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(Lafayette Advertiser)   The city of Memphis votes to rename three city parks that honored the Confederacy and its leaders, including one named after the founder of the KKK. Sadly, even in this day and age, some people have a problem with that   (theadvertiser.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, KKK, Confederacy, Memphis, Sons of Confederate Veterans, diamond, Jefferson Davis Park  
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7046 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Feb 2013 at 1:59 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



589 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-02-06 01:53:06 PM  
I'd be more surprised if nobody in Memphis had a problem with this.
 
2013-02-06 01:53:58 PM  
So they've only lost a battle and not the War of Northern Aggression?

Sounds legit.
 
2013-02-06 02:00:05 PM  
Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???
 
2013-02-06 02:03:06 PM  
And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...
 
2013-02-06 02:03:07 PM  
Sons of Confederate Veterans

How old are these people?
 
2013-02-06 02:03:43 PM  
States' rights!  States' rights!

/Did I do that right?
//probably not...
///Stupid South indeed.
 
2013-02-06 02:04:44 PM  
This will surely solve the palpable racial tension that permeates the city.  And I know lots of people, including, sadly, some relatives, who will have a big problem with this

I went to med school there, so here is one of my many cool story bro type stories:

The main med school building abuts Nathan Bedford Forrest park where there is a giant statue of the general atop his trusty steed, a virtual ad for Memphis' backward racial attitudes. There are also several benches scattered about, on one of which two tourists were shot point blank in the head the week before I started classes.  Thug life.
 
2013-02-06 02:04:47 PM  
B-b-b-but our heritage!
 
2013-02-06 02:05:32 PM  
Whenever I read about this crap, I'm always grateful that's there are secessionist movements, in various parts of Europe, involving countries that have been under the same rule for centuries and centuries.

/looking at you, Wales.
 
2013-02-06 02:05:36 PM  
How about naming one the Robert Byrd Memorial Park?

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-02-06 02:05:37 PM  
'China Bar Tunnel' is a tunnel named after the workers digging it named by the workers digging on a curve and tsaying they were digging to China.
 
2013-02-06 02:06:26 PM  

cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...


Who are only half as goofy as the crowd that say the Lincolin freed the slaves.
 
2013-02-06 02:07:28 PM  
oh wait...

www.publiusforum.com
 
2013-02-06 02:07:36 PM  
And yet Lynchburg lives on.
 
2013-02-06 02:07:44 PM  

doczoidberg: Friggin' South. You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???


Precisely. The traitors need to be kicked in the pants.
 
2013-02-06 02:08:00 PM  
Hmmm...... No indication of what the new names will be.  Perhaps we can help them?
 
2013-02-06 02:08:10 PM  
While they're at it, maybe they can build a special theater in conjunction that would show Birth of a Nation exclusively
 
2013-02-06 02:08:15 PM  
The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.
 
2013-02-06 02:08:23 PM  
There is no law against stupidity and poor taste.
 
2013-02-06 02:08:39 PM  
There are still US cities named after British royalty.
 
2013-02-06 02:09:13 PM  
That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?
 
2013-02-06 02:09:13 PM  

mysticcat: I went to med school there, so here is one of my many cool story bro type stories:

The main med school building abuts Nathan Bedford Forrest park where there is a giant statue of the general atop his trusty steed, a virtual ad for Memphis' backward racial attitudes. There are also several benches scattered about, on one of which two tourists were shot point blank in the head the week before I started classes.  Thug life.



that was a cool story, bro.  i was in tennessee, once, too, near nashville, so that really added to it for me.

thanks for sharing.
 
2013-02-06 02:10:03 PM  
As long as they don't mess with The Rendezvous or Garabaldis (off Highland Ave, near MSU.... back when it WAS MSU...)

/old, old Germantown High alumni
 
2013-02-06 02:10:07 PM  
Why do people in the south love general Lee so much?  He LOST THE WAR!  He failed at the only thing he was supposed to do!

The ultimate "you had one job" joke.
 
2013-02-06 02:10:52 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


They can be proud all they want but they shouldn't be surprised when people correctly point that their "heritage" is deeply rooted in destructive racism.
 
2013-02-06 02:10:58 PM  

KJUW89: States' rights!  States' rights!

/Did I do that right?
//probably not...
///Stupid South indeed.


doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???


Please spare me your condescension.  There are just as many backward-ass racists and bigots in the rest of the U.S. as there are in the Southeast.  Except for Mississippi, maybe.  They are really bad.
 
2013-02-06 02:11:07 PM  
If at first you don't succeed. ..
 
2013-02-06 02:11:14 PM  
They have a big statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest in town, which should be a clue about race relations in Memphis.
 
2013-02-06 02:11:42 PM  
Oh, and anyone that has their mentality parked in the 50s southern stereotype - needs only to swim a lap or two in the big muddy. I've never known anyone who's so much as dipped a toe in that slop that hasn't ended up in the hospital with a severe infection...
 
2013-02-06 02:11:51 PM  

Pochas: Why do people in the south love general Lee so much?  .


Dukes of Hazzard.
 
2013-02-06 02:12:15 PM  
There is nothing wrong with honoring the past.
 
2013-02-06 02:12:20 PM  

Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities named after British royalty.


The Brits are still friends to America.  The south is not.
 
2013-02-06 02:13:02 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


I'm sure their are other people for them to honor besides the founder of the Klan.
 
2013-02-06 02:13:13 PM  

max_pooper: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

They can be proud all they want but they shouldn't be surprised when people correctly point that their "heritage" is deeply rooted in destructive racism.


Whose isn't?
 
2013-02-06 02:13:42 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...
 
2013-02-06 02:13:43 PM  

Brick-House: How about naming one the Robert Byrd Memorial Park?


Weasel Park?  And he wasn't even a good fiddle player.

/Arthritic former fiddle player with intense dislike of corrupt hypocrites, dead or alive.
 
2013-02-06 02:14:38 PM  

mysticcat: KJUW89: States' rights!  States' rights!

/Did I do that right?
//probably not...
///Stupid South indeed.

doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

Please spare me your condescension.  There are just as many backward-ass racists and bigots in the rest of the U.S. as there are in the Southeast.  Except for Mississippi, maybe.  They are really bad.


Okay.  I'll bite.  How many of them have parks named after the founder of the KKK?

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


See above, farkwit.
 
2013-02-06 02:14:38 PM  
Pochas -That reminds me of being a relocated 'yankee' during times when the CDB hit was 'The South's Gonna Do It Again' was big... and I used to comment, "do what???... lose another war??"

/got beat up a lot
 
2013-02-06 02:14:49 PM  
So...what would the crime rate look like on Nathan Bedford Forrest Avenue?
 
2013-02-06 02:14:57 PM  

Brick-House: oh wait...

[www.publiusforum.com image 400x324]


Oh, come on, you disingenuous farkhead, finish his life in quotes:

I apologized a thousand times ... and I don't mind apologizing over and over again. I can't erase what happened.



That's from 2005. So by all means - continue slandering a man who has offered endless apology for the sins of his youth. Just like Jesus would want.

// also, he's been dead for 2.5 years already, and there are plenty of living racists in Congress, if your ire is that up about it
// or, regale us with your best Ted Kennedy jokes; and you probably have a good zinger about Inouye, too
 
2013-02-06 02:15:40 PM  
I'm not sure where I stand on this.

I can't really blame Memphis for doing this from a PR and PC angle, since the names of the parks seem to glorify things that people nowadays don't really see as noble and name-worthy.

On the other hand, it seems that our society has a tendency to whitewash everything, and instead of dealing with our history, and making it a talking/teaching point, It's easier to rename the parks rather than explain why these parks were named, and the history behind the people.
 
2013-02-06 02:16:29 PM  

max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.


Ha!  What date do they celebrate Emancipation Day?  They seem to have had a different idea than the rest of the country.
 
2013-02-06 02:16:41 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


No no, they can be proud.

Well they can be proud, hear now

Be proud you're a rebel

'Cause the South's gonna do it again*

*get their asses kicked in and have their disgusting way of life buried forever
 
2013-02-06 02:17:39 PM  
You can't get much closer to Satan than Nathan Bedford Forrest, but he was one of the best cavalry commanders to ever live.  You have to give the murderous, slave trading, son of a biatch that.
 
2013-02-06 02:17:39 PM  
Will someone please tell me what the positive legacies of Nathan Bedford Forrest were? What exactly is being honored? His profound ignorance? His slaughter of surrendered troops. His slave trading? His terrorism? What is the "legacy " that deserves anything beyond derision?
 
2013-02-06 02:17:59 PM  
Forrest and Kesselring are interesting cases of utterly badass generals and unrepentantly evil bastards.
 
2013-02-06 02:18:12 PM  
Come on! The KKK is one of the most successful terrorist organizations of all time.  Why does subby hate success?
 
2013-02-06 02:18:46 PM  
You know, I say keep the names as they are but then put some sort of plaque up that explains who these people were so everyone knows the parks were named after assholes.
 
2013-02-06 02:18:57 PM  
The north and south should split up again. Both of us would be better off.
 
2013-02-06 02:19:06 PM  

Dr Dreidel: Brick-House: oh wait...

[www.publiusforum.com image 400x324]

Oh, come on, you disingenuous farkhead, finish his life in quotes:

I apologized a thousand times ... and I don't mind apologizing over and over again. I can't erase what happened.

That's from 2005. So by all means - continue slandering a man who has offered endless apology for the sins of his youth. Just like Jesus would want.

// also, he's been dead for 2.5 years already, and there are plenty of living racists in Congress, if your ire is that up about it
// or, regale us with your best Ted Kennedy jokes; and you probably have a good zinger about Inouye, too

apology you say...



1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-06 02:19:10 PM  

mysticcat: This will surely solve the palpable racial tension that permeates the city.  And I know lots of people, including, sadly, some relatives, who will have a big problem with this

I went to med school there, so here is one of my many cool story bro type stories:

The main med school building abuts Nathan Bedford Forrest park where there is a giant statue of the general atop his trusty steed, a virtual ad for Memphis' backward racial attitudes. There are also several benches scattered about, on one of which two tourists were shot point blank in the head the week before I started classes.  Thug life.


Spent a couple weeks there when my cousin got married in 2003.  I don't think I've seen any more blatant racism from blacks or whites anywhere else on the planet.
 
2013-02-06 02:20:38 PM  

doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???


fark you, carpetbagger.

More bourbon, barbecue, and hush puppies for me us.
 
2013-02-06 02:21:02 PM  
Maybe we should start naming things after British Reveloutionary War Generals in New England and American-Mexican Mexican Generals in the Southwest.

How about the Benedict Arnaold Memorial Park.
 
2013-02-06 02:21:53 PM  
Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.
 
2013-02-06 02:22:48 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


They have nothing to be proud of. They picked a fight with their moral, technological, and intellectual betters and got their asses handed to them.
 
2013-02-06 02:23:03 PM  

Mid_mo_mad_man: Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.


Well that hardly deserves a park naming.
 
2013-02-06 02:23:07 PM  
Hey, has Brick-House been in this thread yet to remind us that Democrat Robert Byrd remained a proud racist and Klansman all the way to the end of his life?
 
2013-02-06 02:23:16 PM  

max_pooper: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

They can be proud all they want but they shouldn't be surprised when people correctly point that their "heritage" is deeply rooted in destructive racism.


I don't think that was an issue back then.
 
2013-02-06 02:23:28 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Maybe we should start naming things after British Reveloutionary War Generals in New England and American-Mexican Mexican Generals in the Southwest.

How about the Benedict Arnaold Memorial Park.


He's already got a style of eggs.
 
2013-02-06 02:23:59 PM  

doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???


No you don't understand. You cannot rewrite history and the men who served did so honorably. They were Americans and you don't have to agree with their cause to honor them for doing what they saw as their duty. I just love how Northerners pretend they didn't buy and sell slaves or that every southerner was a slave owner. Ignorant tool.

I grew up in the South. I am white and lived in a black neighborhood. I saw a lot of parents tell their kids to call me names and fight me because I was a white child. I never saw a white, southern person doing that. So you keep on making up that alternate reality you think the south is today.
 
2013-02-06 02:24:00 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Maybe we should start naming things after British Reveloutionary War Generals in New England and American-Mexican Mexican Generals in the Southwest.

How about the Benedict Arnaold Memorial Park.


upload.wikimedia.org
/hot
 
2013-02-06 02:24:09 PM  

CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...


Well... have you accomplished that? So they are up on you then mister fancy pants.
 
2013-02-06 02:24:21 PM  

LowbrowDeluxe: Okay.  I'll bite.  How many of them have parks named after the founder of the KKK?


Didn't they just rename it?  Anyway, it was a vestige of the pre-civil rights era.
 
2013-02-06 02:24:22 PM  
Have you seen this day and age, Subby?
 
2013-02-06 02:25:08 PM  
I'll only accept Confederate names and the Klan if the park name insults them.

The KKK Are Racist Shiatbags Park

Confederates Lost The War Park

Haha Stonewall Jackson Was Shot By His Own Men Park

/is extremely unfunny
 
2013-02-06 02:25:21 PM  

Mija: No you don't understand. You cannot rewrite history and the men who served did so honorably. They were Americans and you don't have to agree with their cause to honor them for doing what they saw as their duty. I just love how Northerners pretend they didn't buy and sell slaves or that every southerner was a slave owner. Ignorant tool.


Well, to be fair, they were trying really hard not to be.

There is little of pride in the revolution, Jim Crow, or the decades of slavery before or racism after.

There is a lot of great food, music, and bourbon though. Enough to be proud of.
 
2013-02-06 02:25:34 PM  

Brick-House: How about naming one the Robert Byrd Memorial Park?

[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x275]


Or how about Strom Thurman Park?
You know the guy who birth a child from a black women as he campaigned to take her rights away.

/At least Byrd recanted his beliefs and worked for civil rights.
 
2013-02-06 02:25:39 PM  
Maybe now the city council can do something about the super-aggressive panhandling tat takes place on Beale St.  I should be able to sit at a bar without some guy asking me for money.
 
2013-02-06 02:25:45 PM  
The sanitization of history continues.
 
2013-02-06 02:26:34 PM  

Brick-House: Dr Dreidel: Brick-House: oh wait...

[www.publiusforum.com image 400x324]

Oh, come on, you disingenuous farkhead, finish his life in quotes:

I apologized a thousand times ... and I don't mind apologizing over and over again. I can't erase what happened.

That's from 2005. So by all means - continue slandering a man who has offered endless apology for the sins of his youth. Just like Jesus would want.

// also, he's been dead for 2.5 years already, and there are plenty of living racists in Congress, if your ire is that up about it
// or, regale us with your best Ted Kennedy jokes; and you probably have a good zinger about Inouye, too

apology you say...


[1.bp.blogspot.com image 275x350]


Hmmm. So any apology is rendered moot if a magazine catering to the purportedly-offended population objects? I have to stay mad at Sarah Silverman because the OU still doesn't like that she said hurtful things about Jews a year ago?

If you have arguments that back up a reason to hate on Robert Byrd this long after he's died - some piece of racist legislation he authored/signed, some big racist thing he's done, SOMETHING beyond statements older than my dad and which have more gravity than the apology.

// really, all that cover does is show that Ebony is just as callous as you (and again, it takes a real Christian to ignore someone's apology)
// although without reading whatever story ran along with that image (assuming it's not shooped), they may have policy objections
// "policy" objections, not "he was in the Klan 60 years ago" objections
 
das
2013-02-06 02:26:36 PM  

MCStymie: So...what would the crime rate look like on Nathan Bedford Forrest Avenue?


About the same as on MLK Drive.
 
2013-02-06 02:26:46 PM  
He wasn't the founder of the KKK, only a member.
 
2013-02-06 02:26:50 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: Mid_mo_mad_man: Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.

Well that hardly deserves a park naming.




Being a brilliant military commander does. Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did
 
2013-02-06 02:27:48 PM  

cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...


Will they be followed by the "Islam is a religion of peace" crowd?

/KKK & Islam = death cults
 
2013-02-06 02:27:56 PM  
As a Memphian, I never understood why we had some many confederate themed parks.  I always figured, when you lose the war, you don't get to fly your flag.

Also, from what I've read, Forrest wanted to be buried "with his men", which by the way he originally was.  He was buried in Elmwood Cemetary with other confederate soldiers.  This was what he wanted.  If the Sons of Confederate Veterans really wanted to honor him, they never would have dug him up and put him where he is today.

Confederate Park was put there in 1964.  You can guess what the city was going through at that time.  Naming a park that was nothing more than a slap in the face to black Memphians.

Jefferson Davis Park was named in 1930.  This nothing more than a tip of the hat to the Jim Crow ideology.

If these parks had been named immediately after the Civil War had ended, it would be one thing --- still silly in today's world, but understandable that they were named as such IF that were the case.  But it's not the case.  These parks were named WAY after the Civil War and they were done so to make political statements.

I know lots of people who have huge problems with the renaming of the parks.  I think it is LONG overdue.  It's embarassing as hell to have the nice, technilogically advanced University of Tennessee School of Medicine right next to the backward thinking Forrest Park.

I've also heard lots of folks around here argue that he became very "black friendly" in his later years.  That doesn't change what he did in his earlier years.  It's an insult to give him a pass.  (Yes, it's also an insult to have given Robert Byrd and George Wallace a pass as well, but I digress.)

And to say that the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery is a joke.  Of the thirteen state that seceded, eleven mention slavery as a reason for secession in their letters of secession.  Of those eleven , eight mention it in the first paragraph.  Of those eight, four mention it in the first sentence.

And Memphians wonder why we can't attract more industry here.

Just my rambling thoughts.
 
2013-02-06 02:28:02 PM  
Where have I seen this before? Oh yeah...

t1.gstatic.com

I figured the revised flag was a little less offensive than the original...

/art imitates life again.
 
2013-02-06 02:28:16 PM  
 
2013-02-06 02:28:17 PM  
Reminds me of the South Park Flag debate.
 
2013-02-06 02:28:20 PM  

Fano: They have a big statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest in town, which should be a clue about race relations in Memphis.


You guys are pikers--here in Richmond we have a whole street of Conferderate generals' statues. Oh--and Arthur Ashe, whose statue has its back to the others. It's quite interesting to watch people at once want to glorify Richmond's past as the capital of the Confederacy and kind of sweep it under the rug that Richmond used to be a huge slave market too.

CSS--last year my husband and I decided to play tourist at home and go to the Museum of the Confederacy, which has Jefferson Davis' house included. The guy who led the house tour was black and going on about its great history. I thought it would be like a Jewish guy leading tours of Auschwitz and saying "wow, those Nazis sure had the right idea, huh?"
 
2013-02-06 02:28:26 PM  

das: MCStymie: So...what would the crime rate look like on Nathan Bedford Forrest Avenue?

About the same as on MLK Drive.


I, for one, have visions of trailer-rowhomes, loud country music blaring at all hours, and tricked-out pickup trucks.
 
2013-02-06 02:28:42 PM  

Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities States named after British royalty.

 
2013-02-06 02:29:45 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities States named after British royalty.


A fair number of which were briefly in the CSA.
 
2013-02-06 02:29:50 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


You celebrate treason as heritage?
 
2013-02-06 02:29:51 PM  
I would be offended if public places were named after racists today, but not when they are historical. I see nothing good about hiding the south's ugly history. I would add plaques to the park describing who it was named for, why, and what our society has learned since then. My six year old can tell you a bit about the history of slavery and civil rights in this country and how many similar changes still lie ahead.

Besides, changing their celebrated racist heroes into PC conversation pieces would piss them off more.
 
2013-02-06 02:30:17 PM  

CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...


So, the same thing the rest of the country has to be proud of then?  (Native Americans ring a bell?)
 
2013-02-06 02:30:48 PM  

Marisyana: I thought it would be like a Jewish guy leading tours of Auschwitz and saying "wow, those Nazis sure had the right idea, huh?"


A pay check is a pay check is a pay check.

/i couldn't do it, wel.. if i was starving....
 
2013-02-06 02:31:11 PM  
at  least forrest sounds like a good loser.  tldr: suck it up, we lost. you'll get over it.

farewell letter to troops (wiki)

Civil war, such as you have just passed through naturally engenders feelings of animosity, hatred, and revenge. It is our duty to divest ourselves of all such feelings; and as far as it is in our power to do so, to cultivate friendly feelings towards those with whom we have so long contended, and heretofore so widely, but honestly, differed. Neighborhood feuds, personal animosities, and private differences should be blotted out; and, when you return home, a manly, straightforward course of conduct will secure the respect of your enemies. Whatever your responsibilities may be to Government, to society, or to individuals meet them like men.

