Die at your station, and thank the Job Creators for giving you the opportunity to do so.

When were 45-60 year-olds retiring in the first place?

I thought we're supposed to work til we're 70 now right?  Isn't that what Romney and supporters were saying during the election?  The SS age is needs to be raised is all the rage.  I mean since we live to be 72 now, we should be cool with 2 years..

sammyk: It's not a competition. Experience will always win.

Not necessarily. Experience wins when it *really matters*. But the vast majority of jobs can be done competently by any moderately intelligent adult if they get a little bit of training. Which means most businesses go for the cheapest employee. And that means the youngest, and least experienced.

sammyk: It's not a competition. Experience will always win.

If experience even threatens to cut into profit margin, it's a liability that must be purged.  That's why these "experienced" guys are looking for jobs in the first place.

a) consumer-driven culture: most people are too stupid to plan for retirement accordingly, as they need the iPhone 5, iPad2, or 65" LED TV because the previous model doesn't have the feature they want
b) many people are still screwed by the housing bubble
c) housing prices will continue to stagnate as boomers try to "cash out" on the massive houses they purchased but have a reduced demand for such housing
d) recessions delay retirements
e) medical technology means longer lifespans, lower infant mortality rate for those with crippling birth defects, illness, etc. leading to higher medical costs
f) longer lifespans mean medical expenses skyrocket, high cost of living
g) higher costs of living mean less consumable income (and conspicuous consumption will have to drop)
h) overly generous benefits/pensions and poor planning to pay for them, particularly of state/local government unfunded liabilities, will weigh heavily upon he economy in the future
i) excessive executive compensation

Result: job market changes, everyone will have to work longer and for less.  Once again, the problems of past generations are kicked down the road to the next.

/yes, I am an economist

alwaysjaded: That's why I've been looking into starting a retirement package and really learn how to manage my money while I'm young. I'm 32 and figure it's never too early. Plus every single one of the 50+ co-workers around here advise it.

Anyone know of any good books or podcasts about finances? Looking to buy a house soon and I've got shiat credit but a good down payment on a mortgage. Who knew not having any debt, paying everything in cash and living within my means would one day bite me in the ass for a loan.

Read the Intelligent Asset Allocator.  Have your money deposited directly from your check into saving so you don't spend it.

Don't be one of those guys with $3k in stocks thinking they are smarter than all the supercomputers and insider information on Wall Street.

Note that the techniques in Intelligent Asset Allocator will probably not work as well nowadays because the global economy is more intertwined, so it is harder to make independent bets.

alwaysjaded: Anyone know of any good books or podcasts about finances? Looking to buy a house soon and I've got shiat credit but a good down payment on a mortgage. Who knew not having any debt, paying everything in cash and living within my means would one day bite me in the ass for a loan.

Easy way to build credit: get credit card, always pay off card every month.  I had a FICO score around 810 as a result of that when I bought my house.  I simply don't spend cash, and keep track of what I'm spending on my card.  Have at least a 20% down payment ready for your house so you don't have to pay for PMI.  (Also note: FHA loans require PMI and are subsequently rarely worth getting unless you don't have much of a down payment).  I also recommend the IRA/401k/403b route someone suggested upthread.  Even if it's only $20 a paycheck, get used to putting money away and gradually increase it as you can.

realmolo: sammyk: It's not a competition. Experience will always win.

Not necessarily. Experience wins when it *really matters*. But the vast majority of jobs can be done competently by any moderately intelligent adult if they get a little bit of training. Which means most businesses go for the cheapest employee. And that means the youngest, and least experienced.

I Laughed OL'd at your dream world.

/has a job that takes a little bit more of training.

//doesn't check facebook every five minutes like most tweeners do.

///doesn't have a facebook account.

////will be gainfully employed for as long as I want.

////\/Cheers!

Chelsea Clinton Is Carrot Top's Lost Twin: realmolo: sammyk: It's not a competition. Experience will always win.

Not necessarily. Experience wins when it *really matters*. But the vast majority of jobs can be done competently by any moderately intelligent adult if they get a little bit of training. Which means most businesses go for the cheapest employee. And that means the youngest, and least experienced.

I Laughed OL'd at your dream world.

Experience matters, but too much experience (re: being too old, basically) is as bad for your job market prospects as having no experience.

Droog8912: Result: job market changes, everyone will have to work longer and for less. Once again, the problems of past generations are kicked down the road to the next.

you left out 30 years of stagnant wages for most people. If wages grew up between 1980 and today like they did between 1947 and 1980 people would have a lot easier time saving and also government at all levels wouldn't be having revenue issues. Also the economy would be a good deal bigger.

When were 45-60 year-olds retiring in the first place?

THIS !

There's something seriously wrong when people who are in the prime of their working life are retiring instead of working.

Am I the only person who has no plans to ever retire?

Droog8912: alwaysjaded: Anyone know of any good books or podcasts about finances? Looking to buy a house soon and I've got shiat credit but a good down payment on a mortgage. Who knew not having any debt, paying everything in cash and living within my means would one day bite me in the ass for a loan.

Easy way to build credit: get credit card, always pay off card every month.  I had a FICO score around 810 as a result of that when I bought my house.  I simply don't spend cash, and keep track of what I'm spending on my card.  Have at least a 20% down payment ready for your house so you don't have to pay for PMI.  (Also note: FHA loans require PMI and are subsequently rarely worth getting unless you don't have much of a down payment).  I also recommend the IRA/401k/403b route someone suggested upthread.  Even if it's only $20 a paycheck, get used to putting money away and gradually increase it as you can.

This.

