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(Kotaku)   The next Xbox will require an internet connection to use and will not play second-hand games as new games will ship with a one-time activation code   (kotaku.com) divider line 392
    More: Fail, Xbox, second-hand, license key, internet access, Durango, connectedness  
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8842 clicks; posted to Geek » on 06 Feb 2013 at 3:30 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-02-06 05:37:48 PM  
Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.
 
Xai
2013-02-06 05:38:44 PM  
Always been a big supporter of xbox, but if they expect me to pay full price to play rubbish games rather than buy them for £2.50 second hand then I have to say;

I will not buy the new xbox if it has this kind of DRM protection.
 
2013-02-06 05:38:50 PM  

Weaver95: Some 'Splainin' To Do: Weaver95: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

which means there's going to be a massive resurgence in computer gaming as consoles die a slow, strangled death.

I think that you are vastly overestimating the amount of consumer outrage that would actually happen.

I think that it can be hard for people in the tech-savvy Fark demographic to fully appreciate the absence of give-a-farks that the average person feels about these kinds of schemes.

you're right.  gamers would NEVER be outraged over changes like this.  Because gamers, as we all know, are a calm and reasonable sort of personality type who understand business realities and won't complain about any reasonable comment made by the industry corporate execs.

/sarcasm.

Have you ever SEEN a gamer forum before!?


First of all, I appreciate the sarcasm tag. I certainly would never had been able to tell you were being sarcastic, otherwise, so thanks! In like manner, I appreciate you capitalizing the important words in your post. I can't imagine how I would have been able to understand your point without that valuable emphasis. If only more posters were as calm and helpful as you, this would be a better Fark.

As to your point, yes, gamers are a reactive bunch who can get up in arms about a great many things. However, I would caution you to bear in mind that the sorts of people who post to forums are precisely the sort who are either  really engaged with the product or who are just the kind of person who likes to biatch about things in public. But that doesn't necessarily reflect the full fan base.

By analogy, It's much like how there are dedicate comic fans as well as casual movie goers. Both groups will see the Avengers, but it's only the former that's prone to be angry because such-and-such a characterization didn't match up with the comic. It's that group that will flood the forums with "Whedon suxx because they totes got Banner wrongggggg!!!"

The point that I'm making is that the consumer market for games is a whole lot bigger than the subset of people who care deeply about internet connectivity requirements and DRM.  You, Weaver, are a very specific sort of game player. You are a dedicated gamer. It doesn't really surprise me, for instance, that you are a PC gamer because that's exactly the market that most appeals to the hardcore.

I suspect that you kind of dislike consoles on general principle because they dumb-down games and are, therefore, looking for signs that something bad will be happening to the console market.  I am simply trying to caution you that your own perspective is skewed by the very fact that you are a serious gamer and that you are, therefore, filtering this news though a very specific point of view.
 
2013-02-06 05:39:38 PM  

MrSteve007: HeartBurnKid: You mean the OS that comes pre-installed on every new PC sold is beating the OS that hasn't been sold in 3-4 years in a segment that is mostly focused on newer, high-end systems? No shiat, Sherlock.

Oh, how quickly the talking points change. Before it was: "Windows 8 isn't selling, it's a flop." MS then announces that it's selling as well as Win 7 did. The next excuse was "Those aren't real sales to consumers, it's just a bunch of licenses and boxes sitting on shelves." Then came "Well, it's selling on new systems, but people are wiping and installing Windows 7 instead!" excuse. And now we have "It's pre-installed on every new PC sold!" excuse.

So you're telling me that Windows 8 became 8% of the total computer gaming market in *3-months* purely because it's sold on new computers. Lol.


It's a Windows vs Windows flame war in a twisted panty fight to the death!
 
2013-02-06 05:40:33 PM  

Surool: MrSteve007: /Oh, that's cute, OSX almost has 3% and Linux is up to nearly 1% of gamers these days. Sounds about right.

That is right. under 4% of gamers use those OSs for gaming. They either (A) Play Angry Birds-style games on tablets, or (B) have a game console. It has been that way since those OSs were invented, so I highly doubt the users give a f*ck about it. The ones that do dual boot their machines with a copy of Windows, so those figures aren't going to ever change for any reason.


... or maybe you're trying to look at a number on one service and extrapolate from there to all services. You know, 100% of users of the MacGameStore are on OSX. By your logic, no gamers use Windows.