The attempt made to establish a separate and independent Confederation has failed; but the consciousness of having done your duty faithfully, and to the end, will, in some measure, repay for the hardships you have undergone. In bidding you farewell, rest assured that you carry with you my best wishes for your future welfare and happiness. Without, in any way, referring to the merits of the Cause in which we have been engaged, your courage and determination, as exhibited on many hard-fought fields, has elicited the respect and admiration of friend and foe. And I now cheerfully and gratefully acknowledge my indebtedness to the officers and men of my command whose zeal, fidelity and unflinching bravery have been the great source of my past success in arms.

I have never, on the field of battle, sent you where I was unwilling to go myself; nor would I now advise you to a course which I felt myself unwilling to pursue. You have been good soldiers, you can be good citizens. Obey the laws, preserve your honor, and the Government to which you have surrendered can afford to be, and will be, magnanimous.
 
2013-02-06 02:31:29 PM  

Farce-Side: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

So, the same thing the rest of the country has to be proud of then?  (Native Americans ring a bell?)


That one's okay, they were godless heathens.
 
2013-02-06 02:31:36 PM  

Mija: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

No you don't understand. You cannot rewrite history and the men who served did so honorably. They were Americans and you don't have to agree with their cause to honor them for doing what they saw as their duty. I just love how Northerners pretend they didn't buy and sell slaves or that every southerner was a slave owner. Ignorant tool.

I grew up in the South. I am white and lived in a black neighborhood. I saw a lot of parents tell their kids to call me names and fight me because I was a white child. I never saw a white, southern person doing that. So you keep on making up that alternate reality you think the south is today.


Do you think that might have something to do with you growing up in a black neighborhood?
 
2013-02-06 02:32:12 PM  
Meh, just take down a cross or a wall that has a bible verse on it, that will even things out again
 
2013-02-06 02:32:22 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


Southerners can be very proud of their heritage. However, it pays to pick portions of one's heritage to be proud of that are actually, you know, in any way admirable. For instance, here in Arkansas, trying to keep black people out of public colleges is part of our heritage, but we'd look pretty goddamned stupid and awful if we claimed to be proud of that part.
 
2013-02-06 02:32:34 PM  

davidphogan: I'd be more surprised if nobody in Memphis had a problem with this.


Done in one.

One trip to Memphis makes me realize that racial relations in St. Louis are like that Coke commercial where people sing in harmony compared to race relations in Memphis.
 
2013-02-06 02:33:22 PM  
The Fort Pillow massacre.

Yeah, N. B. Forrest; heck of a guy.

images.fineartamerica.com
 
2013-02-06 02:34:07 PM  

Mija: No you don't understand. You cannot rewrite history and the men who served did so honorably. They were Americans and you don't have to agree with their cause to honor them for doing what they saw as their duty.


There are those who would say that the cause they served negates any honor that they might otherwise have deserved for the way they served it. Indeed, there are many nowadays who decry the idea of deriving honor from duty, precisely because doing it can drive people to serve such causes.

I don't agree with that school of thought, but it's the sort of argument you're up against. It's maddeningly difficult to refute, because it follows pretty darn well from a certain set of underlying assumptions and values that these same people have had an effective time propagating, and so you wind up having to attack those, and pretty soon you're in a philosophical argument so distant from the original point that you get dismissed as out of scope.
 
2013-02-06 02:34:18 PM  

Mid_mo_mad_man: HotWingConspiracy: Mid_mo_mad_man: Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.

Well that hardly deserves a park naming.

Being a brilliant military commander does

.

Totally. I'll see you at Rommel Park later.

Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did

The important thing is that he and the south were utterly defeated.
 
2013-02-06 02:34:29 PM  

Brick-House: How about naming one the Robert Byrd Memorial Park?

[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x275]


He already got this named after him.
i.huffpost.com

/Been to the top of it.
 
2013-02-06 02:34:45 PM  

Mid_mo_mad_man: HotWingConspiracy: Mid_mo_mad_man: Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.

Well that hardly deserves a park naming.

Being a brilliant military commander does. Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did


Bullshiat. Lee was not the flawless commander myth makes him out to be. Nor were the union generals the universal disasters that myth would make them to be. Lee failed in both his major offensive campaigns. Meade, Sheridan and Grant destroyed the Army of Northern Virgina.
 
2013-02-06 02:35:04 PM  
I grew up in Memphis, and here's the thing - Memphis is a nearly 70% black city, stuck deep in a racist Red state. The state often passes laws with the express purpose of messing with Memphis. So, when the state proposed a ban on renaming parks named after Veterans - Memphis rushed to rename the parks in their borders that glorify the rebelious (and many say, racist) past of that city.

You really want to get into some racism, look at the reverse takeover of the Shelby county schools by Memphis. And yes, that was also started by State level action.
 
2013-02-06 02:35:10 PM  

cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...


To be fair it was about state's rights. Specifically, the right of a state to say it's ok to own another human being.
 
2013-02-06 02:35:43 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities States named after British royalty.


Maryland, Virginia, the Carolinas, Delaware, and Georgia.

Still?  Are you proposing they change?
 
2013-02-06 02:36:19 PM  
It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods
 
2013-02-06 02:36:38 PM  
i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-06 02:36:40 PM  
I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.
 
2013-02-06 02:36:53 PM  

Dr Dreidel: Brick-House: oh wait...

[www.publiusforum.com image 400x324]

Oh, come on, you disingenuous farkhead, finish his life in quotes:

I apologized a thousand times ... and I don't mind apologizing over and over again. I can't erase what happened.

That's from 2005. So by all means - continue slandering a man who has offered endless apology for the sins of his youth. Just like Jesus would want.

// also, he's been dead for 2.5 years already, and there are plenty of living racists in Congress, if your ire is that up about it
// or, regale us with your best Ted Kennedy jokes; and you probably have a good zinger about Inouye, too


He was active with and expressed strong belief in the mission of the KKK until he was at least 31 years old.  That reaaaaaallly pushing it on "youthful indiscretion."
 
2013-02-06 02:37:07 PM  

Joe Blowme: cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...

Will they be followed by the "Islam is a religion of peace" crowd?

/KKK & Islam = death cults


LOL WUT?!

/I won't go on to comparitive religion but of the 3 Abrahmic ones there is only one that diafies the death of its central figure.
 
2013-02-06 02:37:09 PM  

ph0rk: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

fark you, carpetbagger.

More bourbon, barbecue, and hush puppies for me us.


Over 90% of bourbon is from Kentucky which was a union state. And don't include Jack Daniels as it is not a bourbon. It could be called a bourbon but the manufacturers don't want to call it bourbon as it has a distinct flavor from bourbon.
 
2013-02-06 02:37:39 PM  

Private_Citizen: I grew up in Memphis, and here's the thing - Memphis is a nearly 70% black city, stuck deep in a racist Red state bordered by an even more racist Red state. The state often passes laws with the express purpose of messing with Memphis. So, when the state proposed a ban on renaming parks named after Veterans - Memphis rushed to rename the parks in their borders that glorify the rebelious (and many say, racist) past of that city.

You really want to get into some racism, look at the reverse takeover of the Shelby county schools by Memphis. And yes, that was also started by State level action.


FTFY

Memphis and Mississippi are just awful.

I wouldn't have to go though there if there was a faster way to NOLA from St. Louis by car.
 
2013-02-06 02:38:12 PM  

max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.


Other fun fact - Confederate Heroes Day and Martin Luther King Day are during the same week and sometimes on the same day!  But don't tell a Texas there is anything ironic about this schedule or you WILL get an angry States' Rights speech
 
2013-02-06 02:38:17 PM  

Just another Heartland Weirdass: If at first you don't succeed. ..

 
2013-02-06 02:38:46 PM  
I suggest that they rename all three parks Rosa.

I considered the Reverend Doctor Martin Luther King Junior Parks but the signs would be so long that they'd bankrupt the city.
 
2013-02-06 02:38:48 PM  

CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...


I'm glad someone is thinking of the Native Americans.
 
2013-02-06 02:39:04 PM  

drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.


Not all white southerners are racists, just the dumbasses who use the Confederate flag to symbolize their "Southern Pride".

Couldn't you guys use something else that doesn't make you guys look like a bunch of sore losers?
 
2013-02-06 02:39:08 PM  

Mija: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

No you don't understand. You cannot rewrite history and the men who served did so honorably. They were Americans and you don't have to agree with their cause to honor them for doing what they saw as their duty. I just love how Northerners pretend they didn't buy and sell slaves or that every southerner was a slave owner. Ignorant tool.

I grew up in the South. I am white and lived in a black neighborhood. I saw a lot of parents tell their kids to call me names and fight me because I was a white child. I never saw a white, southern person doing that. So you keep on making up that alternate reality you think the south is today.


Wow! You must have gotten beat up a lot!  I mean, its no small feat to have your eyes and ears completely swollen shut for your entire life.
 
2013-02-06 02:39:20 PM  

drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.


Nonsense. You forgot that southerners are fat too, so they are clearly the ones that have absconded with the cake.
 
2013-02-06 02:39:29 PM  
Nathan Bedford Forrest was an advocate for Civil Rights after the war.  Read the article.

Notably this speech to the organization that later became the NAACP:

Ladies and Gentlemen I accept the flowers as a memento of reconciliation between the white and colored races of the southern states. I accept it more particularly as it comes from a colored lady, for if there is any one on God's earth who loves the ladies I believe it is myself. ( Immense applause and laughter.) I came here with the jeers of some white people, who think that I am doing wrong. I believe I can exert some influence, and do much to assist the people in strengthening fraternal relations, and shall do all in my power to elevate every man to depress none. (Applause.) I want to elevate you to take positions in law offices, in stores, on farms, and wherever you are capable of going. I have not said anything about politics today. I don't propose to say anything about politics. You have a right to elect whom you please; vote for the man you think best, and I think, when that is done, you and I are freemen. Do as you consider right and honest in electing men for office. I did not come here to make you a long speech, although invited to do so by you. I am not much of a speaker, and my business prevented me from preparing myself. I came to meet you as friends, and welcome you to the white people. I want you to come nearer to us. When I can serve you I will do so. We have but one flag, one country; let us stand together. We may differ in color, but not in sentiment Many things have been said about me which are wrong, and which white and black persons here, who stood by me through the war, can contradict. Go to work, be industrious, live honestly and act truly, and when you are oppressed I'll come to your relief. I thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for this opportunity you have afforded me to be with you, and to assure you that I am with you in heart and in hand. (Prolonged applause.)

He then gave a black woman a kiss on the cheek, which was scandalous back then.

Bedford Forrest's name was used in the establishment of the Klan, but there's no indication he took part, and it's unclear as to whether he gave consent to use his name.  So the historical record indicates he was far less racist than most whites of his time.
 
2013-02-06 02:39:31 PM  

zetar: The Fort Pillow massacre.

Yeah, N. B. Forrest; heck of a guy.

[images.fineartamerica.com image 850x587]


No, that was taken out of context. There was a spider on that lady's turban, and he was just trying to stick it.  If you don't believe, me just ask the survivors of Fort Pillow, they'll back me up.
 
2013-02-06 02:39:50 PM  

Red Shirt Blues: ph0rk: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

fark you, carpetbagger.

More bourbon, barbecue, and hush puppies for me us.

Over 90% of bourbon is from Kentucky which was a union state. And don't include Jack Daniels as it is not a bourbon. It could be called a bourbon but the manufacturers don't want to call it bourbon as it has a distinct flavor from bourbon.


He said, and I quote: "Friggin' South"

I don't give two shiats which states were Union and which weren't, they're all Union states now.

Kentucky gets painted with the same broad brush the rest of the South does.

/Also, Jack Daniel's sucks smoky balls.
//George Dickel used to be ok
///Charcoal filtering != bourbon.
 
2013-02-06 02:40:28 PM  

Pochas: Why do people in the south love general Lee so much?  He LOST THE WAR!  He failed at the only thing he was supposed to do!

The ultimate "you had one job" joke.


My company had a BOD meeting on MLK Day.  The President and CEO lead the board in singing Happy Birthday to Robert E Lee.
 
2013-02-06 02:40:52 PM  

drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.


I haven't heard anybody say that ever except for people like you who claim that Liberals say that whenever somebody protest to some racist action done by a southern white.
 
2013-02-06 02:40:55 PM  
The Confederate States of America was the stupidest idea any American ever had. Why we Southerners want to celebrate it, I have never been able to figure out. Perpetrators of a rich man's war and a poor man's fight to preserve slavery, led by a bunch of incompetent fools (read up on Alexander Stephens, the Confederate vice president, some time).

I'm OK with Confederate military cemeteries, but Jefferson Davis shouldn't have anything but an outhouse named after him. Nathan Bedford Forrest was a great military commander, but the Fort Pillow massacre and helping to found the Ku Klux kind of take the shine off that.

Oh, and those parks were named in the '30s, when Southern politicians were really concerned about the uppityness of all their quasi-slave labor moving north to get real jobs.
 
2013-02-06 02:41:03 PM  

ph0rk: ///Charcoal filtering != bourbon.


That does not preclude it from being called bourbon.
 
2013-02-06 02:41:54 PM  

ArtosRC: doczoidberg: Friggin' South. You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

Precisely. The traitors need to be kicked in the pants.



You're 140 years too late.
 
2013-02-06 02:42:00 PM  

Tom_Slick: Maybe now the city council can do something about the super-aggressive panhandling tat takes place on Beale St.  I should be able to sit at a bar without some guy asking me for money.


One day a real rain will come and wash the streets clean.

Seriously, bums everywhere. It's how I learned not to acknowledge other human beings lest you be give a half hour story that ends with, "so can you give me some money?"
 
2013-02-06 02:42:39 PM  

doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???


Wow! Did you know the first successful heart transplant happened in the south? Did you know a ton of your food comes from the south? Did you know the natural beauty of the south brings in billions of tourist dollars? You are a troll and I just fed you, I hope you are happy.

Those people fought for what that state believed in.  Agree or disagree, I respect that. So many have forgotten that slavery was only a part of the civil war. We were a country that only a generation or two before had fought to be free from an oppressive government. Many were just pissed off that the new government, not as old as their fathers and grandfathers, was already telling them what to do. Many of the wealthy and influential feared their livelihood would be destroyed. Perspective helps. Any person denying slavery was a big part of the Civil War is an idiot. Any one who says it was the only factor is just as big of an idiot. The south believed they were being oppressed and fought to end that perceived oppression. The only difference in the south and the Revolutionary Colonials (who were slave owners) is that the Colonials won. Had they lost we would all be talking about what murderous and treasonous asses we all were as we toasted long live the queen.
 
2013-02-06 02:43:01 PM  

stampylives: He was active with and expressed strong belief in the mission of the KKK until he was at least 31 years old. That reaaaaaallly pushing it on "youthful indiscretion."


In 2005, when he offered that apology, he was 88 - "the sins of his [relative] youth".

// 57 years is a long damned time - some might say "a lifetime"
 
2013-02-06 02:43:39 PM  

Mija: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

No you don't understand. You cannot rewrite history and the men who served did so honorably. They were Americans and you don't have to agree with their cause to honor them for doing what they saw as their duty. I just love how Northerners pretend they didn't buy and sell slaves or that every southerner was a slave owner. Ignorant tool.

I grew up in the South. I am white and lived in a black neighborhood. I saw a lot of parents tell their kids to call me names and fight me because I was a white child. I never saw a white, southern person doing that. So you keep on making up that alternate reality you think the south is today.



Hail slavery, the New England dream!
Mr. Adams, I give you a toast:
Hail Boston! Hail Charleston!
Who stinketh the most?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUi1xtUQkBI
 
2013-02-06 02:43:48 PM  

Pants full of macaroni!!: Hey, has Brick-House been in this thread yet to remind us that Democrat Robert Byrd remained a proud racist and Klansman all the way to the end of his life?


Yes. Brick-House wants us to know that Sen. Byrd never once renounced the Klan or racism. I see no reason not to take him at his word, based on his posting history.
 
2013-02-06 02:43:56 PM  
If I read that right, the council knows people are pissed off about who the park was named after, so the hastily past a resolution making illegal to change the name of a park named for a historical figure.

Way to be classy, guys.  No need to listed to the people who HIRED YOU!
 
2013-02-06 02:44:00 PM  

CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...


You mean the Indians?
 
2013-02-06 02:44:06 PM  
Glad to see that Revisionist History Derp is alive and well in in Memphis...

... and this thread.
 
2013-02-06 02:44:31 PM  

Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods


What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?
 
2013-02-06 02:44:43 PM  

scout48: Did you know the first successful heart transplant happened in the south?


Maybe they should name a park for the doctor that performed it instead of a racist loser.
 
2013-02-06 02:46:15 PM  

Amos Quito: Glad to see that Revisionist History Derp is alive and well in in Memphis...

... and this thread.


What is the revision exactly? Seems to me it's getting renamed based on a sober look at known history.
 
2013-02-06 02:46:33 PM  

MCStymie: So...what would the crime rate look like on Nathan Bedford Forrest Avenue?


ok this made me smile.

we need a new country east and left coast sates then the flyover states
 
2013-02-06 02:47:01 PM  

Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods


Not the worst.

freebeacon.com
 
2013-02-06 02:47:39 PM  

karnal: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?


Likely due to racists in local government.
 
2013-02-06 02:47:47 PM  

ongbok: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

I'm sure their are other people for them to honor besides the founder of the Klan.


Alex Chilton Park has a nice ring to it.
 
2013-02-06 02:47:51 PM  
Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk
 
2013-02-06 02:48:02 PM  
Kentucky was a border state.  These were states that had Southern sympathies, but were in no position to fight with Illinois.

I would hope that our little misadventure in Indochine would have disabused us of our belief in our inherent moral superiority.  I will keep hoping. . .
 
2013-02-06 02:48:11 PM  
Its not like Germany took down all the Hitler statues and decided to stop flying the Nazi flag over their capital.
 
2013-02-06 02:48:55 PM  
t.qkme.me

R.I.P.
 
2013-02-06 02:48:58 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: Will someone please tell me what the positive legacies of Nathan Bedford Forrest were? What exactly is being honored? His profound ignorance? His slaughter of surrendered troops. His slave trading? His terrorism? What is the "legacy " that deserves anything beyond derision?


His Cameo in Forrest Gump?
 
2013-02-06 02:49:35 PM  
Just in the local area of Virginia here we have Jefferson Davis Highway and Lee Highway (named after General Lee). Are we supposed to change those? There's also Jeb Stuart High School and other schools named after Confederates. A major tourist attraction in Mississippi is the home of Jefferson Davis. Should they bulldoze it? Stop trying to erase the past. Political correctness run amok.
 
2013-02-06 02:50:09 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Its not like Germany took down all the Hitler statues and decided to stop flying the Nazi flag over their capital.


Well, the VW Beetle was quite a popular car for years despite getting two thumbs up from the uniballed little prick.
 
2013-02-06 02:50:30 PM  

karnal: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?


That is interesting considering the renaming of the streets was supposed to bring those communities together to make the neighborhood better. I wonder what happend as well.
 
2013-02-06 02:50:34 PM  

oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk


You could, but you'd be wrong.
 
2013-02-06 02:50:49 PM  
Instead of renaming the parks, why not erect one of those historical marker plaques educating visitors on what shiatheads these guys were?
 
2013-02-06 02:51:11 PM  
It's no worst then naming stuff after George Custer or Nathaniel Lyon.  Both did a fine job of handling injuns.
 
2013-02-06 02:51:22 PM  

LowbrowDeluxe: Okay. I'll bite. How many of them have parks named after the founder of the KKK?

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners. That seems fair, right?

See above, farkwit.



You may want to check the history of the Klan in Indiana starting in the 1910s. And you might want to check out the United Northern and Southern Knights of the Ku Klux Klan   They're based out of Michigan.

You are aware that when the US started, there were slaves all over the country, right?
 
2013-02-06 02:51:57 PM  

RealityChuck: Nathan Bedford Forrest was an advocate for Civil Rights after the war.  Read the article.

