 PM  

ha-ha-guy: Theaetetus: This thread: "Yeah, if Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo refuse to let you play used games, then everybody would switch to Valve! Woohoo, hooray for Steam!"
Reality: Valve sued in Germany over the Right to Resell Games "Because Valve forbids its users to sell or transfer their accounts to another person, the exchange of games that can only be played online is impossible, she said. This means that a Steam user only partially owns games, Elbrecht said. "If I pay the full price for a game, then why am I not allowed to do with it what I want," she added."

You can transfer games.  You can't transfer an account.  The idiot suing Valve should learn how to use the transfer game function built into Steam instead.

/wait why are you even off my ignore list?
//I think you were being so dumb in some other thread I just had to remove you and see


I thought you could only transfer games if you've never played them.
 
2013-02-06 04:44:55 PM  
Seems like there's an opportunity for the publishers to make some money without completely pissing off all of their customers.
All they'd need to do is to allow re-activation of used games for a *reasonable* fee ($10-$15)

That lets them recoup some of the money they're "losing" on the 2nd hand game market.

Lots of companies successfully charge a hefty premium for their products because of high resale values (BMW, Snap-On)
 
2013-02-06 04:45:11 PM  
 
2013-02-06 04:46:58 PM  

umad: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: The way Valve was talking, there were going to go in and make their own flavor of Linux that was easy and attractive to make games for. They would then populate the title list with their own IP.

Aren't these guys famous for making vaporware?

Do you really not know who Valve is? I don't think this is the thread you are looking for. Go back to your Angry Birds.


I remember hearing something about a third half life and a 2nd dota.

Seriously, they release what, like 1 game a year? And nothing last year?
 
2013-02-06 04:47:41 PM  

RoxtarRyan: ha-ha-guy: /plus Valve can release its operating system for general download and instantly get market share since millions of people will download it and set up a dual boot on their PC
//Valve can release a beta, stick some of their games on it for free (or on trial) and suddenly have X% of the market share without ever shipping a piece of hardware.
/especially if they drop strong hits about launch day Half Life, Team Fortress, Left 4 Dead, and all the other IPs they control

You do realize people can already use Steam and play those games without dual-booting, right? Like, there is an application that you can run to play those games right now? Why would anyone want to dual boot their machine so it can do only one thing? At that point, your PC is nothing but a console, but even more limited than the 360 and PS3 is right now (being able to surf the web, do youtube, videos, music, etc.)


No, I just somehow blissfully remained totally unaware that Steam worked on Windows and lets you play games on Windows.  Somehow I know what Valve is, what Steam is, and all that, but I had no clue it worked on Windows.

The whole reason Valve started talking about this was unhappiness over Microsoft's Windows 8 policies, the MS App Store, and things like that.  That led Gabe to start talking about gaming studios moving over to Linux.  The idea was a Linux that was all nice and user friendly for gaming, email, web surfing, watching videos, functioning as a home server, a media PC to the TV, etc.  The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.

I'd argue the idea has merit, in that people who can't master any type of moderately difficult computer related concept left for console gaming years ago.  Those who remain would likely be willing to at least consider a dual boot option or buy a Valve console to play games.
 
2013-02-06 04:48:15 PM  

Eddie Adams from Torrance: All they'd need to do is to allow re-activation of used games for a *reasonable* fee ($10-$15)


Exactly what Bioware does for a lot of their games. The Mass Effect series, coming to mind, required a unique code in order for a lot of zero-day "DLC", or even using post zero-day DLC. You can play the game used and not pay it, but you're playing the bare-bones version. Good enough for some, I imagine.
 
2013-02-06 04:48:16 PM  

BumpInTheNight: mcreadyblue: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?

Linux pretty much is a game.

It does often remind me of Myst, that's for sure.


At least I could get the sound to work in Myst
 
2013-02-06 04:48:50 PM  

WalkingCarpet: I seriously doubt this is true, it would be the death knell for the Xbox brand and Microsoft must know it.

Sony on the other hand would cream their pants.



Yeah, but you forget that Microsoft is now in the hands of Steve Ballmer, the farking moron that thinks ribbons and Windows 8 are great ideas, so enjoy your console shiat sandwich.
 
2013-02-06 04:49:03 PM  

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Seems like there's an opportunity for the publishers to make some money without completely pissing off all of their customers.
All they'd need to do is to allow re-activation of used games for a *reasonable* fee ($10-$15)

That lets them recoup some of the money they're "losing" on the 2nd hand game market.

Lots of companies successfully charge a hefty premium for their products because of high resale values (BMW, Snap-On)


They're already starting that with multiplayer passes. Buy a game brand new, get a one time activation code that allows you to use the multiplayer servers. If you buy the game used, you can still do anything you want on single-player, but have to buy an online pass (usually $10-$15) to play multiplayer. This is the most that console developers have done to quell the used game market so far. PC developers have pushed the boundaries a little further with various DRM, and had their hand bitten pretty bad in the process *cough* UBISoft *cough*
 
2013-02-06 04:51:34 PM  

ha-ha-guy: /wait why are you even off my ignore list?


Fark accounts come with a handy Ignore Feature. Use it to filter out those posters whose comments you'd prefer not to read. Keep in mind that discussing who's on your ignore list is the opposite of ignoring. It crosses the line into trolling of other Fark members and may result in a suspension of posting privileges.

/i.e. suck it.
 
2013-02-06 04:52:19 PM  

scottydoesntknow: BumpInTheNight:

/if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it.  If that didn't exist you would damn well find you could buy games at prices you want like the the Master Gaming Race can via steam.  Do I buy a lot of games at the $60 mark?  Nope.  Do I buy a lot of first-hand games?  Yep.

Adjusted for inflation, most SNES games cost around $80 new and some went well above $100. Charticle


Yeah, that's why I got 1 game for my birthday and 1 game for Christmas back in the late 80s/early 90s.

/Got Mega Man 2 instead of Mega Man 3 due to the price difference.
 
2013-02-06 04:52:32 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.
 
2013-02-06 04:53:48 PM  

HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.


It's failing...kinda.
 
2013-02-06 04:54:45 PM  

ha-ha-guy: The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.


If they did that, then that is a prime example of one company trying to be the biggest douche they can. There is nothing in Win8 that stops Steam from functioning or working like Win7. I have it on my laptop, and Steam runs fine, no problems. This is them being pissy that MS is putting something with their OS that gives people another venue for purchasing 3rd party software. If anything else, that would drive people away from Steam to other companies like Direct2Drive, Gamers Gate, Amazon Game Downloads, etc. Why bother setting up a dual-boot to play games when there are companies who are more than happy to take your money without modifying your computer?
 
2013-02-06 04:55:35 PM  

BumpInTheNight: /if you support used games you are really supporting a vampiric business model called Gamestop, that's it.


No, that's not it.  You're supporting a thousand mom-and-pop shops that make fark-all on new games and rely on used sales to keep the store open.  You're supporting gamers who sell their old games on eBay so they can go buy new ones.  You're supporting kids trading games for the weekend so they can try out a game they haven't played before.  You're supporting rental services like GameFly.

And you're also supporting the dickbags at GameStop, sure.  But I'm not willing to cut my nose off to spite my face.
 
2013-02-06 04:55:37 PM  

eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.


They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.
 