Don't get me wrong, a large portion of gamers are on Windows, but another large portion are on Macs or on consoles. Using only one data source that misses those groups just results in invalid conclusions.
 
2013-02-06 05:40:53 PM  
img839.imageshack.us

Weaver95: Have you ever SEEN a gamer forum before!?


I think you are correct about console games taking it in the neck with the sort of restrictions and "improvements" the article is proposing. The average age of a video gamer is 37. If they wanted to jump around while playing a video game they would already own a Wii. Kinect technology is Microsoft's following an already saturated market. As far as one user only games, they are just begging to be hacked and defeated.
 
2013-02-06 05:41:01 PM  
I haven't read this thread but what if your X-Box craps out (as they are known to do) or it's stolen and you have to get another one? How do you play the games you own?
 
2013-02-06 05:41:31 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


And you must have missed back when new games cost only $40,  $50 max.
 
2013-02-06 05:42:50 PM  
Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.
 
2013-02-06 05:45:44 PM  
I'm late to the party but GO PCs! Throw money at Star Citizen (wing commander/freelancer descendent, by the same creator)
 
2013-02-06 05:46:34 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


It was $50 unless you bought a new NES system (when it came with the NES). You got boned.
 
2013-02-06 05:46:48 PM  
Not surprising. Might as well get rid of the disks altogether and sell them 100% via download. Tiered pricing for quality, release date, etc.
Big bad news for Gamestop
 
2013-02-06 05:46:50 PM  
Well, should they do this, I won't be buying.

/Then again I dont think they would be marketing to a thirty-something part time gamer anyway.  The kids are who all this gets marketed to anyway.  Their parents by extension will buy it for them and like it.
 
2013-02-06 05:46:52 PM  

Mugato: I haven't read this thread but what if your X-Box craps out (as they are known to do) or it's stolen and you have to get another one? How do you play the games you own?


Probably the same thing that happens now, your games are tied to your gamertag, not the hardware.
 
2013-02-06 05:51:45 PM  

Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.


Except that it actually cost $45.

And if they do implement this game prices will absolutely NOT come down.  Not even $5.
 
2013-02-06 05:56:38 PM  

lewismarktwo: Myria: Those who complain about the price of AAA games today must not have been around when Super Mario Bros. 3 came out for $75.

Except that it actually cost $45.

And if they do implement this game prices will absolutely NOT come down.  Not even $5.


Actually, after looking at a couple sources, right in the middle at $55 or so. However, there were many games that did retail for $60 or $70.
 
2013-02-06 05:57:13 PM  

MrSteve007: HeartBurnKid: You mean the OS that comes pre-installed on every new PC sold is beating the OS that hasn't been sold in 3-4 years in a segment that is mostly focused on newer, high-end systems? No shiat, Sherlock.

Oh, how quickly the talking points change. Before it was: "Windows 8 isn't selling, it's a flop." MS then announces that it's selling as well as Win 7 did. The next excuse was "Those aren't real sales to consumers, it's just a bunch of licenses and boxes sitting on shelves." Then came "Well, it's selling on new systems, but people are wiping and installing Windows 7 instead!" excuse. And now we have "It's pre-installed on every new PC sold!" excuse.

So you're telling me that Windows 8 became 8% of the total computer gaming market in *3-months* purely because it's sold on new computers. Lol.


Ummm... yes.  I do believe that gamers, who in general churn through systems faster than the general public, have adopted Windows 8 in far greater numbers than the general public largely because it's sold on new systems.  That is exactly what I'm telling you.  And I don't recall saying any of those other things, but I suppose next you'll accuse me of being a sockpuppet or a paid shill or a Mac fanboy or whatever for stating the obvious.
 
2013-02-06 06:00:57 PM  
Well looks like i won't be buying the next gen Xbox then nor Sony's offering if they stick with this cockamamie idea.  Nintendo will never go for this so they will poised to take advantage if Sony and Microsoft shoot themselves in the foot.

Steam is great if you have a fast enough internet service to take advantage of it , i for one do not.
 
2013-02-06 06:02:04 PM  

PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.





Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?
 
2013-02-06 06:02:46 PM  

Theaetetus: ... or maybe you're trying to look at a number on one service and extrapolate from there to all services. You know, 100% of users of the MacGameStore are on OSX. By your logic, no gamers use Windows.

Don't get me wrong, a large portion of gamers are on Windows, but another large portion are on Macs or on consoles. Using only one data source that misses those groups just results in invalid conclusions.