Notably this speech to the organization that later became the NAACP:

Ladies and Gentlemen I accept the flowers as a memento of reconciliation between the white and colored races of the southern states. I accept it more particularly as it comes from a colored lady, for if there is any one on God's earth who loves the ladies I believe it is myself. ( Immense applause and laughter.) I came here with the jeers of some white people, who think that I am doing wrong. I believe I can exert some influence, and do much to assist the people in strengthening fraternal relations, and shall do all in my power to elevate every man to depress none. (Applause.) I want to elevate you to take positions in law offices, in stores, on farms, and wherever you are capable of going. I have not said anything about politics today. I don't propose to say anything about politics. You have a right to elect whom you please; vote for the man you think best, and I think, when that is done, you and I are freemen. Do as you consider right and honest in electing men for office. I did not come here to make you a long speech, although invited to do so by you. I am not much of a speaker, and my business prevented me from preparing myself. I came to meet you as friends, and welcome you to the white people. I want you to come nearer to us. When I can serve you I will do so. We have but one flag, one country; let us stand together. We may differ in color, but not in sentiment Many things have been said about me which are wrong, and which white and black persons here, who stood by me through the war, can contradict. Go to work, be industrious, live honestly and act truly, and when you are oppressed I'll come to your relief. I thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for this opportunity you have afforded me to be with you, and to assure you that I am with you in heart and in hand. (Prolonged applause.)

He then gave a black w ...


Wow. Did not know that.
 
2013-02-06 02:52:01 PM  

someonelse: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

Not the worst.

[freebeacon.com image 798x498]


ohyou.jpg

/hating rich people is a learned behavior
 
2013-02-06 02:52:02 PM  

Tom_Slick: Maybe now the city council can do something about the super-aggressive panhandling tat takes place on Beale St.  I should be able to sit at a bar without some guy asking me for money.


 if he was the bartender, that was a helluva route to get out of paying the tab.
"That'll be 14 dollars"
"GET A JOB, BUM"
 
2013-02-06 02:52:05 PM  

ongbok: drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.

I haven't heard anybody say that ever except for people like you who claim that Liberals say that whenever somebody protest to some racist action done by a southern white.


Well shoot. I will switch from being a liberal to a conservative to match your stereotype. My bad!
 
2013-02-06 02:52:21 PM  

TheSnacky: Confederate Park was put there in 1964. You can guess what the city was going through at that time. Naming a park that was nothing more than a slap in the face to black Memphians.

Jefferson Davis Park was named in 1930. This nothing more than a tip of the hat to the Jim Crow ideology.


Seriously? In that case, they should NOT rename those parks. Instead, they should put up plaques at each one explaining just what a giant douchebag Memphis was being when they named them.
 
2013-02-06 02:52:22 PM  

Onkel Buck: karnal: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?

That is interesting considering the renaming of the streets was supposed to bring those communities together to make the neighborhood better. I wonder what happend as well.


I think the first point is suspect - MLK died in '68, how fast were streets named? How fast did neighborhoods change? In more than one city in NC, a major road was only renamed MLK for the sections through poor neighborhoods, rather than the whole city.
 
2013-02-06 02:52:45 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Joe Blowme: cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...

Will they be followed by the "Islam is a religion of peace" crowd?

/KKK & Islam = death cults

LOL WUT?!

/I won't go on to comparitive religion but of the 3 Abrahmic ones there is only one that diafies the death of its central figure.


I thought we were baggin on cults that promote killing those who are different and still believe in slavery.
 
2013-02-06 02:53:19 PM  
The cleansing of history continues as the intolerant continue to widen their scope of what is offensive.  Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures?  A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.  When we lose sight of where we've come from don't we also risk letting history repeat itself?
 
2013-02-06 02:53:35 PM  
Good luck, non-racist Memphisites.  I remember the kerfuffle over taking the confederate flag off the state house in South Carolina.  It cost the governor the re-election and at the end of the day, it was moved all the way from the top of the building to .... a statue on the front lawn.
 
2013-02-06 02:54:03 PM  

Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.


Yeah, that was the War of 1812.
 
2013-02-06 02:55:44 PM  

Mid_mo_mad_man: HotWingConspiracy: Mid_mo_mad_man: Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.

Well that hardly deserves a park naming.

Being a brilliant military commander does. Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did


Atlanta, The Gulf states, and General Sherman laugh at that observation.

/Well maybe not the former.
 
2013-02-06 02:55:47 PM  

Amos Quito: Glad to see that Revisionist History Derp is alive and well in in Memphis...


Seriously, what is with people trying to call renaming a street, "revising history"? That's unbelievably silly. I mean, I guess if you learned history from freaking street signs then that might justify making a statement that stupid, but still...
 
2013-02-06 02:55:50 PM  

farm machine: Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures? A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.


More suited for the name of a landfill or waste treatment plant.
 
2013-02-06 02:55:52 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: karnal: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?

Likely due to racists in local government.



Here are our local officials.....see if you can you spot the racists?

http://www.cityofmobile.org/govt.php
 
2013-02-06 02:55:56 PM  
The irrationality in this thread is really depressing.

Everyone comments as though they are the supreme overlord of Memphis, that they are the final word on history, that no other viewpoint than theirs is correct.

It is much better and wiser to let regions of this enormous country showcase what they want. If Memphis wants to make a memorial to Gen. Forrest, let them. If 200 years later they want to tear it down, let them. If pro-Confederate groups want to agitate against the changes, let them. Let them persuade the people of Memphis.

Yet people in here have this tyrant's attitude, which has become the new norm apparently, to just swallow the mainstream version of history uncritically and then try to barf it back in soundbites to validate whatever center-left political action is taken.

It's a good thing that regions of this country don't accept or fit into the mainstream of American society and history. It shows that we can tolerate disagreement. We can express our disagreements without loudly demanding absolutist positions and through the exertion of faux moral highground to validate our political desires.
 
2013-02-06 02:56:26 PM  

KenShabby: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

Yeah, that was the War of 1812.


Yes, he brings that up a lot. A whole lot. I expect him to post a pic of Canadian soldiers burning the White House any moment now.
 
2013-02-06 02:56:28 PM  

Karac: Good luck, non-racist Memphisites.  I remember the kerfuffle over taking the confederate flag off the state house in South Carolina.  It cost the governor the re-election and at the end of the day, it was moved all the way from the top of the building to .... a statue on the front lawn.


Don't forget the resemblance of the state flag of Georgia to the CSA flag (not the battle flag).


CSA flag:
upload.wikimedia.org
Georgia state flag:
upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-02-06 02:56:36 PM  
People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.
 
2013-02-06 02:56:55 PM  

max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.


Are they the same day?

I can see Texas going in either direction with that, actually.
 
2013-02-06 02:57:00 PM  

RealityChuck: Nathan Bedford Forrest was an advocate for Civil Rights after the war.  Read the article.

Notably this speech to the organization that later became the NAACP:

Ladies and Gentlemen I accept the flowers as a memento of reconciliation between the white and colored races of the southern states. I accept it more particularly as it comes from a colored lady, for if there is any one on God's earth who loves the ladies I believe it is myself. ( Immense applause and laughter.) I came here with the jeers of some white people, who think that I am doing wrong. I believe I can exert some influence, and do much to assist the people in strengthening fraternal relations, and shall do all in my power to elevate every man to depress none. (Applause.) I want to elevate you to take positions in law offices, in stores, on farms, and wherever you are capable of going. I have not said anything about politics today. I don't propose to say anything about politics. You have a right to elect whom you please; vote for the man you think best, and I think, when that is done, you and I are freemen. Do as you consider right and honest in electing men for office. I did not come here to make you a long speech, although invited to do so by you. I am not much of a speaker, and my business prevented me from preparing myself. I came to meet you as friends, and welcome you to the white people. I want you to come nearer to us. When I can serve you I will do so. We have but one flag, one country; let us stand together. We may differ in color, but not in sentiment Many things have been said about me which are wrong, and which white and black persons here, who stood by me through the war, can contradict. Go to work, be industrious, live honestly and act truly, and when you are oppressed I'll come to your relief. I thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for this opportunity you have afforded me to be with you, and to assure you that I am with you in heart and in hand. (Prolonged applause.)

He then gave a black w ...


Yeah. Forrest was a Democratic politician, and involved in efforts after the war to try to attract black voters to the party. Once they had been disenfranchised, you didn't see a lot of former Confederates sucking up to groups of black people. They did all those things, got oppressed any way, and Forrest didn't get in the way of Jim Crow.
 
2013-02-06 02:57:05 PM  

Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.


So the 'merikun mission statement of that war was to "run away whilst screaming like girls & pissing your pants"?
 
2013-02-06 02:57:25 PM  

karnal: HotWingConspiracy: karnal: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?

Likely due to racists in local government.


Here are our local officials.....see if you can you spot the racists?

http://www.cityofmobile.org/govt.php


When was the street named?
 
2013-02-06 02:57:39 PM  
www4.pictures.zimbio.com
"Rename all the parks but make sure to take out all the basketball courts."
 
2013-02-06 02:57:43 PM  
why don't cities just name their parks properly so you know what you're in for. Prostitution Park, Methamphetamine Park, Panhandlers Park, Buttf*ck Park....I think you can get the idea.
 
2013-02-06 02:58:08 PM  

KenShabby: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

Yeah, that was the War of 1812.


angrymanspeaks.files.wordpress.com
All right. w'ell call it a draw.
 
2013-02-06 02:58:24 PM  

Farce-Side: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

So, the same thing the rest of the country has to be proud of then?  (Native Americans ring a bell?)


Benjamin Orr: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

You mean the Indians?


A good point for a different discussion.  It, however, doesn't address my original question, unless you're trying to say that subjugating Africans was OK by virtue of the fact that we'd already subjugated the Native Americans.
 
2013-02-06 02:59:02 PM  

Nabb1: KenShabby: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

Yeah, that was the War of 1812.

Yes, he brings that up a lot. A whole lot. I expect him to post a pic of Canadian soldiers burning the White House any moment now.


I see. I'll just move along now.
 
2013-02-06 02:59:12 PM  
"" Memphis votes ""

Democracy.  How does it work?
 
2013-02-06 02:59:37 PM  
Weren't there 3 black kids who were murdered by a sniper in Memphis back in the 70's? Name the parks after them
 
2013-02-06 02:59:57 PM  
I'm opposed to it also, simply because its part of our nations history.

We have schools and parks named after Malcolm X who was a hatred filled racist man, who in the end was shot something like 50 times by his own followers.

Get over it.
 
2013-02-06 03:00:05 PM  

Walker: Just in the local area of Virginia here we have Jefferson Davis Highway


Jeff Davis Highway here in Richmond is the white trash version of Martin Luther King Boulevard.  All the ugly hookers and meth you could want.
 
2013-02-06 03:00:27 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

You celebrate treason as heritage?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4th_of_july
 
2013-02-06 03:00:30 PM  

oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

So the 'merikun mission statement of that war was to "run away whilst screaming like girls & pissing your pants"?


There's a spot not far from where I'm sitting where a few hundred men under Andrew Jackson turned a much larger force of the Crown's finest into alligator shiat.
 
2013-02-06 03:00:35 PM  

CheekyMonkey: A good point for a different discussion.  It, however, doesn't address my original question, unless you're trying to say that subjugating Africans was OK by virtue of the fact that we'd already subjugated the Native Americans.


It is a reaction (and a just one, I think) to the relatively naive comment that the South and Southerns have nothing to be proud of.

The rest of the country has farked up and acted like dicks in the past (Native Americans, Japanese Americans in WWII, etc), but they're proud of plenty (of other things).
 
2013-02-06 03:00:37 PM  

doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???


No, no. A history of armed rebellion in defense of slavery and violent repression of minorities is something that everyone should be proud of!
 
2013-02-06 03:00:46 PM  

quiet_american: The irrationality in this thread is really depressing.

Everyone comments as though they are the supreme overlord of Memphis, that they are the final word on history, that no other viewpoint than theirs is correct.

It is much better and wiser to let regions of this enormous country showcase what they want. If Memphis wants to make a memorial to Gen. Forrest, let them. If 200 years later they want to tear it down, let them. If pro-Confederate groups want to agitate against the changes, let them. Let them persuade the people of Memphis.

Yet people in here have this tyrant's attitude, which has become the new norm apparently, to just swallow the mainstream version of history uncritically and then try to barf it back in soundbites to validate whatever center-left political action is taken.

It's a good thing that regions of this country don't accept or fit into the mainstream of American society and history. It shows that we can tolerate disagreement. We can express our disagreements without loudly demanding absolutist positions and through the exertion of faux moral highground to validate our political desires.



Here....I got you something:

sportymom.me
 
2013-02-06 03:00:58 PM  

minoridiot: It's no worst then naming stuff after George Custer or Nathaniel Lyon.  Both did a fine job of handling injuns.


And Andrew Jackson is on the $20 bill.
 
2013-02-06 03:01:04 PM  

quiet_american: It is much better and wiser to let regions of this enormous country showcase what they want. If Memphis wants to make a memorial to Gen. Forrest, let them. If 200 years later they want to tear it down, let them. If pro-Confederate groups want to agitate against the changes, let them. Let them persuade the people of Memphis.


Why don't you just calm down and let people biatch and rant on fark? Seriously, pro-Confederate groups can agitate, but you can't tolerate people just talking on fark? Fascist freak....
 
2013-02-06 03:01:11 PM  

darth_badger: [www4.pictures.zimbio.com image 431x594]
"Rename all the parks but make sure to take out all the basketball courts."


Can I politely ask who/what the f**k is that?
 
2013-02-06 03:01:24 PM  

ph0rk: Karac: Good luck, non-racist Memphisites.  I remember the kerfuffle over taking the confederate flag off the state house in South Carolina.  It cost the governor the re-election and at the end of the day, it was moved all the way from the top of the building to .... a statue on the front lawn.

Don't forget the resemblance of the state flag of Georgia to the CSA flag (not the battle flag).


CSA flag:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 500x278]
Georgia state flag:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 500x313]


So you'd rather we switch back to the old one?

encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com
 
2013-02-06 03:02:08 PM  

Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.


Not a bad troll, but no one honestly believes a bagel is superior to a biscuit.
 
2013-02-06 03:02:13 PM  

oldfarthenry: Lost Thought 00: Its not like Germany took down all the Hitler statues and decided to stop flying the Nazi flag over their capital.

Well, the VW Beetle was quite a popular car for years despite getting two thumbs up from the uniballed little prick.


Not just "getting two thumbs up" but rather "commissioned by".  The Beetle was a direct result of Hitler requesting, and getting, a low-cost, simple and reliable automobile.  It's popularity had to do with it's high value-to-cost ratio.  Ferdinand Porsche was somewhat of an automotive genius.
 
2013-02-06 03:02:27 PM  

oldfarthenry: darth_badger: [www4.pictures.zimbio.com image 431x594]
"Rename all the parks but make sure to take out all the basketball courts."

Can I politely ask who/what the f**k is that?


A person dressed up like Uncle Ruckus:

i317.photobucket.com
 
2013-02-06 03:02:35 PM  

Red Shirt Blues: ph0rk: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

fark you, carpetbagger.

More bourbon, barbecue, and hush puppies for me us.

Over 90% of bourbon is from Kentucky which was a union state. And don't include Jack Daniels as it is not a bourbon. It could be called a bourbon but the manufacturers don't want to call it bourbon as it has a distinct flavor from bourbon.


It is a long-standing joke that Kentucky was the only state to join the Confederacy AFTER the Civil War. While the Confederate Senators of other Southern states were shunned and sometimes prosecuted, in Kentucky they were made judges and elected to statewide political offices. Until around 1900, it was very difficult to be appointed to the bench or elected to any political office without having had Confederate sympathies.

But you are 100% correct about the bourbon. That swill they make in Tessessee just doesn't deserve the name.
 
2013-02-06 03:02:37 PM  

Mid_mo_mad_man: Being a brilliant military commander does. Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did


Lee did a bang up job of defeating himself, too. Especially not listening to Longstreet's advice with regard to Gettysburg (instead of fighting them there, get between the union army and DC). A LOT of generals in that war used Napoleonic Tactics (An entrenched position can be taken by simply throwing enough people at it) without taking the enhanced firearms of the age into account.
 
2013-02-06 03:03:00 PM  

Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

So the 'merikun mission statement of that war was to "run away whilst screaming like girls & pissing your pants"?

There's a spot not far from where I'm sitting where a few hundred men under Andrew Jackson turned a much larger force of the Crown's finest into alligator shiat.


And there's a whole country I'm sittin' in that you blowhards failed to conquer - on three attempts, I might add.
 
2013-02-06 03:03:04 PM  
oldfarthenry:
Can I politely ask who/what the f**k is that?

Uncle Ruckus.


no relation
 
2013-02-06 03:03:06 PM  

Farce-Side: ph0rk: Karac: Good luck, non-racist Memphisites.  I remember the kerfuffle over taking the confederate flag off the state house in South Carolina.  It cost the governor the re-election and at the end of the day, it was moved all the way from the top of the building to .... a statue on the front lawn.

Don't forget the resemblance of the state flag of Georgia to the CSA flag (not the battle flag).


CSA flag:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 500x278]
Georgia state flag:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 500x313]

So you'd rather we switch back to the old one?

[encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com image 276x183]


Heh, no, but I wish more people would have farking noticed what it was changed to.
 
2013-02-06 03:03:07 PM  

farm machine: The cleansing of history continues as the intolerant continue to widen their scope of what is offensive.  Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures?  A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.  When we lose sight of where we've come from don't we also risk letting history repeat itself?


Yes how dare we not tolerate slavery, racism and treason. Those things shouldn't be considered in any way offensive. We must continue to honor those associated with those noble causes.
 
2013-02-06 03:03:35 PM  

farm machine: The cleansing of history continues as the intolerant continue to widen their scope of what is offensive.  Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures?  A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.  When we lose sight of where we've come from don't we also risk letting history repeat itself?


Of course, Memphis could do what most civilized communities do, and put up a nice little informative sign explaining the history of the park, and why it was renamed. Then when the Honey BooBoo clans go there for their annual "eat cheez puffs and be sedentary outside" outing, they can read the first three words of it before getting bored/winded/distracted by a shiny thing.
 
2013-02-06 03:03:40 PM  

Marisyana: Walker: Just in the local area of Virginia here we have Jefferson Davis Highway

Jeff Davis Highway here in Richmond is the white trash version of Martin Luther King Boulevard.  All the ugly hookers and meth you could want.


What makes that even funnier is that the Pentagon is visible from the Jeff Davis. (I work here - not the Pentagon; about a mile south.)

// maybe that's what it turns into after dark, or once you get to Old Town
// during the day it's hot hookers and pot
// ...um, so I hear
 
2013-02-06 03:03:42 PM  
When northern soldiers invaded the courthouse of Murfreesboro, TN, they made it their local headquarters. Forrest was informed by some local women that some male Confederate sympathizers were being held Murfreesboro. Forrest quietly invaded the town in the middle of the night. When his men found the jail on fire, they went in to rescue men. After several hours of fighting, he raided the courthouse.

And that's why they're called the MTSU Raiders.
The ROTC building is named after him as well.
 
2013-02-06 03:04:01 PM  

Onkel Buck: someonelse: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

Not the worst.

[freebeacon.com image 798x498]

ohyou.jpg

/hating rich people is a learned behavior


Rich people are excellent teachers.
 
2013-02-06 03:04:11 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House


I reckon that's your problem right there, fella. Any man with a head under his cap and one foot on each shoe can tell ya you don't get chicken feed by going to the cotton gin, and as sure as sugar is sweet, if you're looking to get sweet on Sally you don't dance with Darlene.
 
2013-02-06 03:04:46 PM  

max_pooper: They can be proud all they want but they shouldn't be surprised when people correctly point that their "heritage" is deeply rooted in destructive racism.


Last time I checked, the North had slaves also.  Oh, and the South didn't invent it. It's been around for as long as men have walked the earth. But yeah, let's all focus on hating Southerners. :O
http://www.slavenorth.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_slavery
 
2013-02-06 03:04:48 PM  

Bartleby the Scrivener: at  least forrest sounds like a good loser.  tldr: suck it up, we lost. you'll get over it.

farewell letter to troops (wiki)


Forrest may have been a capable military commander who did his military duty with courage and honor. He was also a vicious racist who was a founder of the KKK.

Memorials (even something as simple as the name of a park) are inherently hagiographic--they celebrate an individual while glossing over or ignoring that individual's flaws, mistakes, and problems. They indicate that the subject of the memorial was a praiseworthy individual, and the glow of that praise encompasses--to a greater or lesser extent--everything that person did. That's why memorials to Forrest are inherently problematic.

I doubt you'll find a park anywhere in this country named after Benedict Arnold, despite the fact that he served the Continental Army with distinction between 1775 and 1779. Because to memorialize him in such a way would serve to diminish the enormity of his treason.
 
