If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Huffington Post)   About farking time: the States and the Fed to sue S&P because mortgage fraud has become standard and we're all poors   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 76
    More: Spiffy, United States, Mcgraw-Hill Cos. Inc., Maytag, travel websites, Western Digital, Tamiflu, petroleum industry, misconduct  
•       •       •

6659 clicks; posted to Business » on 04 Feb 2013 at 5:02 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



76 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-02-04 03:53:34 PM
somebody better go to jail for this crisis. personally, i'd like it to be jamie dimon and/or lloyd blankfein. but i'd settle for anone in their tax bracket. wait -what am i saying? they pay less tax as a percentage of their income than i do!
 
2013-02-04 04:04:00 PM
No mention of suing Freddie Mae, Fannie Mac or any of the bozos in Washington that set up the whole scheme?
 
2013-02-04 04:35:50 PM
Oh no. Civil charges. Whatever shall they do?
 
2013-02-04 04:36:50 PM
encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-04 04:41:46 PM

FlashHarry: somebody better go to jail for this crisis. personally, i'd like it to be jamie dimon and/or lloyd blankfein. but i'd settle for anone in their tax bracket. wait -what am i saying? they pay less tax as a percentage of their income than i do!


We already know that isn't going to happen.

They will just settle for far less than they made.  No big deal.
 
2013-02-04 04:48:44 PM

FlashHarry: somebody better go to jail for this crisis. personally, i'd like it to be jamie dimon and/or lloyd blankfein. but i'd settle for anone in their tax bracket. wait -what am i saying? they pay less tax as a percentage of their income than i do!


There have been a number of exposés on the crisis and many of them suggest the same thing: had Obama and his cabinet gone for blood just after the crisis, it most likely would have created a crisis in itself, hampering recovery.

Now that the economy has stabilized and markets are back up, the question on everyone's mind is if his administration will finally go after the crooks.  Sadly, many experts believe that he won't.  You know, because he is a Kenyan pinko commie socialist who hates American business.  Or something.


/they were just talking about this on Bill Moyers Journal this week
 
2013-02-04 04:57:39 PM

dj_bigbird: No mention of suing Freddie Mae, Fannie Mac or any of the bozos in Washington that set up the whole scheme?


derp

growlersoftware.com

growlersoftware.com
 
2013-02-04 05:05:54 PM
Didn't i see something on the dailyshow the other night that some big banks ended up not getting charged because it would cause the banks to fail?  That a precedent had been set that if you were important enough, you don't have to go to jail?
 
2013-02-04 05:08:28 PM

basemetal: [encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com image 275x183]


i.imgur.com
 
2013-02-04 05:08:50 PM

FlashHarry: somebody better go to jail for this crisis. personally, i'd like it to be jamie dimon and/or lloyd blankfein. but i'd settle for anone in their tax bracket. wait -what am i saying? they pay less tax as a percentage of their income than i do!


Jail nothing.

Wheel out ol' Sparky and let's fry the three people most responsible and send a nice conditional and temporary stay of execution to the next 7.

Also seize assets. All the assets. Too big to fail, not too big to have to eat at Walmart.
 
2013-02-04 05:09:41 PM
I do not believe anything will come of it. The banks tell the government what to do, not the other way around.
 
2013-02-04 05:10:36 PM
We've already determined that accounting practices for big financial institutions are so convoluted (aka made-up garbage) that they can't even be audited by professionals. How is a jury ever going to determine whether any wrong doing even occurred? Those guys can just write their own rules.
 
2013-02-04 05:10:48 PM
FTFAIn a variety of lawsuits brought by investors, S&P has maintained that its ratings constitute opinions protected by the 1st Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

That would cover Bernie Madoff's sales pitch too, wouldn't it?
 
2013-02-04 05:11:23 PM
Headline made me chuckle, Subby.
 
2013-02-04 05:11:42 PM
Dog and pony show, nothing more.
 
2013-02-04 05:12:06 PM

basemetal: [encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com image 275x183]


This!
 
2013-02-04 05:12:49 PM
Methinks this is at least in part retaliation for downgrading US and state debt.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-02-04 05:13:46 PM

The company's statement:

It would disregard the central facts that S&P reviewed the same subprime mortgage data as the rest of the market - including U.S. government officials who in 2007 publicly stated that problems in the subprime market appeared to be contained - and that every CDO that (the Department of Justice) has cited to us also independently received the same rating from another rating agency.
If they can prove that last part to a jury the government's case would be weak.
 