2013-02-06 04:55:39 PM  
Funny that everyone rushes to point the finger at MS or Sony on this (if it is even true) when the push is probably coming from the game developers.
 
2013-02-06 04:56:24 PM  

RoxtarRyan: ha-ha-guy: The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.

If they did that, then that is a prime example of one company trying to be the biggest douche they can. There is nothing in Win8 that stops Steam from functioning or working like Win7. I have it on my laptop, and Steam runs fine, no problems. This is them being pissy that MS is putting something with their OS that gives people another venue for purchasing 3rd party software. If anything else, that would drive people away from Steam to other companies like Direct2Drive, Gamers Gate, Amazon Game Downloads, etc. Why bother setting up a dual-boot to play games when there are companies who are more than happy to take your money without modifying your computer?


Because the store was only part of the issue.  A number of the companies also expressed unhappiness with the development tools for Windows 8.  MS may have gotten its shiat together and fixed their dev tools though.
 
2013-02-06 04:57:01 PM  

moothemagiccow: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.

They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.


I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.  But people have been eager to call gloom-and-doom for Nintendo since the GameCube, so they'll seize on anything, including the new system being slightly less successful than Nintendo thought it would be.
 
2013-02-06 04:58:28 PM  

RoxtarRyan: ha-ha-guy: The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.

If they did that, then that is a prime example of one company trying to be the biggest douche they can. There is nothing in Win8 that stops Steam from functioning or working like Win7. I have it on my laptop, and Steam runs fine, no problems. This is them being pissy that MS is putting something with their OS that gives people another venue for purchasing 3rd party software. If anything else, that would drive people away from Steam to other companies like Direct2Drive, Gamers Gate, Amazon Game Downloads, etc. Why bother setting up a dual-boot to play games when there are companies who are more than happy to take your money without modifying your computer?


And even moreso when the usage of Steam on Win8 desktops is still increasing, according to the recent Steam H&S Survey.
 
2013-02-06 04:58:31 PM  

HallsOfMandos: Funny that everyone rushes to point the finger at MS or Sony on this (if it is even true) when the push is probably coming from the game developers.


As published both Sony and MS don't have the great reps in the gaming community.  Well MS isn't that bad, but Sony likes to load intrusive DRM on the titles they publish.

/also the media they sell, remember that whole root kit fuss?
//in many cases the publisher makes the call on DRM
 
2013-02-06 05:00:12 PM  

HeartBurnKid: moothemagiccow: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.

They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.

I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.  But people have been eager to call gloom-and-doom for Nintendo since the GameCube, so they'll seize on anything, including the new system being slightly less successful than Nintendo thought it would be.


The problem is that had the Wii U was up against the PS3 and 360 back in 2006, it would have kicked ass but now, everyone is saying Nintendo is playing catch up.

And the people who are saying doom and gloom to Nintendo are just Sony and 360 fans. The 3DS took awhile to pick up steam but it's selling like hotcakes now.
 
2013-02-06 05:00:58 PM  

kab: Turn X-Box Live into a free service for all registered owners, follow Steam's lead as far as having frequent sales on fairly new titles, and I don't think you'll hear many people complaining THAT much when the dust settles.

Keep trying to nickel and dime your base, however, and charging $60 despite saving a good chunk of change on the lack of physical distribution, and MS deserves to be abandoned like a sinking ship.


right well the entire reason digital distribution took off in the first place was because:

A) added convenience
B) price competitive software
C) secured backlogs

kinda hard to trust console makers on that kind of stuff
 
2013-02-06 05:01:19 PM  
I love my 360 and have had countless hours of fun with it, however if they actually go this route, count me in as not buying.
If they require a constant connection, I'm so out it's not funny. Like people said on the first page: Welcome to Sonytown.

As for used games, I can't really comprehend what that would be like. I would hope the prices would come down for new games. However it takes years to make a new game. I did not mind paying $60 for Borderlands 2, because a building full of adults spend 3 years creating it for me. Price seems kinda low if you actually consider what goes into each game.
 
2013-02-06 05:05:25 PM  
Funny, I remember seeing this exact same thing when the 360 and PS3 came out
 
2013-02-06 05:05:37 PM  
If Sony does the same thing, what's this going to mean when Sony takes down PSN for a month and a half after LulzSec 2 hacks it again?

Also, a console you can't play because their service is in weekly maintenance?
 
2013-02-06 05:07:49 PM  

RockChalkH1N1: Funny, I remember seeing this exact same thing when the 360 and PS3 came out


It's different now because how rampant DLC and online has become.
 
2013-02-06 05:08:13 PM  

Weaver95: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.


I think that you are vastly overestimating the amount of consumer outrage that would actually happen.

I think that it can be hard for people in the tech-savvy Fark demographic to fully appreciate the absence of give-a-farks that the average person feels about these kinds of schemes.
 
2013-02-06 05:10:30 PM  

eddievercetti: RockChalkH1N1: Funny, I remember seeing this exact same thing when the 360 and PS3 came out

It's different now because how rampant DLC and online has become.


Not to mention how many industry-types have spoken out against used games, and of course, "Project 10-Dollar".
 
2013-02-06 05:12:15 PM  

HeartBurnKid: I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.


Whoopty-doo. The 360 was still impossible to find in stores at this point in its life-cycle. They were selling as many of them as they could produce.
 
2013-02-06 05:13:16 PM  

eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: moothemagiccow: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.

They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.

I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.  But people have been eager to call gloom-and-doom for Nintendo since the GameCube, so they'll seize on anything, including the new system being slightly less successful than Nintendo thought it would be.

The problem is that had the Wii U was up against the PS3 and 360 back in 2006, it would have kicked ass but now, everyone is saying Nintendo is playing catch up.

And the people who are saying doom and gloom to Nintendo are just Sony and 360 fans. The 3DS took awhile to pick up steam but it's selling like hotcakes now.


eh, Wii's situation is something that'll likely never be replicated... you had an extremely underpowered console, a unique forced control input that had latency/precision issues that would later come to bite them in the butt software wise (while not really being a sales hinderence), and an archaic online "feature"

Wii U has far more potential to stay relevant for years to come even if it's not as powerful as the others
 
2013-02-06 05:15:28 PM  

ha-ha-guy: RoxtarRyan: ha-ha-guy: /plus Valve can release its operating system for general download and instantly get market share since millions of people will download it and set up a dual boot on their PC
//Valve can release a beta, stick some of their games on it for free (or on trial) and suddenly have X% of the market share without ever shipping a piece of hardware.
/especially if they drop strong hits about launch day Half Life, Team Fortress, Left 4 Dead, and all the other IPs they control

You do realize people can already use Steam and play those games without dual-booting, right? Like, there is an application that you can run to play those games right now? Why would anyone want to dual boot their machine so it can do only one thing? At that point, your PC is nothing but a console, but even more limited than the 360 and PS3 is right now (being able to surf the web, do youtube, videos, music, etc.)

No, I just somehow blissfully remained totally unaware that Steam worked on Windows and lets you play games on Windows.  Somehow I know what Valve is, what Steam is, and all that, but I had no clue it worked on Windows.

The whole reason Valve started talking about this was unhappiness over Microsoft's Windows 8 policies, the MS App Store, and things like that.  That led Gabe to start talking about gaming studios moving over to Linux.  The idea was a Linux that was all nice and user friendly for gaming, email, web surfing, watching videos, functioning as a home server, a media PC to the TV, etc.  The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.