2013-02-06 03:04:49 PM  

SMB2811: All2morrowsparTs: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

You celebrate treason as heritage?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4th_of_july


It's only treason if you lose the war.
 
2013-02-06 03:05:05 PM  

oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

So the 'merikun mission statement of that war was to "run away whilst screaming like girls & pissing your pants"?

There's a spot not far from where I'm sitting where a few hundred men under Andrew Jackson turned a much larger force of the Crown's finest into alligator shiat.

And there's a whole country I'm sittin' in that you blowhards failed to conquer - on three attempts, I might add.


You must have fought quite valiantly in those battles. Did you receive any medals?
 
2013-02-06 03:05:19 PM  

Bartleby the Scrivener: Rapmaster2000: Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House

I reckon that's your problem right there, fella. Any man with a head under his cap and one foot on each shoe can tell ya you don't get chicken feed by going to the cotton gin, and as sure as sugar is sweet, if you're looking to get sweet on Sally you don't dance with Darlene.


Apropos of nothing, I read that in Uncle Ruckus's voice.

You are now reading this text in Uncle Ruckus's voice.
 
2013-02-06 03:05:28 PM  

ph0rk: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

fark you, carpetbagger.

More bourbon, barbecue, and hush puppies for me us.


Let's not get carried away.
 
2013-02-06 03:06:05 PM  

scout48: Those people fought for what that state believed in.  Agree or disagree, I respect that. So many have forgotten that slavery was only a part of the civil war. We were a country that only a generation or two before had fought to be free from an oppressive government. Many were just pissed off that the new government, not as old as their fathers and grandfathers, was already telling them what to do. Many of the wealthy and influential feared their livelihood would be destroyed. Perspective helps. Any person denying slavery was a big part of the Civil War is an idiot. Any one who says it was the only factor is just as big of an idiot. The south believed they were being oppressed and fought to end that perceived oppression. The only difference in the south and the Revolutionary Colonials (who were slave owners) is that the Colonials won. Had they lost we would all be talking about what murderous and treasonous asses we all were as we toasted long live the queen.


So, just to be clear, you'd be cool with parks named in honor of the 9/11 hijackers too, right?  They were fighting for what they believed in, however abhorrent.  That's, you know, what you seem to be saying, that because they believed in what they were doing, it absolves them of responsibility for their actions.

You know who else I think you'd be ok with a park named after?
 
2013-02-06 03:06:22 PM  

MagSeven: RealityChuck: Nathan Bedford Forrest was an advocate for Civil Rights after the war.  Read the article.

Notably this speech to the organization that later became the NAACP:

Ladies and Gentlemen I accept the flowers as a memento of reconciliation between the white and colored races of the southern states. I accept it more particularly as it comes from a colored lady, for if there is any one on God's earth who loves the ladies I believe it is myself. ( Immense applause and laughter.) I came here with the jeers of some white people, who think that I am doing wrong. I believe I can exert some influence, and do much to assist the people in strengthening fraternal relations, and shall do all in my power to elevate every man to depress none. (Applause.) I want to elevate you to take positions in law offices, in stores, on farms, and wherever you are capable of going. I have not said anything about politics today. I don't propose to say anything about politics. You have a right to elect whom you please; vote for the man you think best, and I think, when that is done, you and I are freemen. Do as you consider right and honest in electing men for office. I did not come here to make you a long speech, although invited to do so by you. I am not much of a speaker, and my business prevented me from preparing myself. I came to meet you as friends, and welcome you to the white people. I want you to come nearer to us. When I can serve you I will do so. We have but one flag, one country; let us stand together. We may differ in color, but not in sentiment Many things have been said about me which are wrong, and which white and black persons here, who stood by me through the war, can contradict. Go to work, be industrious, live honestly and act truly, and when you are oppressed I'll come to your relief. I thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for this opportunity you have afforded me to be with you, and to assure you that I am with you in heart and in hand. (Prolonged applause.)

Wow, I did not know that.



It's not as impressive as it sounds. He was making a speech to a black audience, in an attempt to win black voters. He did bugger all to further their civil rights. Read it in context.
 
2013-02-06 03:06:28 PM  

Mr. Cat Poop: Brick-House: How about naming one the Robert Byrd Memorial Park?

[upload.wikimedia.org image 220x275]

He already got this named after him.
[i.huffpost.com image 570x238]

/Been to the top of it.


Every building, road, tree and rock in West Virginia is already named after him.

Hell, they should just call it "The Robert C. Byrd State of West Virginia".
 
2013-02-06 03:07:03 PM  
cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...

Well that is the typical Libertarian POV on this.
 
2013-02-06 03:07:14 PM  

CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners. That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of? I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...


I love this.  The North had slaves. And to look at a group of people and say that they have nothing to be proud of.  Classic.  Love this.  Thanks for showing your colors.
Q: How many liberals does it take to change a lightbulb?
A: You're a racist.
 
2013-02-06 03:07:15 PM  
 Just name the gatdanged Park after Colonel Angus and be done with it, you honkey assed crackers.  You know the brother don't wan' nothin' to do with no Colonel Angus.
 
2013-02-06 03:07:44 PM  

ArtosRC: doczoidberg: Friggin' South. You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

Precisely. The traitors need to be kicked in the pants.


So .... you hate all Americans?  Especially that arch-traitor John Hancock?
 
2013-02-06 03:07:47 PM  

ph0rk: Heh, no, but I wish more people would have farking noticed what it was changed to.


They noticed, you have no idea the trouble and outrage it took to change it from the Stars and Bars, it was one of those lesser of 2 evils things.  At least now every government building doesn't look like it is holding a Klan rally.
 
2013-02-06 03:08:14 PM  

Onkel Buck: someonelse: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

Not the worst.

[freebeacon.com image 798x498]

ohyou.jpg

/hating rich people is a learned behavior


So is hating black people.

See: Any playground with children of different races.
 
2013-02-06 03:08:15 PM  

quiet_american: The irrationality in this thread is really depressing.

Everyone comments as though they are the supreme overlord of Memphis, that they are the final word on history, that no other viewpoint than theirs is correct.

It is much better and wiser to let regions of this enormous country showcase what they want. If Memphis wants to make a memorial to Gen. Forrest, let them. If 200 years later they want to tear it down, let them. If pro-Confederate groups want to agitate against the changes, let them. Let them persuade the people of Memphis.

Yet people in here have this tyrant's attitude, which has become the new norm apparently, to just swallow the mainstream version of history uncritically and then try to barf it back in soundbites to validate whatever center-left political action is taken.

It's a good thing that regions of this country don't accept or fit into the mainstream of American society and history. It shows that we can tolerate disagreement. We can express our disagreements without loudly demanding absolutist positions and through the exertion of faux moral highground to validate our political desires.


Why, that sounds *reasonable.* GRAB THE TAR N FEATHERS, BOYS!

/nicely written
 
2013-02-06 03:08:43 PM  

ph0rk: Karac: Good luck, non-racist Memphisites.  I remember the kerfuffle over taking the confederate flag off the state house in South Carolina.  It cost the governor the re-election and at the end of the day, it was moved all the way from the top of the building to .... a statue on the front lawn.

Don't forget the resemblance of the state flag of Georgia to the CSA flag (not the battle flag).


CSA flag:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 500x278]
Georgia state flag:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 500x313]


That was awesome.  So Governor Goober promised Georgians that if elected he would change the flag back to the battle flag even though he was constitutionally prevented from doing so.  Upon election, he reveals that (sad trombone) he doesn't have the power to do so, but he would if he could.

www.georgiaheritagecouncil.org

So we got this stereotypical image.
 
2013-02-06 03:09:00 PM  
I've asked folks what "Southern Pride" stands for, and most answers are some form of "being proud of your heritage."

Just remember that White Southern heritage is basically succeeding from the Union because you wanted to continue to keep other human beings as slaves.
 
2013-02-06 03:09:22 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: karnal: HotWingConspiracy: karnal: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

What is interesting is that when the streets were originally named after MLK, they did not run right through the worse part of town.  Over time they became the worse.  Wonder why that is?

Likely due to racists in local government.


Here are our local officials.....see if you can you spot the racists?

http://www.cityofmobile.org/govt.php

When was the street named?



Late 70's....maybe early 80's....there are a lot of houses along this stretch that were very nice back then too....now sit abandoned or needing to be demolished.
Maybe all the white people decided to move than live on a street named after Mr King.....I don't know.  It would be interesting to find out though.
 
2013-02-06 03:09:30 PM  

Tom_Slick: ph0rk: Heh, no, but I wish more people would have farking noticed what it was changed to.

They noticed, you have no idea the trouble and outrage it took to change it from the Stars and Bars, it was one of those lesser of 2 evils things.  At least now every government building doesn't look like it is holding a Klan rally.


No, it just looks like the inhabitants are quietly waiting for the South to rise again.

Further, you could plaster the CSA flag on pickups and cheap tshirts all over the country and hardly anyone would get pissed.
 
2013-02-06 03:09:53 PM  

mbillips: MagSeven: RealityChuck: Nathan Bedford Forrest was an advocate for Civil Rights after the war.  Read the article.

Notably this speech to the organization that later became the NAACP:

Ladies and Gentlemen I accept the flowers as a memento of reconciliation between the white and colored races of the southern states. I accept it more particularly as it comes from a colored lady, for if there is any one on God's earth who loves the ladies I believe it is myself. ( Immense applause and laughter.) I came here with the jeers of some white people, who think that I am doing wrong. I believe I can exert some influence, and do much to assist the people in strengthening fraternal relations, and shall do all in my power to elevate every man to depress none. (Applause.) I want to elevate you to take positions in law offices, in stores, on farms, and wherever you are capable of going. I have not said anything about politics today. I don't propose to say anything about politics. You have a right to elect whom you please; vote for the man you think best, and I think, when that is done, you and I are freemen. Do as you consider right and honest in electing men for office. I did not come here to make you a long speech, although invited to do so by you. I am not much of a speaker, and my business prevented me from preparing myself. I came to meet you as friends, and welcome you to the white people. I want you to come nearer to us. When I can serve you I will do so. We have but one flag, one country; let us stand together. We may differ in color, but not in sentiment Many things have been said about me which are wrong, and which white and black persons here, who stood by me through the war, can contradict. Go to work, be industrious, live honestly and act truly, and when you are oppressed I'll come to your relief. I thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for this opportunity you have afforded me to be with you, and to assure you that I am with you in heart and in hand. (Prolonged applause.) ...


Drats. I wanted to take it at face value with him having no ulterior motives.
/silly me!
//thanks for the link
 
2013-02-06 03:10:14 PM  

Onkel Buck: someonelse: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

Not the worst.

[freebeacon.com image 798x498]

ohyou.jpg

/hating rich people is a learned behavior


Fail.  You don't have to teach a dog to want another dog's bone.
 
2013-02-06 03:10:46 PM  

oldfarthenry: darth_badger: [www4.pictures.zimbio.com image 431x594]
"Rename all the parks but make sure to take out all the basketball courts."

Can I politely ask who/what the f**k is that?



Uncle Ruckus ... no relation.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/362353100/the-uncle-ruckus-movie
 
2013-02-06 03:11:02 PM  

dukwbutter: max_pooper: They can be proud all they want but they shouldn't be surprised when people correctly point that their "heritage" is deeply rooted in destructive racism.

Last time I checked, the North had slaves also.  Oh, and the South didn't invent it. It's been around for as long as men have walked the earth. But yeah, let's all focus on hating Southerners. :O
http://www.slavenorth.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_slavery



Yeah, but the North got better; only Delaware, Maryland, Kentucky and Missouri (and DC) allowed slavery in 1861. And they didn't secede from the Union and fight a bloody war in order to preserve slavery. Cannibalism and rape have been around as long as men have walked the earth, too.
 
2013-02-06 03:11:09 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


...and the Germans. Don't forget them...
 
2013-02-06 03:11:10 PM  

dukwbutter: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners. That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of? I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

I love this.  The North had slaves. And to look at a group of people and say that they have nothing to be proud of.  Classic.  Love this.  Thanks for showing your colors.
Q: How many liberals does it take to change a lightbulb?
A: You're a racist.


If the civil war was, in fact, about states rights, then why did the south actively and repeatedly (when they were part of the union) attempt to deny the states rights of the *northen* states, with shiat like the fugitive slave act?
 
2013-02-06 03:11:29 PM  

ph0rk: CheekyMonkey: A good point for a different discussion.  It, however, doesn't address my original question, unless you're trying to say that subjugating Africans was OK by virtue of the fact that we'd already subjugated the Native Americans.

It is a reaction (and a just one, I think) to the relatively naive comment that the South and Southerns have nothing to be proud of.

The rest of the country has farked up and acted like dicks in the past (Native Americans, Japanese Americans in WWII, etc), but they're proud of plenty (of other things).


The rest of the country doesn't name parks and fly flags celebrating this evil shiat.  Maybe the south should take a farking hint and move into the 21st century with the rest of the country.  Take your little boy rebel underwear off the god damn capital buildings and stop whining every time someone forces you to scrub some horribly racist shiat out of the public eye.
 
2013-02-06 03:11:37 PM  

zarberg: I've asked folks what "Southern Pride" stands for, and most answers are some form of "being proud of your heritage."

Just remember that White Southern heritage is basically succeeding from the Union because you wanted to continue to keep other human beings as slaves.


Uneducated people will give uneducated answers to a similar question regardless of what part of the country they are from.
 
2013-02-06 03:11:55 PM  

CheekyMonkey: A good point for a different discussion. It, however, doesn't address my original question, unless you're trying to say that subjugating Africans was OK by virtue of the fact that we'd already subjugated the Native Americans.


CheekyMonkey, you seem to miss somehow that the North had slaves also.  Not only that, but the Civil war wasn't about slavery.  Lincoln told the South they could keep their slaves if they'd just stay in the Union.  Also, the Emancipation freed only the slaves in the South, not the Slaves in the North. The more you know. ;)

Not really so cheeky now are we?  More like a politically correct fool.
 
2013-02-06 03:13:39 PM  

Brick-House: How about naming one the Robert Byrd Memorial Park?


I don't understand.  Why do you think a city in Tennessee should name a park for a Senator from West Virginia?
 
2013-02-06 03:13:47 PM  

Spaced Cowboy: ph0rk: CheekyMonkey: A good point for a different discussion.  It, however, doesn't address my original question, unless you're trying to say that subjugating Africans was OK by virtue of the fact that we'd already subjugated the Native Americans.

It is a reaction (and a just one, I think) to the relatively naive comment that the South and Southerns have nothing to be proud of.

The rest of the country has farked up and acted like dicks in the past (Native Americans, Japanese Americans in WWII, etc), but they're proud of plenty (of other things).

The rest of the country doesn't name parks and fly flags celebrating this evil shiat.  Maybe the south should take a farking hint and move into the 21st century with the rest of the country.  Take your little boy rebel underwear off the god damn capital buildings and stop whining every time someone forces you to scrub some horribly racist shiat out of the public eye.


Uh. The town of Forsyth, Montana is named after the US commander at Wounded Knee.
 
2013-02-06 03:13:49 PM  

max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.


Apologies if this is a repeat, but bullshiat. We get MLK day like everyone else. I have never heard of those other two.

/some of us down here are still sane
 
2013-02-06 03:13:53 PM  

Mid_mo_mad_man: HotWingConspiracy: Mid_mo_mad_man: Forrest did not start the KKK that existed in the 1950's. The klan he founded died out fairly quickly.

Well that hardly deserves a park naming.

Being a brilliant military commander does. Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did


I doubt we'll see Rommel park anytime soon.

It doesn't matter how good at his job he was. He fought on the side of evil. The evil side doesn't deserve statues. None.
 
2013-02-06 03:14:12 PM  

Bartleby the Scrivener


I reckon that's your problem right there, fella. Any man with a head under his cap and one foot on each shoe can tell ya you don't get chicken feed by going to the cotton gin, and as sure as sugar is sweet, if you're looking to get sweet on Sally you don't dance with Darlene.


Okay, who let Ross Perot in here??
 
2013-02-06 03:14:13 PM  

CheekyMonkey: Farce-Side: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

So, the same thing the rest of the country has to be proud of then?  (Native Americans ring a bell?)

Benjamin Orr: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

You mean the Indians?

A good point for a different discussion.  It, however, doesn't address my original question, unless you're trying to say that subjugating Africans was OK by virtue of the fact that we'd already subjugated the Native Americans.



If they'd been a little more disease resistant, the European colonists wouldn't have imported Africans.
 
2013-02-06 03:14:20 PM  
The "states rights" rationalization always makes me chuckle, as it was the federal government's refusal to enforce the fugitive slave act that was such a big issue at the time. You know, where the federal government would force northern states to return slaves escaped from southern states. Kinda the opposite of states rights if you ask me.

Or maybe we can ask R.E. Lee. When asked by Lincoln to command the Army of Potomac he replied, "I look upon secession as anarchy. If I owned the four millions of slaves at the South, I would sacrifice them all to the Union; but how can I draw my sword upon Virginia, my native state?"

So he seemed to think freeing the slaves would have solved everything. But what did he know?
 
2013-02-06 03:14:27 PM  

dukwbutter: CheekyMonkey, you seem to miss somehow that the North had slaves also. Not only that, but the Civil war wasn't about slavery. Lincoln told the South they could keep their slaves if they'd just stay in the Union. Also, the Emancipation freed only the slaves in the South, not the Slaves in the North. The more you know. ;)

Not really so cheeky now are we? More like a politically correct fool.


Yes it was. The North did not go to war to prevent slavery, but the south sure as hell went to war because they feared it would be eliminated.

For fark's sake, have you even *read* the articles of succession?

Political correctness isn't really tied to any part of the political spectrum. (see: 'Homicide Bombers'), and "No no it was about STATES RIGHTS! Slavery played no part!" is a *STUNNING* example of it.
 
2013-02-06 03:14:47 PM  

Galloping Galoshes: All2morrowsparTs: Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities States named after British royalty.

Maryland, Virginia, the Carolinas, Delaware, and Georgia.

Still?  Are you proposing they change?


No. Not at all. Not even the cities. You see that is actual heritage. We were made up of French, Dutch, English, Spanish and Russian colonies as well as the Indingenous Nations before that and the names of our States and Cities reflect that.
 
2013-02-06 03:16:02 PM  

ph0rk: oldfarthenry: darth_badger: [www4.pictures.zimbio.com image 431x594]
"Rename all the parks but make sure to take out all the basketball courts."

Can I politely ask who/what the f**k is that?

A person dressed up like Uncle Ruckus:

[i317.photobucket.com image 600x750]



No it's the REAL Uncle Ruckus, Gary Anthony Williams, in costume at the NAACP Image awards promoting the new movie project.

http://youtu.be/XCVrZ10tFT0 - Uncle Ruckus at the NAACP Image Awards - NSFW
 
2013-02-06 03:16:10 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Maybe we should start naming things after British Reveloutionary War Generals in New England and American-Mexican Mexican Generals in the Southwest.

How about the Benedict Arnaold Memorial Park.


we got a monument in NY

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boot_Monument">http://en.wikipedia.org/ wiki/Boot_Monument
 
2013-02-06 03:16:23 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Philip Francis Queeg: Will someone please tell me what the positive legacies of Nathan Bedford Forrest were? What exactly is being honored? His profound ignorance? His slaughter of surrendered troops. His slave trading? His terrorism? What is the "legacy " that deserves anything beyond derision?

His Cameo in Forrest Gump?


"They'd all dress up in their robes and their bedsheets and act like a bunch of ghosts or spooks or something. They'd even put  bedsheets on their horses and ride around. And anyway, that's how I got my name. Forrest Gump. Momma said that the Forrest part was to remind me that sometimes we all do things that, well, just don't make no sense."

And the South continues the tradition of things that, well, don't make no sense.
 
2013-02-06 03:16:25 PM  
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-06 03:16:26 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: Yes how dare we not tolerate slavery, racism and treason. Those things shouldn't be considered in any way offensive. We must continue to honor those associated with those noble causes.


"Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."
 
2013-02-06 03:16:53 PM  

dukwbutter: And to look at a group of people and say that they have nothing to be proud of.


They have plenty to be proud of.  The Confederacy is  not one of them.  The Civil War is  not one of them.  The Confederate flag is  not one of them.

It's not so much having pride, it's being proud of something profoundly and forever linked to the concept of owning other human beings and treating them as property.  That's, sorry, just not something to be proud of.