I'm pretty sure that Steam controls a vast majority of the *cross-platform* gaming market - especially when it comes to major titles. At any given moment, they have 4-5 million players online. That's a pretty solid sampling size. They're the best place to start when attempting to look at what's out there in terms of demographics. Is it perfect? No, but it's the biggest cross-platform player out there. Of course there's also Origin (with Diablo, StarCraft, etc), but other than that, I'm not sure if there's much in the way of cross platform games - unless you're talking about the "Hey, I'm playing a game while taking a poop market" e.g.. Angry Birds.
 
2013-02-06 06:06:53 PM  
Video games are like prostitution:

If I pay for it.. I want to touch it, insert it, and play around until I've been satisfied.
 
2013-02-06 06:08:59 PM  
If this bears truth, then begun, the Second North American Video Game Crash has.
 
2013-02-06 06:10:48 PM  

way south: I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.


The physical media can often be found cheaper than direct download. I'd really rather have bought Fallout 3 and NV through Xbox live, as I wouldn't have to dick around with finding where my dipshiat wife hid the disc when she watched the Care Bears movie. While they were $50 and $60 to download, they were $20 at Walmart.
 
2013-02-06 06:13:26 PM  

way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?


Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.
 
2013-02-06 06:13:39 PM  

TiiiMMMaHHH: Video games are like prostitution:

If I pay for it.. I want to touch it, insert it, and play around until I've been satisfied.


I've always thought with the price of some SNES games, they should be blowing me.
 
2013-02-06 06:15:38 PM  
www.deviantart.com
 
2013-02-06 06:16:48 PM  

MrSteve007: I'm pretty sure that Steam controls a vast majority of the *cross-platform* gaming market - especially when it comes to major titles. At any given moment, they have 4-5 million players online.


There are somewhere around 30-40 million people on XBox Live (subscribers, not necessarily all online at the moment).  If even a mere 1% were online at one point, that would drastically change those numbers... and the real numbers are probably more like 10-20%. PSN is lower, but not negligible.
Point is that while Steam's numbers are nothing to sneeze at, they shouldn't be used for industry wide extrapolation.


MrSteve007: Of course there's also Origin (with Diablo, StarCraft, etc), but other than that, I'm not sure if there's much in the way of cross platform games - unless you're talking about the "Hey, I'm playing a game while taking a poop market" e.g.. Angry Birds.


And just because you don't like a particular type of game doesn't mean it's not a real game. This "people who play [x] game aren't  real gamers" is just a No True Scotsman fallacy to artificially skew the numbers to what best support their conclusion. It's how they can ignore the fact that the average gamer overall, and the one who spends the most on video games, is a 35 year old woman.
 
2013-02-06 06:17:44 PM  

Slaves2Darkness: AdamK: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: moothemagiccow: eddievercetti: HeartBurnKid: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Nintendo's system is already out.  They didn't.

It's failing...kinda.

They've sold 3 million worldwide. It's a failure because you can walk into a store and buy it? Whoever was expecting  to replicate the Wii's success is a dumbass, including anyone at nintendo.

I actually saw a side-by-side comparison that showed it's actually sold more than the 360 did at this point in its life-cycle.  But people have been eager to call gloom-and-doom for Nintendo since the GameCube, so they'll seize on anything, including the new system being slightly less successful than Nintendo thought it would be.

The problem is that had the Wii U was up against the PS3 and 360 back in 2006, it would have kicked ass but now, everyone is saying Nintendo is playing catch up.

And the people who are saying doom and gloom to Nintendo are just Sony and 360 fans. The 3DS took awhile to pick up steam but it's selling like hotcakes now.

eh, Wii's situation is something that'll likely never be replicated... you had an extremely underpowered console, a unique forced control input that had latency/precision issues that would later come to bite them in the butt software wise (while not really being a sales hinderence), and an archaic online "feature"

Wii U has far more potential to stay relevant for years to come even if it's not as powerful as the others

The Wii U is just a gimick console.


a touchscreen is a gimmick?
 
2013-02-06 06:20:07 PM  
Welcome to the future.

I remember all the same whining and bellyaching when Steam came out.
 
2013-02-06 06:25:38 PM  

chuggernaught: [www.deviantart.com image 600x200]


I find that graphic hilarious ever since I bailed on my PS3 for a gaming rig.

What a difference.
 
2013-02-06 06:30:49 PM  

HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.