I'd argue the idea has merit, in that people who can't master any type of moderately difficult computer related concept left for console gaming years ago.  Those who remain would likely be willing to at least consider a dual boot option or buy a Valve console to play games.


You're missing a critical step -- Valve is also pushing for computer manufacturers to sell preconfigured "Steamboxes"; that is, SFF computers that boot Linux and go straight into Steam's Big Picture Mode.  Xi3 was actually showing a prototype off at CES, and Gabe has confirmed they're talking with other hardware manufacturers about doing the same thing.
 
Bf+
2013-02-06 05:17:17 PM  
No thanks-- i'm just used to the playstation contolle...
www.ps4playstation4.com

...well, fark.
 
2013-02-06 05:17:29 PM  

AdamK: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: moothemagiccow: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.

They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.

I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.  But people have been eager to call gloom-and-doom for Nintendo since the GameCube, so they'll seize on anything, including the new system being slightly less successful than Nintendo thought it would be.

The problem is that had the Wii U was up against the PS3 and 360 back in 2006, it would have kicked ass but now, everyone is saying Nintendo is playing catch up.

And the people who are saying doom and gloom to Nintendo are just Sony and 360 fans. The 3DS took awhile to pick up steam but it's selling like hotcakes now.

eh, Wii's situation is something that'll likely never be replicated... you had an extremely underpowered console, a unique forced control input that had latency/precision issues that would later come to bite them in the butt software wise (while not really being a sales hinderence), and an archaic online "feature"

Wii U has far more potential to stay relevant for years to come even if it's not as powerful as the others


The Wii U is just a gimick console.
 
2013-02-06 05:18:33 PM  

eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.


They haven't put out a "must-have" game yet. I bet their numbers go way up when the next Zelda game ships.
 
2013-02-06 05:18:37 PM  

RoxtarRyan: RoxtarRyan: ha-ha-guy: The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.

If they did that, then that is a prime example of one company trying to be the biggest douche they can. There is nothing in Win8 that stops Steam from functioning or working like Win7. I have it on my laptop, and Steam runs fine, no problems. This is them being pissy that MS is putting something with their OS that gives people another venue for purchasing 3rd party software. If anything else, that would drive people away from Steam to other companies like Direct2Drive, Gamers Gate, Amazon Game Downloads, etc. Why bother setting up a dual-boot to play games when there are companies who are more than happy to take your money without modifying your computer?

And even moreso when the usage of Steam on Win8 desktops is still increasing, according to the recent Steam H&S Survey.


That is pretty interesting. Looks like in a month or two, Windows 8 will have more Steam gamers on that platform than XP. Guess the haters are going to have to start eating crow about Win 8.

cdn.ientry.com
/Oh, that's cute, OSX almost has 3% and Linux is up to nearly 1% of gamers these days. Sounds about right.
 
2013-02-06 05:19:47 PM  

RoxtarRyan: ha-ha-guy: The carrot go install it would be the Linux version of Steam that offered exclusive features or titles the Windows 8 version of Steam lacked.

If they did that, then that is a prime example of one company trying to be the biggest douche they can. There is nothing in Win8 that stops Steam from functioning or working like Win7. I have it on my laptop, and Steam runs fine, no problems. This is them being pissy that MS is putting something with their OS that gives people another venue for purchasing 3rd party software. If anything else, that would drive people away from Steam to other companies like Direct2Drive, Gamers Gate, Amazon Game Downloads, etc. Why bother setting up a dual-boot to play games when there are companies who are more than happy to take your money without modifying your computer?


What drives me away from Steam is not being able to play games I already bought.   I pull out some old stuff like Battlefield 2142 and try to install it.  Of course I don't remember what  my username was from six years ago, so I have Steam email my username to my email which I luckily still have.  Then I go to log on and get some "fark you in the ass" error.  I'll go home and try it again - don't rememeber what the deal was exactly, but it was a circular string of shiat as I recall.  Total bullshiat.  In the future I'll just write down username and password information on the game manual - when I actually purchase physical media.
 
2013-02-06 05:19:52 PM  

BumpInTheNight: I know the charges on my credit card are going to Valve not Bethesda but I do know inevitably some of it will make it back to Bethesda, unlike when you buy a used game from Gamestop


Do you own the games or not? If you own them, you can resell them. Period. That's what ownership means. If you take away that, then you don't own the product. At best, you are purchasing a lifetime use license.

Now, if the game companies want to go to a license/lease system, then fine. Let them be upfront about that and come up with a model that makes sense for such a system. Such a model should not be based around a point-of-sale concept, however.

But don't give me a hybrid system where I "buy" a product that I do not, in any meaningful sense of the word, own.
 
2013-02-06 05:19:53 PM  
Welcome to the future of gaming and that'll be $3.50.
 
2013-02-06 05:20:10 PM  

Some 'Splainin' To Do: Weaver95: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.

I think that you are vastly overestimating the amount of consumer outrage that would actually happen.

I think that it can be hard for people in the tech-savvy Fark demographic to fully appreciate the absence of give-a-farks that the average person feels about these kinds of schemes.


you're right.  gamers would NEVER be outraged over changes like this.  Because gamers, as we all know, are a calm and reasonable sort of personality type who understand business realities and won't complain about any reasonable comment made by the industry corporate execs.

/sarcasm.

Have you ever SEEN a gamer forum before!?
 
2013-02-06 05:24:45 PM  

Tigger: GAT_00: Crusader Kings 2

I literally cannot even get started on that farker. Makes my head all melty.


If you've only used the Paradox tutorials, that may be why.  There is a fantastic and huge, if slightly out of date, walkthrough here.I saw that long after I started playing, but it looks pretty good.
 
2013-02-06 05:26:52 PM  

Antimatter: i'd have given the lawyers a goo shot at winning a court case on that grounds


Guess where my perverted brain automatically went with that?

mainstreet62: Requiring an Internet connection will make any company reviled.

See: Blizzard (Diablo 3)


I'm still pissed I need an internet connection to play WoW.
 
2013-02-06 05:26:56 PM  

WalkingCarpet: Since Sony is unveiling the PS4 in a couple of weeks we'll know a lot more then.


Less than 2 months after Christmas? That's good thinking.
 
2013-02-06 05:28:39 PM  

ladyfortuna: Weaver95: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.

I read a while back that Gamestop is seriously considering getting into the retro game business, which pisses me off royally. I'm selling most NES carts for effectively $2-$3 at best after shipping and before fees, and as soon as GS gets in, expect ebay to become a sudden storm of activity - both for civilians and for GS's future stock buyers outbidding the rest of us on just about everything.

/prediction
//I could be wrong of course


If you don't mind me asking, where do you get your stock?  Garage sales?  Craigslist?
 
2013-02-06 05:30:02 PM  

Big_Fat_Liar: What drives me away from Steam is not being able to play games I already bought.


The only issue I've had like that with Steam was with the original Dragon Age. Bought it on Steam, the package with all the DLC, and there was an issue about 30 hours in where the DLC wasn't able to "phone home", causing all my game saves afterward to pretty much be corrupt. By the time I realized what happened, I logged another 50 hours in. Steam pointed their fingers at Bioware as the publisher, Bioware pointed fingers at Steam as the distributor, and nothing was done to fix it at all.