There's plenty of other things the south could be proud of, but this is like a millstone they wear around their necks and act like it's made of gold.
 
2013-02-06 03:16:53 PM  
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-06 03:17:18 PM  

drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.


Not all Southern Whites are racist but all Southern Whites that name thier parks after Confederate Generals are.
 
2013-02-06 03:17:56 PM  

RedT: max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.

Other fun fact - Confederate Heroes Day and Martin Luther King Day are during the same week and sometimes on the same day!  But don't tell a Texas there is anything ironic about this schedule or you WILL get an angry States' Rights speech


Austinite? And totally hawt?
How YOU doin'?
 
2013-02-06 03:18:00 PM  
From South Carolina's Article of Secession.

"

No person held to service or labor in one State, under the laws thereof, escaping into another, shall, in consequence of any law or regulation therein, be discharged from such service or labor, but shall be delivered up, on claim of the party to whom such service or labor may be due."
This stipulation was so material to the compact, that without it that compact would not have been made. The greater number of the contracting parties held slaves, and they had previously evinced their estimate of the value of such a stipulation by making it a condition in the Ordinance for the government of the territory ceded by Virginia, which now composes the States north of the Ohio River.



The same article of the Constitution stipulates also for rendition by the several States of fugitives from justice from the other States.
The General Government, as the common agent, passed laws to carry into effect these stipulations of the States. For many years these laws were executed. But an increasing hostility on the part of the non-slaveholding States to the institution of slavery, has led to a disregard of their obligations, and the laws of the General Government have ceased to effect the objects of the Constitution. The States of Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Wisconsin and Iowa, have enacted laws which either nullify the Acts of Congress or render useless any attempt to execute them. In many of these States the fugitive is discharged from service or labor claimed, and in none of them has the State Government complied with the stipulation made in the Constitution. The State of New Jersey, at an early day, passed a law in conformity with her constitutional obligation; but the current of anti-slavery feeling has led her more recently to enact laws which render inoperative the remedies provided by her own law and by the laws of Congress. In the State of New York even the right of transit for a slave has been denied by her tribunals; and the States of Ohio and Iowa have refused to surrender to justice fugitives charged with murder, and with inciting servile insurrection in the State of Virginia. Thus the constituted compact has been deliberately broken and disregarded by the non-slaveholding States, and the consequence follows that South Carolina is released from her obligation.



The ends for which the Constitution was framed are declared by itself to be "to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity."
These ends it endeavored to accomplish by a Federal Government, in which each State was recognized as an equal, and had separate control over its own institutions. The right of property in slaves was recognized by giving to free persons distinct political rights, by giving them the right to represent, and burthening them with direct taxes for three-fifths of their slaves; by authorizing the importation of slaves for twenty years; and by stipulating for the rendition of fugitives from labor.



We affirm that these ends for which this Government was instituted have been defeated, and the Government itself has been made destructive of them by the action of the non-slaveholding States. Those States have assume the right of deciding upon the propriety of our domestic institutions; and have denied the rights of property established in fifteen of the States and recognized by the Constitution; they have denounced as sinful the institution of slavery; they have permitted open establishment among them of societies, whose avowed object is to disturb the peace and to eloign the property of the citizens of other States. They have encouraged and assisted thousands of our slaves to leave their homes; and those who remain, have been incited by emissaries, books and pictures to servile insurrection.


For twenty-five years this agitation has been steadily increasing, until it has now secured to its aid the power of the common Government. Observing the forms of the Constitution, a sectional party has found within that Article establishing the Executive Department, the means of subverting the Constitution itself. A geographical line has been drawn across the Union, and all the States north of that line have united in the election of a man to the high office of President of the United States, whose opinions and purposes are hostile to slavery. He is to be entrusted with the administration of the common Government, because he has declared that that "Government cannot endure permanently half slave, half free," and that the public mind must rest in the belief that slavery is in the course of ultimate extinction.


This sectional combination for the submersion of the Constitution, has been aided in some of the States by elevating to citizenship, persons who, by the supreme law of the land, are incapable of becoming citizens; and their votes have been used to inaugurate a new policy, hostile to the South, and destructive of its beliefs and safety.


On the 4th day of March next, this party will take possession of the Government. It has announced that the South shall be excluded from the common territory, that the judicial tribunals shall be made sectional, and that a war must be waged against slavery until it shall cease throughout the United States.


The guaranties of the Constitution will then no longer exist; the equal rights of the States will be lost. The slaveholding States will no longer have the power of self-government, or self-protection, and the Federal Government will have become their enemy.


Sectional interest and animosity will deepen the irritation, and all hope of remedy is rendered vain, by the fact that public opinion at the North has invested a great political error with the sanction of more erroneous religious belief.


We, therefore, the People of South Carolina, by our delegates in Convention assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, have solemnly declared that the Union heretofore existing between this State and the other States of North America, is dissolved, and that the State of South Carolina has resumed her position among the nations of the world, as a separate and independent State; with full power to levy war, conclude peace, contract alliances, establish commerce, and to do all other acts and things which independent States may of right do.


Adopted December 24, 1860  "cession.


Man. They mention slavery a LOT in there. Weird. I was assured it was not about slavery at all!
 
2013-02-06 03:18:28 PM  

MagicMissile: I'm opposed to it also, simply because its part of our nations history.

We have schools and parks named after Malcolm X who was a hatred filled racist man, who in the end was shot something like 50 times by his own followers.

Get over it.


Someone left history class before the 8th grade ended. You need to download an update to your history database. You read like a MapQuest map that hasn't added the newer streets yet.
 
2013-02-06 03:19:49 PM  

Dr. Whoof: scout48: Those people fought for what that state believed in.  Agree or disagree, I respect that. So many have forgotten that slavery was only a part of the civil war. We were a country that only a generation or two before had fought to be free from an oppressive government. Many were just pissed off that the new government, not as old as their fathers and grandfathers, was already telling them what to do. Many of the wealthy and influential feared their livelihood would be destroyed. Perspective helps. Any person denying slavery was a big part of the Civil War is an idiot. Any one who says it was the only factor is just as big of an idiot. The south believed they were being oppressed and fought to end that perceived oppression. The only difference in the south and the Revolutionary Colonials (who were slave owners) is that the Colonials won. Had they lost we would all be talking about what murderous and treasonous asses we all were as we toasted long live the queen.

So, just to be clear, you'd be cool with parks named in honor of the 9/11 hijackers too, right?  They were fighting for what they believed in, however abhorrent.  That's, you know, what you seem to be saying, that because they believed in what they were doing, it absolves them of responsibility for their actions.

You know who else I think you'd be ok with a park named after?



It's almost a sure bet that there are parks named after them. Just not on this continent.
 
2013-02-06 03:19:57 PM  

GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."


There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...
 
2013-02-06 03:21:38 PM  

Red Shirt Blues: ph0rk: ///Charcoal filtering != bourbon.

That does not preclude it from being called bourbon.


Actually real Bourbon is not Charcholed filtered. It is aged in barrels that have been burnt out.
 
2013-02-06 03:21:46 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities States named after British

sassy black Spanish royalty.

2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-06 03:21:53 PM  

Ned Stark: The north and south should split up again. Both of us would be better off.


Then you'd have a massive influx of black and poor people into the union as their lives become massively more depressing and deadly under the Rush Limbaugh presidency.
 
2013-02-06 03:22:17 PM  

VendorXeno: There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...


...so you say as if this is a new, isolated phenomena, and that the sanitizing of our history hasn't been going on for decades.
 
2013-02-06 03:22:45 PM  
Excerpt from the Texas Articles of Secession:

"Texas abandoned her separate national existence and consented to become one of the Confederated Union to promote her welfare, insure domestic tranquility and secure more substantially the blessings of peace and liberty to her people. She was received into the confederacy with her own constitution, under the guarantee of the federal constitution and the compact of annexation, that she should enjoy these blessings. She was received as a commonwealth holding, maintaining and protecting the institution known as negro slavery - the servitude of the African to the white race within her limits - a relation that had existed from the first settlement of her wilderness by the white race, and which her people intended should exist in all future time. Her institutions and geographical position established the strongest ties between her and other slaveholding States of the confederacy. Those ties have been strengthened by association. But what has been the course of the government of the United States, and of the people and authorities of the non-slave-holding States, since our connection with them?

The controlling majority of the Federal Government, under various pretences and disguises, has so administered the same as to exclude the citizens of the Southern States, unless under odious and unconstitutional restrictions, from all the immense territory owned in common by all the States on the Pacific Ocean, for the avowed purpose of acquiring sufficient power in the common government to use it as a means of destroying the institutions of Texas and her sister slaveholding States.

By the disloyalty of the Northern States and their citizens and the imbecility of the Federal Government, infamous combinations of incendiaries and outlaws have been permitted in those States and the common territory of Kansas to trample upon the federal laws, to war upon the lives and property of Southern citizens in that territory, and finally, by violence and mob law, to usurp the possession of the same as exclusively the property of the Northern States.

The Federal Government, while but partially under the control of these our unnatural and sectional enemies, has for years almost entirely failed to protect the lives and property of the people of Texas against the Indian savages on our border, and more recently against the murderous forays of banditti from the neighboring territory of Mexico; and when our State government has expended large amounts for such purpose, the Federal Government has refuse reimbursement therefore, thus rendering our condition more insecure and harassing than it was during the existence of the Republic of Texas.

These and other wrongs we have patiently borne in the vain hope that a returning sense of justice and humanity would induce a different course of administration.

When we advert to the course of individual non-slaveholding States, and that a majority of their citizens, our grievances assume far greater magnitude.

The States of Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, New York, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Wisconsin, Michigan and Iowa, by solemn legislative enactments, have deliberately, directly or indirectly violated the 3rd clause of the 2nd section of the 4th article [the fugitive slave clause] of the federal constitution, and laws passed in pursuance thereof; thereby annulling a material provision of the compact, designed by its framers to perpetuate the amity between the members of the confederacy and to secure the rights of the slave-holding States in their domestic institutions - a provision founded in justice and wisdom, and without the enforcement of which the compact fails to accomplish the object of its creation. Some of those States have imposed high fines and degrading penalties upon any of their citizens or officers who may carry out in good faith that provision of the compact, or the federal laws enacted in accordance therewith.

In all the non-slave-holding States, in violation of that good faith and comity which should exist between entirely distinct nations, the people have formed themselves into a great sectional party, now strong enough in numbers to control the affairs of each of those States, based upon an unnatural feeling of hostility to these Southern States and their beneficent and patriarchal system of African slavery, proclaiming the debasing doctrine of equality of all men, irrespective of race or color - a doctrine at war with nature, in opposition to the experience of mankind, and in violation of the plainest revelations of Divine Law. They demand the abolition of negro slavery throughout the confederacy, the recognition of political equality between the white and negro races, and avow their determination to press on their crusade against us, so long as a negro slave remains in these States.

For years past this abolition organization has been actively sowing the seeds of discord through the Union, and has rendered the federal congress the arena for spreading firebrands and hatred between the slave-holding and non-slaveholding States.

By consolidating their strength, they have placed the slave-holding States in a hopeless minority in the federal congress, and rendered representation of no avail in protecting Southern rights against their exactions and encroachments.

They have proclaimed, and at the ballot box sustained, the revolutionary doctrine that there is a "higher law" than the constitution and laws of our Federal Union, and virtually that they will disregard their oaths and trample upon our rights.

They have for years past encouraged and sustained lawless organizations to steal our slaves and prevent their recapture, and have repeatedly murdered Southern citizens while lawfully seeking their rendition.
"

Weird, they mention slavery a lot too. In fact, a major contention seems to be that the North *isn't* helping  them recapture slaves via the fugitive slave act! (Despite such an act *violating* the Northern States "State Rights").

How strange. Perhaps all the states were just lying about their ACTUAL reasons for seceding, and just mentioned slavery a lot because...

Well...

Hrm. Gee. I am positively stumped. I'm sure dukwbutter can explain how this is, in fact, not about slavery, though.
 
2013-02-06 03:22:48 PM  
upload.wikimedia.org

"That's nice... They named a tank after me."

: )
 
2013-02-06 03:23:09 PM  

Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.


Hey now, they tried to be more collectively industrious.  But then we set their labor force free.

Surely you're not suggesting that they actually do something themselves, now?

/am full of sarcasm and snark today
//having to code in java always has this effect on me
 
2013-02-06 03:23:35 PM  

VendorXeno: GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."

There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...


Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.
 
2013-02-06 03:25:09 PM  

keylock71: [upload.wikimedia.org image 250x317]

"That's nice... They named a tank after me."

: )


I propose we name an expressway from Atlanta to Savannah for him!

I wonder what method we can use to defoliate the land to be used ... hmmm ...
 
2013-02-06 03:25:16 PM  

SuperChuck: SMB2811: All2morrowsparTs: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

You celebrate treason as heritage?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4th_of_july

It's only treason if you lose the war.


Treason never prospers.
What's the reason?
If it doth prosper,
none dare call it treason!
 
2013-02-06 03:26:05 PM  
Every time this type of thread comes up about the South, it's hilarious to read the sanctimonious comments from people who have never lived here.
 
2013-02-06 03:26:55 PM  

GoldSpider: ...so you say as if this is a new, isolated phenomena, and that the sanitizing of our history hasn't been going on for decades.


Really? They've stopped teaching about the CIVIL WAR in schools? The last hold out for historic accuracy is a goddamned STREET SIGN? Are you even listening to yourself? There is nothing here that involves the "sanitation of history." I dunno what AM radio inspired delusions you use to craft your reactions but changing a street name in Memphis isn't part of any conspiracy to erase the facts of the Civil War.
 
2013-02-06 03:26:58 PM  

max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.


Never heard of Confederate Heroes Day. Lived in TX for 25 years. No such thing as Emancipation Day, unless you mean Juneteenth.
 
2013-02-06 03:27:09 PM  

oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

So the 'merikun mission statement of that war was to "run away whilst screaming like girls & pissing your pants"?

There's a spot not far from where I'm sitting where a few hundred men under Andrew Jackson turned a much larger force of the Crown's finest into alligator shiat.

And there's a whole country I'm sittin' in that you blowhards failed to conquer - on three attempts, I might add.


And yet, the current take over is being done with out a shot fired. Sad, i expected more from those who refused to be defeated by the blitz. Sad....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkuzEUVqIDo&feature=player_embedded
 
2013-02-06 03:27:47 PM  

TerminalEchoes: VendorXeno: GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."

There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...

Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.


I knew you guys hated schools, but I didn't know you couldn't even afford textbooks and had to do all your book learning from street signs.
 
2013-02-06 03:27:48 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Red Shirt Blues: ph0rk: ///Charcoal filtering != bourbon.

That does not preclude it from being called bourbon.

Actually real Bourbon is not Charcholed filtered. It is aged in barrels that have been burnt out.


Makers of Tennessee Whisky do both. And technically, they could call it bourbon - I think they do outside the US. JD still tastes like crap, though. Dickel no. 12 used to be great, but has gone downhill since Diageo  took over.

You can also call whiskey that has only been aged 3 months bourbon if the mashbill is right and the aging was done in charred oak.
 
2013-02-06 03:27:49 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


I'm of German heritage?  Would you have a problem with people being proud of THAT?
 
2013-02-06 03:29:02 PM  

oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

So the 'merikun mission statement of that war was to "run away whilst screaming like girls & pissing your pants"?

There's a spot not far from where I'm sitting where a few hundred men under Andrew Jackson turned a much larger force of the Crown's finest into alligator shiat.

And there's a whole country I'm sittin' in that you blowhards failed to conquer - on three attempts, I might add.


sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net


Canucks are so cute when they get uppity.
Like a chihuahua yapping at your heels kinda cute.
 
2013-02-06 03:30:58 PM  

VendorXeno: quiet


yea, let them agitate, and let the other people speak their minds without resorting to such reflexive and tired memes:

Quotes like Forrest "is as close to Satan as you can get" - it's just stupid. I'd call it juvenile but I've heard juveniles make better arguments than that.

It's the zealousness of the ignorant mob, screaming soundbites.

I'm not trying to push my particular policy choice here, but in general, we'd all benefit from:
1- elevating the discourse
2- refraining from soundbites
3- tolerating dissident opinion

And yes, that includes pro-Confederate arguments. That includes pro-Forrest arguments.

I realize this is a web forum and asking people these things is, in itself, cliche. But as I said it's just depressing to read some of the ignorant viciousness in here.
 
2013-02-06 03:31:17 PM  

TerminalEchoes: VendorXeno: GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."

There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...

Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.


No one is erasing history.  We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."

Try learning about history from, oh i don't know, a book perhaps.  You really shouldn't be learning about the history of your country from flags, road signs, and placards at state parks.
 
2013-02-06 03:31:21 PM  

zarberg: keylock71: [upload.wikimedia.org image 250x317]

"That's nice... They named a tank after me."

: )

I propose we name an expressway from Atlanta to Savannah for him!

I wonder what method we can use to defoliate the land to be used ... hmmm ...


zarberg: keylock71: [upload.wikimedia.org image 250x317]

"That's nice... They named a tank after me."

: )

I propose we name an expressway from Atlanta to Savannah for him!

I wonder what method we can use to defoliate the land to be used ... hmmm ...


Lol... If I were a wealthy man, I'd organize an Annual William Tecumseh Sherman Banquet in Atlanta.

They named a tank after Lee, too, but it never had the name recognition the Sherman did.

...And if memory serves me correctly, the British version of the M3 Lee was called the Grant after Ulysses S. Grant.

There's a joke in there somewhere... Damned if I can figure it out, though.
 
2013-02-06 03:31:25 PM  

scout48: doczoidberg: Friggin' South.

You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

Wow! Did you know the first successful heart transplant happened in the south? Did you know a ton of your food comes from the south? Did you know the natural beauty of the south brings in billions of tourist dollars? You are a troll and I just fed you, I hope you are happy.

Those people fought for what that state believed in.  Agree or disagree, I respect that. So many have forgotten that slavery was only a part of the civil war. We were a country that only a generation or two before had fought to be free from an oppressive government. Many were just pissed off that the new government, not as old as their fathers and grandfathers, was already telling them what to do. Many of the wealthy and influential feared their livelihood would be destroyed. Perspective helps. Any person denying slavery was a big part of the Civil War is an idiot. Any one who says it was the only factor is just as big of an idiot. The south believed they were being oppressed and fought to end that perceived oppression. The only difference in the south and the Revolutionary Colonials (who were slave owners) is that the Colonials won. Had they lost we would all be talking about what murderous and treasonous asses we all were as we toasted long live the queen.


This is why the South, where I live is so farked up. I live in Memphis too. Check out the comments tab in the article. Unf*cking believable. Most of them are Angry Old Retired Men and members of the Clan and the SoCV's, gun nuts, Teatards, etc. The myth of the Ole South is burned into their heads and they can't see it any other way. Sad thing is, they just pass this garbled sense of history on to their progeny and it just goes on and on.

I bet your one of those shiatkickers that posts on the CA. Well, buddy, you're in over your head at Fark. Stand by to get your ass handed to you.

The majority of Memphians don't care. Move the bodies and the statue to Shiloh. Just put all of the holy relics on a godam flatbed and drive slowly down Hwy 57 to the military park. All the old south morans can stand by the highway and wave rebel flags and shed a tear when the funerary barge trundles by.
 
2013-02-06 03:31:28 PM  

TerminalEchoes: Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.


Changing a street name doesn't erase history. Read a goddamned book if you want to know your history. . Seriously, thinking that taking a name off a street sign, "erases history," is delusional. The idea imparts a relationship and importance that doesn't exist in reality. Kids don't stare up at street signs and become inspired by the names there. The Pharaoh isn't erasing all trace of these people from public record. Get...some...perspective...The idea that changing a street sign is an attack on history is pure WHARGLEBLAARG.
 
2013-02-06 03:31:45 PM  

dukwbutter: Not only that, but the Civil war wasn't about slavery.


Yes, and WWII was only so that Germany could secure oil shale.
 
2013-02-06 03:32:52 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Onkel Buck: someonelse: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

Not the worst.

[freebeacon.com image 798x498]

ohyou.jpg

/hating rich people is a learned behavior

Fail.  You don't have to teach a dog to want another dog's bone.


Coveting is not the same as hatred.
 
2013-02-06 03:33:25 PM  

TerminalEchoes: It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.


A good way to do that "moving on" part might be to rename the parks (which does not, contrary to popular belief, involve erasing all recorded evidence of its prior name). We didn't erase history when we stopped doing the racist version of "eenie meenie miney moe."
 