Reselling old disks won't drive content development or the technological infrastructure needed to keep new games coming.
Yes this is bad for the ma and pa stores, but we can probably find a better solution for preserving and distributing old content online than searching a bargain bin of rotting plastic.

The pricing model that exists is enforced by Walmart and the publishers. Its affected by things like piracy and the turnover rate of old disks at resellers.
Get them out of the mix and developers get more negotiating power with the consoles makers. They can adjust price points to be competitive or cash in on hot content.
It's the product that should drive this industry, not the brick and mortar stores.

/This is where we're going. No sense in stalling now.
 
2013-02-06 06:34:17 PM  

way south: HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.

Reselling old disks won't drive content development or the technological infrastructure needed to keep new games coming.
Yes this is bad for the ma and pa stor ...


You're so cute.  You think they're actually going to pass the savings on to the end user.
 
2013-02-06 06:34:19 PM  

Ed Finnerty: chuggernaught: [www.deviantart.com image 600x200]

I find that graphic hilarious ever since I bailed on my PS3 for a gaming rig.

What a difference.


I've stopped buying many games I want to because my roommate's computer sucks and I don't want to exclude him from various games because I bought them for PC.

/have a ps3 and 360 that are almost unused
 
2013-02-06 06:35:05 PM  
A Kotaku Report on an Edge report on some hearsay.

i1.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-02-06 06:37:57 PM  

HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.


Emulators and ROMs will always be around, I suspect that 20 years from now these new games would be cracked and should you get nostalgic you will still be able to play them even if they were supposed to be one pay one play.
 
2013-02-06 06:38:04 PM  

whistleridge: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Yeah,,,not going to happen. Unlike a website paywall, which requires only a small investment and still doesn't pay off very well, this is a HUGE investment. And all the other guy has to do to kill you is say 'hey...no paywall'. End of game, right there.

No way this happens.


Add to this that if all three mysteriously and independently decide to block used games there will be a deluge of lawsuits faster than you can say "collusion and restraint of trade."
 
2013-02-06 06:38:23 PM  

Theaetetus: There are somewhere around 30-40 million people on XBox Live (subscribers, not necessarily all online at the moment). If even a mere 1% were online at one point, that would drastically change those numbers... and the real numbers are probably more like 10-20%. PSN is lower, but not negligible.
Point is that while Steam's numbers are nothing to sneeze at, they shouldn't be used for industry wide extrapolation.


According to the latest numbers, Steam has 50 million subscribers - which if you're comparing all the players (including console subscribers), that makes them the largest single outlet for non-portable gaming, and certainly the largest cross platform system; making them the best place to compare cross platform gaming.

Theaetetus: And just because you don't like a particular type of game doesn't mean it's not a real game. This "people who play [x] game aren't real gamers" is just a No True Scotsman fallacy to artificially skew the numbers to what best support their conclusion. It's how they can ignore the fact that the average gamer overall, and the one who spends the most on video games, is a 35 year old woman.


I agree, there's a lot of casual gamers who are blowing time on facebook, playing Farmville and the like. The difference is that they're not paying for their games and the companies are relying on advertising and in-game transactions to make money. Whereas when big title console or PC games launch, they typically bring in more money than most Hollywood blockbusters. About $1.5-$2 billion is spent each month on games in the US. It's a huge entertainment market.

Every once in a while, you get a big hit in the couple dollar mobile game (Angry Birds, or Bejeweled), but even then, those franchises have only grossed about $100 million apiece. When you think about Call of Duty, Battlefield, Gears of War, the Sims, Mario, Grand Theft Auto, or even Halo, you're talking about billion dollar franchises. 

Mobile gaming is certainly there, but in terms of money, they're small fries compared to consoles or PCs.
 
2013-02-06 06:40:20 PM  

Mugato: WalkingCarpet: Since Sony is unveiling the PS4 in a couple of weeks we'll know a lot more then.

Less than 2 months after Christmas? That's good thinking.


They won't actually be selling it till next christmas.
 
2013-02-06 06:41:13 PM  

HeartBurnKid: way south: PsyLord: Am I the only person that thinks that subby confused the next xbox with the PS4?
*reads the article*
Sonuva... whoever implements this will the the company that I will boycott.

Meh, I don't see why anyone should bother.

I mean, fark gamestop. They ripoff gamers to milk money from the industry while producing nothing. The next entity that needs to be farked over is walmart, and then the publishers themselves. They encourage physical media and exert arbitrary design influence because gamers are too stupid to download product strait from the developers.