Odd, since my pirated copy with all the DLC worked just fine. Funny, since I pirated it first, but liked it so much I paid for it, only to have it not work.
 
2013-02-06 05:30:15 PM  

MrSteve007: That is pretty interesting. Looks like in a month or two, Windows 8 will have more Steam gamers on that platform than XP. Guess the haters are going to have to start eating crow about Win 8.


You mean the OS that comes pre-installed on every new PC sold is beating the OS that hasn't been sold in 3-4 years in a segment that is mostly focused on newer, high-end systems?  No shiat, Sherlock.
 
2013-02-06 05:35:03 PM  

Gonz: FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.


On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.


I seriously doubt this.  Bear in mind that the software companies sell more than enough games to remain profitable at $60/game.  Most will likely consider the extra money they earn from gamers that buy full priced games because they can't buy on the secondary market as "extra money" and better than the extra money they might gain by giving up $5/game across all of their sales just to pick up a few more "extra gamers" that simply won't pay $60 but will pay $55.

I could be wrong, but to me, games aren't fungible items.  Halo 4 isn't Madden which isn't Bioshock or GTA.  In otherwords, the games aren't close enough equivalents for competitors to drive prices down through competition.
 
2013-02-06 05:37:05 PM  

HeartBurnKid: You mean the OS that comes pre-installed on every new PC sold is beating the OS that hasn't been sold in 3-4 years in a segment that is mostly focused on newer, high-end systems? No shiat, Sherlock.


Oh, how quickly the talking points change. Before it was: "Windows 8 isn't selling, it's a flop." MS then announces that it's selling as well as Win 7 did. The next excuse was "Those aren't real sales to consumers, it's just a bunch of licenses and boxes sitting on shelves." Then came "Well, it's selling on new systems, but people are wiping and installing Windows 7 instead!" excuse. And now we have "It's pre-installed on every new PC sold!" excuse.

So you're telling me that Windows 8 became 8% of the total computer gaming market in *3-months* purely because it's sold on new computers. Lol.
 
2013-02-06 05:37:14 PM  

MrSteve007: /Oh, that's cute, OSX almost has 3% and Linux is up to nearly 1% of gamers these days. Sounds about right.


That is right. under 4% of gamers use those OSs for gaming. They either (A) Play Angry Birds-style games on tablets, or (B) have a game console. It has been that way since those OSs were invented, so I highly doubt the users give a f*ck about it. The ones that do dual boot their machines with a copy of Windows, so those figures aren't going to ever change for any reason.
 
2013-02-06 05:37:48 PM  
Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.
 
Xai
2013-02-06 05:38:44 PM  
Always been a big supporter of xbox, but if they expect me to pay full price to play rubbish games rather than buy them for £2.50 second hand then I have to say;

I will not buy the new xbox if it has this kind of DRM protection.
 
2013-02-06 05:38:50 PM  

Weaver95: Some 'Splainin' To Do: Weaver95: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.

I think that you are vastly overestimating the amount of consumer outrage that would actually happen.

I think that it can be hard for people in the tech-savvy Fark demographic to fully appreciate the absence of give-a-farks that the average person feels about these kinds of schemes.

you're right.  gamers would NEVER be outraged over changes like this.  Because gamers, as we all know, are a calm and reasonable sort of personality type who understand business realities and won't complain about any reasonable comment made by the industry corporate execs.

/sarcasm.

Have you ever SEEN a gamer forum before!?


First of all, I appreciate the sarcasm tag. I certainly would never had been able to tell you were being sarcastic, otherwise, so thanks! In like manner, I appreciate you capitalizing the important words in your post. I can't imagine how I would have been able to understand your point without that valuable emphasis. If only more posters were as calm and helpful as you, this would be a better Fark.

As to your point, yes, gamers are a reactive bunch who can get up in arms about a great many things. However, I would caution you to bear in mind that the sorts of people who post to forums are precisely the sort who are either  really engaged with the product or who are just the kind of person who likes to biatch about things in public. But that doesn't necessarily reflect the full fan base.

By analogy, It's much like how there are dedicate comic fans as well as casual movie goers. Both groups will see the Avengers, but it's only the former that's prone to be angry because such-and-such a characterization didn't match up with the comic. It's that group that will flood the forums with "Whedon suxx because they totes got Banner wrongggggg!!!"

The point that I'm making is that the consumer market for games is a whole lot bigger than the subset of people who care deeply about internet connectivity requirements and DRM.  You, Weaver, are a very specific sort of game player. You are a dedicated gamer. It doesn't really surprise me, for instance, that you are a PC gamer because that's exactly the market that most appeals to the hardcore.

I suspect that you kind of dislike consoles on general principle because they dumb-down games and are, therefore, looking for signs that something bad will be happening to the console market.  I am simply trying to caution you that your own perspective is skewed by the very fact that you are a serious gamer and that you are, therefore, filtering this news though a very specific point of view.
 
2013-02-06 05:39:38 PM  

MrSteve007: HeartBurnKid: You mean the OS that comes pre-installed on every new PC sold is beating the OS that hasn't been sold in 3-4 years in a segment that is mostly focused on newer, high-end systems? No shiat, Sherlock.

Oh, how quickly the talking points change. Before it was: "Windows 8 isn't selling, it's a flop." MS then announces that it's selling as well as Win 7 did. The next excuse was "Those aren't real sales to consumers, it's just a bunch of licenses and boxes sitting on shelves." Then came "Well, it's selling on new systems, but people are wiping and installing Windows 7 instead!" excuse. And now we have "It's pre-installed on every new PC sold!" excuse.

So you're telling me that Windows 8 became 8% of the total computer gaming market in *3-months* purely because it's sold on new computers. Lol.


It's a Windows vs Windows flame war in a twisted panty fight to the death!
 
2013-02-06 05:40:33 PM  

Surool: MrSteve007: /Oh, that's cute, OSX almost has 3% and Linux is up to nearly 1% of gamers these days. Sounds about right.

That is right. under 4% of gamers use those OSs for gaming. They either (A) Play Angry Birds-style games on tablets, or (B) have a game console. It has been that way since those OSs were invented, so I highly doubt the users give a f*ck about it. The ones that do dual boot their machines with a copy of Windows, so those figures aren't going to ever change for any reason.


... or maybe you're trying to look at a number on one service and extrapolate from there to all services. You know, 100% of users of the MacGameStore are on OSX. By your logic, no gamers use Windows.

Don't get me wrong, a large portion of gamers are on Windows, but another large portion are on Macs or on consoles. Using only one data source that misses those groups just results in invalid conclusions.
 
2013-02-06 05:40:53 PM  
img839.imageshack.us

Weaver95: Have you ever SEEN a gamer forum before!?


I think you are correct about console games taking it in the neck with the sort of restrictions and "improvements" the article is proposing. The average age of a video gamer is 37. If they wanted to jump around while playing a video game they would already own a Wii. Kinect technology is Microsoft's following an already saturated market. As far as one user only games, they are just begging to be hacked and defeated.
 
2013-02-06 05:41:01 PM  
I haven't read this thread but what if your X-Box craps out (as they are known to do) or it's stolen and you have to get another one? How do you play the games you own?
 
2013-02-06 05:41:31 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


And you must have missed back when new games cost only $40,  $50 max.
 
2013-02-06 05:42:50 PM  
Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.
 