2013-02-06 03:33:42 PM  

DROxINxTHExWIND: MagicMissile: I'm opposed to it also, simply because its part of our nations history.

We have schools and parks named after Malcolm X who was a hatred filled racist man, who in the end was shot something like 50 times by his own followers.

Get over it.

Someone left history class before the 8th grade ended. You need to download an update to your history database. You read like a MapQuest map that hasn't added the newer streets yet.


Let me guess, you have one of those "By any means necessary" posters on your wall right now. Idolizing the man holding an AK-47, peering out a window in defiance, not realizing when it was taken he was in fear of his life from the the Nation of Islam.
 
2013-02-06 03:33:42 PM  

VendorXeno: Really? They've stopped teaching about the CIVIL WAR in schools? The last hold out for historic accuracy is a goddamned STREET SIGN? Are you even listening to yourself? There is nothing here that involves the "sanitation of history." I dunno what AM radio inspired delusions you use to craft your reactions but changing a street name in Memphis isn't part of any conspiracy to erase the facts of the Civil War.


The Larch: I knew you guys hated schools, but I didn't know you couldn't even afford textbooks and had to do all your book learning from street signs.


If it's "just a street sign", why expend so much effort and emotion to remove them?
 
2013-02-06 03:33:44 PM  

Felgraf: Mid_mo_mad_man: Being a brilliant military commander does. Btw the federal armies did not defeat Lee. Northern manufacturing & the USA Navy did

Lee did a bang up job of defeating himself, too. Especially not listening to Longstreet's advice with regard to Gettysburg (instead of fighting them there, get between the union army and DC). A LOT of generals in that war used Napoleonic Tactics (An entrenched position can be taken by simply throwing enough people at it) without taking the enhanced firearms of the age into account.


Lee's actions at Gettysburg will forever confuse the hell out of me. It's not as if Lee hadn't seen first hand what concentrated fire from an entrenched position could do. At Cold Harbor and Fredricksburg, the confederates slaughtered Union soldiers on open ground wholesale from behind the safety of cover.

Lee's forces were approaching an enemy armed with superior repeating rifles, who were dug in behind stone walls, and whose approach was open gron
 
2013-02-06 03:33:51 PM  

oh_please: Every time this type of thread comes up about the South, it's hilarious to read the sanctimonious comments from people who have never lived here.


People are pretty bigoted about the rest of the country, too. It's pretty ridiculous.
 
2013-02-06 03:35:36 PM  

Mara See Mara Do: max_pooper: The State of Texas officially observes (with state employees getting a paid day off) Confederate Heroes Day, Martin Luther King Day and Emancipation Day In Texas.

Apologies if this is a repeat, but bullshiat. We get MLK day like everyone else. I have never heard of those other two.

/some of us down here are still sane


It's true.
Juneteenth (Emancipation Day) is a state holiday.
Confederate Heroes Day is a state holiday as well.


\is a Texas state employee.
 
2013-02-06 03:36:11 PM  
I remember sitting in a bar in new orleans years ago when two guys from rhode island came in, and were telling us how backwards and racist the south was.   After a couple of drinks one says "your black people are a louder and more uppity bunch than ours."   Funny how fast that uppity "black" bartender went over the bar.  Then came back and apologized to us and bought us a round after he threw the enlightened yankees out.

When I lived in Philly people kept asking me if I was Puerto Rican.

When I lived in San Fran when I spoke spanish once a guy said to me "you are the whitest mexican I have ever seen."

However, my Colombian/Sicilian mix in south lousiana, was never questioned.  Except every now and then a northerner would ask me if I was a creole...
 
2013-02-06 03:37:15 PM  

TerminalEchoes: VendorXeno: GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."

There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...

Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.


A street name is an honor - a memorial to remember the good deeds of dead people. These places were named as some kind of pathetic holdout that the Civil War was a good idea. These people aren't worth remembering.
 
2013-02-06 03:38:11 PM  

zarberg: keylock71: [upload.wikimedia.org image 250x317]

"That's nice... They named a tank after me."

: )

I propose we name an expressway from Atlanta to Savannah for him!

I wonder what method we can use to defoliate the land to be used ... hmmm ...


You mean I-75 / I-16?  We already have that.  We just didn't name it for him.
 
2013-02-06 03:38:27 PM  

Warlordtrooper: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

I'm of German heritage?  Would you have a problem with people being proud of THAT?


I'm of German heritage, too. I'm not proud of it specifically (my family's from basically every country in Europe that isn't the UK, France and Portugal), but I certainly wouldn't hide it. You can be proud of a heritage without incorporating the known-asshole parts of that heritage.

You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery. "Southern Pride" can be easily reappropriated to mean a Junetime march with rainbow flags.
You're from Germany? Awesome - even though I don't like weissbier, schnitzel is proof of god's love, I know a bit of the language, your people are polite (the few native-Germans I've ever met, anyway) and the endless jokes about sterile efficiency never fail to amuse. DON'T, however, start wistfully remembering WWII from the Kraut side. So long as you're not very "white power"-y, I think you'll be OK citing your German heritage.

// this really shouldn't need to be said
 
2013-02-06 03:38:36 PM  

GoldSpider: VendorXeno: Really? They've stopped teaching about the CIVIL WAR in schools? The last hold out for historic accuracy is a goddamned STREET SIGN? Are you even listening to yourself? There is nothing here that involves the "sanitation of history." I dunno what AM radio inspired delusions you use to craft your reactions but changing a street name in Memphis isn't part of any conspiracy to erase the facts of the Civil War.

The Larch: I knew you guys hated schools, but I didn't know you couldn't even afford textbooks and had to do all your book learning from street signs.

If it's "just a street sign", why expend so much effort and emotion to remove them?


Well, probably because we name streets after people we respect and admire.  We don't name them after traitors.
 
2013-02-06 03:38:41 PM  

Spaced Cowboy: We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."


It's not just "their" heritage, it's the country's.  Sorry if that makes you feel uncomfortable (and perhaps it should), but "making it go away" isn't the proper response to ugly chapters in our history.
 
2013-02-06 03:39:05 PM  
...open ground covered by artillery.

/posted from my stupid mobile phone
 
2013-02-06 03:40:31 PM  

give me doughnuts: ArtosRC: doczoidberg: Friggin' South. You bastards have nothing to be proud of. Understand???

Precisely. The traitors need to be kicked in the pants.


You're 140 years too late.


Here's a question I ought to point out: Should we get rid of Memorial Day too?
 
2013-02-06 03:40:31 PM  
Memphis has streets that change names for a block or two, just so whites could say the didn't live on the same street with blacks.
 
2013-02-06 03:41:13 PM  

Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.


Sounds to me like you need to wipe your vagina.
 
2013-02-06 03:41:51 PM  

Dr Dreidel: You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery. "Southern Pride" can be easily reappropriated to mean a Junetime march with rainbow flags.


That would be fabu...no, you know, no, not going to do it.  It would be a good thing, just a good thing.
 
2013-02-06 03:42:41 PM  

GoldSpider: Spaced Cowboy: We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."

It's not just "their" heritage, it's the country's.  Sorry if that makes you feel uncomfortable (and perhaps it should), but "making it go away" isn't the proper response to ugly chapters in our history.


Those chapters can be found in things called books. As for parks and street signs, times change. We got rid of the old iron street signs because they rusted and didn't show up at night. Coca-cola doesn't have cocaine in it anymore, either. You can read all about it in books.
 
2013-02-06 03:42:56 PM  
I say give them names like Martin Luther King JR Park, Malcom-X Park, and Rosa Parks Park.

But then I like pissing people off.
 
2013-02-06 03:43:25 PM  

GoldSpider: If it's "just a street sign", why expend so much effort and emotion to remove them?


Ah, I see your confusion. You can't distinguish between a trivial monument and historical facts. That's why when people who don't like a trivial monument to someone or something they don't respect replace it you think it's somehow able to erase all the history about the person that monument is dedicated to.

/hand-holding people through the simplest of thought processes...
 
2013-02-06 03:43:44 PM  

theflatline: I remember sitting in a bar in new orleans years ago when two guys from rhode island came in, and were telling us how backwards and racist the south was.   After a couple of drinks one says "your black people are a louder and more uppity bunch than ours."   Funny how fast that uppity "black" bartender went over the bar.  Then came back and apologized to us and bought us a round after he threw the enlightened yankees out.

When I lived in Philly people kept asking me if I was Puerto Rican.

When I lived in San Fran when I spoke spanish once a guy said to me "you are the whitest mexican I have ever seen."

However, my Colombian/Sicilian mix in south lousiana, was never questioned.  Except every now and then a northerner would ask me if I was a creole...


So instead of drawing conclusions on that individual for what they looked like, you drew them on where they were from. Almost like a prejudice. Odd.
 
2013-02-06 03:44:28 PM  

Spaced Cowboy: TerminalEchoes: VendorXeno: GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."

There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...

Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.

No one is erasing history.  We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."

Try learning about history from, oh i don't know, a book perhaps.  You really shouldn't be learning about the history of your country from flags, road signs, and placards at state parks.


Well crap. Let me just go ahead and burn this MA History degree from the U of Memphis since I've apparently never read a history book.
 
2013-02-06 03:44:43 PM  

Felgraf: For fark's sake, have you even *read* the articles of succession?


For Fark's sake.  Do you even know the difference between "secession" and "succession"?  Guffaw!!!! Sucks having a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
 
2013-02-06 03:45:20 PM  

GoldSpider: Spaced Cowboy: We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."

It's not just "their" heritage, it's the country's.  Sorry if that makes you feel uncomfortable (and perhaps it should), but "making it go away" isn't the proper response to ugly chapters in our history.


Want to make sure we never forget the history?  Rename the streets for Frederick Douglas and Harriet Tubman.   Name them for Rosa Parks and Martin Luther King.  Don't name them for Klansmen and traitors.
 
2013-02-06 03:46:05 PM  
To be clear, as a black southerner, I have no problem with them keeping the names the same, or changing them.  It's farking Memphis, nobody wants to be there anyway.

Also, as a white southerner, I have no problem with them keeping the names the same, or changing them.  It's farking Memphis, nobody wants to be there anyway.
 
2013-02-06 03:46:22 PM  

dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?


Yes. Yes it does.
 
2013-02-06 03:46:28 PM  

CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...


www.smokymtbarbecue.com
 
2013-02-06 03:47:14 PM  

Dr. Whoof: dukwbutter: And to look at a group of people and say that they have nothing to be proud of.

They have plenty to be proud of. The Confederacy is not one of them. The Civil War is not one of them. The Confederate flag is not one of them.


We are proud of every one of these things.  You have no right to tell Southerners what they are allowed to be proud of. fark you and the horse you rode in on.
 
2013-02-06 03:47:15 PM  

dukwbutter: Felgraf: For fark's sake, have you even *read* the articles of succession?

For Fark's sake.  Do you even know the difference between "secession" and "succession"?  Guffaw!!!! Sucks having a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.


I'm just going to put a checkmark in the "NO" box then. Is that OK?
 
2013-02-06 03:47:33 PM  

TerminalEchoes: Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.

Sounds to me like you need to wipe your vagina.


No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.
 
2013-02-06 03:47:38 PM  

farm machine: The cleansing of history continues as the intolerant continue to widen their scope of what is offensive.  Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures?  A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.  When we lose sight of where we've come from don't we also risk letting history repeat itself?


So can I name the street you live on Hitler Way? Stalin Street? It keeps history dirty and is definately a testement to ill concieved failures and our ability to persevere and triumpth over adversity. How about the Hun Highway, The Mongolian Mile, Black Pleage Epidemic Expressway?
 
2013-02-06 03:47:39 PM  

Dr Dreidel: You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery.


That's the point. Southerners aren't allowed to do any of that without having some assholes rub the rest of it in their faces. If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.
 
2013-02-06 03:48:30 PM  

TerminalEchoes: Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.

Sounds to me like you need to wipe your vagina.


Also, I thought I'd give you some help here.  Don't repeat what you just said.  You're telling people that you don't know very much about vaginas.
 
2013-02-06 03:48:47 PM  

VendorXeno: Ah, I see your confusion. You can't distinguish between a trivial monument and historical facts. That's why when people who don't like a trivial monument to someone or something they don't respect replace it you think it's somehow able to erase all the history about the person that monument is dedicated to.


What confuses me is the amount of butthurt these "trivial monuments" seem to cause among the compulsively-offended.
 
2013-02-06 03:49:04 PM  

SuperChuck: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4th_of_july


Vicksburg didn't celebrate the 4th of July from 1863 through the Bicentennial (1976).  In 1976, they shot fireworks. The next year (1977), they did not.
 
2013-02-06 03:49:18 PM  

dukwbutter: Dr. Whoof:They have plenty to be proud of. The Confederacy is not one of them. The Civil War is not one of them. The Confederate flag is not one of them.

We are proud of every one of these things.  You have no right to tell Southerners what they are allowed to be proud of. fark you and the horse you rode in on.


Well, you go right ahead and be proud.  Bless your heart.
 
2013-02-06 03:49:37 PM  

Nabb1: KenShabby: Nabb1: oldfarthenry: Ya know - I "could" point out that the star-spangled banner was a poem about a war you guys LOST!

/tries to deflect heat off them-there southern folk

You could, but you'd be wrong.

Yeah, that was the War of 1812.

Yes, he brings that up a lot. A whole lot. I expect him to post a pic of Canadian soldiers burning the White House any moment now.


Well, just consider two things. The war was started by the US attempting to annex large parts of Canada. You were thrown back acoss the border and not only did not fullfil the mission, came perilously close to losing significant territory yourself.

The second point is that in any encounters of even marginally comparable numbers, the US decisively won only once, and that battle (New Orleans) occurred after the peace was signed.

Now, if an American wants to maintain that it was essentially a draw, I would say, debatable, but OK. It was a negotiated peace. You still came out of it with no significant gain and a heck of a lot of damage. Me, I'm just glad we didn't keep Detroit.
 
2013-02-06 03:49:57 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Pleage


What is that?
 
2013-02-06 03:50:17 PM  

GoldSpider: Spaced Cowboy: We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."

It's not just "their" heritage, it's the country's.  Sorry if that makes you feel uncomfortable (and perhaps it should), but "making it go away" isn't the proper response to ugly chapters in our history.


No one is making the history go away.  Where do you keep pulling this nonsense from?  Have you considered being less retarded and maybe trying to grasp this simple concept that history remains despite the lack of your road signs.

You'll still be able to go to a library (if they have any left down south) and read all about these historical turds.  Just because a state park that you've probably never visited will no longer honor the name of some shiat stain, doesn't mean we as a nation stop understanding those events.  It simply means we stop honoring shiat stains.  It really is as simple as that.
 
2013-02-06 03:51:16 PM  
Memphis names things, to remember them...


Democrats elect them to write laws...
images.politico.com

Which is worse?
 
2013-02-06 03:51:22 PM  

petec: All2morrowsparTs: Maybe we should start naming things after British Reveloutionary War Generals in New England and American-Mexican Mexican Generals in the Southwest.

How about the Benedict Arnaold Memorial Park.

we got a monument in NY

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boot_Monument">http://en.wikipedia.org/ wiki/Boot_Monument


Funny that they don't put his name on the monument.
 
2013-02-06 03:51:27 PM  

give me doughnuts: If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.


Really? That's what this is? You're doing it to piss off the dirty liberals?

Forgive me for laughing at you.
 
2013-02-06 03:51:28 PM  

TerminalEchoes: Spaced Cowboy: TerminalEchoes: VendorXeno: GoldSpider: "Those who fail to learn erase the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them."

There it is again. Seriously, how much mercury do you have to eat to think that changing a street sign is erasing history? Talk about a total loss of perspective...

Sorry, I agree with GoldSpider. I LIVE in Memphis and this is a stupid idea. Good or bad, the Civil War did happen. It's part of history. It's part of who we are today. It's stupid to try and erase the dark spots. Accept them and move on.

No one is erasing history.  We're erasing your sad, century long devotion to honoring those dark spots as your "heritage."

Try learning about history from, oh i don't know, a book perhaps.  You really shouldn't be learning about the history of your country from flags, road signs, and placards at state parks.

Well crap. Let me just go ahead and burn this MA History degree from the U of Memphis since I've apparently never read a history book.


Ask for a refund... immediately.
 
2013-02-06 03:51:28 PM  

Rapmaster2000: TerminalEchoes: Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.

Sounds to me like you need to wipe your vagina.

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.


I will take a gentile southern gal over a northern gal any day.  New Orleans, Atlanta, has top quality women with jobs, educations, who have not lost their feminine sides.

But it seems like you are only dating gold diggers, which all over the planet, not just the south.
 
2013-02-06 03:52:34 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: farm machine: The cleansing of history continues as the intolerant continue to widen their scope of what is offensive.  Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures?  A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.  When we lose sight of where we've come from don't we also risk letting history repeat itself?

So can I name the street you live on Hitler Way? Stalin Street? It keeps history dirty and is definately a testement to ill concieved failures and our ability to persevere and triumpth over adversity. How about the Hun Highway, The Mongolian Mile, Black Pleage Epidemic Expressway?


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/world-war-two/9839666/Russia-revi ve s-Stalingrad-city-name.html
 
2013-02-06 03:52:34 PM  

Cybernetic: Rapmaster2000: Onkel Buck: someonelse: Onkel Buck: It's more offensive that all the streets named after MLK usually run right through the worst crime infested neighborhoods

Not the worst.

[freebeacon.com image 798x498]

ohyou.jpg

/hating rich people is a learned behavior

Fail.  You don't have to teach a dog to want another dog's bone.

Coveting is not the same as hatred.


Hatred and envy is pretty much the natural world order.  Only society provides the framework to punish with jail or the pathway to deter me with opportunity from using my group to subjugate your group.  Tolerance and respect is learned.  Hatred is the default position we fall back to.
 
2013-02-06 03:52:37 PM  

OnlyM3: Memphis names things, to remember them...


Democrats elect them to write laws...
[images.politico.com image 274x206]

Which is worse?


Well, that's a good point.  I'm going to work against the re-election of Byrd next time he's on the ballot.
 
2013-02-06 03:52:42 PM  

Cortez the Killer: CheekyMonkey: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

Remind me again what they have to be proud of?  I mean, aside for the systematic subjugation, oppression and dehumanization of a group of people with darker skin, of course...

ribs.jpeg



i450.photobucket.com
 
2013-02-06 03:52:49 PM  
I bet this sign isn't even up anymore. History erasers!

nysiaf.org
 
2013-02-06 03:53:49 PM  

Rapmaster2000: TerminalEchoes: Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.

Sounds to me like you need to wipe your vagina.

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.



Good thing you know a few, then.
 
2013-02-06 03:53:56 PM  

GoldSpider: What confuses me is the amount of butthurt these "trivial monuments" seem to cause among the compulsively-offended.


*shrugs* Some people, having had to grow up dealing with segregation, bigotry, racial violence against them, and that sort of thing I guess have some issues with people honoring those practices, go figure. If that's actually confusing to you then that helps explain why you keep equating street signs to history.
 
2013-02-06 03:54:19 PM  

dukwbutter: Felgraf: For fark's sake, have you even *read* the articles of succession?

For Fark's sake.  Do you even know the difference between "secession" and "succession"?  Guffaw!!!! Sucks having a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.


Nice that you jump on a misspelling, but had no reply to the lengthy posts of the SC and Texas ordinances of secession that he posted. What say you to those?
 
2013-02-06 03:54:38 PM  
theflatline:

I will take a gentile southern gal over a northern gal any day.

I'm not surprised to hear that a Southerner refuses to date Jews.
 
2013-02-06 03:54:40 PM  

Spaced Cowboy: No one is making the history go away. Where do you keep pulling this nonsense from? Have you considered being less retarded and maybe trying to grasp this simple concept that history remains despite the lack of your road signs.


Don't you think you're getting awfully worked up about these "trivial monuments"?  Do you always get this angry and spiteful when you encounter someone with whom you disagree?
 
2013-02-06 03:55:02 PM  

The Larch: give me doughnuts: If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.

Really? That's what this is? You're doing it to piss off the dirty liberals?

Forgive me for laughing at you.


All of us "liberals" are very upset that large sects of the south have embraced generations of stupidity as an ideology.  It's all terribly upsetting and totally not a constant source of hilarity.
 
2013-02-06 03:56:07 PM  
From molasses to rum to slaves, the whole country, north and south were in on the slave trade.
 