2013-02-04 05:14:08 PM

dj_bigbird: No mention of suing Freddie Mae, Fannie Mac or any of the bozos in Washington that set up the whole scheme?


Neither Fannie Mae nor Freddie Mac set up either the housing bubble or the following the financial crisis.

How do people stay this stupid?
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-02-04 05:15:56 PM
orbister

Madoff was accused of fraud. It's not clear yet what S&P will be accused of.
 
2013-02-04 05:19:36 PM

ZAZ: The company's statement:It would disregard the central facts that S&P reviewed the same subprime mortgage data as the rest of the market - including U.S. government officials who in 2007 publicly stated that problems in the subprime market appeared to be contained - and that every CDO that (the Department of Justice) has cited to us also independently received the same rating from another rating agency.If they can prove that last part to a jury the government's case would be weak.


Ah the old "But officer, I was just keeping up with traffic- everyone else was speeding too" defense. As a credit rating agency, they had a fiduciary responsibility to independently verify the value of those notes, irrelevant of what other players were saying.
 
2013-02-04 05:23:14 PM
Fark S&P. They signed off on sub-standard tranches of bundled mortgages that Frankie the Loan Shark would turn his nose up at as AAA grade. They colluded with the big banks and mortgage companies to pass off hammered shiat as pure gold. Fark them in the ear.
 
2013-02-04 05:24:33 PM

X-boxershorts: How do people stay this stupid?


I hear one way is for people to pay them to say stupid things on the Internet.
 
2013-02-04 05:24:42 PM

Random Anonymous Blackmail: Dog and pony show, nothing more.



In so much as they are not really going to sue them or a preemptive strike so that we dont get a downgrade again?
 
2013-02-04 05:26:03 PM
The model used to rate bonds. That model glue is strong stuff.
 
2013-02-04 05:28:17 PM
I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!
 
2013-02-04 05:33:04 PM

Pocket_Fisherman: I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!


why sell?
 
2013-02-04 05:34:55 PM
Who would ever want to make a mortgage loan?

If you approve a marginal loan, you're committing fraud and you'll be showering with Jerry Sandusky.

If you don't approve a marginal loan, you're a racist and you're Red Lining.
 
2013-02-04 05:35:17 PM

some_beer_drinker: Pocket_Fisherman: I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!

why sell?


or why biatch? you paid less in rent than i did. you didnt think you really owned it, did you? the banks own everything, including your slave ass.

the big boys are cashing out...boomers are cashing out...we have hit a huge wall, and only the strong will survive. hope you dont owe a bank money...
 
2013-02-04 05:45:50 PM
They should sue Moody's too. Stick it to Buffet!
 
2013-02-04 05:51:44 PM

vpb: FlashHarry: somebody better go to jail for this crisis. personally, i'd like it to be jamie dimon and/or lloyd blankfein. but i'd settle for anone in their tax bracket. wait -what am i saying? they pay less tax as a percentage of their income than i do!

We already know that isn't going to happen.

They will just settle for far less than they made.  No big deal.


Exactly. It will just be one more cost of doing business. Seriously, without criminal charges and jail time that's all these "fines" are - the government taking a small cut of the action. Just look at Mozillo the old CEO of COuntrywide financial... He paid a fine that amounted to around 5% of the money he made off the wholesale fraud at Countrywide which helped lead to the housing crash. It absolutely made sense for him to do that business because he made out like a bandit.

No clawbacks, no jail time, just 5% for the government - like 23% less than I pay in taxes on my wages. Why wouldn't the nations business leaders just sell out the nation's future for personal gain at every turn? There's only upsides to doing it, no downsides whatsoever, no real risk.
 
2013-02-04 05:55:53 PM

impaler: dj_bigbird: No mention of suing Freddie Mae, Fannie Mac or any of the bozos in Washington that set up the whole scheme?

derp

[growlersoftware.com image 473x279]

[growlersoftware.com image 335x270]


Those are interesting; do you have a theory on why they needed those gi-normous bailouts with such low default rates?
 
2013-02-04 06:10:38 PM

orbister: FTFA:  In a variety of lawsuits brought by investors, S&P has maintained that its ratings constitute opinions protected by the 1st Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

That would cover Bernie Madoff's sales pitch too, wouldn't it?