2013-02-06 05:45:44 PM  
I'm late to the party but GO PCs! Throw money at Star Citizen (wing commander/freelancer descendent, by the same creator)
 
2013-02-06 05:46:34 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


It was $50 unless you bought a new NES system (when it came with the NES). You got boned.
 
2013-02-06 05:46:48 PM  
Not surprising. Might as well get rid of the disks altogether and sell them 100% via download. Tiered pricing for quality, release date, etc.
Big bad news for Gamestop
 
2013-02-06 05:46:50 PM  
Well, should they do this, I won't be buying.

/Then again I dont think they would be marketing to a thirty-something part time gamer anyway.  The kids are who all this gets marketed to anyway.  Their parents by extension will buy it for them and like it.
 
2013-02-06 05:46:52 PM  

Mugato: I haven't read this thread but what if your X-Box craps out (as they are known to do) or it's stolen and you have to get another one? How do you play the games you own?


Probably the same thing that happens now, your games are tied to your gamertag, not the hardware.
 
2013-02-06 05:51:45 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


Except that it actually cost $45.

And if they do implement this game prices will absolutely NOT come down.  Not even $5.
 
2013-02-06 05:56:38 PM  

lewismarktwo: Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.

Except that it actually cost $45.

And if they do implement this game prices will absolutely NOT come down.  Not even $5.


Actually, after looking at a couple sources, right in the middle at $55 or so. However, there were many games that did retail for $60 or $70.
 
2013-02-06 05:57:13 PM  

MrSteve007: HeartBurnKid: You mean the OS that comes pre-installed on every new PC sold is beating the OS that hasn't been sold in 3-4 years in a segment that is mostly focused on newer, high-end systems? No shiat, Sherlock.

Oh, how quickly the talking points change. Before it was: "Windows 8 isn't selling, it's a flop." MS then announces that it's selling as well as Win 7 did. The next excuse was "Those aren't real sales to consumers, it's just a bunch of licenses and boxes sitting on shelves." Then came "Well, it's selling on new systems, but people are wiping and installing Windows 7 instead!" excuse. And now we have "It's pre-installed on every new PC sold!" excuse.

So you're telling me that Windows 8 became 8% of the total computer gaming market in *3-months* purely because it's sold on new computers. Lol.


Ummm... yes.  I do believe that gamers, who in general churn through systems faster than the general public, have adopted Windows 8 in far greater numbers than the general public largely because it's sold on new systems.  That is exactly what I'm telling you.  And I don't recall saying any of those other things, but I suppose next you'll accuse me of being a sockpuppet or a paid shill or a Mac fanboy or whatever for stating the obvious.
 
2013-02-06 06:00:57 PM  
Well looks like i won't be buying the next gen Xbox then nor Sony's offering if they stick with this cockamamie idea.  Nintendo will never go for this so they will poised to take advantage if Sony and Microsoft shoot themselves in the foot.

Steam is great if you have a fast enough internet service to take advantage of it , i for one do not.
 
2013-02-06 06:02:04 PM  

PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.





Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?
 
2013-02-06 06:02:46 PM  

Theaetetus: ... or maybe you're trying to look at a number on one service and extrapolate from there to all services. You know, 100% of users of the MacGameStore are on OSX. By your logic, no gamers use Windows.

Don't get me wrong, a large portion of gamers are on Windows, but another large portion are on Macs or on consoles. Using only one data source that misses those groups just results in invalid conclusions.


I'm pretty sure that Steam controls a vast majority of the *cross-platform* gaming market - especially when it comes to major titles. At any given moment, they have 4-5 million players online. That's a pretty solid sampling size. They're the best place to start when attempting to look at what's out there in terms of demographics. Is it perfect? No, but it's the biggest cross-platform player out there. Of course there's also Origin (with Diablo, StarCraft, etc), but other than that, I'm not sure if there's much in the way of cross platform games - unless you're talking about the "Hey, I'm playing a game while taking a poop market" e.g.. Angry Birds.
 
2013-02-06 06:06:53 PM  
Video games are like prostitution:

If I pay for it.. I want to touch it, insert it, and play around until I've been satisfied.
 
2013-02-06 06:08:59 PM  
If this bears truth, then begun, the Second North American Video Game Crash has.
 
2013-02-06 06:10:48 PM  

way south: I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.


The physical media can often be found cheaper than direct download. I'd really rather have bought Fallout 3 and NV through Xbox live, as I wouldn't have to dick around with finding where my dipshiat wife hid the disc when she watched the Care Bears movie. While they were $50 and $60 to download, they were $20 at Walmart.
 
2013-02-06 06:13:26 PM  

way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?


Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.
 
2013-02-06 06:13:39 PM  

TiiiMMMaHHH: Video games are like prostitution:

If I pay for it.. I want to touch it, insert it, and play around until I've been satisfied.


I've always thought with the price of some SNES games, they should be blowing me.
 
2013-02-06 06:15:38 PM  
www.deviantart.com
 
2013-02-06 06:16:48 PM  

MrSteve007: I'm pretty sure that Steam controls a vast majority of the *cross-platform* gaming market - especially when it comes to major titles. At any given moment, they have 4-5 million players online.


There are somewhere around 30-40 million people on XBox Live (subscribers, not necessarily all online at the moment).  If even a mere 1% were online at one point, that would drastically change those numbers... and the real numbers are probably more like 10-20%. PSN is lower, but not negligible.
Point is that while Steam's numbers are nothing to sneeze at, they shouldn't be used for industry wide extrapolation.


MrSteve007: Of course there's also Origin (with Diablo, StarCraft, etc), but other than that, I'm not sure if there's much in the way of cross platform games - unless you're talking about the "Hey, I'm playing a game while taking a poop market" e.g.. Angry Birds.


And just because you don't like a particular type of game doesn't mean it's not a real game. This "people who play [x] game aren't  real gamers" is just a No True Scotsman fallacy to artificially skew the numbers to what best support their conclusion. It's how they can ignore the fact that the average gamer overall, and the one who spends the most on video games, is a 35 year old woman.
 
2013-02-06 06:17:44 PM  

Slaves2Darkness: AdamK: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: moothemagiccow: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.

They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.

I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.  But people have been eager to call gloom-and-doom for Nintendo since the GameCube, so they'll seize on anything, including the new system being slightly less successful than Nintendo thought it would be.

The problem is that had the Wii U was up against the PS3 and 360 back in 2006, it would have kicked ass but now, everyone is saying Nintendo is playing catch up.

And the people who are saying doom and gloom to Nintendo are just Sony and 360 fans. The 3DS took awhile to pick up steam but it's selling like hotcakes now.

eh, Wii's situation is something that'll likely never be replicated... you had an extremely underpowered console, a unique forced control input that had latency/precision issues that would later come to bite them in the butt software wise (while not really being a sales hinderence), and an archaic online "feature"

Wii U has far more potential to stay relevant for years to come even if it's not as powerful as the others

The Wii U is just a gimick console.


a touchscreen is a gimmick?
 
2013-02-06 06:20:07 PM  
Welcome to the future.

I remember all the same whining and bellyaching when Steam came out.
 
2013-02-06 06:25:38 PM  

chuggernaught: [www.deviantart.com image 600x200]


I find that graphic hilarious ever since I bailed on my PS3 for a gaming rig.

What a difference.
 