Most youts are pretty dumb. Experience is everything. It takes at least a decade to become an expert at something, I read once. In fact, we don't hire anyone under 30 at my workplace. Well, except for the menial labor positions like toilet-cleaner or jizz-mopper. And in that case we use a temp agency for that yummy cheap payroll. Less bennies for the youts, more bennies for me :)

johne3819: I thought we're supposed to work til we're 70 now right?  Isn't that what Romney and supporters were saying during the election?  The SS age is needs to be raised is all the rage.  I mean since we live to be 72 now, we should be cool with 2 years..

Its not true though. The mode and median life expectancy haven't changed much, just the average. The top 20% are living much longer, the bottom 80% haven't changed much at all. So those who actually need Social Security, nothing has changed in their life expectancy.

sammyk: It's not a competition. Experience will always win.

Many places are reluctant to hire old folks due to the increased burden on their healthcare plan that eventually results in higher premiums.

45-62

Isn't that the cohort which is responsible for running the whole shebang?

You do the youth thing. Discover yourself in your 20's. Hone your skills through your 30's. Step up to the decision making in your 40's. Senior management in 50's. Emeritus in your 60's. Retire, and know your turned things over in good shape. Early retirement is irresponsible.

johne3819: I thought we're supposed to work til we're 70 now right?  Isn't that what Romney and supporters were saying during the election?  The SS age is needs to be raised is all the rage.  I mean since we live to be 72 now, we should be cool with 2 years..

Just FYI, SS retirement age HAS ALREADY been raised, back in the 80's. But nah, really, they should raise it again, because Romney pays way too much in taxes already.

Chelsea Clinton Is Carrot Top's Lost Twin: realmolo: sammyk: It's not a competition. Experience will always win.

Not necessarily. Experience wins when it *really matters*. But the vast majority of jobs can be done competently by any moderately intelligent adult if they get a little bit of training. Which means most businesses go for the cheapest employee. And that means the youngest, and least experienced.

I Laughed OL'd at your dream world.

If the part in bold weren't true elementary school teachers wouldn't need a union.

AlwaysRightBoy: To be honest. Youts are not that smart.

At my ad agency, we go through them like a cord of wood.

You don't strike me as particularly bright, yourself.

alwaysjaded: Droog8912: alwaysjaded: Anyone know of any good books or podcasts about finances? Looking to buy a house soon and I've got shiat credit but a good down payment on a mortgage. Who knew not having any debt, paying everything in cash and living within my means would one day bite me in the ass for a loan.

Easy way to build credit: get credit card, always pay off card every month.  I had a FICO score around 810 as a result of that when I bought my house.  I simply don't spend cash, and keep track of what I'm spending on my card.  Have at least a 20% down payment ready for your house so you don't have to pay for PMI.  (Also note: FHA loans require PMI and are subsequently rarely worth getting unless you don't have much of a down payment).  I also recommend the IRA/401k/403b route someone suggested upthread.  Even if it's only $20 a paycheck, get used to putting money away and gradually increase it as you can.

I'm close to having 12k for a down payment for a 115k house (in Houston so good housing is cheap). Started a credit card just like you mentioned through my bank, I just don't know how long it will take to repair my score. Really want to stop renting but don't wanna rush. I need to learn more about IRA's. Thanks for your input.

I went from a 418 FICO to close to a 700 in about 4 years. It takes time, but there are somethings you can do. If you are diligent you can actually get some negative items removed from your report (legitimately). I spent a LOT of time reading this forum http://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Rebuilding-Your-Credit/bd-p/rebuildin g credit  . There are some very bright and helpful people there that know the system.

Time and money heals a FICO score.

shanteyman: When were 45-60 year-olds retiring in the first place?

THIS !

There's something seriously wrong when people who are in the prime of their working life are retiring instead of working.

Seconded.

alwaysjaded: Anyone know of any good books or podcasts about finances? Looking to buy a house soon and I've got shiat credit but a good down payment on a mortgage. Who knew not having any debt, paying everything in cash and living within my means would one day bite me in the ass for a loan.

Listen to Clark Howard Show  daily podcast that's pulled from his syndicated radio show.   He doesn't give stock or investment advice, but he's pretty good about common sense advice to saving money, consumer advocacy, preparing for retirement, avoiding scams and making major financial decisions.

SineSwiper: shanteyman: When were 45-60 year-olds retiring in the first place?

THIS !

There's something seriously wrong when people who are in the prime of their working life are retiring instead of working.

Seconded.

Sounds like a good plan to me, I hope to be retired before 60.

Health Care is a big part of this.   There may be plenty of workers in their late 50's early 60's who might consider starting to live off their savings only they can't possibly afford the health insurance premiums.

InmanRoshi: alwaysjaded: Anyone know of any good books or podcasts about finances? Looking to buy a house soon and I've got shiat credit but a good down payment on a mortgage. Who knew not having any debt, paying everything in cash and living within my means would one day bite me in the ass for a loan.

Listen to Clark Howard Show  daily podcast that's pulled from his syndicated radio show.   He doesn't give stock or investment advice, but he's pretty good about common sense advice to saving money, consumer advocacy, preparing for retirement, avoiding scams and making major financial decisions.

Dave Ramsey is pretty good too if you can tune out the politics and religious noise. He is a bit of an extremist on some financial issues but if someone didn't have financial sense and needed someone else to tell them what to do with their money a person could do worse than follow his advice.

Learning to live with less, was always part of the plan, wasn't it?  Less growth, less consumption, less people via less babies; less means less.  Let the old farts grind it out.  Ride a bike, learn to surf, or find a comfy seat at a pub.  Enjoy your your youth through your 30's, something will open up around your 40th birthday.

Unless you're a genius, the world won't have much use for you.