Screw the lot of them.
Buy strait from the console maker, buy it online, and maybe (just maybe) they'll get the hint that these three groups of leeches need to die.

We live in an age where you can get content strait from the mouth of its creator with very few middlemen. Why should I boycott the future to preserve the lifestyle of the most middlest men in the industry?

Because you don't want to cut off your nose to spite your face?

No used sales means no Gamestop, sure.  It also means no mom-and-pop shops, no selling your old games on eBay, and no trading games with your friends.  Depending on how it's handled, it may even mean no bringing your games to your friend's house (unless you bring your console too).  It also means that every game will be an ultimately transient medium, impossible to preserve for future generations.  It means no finding a game in a thrift store 10-20 years down the road, saying, "Say, I always wanted to try this," then taking it home, going up in the attic, blowing the dust off your Xbox 720, and having a grand old time.  It means that every cultural touchstone that we have as gamers disappears like dust in the wind as the games get discontinued.

But hey, Gamestop gets screwed.  So there's that.


for sure, gamestop is a gamestop issue not a "physical media" issue

it'd be like getting rid of movies on discs just to spite redbox... who cares?

at the end of the day, DD is good for those who like it, but if you don't like it then there should still be legitimate ways around it, no reason to force it on everybody just to spite one company
 
2013-02-06 07:04:29 PM  

MrSteve007: Theaetetus: There are somewhere around 30-40 million people on XBox Live (subscribers, not necessarily all online at the moment). If even a mere 1% were online at one point, that would drastically change those numbers... and the real numbers are probably more like 10-20%. PSN is lower, but not negligible.
Point is that while Steam's numbers are nothing to sneeze at, they shouldn't be used for industry wide extrapolation.

According to the latest numbers, Steam has 50 million subscribers - which if you're comparing all the players (including console subscribers), that makes them the largest single outlet for non-portable gaming, and certainly the largest cross platform system; making them the best place to compare cross platform gaming.


According to the latest numbers, PSN has 69 million users. Between that and XBL, they have double the numbers of Steam (blatantly ignoring the fact that there's huge overlap between all three).
Sorry, no - there is no single place to extrapolate numbers from, and it's unreasonable to do so when you've got explicit knowledge of numbers that aren't covered by your single source that are as big, if not bigger, than your source's numbers.

Theaetetus: And just because you don't like a particular type of game doesn't mean it's not a real game. This "people who play [x] game aren't real gamers" is just a No True Scotsman fallacy to artificially skew the numbers to what best support their conclusion. It's how they can ignore the fact that the average gamer overall, and the one who spends the most on video games, is a 35 year old woman.

I agree, there's a lot of casual gamers who are blowing time on facebook, playing Farmville and the like. The difference is that they're not paying for their games and the companies are relying on advertising and in-game transactions to make money.


:P

Whereas when big title console or PC games launch, they typically bring in more money than most Hollywood blockbusters. About $1.5-$2 billion is spent each month on games in the US. It's a huge entertainment market.

Every once in a while, you get a big hit in the couple dollar mobile game (Angry Birds, or Bejeweled), but even then, those franchises have only grossed about $100 million apiece. When you think about Call of Duty, Battlefield, Gears of War, the Sims, Mario, Grand Theft Auto, or even Halo, you're talking about billion dollar franchises.


Mobile gaming is certainly there, but in terms of money, they're small fries compared to consoles or PCs.

Ah, but in ROI, they're huge. All of those AAA titles  cost $100 million apiece. The mobile games are winning in terms of actual profit margins.
 
2013-02-06 07:06:04 PM  
I heard the next XBOX will kick your puppy and fark your significant other behind your back.  It's rumored to be infested with several dozen antibiotic resistant strains of STD and contagious diseases and automatically removes 20% of your balance from your checking account per week.  In addition, it contains a sensor that alerts the police any time it detects that you have a BAC above 0.08 or whenever there's any trace of illicit drugs.  It also poops in your shoes.
 
2013-02-06 07:08:21 PM  

Gonz: FirstNationalBastard: GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.

Okay, then platform gaming consoles will fail.

Either way.

Nah. I mean, what's going to replace them? Computers? People are getting away from desktops and laptops, and moving to tablets. And while stuff like Angry Birds is entertaining, there will still be demand for large, immersive games.

On the bright side, without the possibility of a used-game market, the initial cost of new games should drop, since software companies don't have to account for lost revenue from purchases on the second-hand market.

Or, to put it another way: you'll get over it.