2013-02-06 06:30:49 PM  

HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.




Reselling old disks won't drive content development or the technological infrastructure needed to keep new games coming.
Yes this is bad for the ma and pa stores, but we can probably find a better solution for preserving and distributing old content online than searching a bargain bin of rotting plastic.

The pricing model that exists is enforced by Walmart and the publishers. Its affected by things like piracy and the turnover rate of old disks at resellers.
Get them out of the mix and developers get more negotiating power with the consoles makers. They can adjust price points to be competitive or cash in on hot content.
It's the product that should drive this industry, not the brick and mortar stores.

/This is where we're going. No sense in stalling now.
 
2013-02-06 06:34:17 PM  

way south: HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.

Reselling old disks won't drive content development or the technological infrastructure needed to keep new games coming.
Yes this is bad for the ma and pa stor ...


You're so cute.  You think they're actually going to pass the savings on to the end user.
 
2013-02-06 06:34:19 PM  

Ed Finnerty: chuggernaught: [www.deviantart.com image 600x200]

I find that graphic hilarious ever since I bailed on my PS3 for a gaming rig.

What a difference.


I've stopped buying many games I want to because my roommate's computer sucks and I don't want to exclude him from various games because I bought them for PC.

/have a ps3 and 360 that are almost unused
 
2013-02-06 06:35:05 PM  
A Kotaku Report on an Edge report on some hearsay.

i1.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-02-06 06:37:57 PM  

HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.


Emulators and ROMs will always be around, I suspect that 20 years from now these new games would be cracked and should you get nostalgic you will still be able to play them even if they were supposed to be one pay one play.
 
2013-02-06 06:38:04 PM  

whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.


Add to this that if all three mysteriously and independently decide to block used games there will be a deluge of lawsuits faster than you can say "collusion and restraint of trade."
 
2013-02-06 06:38:23 PM  

Theaetetus: There are somewhere around 30-40 million people on XBox Live (subscribers, not necessarily all online at the moment). If even a mere 1% were online at one point, that would drastically change those numbers... and the real numbers are probably more like 10-20%. PSN is lower, but not negligible.
Point is that while Steam's numbers are nothing to sneeze at, they shouldn't be used for industry wide extrapolation.


According to the latest numbers, Steam has 50 million subscribers - which if you're comparing all the players (including console subscribers), that makes them the largest single outlet for non-portable gaming, and certainly the largest cross platform system; making them the best place to compare cross platform gaming.

Theaetetus: And just because you don't like a particular type of game doesn't mean it's not a real game. This "people who play [x] game aren't real gamers" is just a No True Scotsman fallacy to artificially skew the numbers to what best support their conclusion. It's how they can ignore the fact that the average gamer overall, and the one who spends the most on video games, is a 35 year old woman.


I agree, there's a lot of casual gamers who are blowing time on facebook, playing Farmville and the like. The difference is that they're not paying for their games and the companies are relying on advertising and in-game transactions to make money. Whereas when big title console or PC games launch, they typically bring in more money than most Hollywood blockbusters. About $1.5-$2 billion is spent each month on games in the US. It's a huge entertainment market.

Every once in a while, you get a big hit in the couple dollar mobile game (Angry Birds, or Bejeweled), but even then, those franchises have only grossed about $100 million apiece. When you think about Call of Duty, Battlefield, Gears of War, the Sims, Mario, Grand Theft Auto, or even Halo, you're talking about billion dollar franchises. 

Mobile gaming is certainly there, but in terms of money, they're small fries compared to consoles or PCs.
 
2013-02-06 06:40:20 PM  

Mugato: WalkingCarpet: Since Sony is unveiling the PS4 in a couple of weeks we'll know a lot more then.

Less than 2 months after Christmas? That's good thinking.


They won't actually be selling it till next christmas.
 
2013-02-06 06:41:13 PM  

HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.


for sure, gamestop is a gamestop issue not a "physical media" issue

it'd be like getting rid of movies on discs just to spite redbox... who cares?

at the end of the day, DD is good for those who like it, but if you don't like it then there should still be legitimate ways around it, no reason to force it on everybody just to spite one company
 
2013-02-06 07:04:29 PM  

MrSteve007: Theaetetus: There are somewhere around 30-40 million people on XBox Live (subscribers, not necessarily all online at the moment). If even a mere 1% were online at one point, that would drastically change those numbers... and the real numbers are probably more like 10-20%. PSN is lower, but not negligible.
Point is that while Steam's numbers are nothing to sneeze at, they shouldn't be used for industry wide extrapolation.

According to the latest numbers, Steam has 50 million subscribers - which if you're comparing all the players (including console subscribers), that makes them the largest single outlet for non-portable gaming, and certainly the largest cross platform system; making them the best place to compare cross platform gaming.


According to the latest numbers, PSN has 69 million users. Between that and XBL, they have double the numbers of Steam (blatantly ignoring the fact that there's huge overlap between all three).
Sorry, no - there is no single place to extrapolate numbers from, and it's unreasonable to do so when you've got explicit knowledge of numbers that aren't covered by your single source that are as big, if not bigger, than your source's numbers.

Theaetetus: And just because you don't like a particular type of game doesn't mean it's not a real game. This "people who play [x] game aren't real gamers" is just a No True Scotsman fallacy to artificially skew the numbers to what best support their conclusion. It's how they can ignore the fact that the average gamer overall, and the one who spends the most on video games, is a 35 year old woman.

I agree, there's a lot of casual gamers who are blowing time on facebook, playing Farmville and the like. The difference is that they're not paying for their games and the companies are relying on advertising and in-game transactions to make money.


:P

Whereas when big title console or PC games launch, they typically bring in more money than most Hollywood blockbusters. About $1.5-$2 billion is spent each month on games in the US. It's a huge entertainment market.

Every once in a while, you get a big hit in the couple dollar mobile game (Angry Birds, or Bejeweled), but even then, those franchises have only grossed about $100 million apiece. When you think about Call of Duty, Battlefield, Gears of War, the Sims, Mario, Grand Theft Auto, or even Halo, you're talking about billion dollar franchises.

Mobile gaming is certainly there, but in terms of money, they're small fries compared to consoles or PCs.


Ah, but in ROI, they're huge. All of those AAA titles  cost $100 million apiece. The mobile games are winning in terms of actual profit margins.
 
2013-02-06 07:06:04 PM  
I heard the next XBOX will kick your puppy and fark your significant other behind your back.  It's rumored to be infested with several dozen antibiotic resistant strains of STD and contagious diseases and automatically removes 20% of your balance from your checking account per week.  In addition, it contains a sensor that alerts the police any time it detects that you have a BAC above 0.08 or whenever there's any trace of illicit drugs.  It also poops in your shoes.
 
2013-02-06 07:08:21 PM  

Gonz: FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.

Nah. I mean, what's going to replace them? Computers? People are getting away from desktops and laptops, and moving to tablets. And while stuff like Angry Birds is entertaining, there will still be demand for large, immersive games.

On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.


Or, to put it yet another way, without competition from the used market, they can mark them up all they like. You can count on a company facing less competition to raise, not lower, their prices. $60 for a game -- are you f*cking kidding me?
 
2013-02-06 07:20:21 PM  

StubePT: Step 1: Create rumor that you'll kill used game sales.

Step 2a: Wait for Gamestop to panic.