If S&P were selling bonds, your comparison might be closer to correct.
 
2013-02-04 06:11:36 PM

Pocket_Fisherman: I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!


They made you overpay for your house?
 
2013-02-04 06:12:01 PM

mongbiohazard: vpb: FlashHarry: somebody better go to jail for this crisis. personally, i'd like it to be jamie dimon and/or lloyd blankfein. but i'd settle for anone in their tax bracket. wait -what am i saying? they pay less tax as a percentage of their income than i do!

We already know that isn't going to happen.

They will just settle for far less than they made.  No big deal.

Exactly. It will just be one more cost of doing business. Seriously, without criminal charges and jail time that's all these "fines" are - the government taking a small cut of the action. Just look at Mozillo the old CEO of COuntrywide financial... He paid a fine that amounted to around 5% of the money he made off the wholesale fraud at Countrywide which helped lead to the housing crash. It absolutely made sense for him to do that business because he made out like a bandit.

No clawbacks, no jail time, just 5% for the government - like 23% less than I pay in taxes on my wages. Why wouldn't the nations business leaders just sell out the nation's future for personal gain at every turn? There's only upsides to doing it, no downsides whatsoever, no real risk.


I don't understand why the govt doesn't use RICO in cases like this. The guy pays a fine, which is sort of an admission that the fraud exists.  Why can't the feds seize his houses, cars, bank accounts, stock portfolio, etc.  Since fraud occured, the financial organization was essentially a criminal enterprise.  ALL payments he received as part of that criminal enterprise are subject to seizure.

I think it would only take one or two cases like this and people might actually start following the rules.
 
2013-02-04 06:14:10 PM

Anonymocoso: Who would ever want to make a mortgage loan?

If you approve a marginal loan, you're committing fraud and you'll be showering with Jerry Sandusky.

If you don't approve a marginal loan, you're a racist and you're Red Lining.


I've often suggested that a way to prevent this in the future would be to ban any loans to people with credit scores below an arbitrary number, like 650.
 
jvl
2013-02-04 06:16:12 PM
I was someone who saw the bubble for what it was at the time.  Everyone, not just S&P raters, saw no bubble. I learned to say my piece and shut up while people nodded politely at me like a madman.

And I do not see that S&P did anything wrong.  They simply drank the cool-aid like everyone else.  Does anyone else remember the old line about "the nationwide market has never gone down" by people who conveniently had forgotten the Great Depression?

Put yourself in the seat of an S&P analyst during bubble's ascent.  What do you do?  If you call it a bubble and say things will go badly, year after year your boss sees how reality differs from your prediction and fires you for being a moron.  Meanwhile, an analyst who rubber-stamps everything looks like a freaking genius.

"The Madness of Crowds" was first published in 1841 and explained all this.  But still we forget the lessons every time the economy runs smoothly for 20 years.  And still we forget the lessons and look for scapegoats when things go badly, even though both scapegoat and victim were equally complicit in the madness.
 
2013-02-04 06:21:51 PM

Debeo Summa Credo: Anonymocoso: Who would ever want to make a mortgage loan?

If you approve a marginal loan, you're committing fraud and you'll be showering with Jerry Sandusky.

If you don't approve a marginal loan, you're a racist and you're Red Lining.

I've often suggested that a way to prevent this in the future would be to ban any loans to people with credit scores below an arbitrary number, like 650.


Still too racisty
 
2013-02-04 06:23:31 PM
Stupid question (or maybe it isn't)

Is this the same McGraw-Hill that makes textbooks for grade schools?

If so, *man* we're farked. -that's the wolves guarding the hen house for sure.
 
2013-02-04 06:24:40 PM

X-boxershorts: dj_bigbird: No mention of suing Freddie Mae, Fannie Mac or any of the bozos in Washington that set up the whole scheme?

Neither Fannie Mae nor Freddie Mac set up either the housing bubble or the following the financial crisis.

How do people stay this stupid?


They didn't set up the housing bubble by being the largest providers of housing finance during the inflation of the housing bubble?

Why such an apologist? Fannie made the same mistakes that Lehman and S&P and Wachovia et al made. They bought into the bubble. It's just that the magnitude of fannie/freddies lending dwarfs the others.

Is it that Fannie Freddie have historically been democratic supported institutions, whom conservatives like the WSJ op Ed board had called to be curtailed well before the crisis?
 