Or, to put it yet another way, without competition from the used market, they can mark them up all they like. You can count on a company facing less competition to raise, not lower, their prices. $60 for a game -- are you f*cking kidding me?
 
2013-02-06 07:20:21 PM  

StubePT: Step 1: Create rumor that you'll kill used game sales.

Step 2a: Wait for Gamestop to panic.

Step 2b: Make a deal with Gamestop for a cut of all used game sales.

Step 3: Profit.


Yep, pretty much.
 
2013-02-06 07:22:13 PM  

MrHappyRotter: I heard the next XBOX will kick your puppy and fark your significant other behind your back.  It's rumored to be infested with several dozen antibiotic resistant strains of STD and contagious diseases and automatically removes 20% of your balance from your checking account per week.  In addition, it contains a sensor that alerts the police any time it detects that you have a BAC above 0.08 or whenever there's any trace of illicit drugs.  It also poops in your shoes.


Why are describing my ex-wife?
 
2013-02-06 07:23:45 PM  
Why all the gamestop hate? Sure, the central office can be dicks, but sometimes the employees are damn good. The ones at my local shop are pretty friggen helpful, knowledgeable, and friendly to talk with-I have even seen them steer people away from crap games/games that they would likely not enjoy.

/I realize this is probably the exception to the rule.
 
2013-02-06 07:26:34 PM  

GAT_00: FirstNationalBastard: The new X-Box will fail.

Not when Sony does the same thing.  Nintendo probably will too.


I highly doubt Nintendo will:
a. The Wii U just came out.
b. Nintendo is the one company with good business practices in the console market. They refused to release a WiiHD as they were uncomfortable with releasing a 'new' console just for graphical updates. They also announced they are expanding their development window for increased game quality, while many publishers have been shrinking them to fit with annual releases.

$ony on the other hand can be just as bad as M$. I hate the idea, and I imagine the sales of the consoles and the games will suffer.
 
2013-02-06 07:29:56 PM  

Theaetetus: Ah, but in ROI, they're huge. All of those AAA titles cost $100 million apiece. The mobile games are winning in terms of actual profit margins.


Ha, so now you're down to arguing margins? As a business owner, what would you rather have?

The largest mobile title: Angry birds, which cost $140k to make and netted some $70 million over a couple years of sales. Link

Indeed, it has a major 500 to 1 margin - which sounds mighty.

Or.

One of the largest console/PC titles - Call of Duty: MW 3 - costing ~$100 million to program, and then makes $1-billion of sales in two weeks? Link

Darn, I COD's 10-1 sales margin is nothing against Angry Bird's 500 to 1. Never mind they netted $900 million more than Angry Birds,  in only half a month. Face it: mobile gaming's revenues is a fraction of that of PC/Console. Sure, margins can be impressive - but total profit isn't even close.
 
2013-02-06 07:35:21 PM  

Theaetetus: According to the latest numbers, PSN has 69 million users. Between that and XBL, they have double the numbers of Steam (blatantly ignoring the fact that there's huge overlap between all three).


Remember that PSN users also include PSP and the Vita - so you have a lot of portable overlap.
 
2013-02-06 07:37:10 PM  
Welcome to PC gaming?
 
2013-02-06 07:38:36 PM  

RoxtarRyan: Big_Fat_Liar: What drives me away from Steam is not being able to play games I already bought.

The only issue I've had like that with Steam was with the original Dragon Age. Bought it on Steam, the package with all the DLC, and there was an issue about 30 hours in where the DLC wasn't able to "phone home", causing all my game saves afterward to pretty much be corrupt. By the time I realized what happened, I logged another 50 hours in. Steam pointed their fingers at Bioware as the publisher, Bioware pointed fingers at Steam as the distributor, and nothing was done to fix it at all.

Odd, since my pirated copy with all the DLC worked just fine. Funny, since I pirated it first, but liked it so much I paid for it, only to have it not work.


No good deed goes unpunished. I bought some lazy console ports sequels that I had been excited about on Steam only to find out that I can't re-map the controls. That sh*t is f*cking infuriating. If I wanted to play it on a console, I would have bought it for one. The notion that it takes (usually multiple) patches to add something that seems to be little more than an afterthought for the developers.

Bought Darksiders II, and the controls are worthless. Pirated a couple of others to test only to find that the controls were similarly worthless. I foolishly thought that the updated version of DS II would have the control issues patched.

I have learned to pirate a game like that to test before actually buying it.
 
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