2013-02-06 03:56:35 PM  

Rapmaster2000: TerminalEchoes: Rapmaster2000: People just don't want anything to change.  Especially Southerners who always handle change the worst.  Over the last 50 years all of these Yankees moved down and took the jobs that Southerners couldn't do because Southerners wouldn't change.

If Southerners had changed and spent more time working on math rather than practicing football, then they might have prevented the Yankee influx that has supplanted their inferior culture and heritage.  These Southern people have no one to blame but themselves for the end of their traditions.  That's how it's always worked.  The winners write history.

If you people had collectively been more industrious, then you could be sitting around Manhattan, yammering about how the biscuits are so much better in Birmingham.  Alas, you have to hear me lament the lack of decent bagels while you wait on me at the Waffle House.

Sounds to me like you need to wipe your vagina.

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.


I'm finding it very hard to believe you date women.
 
2013-02-06 03:57:04 PM  

someonelse: I bet this sign isn't even up anymore. History erasers!

[nysiaf.org image 510x380]


I'm offended by the incorrect use of the apostrophe.
 
2013-02-06 03:57:14 PM  

Felgraf: Hrm. Gee. I am positively stumped. I'm sure dukwbutter can explain how this is, in fact, not about slavery, though.


Both Lincoln and Grant owned slaves. In his inaugural address of March 4, 1861, U.S. President Abraham Lincoln stated, "I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so."  Union General U.S. Grant said, "If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side."

So, yeah, it wasn't about slavery. The more you know...
 
2013-02-06 03:57:43 PM  

GoldSpider: Don't you think you're getting awfully worked up about these "trivial monuments"?


Well, even a trivial monument to slavery and oppression is a bad thing. I think it's pretty awesome that we've successfully tackled so much of the big stuff and we're finally down to the little stuff.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:05 PM  
Why don't we just names parks after their locations (Main Street Park, for example) and be done with it? It has the advantage that the location is in the name, so if you know where Main Street is, you know where the park is.

We really don't need to honor dead people. I know we love doing that, but it's really not necessary. They're dead. They don't give a shiat about anything anymore, much less how many parks, schools and monuments have their name on them.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:10 PM  

The Larch: give me doughnuts: If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.

Really? That's what this is? You're doing it to piss off the dirty liberals?

Forgive me for laughing at you.



Think of the word that gets filterered as "attractive and successful african-american."  Why do you think that was "taken back"?
If you throw it people's face long enough...
 
2013-02-06 03:58:28 PM  

GoldSpider: Spaced Cowboy: No one is making the history go away. Where do you keep pulling this nonsense from? Have you considered being less retarded and maybe trying to grasp this simple concept that history remains despite the lack of your road signs.

Don't you think you're getting awfully worked up about these "trivial monuments"?  Do you always get this angry and spiteful when you encounter someone with whom you disagree?


I'm bored on Fark, just like you.  This is more "meh" than "angry and spiteful."

If pretending that I'm all kinds of upset instead of just terminally bored makes this conversation more interesting, then run with it, I say.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:38 PM  

ChuDogg: DROxINxTHExWIND: MagicMissile: I'm opposed to it also, simply because its part of our nations history.

We have schools and parks named after Malcolm X who was a hatred filled racist man, who in the end was shot something like 50 times by his own followers.

Get over it.

Someone left history class before the 8th grade ended. You need to download an update to your history database. You read like a MapQuest map that hasn't added the newer streets yet.

Let me guess, you have one of those "By any means necessary" posters on your wall right now. Idolizing the man holding an AK-47, peering out a window in defiance, not realizing when it was taken he was in fear of his life from the the Nation of Islam.


I take it you've never seen the movie "X". If you had, you'd know that Malcolm's issues with the Nation of Islam are well documented. But, if you know that, then it seems like you'd also know that his beef with the Nation of Islam was in part due to his growing acceptance of people of all races that came after his pilgrimage to Mecca. So, why would someone who obviously knows a little about history act as if he doesn't know that Malcolm X did not die hating white people? Puzzling.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:49 PM  

Dr Dreidel: German


Dr Dreidel: Warlordtrooper: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

I'm of German heritage?  Would you have a problem with people being proud of THAT?

I'm of German heritage, too. I'm not proud of it specifically (my family's from basically every country in Europe that isn't the UK, France and Portugal), but I certainly wouldn't hide it. You can be proud of a heritage without incorporating the known-asshole parts of that heritage.

You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery. "Southern Pride" can be easily reappropriated to mean a Junetime march with rainbow flags.
You're from Germany? Awesome - even though I don't like weissbier, schnitzel is proof of god's love, I know a bit of the language, your people are polite (the few native-Germans I've ever met, anyway) and the endless jokes about sterile efficiency never fail to amuse. DON'T, however, start wistfully remembering WWII from the Kraut side. So long as you're not very "white power"-y, I think you'll be OK citing your German heritage.

// this really shouldn't need to be said


This. Why so proud of causing the war that killed more than a half million Americans?
 
2013-02-06 03:58:50 PM  

SMB2811: All2morrowsparTs: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

You celebrate treason as heritage?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4th_of_july


Well treason would be the case if we were still a Colony Britain. The CSA will not be traitors as soon as they win the war.
 
2013-02-06 03:58:57 PM  

George Babbitt: From molasses to rum to slaves, the whole country, north and south were in on the slave trade.


Well, only one side went to war to preserve it.
 
2013-02-06 03:59:03 PM  

Warlordtrooper: I'm of German heritage? Would you have a problem with people being proud of THAT?


I'm German also.  I don't care if you're proud of your heritage or not.  Just don't be putting down my heritage.  Don't be telling me I can't be proud of my heritage.  It's pathetic.
 
2013-02-06 03:59:21 PM  

give me doughnuts: Dr Dreidel: You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery.

That's the point. Southerners aren't allowed to do any of that without having some assholes rub the rest of it in their faces. If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.


What kind of assholes do you hang out with? Living just outside DC for the better part of the last 20 years, I've met a million Southerners, and never once have I heard Northerners start bringing that shiat up to counter a Southerner's boast (unless a Southerner was being a dick about it) - most of us have moved on from the Civil War, mostly by not having reminders of the losing side's power structure every 30 feet.

EVERY culture has shameful parts of their history, full stop. When you start referencing that history, best to not recall those shameful parts. "Come to the South, we put 800g of sucrose in every glass of our tea!" will get a much better response than "Come to Norfolk, where we showed them Yankees what-fer!"
 
2013-02-06 03:59:40 PM  

The Larch: Well, even a trivial monument to slavery and oppression is a bad thing. I think it's pretty awesome that we've successfully tackled so much of the big stuff and we're finally down to the little stuff.


I'd wager there are plenty of Robert E. Lee statues that need torn down.
 
2013-02-06 03:59:52 PM  

give me doughnuts: The Larch: give me doughnuts: If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.

Really? That's what this is? You're doing it to piss off the dirty liberals?

Forgive me for laughing at you.


Think of the word that gets filterered as "attractive and successful african-american."  Why do you think that was "taken back"?
If you throw it people's face long enough...


Please, proceed.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:16 PM  
Mike_1962: Well, just consider two things. The war was started by the US attempting to annex large parts of Canada. You were thrown back acoss the border and not only did not fullfil the mission, came perilously close to losing significant territory yourself.

The second point is that in any encounters of even marginally comparable numbers, the US decisively won only once, and that battle (New Orleans) occurred after the peace was signed.

Now, if an American wants to maintain that it was essentially a draw, I would say, debatable, but OK. It was a negotiated peace. You still came out of it with no significant gain and a heck of a lot of damage. Me, I'm just glad we didn't keep Detroit.


The U.S. had a number of grievances against England not the least of which was interference with trade, seizing US merchant ships and pressing their crews into service in the Royal Navy not the least among them. So, they did the best they could to strike against British interests and attacked Canada. The main goal was to draw England back into conflict, and then the U.S. got most of what it wanted before the war in terms of the terms of the treaty. Attacking Canada was a means to that end.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:27 PM  
give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.


Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

3.bp.blogspot.com

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:31 PM  

BafflerMeal: All2morrowsparTs: farm machine: The cleansing of history continues as the intolerant continue to widen their scope of what is offensive.  Why not leave these parks named as is as a testament to ill conceived failures?  A tribute to our ability to persevere and triumph over adversity.  When we lose sight of where we've come from don't we also risk letting history repeat itself?

So can I name the street you live on Hitler Way? Stalin Street? It keeps history dirty and is definately a testement to ill concieved failures and our ability to persevere and triumpth over adversity. How about the Hun Highway, The Mongolian Mile, Black Pleage Epidemic Expressway?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/world-war-two/9839666/Russia-revi ve s-Stalingrad-city-name.html


Touche' I just read about that the other day. To their credit the city was opposed to this.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:38 PM  

Rapmaster2000: theflatline:

I will take a gentile southern gal over a northern gal any day.

I'm not surprised to hear that a Southerner refuses to date Jews.


I suggest you check out my beak, and that should have been genteel, as sometimes my spanish phonetics bleed over into my english spelling.

Spent much of my time at our local JCC as a youth, and gramps even has a temple in Panama named after him.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:40 PM  

dukwbutter: So, yeah, it wasn't about slavery. The more you know..


Actually, your quotes not withstanding, Lincoln still ran for president on an emancipation platform. See the Lincoln vs Douglas debates. And several southern states specifically stated that if Lincoln were to win the presidency, based on this particular plank of his platform, they would secede. And when he won, they did, and that was the stated reason. Isolated quotes can't erase historical fact. When dealing with history, you have to deal with all of it, not just tiny parts your prefer.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:44 PM  

Spaced Cowboy: I'm bored on Fark, just like you. This is more "meh" than "angry and spiteful."

If pretending that I'm all kinds of upset instead of just terminally bored makes this conversation more interesting, then run with it, I say.


Fair enough.  We need another gun thread.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:48 PM  

dukwbutter: Dr. Whoof: dukwbutter: And to look at a group of people and say that they have nothing to be proud of.

They have plenty to be proud of. The Confederacy is not one of them. The Civil War is not one of them. The Confederate flag is not one of them.

We are proud of every one of these things.  You have no right to tell Southerners what they are allowed to be proud of. fark you and the horse you rode in on.


Actually, I sure do have a right to tell them.  They don't have to listen, unless they get all "secessiony" again and then, well, they get told with bullets (and these days, missiles, artillery, etc).

However, yeah, I have every right to say treating other human beings as property and essentially livestock, and fighting a war to that end, is nothing to be proud of.  It's a heritage of evil.  Instead, go be proud of GOOD things the south has done.
 
2013-02-06 04:00:49 PM  

dukwbutter: Felgraf: Hrm. Gee. I am positively stumped. I'm sure dukwbutter can explain how this is, in fact, not about slavery, though.

Both Lincoln and Grant owned slaves. In his inaugural address of March 4, 1861, U.S. President Abraham Lincoln stated, "I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so."  Union General U.S. Grant said, "If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side."

So, yeah, it wasn't about slavery. The more you know...


Yeah, it was at least partially about slavery. Regardless of what Lincoln or Grant said.
 
2013-02-06 04:01:29 PM  

Dr Dreidel: You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery. "Southern Pride" can be easily reappropriated to mean a Junetime march with rainbow flags.
You're from Germany? Awesome - even though I don't like weissbier, schnitzel is proof of god's love, I know a bit of the language, your people are polite (the few native-Germans I've ever met, anyway) and the endless jokes about sterile efficiency never fail to amuse. DON'T, however, start wistfully remembering WWII from the Kraut side. So long as you're not very "white power"-y, I think you'll be OK citing your German heritage.


Don't dare tell me what I can and can't be proud of. fark you. I'm proud of the secession of the South.  fark the North. Lincoln and Grant both had slaves.  fark you for telling me what I can be proud of.
 
2013-02-06 04:01:43 PM  

dukwbutter: Felgraf: For fark's sake, have you even *read* the articles of succession?

For Fark's sake.  Do you even know the difference between "secession" and "succession"?  Guffaw!!!! Sucks having a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.


Aye, I mistyped in my initial post, I realize that.  Could you please address the following posts where I not only spell it correctly, but cite two of the articles of secession? And where I point out how they, loudly and frequently, address slavery as a reason for why they seceded.

I'd argue that screwing up a homophone doesn't really equal an unarmed opponent, but, surely if I am so inferior to yourself, you can explain away my subsequent posts?

I await your answer with bated (or baited: both spellings appear to be acceptable) breath, really and truly I do.
 
2013-02-06 04:02:06 PM  

dukwbutter: Felgraf: Hrm. Gee. I am positively stumped. I'm sure dukwbutter can explain how this is, in fact, not about slavery, though.

Both Lincoln and Grant owned slaves. In his inaugural address of March 4, 1861, U.S. President Abraham Lincoln stated, "I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so."  Union General U.S. Grant said, "If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side."

So, yeah, it wasn't about slavery. The more you know...


Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.
 
2013-02-06 04:02:34 PM  

Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.


My god! J.Crew just puked all over that picture.
 
2013-02-06 04:02:37 PM  

Dr. Whoof: Actually, I sure do have a right to tell them. They don't have to listen, unless they get all "secessiony" again and then, well, they get told with bullets (and these days, missiles, artillery, etc).


What a wasted opportunity to use the term "fixin' to".
 
2013-02-06 04:02:39 PM  

dukwbutter: Both Lincoln and Grant owned slaves. In his inaugural address of March 4, 1861, U.S. President Abraham Lincoln stated, "I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so." Union General U.S. Grant said, "If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side."

So, yeah, it wasn't about slavery. The more you know...


So, what, the states were lying in their articles of secession? The hell did they mention slavery so much, if it wasn't about slavery at all?
 
2013-02-06 04:02:55 PM  

Dr Dreidel: give me doughnuts: Dr Dreidel: You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery.

That's the point. Southerners aren't allowed to do any of that without having some assholes rub the rest of it in their faces. If you keep insulting people with something for long enough, they adopt it with pride just to be contrary and piss you off.

What kind of assholes do you hang out with? Living just outside DC for the better part of the last 20 years, I've met a million Southerners, and never once have I heard Northerners start bringing that shiat up to counter a Southerner's boast (unless a Southerner was being a dick about it) - most of us have moved on from the Civil War, mostly by not having reminders of the losing side's power structure every 30 feet.

EVERY culture has shameful parts of their history, full stop. When you start referencing that history, best to not recall those shameful parts. "Come to the South, we put 800g of sucrose in every glass of our tea!" will get a much better response than "Come to Norfolk, where we showed them Yankees what-fer!"


There are a lot of them in this thread.

/and sweet tea is gross
 
2013-02-06 04:03:30 PM  

The Larch: succession


Meaning "No, you don't know the difference either?"
 
2013-02-06 04:03:39 PM  

theflatline: Rapmaster2000: theflatline:

I will take a gentile southern gal over a northern gal any day.

I'm not surprised to hear that a Southerner refuses to date Jews.

I suggest you check out my beak, and that should have been genteel, as sometimes my spanish phonetics bleed over into my english spelling.

Spent much of my time at our local JCC as a youth, and gramps even has a temple in Panama named after him.


Well then you can't join our Club.  Sorry, but you're just not our sort.
 
2013-02-06 04:03:45 PM  

Walker: Just in the local area of Virginia here we have Jefferson Davis Highway and Lee Highway (named after General Lee). Are we supposed to change those? There's also Jeb Stuart High School and other schools named after Confederates. A major tourist attraction in Mississippi is the home of Jefferson Davis. Should they bulldoze it? Stop trying to erase the past. Political correctness run amok.


Isn't there a statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest in Washington DC?
 
2013-02-06 04:05:03 PM  

Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.



Good stuff? Vodka?  Almost at tasteless as those shorts.
 
2013-02-06 04:05:16 PM  

danfrank: This. Why so proud of causing the war that killed more than a half million Americans?


Because they were fighting for their way for life? For what they believe in?  They have every right to be proud.
 
2013-02-06 04:05:34 PM  

GoldSpider: VendorXeno: Ah, I see your confusion. You can't distinguish between a trivial monument and historical facts. That's why when people who don't like a trivial monument to someone or something they don't respect replace it you think it's somehow able to erase all the history about the person that monument is dedicated to.

What confuses me is the amount of butthurt these "trivial monuments" seem to cause among the compulsively-offended.


What do you call people who are ALWAYS offended that someone would take offense to something?
 
2013-02-06 04:06:02 PM  
Rapmaster2000: Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.


That would work if even one person in that picture was wearing any sort of Ole Miss apparel.
 
2013-02-06 04:06:14 PM  

Noam Chimpsky: There are still US cities named after British royalty.


A couple of states and many many counties no less.
 
2013-02-06 04:06:30 PM  

Felgraf: dukwbutter: Felgraf: For fark's sake, have you even *read* the articles of succession?

For Fark's sake.  Do you even know the difference between "secession" and "succession"?  Guffaw!!!! Sucks having a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

Aye, I mistyped in my initial post, I realize that.  Could you please address the following posts where I not only spell it correctly, but cite two of the articles of secession? And where I point out how they, loudly and frequently, address slavery as a reason for why they seceded.

I'd argue that screwing up a homophone doesn't really equal an unarmed opponent, but, surely if I am so inferior to yourself, you can explain away my subsequent posts?

I await your answer with bated (or baited: both spellings appear to be acceptable) breath, really and truly I do.


What are you? Homophonic?
 
2013-02-06 04:06:42 PM  
give me doughnuts:

Good stuff? Vodka?  Almost at tasteless as those shorts.

4.bp.blogspot.com
We'll never give you a bid with that attitude.
 
2013-02-06 04:07:09 PM  

VendorXeno: Actually, your quotes not withstanding, Lincoln still ran for president on an emancipation platform. See the Lincoln vs Douglas debates. And several southern states specifically stated that if Lincoln were to win the presidency, based on this particular plank of his platform, they would secede. And when he won, they did, and that was the stated reason. Isolated quotes can't erase historical fact. When dealing with history, you have to deal with all of it, not just tiny parts your prefer.


So, when he said the south could keep their slaves if they would just rejoin the Union....you would explain that how.  They're just "quotes".  I love how "quotes" are different from "historical facts".  Tell me more professor. :O
 
2013-02-06 04:07:14 PM  

dukwbutter: Don't dare tell me what I can and can't be proud of.


I'll dare.

Don't be proud of marrying your sister.
Don't be proud of the BJ you gave that trucker last night.
Don't be proud of those curtains you bought at JC Penny's on sale.
Don't be proud of your genital warts.
Don't be proud of beating your sister/wife.
Don't be proud of that one time when your uncle dared you to superglue your eyelids shut and you did.
Don't be proud of that funny smell on your upper lip.
Don't be proud of having written the Twilight books.

This list could go on for a while...I'll let others add to it.
 
2013-02-06 04:07:19 PM  

dukwbutter: Don't dare tell me what I can and can't be proud of. fark you. I'm proud of the secession of the South. fark the North. Lincoln and Grant both had slaves. fark you for telling me what I can be proud of.


Be proud of whatever you want. Don't expect the rest of us to start showering you with flowers and adoration for it, though.

// those are suggestions for good-neighboring, not absolute thou-shall-nots
// you're proud of the South's secession? Well, I'm proud the North kicked the South's sorry asses all the way to Vicksburg and back
// you may find that that pride does not endear you to most Americans - but I think you deserve to know this beforehand
 
2013-02-06 04:07:25 PM  

dukwbutter: danfrank: This. Why so proud of causing the war that killed more than a half million Americans?

Because they were fighting for their way for life? For what they believe in?  They have every right to be proud.


And what "way of life" was that? Be specific, with examples of how the federal government was stopping them living this "way of life".
 
2013-02-06 04:08:58 PM  

dukwbutter: The Larch: succession

Meaning "No, you don't know the difference either?"


You don't understand how the quote button works, do you?  Maybe you can be proud of that, too.
 
2013-02-06 04:09:41 PM  

Dr. Whoof: They have plenty to be proud of. The Confederacy is not one of them. The Civil War is not one of them. The Confederate flag is not one of them.

We are proud of every one of these things. You have no right to tell Southerners what they are allowed to be proud of. fark you and the horse you rode in on.

Actually, I sure do have a right to tell them. They don't have to listen, unless they get all "secessiony" again and then, well, they get told with bullets (and these days, missiles, artillery, etc).

However, yeah, I have every right to say treating other human beings as property and essentially livestock, and fighting a war to that end, is nothing to be proud of. It's a heritage of evil. Instead, go be proud of GOOD things the south has done.