2013-02-04 06:26:13 PM

jvl: I was someone who saw the bubble for what it was at the time.  Everyone, not just S&P raters, saw no bubble. I learned to say my piece and shut up while people nodded politely at me like a madman.

And I do not see that S&P did anything wrong.  They simply drank the cool-aid like everyone else.  Does anyone else remember the old line about "the nationwide market has never gone down" by people who conveniently had forgotten the Great Depression?

Put yourself in the seat of an S&P analyst during bubble's ascent.  What do you do?  If you call it a bubble and say things will go badly, year after year your boss sees how reality differs from your prediction and fires you for being a moron.  Meanwhile, an analyst who rubber-stamps everything looks like a freaking genius.

"The Madness of Crowds" was first published in 1841 and explained all this.  But still we forget the lessons every time the economy runs smoothly for 20 years.  And still we forget the lessons and look for scapegoats when things go badly, even though both scapegoat and victim were equally complicit in the madness.


Great post.
 
2013-02-04 06:47:40 PM

dj_bigbird: No mention of suing Freddie Mae, Fannie Mac or any of the bozos in Washington that set up the whole scheme?


Trolling? Or don't understand the actual issues?

S&P will settle. Some people may be fired. Fines will be paid. Nothing else.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-04 06:54:00 PM

Debeo Summa Credo: Pocket_Fisherman: I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!

They made you overpay for your house?


Yes, they did.  They drove up prices then collapsed the market by fraudulently over-rating bad debt.
 
2013-02-04 06:55:43 PM

Red Shirt Blues: Debeo Summa Credo: Anonymocoso: Who would ever want to make a mortgage loan?

If you approve a marginal loan, you're committing fraud and you'll be showering with Jerry Sandusky.

If you don't approve a marginal loan, you're a racist and you're Red Lining.

I've often suggested that a way to prevent this in the future would be to ban any loans to people with credit scores below an arbitrary number, like 650.

Still too racisty


Do tell. You seem to have dropped your shovel. I offer it back to you. Please...dig some more and explain this to us all how the CRA program, which still to this day, enjoys a comparable default rate to traditional PRIME rated mortgages, forced these poor poor banks to write millions of loans with fraudulent documentation....
 
2013-02-04 06:58:51 PM
Are they Criminal charges? No?

Then fark you, Obama and Holder.

dl.dropbox.com

Frontline on PBS: The Untouchables: Why Wall Street has excaped prosecution for criminal fraud
 
2013-02-04 06:59:05 PM

vpb: Debeo Summa Credo: Pocket_Fisherman: I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!

They made you overpay for your house?

Yes, they did.  They drove up prices then collapsed the market by fraudulently over-rating bad debt.


Huh? You are the one who drove up prices by overpaying.
 
2013-02-04 07:05:48 PM

X-boxershorts: CRA program


Non-Hispanic whites represent the majority of at-risk borrowers, but African-American and
Latino borrowers are more likely to be at imminent risk of foreclosure (21.6% and 21.4%,
respectively) than non-Hispanic white borrowers (14.8%).

Derp
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-02-04 07:08:20 PM

Debeo Summa Credo: vpb: Debeo Summa Credo: Pocket_Fisherman: I'm selling my house for 10k less than I paid for it 9 years ago.  Thanks guys!

They made you overpay for your house?

Yes, they did.  They drove up prices then collapsed the market by fraudulently over-rating bad debt.

Huh? You are the one who drove up prices by overpaying.


How did I "over pay"?  Do you think that market value is some sort of inherent quality that's independent of the market?
 
2013-02-04 07:08:20 PM

theorellior: Fark S&P. They signed off on sub-standard tranches of bundled mortgages that Frankie the Loan Shark would turn his nose up at as AAA grade. They colluded with the big banks and mortgage companies to pass off hammered shiat as pure gold. Fark them in the ear.


Well, gee. Who got hurt by their fraudulent ratings?

Oh, right. Every single taxpayer who has to cover for a collapsed pension fund.

The State Board of Administration, which manages many of Florida's public investments, has seen its assets plummet by $62-billion, a third of their value, in the last 13 months.
 
2013-02-04 07:10:29 PM
More like someone better go to jail for putting 3 unstoppable autoplay videos on that page.

/dnrtfa
//couldn't, sounded like a flock of geese in a room with ron burgundy
 
Displayed 50 of 76 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report