Step 2b: Make a deal with Gamestop for a cut of all used game sales.

Step 3: Profit.


Yep, pretty much.
 
2013-02-06 07:22:13 PM  

MrHappyRotter: I heard the next XBOX will kick your puppy and fark your significant other behind your back.  It's rumored to be infested with several dozen antibiotic resistant strains of STD and contagious diseases and automatically removes 20% of your balance from your checking account per week.  In addition, it contains a sensor that alerts the police any time it detects that you have a BAC above 0.08 or whenever there's any trace of illicit drugs.  It also poops in your shoes.


Why are describing my ex-wife?
 
2013-02-06 07:23:45 PM  
Why all the gamestop hate? Sure, the central office can be dicks, but sometimes the employees are damn good. The ones at my local shop are pretty friggen helpful, knowledgeable, and friendly to talk with-I have even seen them steer people away from crap games/games that they would likely not enjoy.

/I realize this is probably the exception to the rule.
 
2013-02-06 07:26:34 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


I highly doubt Nintendo will:
a. The Wii U just came out.
b. Nintendo is the one company with good business practices in the console market. They refused to release a WiiHD as they were uncomfortable with releasing a 'new' console just for graphical updates. They also announced they are expanding their development window for increased game quality, while many publishers have been shrinking them to fit with annual releases.

$ony on the other hand can be just as bad as M$. I hate the idea, and I imagine the sales of the consoles and the games will suffer.
 
2013-02-06 07:29:56 PM  

Theaetetus: Ah, but in ROI, they're huge. All of those AAA titles cost $100 million apiece. The mobile games are winning in terms of actual profit margins.


Ha, so now you're down to arguing margins? As a business owner, what would you rather have?

The largest mobile title: Angry birds, which cost $140k to make and netted some $70 million over a couple years of sales. Link

Indeed, it has a major 500 to 1 margin - which sounds mighty.

Or.

One of the largest console/PC titles - Call of Duty: MW 3 - costing ~$100 million to program, and then makes $1-billion of sales in two weeks? Link

Darn, I COD's 10-1 sales margin is nothing against Angry Bird's 500 to 1. Never mind they netted $900 million more than Angry Birds,  in only half a month. Face it: mobile gaming's revenues is a fraction of that of PC/Console. Sure, margins can be impressive - but total profit isn't even close.
 
2013-02-06 07:35:21 PM  

Theaetetus: According to the latest numbers, PSN has 69 million users. Between that and XBL, they have double the numbers of Steam (blatantly ignoring the fact that there's huge overlap between all three).


Remember that PSN users also include PSP and the Vita - so you have a lot of portable overlap.
 
2013-02-06 07:37:10 PM  
Welcome to PC gaming?
 
2013-02-06 07:38:36 PM  

RoxtarRyan: Big_Fat_Liar: What drives me away from Steam is not being able to play games I already bought.

The only issue I've had like that with Steam was with the original Dragon Age. Bought it on Steam, the package with all the DLC, and there was an issue about 30 hours in where the DLC wasn't able to "phone home", causing all my game saves afterward to pretty much be corrupt. By the time I realized what happened, I logged another 50 hours in. Steam pointed their fingers at Bioware as the publisher, Bioware pointed fingers at Steam as the distributor, and nothing was done to fix it at all.

Odd, since my pirated copy with all the DLC worked just fine. Funny, since I pirated it first, but liked it so much I paid for it, only to have it not work.


No good deed goes unpunished. I bought some lazy console ports sequels that I had been excited about on Steam only to find out that I can't re-map the controls. That sh*t is f*cking infuriating. If I wanted to play it on a console, I would have bought it for one. The notion that it takes (usually multiple) patches to add something that seems to be little more than an afterthought for the developers.

Bought Darksiders II, and the controls are worthless. Pirated a couple of others to test only to find that the controls were similarly worthless. I foolishly thought that the updated version of DS II would have the control issues patched.

I have learned to pirate a game like that to test before actually buying it.
 
rpm
2013-02-06 07:40:14 PM  

yukichigai: Add to this that if all three mysteriously and independently decide to block used games there will be a deluge of lawsuits faster than you can say "collusion and restraint of trade."


No class action ones though, those are all banned in the TOS.
 
2013-02-06 07:40:28 PM  
Yet you idiots will still pay far out the ass for the new Xbox and its DRM incrusted games regardless. I guarantee it. That's the only reason manufacturers can keep pulling shiat like this. Stop giving them your money and they'll stop being shiatty.
 
2013-02-06 07:40:39 PM  

MrSteve007: Ha, so now you're down to arguing margins? As a business owner, what would you rather have?


Margins, by far, because let's be honest - we're not the business owners, but business  investors. You forget, there's Angry Birds, Angry Birds:Space, Angry Birds: Star Wars, Angry Birds: Rio, etc., and new versions can be cranked out in a month or two. I'd rather have a 50000% rate of return on my investment, with my capital only "tied up" for a few weeks, giving it an annual rate of return that's simply astronomical, than have a 1000% rate of return on an investment that takes several years to develop, giving it an annual rate of return of far less.
 
hej [TotalFark]
2013-02-06 07:42:40 PM  
The new Xbox will lock games to one system, says Sony's PR firm.
 
2013-02-06 07:45:38 PM  
Why is this rumor being posted/treated as truth? Just to give people an excuse to bash Microsoft, and praise that wonderful Mom & Pop company called Sony?
 
2013-02-06 07:48:53 PM  

GreenAdder: BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.

Yeah. And buy nothing but brand-new cars from now on. Think of all those people in the manufacturing sector who miss out every year because those cheap jerks bought used cars. Let's not forget all the architects put out of work by people buying pre-owned houses. And I don't even want to get into how much I hate it when people lend each other books.

You know what really honked me off? I wound up at this place called a "pawn shop," and it was full of used stuff. Clothes, electronics, guitars, movies...  I kept thinking to myself, "you cheap jerks! Gibson isn't making any money from the sale of that guitar!"


Not to mention, what kind of society do we live in where we should throw shiat away just because we've grown bored of it?

Second hand markets help keep shiat from being wasted.
 
2013-02-06 07:49:03 PM  

The Larch: BumpInTheNight: mcreadyblue: moothemagiccow: ha-ha-guy: Never happen.  Valve would (and likely is going to) just drop a gaming console based on *nix with commodity hardware and dominate the market.

Since when do people make games for Linux?

Linux pretty much is a game.

It does often remind me of Myst, that's for sure.

At least I could get the sound to work in Myst


Are you telling me that the next step of learning Linux is one of those damn sound puzzles??
 
2013-02-06 07:50:07 PM  

andyofne: GreenAdder: BumpInTheNight: Anything that kills the used games market is good to me.  Pay the developers you cheap jerks, and if you don't want to pay full price then wait for it to go on sale.

Yeah. And buy nothing but brand-new cars from now on. Think of all those people in the manufacturing sector who miss out every year because those cheap jerks bought used cars. Let's not forget all the architects put out of work by people buying pre-owned houses. And I don't even want to get into how much I hate it when people lend each other books.

You know what really honked me off? I wound up at this place called a "pawn shop," and it was full of used stuff. Clothes, electronics, guitars, movies...  I kept thinking to myself, "you cheap jerks! Gibson isn't making any money from the sale of that guitar!"

Not to mention, what kind of society do we live in where we should throw shiat away just because we've grown bored of it?