The North did all of those same things, j@ckass.  The North had slaves. Lincoln had slaves.  Grant had slaves.  You're trying to paint it as a southern invention. It was not.  farkwad.
 
2013-02-06 04:10:04 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: Will someone please tell me what the positive legacies of Nathan Bedford Forrest were? What exactly is being honored? His profound ignorance? His slaughter of surrendered troops. His slave trading? His terrorism? What is the "legacy " that deserves anything beyond derision?


i1207.photobucket.com
 
2013-02-06 04:10:09 PM  

Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....so you're a sterotypical frat boy?  Nice.  Doesn't take money to dress like that or get those girls, just a pretentious sense of self worth.  A lot of people I know (from the south) have that same thing.  And those same shorts.

/Absolut, the good stuff? hahahaha....
//I bow to your comedy stylings sir.
 
2013-02-06 04:10:41 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: Sons of Confederate Veterans

How old are these people?


A little younger than the Daughters of the American Revolution.
 
2013-02-06 04:10:52 PM  

danfrank: dukwbutter: Felgraf: Hrm. Gee. I am positively stumped. I'm sure dukwbutter can explain how this is, in fact, not about slavery, though.

Both Lincoln and Grant owned slaves. In his inaugural address of March 4, 1861, U.S. President Abraham Lincoln stated, "I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so."  Union General U.S. Grant said, "If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side."

So, yeah, it wasn't about slavery. The more you know...

Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.



When his family was in Kentucky, they were too poor for anything like that, and Illinois was a free state.
 
2013-02-06 04:10:57 PM  

dukwbutter: So, when he said the south could keep their slaves if they would just rejoin the Union....you would explain that how.  They're just "quotes".  I love how "quotes" are different from "historical facts".  Tell me more professor. :O


Now this is interesting. If secession had nothing to do with slavery, then why on earth would Lincoln ever think to offer such a concession to reverse it? The very idea you're appealing to insists that you're wrong. So in short, if Lincoln was trying to double back on his emancipation platform to end secession, then secession clearly had something to do with slavery. Again, you're trying to use isolated elements to ignore facts, only now you're even screwing that up.
 
2013-02-06 04:10:57 PM  

All2morrowsparTs: Joe Blowme: cynicalbastard: And soon, we will have the "And the War between the States had nothin' to do with Slavery, it was all about State's Rights and Import taxes!" crowd...

Will they be followed by the "Islam is a religion of peace" crowd?

/KKK & Islam = death cults

LOL WUT?!

/I won't go on to comparitive religion but of the 3 Abrahmic ones there is only one that diafies the death of its central figure.


"diafies?"
 
2013-02-06 04:11:33 PM  
Perhaps we are talking at cross purposes here:

The South through a big hissy fit and decided to secede because they feared they would lose their slaves, and that the north was making it difficult for them to own slaves. Dukwbutter, do you agree or disagree?
(Note that I *can* cite the articles of secession again. Unless you feel they were lying when the wrote those?)

Meanwhile, the North waged a war to preserve the union, a war they feel the south instigated in protection of slavery. While the north did not enter the war with the intention of ending slavery, the south DID secede with the intention of KEEPING slavery.
 
2013-02-06 04:12:07 PM  

dukwbutter: Dr. Whoof: They have plenty to be proud of. The Confederacy is not one of them. The Civil War is not one of them. The Confederate flag is not one of them.

We are proud of every one of these things. You have no right to tell Southerners what they are allowed to be proud of. fark you and the horse you rode in on.

Actually, I sure do have a right to tell them. They don't have to listen, unless they get all "secessiony" again and then, well, they get told with bullets (and these days, missiles, artillery, etc).

However, yeah, I have every right to say treating other human beings as property and essentially livestock, and fighting a war to that end, is nothing to be proud of. It's a heritage of evil. Instead, go be proud of GOOD things the south has done.

The North did all of those same things, j@ckass.  The North had slaves. Lincoln had slaves.  Grant had slaves.  You're trying to paint it as a southern invention. It was not.  farkwad.


You keep saying Lincoln had slaves. Where are you getting this?
 
2013-02-06 04:12:35 PM  

danfrank: Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.


Git some!!!  You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today.  Sucks.  Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it?  OMG they lied to me in school. Doh!  Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html
 
2013-02-06 04:12:49 PM  

DROxINxTHExWIND: What do you call people who are ALWAYS offended puzzled that someone would take offense to something?


Just seems like a lot effort is wasted on stuff like this.  Your priorities may vary.
 
2013-02-06 04:13:13 PM  

drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.


The cake is a lie
 
2013-02-06 04:13:18 PM  

Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

Good stuff? Vodka?  Almost at tasteless as those shorts.

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 719x493]
We'll never give you a bid with that attitude.



Good.
 
2013-02-06 04:13:55 PM  

Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.



From that picture I can tell you're a racist.
 
2013-02-06 04:14:54 PM  

Felgraf: Perhaps we are talking at cross purposes here:

The South through a big hissy fit and decided to secede because they feared they would lose their slaves, and that the north was making it difficult for them to own slaves. Dukwbutter, do you agree or disagree?
(Note that I *can* cite the articles of secession again. Unless you feel they were lying when the wrote those?)

Meanwhile, the North waged a war to preserve the union, a war they feel the south instigated in protection of slavery. While the north did not enter the war with the intention of ending slavery, the south DID secede with the intention of KEEPING slavery.



But think about this question: Why did the South want to keep slavery going?
 
2013-02-06 04:15:51 PM  

dukwbutter: The North did all of those same things, j@ckass.  The North had slaves. Lincoln had slaves.  Grant had slaves.  You're trying to paint it as a southern invention. It was not.  farkwad.


Yeah, but see, you don't see northerners screaming about "Northern pride" and wearing a Union battle flag and proclaiming "the South will burn again!".  Well, outside of being sarcastic in Fark threads.  It's not something people generally do.  The opposite, however, it alive and well south of the Mason-Dixon.

Though I admit this Union battle flag is pretty bad ass:
www.thegoodfight.us
 
2013-02-06 04:15:55 PM  

Dr Dreidel: dukwbutter: Don't dare tell me what I can and can't be proud of. fark you. I'm proud of the secession of the South. fark the North. Lincoln and Grant both had slaves. fark you for telling me what I can be proud of.

Be proud of whatever you want. Don't expect the rest of us to start showering you with flowers and adoration for it, though.

// those are suggestions for good-neighboring, not absolute thou-shall-nots
// you're proud of the South's secession? Well, I'm proud the North kicked the South's sorry asses all the way to Vicksburg and back
// you may find that that pride does not endear you to most Americans - but I think you deserve to know this beforehand


I think it's pathetic that the white southern christian male is demonized. It's the last unprotected class of the politically correct.  Blacks. Gays. Jews. Anything is fine, so long as you're not a white southern christian male.  Then, all bets are off.
 
2013-02-06 04:15:56 PM  

Nabb1: Rapmaster2000: Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.

That would work if even one person in that picture was wearing any sort of Ole Miss apparel.


My bad.  That was a home Vanderbilt game.  We came to see our bro, Jay Cutler.  I've tailgate with my bros at every school in the SEC except Kentucky (because why bother) and Miss State (because Miss State is in Starkville).
 
2013-02-06 04:16:04 PM  

dukwbutter: Dr Dreidel: You're from the South? Awesome - talk about biscuits and football and NASCAR and Texas oil and Florida/LA heat and have a silly accent and wear overalls and drink you some sweetea. DON'T, however, be proud of secession, civil war and slavery. "Southern Pride" can be easily reappropriated to mean a Junetime march with rainbow flags.
You're from Germany? Awesome - even though I don't like weissbier, schnitzel is proof of god's love, I know a bit of the language, your people are polite (the few native-Germans I've ever met, anyway) and the endless jokes about sterile efficiency never fail to amuse. DON'T, however, start wistfully remembering WWII from the Kraut side. So long as you're not very "white power"-y, I think you'll be OK citing your German heritage.

Don't dare tell me what I can and can't be proud of. fark you. I'm proud of the secession of the South.  fark the North. Lincoln and Grant both had slaves.  fark you for telling me what I can be proud of.


Ahh, one of the proud Sons of the South in all his ignorant glory.
 
2013-02-06 04:16:31 PM  

ScouserDuck: max_pooper: dukwbutter: That's right. Everyone can be proud of their heritage. Except for Southerners.  That seems fair, right?

They can be proud all they want but they shouldn't be surprised when people correctly point that their "heritage" is deeply rooted in destructive racism.

Whose isn't?


You know man, I did a Ctrl-F on this whole thread looking for somebody who addressed your question.
 
2013-02-06 04:16:45 PM  

Farce-Side: Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....so you're a sterotypical frat boy?  Nice.  Doesn't take money to dress like that or get those girls, just a pretentious sense of self worth.  A lot of people I know (from the south) have that same thing.  And those same shorts.

/Absolut, the good stuff? hahahaha....
//I bow to your comedy stylings sir.


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that's not really him.
 
2013-02-06 04:17:32 PM  

dukwbutter: danfrank: Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.

Git some!!!  You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today.  Sucks.  Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it?  OMG they lied to me in school. Doh!  Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html


Your website states that his father in law owned slaves.

Not that Abraham Lincoln owned slaves.

Also, I don't think anyone is trying to argue "ZOMG THE SOUTH CREATED SLAVERY". What I *AM* trying to say is that the south threw a petulant, horrific, nation-sundering temper tantrum like a three-year-old being denied candy because they thought they were going to lose the right to own slaves.

Do you disagree? Again, if so, do you feel the leaders were simply lying when the wrote the articles of secession?
 
2013-02-06 04:17:59 PM  

dukwbutter: So, when he said the south could keep their slaves if they would just rejoin the Union....you would explain that how.  They're just "quotes".  I love how "quotes" are different from "historical facts".  Tell me more professor. :O


The South seceded to preserve slavery. Anything Lincoln did in response to that does nothing change their reasons for seceding.

Lincoln loved his country and hated war more than he hated slavery.  He wasn't a perfect man, and he didn't always make the right choices.

But the hard cold fact is that the South went to war to preserve slavery.  That was their stated purpose.  Learn your history.
 
2013-02-06 04:18:04 PM  

dukwbutter: danfrank: Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.

Git some!!!  You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today.  Sucks.  Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it?  OMG they lied to me in school. Doh!  Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html


Wow is that link full of absolute shiat.
 
2013-02-06 04:18:25 PM  

The Larch: You don't understand how the quote button works, do you? Maybe you can be proud of that, too.


Actually. I do. How about a big cup of go fark yourself?
 
2013-02-06 04:18:27 PM  

karnal: Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.


From that picture I can tell you're a racist.


That's so unfair.  I always talk with the porter at my Dad's dealership.

Why, just the other day I was saying to my black friend at the Club "Oh Porterhouse, look at the wax build up on these shoes!   I want that wax stripped off there, then I want them creamed and buffed with a fine chamois, and I want them now. Chop chop!"
 
2013-02-06 04:18:36 PM  

dukwbutter: Git some!!!  You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today.  Sucks.  Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it?  OMG they lied to me in school. Doh!  Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html


Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

To clarify, four points

1: Lincoln never owned slaves.
2. The Corwin amendment was offered forth to let states that already had slavery implemented keep it, but would still have outlawed slavery in new states/territories. This was unacceptable to the seceding states (slavery was the issue.)
3. Foaming with glee that you are 'educating liberals' from "dixiescv"  kind of suggests that you're, in fact, just an uneducated idiot.
4. You're an uneducated idiot. 

Another fine example of someone who is creating their own fantasy history, not due to facts, but due to their partisan political identity. dukwbutter hates liberals. Liberals are associated with the fact that the Civil War was about slavery. Therefor dukwbutter hates facts.
 
2013-02-06 04:18:38 PM  
It is highly uncertain Nathan Bedford Forrest had anything to do with the founding of the KKK aside from having his name attached to it. He was probably a member at best, and even then he left before it became a violent organization. He's no saint, but the hyperbole in this thread (I know, it's Fark, big surprise) is ridiculous.

He was a the premier cavalry commander of the Civil War and, as others noted, actually campaigned for civil rights by the end of his life.

/Yankee
 
2013-02-06 04:19:49 PM  

dukwbutter: danfrank: Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.

Git some!!!  You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today.  Sucks.  Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it?  OMG they lied to me in school. Doh!  Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html


Oh, man. You didn't even read your terrible blog, did you.
 
2013-02-06 04:21:02 PM  

dukwbutter: danfrank: Abraham Lincoln owned slaves? Please provide a citation for that, because I think you're full of shiat.

Git some!!!  You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today.  Sucks.  Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it?  OMG they lied to me in school. Doh!  Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html


I don't see anything in your, uhm, "scholarly article" about Lincoln owning slaves.
 
2013-02-06 04:21:49 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: Ahh, one of the proud Sons of the South in all his ignorant glory.


You're ignorant, J@ckass.  what have I posted that's wrong.  I'm the only conservative person that still bothers to check on Fark after it went full commie.  Sucks. One person arguing against a thousand drones that only know what they lurned in publik skool. Sucks.
 
2013-02-06 04:22:06 PM  

dukwbutter: The Larch: You don't understand how the quote button works, do you? Maybe you can be proud of that, too.

Actually. I do. How about a big cup of go fark yourself?


Can I get a donut with that?
 
2013-02-06 04:22:10 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND:  I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that's not really him.

Gee, ya think?
 
2013-02-06 04:22:39 PM  

dukwbutter: I think it's pathetic that the white southern christian male is demonized. It's the last unprotected class of the politically correct. Blacks. Gays. Jews. Anything is fine, so long as you're not a white southern christian male. Then, all bets are off.


Aaaaannnd, there it is.

We get it, bro.  You're a victim.
 
2013-02-06 04:22:57 PM  
Here in Jacksonville we have a high school...in a predominately minority neighborhood...named after N.B. Forest...yay
 
2013-02-06 04:23:02 PM  

quiet_american: The irrationality in this thread is really depressing.

Everyone comments as though ... no other viewpoint than theirs is correct.
...
Yet people in here have this tyrant's attitude ... to just swallow the mainstream version of history uncritically and then try to barf it back in soundbites to validate whatever center-left political action is taken.


Ok, now fun thought experiment:  read the two statements above (shortened for brevity). See the problem? Hint: I bolded the key words.
 
2013-02-06 04:23:15 PM  

VendorXeno: dukwbutter: Git some!!! You freaking liberal yankees are getting a full does of truth today. Sucks. Nothing like what you learned in the history books, is it? OMG they lied to me in school. Doh! Suck it libtards!

http://www.dixiescv.org/slavery.html

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

To clarify, four points

1: Lincoln never owned slaves.
2. The Corwin amendment was offered forth to let states that already had slavery implemented keep it, but would still have outlawed slavery in new states/territories. This was unacceptable to the seceding states (slavery was the issue.)
3. Foaming with glee that you are 'educating liberals' from "dixiescv" kind of suggests that you're, in fact, just an uneducated idiot.
4. You're an uneducated idiot.

Another fine example of someone who is creating their own fantasy history, not due to facts, but due to their partisan political identity. dukwbutter hates liberals. Liberals are associated with the fact that the Civil War was about slavery. Therefor dukwbutter hates facts.


You're an idiot. And a j@ck@ss. And you're wrong. Have a nice go fark yourself  :)
 
2013-02-06 04:24:04 PM  
Geeze, is it a sign that I was born and raised in Tennessee (just north of Nashville) that I knew the founder of the KKK by heart? Dammit. I agree with changing Nathan bedford Forest Park. There's even a statue of the'tard somewhere, or there used to be.
 
2013-02-06 04:24:54 PM  

Maestro1701: drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.

The cake is a lie


Southerners should be proud of their cake. I have nothing but respect for this.

www2.worldpub.net
 
2013-02-06 04:25:13 PM  

dukwbutter: Philip Francis Queeg: Ahh, one of the proud Sons of the South in all his ignorant glory.

You're ignorant, J@ckass.  what have I posted that's wrong.  I'm the only conservative person that still bothers to check on Fark after it went full commie.  Sucks. One person arguing against a thousand drones that only know what they lurned in publik skool. Sucks.


Things you have posted that are wrong:

Lincoln owned slaves.

That the civil war and secession had nothing to do with slavery.

Not to mention linking to a webpage that was jammed with laughably obvious errors.
 
2013-02-06 04:25:45 PM  

dukwbutter: You're an idiot. And a j@ck@ss. And you're wrong. Have a nice go fark yourself  :)


Well, darn. I predict this thread is about to get a lot shorter, and a lot less... uhh.. interesting.
 
2013-02-06 04:26:25 PM  

RealityChuck: He then gave a black woman a kiss on the cheek, which was scandalous back then.

Bedford Forrest's name was used in the establishment of the Klan, but there's no indication he took part, and it's unclear as to whether he gave consent to use his name. So the historical record indicates he was far less racist than most whites of his time.


How dare you try to bring fact and reason into this discussion. Cant you see we need to insult southerners for something that happened over 150 years ago. Everyone living in the South whether they were born there or not, is responsible. Nevermind the fact that many monuments and parks in the North are named after butchers who oppressed and murdered Native Americans. While we are at, it lets rename places like Auschwitz and Dachau, and Bataan bad things happened there and if we change the name we can remove the truth from History.....
 
2013-02-06 04:27:20 PM  

dukwbutter: You're an idiot. And a j@ck@ss. And you're wrong. Have a nice go fark yourself :)


And yet, you've failed to prove it. : )
 
2013-02-06 04:27:27 PM  
My Dad owns a dealership called Nathan Bedford Forrest Kia.  I dare any of you to take it from me!
 
2013-02-06 04:27:29 PM  

someonelse: Maestro1701: drumfreek: I love how most everybody here uses the typical Southern stereotype. All southern whites are racist. For you guys, I have seen some dumb motherfarkers in my life, but you take the cake.

The cake is a lie

Southerners should be proud of their cake. I have nothing but respect for this.

[www2.worldpub.net image 400x422]


Real southern cake:

1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-02-06 04:27:48 PM  

DROxINxTHExWIND: I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that's not really him.


I know, hence the appreciation of his comedy stylings.
 
2013-02-06 04:27:49 PM  

Rapmaster2000: karnal: Rapmaster2000: give me doughnuts:

No, I'm calm, cool, and collected down here with all of these easy Southern women.  They like guys with money.

Good thing you know a few, then.

Yes, it is.  It's a my patented system which I call SCRAPS, which is not an acronym.  You see, after a young debutante fails once again to secure a proper husband, I move in to console her with promises of Broadway plays and indoor plumbing.  Let's just say it's easy pickings.

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 604x453]

Here's a picture of me and some of my bros partying before the Ole Miss game.  Check out my madras shorts and of course, the Absolut.  Only the good stuff for me, Bo, Rhett, Gage, and Jackson.


From that picture I can tell you're a racist.

That's so unfair.  I always talk with the porter at my Dad's dealership.

Why, just the other day I was saying to my black friend at the Club "Oh Porterhouse, look at the wax build up on these shoes!   I want that wax stripped off there, then I want them creamed and buffed with a fine chamois, and I want them now. Chop chop!"



Well played!
 
2013-02-06 04:28:01 PM  

dukwbutter: You're an idiot. And a j@ck@ss. And you're wrong. Have a nice go fark yourself :)


Here, I shall try to help, oh intellectual superior, in helping you show how you are wrong in at least one respect.
"Or Abraham Lincoln's Father in Law's Slaves?"

Lincoln's Father in Law's Slaves?

Father in Law


While this may be difficult, those words roughly boil down into "Someone who is not Lincoln".

In fact, their last name was not EVEN Lincoln. I realize that in some (very limited) areas of the south, a southern man may share the same last name as his father in law, but I am fairly certain this was not the case here.

I hope this is complicated enough for your superior intellect to comprehend.
 
2013-02-06 04:28:40 PM  

dukwbutter: I think it's pathetic that the white southern christian male is demonized. It's the last unprotected class of the politically correct. Blacks. Gays. Jews. Anything is fine, so long as you're not a white southern christian male. Then, all bets are off.


Demonized? The same way White Southern Christian Males demonized everyone else for a few hundred years? You're upset because you're not getting treated as lords of the manor anymore?

Grow up, snowflake. No one cares who you are, where you come from or what religion you claim (well, right up until those things become justifications for mistreating others). If you're feeling demonized, I'd start taking a long look at what you're calling "demonization" and what the delta is between what you're expecting and what you're getting.

Also, "demonization" is going to be a tough sell when all the statistics still point to white advantage. Don't feel bad - I get to use that advantage too, despite being Jewish. SO unfair, right?