Second hand markets help keep shiat from being wasted.


slurmed.com
 
2013-02-06 07:51:14 PM  

crab66: Welcome to PC gaming?


I dunno. I think it was Far Cry 2 that offered a way to deregister a game from your computer so you could transfer it to someone else. Which was epically handy because that game sucked ass so bad.
 
2013-02-06 07:51:54 PM  

miniflea: ladyfortuna


Combination of Clist, facebook groups (seriously), and classified ads mostly. Also I used to work at EBGamestop back in the day and hoarded a bunch of marketing materials, which apparently people like and want to buy from me now. That's the other reason I'll probably get out at some point, most of that stuff is usually worth more than 'ten copies of crappy sports games from your closet' but there's a finite supply.
 
2013-02-06 07:55:14 PM  

YodaBlues: StubePT: Step 1: Create rumor that you'll kill used game sales.

Step 2a: Wait for Gamestop to panic.

Step 2b: Make a deal with Gamestop for a cut of all used game sales.

Step 3: Profit.

Yep, pretty much.


If game shops had agreed a 10% markup on pre-owned games and fed that to the houses 15 years ago shat wouldn't be remotely this bad. Those 9 billion FIFA pre-owneds currently in shops might have actually been worth the media they were printed on. For a little longer.

/EA Take note
 
2013-02-06 07:55:56 PM  
I've been saying for nearly a year-and-a-half that console video games are screwed.  Welcome to the dying throes of a format which is hemorrhaging customers and whose only recourse is "make the existing audience pay more money for the same stuff."  But please, continue to convince yourselves the underwhelming 3DS, Vita, and Wii U numbers aren't consistent with a market that no longer wants to pay hundreds of dollars to adopt a video game platform, a market where people can play games on their phone or computer for free.

way south: I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.


Used video game sales and retail have been a part of American video games since the late eighties.  Video game companies realized they had no recourse for the American first-sale doctrine, and to some degree endorsed resale, because the sale of those old games got money into the hands of consumers, allowing them to buy new games.  The video game industry only started caring when 1) GameStop centralized American video game retail about an extremely margin-heavy take on used games, and 2) both the economy and the exodus of the Wii boomers left all these companies scraping for money that doesn't exist anymore.
 
2013-02-06 07:56:50 PM  
Sony and Microsoft will get hammered if they take this path.

I am surprised nobody has mentioned the recent ruling in Euroland that requires digital purchases to be transferable. I'm sure there is nothing that the EU courts would like to do more than fine Sony and MS a few billion dollars and THEN make them patch their hardware to allow consumers to transfer ownership.
 
2013-02-06 07:57:34 PM  

sephjnr: YodaBlues: StubePT: Step 1: Create rumor that you'll kill used game sales.

Step 2a: Wait for Gamestop to panic.

Step 2b: Make a deal with Gamestop for a cut of all used game sales.

Step 3: Profit.

Yep, pretty much.

If game shops had agreed a 10% markup on pre-owned games and fed that to the houses 15 years ago shat wouldn't be remotely this bad. Those 9 billion FIFA pre-owneds currently in shops might have actually been worth the media they were printed on. For a little longer.

/EA Take note


Sports games seem to be one of the biggest rackets in video gaming. Every year, people line up like Alzheimer's patients and drop $60 on the same damn game so they can have the updated players names and faces.

Then again, the last sports game I actively played was Lakers v Celtics on my Sega Genesis.
 
2013-02-06 07:58:22 PM  
3.bp.blogspot.com

The Ouya might actually have a chance to kick MS and Sony's ass, after all.

For those who don't know, it's an Android-based console that is mostly open, meaning anyone can develop for it without an expensive dev kit, as long as they honor the requirement of the game having some "free to play" features.

And don't let the fact that it's Android-based make you think it's all tablet games or mobile games. There are some nice titles being developed. Of course, with an open platform you're going to get a lot of crap, too, but I think the cream will float to the top.

The Ouya's only $99, and I suspect it will be more of a challenger than the big boys think.
 
2013-02-06 07:59:27 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


Yes, but SMB 3 didn't have on-cartridge content that you had to pay between $5 to $20 to unlock, or require a continuous internet connection to play, or have ridiculous DRM, or require a patch every other week.

BTW - You paid $75 for SMB 3? You go ripped off. I got it for $55. The last time I paid $75 for a game was EarthBound, and it came in a large box with an awesome strategy guide.
 
2013-02-06 07:59:36 PM  

madgonad: Sony and Microsoft will get hammered if they take this path.

I am surprised nobody has mentioned the recent ruling in Euroland that requires digital purchases to be transferable. I'm sure there is nothing that the EU courts would like to do more than fine Sony and MS a few billion dollars and THEN make them patch their hardware to allow consumers to transfer ownership.


There should be some sort of a transferable ownership, but the video game companies would never allow it.
 
2013-02-06 08:01:54 PM  

Felgraf: Why all the gamestop hate? Sure, the central office can be dicks, but sometimes the employees are damn good. The ones at my local shop are pretty friggen helpful, knowledgeable, and friendly to talk with-I have even seen them steer people away from crap games/games that they would likely not enjoy.

/I realize this is probably the exception to the rule.


My typical experience involves being told that I need to pre-order some game in a genre totally opposite from whatever I am buying. And getting 5 bucks off the full price of the game because it's used. Screw that.
 
2013-02-06 08:04:07 PM  
Glad I'm a PC gamer!
 
2013-02-06 08:10:57 PM  

grimlock1972: Well looks like i won't be buying the next gen Xbox then nor Sony's offering if they stick with this cockamamie idea.  Nintendo will never go for this so they will poised to take advantage if Sony and Microsoft shoot themselves in the foot.

Steam is great if you have a fast enough internet service to take advantage of it , i for one do not.


Which explains why Nintendo is taking over the market right now and destroying the competition.

Oh wait - no they are not - their brand new console is being buried by 10 year old boxes from Microsoft and Sony and there overall market share is dropping by the hour.

/this is the future dude - get over it
 
2013-02-06 08:12:42 PM  

Fano: Felgraf: Why all the gamestop hate? Sure, the central office can be dicks, but sometimes the employees are damn good. The ones at my local shop are pretty friggen helpful, knowledgeable, and friendly to talk with-I have even seen them steer people away from crap games/games that they would likely not enjoy.

/I realize this is probably the exception to the rule.

My typical experience involves being told that I need to pre-order some game in a genre totally opposite from whatever I am buying. And getting 5 bucks off the full price of the game because it's used. Screw that.


I'm on friendly terms with the manager and one or two other guys at the local one, but one of the other employees treated me like a know-nothing customer after I asked a normal question, most likely due to being female. Neither of the guys I know were there at the time or he'd probably have gotten an earful. I don't go in all that often but when I do I tend to drop a couple hundred, mostly on stuff for resale. The manager knows that since he has to do the tax-free form, but he's cool with it since they're still making their cut. The other guy actually told me outright that he barely plays games anymore and most of the employees just read their magazine and regurgitate the info to customers.

I think the overall attitude of the district managers has a lot of influence on how the stores run, honestly. Back when I worked at one, the DM had trained almost all the current store managers as entry level sales associates and he himself was a store manager. I'm pretty sure that's why those five years started out amazing and slowly started to suck, since the company went public at the same time.